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01:56:57 <GregorR> You will rue this day! Well, go on ... start ruing!
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02:03:48 <Sgeo> "It is our duty to inform you that as of 7:35:05am UTC on September 10, 2008, the Earth has been destroyed." http://qntm.org/?board
02:14:39 <pikhq> I love Sam Hughes. :D
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06:41:56 <oklobol> real a = 1.352; real i = 0.0177; while(i < a) { i += differential; }
06:49:48 <oklobol> +++>+++++<[-->-<]>>+<[->++<]>:
06:52:30 <oklobol> +++>+++++< {*3 5} [-->-<] {*0 3.5} >>+< {0 *3.5 1} [->++<] {0 *0 8} >: {0 0 *8 => 8}
07:37:00 <oklobol> it's an indian term for irc channel
07:37:21 <oklobol> pikhq realized this is a channel, and, you know, he's indian
07:37:47 <pikhq> But I am related to the only white man to go on the trail of tears.
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07:49:20 <oklopol> mirc owns, if i send messages with /msg and i have a channel window open, the message becomes part of that channel's log
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12:04:10 <tusho> hey guyz StoryGen v2 beta test <3 http://91.105.98.27:4567/
12:08:49 * oerjan thinks the fragments are a little too short.
12:09:36 <oerjan> As in, I couldn't get my initial sentence in.
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12:16:34 <tusho> oerjan: that is intentional
12:16:41 <tusho> you are meant to leave sentences unfinished
12:19:47 <oerjan> you are not required to be consistent with your own previous fragments, i hope :D
12:21:01 <tusho> oerjan: in fact, it works better when more people do it
12:21:05 <tusho> because otherwise you can easily get continuity
12:21:08 <tusho> Slereah: are you doing it?
12:21:11 <slereah> http://img.4chan.org/b/src/1221130716923.jpg
12:21:15 <tusho> In a non-innuendo wau7
12:21:23 <oerjan> i'm doing my best to avoid it
12:21:40 <tusho> i'm not gonna do the next one, lets' see if anyone else is doing them
12:22:45 <tusho> http://91.105.98.27:4567/
12:22:58 <oerjan> slereah: my question is whether the amish will out-breed the rest of them
12:23:25 <slereah> I doubt it, since the world will end :o
12:23:41 <oerjan> (although there is a similar norwegian sect with the breeding if not the low-tech)
12:25:02 <slereah> At least the act that leads to it
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12:26:33 <tusho> you need to tell all your friends.
12:26:36 <tusho> oh wait you're a mathematician
12:26:39 <tusho> you don't have any
12:28:09 <tusho> this is a hard one.
12:54:13 <tusho> AnMaster: a published mathematician
12:54:29 <tusho> where do you think he gets his terrible puns?
12:54:38 <tusho> he figures their punniness with mathematics.
12:55:38 <tusho> AnMaster: you don't know oerjan's terrible puns?
12:56:03 <AnMaster> well I use irc logs for a reason
12:56:10 <AnMaster> I don't have a good memory for such stuff
12:56:33 <tusho> optbot is named after oerjan's terrible puns.
12:56:34 <optbot> tusho: K={A=_;X=8;{B=_;A}};
12:56:42 <oerjan> you don't have a puny memory, then.
12:58:57 <AnMaster> hm I suspect a pun there, though I'm unable to see what it is
13:00:58 <tusho> oerjan: i thought it was quite punny
13:02:07 <tusho> finns are a lot funnier than swedes.
13:02:37 <tusho> norway is actually sweden
13:02:41 <tusho> (which is actually finland)
13:03:22 <AnMaster> well since they are all of the type country *, they could be aliased without causing undefined behaviour ;P
13:03:26 <oerjan> which is actually iceland
13:03:38 <tusho> and the LHC saps particles from germany
13:03:51 <tusho> AnMaster: countries are not pointers to countries.
13:03:58 <tusho> iceland isn't a sign saying, "Iceland is over here ->"
13:04:57 <AnMaster> tusho, in that case they can't alias each other
13:05:15 <tusho> AnMaster: of course not, if you use such a stupid language as c
13:05:20 <oerjan> i would have thought it sapped particles from france and switzerland, since that's where it is
13:05:20 <tusho> but as we all know, the universe is written in lisp
13:05:27 <tusho> oerjan: no, germany
13:06:07 <oerjan> well, it is a multinational project
13:06:27 <tusho> germany just killed jews
13:06:31 <tusho> so it just saps their praticles
13:06:35 <tusho> germany will just disappear, not the universe
13:07:20 <oerjan> it seems to be sapping brain cells from the UK, anyhow
13:07:32 <tusho> oerjan: in what way?
13:07:38 <tusho> i am the wisest thinker
13:07:44 <tusho> it's in the 4 days of harmonious nature rotation
13:07:55 <oerjan> well, per brain cell that may be true
13:08:04 <tusho> your brain cells are educated stupid
13:09:40 <oerjan> i have this urge to mention that the Vatican State has a density of 2 popes per square kilometer
13:09:54 <tusho> darwin si the pope
13:09:59 <tusho> also eveyrone is darwin
13:10:07 <tusho> therefore 1darwin=10darwin=100darwin=etc
13:10:09 <tusho> but only in africa
13:10:13 <tusho> so, the universe is made out of darwin
13:10:16 <tusho> but the pope is anti-darwin
13:10:20 <tusho> and thus the pope is actually darwin
13:10:47 <tusho> darwin, as a pope, cannot deny he is darwin
13:10:58 <oerjan> aren't you a bit young to be on whatever you're on right now? >_<
13:11:01 <tusho> out of darwinpapalinfallability
13:11:07 <tusho> thus, we must conclude
13:11:20 <tusho> even though darwin had no moustache infallability when he wrote about natural selection
13:11:26 <tusho> and therefore had papal infallability
13:11:41 <tusho> oerjan: i am actually 471 years old
13:12:04 <oerjan> but the infallibility was only declared some time in the 19th century, possibly after darwin made his theories
13:12:15 <tusho> darwin is retroactive
13:12:26 <tusho> his universe runs on feather
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13:13:38 <tusho> before electricity
13:13:45 <tusho> electricity was invented in 2BE
13:14:39 <tusho> inhaling his holy fumes
13:14:48 <oerjan> so he was only infallible for 12 years at most
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13:15:00 <tusho> he was infallable for 46 years and 5 mellenia
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13:15:14 <oerjan> i am declaring a Great Schism
13:15:37 <tusho> i am declaring a great schemeism
13:15:40 <tusho> (((((((((((((((((((
13:15:41 <tusho> ]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
13:15:48 <oerjan> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaa
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13:18:12 <oerjan> i suggest a compromise: maybe it is his holy fumes that are infallible
13:21:23 <oerjan> then there can only be holy war
13:21:37 <oerjan> we must choose symbols
13:22:26 <oerjan> i choose the holy fumes as my symbol
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13:43:37 <tusho> say, how does c handle inlined recursive functions
13:44:54 <oerjan> is inlining part of the standard?
13:47:30 <oerjan> ah in C99 according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inline_function
13:48:18 <oerjan> "Many compilers can also inline expand some recursive functions; recursive macros are typically illegal.
13:49:39 <tusho> oerjan: It just ignores my inline.
13:50:21 <tusho> oerjan: even though it compiled inline void forever(void) { forever(); } into a jmp...
13:50:25 <tusho> it WOULD be able to inline it then
13:52:34 <oerjan> the latter is tail recursive, that might help
13:53:16 <oerjan> or are you saying it doesn't
13:54:03 <oerjan> http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc-4.1.1/gcc/Inline.html
13:54:17 <oerjan> "Using -Winline will warn when a function marked inline could not be substituted, and will give the reason for the failure."
13:57:58 <oerjan> "GCC does not inline any functions when not optimizing unless you specify the `always_inline' attribute for the function"
14:05:57 <tusho> Once upon a time there was an esoteric magician who spoke incomprehensibly. He wanted to make a magical language that was even worse. He called it... the Monstrous Money-Devourer ... of Death. And then he jumped into the big black lake of t-shirts. Cautiously approaching the washing machine, Jibbedybob appeared. Bob was there too. Jibbedybob was Bob's friend and Jibbedy was Jibbedybob's friend, They raped each other daily. Yum. It was delicious, like cake. T
14:07:14 <oerjan> i guess it doesn't count as innuendo if it's super explicit
14:07:30 <tusho> http://91.105.98.27:4567/ new storii
14:10:15 <oerjan> what the? something went wrong
14:11:16 <oerjan> maybe it's just the display that is broken
14:12:21 <oerjan> (my history clearly shows that i did _not_ duplicate fie when writing)
14:13:49 <oerjan> oh weird, it's a browser error
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15:09:52 <tusho> All Mister Jenkins could think was "How I like turnips, and the moving messages. In fact, when they moved they ploughed over the field like giant worms of doom ... sexy ones exploded in rage at the very sight of the hideous evil Mrr is a race of clones. goths too. like OO neckties and a thousand baloons, hai - who is a person - Niklas was his lovemaker. is a penis "sniper whore" JK I don't think so, sir.
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15:16:27 <AnMaster> "There are two ways to run efunge." or "There are two ways of running efunge."
15:16:44 <tusho> "You can run efunge in two ways:"
15:23:52 <AnMaster> is ' called "single-quote" or "single quote"
15:24:38 <AnMaster> Deewiant, anyway I got a command line wrapper kind of working now, not well tested
15:26:37 <AnMaster> "Using 'efunge:start("path/to/befunge/program.bf").' (without the single quotes)"
15:26:49 <Deewiant> and actually, "quote" is informal if you want to be strict about it :-)
15:26:49 <AnMaster> since it have to be double quotes in the inner bit
15:27:06 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well the issue is I need double quotes which should stay
15:27:28 <Deewiant> I usually just assume the reader has half a brain
15:27:45 <AnMaster> ah probably true in the case of a funge interpreter
15:28:09 <AnMaster> Deewiant, however if i didn't use quotes most reads not familiar with erlang would miss the dot at the end
15:28:44 <Deewiant> I'd say something about the dot and not the quotes, then :-)
15:30:18 <AnMaster> Deewiant, does the mycology page only list funge-98 interpreters?
15:30:26 <AnMaster> since mycology can test funge-93 too
15:30:38 <Deewiant> I know, but that wasn't really the point
15:30:52 <Deewiant> and most funge-93 interpreters get everything correct anyway
15:31:11 <Deewiant> things that I think of that might vary are "# <" and division by zero
15:31:42 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well I don't ask the user there, I do like 98, since I plan to change efunge into 98/108 at some point
15:32:10 <AnMaster> Deewiant, and what do you mean with # <
15:32:16 <AnMaster> what is there to get wrong there?
15:32:32 <Deewiant> in many funge-98 interps it doesn't
15:32:42 <Deewiant> or many and many... at least two :-P
15:33:18 <AnMaster> anyway befunge would work without #, since you can just use a space in the hole
15:33:36 <AnMaster> question: how many instructions can you reduce Funge-98 too while still being turing complete?
15:33:51 <Deewiant> the funge-93 set is turing complete
15:33:55 <AnMaster> I'd start with befunge-93 + infinite space then work down from there
15:34:33 <Deewiant> in befunge, I guess it could be
15:35:41 <AnMaster> in befunge, which I talked about, it is easy to remove #, you just use a space at the crossing
15:37:12 <AnMaster> I think : could be remove, replace with a p and two g
15:37:12 <slereah> AND WHAT ABOUT NINE ELEVEN
15:37:27 <Deewiant> I think it would be more interesting to remove p and g :-)
15:37:36 <AnMaster> Deewiant, then it wouldn't be funge really
15:38:01 <AnMaster> isn't the whole point being self modifying
15:38:17 <AnMaster> without that befunge93 would be easy to compile too
15:38:38 <Deewiant> you wanted the smallest instruction set
15:38:48 <Deewiant> I'd say, replace p and g with y
15:39:34 <AnMaster> but you need to keep either - or +
15:39:45 <AnMaster> or you can't do negative numbers indeed
15:40:09 <AnMaster> you could drop 2-9, I think you need 0 and 1 still
15:40:53 <Deewiant> what have we still got... 1-y\$
15:41:00 <AnMaster> _1-^><vy I guess you need then
15:41:42 <AnMaster> Deewiant, couldn't you just do some throwaway calculation?
15:41:49 <Deewiant> or even just one of [] might be enough
15:42:09 <Deewiant> AnMaster: can't empty the stack ever with any of those, or?
15:42:31 <Deewiant> not sure if that's exactly necessary though
15:42:53 <AnMaster> well, we are down at _1-[]y$ now
15:43:55 <AnMaster> well I never considered befunge a turing tarpit, but this reduction certainly is one
15:44:23 <AnMaster> Deewiant, are both [ and ] needed or?
15:44:48 <AnMaster> well ok, I guess you could simulate a [ using several ]
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15:45:45 <AnMaster> Deewiant, no, not if you want to end up in the same column
15:46:01 <Deewiant> just rearrange the code so that you don't want to
15:46:34 <Deewiant> in all honesty I'm not sure we need all of _[], just w should be enough
15:46:35 <AnMaster> using > to show where code enters
15:47:09 <AnMaster> yes pushing two things to decide turn direction
15:47:24 <Deewiant> and you get 'if' functionality for free
15:48:47 <AnMaster> I suspect you may also need x, but I can't prove that
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15:50:09 <AnMaster> like jump based on address on stack, not only fixed jump
15:50:48 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I suggest modifying y to be a pure pick instruction in such a case, since the other bits are hardly useful
15:51:10 <Deewiant> well of course if we're going to start modifying stuff
15:51:23 <Deewiant> but if we do that we should be able to get by with even less instructions
15:51:37 <AnMaster> Deewiant, sure, one instruction is enough iirc?
15:52:05 <Deewiant> since we can define an infinite number of behaviours for it :-P
15:52:11 <Deewiant> "if x is in an odd-numbered column then..."
15:52:44 <AnMaster> "subtract and branch unless positive" in OISC, said to be turing complete...
15:53:08 <Deewiant> I wonder if anything can compile to that instruction
15:53:20 <Deewiant> could then translate it to asm and see how fast stuff runs ;-)
15:53:49 <Deewiant> compile C to that, for instance
15:53:49 <AnMaster> well I bet x86 got something close ;)
15:54:22 <AnMaster> http://eigenratios.blogspot.com/2006/09/mark-ii-oisc-self-interpreter.html
15:54:51 <AnMaster> Deewiant, anyway I don't think you can compile C easily, would be restricted, since C got stuff like IO and so
15:55:30 <pikhq> One could do a standalone implementation.
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16:29:22 <tusho> ERROR Your host is trying to (re)connect too fast -- throttled
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16:40:47 <AnMaster> tusho, well fix your connection then!
16:40:59 <tusho> nothing to do with my connection.
16:41:12 <AnMaster> tusho, stop quitting your client all the time then
16:41:28 <tusho> It wiped all my settings randomly and I had to test them, so shut up.
16:42:30 <AnMaster> tusho, sucky client that doe that
16:43:01 <tusho> AnMaster: no, it was my fault
16:43:12 <tusho> I killed it while it was writing to the prefs or something
16:43:13 <AnMaster> of course you could just restore from the daily backup of your home dir
16:43:24 <tusho> AnMaster: i can't afford a drive for backups
16:44:10 <AnMaster> tusho, tapes aren't that expensive
16:44:18 <AnMaster> but if you got no tape drive, true
16:44:20 <tusho> AnMaster: enjoy your 1970
16:44:38 <AnMaster> tusho, tapes last longer than cds or harddrives certainly
16:44:50 <tusho> hds last long enough for me to care about
16:49:45 <Sgeo> AnMaster, butbut.. they're affected by magnets and stuff. That scares me, tbh
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16:53:08 <AnMaster> but cds doesn't last very long
16:54:33 <Sgeo> Is there any way to shield tapes?
16:54:52 <AnMaster> well same way as you shield against any EMP I assume
16:56:05 <Sgeo> Is it worth using tape to backup a home system
16:58:04 <AnMaster> Sgeo, I had the luck of finding a tape drive cheaply, local school was throwing out old equipment, got it for probably 1/10 of what it was really worth
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18:55:33 <AnMaster> Deewiant, my FING is now updated, however I will probably not make a release this weekend
18:55:43 <AnMaster> unless you actually plan to update mycology results page
18:55:57 <AnMaster> Deewiant, apart from FING, are there other changes?
18:56:56 <AnMaster> "2008–09–10 Mycology updates" on your website
18:57:23 <Deewiant> there is a changelog in the readme.txt, you know
18:58:37 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well it contradicts your web page
18:58:39 <AnMaster> " * Mycology update, some bugfixes."
18:58:44 <AnMaster> 2008-09-10 - Made the check for wraparound with non-cardinal delta a bit
18:58:44 <AnMaster> stricter (instead of a delta of (12,0) it uses (13,2)).
18:58:57 <AnMaster> and the 2008-09-06 release is not mentioned on the website
18:59:02 <Deewiant> yeah, that's irrelevant and a bugfix
18:59:08 <Deewiant> there never was a 2008-09-06 release
18:59:18 <AnMaster> 2008-09-06 - Fixed a misspelled error message in mycouser.b98 for
18:59:19 <AnMaster> - Fixed a bug in 2k6 testing that led to an infinite loop.
18:59:21 <Deewiant> that's just when I made the changes
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19:00:38 <AnMaster> Deewiant, have you seen that Mike made even more fingerprints
19:01:17 <Deewiant> something like that, I only glanced at it
19:01:27 <AnMaster> Deewiant, do you plan to implement it?
19:01:37 <Deewiant> I have no idea what it contains, like said
19:01:47 <Deewiant> and right now I really don't care either :-P
19:02:04 <Deewiant> ah, that might almost be useful
19:02:37 <Deewiant> I wonder if he specified it either completely uselessly or so strictly that it's a pain to implement
19:02:45 <AnMaster> Deewiant, btw if the mycology results page will be updated to include cfunge (as run on linux, as you said yourself) before the end of the weekend, a release will be made during Saturday, if it won't be updated, there will be no release
19:03:20 <AnMaster> Deewiant, yeah he haven't yet learnt the balance
19:03:31 <tusho> AnMaster is pioneering "software release by ransom"
19:03:40 <AnMaster> tusho, well someone has to be the first
19:03:48 <tusho> "Update the page by the weekend OR THE RELEASE GETS IT"
19:03:50 <Deewiant> except that I really don't care whether he releases or not :-P
19:04:08 <AnMaster> Deewiant, just I like to include more bug fixes before next release
19:04:17 <AnMaster> unless you actually plan to update that page
19:04:45 <AnMaster> Deewiant, or I will claim to be "mycology 2008-09-10 conforming"
19:05:02 * tusho claims to be 10 feet tall
19:05:24 <tusho> AnMaster: i pass as 10 feet tall too
19:05:31 <tusho> AnMaster: 10 feet in meters = 10 feet
19:05:44 <tusho> AnMaster: actually 3.04800 meters.
19:05:48 <Deewiant> that's a bit over or under 3 metres
19:05:50 * tusho claims to have worked that out in my head
19:06:04 <Deewiant> I just remember that one foot is around 30 cm
19:06:05 <tusho> AnMaster: i was crouching, you moron
19:06:25 <tusho> AnMaster: that's what i want you to think
19:06:35 <AnMaster> "ICAL"0x4943414cSome Intercal-like functions(RCS)
19:06:54 <Deewiant> I wonder if ais has an opinion on that ICAL, it's probably all wrong ;-)
19:07:11 <Deewiant> does it even have anything useful
19:07:36 <tusho> Deewiant: hi deewiant i am going to speck a fignerpting on irc ok??? then i will put it on the web, and you will implement it
19:07:38 <AnMaster> so lets see what ones are new, ARRY, BOOL, FOBJ, FPRT, ICAL, IMTH, RAND, SORT,
19:07:51 <Deewiant> tusho: ,,,,,,,,,,,
19:07:58 <tusho> Deewiant: ok,,,,,,here it is
19:08:12 <tusho> "BF": R ( c -- ) run brainfuck code
19:08:21 <tusho> Deewiant: hehehhehehehhee...
19:08:29 <AnMaster> that is plain idiotic, I mean those are not hard in pure befunge
19:08:45 <tusho> Deewiant: its a mystery,,ehehehehe.... it is the brainfuck code.......
19:09:00 <AnMaster> Deewiant, in FOBJ: "I 0gnirts referes to the funge file containing the code for the object"
19:09:20 <tusho> Deewiant: hello,,,,,,,how goes the implement
19:09:28 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well yes, FOBJ seems pretty messed up
19:10:13 <AnMaster> "Funge-space for objects is in Trefunge mode." <-- nice way to lock out for example CCBI and cfunge
19:10:22 <AnMaster> and efunge won't do tre-funge either
19:10:31 <tusho> don't blame him for your interp inferiorities
19:10:35 <tusho> Deewiant: will it do Nfunge
19:10:47 <tusho> Deewiant: will it do nfunge if i write a patc
19:11:08 <Deewiant> or, well, depends on the size of the patch ;-)
19:11:12 <AnMaster> Deewiant, also I fail to see how these are object orientated really, where is the inheritance...
19:11:13 <Deewiant> it'd have to be pretty big :-P
19:11:22 <tusho> Deewiant: it'd be some commits
19:11:30 <tusho> AnMaster: object orientation!=classes
19:11:35 <tusho> it's probably prototypical
19:11:55 <tusho> if it lets you fondle an existing object, and clone an object, then it's prototypical
19:12:02 <Deewiant> it looks a lot like namespaces + functions only, actually
19:12:03 <Deewiant> tusho: http://www.rcfunge98.com/rcfunge2_manual.html#FOBJ
19:12:17 <AnMaster> http://rcfunge98.com/rcsfingers.html#IMTH <-- now that is kind of stupid too, since the functionality is either simple in pure funge, (E for example), or available in other fingerprints
19:12:18 <tusho> Deewiant: that's retarded
19:12:38 <tusho> Deewiant: ok forget BF i am writing a better fingerprint
19:12:42 <tusho> called MKRL (Mike Riley)
19:12:48 <Deewiant> and I like that the specs talk about "message handlers" without saying at all what they are
19:13:28 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well I won't implement any if these new ones I think. Yes I will probably do MVRS in efunge
19:13:46 <Deewiant> I probably won't implement anything completely pointless
19:14:28 <Deewiant> well that's certainly descriptive
19:14:34 <tusho> why are the 0x... things so long?
19:14:38 <AnMaster> well it seems pretty clear, except most doesn't make sense for funge
19:14:48 <tusho> but his are longer
19:14:52 <AnMaster> Deewiant, for example, %zu would make no sense in funge
19:15:04 <Deewiant> AnMaster: erm, "printf style" doesn't really say anything
19:15:15 <Deewiant> C/C++/Java/D/Haskell/other printf? which version?
19:15:25 <AnMaster> Deewiant, obviously C is the default ;P
19:15:37 <Deewiant> AnMaster: and it's "style" anyway, could use D writef as well :-P
19:15:51 <Deewiant> tusho: and that can't be right
19:16:05 <tusho> Deewiant: 0x4A27F51 is right...
19:16:38 <AnMaster> tusho, you wouldn't have said that if I pointed out the error :P
19:16:44 <Deewiant> AnMaster: i.e. it doesn't specify that it has to work like printf, only in the style of printf :-P
19:16:58 <AnMaster> Deewiant, ah I see the issue yes
19:17:19 <Deewiant> AnMaster: which would allow pretty much anything, actually. :-P
19:17:29 <AnMaster> Deewiant, however I suspect trying that philosophical approach would make Mike ignore you ;P
19:17:52 <AnMaster> Deewiant, you or I should get ais to take a look at ICAL
19:17:59 <Deewiant> the single dimension stuff of ARRY is just a poorer form of JSTR
19:18:27 <AnMaster> "Addresses used by this extension are absolute, the storage offset does NOT apply to these functions."
19:18:30 <Deewiant> AnMaster: haha, implement ARRY so that ABCDEF reflect and G pushes 0
19:18:56 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well certainly allowed as it seems, but no I won't
19:19:01 <Deewiant> "Negative array indexes are allowed "
19:19:04 <AnMaster> I won't implement any of these new ones
19:19:13 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I assume same as in C
19:19:35 <AnMaster> Deewiant, may not be segfault, not if the system is running in a non-protected environment
19:19:38 <Deewiant> I'm fairly sure that's implementation-defined in C
19:20:00 <Deewiant> so, it's allowed to be implementation-defined? ;-)
19:20:07 <AnMaster> Deewiant, actually, while that wasn't what I meant, it seems correct
19:20:14 <AnMaster> I meant that it is basically pointer access
19:20:44 <tusho> Deewiant: AnMaster: ok I made my first fingerprint
19:20:45 <AnMaster> a[x] == *(&a + x) (not always and not exactly, but you get my point)
19:20:45 <Deewiant> hmh, BOOL/IMTH/FIXP overlap a lot :-/
19:20:49 <tusho> http://tusho.net/mkry/
19:20:54 <tusho> please review & suggest & implement
19:21:37 <tusho> AnMaster: ehhehehehehehehehehehehehhe............
19:21:40 <Deewiant> tusho: why 0gnirts, pushing ",,,,...." would require a pop
19:21:55 <tusho> Deewiant: eehhehe,,,not sure....
19:22:25 <AnMaster> tusho, I may actually implement that, probably not, but I don't rule out the possibility
19:22:32 <tusho> Deewiant: ah what should i use intsead
19:22:37 <Deewiant> RAND is poorly defined, does it use a generator of its own or not
19:22:57 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well as I said above, IMTH is useless, since there are other fingerprints to do those things, or they are easy in pure funge
19:23:04 <Deewiant> tusho: well, just ( -- chars...) or something
19:23:12 <Deewiant> other than that RAND can be handy
19:23:23 <Deewiant> since if you need a value ? is a bit painful
19:23:37 <tusho> http://tusho.net/mkry/
19:23:47 <Deewiant> also, RAND doesn't really say anything about the qualities of the generator
19:23:48 <AnMaster> tusho, um "All pushes from 3 to 15."
19:24:10 <tusho> Deewiant: i know, crazy, i meant to update it without changing it
19:24:13 <AnMaster> tusho, and yes I love this parody :D
19:24:26 <AnMaster> tusho, just that 3..15 range changed
19:24:29 <Deewiant> is pseudorandom okay for RAND or not? doesn't say. do values need to be evenly distributed? doesn't say.
19:24:46 <tusho> so that ECED works
19:25:04 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well I'd say you should select by fair dice roll then hard code a lookup table
19:25:50 <tusho> what ridiculous thing to write next
19:26:01 <tusho> Deewiant: will you implement mkry
19:26:03 <AnMaster> Deewiant, indeed, I got no idea what those vectors mean
19:26:03 <Deewiant> that too, but wth are those arguments
19:26:10 <tusho> Deewiant: if i provide a file?
19:26:23 <AnMaster> tusho, probably not, but you could try implement it using mini-funge
19:26:32 <AnMaster> I think efunge may handle that
19:26:32 <Deewiant> tusho: I can provide you a file too! See http://www.google.com/index.html
19:26:39 <tusho> Deewiant: if i provide an implementation file
19:26:42 <AnMaster> it will implement dynafing from !Befugne then
19:27:06 <tusho> Deewiant: why not, it'd be a cp :P
19:27:52 <AnMaster> Deewiant, anyway, I still plan my SOCK replacement suite, but I didn't receive any comments on it from you, I did send the mail to you
19:28:23 <tusho> Deewiant: i'd provide a patch
19:28:24 <Deewiant> AnMaster: yeah, which means I don't have anything meaningful to say :-P
19:28:30 <Deewiant> tusho: so it's not just a cp ;-)
19:28:35 <tusho> Deewiant: ok, cp && patch
19:28:38 <tusho> is that acceptable? :P
19:28:53 <AnMaster> Deewiant, but do you like the idea or not?
19:29:01 <tusho> Deewiant: i'll fork ccbi if you don't
19:29:12 <AnMaster> Deewiant, and I would like some input on the "auto handler" for "don't care what ip version"
19:29:17 <Deewiant> tusho: if I were you I'd just do the mini-funge impl :-P
19:29:30 <tusho> Deewiant: i don't know funge.
19:30:29 <tusho> "FRTH" 0x46525448 Some common forth [sic] commands
19:30:44 <Deewiant> that's not how forth is spelled
19:30:55 <tusho> Deewiant: thats how the language name is spelled...
19:31:13 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I said in the mail, the idea of an application in funge being able to use a generic interface for ipv4 and ipv6
19:31:15 <tusho> i'm case-insensitive
19:31:36 <tusho> i use a case-insensitive filesystem and such.
19:31:43 <tusho> and type in lowercase on irc
19:31:59 <Deewiant> Capitalization is the difference between "I had to help my uncle Jack off a horse.." and "I had to help my uncle jack off a horse.."
19:32:16 <tusho> Deewiant: and those sentences are such common, everday occurences
19:32:21 <tusho> besides, i am a fan of innuendo.
19:32:37 <Deewiant> it's a reason for not always being case-insensitive
19:32:57 <Deewiant> AnMaster: so what input do you want on that
19:33:20 <AnMaster> Deewiant, what design would be good for that, yet allow separate ipv6 and ipv4 for those who wanted?
19:33:22 <tusho> Deewiant: i am always, always case-insensitive
19:33:42 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I'm pretty much lost there
19:34:17 <Deewiant> I don't know very much about network programming so I'm not exactly an authority on the topic
19:34:27 <AnMaster> should there be a SCKI for IPv4/6 with a flag for "don't care, ipv4, ipv6"
19:34:43 <Deewiant> or would it be possible to tag a socket with a flag
19:34:57 <Deewiant> and then just use the same interface always
19:35:16 <AnMaster> well the shared parts would have the same interface
19:35:19 <Deewiant> when you create a socket, specify a flag, like the current SOCK does, for whether it's IPv4/IPv6
19:35:38 <AnMaster> yes makes sense in a SCKI part
19:35:45 <AnMaster> since we need SCKU for unix sockets
19:36:10 <AnMaster> so one for core (NSCK), then SCKI for TCP/UDP + IP, and SCKU for unix sockets
19:36:29 <Deewiant> yeah, unix sockets mess everything up :-P
19:36:45 <AnMaster> Deewiant, to make stuff more portable it is separate
19:37:00 <Deewiant> if they didn't exist, it would be much simpler :-)
19:37:21 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well you could choose not to implement SCKU
19:37:41 <Deewiant> you should leave it open anyway
19:37:59 <Deewiant> maybe add an instruction to query whether a certain flag combination (TCP/IPv4 for instance) is supported
19:38:09 <tusho> Deewiant: fingerprints/tusho/mkry.d GOOOOOOO
19:38:11 <AnMaster> http://rcfunge98.com/dyfp.f98 <-- hm can't find any details for that fingerprint?
19:38:15 <Deewiant> so that you know that creating a socket fails for that reason and not just randomly
19:38:37 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well ok it would be part of SCKI
19:39:16 <AnMaster> the core could have an instruction to list supported address family fingerprints
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19:40:17 <tusho> your fingerprint mechanism is confusing kekekekekekekke ^________^
19:40:19 <AnMaster> tusho, implement it in dynafing
19:40:31 <AnMaster> tusho, ah, you don't support "kekekekekekekke" in MKRY!
19:40:45 <AnMaster> or maybe that should be in TUSH?
19:40:48 <tusho> AnMaster: it is MKRY
19:44:40 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I just got a good idea for a fingerprint, that is *truely* non-portable
19:44:52 <tusho> AnMaster: 'Spec: Be non-portable.'
19:45:08 <AnMaster> ERLANG (cells have to be larger than 32-bit, probably BIGNUM to fit the name)
19:45:18 <AnMaster> E evaluate 0"gnirts" as erlang
19:45:29 <tusho> AnMaster: total ripoff of my BF
19:45:31 <AnMaster> of course I won't implement such a thing in efunge
19:45:54 <AnMaster> tusho, point it is would require the interpreter to be written in erlang
19:46:07 <tusho> just run an erlang process in the background
19:46:15 <tusho> and send off the string
19:46:43 <tusho> AnMaster: it's still portable
19:46:58 <AnMaster> tusho, no, since it have to evaluate within the context of the interpreter
19:47:09 <tusho> AnMaster: the spec does not say that
19:47:11 <AnMaster> possibly affecting interpreter internals
19:47:18 <tusho> and that's easy too
19:47:19 <AnMaster> tusho, they do, but I wasn't finished with them
19:47:23 <tusho> write an interp bridge in erlang
19:47:29 <tusho> that just sends it back to your other-lang interp
19:47:33 <tusho> and changes the interp there
19:47:43 <AnMaster> tusho, could be hard if it is in C or C++ or whatever
19:48:25 * tusho points a gun at AnMaster's head
19:48:31 <tusho> implement it or BANG.
19:48:47 * AnMaster implements BANG to reflect on everything
19:48:55 <tusho> implement it or i will shoot you.
19:49:03 <AnMaster> tusho, sorry since BANG will reflect
19:49:12 <AnMaster> it would just bounce and hit yourself
19:49:38 <AnMaster> tusho, anyway no I won't ever implement it
19:49:51 <tusho> not even if i would kill you if you didn't?
19:50:18 <AnMaster> that would be an extremely silly action of you
19:50:34 <tusho> AnMaster: but if i did?
19:51:43 <AnMaster> anyway I haven't worked out how fingerprints should work in efunge yet
19:51:57 <tusho> AnMaster: so you value not implementing ERLANG over your life
19:56:28 <AnMaster> wonder if ais will be here tomorrow
19:56:52 <AnMaster> and I'm going to ignore you when you get too silly
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20:47:24 <oerjan> hey, i resemble that glob
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21:15:19 <oerjan> And then a miracle happens
21:17:23 <Deewiant> http://arcanux.org/lambdacats/impossible.jpg
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21:45:37 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | There are probably many..
21:46:33 <oerjan> There can be only one!
21:49:07 <oerjan> http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ThereCanBeOnlyOne (warning: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TVTropesWillRuinYourLife)
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22:10:19 <tusho> oerjan: is there a TerriblePun trope on tehre
22:17:31 <oerjan> not exactly, but try http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HurricaneOfPuns
22:17:59 <tusho> http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/08.09.10
22:18:03 <tusho> slowest day in an awful long while
22:19:59 <oerjan> it was because the earth was destroyed
22:28:31 <oerjan> incidentally there was a 16 year old Indian girl who committed suicide when she heard about the LHC fears. I think she might be a good candidate for the Darwin award.
22:29:05 <Slereah> Only if the earth isn't destroyed :o
22:29:55 <tusho> i am a zombeeeeeeeeeee
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22:32:19 <fungot> tusho: i should also buy another notebook a 1,3 kg lightweight p3 samsung, 1 cm thick, 12" disp, complete with a tent rather than a primitive.
22:32:25 <tusho> Slereah: Shut up: You are dead. You cannot talk.
22:32:34 <fizzie> Heh, a laptop with a tent.
22:32:46 <tusho> fizzie: But no primitives.
22:32:49 <tusho> How does it run...?
22:32:58 <oerjan> tusho: you ate only his brain, no vital organs
22:33:35 <oerjan> i thought that was just zombie grammar
22:35:28 <oerjan> alternative theory: Slereah is speaking from inside your stomach
22:36:33 <oerjan> fungot: are you a markov bot?
22:36:34 <fungot> oerjan: it's the year 2006
22:37:04 <tusho> oerjan: no, we're not in some demented vore slashfiction
22:37:12 <tusho> Slereah is thoroughly dead and cannot speak.
22:37:22 <tusho> (I mean, I *hope* we're not in some demented vore slashfiction...)
22:37:29 <oerjan> third try: he's a ghost
22:37:42 <oerjan> i mean if there are zombies there can be ghosts
22:37:45 <Slereah> tusho : Do you have a boner
22:37:51 <tusho> Slereah: No, and you still cannot speak.
22:37:56 <tusho> You have not risen from the dead yet.
22:38:05 <oerjan> Slereah: Rise and shine
22:38:20 <tusho> oerjan: if he was a ghost then he wouldn't respond to pings
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