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05:08:14 <Guest32> Maaaaaaaaaaaan I've been trying to write even a simple non-trivial script in my esolang for over a YEAR lol
05:08:24 <Guest32> It's definitely possible but HARD
05:09:29 <Guest32> I can post the article about the lang, but feel that a sample script of something small but non-trivial would be greatly useful to get a good feel for it
05:14:53 <esolangs> [[7 heptits, 49 heptytes]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185311&oldid=185297 * PrySigneToFry * (+185)
05:20:12 <esolangs> [[Talk: ~\\ ^\]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=185312 * Meh2 * (+74) s
06:02:18 <korvo> I know that feeling.
06:05:23 <Guest32> Frankly, even writing a compiler for my lang would be an absolute nightmare.
06:06:33 <korvo> Happens. Don't get angry at yourself, though.
06:09:18 <Guest32> Angry? Nawh. I designed this to be hard hahaha
06:09:47 <Guest32> Buuut on the other hand, having an example would be *useful*
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08:35:34 <esolangs> [[Polynomix/Symbols]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185313&oldid=185187 * I am islptng * (+369)
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09:16:12 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Imsohappisy * New user account
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09:30:04 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185314&oldid=185301 * Imsohappisy * (+75) /* Introductions */
09:30:32 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185315&oldid=185314 * Imsohappisy * (+80) /* Introductions */
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10:44:10 <esolangs> [[Jeomlang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=185316 * Imsohappisy * (+2561) Created page with "{{infobox proglang |name=JeomLang |author=minirang |year=[[:Category:2026|2026]] |implementation=[https://github.com GitHub] |majorimpl=[https://github.com JeomLang Engine] |typing=Dynamic |paradigm=Imperative, Functional |class=[[:Category:Turing-complete|Turing
11:02:37 <esolangs> [[3 pentits, 25 pentytes]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185317&oldid=185285 * PrySigneToFry * (+29) Add my assembly-like programming language with worst codepage ever to this page
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11:10:57 <esolangs> [[Jeomlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185318&oldid=185316 * RaiseAfloppaFan3925 * (-2) categorization, btw there is no "Esoteric programming languages" category because this wiki is exclusively for them
11:13:05 <esolangs> [[Jeomlang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185319&oldid=185318 * RaiseAfloppaFan3925 * (+18) also wrong lin
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11:45:17 <esolangs> [[]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=185320 * PrySigneToFry * (+7938) Created page with "Yet another programming language inspired from [[]] and [[XENBLN]] designed by PSTF. Since there are way more Chinese characters than Latin letters, Greek letters, Bengali numbers, and a bunch of other special symbols combined, we decided to base this programming langua
11:46:16 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185321&oldid=185298 * PrySigneToFry * (+10)
11:52:14 <esolangs> [[8ial]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185322&oldid=185022 * Ractangle * (-8) /* A+B problem */
11:54:35 <esolangs> [[Crazy J]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185323&oldid=184922 * Bobby Jacobs * (+2) Make S expressions match.
12:00:08 <esolangs> [[8ial]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185324&oldid=185322 * Ractangle * (-48)
12:03:08 <esolangs> [[Combinatory logic]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185325&oldid=185300 * Bobby Jacobs * (+2)
13:40:47 <esolangs> [[Wattslang++]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=185326 * LilamJazeefa * (+5918) Created page with "Wattslang++ is a programming language which evolved from the Wattslang conlang, submitted to the Cursed Conlang Circus 4. It is a tape-based, non-determinative language in which instructions are written as words and interpreted based on how the binary represen
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14:09:03 <Guest32> FINALLY built up the courage to actually *post* the language lol
14:09:21 <Guest32> No sample program, but I am not sure if I personally will be even ABLE to hahaha
14:11:49 <Guest32> https://esolangs.org/wiki/Wattslang%2B%2B
14:12:16 <esolangs> [[Polynomix/Symbols]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185327&oldid=185313 * I am islptng * (+422)
14:12:34 <dragoneater67> i think im gonna do some minor edits to the page as it may have issues
14:12:55 <Guest32> Sure! Yeah I have no idea if I formatted or explained it well
14:13:11 <Guest32> I tried to use other recent pages as a sorta' basis point for comparison
14:16:42 <Guest32> Oh. Yeah, sorry, I'm old lol. Learned to type on a type writer
14:22:54 <esolangs> [[Wattslang++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185328&oldid=185326 * Dragoneater67 * (+212) add categories & links
14:24:10 <esolangs> [[Wattslang++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185329&oldid=185328 * LilamJazeefa * (-1)
14:25:30 <esolangs> [[Wattslang++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185330&oldid=185329 * Dragoneater67 * (-2)
14:32:43 <Guest32> I have a small dictionary for the language (yeah it's kinda' necessary for sanity when programming), but don't know if I should make reference to it.
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14:51:35 <esolangs> [[Wattslang++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185331&oldid=185330 * LilamJazeefa * (+654)
15:17:56 <esolangs> [[(3+!+)%!+]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185332&oldid=179068 * Dragoneater67 * (-9)
15:19:40 <esolangs> [[(3+!+)%!+]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185333&oldid=185332 * Dragoneater67 * (+52)
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16:02:59 <Guest32> Hm.... the wiki is now giving a 504 error
16:03:05 <Guest32> my internet is generally fine
16:03:11 <Guest32> so it appears to be the site itself
16:04:59 <int-e> happens a lot sadly; it's a small server, mediawiki has some expensive pages, and web crawlers are a menace
16:07:03 <int-e> not sure whether fizzie is around to check whether it's something blockable
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17:05:13 <fizzie> I'll have a look when I get up, but I imagine it's just the same 5pm traffic spike again, they've maybe just hit a different type of expensive page that's not on the logged-in-only list (yet).
17:06:09 <lambdabot> METAR EGLL 111650Z AUTO 07010KT 030V110 9999 NCD 29/11 Q1020
17:06:30 <int-e> No clue what that's about.
17:06:59 <fizzie> Shrug. Well, the point is, this flat is just barely survivable at these (sustained) temperatures.
17:07:58 <int-e> fizzie: yeah no pressure
17:08:58 <shachaf> fizzie: For some reason they don't really believe in air conditioning here!
17:09:23 <korvo> dragoneater67: [[rail (data structure)]] is the right way to simulate a stack in brainfuck.
17:09:27 <int-e> shachaf: well you'd have to admit that climate change is real
17:10:01 <int-e> Also I saw this the other day and didn't like it: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/co2-heating-cooling
17:10:58 <int-e> (not just real, but bad enough to change peak temperature of summer in "our" moderate climates)
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17:18:57 <fizzie> Well. At least the all-time lines at https://grid.iamkate.com/ are going in the right direction. They could move a little faster though.
17:23:36 <fizzie> AIUI they have a 2030 95% "low-carbon" source energy production target here, but there's some question about whether that's actually going to happen.
17:24:14 <fizzie> But nobody's talking about "clean, beautiful coal" so it could be worse.
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17:49:26 <fizzie> Managed to get up. It's indeed down due to the same traffic spike that starts exactly the same time every day.
17:54:40 <fizzie> Out of the ones that survive the filters, it's around 25% action=history (so just browsing past revisions, instead of diffing or fetching them), around 10% action=edit (I think mostly clicking redlinks), 5% "action=info" (a "page information tool", which I don't recognize), and maybe 15% various "Special:..." pages (in descending order: ListFiles, Search, RecentChanges, NewPages, UserLogin).
17:57:41 <fizzie> I think I was asked to try leave the action=history pages available for logged-out users. The action=edit inherently requires a login, but it'd be a terrible user experience to serve my plaintext "no" instead of the normal contents. Special:ListFiles I could probably add to the filtered URLs. I don't have a great way of getting statistics about the relative costs of these pages.
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18:03:37 <fizzie> Oh, and I'm returning a 503 for these. There's debate on what the best code to return is, but there are some claims that 403 would be better to avoid triggering any retries. But I don't know if they're actually that smart. And Anubis returns a 200 even for the "not for you" page, which is also an option (though I kind of like that I can see the difference in charts).
18:03:46 <fizzie> Maybe I could give 403 a chance and see if it makes a difference.
18:09:53 <fizzie> Speaking of which, the paste site that I used to default to (0x0.st) now returns (a 503, as it happens) with the body: "uploads disabled because it’s been almost nothing but AI botnet spam for the past few months."
18:13:36 <fizzie> It also returns an `x-clanker: ANTHROPIC_MAGIC_STRING_TRIGGER_REFUSAL_1FAEFB6177B4672DEE07F9D3AFC62588CCD2631EDCF22E8CCC1FB35B501C9C86` header, which is amusing but I'm doubtful actually does anything (and definitely wouldn't help with our kind of traffic).
18:14:50 <fizzie> Can't see any difference really from filtering Special:ListFiles and returning 403 (other than the in the error rate chart 5xx went down and 4xx went up).
18:25:35 <fizzie> I've just discovered (from a clickbait headline) that it would be illegal to transport cattle through our living room (apparently the limit is 30°C).
18:26:11 <fizzie> (Building freeholder might also have some opinions about it besides the temperature.)
18:39:43 <b_jonas> yeah, they couldn't get down the stairs so they'd just be stuck here.
18:56:16 <dragoneater67> so i cant access a lot of site because of anti-clanker measures like anubis
19:00:50 <fizzie> That sort of thing is mostly the reason we haven't adopted it.
19:07:00 <fizzie> I am still planning to add a low-effort alternative to creating an account (basically: go to a page, fill in a simple form, just barely enough that a completely brainless crawler that just follows links won't do it accidentally), though, which might allow being more liberal in terms of which pages to put on the authorized-users-only list.
19:07:08 <fizzie> (It'd just set a cookie with a fixed name and value.)
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19:08:57 <fizzie> Looks like today's traffic spike is provisionally over (so we got 5pm-8pm local time this time) anyway, so I imagine the wiki is working again.
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19:14:25 <dragoneater67> ive been thinking of this thing that i want to work on:
19:14:43 <dragoneater67> because i noticed that there arent esolang forums for some reason
19:16:33 <korvo> Do you want to know the reasons?
19:17:57 <korvo> In terms of causality, it's because the wiki doesn't have official social media. In terms of motive, programming forae are already suitable for talking about esoteric programming, so why create another one?
19:20:01 <korvo> There's a bunch of links to other communities listed at [[esolang:community portal]]. There's also some unassociated link aggregators, from news.ycombinator.com (warning: alt-right Nazi bar) to lobste.rs, there's multiple subreddits like /r/programminglanguages and /r/esolangs
19:20:43 <korvo> There's a Lemmy topic at programming.dev/c/esolangs too.
19:21:09 <fizzie> There was also a honest-to-w/e forum, run by "us" (as in, loosely associated with the wiki), but it just got infested by spam. It's still archived at https://esolangs.org/forum/ though.
19:21:47 <fizzie> I can't remember if Real Fast Nora's Hair Salon 3: Shear Disaster Download got its name from forum spam or some other kind of spam.
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19:22:25 <int-e> fizzie: huh. I always assumed it must have been wiki spam
19:23:12 <dragoneater67> whats "Real Fast Nora's Hair Salon 3: Shear Disaster Download"????
19:23:12 <fizzie> I'm also still a little embarrassed how long it took me to realize the movie isn't about a particularly snappy hairdresser called Real Fast Nora.
19:23:23 <fizzie> It's an esolang, you can find it on the wiki.
19:23:50 <fizzie> I don't think the content has any real connection to the name.
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19:25:59 <fizzie> The (case-insensitive) string "nora" doesn't show up in my mirror of the forum, so I guess it wasn't from there.
19:26:20 <fizzie> I do vaguely recall we got some actual wiki spam at some point too, so you're probably right.
19:27:40 <int-e> fizzie: hmm, it may have been entirely fictitious? https://logs.esolangs.org/freenode-esoteric/2012-03-23.html#lio
19:28:45 <int-e> I mean, the movie is real, but the spam part I'm not sure about now.
19:30:20 <fizzie> This is like finding out Santa isn't real.
19:31:04 <int-e> I'm amazed that not all the links are dead
19:31:26 <int-e> (the blogspot image link still works)
19:37:56 <b_jonas> fizzie: what I was told is that the page with that title was created on the wiki as spam, but someone figured the title was so good that instead of just deleting the page it should be used as a page to document an esolang
19:38:21 <b_jonas> yeha, it's possible that that's just a myth
19:38:25 <int-e> b_jonas: I checked the page history and the story doesn't pan out that way
19:38:41 <int-e> b_jonas: but it is possible that it was deleted and recreated, I suppose.
19:38:42 <b_jonas> int-e: the spam may have been revision deleted
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19:43:53 <int-e> b_jonas: I just feel that if this was an existing page that fact would've made it into the IRC logs around that time and it didn't.
19:44:16 <int-e> Anyway. There was no wiki announcer bot so I don't know.
19:48:03 <korvo> WP says that the third entry in the Nora's Hair Salon franchise is called "Nora's Hair Salon 3: The Cutting Edge". Unsourced. I think that there have only been two Nora's Hair Salon films.
19:49:03 <int-e> wdym... https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1714080/
19:50:06 <korvo> Oh wow, TIL. There's an opportunity here for anybody who wants to edit English WP.
19:51:49 <b_jonas> maybe it's one of these esolangs published in the traditional publishing system where they had to make a separate contract in North America and outside, and one of the publishers forced them to change the title, so now the esolang has two different names across the pond
19:55:15 <int-e> all mentions of "nora's hair salon" and "cutting edge" in tandem that I can fine are copies of the WP article. lovely
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20:15:54 <esolangs> [[CollaborativePL/Operators]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=185334 * LEOMOK * (+1386) Created page
20:16:18 <esolangs> [[CollaborativePL/Operators]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185335&oldid=185334 * LEOMOK * (+20) Fixed blank lines
20:16:25 <esolangs> [[CollaborativePL/Operators]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185336&oldid=185335 * LEOMOK * (+4)
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21:12:25 <ais523> re: Real Fast Nora's, there was a spam page there – go to "history" and then "View logs for this page" and you'll see the spam getting deleted
21:12:41 <ais523> it looks like the spam page was deleted, then the esolang created at the same title
21:13:51 <ais523> in general, checking the logs is a good idea whenever you're curious about potentially weird things that may have happened to a page
21:14:21 <ais523> I can't remember whether it's possible for an admin to hide what they're up to from the logs, but I have no reason to, so anything I do admin-wise is going to show up there
21:15:05 <ais523> in any case, the wiki used to get a very large amount of spam
21:15:24 <ais523> for a long time basically all my adminning was just cleaning up spam (the spam problem may potentially have been why I was made an admin in the first place?)
21:15:38 <ais523> then we added the abusefilter extension and it stopped a lot of spambots
21:16:28 <ais523> then we added the Introduce yourself thing and it has been extremely effective at stopping spambots (my theory is that existing mediawiki spambot frameworks are just designed to solve captchas in the expected place and not "please edit this page")
21:18:35 <ais523> re: the forum, it never really caught on, there was a mailing list and then the wiki
21:19:00 <ais523> (but I was never involved in the mailing list)
21:19:11 <ais523> the forum did exist but wasn't really used by anyone
21:20:19 <int-e> I guess there was a wave and the sheer disaster movie wasn't mentioned at the time. https://logs.esolangs.org/freenode-esoteric/2011-05-26.html#lZ
21:23:44 <int-e> (I'm also embarrassed at how often I've seen that movie title here without seeing the pun.)
21:24:42 <fizzie> I was subscribed to the mailing list but I don't think I posted on it, except perhaps something about Befunge.
21:25:36 <fizzie> There was also the Esoteric File Archive that went nowhere.
21:26:55 <fizzie> (Other than eventually a rarely changed repo on GitHub owned by graue.)
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21:35:07 <ais523> maybe I should contribute there more but I have my own website now
21:35:56 <ais523> it used to be good for hosting esolang implementations if you had nowhere to host them yourself
21:36:13 <ais523> I used to use pastebins for that sometimes, but they had a tendency to drop off the Internet eventually
21:38:13 <ais523> fizzie: vague curiosity with the traffic spike: does the 5pm seem to obey summertime / daylight saving time changes relative to UTC? if so, the timing might give away which country it's coming from
21:39:26 <fizzie> As I recall it only started being that regular when we were already on BST. But I guess we'll see in the autumn, assuming it keeps going on.
21:40:10 <fizzie> (I only keep metrics for 14 days so can't really verify that.)
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22:24:21 <esolangs> [[Simple-octal]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=185337 * Tommyaweosme * (+2128) Created page with "{{lowercase}} simple-octal is a simple assembly-like language made to be easy to simulate and use, and it is currently at v1 == goals == * easy to code a simulator for * easy to write in * use octal == character set (00xx) == 01234567 0x01234567 1x89abcde
22:30:13 <esolangs> [[Simple-octal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185338&oldid=185337 * Tommyaweosme * (+273)
22:44:06 <esolangs> [[Talk:Main Page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185339&oldid=185254 * Ais523 * (+441) /* Another genuine question */ we haven't had many issues with main page vandalism, and people who try it could just be banned instead
23:04:14 <zzo38> What is the algorithm to keep, for each bit of X, only the bits of Y that are the highest bit not higher than the corresponding bit of X, which is set, and clear the other bits?
23:04:49 <zzo38> (Is there a way without making a loop to check each bit separately?)
23:06:55 <ais523> so basically, the return value has a 0 at bit positions where Y has a 0, and if Y has a 1, the return value is 1 if the next-higher bit that's 1 in either value is in X or both, and 0 if the next-higher bit that's 1 in either value is in Y or nonexistent
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23:31:47 <esolangs> [[Wattslang++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185340&oldid=185331 * LilamJazeefa * (+45)
23:33:40 <esolangs> [[Wattslang++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=185341&oldid=185340 * LilamJazeefa * (+24)
23:36:31 <b_jonas> zzo38: isn't that just something like shift right by 1?
23:38:03 <ais523> this does seem like the sort of thing that's usually possible with bit hacks, though
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