←2009-02-24 2009-02-25 2009-02-26→ ↑2009 ↑all
00:00:32 -!- [helloworld] has joined.
00:00:44 <[helloworld]> hello, how to write modulo in Brainfuck
00:00:52 <[helloworld]> a modulo b
00:01:33 <ehird> it's on bf algos pag
00:01:33 <ehird> e
00:01:34 <ehird> iirc
00:01:37 <ehird> http://esolangs.org
00:01:47 <oerjan> grmbl wiki is slow
00:02:21 <[helloworld]> i mean something like if i type Z from keyboard it should return me A
00:02:45 <[helloworld]> so it's modulo, isn't it?
00:03:22 <oerjan> that's a little ... vague
00:03:32 <ehird> [helloworld]: no.
00:03:37 <ehird> do you know what modulo is ?
00:03:49 <[helloworld]> yes
00:04:16 <ehird> are you sure?
00:04:23 <ehird> but it's on the wiki, if you are
00:04:41 <[helloworld]> i could do modulo 26 + 36
00:05:02 <[helloworld]> or something like that, i don't remember ascii values now
00:05:36 <[helloworld]> so maybe whats the trickier method to do that: read char if it's Z return A, otherwise return that char?
00:06:00 <kerlo> Add a constant, take it modulo 26, add another constant.
00:06:42 <[helloworld]> kerlo, yes, i meant that, but ehird said it's wrong way
00:06:54 <[helloworld]> am i right?
00:07:07 <oklopol> wut.
00:07:11 <[helloworld]> maybe it's better method using smething like if()?
00:07:16 <ehird> what you're saying doesn't make much sense, really, but for {Z->A;x->x}, modulo would work.
00:07:17 <kerlo> To be precise: add 14, take it modulo 26, add 65.
00:07:38 <oklopol> it would?
00:07:46 <[helloworld]> ehird, do you think is better way to solve that?
00:07:59 <oerjan> [helloworld]: you're meaning rot-N of letters? that's not the same as modulo but modulo can be used to implement it. in bf that's probably overkill though.
00:08:00 <ehird> Just check its value
00:08:00 <kerlo> [helloworld]: my modulo method works perfectly fine if you know the input is A-Z.
00:08:06 <ehird> [helloworld]: try this
00:08:20 <ehird> err, whatever
00:08:20 <oklopol> kerlo: huh?
00:08:20 <ehird> just if it
00:08:33 <oklopol> hmm
00:08:40 <oklopol> well there's a 1/26 chance you're right
00:08:50 <[helloworld]> kerlo, ik now that but i have problems with codein' modulo in BF
00:08:57 <kerlo> No, the chance is decidedly greater. :-P
00:08:59 <ehird> its on the wiki
00:09:00 <ehird> i just told you that
00:09:12 <oerjan> ehird: the wiki is practically down
00:09:15 <oklopol> kerlo: oh was 14 for adding one?
00:09:17 <ehird> no it's not
00:09:18 <ehird> works fine for me
00:09:22 <kerlo> oklopol: yes.
00:09:27 <oklopol> right, right.
00:09:30 <oerjan> i couldn't get the page a moment ago
00:09:39 <ehird> [helloworld]: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Brainfuck_algorithms#Divmod_algorithm
00:09:43 <oklopol> i assumed rot-13, because clearly you'd add 14 to rotate by 13.
00:09:45 <ehird> just ignore the div result
00:10:00 <[helloworld]> oklopol, so my algorithm will be do something like rot-1
00:10:07 <ehird> no
00:10:10 <ehird> for all other letters, it'd id
00:10:17 <ehird> all you're doing is s/Z/A/
00:10:47 <[helloworld]> rot-1 for {A,B,C....Z}
00:10:56 <oklopol> [helloworld]: kinda trivial to do that special case, just inc, and check if z+1
00:11:28 <[helloworld]> oklopol, how to code it?
00:11:31 <oklopol> ...you can do an if right?
00:11:43 <[helloworld]> but how in BF?
00:11:50 <oklopol> is that a no?
00:12:02 <ehird> oklopol is so funny
00:12:08 <oklopol> :|
00:12:14 <oklopol> i'm not trying to be
00:12:21 <ehird> it's a no, yes.
00:12:23 <oklopol> i didn't know what he was referring to.
00:12:24 <[helloworld]> i have been searching if condition if brainfuck but really can't find :/
00:12:32 <oklopol> right, so that's your prob
00:12:38 <oklopol> just check the algo page or think about it a bit
00:13:04 <oklopol> one solution is to use one bit of extra state info to get the loop to be done just once
00:13:04 <[helloworld]> ok, thanks a lot, i gona read it and try to code it ;) cya
00:13:09 <ehird> omg oklopol
00:13:10 <ehird> http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/7zip9/i_was_reading_through_some_old_python_mailing/c07umsq
00:13:13 <ehird> higher order functions
00:13:17 <ehird> in ms dos
00:13:19 <ehird> batch
00:13:19 <ehird> files
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00:13:26 <ehird> functional dos.
00:13:50 <oklopol> anyway ehird i don't really see how you can nag about my not being sure what he meant after being a jackass to him until that point
00:14:05 <oklopol> or maybe you actually didn't get him, dunno, same thing.
00:14:07 <ehird> i was being a jackass? news to me.
00:14:18 <ehird> he wasn't stating his problem clearly. i told him this.
00:14:27 <oklopol> YEAH WELL YOUR MUM
00:14:34 <oklopol> you see i'm fucking pissed at myself atm.
00:14:39 <ehird> why
00:14:46 <oklopol> and because i'm also very tired, i can't separate you from me.
00:14:50 <oklopol> because we're one of a kind
00:14:52 <oklopol> well
00:14:53 <oklopol> you know
00:14:55 <oklopol> should do
00:14:57 <oklopol> and i play.
00:15:01 <oklopol> hearts
00:15:05 <oklopol> it's a great game
00:15:40 <ehird> oklopol; so are you green
00:16:39 <oklopol> shall i assume the literal sense?
00:18:16 <oklopol> well anyway, i'm green in all senses and nonsenses
00:18:22 <oklopol> and now i'm really going
00:18:29 <oklopol> and my computer is so hot it hurts my lap
00:18:36 <oklopol> ~~~>
00:19:20 <Slereah_> Are you hot in the lap, oklopol? <3
00:20:35 <AnMaster> ehird, there?
00:20:41 <ehird> yes
00:20:45 <AnMaster> ehird, I don't get 1/0 strip 130...
00:20:50 <AnMaster> what is "jar breeze"
00:20:58 <AnMaster> google wasn't helpfulk
00:21:00 <AnMaster> helpful*
00:21:18 <ehird> Either nonsense or a reference to a contemporary comic circa 2001.
00:21:24 <ehird> Which I have no idea.
00:21:44 <AnMaster> ah
00:22:05 <oerjan> AnMaster: it refers to a jar mentioned in one of the very first comics
00:22:13 <AnMaster> oerjan, oh that jar...
00:22:18 <ehird> Well, x is a contemporary of x...
00:22:20 <oerjan> which indeed is taken from another comic
00:22:25 <AnMaster> oerjan, oh?
00:22:28 <AnMaster> I never understood it
00:22:31 <AnMaster> the jar
00:22:56 <oerjan> the jar and barnacle jones (iirc) was stolen from another comic
00:23:02 <oerjan> as the very first characters
00:23:16 <AnMaster> oerjan, yeah I didn't get barnacle jones...
00:23:19 <oerjan> (well the jar wasn't a character)
00:23:34 <ehird> AnMaster: dude, read the annotations
00:23:38 <ehird> they pop up every few strips
00:23:41 <AnMaster> annotations?
00:23:43 <AnMaster> oh ok
00:23:51 <ehird> AnMaster: you are reading the undefined.net/1/0/ version right
00:23:59 <AnMaster> ehird, yep
00:24:04 <AnMaster> didn't notice annotations
00:24:11 <ehird> they appear right below the comic :P
00:24:19 <ehird> for barnacle:
00:24:20 <ehird> Check out this comic for an explanation of "Barnacle" Jones' origins!
00:24:20 <ehird> I have yet to get the authour's explicit permission to use this strip this way. If anyone knows how I can get in touch with him, please help!
00:24:23 <AnMaster> ehird, above the buttons?
00:24:25 <ehird> the link: http://www.undefined.net/1/0/history.gif
00:24:26 <ehird> AnMaster: yep
00:24:36 <AnMaster> oh I never noticed it
00:28:46 * oerjan is a bit sorry for cracking Puzzlang
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00:29:10 <oerjan> (see wiki)
00:29:49 <AnMaster> oerjan, err?
00:30:24 <oerjan> >_<
00:30:44 <oerjan> it's a new language, posted today
00:31:50 <oerjan> which the inventor said was almost impossible to program, but it isn't.
00:32:06 <oerjan> unless i messed up my bf translation
00:33:05 <oklopol> oerjan: bad oerjan!
00:33:33 * oerjan swats himself -----###
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00:39:53 <kerlo> If I understand correctly, it's easy to decrement a whole bunch of times and then do something.
00:40:19 <kerlo> Just alternate between blank lines, lines containing nothing but -, and lines that actually contain useful stuff.
00:41:29 <oerjan> yep, and then the rest of it is to note that a sufficient large triangle can increment
00:45:59 <kerlo> Indeed.
00:49:13 <oerjan> hm it is also easy to do several useful things on one line, since all the decrements are done on the previous line
00:53:18 <kerlo> Don't call something difficult unless you invented it three years ago, it's simple, and still nobody knows whether it's Turing-complete or not. :-)
00:58:25 * kerlo goes through all the languages older than /// in [[Category:Unknown computational class]] and tries to determine whether they're Turing-complete or not
01:06:17 * kerlo dismisses 3D as ill-defined despite having an interpreter
01:07:26 <kerlo> And now I'm feeling sick, so I'm going to go take a placebo.
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05:22:11 <Sgeo> G'night all
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06:13:03 <GregorR> Now that I've started hosting my projects at codu, my barrier for starting a new project has gotten so low that I start stupid projects I'll never finish.
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09:09:19 <oklopol> GregorR: welcome to the club of the cool
09:30:39 <oklopol> actually i just have a todo list nowadays.
09:31:16 <oklopol> used to have a programming projects folder, but that was ...suboptimal.
09:31:24 <oklopol> well okay naturally i have that too
09:31:39 <oklopol> but anyway. frogs.
10:06:31 <psygnisfive> frogs?!
10:06:32 <psygnisfive> like...
10:06:34 <psygnisfive> french people?
10:06:59 <psygnisfive> i have a programming folder inside my projects folder.
10:09:16 <oklopol> yes i do something like that too
10:09:34 <oklopol> actually i split by programming language, which is stupid imo.
10:09:38 <oklopol> i'd never do that if i were me
10:10:44 <psygnisfive> my projects folder: blog stuff, conlangs, conworlds, cyberbrains, efc archives, fashion, formal memetics, iptv shows, linguistics, megacities, philosophy, political writing, programming, sinogram fonts, t-shirts
10:11:53 <psygnisfive> inside programming: antigravity, ectoplasm, evolutionary algorithms, human-language like pl, linguistics db, lisp machine, misc javascript, oomysql, reactance, teaching js
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10:23:50 <oklopol> fashion?
10:24:03 <psygnisfive> yes
10:24:20 <psygnisfive> pics ive saved from various sources that embody certain stylistic elements that i want to experiment with
10:24:25 <oklopol> (...are you gay or something?)
10:24:32 <psygnisfive> :D
10:24:42 <psygnisfive> huge homofag
10:24:57 <psygnisfive> but _I_ atleast dont play pokemon!
10:25:59 <oklopol> i'll poke anything that has six tails
10:26:17 * psygnisfive pokes oklopol
10:26:21 <psygnisfive> teach me finnish
10:26:53 <oklopol> i don't really play pokemon, i thought i'd finish one of them at some point, because all my finnirl friends were playing it
10:27:02 <oklopol> but i fucked up all the save files like 10 times
10:27:07 <psygnisfive> well no, dont, you probably dont understand finnish grammar :p
10:27:11 <oklopol> so i just removed it
10:27:18 <oklopol> "understand"
10:27:26 <psygnisfive> you probably dont!
10:27:30 <oklopol> i don't even understand what your understanding is.
10:27:50 <psygnisfive> you obviously speak finnish, but thats not the same as knowing the grammar.
10:28:10 <oklopol> what's "knowing the grammar"? i know the rules.
10:28:24 <oklopol> but i know them in english too, that apparently isn't "knowing the grammar"
10:28:30 <psygnisfive> well, you can speak it, sure
10:28:32 <psygnisfive> but i mean like
10:28:58 <psygnisfive> could you explain to me what tree transformations are going on in the production of a finnish sentence?
10:29:00 <psygnisfive> probably not!
10:29:11 <oklopol> i definitely couldn't
10:29:19 <psygnisfive> yeah.
10:31:08 <oklopol> (but i do know more than pretty much any non-linquist you'll find here [if you allow me to lie a little])
10:31:21 <oklopol> {i don't actually know that, it's just my experience}
10:31:32 <oklopol> <bracketfest>
10:31:34 <psygnisfive> ::nod::
10:31:36 <psygnisfive> but like
10:32:04 <psygnisfive> could you give me a fairly detailed account of nominal morphology and the times when the various morphs are used
10:32:07 <psygnisfive> probably not eh
10:32:49 <oklopol> hmm
10:33:16 <oklopol> i do have something to say about that, but nothing fairly detailed, i think i know the big picture about that if i understood the q.
10:34:30 <oklopol> should probably study that, the problem is i hear the introductory courses are hell, teaching trees and all that to people who liked writing pretty essays in high school.
10:34:54 <psygnisfive> eh
10:35:07 <psygnisfive> its not that bad but a lot of people dont understand what theyre getting themselves into
10:35:14 <psygnisfive> linguistics is NOT <insert language here>
10:36:10 <oklopol> do realize i haven't actually taken linguistics courses, and the guy who i heard this from has a tendency to leave the lecture because of something the lecturer said that he considered too trivial.
10:36:25 <oklopol> (i do that too tho)
10:36:31 <psygnisfive> lol
10:36:52 <oklopol> it's the god i'm wasting my time here reflex
10:37:41 <oklopol> (i don't know about you but in our uni it's pretty much standard practise to leave whenever you want to)
10:38:01 <psygnisfive> hm well its considered rude here
10:40:01 <oklopol> well naturally some lecturers may give you the evil eye if you make too much noise, but attendance is not compulsory, so.
10:40:41 <oklopol> not really considered rude here, at least among me.
10:40:49 <psygnisfive> its not compulsory here, usually, tho some profs factor attendance into grades
10:41:41 <oklopol> our courses are usually entirely about the exam, and you can get extra points for exercises or projects.
10:42:26 <psygnisfive> hm
10:45:36 <oklopol> exercises are usually compulsory to some percentage though.
10:45:43 <psygnisfive> yah.
10:46:03 <oklopol> so in practise there's a lot of compulsory attendance.
10:47:29 <oklopol> (also this is just the it department, the others are much less "free")
10:47:44 <oklopol> *-"
10:47:46 <oklopol> *-"
10:47:56 <psygnisfive> hm.
10:49:34 <oklopol> BW(BC).
10:49:42 <psygnisfive> BW(BC)?
10:50:02 <oklopol> yeah it means you're a hummingbird
10:50:08 <psygnisfive> :D
10:50:09 <oklopol> cuz ya hum.
10:50:32 * psygnisfive flutters around, hovering occasionally
10:51:26 <oklopol> "deadline 3, computation time 6"
10:51:32 <oklopol> something doesn't look right
10:51:34 <psygnisfive> che?
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10:52:36 <psygnisfive> ayo migomipo
10:55:22 <MigoMipo> Hi psygnisfive
11:12:25 <oklopol> byeeee
11:12:26 <oklopol> ->
11:31:09 <psygnisfive> bye okolove
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14:26:41 <impomatic> my shared ip was banned again :-(
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16:58:29 <AnMaster> err
16:58:37 <AnMaster> how do you escape a ? in a URL?
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16:59:03 <AnMaster> web archive is acting up because of it....
17:01:00 <AnMaster> ah found it
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17:26:30 <AnMaster> hrrm oerjan not here...
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18:48:55 <oerjan> <AnMaster> hrrm oerjan not here...
18:48:59 <oerjan> IS TOO
18:52:09 <lament> OH NO
18:52:31 * oerjan hurriedly checks IWC
18:52:42 <AnMaster> oerjan, hi
18:52:52 <oerjan> ho
18:53:05 <AnMaster> oerjan, checked IWC?
18:53:24 <AnMaster> I think IWC jumped the frog when the universe exploded
18:53:27 <AnMaster> really
18:53:37 <oerjan> in case that was what you were going to ask
18:53:55 <AnMaster> ?
18:54:03 <oerjan> well it jumped the shark a long time ago
18:54:13 <AnMaster> oerjan, yes in the mythbuster theme iirc
18:54:27 <AnMaster> point is, I don't think it is as funny as the early strips any more
18:54:32 <AnMaster> it is doing an xkcd
18:54:42 <AnMaster> well not exactly
18:54:45 <AnMaster> but very close
18:55:25 <oerjan> i'm not sure i agree
18:55:39 <AnMaster> really?
18:55:47 <oerjan> the featureless mountains were a nice touch :D
18:57:22 <oerjan> well it is a bit long-winded
18:58:41 <AnMaster> yeah
18:58:54 <AnMaster> get normal universe back before mid-March please..
18:59:34 <oklopol> oh you mean kinda like *your mom*
19:06:16 <oklopol> also "jumping the frog" was kinda funny after reading where the term comes from
19:06:47 <oklopol> then again, what isn't these days
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23:18:58 <oerjan> fucking wiki locking up just as i'm saving :<
23:19:39 <oerjan> apparently insulting it helps.
23:20:35 <oklopol> can you say the f word on irc? :|
23:20:46 <oerjan> it's been done before, i'm sure
23:21:17 * oklopol checks
23:22:01 <oklopol> hmm.
23:22:19 <oklopol> i'm getting a deja vu from when i searched for "and" once.
23:23:07 <oerjan> by a remarkable coincidence, "and" has never been used (although it has been mentioned)
23:23:38 <oklopol> ah, they were all instances of "brainfuck"
23:23:45 <oerjan> nope
23:24:00 <oklopol> nope?
23:24:04 <oerjan> i am sure ehird used -fucking- as an infix the other day
23:24:25 <oklopol> yes but he used -brain- in an earlier message
23:24:42 <oerjan> so it was really a brainfuck circumfix, you say?
23:25:00 <oklopol> more like amongfix
23:25:09 <AnMaster> a (not very) interesting speed test:
23:25:11 <AnMaster> dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/null& pid=$! ; sleep 30; kill -USR1 $pid; sleep 1; kill $pid
23:28:30 * oerjan supposes correcting bad language _is_ appropriate for a Playground program
23:30:36 * GregorR takes a bow.
23:31:25 <oklopol> hey that was kinda ironic
23:31:33 <oerjan> not really.
23:31:41 <oerjan> too obvious for that.
23:32:00 <oklopol> yes, it was probably something deeperer
23:32:52 <oerjan> it was mock-ironic, i guess
23:33:29 <AnMaster> err
23:33:30 <AnMaster> no
23:33:33 <oklopol> deeper.
23:33:34 <AnMaster> post-mock-ironic
23:33:35 <oerjan> not to be confused with macaronic
23:34:02 <oerjan> there is no post mock-ironic. that's the end of humor.
23:34:11 <oklopol> post-humorous comedy
23:34:13 <oerjan> it dies there, horribly.
23:34:32 <AnMaster> oerjan, yeah now what was that quote...
23:34:35 * AnMaster tries to remember
23:34:42 <AnMaster> probably from before I began logging irc
23:34:45 * oerjan has no idea
23:34:55 <oklopol> what quote, i can search again
23:35:02 <oklopol> i'm a searcher boy
23:35:03 <AnMaster> oklopol, not in #esoteric
23:35:05 <AnMaster> other channel
23:35:09 <AnMaster> #init probably
23:35:11 <oklopol> i can search there too.
23:35:17 <AnMaster> this was from before my time in #esoteric
23:35:34 <oerjan> ironically, the quote was lost
23:36:25 <oerjan> also not to be confused with macarenic. hm that _might_ be an even later stage.
23:36:33 <oerjan> sort of zombie humor
23:36:58 <AnMaster> /mnt/cdrom $ bzgrep -i alice */*.bz2 | grep -i post
23:37:02 <AnMaster> lets see if that helps
23:37:07 <oklopol> macarenic?
23:37:07 <AnMaster> since it didn't seem to be #init
23:37:15 <AnMaster> oklopol, ?
23:37:23 <oerjan> oklopol: lots of singing and dancing
23:37:25 <oklopol> AnMaster: i'm just suggesting.
23:37:28 <AnMaster> oklopol, GRAIINS
23:37:38 <oerjan> oops
23:37:46 <oklopol> oerjan: so from the song, just wondered about the zombies
23:37:48 <AnMaster> well
23:38:01 <AnMaster> it is quite possible the quote is too old for me to have a log of it
23:38:09 <oerjan> oklopol: that was an afterthought. after death, that is.
23:38:32 <AnMaster> I began IRC in 2004 or so, my logs go back to 2005
23:38:34 <oerjan> AnMaster: perhaps it was a past life regression, from ancient greece or egypt
23:38:35 <AnMaster> so
23:38:45 <AnMaster> could very well be 2004
23:38:58 <AnMaster> + bzgrep takes ages
23:39:04 <oklopol> oerjan: ohhoh!
23:39:26 <oerjan> i guess that would be mummy humor
23:40:04 <AnMaster> oerjan, your mummy is fat?
23:40:17 <oklopol> hey i get that :DDDDDDDD
23:40:31 <oerjan> no, just dead. also, she was never fat, very skinny.
23:40:41 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
23:40:45 <AnMaster> oerjan, oh ok
23:45:37 <AnMaster> anyway iirc it was like this
23:47:33 <AnMaster> someone were discussing a post-modern book, and someone mentioned something about post-humorous... And they found some persons in books that were post-modern or post-humours. Then someone asked what you were if you were post-modern AND post-humorous. Answer: Dead.
23:47:50 <AnMaster> can't find the full (and funny) quote
23:48:34 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined.
23:49:03 <oerjan> posthumous, that is
23:49:29 <AnMaster> oerjan, no
23:49:33 <AnMaster> post-humorous
23:49:39 <oerjan> *whoosh*
23:49:52 <AnMaster> oerjan, posthumous is something else
23:49:54 <GregorR> post-hummus
23:49:56 <AnMaster> and an existing word
23:50:27 <oerjan> *whoosh*
23:51:19 <oerjan> GregorR: well if you're also from the maghreb area...
23:51:29 -!- oklopol has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
23:51:36 -!- oklopol has joined.
23:51:46 <oerjan> um wait, levantine
23:52:16 <oerjan> lots of post-hummus people in gaza these days
23:52:28 <AnMaster> wth...
23:52:35 <AnMaster> firefox was using around 2 GB memory
23:52:40 <AnMaster> explains all the swap trashing
23:52:44 <AnMaster> I have 1.5 GB RAM
23:56:29 <GregorR> Goooo Firefox 8-D
23:56:57 <GregorR> Sounds like Trac 0.11 8-D
23:57:02 <AnMaster> GregorR, err?
23:57:07 <AnMaster> I used trac 0.10 before...
23:57:12 <AnMaster> don't know 0.11 well
23:57:17 <AnMaster> what about it?
23:57:23 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Remote closed the connection).
23:57:38 <GregorR> I had Trac 0.11 on codu.org for a long time, it routinely chewed up all my memory and killed everything while responding to queries in a timely "I'll get to it when I feel like it" sort of way.
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23:57:42 <GregorR> I finally downgraded.
23:58:07 <AnMaster> GregorR, hope you reported this as a bug?
23:58:14 <AnMaster> a REGRESSION BUG
23:58:16 <GregorR> It's been reported numerous times.
23:58:20 <AnMaster> GregorR, and?
23:58:47 <GregorR> And they say "Trac 0.11 uses a new rendering engine which takes a bit more memory. In most situations the difference shouldn't be noticeable, and we choose to ignore your situation."
23:58:53 <GregorR> (Not in so many words :P )
23:58:58 <AnMaster> ah
23:59:08 <AnMaster> but it is often noticeable?
23:59:34 <GregorR> It was /always/ absurdly slow, so yeah.
23:59:55 <AnMaster> IMO all apps should have upper limits on how much they will allocate
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