00:00:08 <aliseiphone> that's like mixing cyanide and heroin, dumping it in a public place
00:00:11 <ais523> it could turn into the programming equivalent of goatse
00:01:19 <ais523> still, I'm still convinced that Feather is consistent, somehow
00:01:20 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, add "FURTHER WARNING: MIGHT DRIVE YOU INSANE"
00:01:23 <ais523> and can be implemented
00:01:23 * Sgeo_ wants to learn Feather
00:01:29 <ais523> Sgeo_: so do I, and I invented it
00:01:37 <ais523> AnMaster: today is a /really/ bad day
00:01:45 <ais523> maybe I'll try on Thursday
00:01:46 <oerjan> aliseiphone: i thought that was essentially the name-giving comic for Cyanide and Happiness
00:02:00 <AnMaster> ais523, sometime within the next few years is OK for me
00:02:11 <ais523> WARNING: READING THIS SIGN IS A WASTE OF YOUR TIME
00:02:18 -!- aschueler has joined.
00:02:30 <ais523> aliseiphone: I thought cyanide /smelt/ like almonds
00:02:37 <ais523> discovering what it tastes like is quite difficult to do safely
00:02:57 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, or do you think that should be a WARNING
00:03:04 <ais523> but the almond smell is a good way to detect accidental cyanide leaks in chemical labs, that's why it's well known
00:03:25 <Sgeo_> NOTE: MAY CAUSE LACK OF NUTS
00:03:29 <cpressey> I'm worried about accidental almond paste leaks now
00:03:35 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, people can go nuts from it
00:03:46 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, so it doesn't contain nuts. It causes nuts
00:03:52 * Sgeo_ is just being random now
00:03:54 <ais523> cpressey: recently, there was a giant leak at a natural gas odorising factory
00:04:01 <ais523> which was responsible for adding the smell to natural gas
00:04:04 * Sgeo_ is on lack of sleep, for not as good a reason as ais523
00:04:11 <ais523> well, I say "recently" meaning "within the past decade or two"
00:04:17 <Sgeo_> Hopefully, I won't turn into those people who die due to not sleeping and just gaming
00:04:20 <aliseiphone> cpressey: Don't worry. Just look out for the smell of cyanide.
00:04:22 <ais523> because I tend to be less precise with language when lacking sleep
00:04:50 <AnMaster> ais523, you are sleep deprived? Why?
00:04:50 <aliseiphone> ais523: Recently -- I think matter had established itself by this point -- ...
00:04:53 <Sgeo_> I'm planning on locking myself out of Internet access from certain time to certain time
00:05:08 <ais523> AnMaster: trying to finish off an academic paper
00:05:17 <ais523> well, actually having finished it and the deadline expires in 56 minutes
00:05:28 <ais523> and yet I haven't heard from the person who's /meant/ to be submitting it
00:05:37 <AnMaster> ais523, send it in yourself then?
00:05:37 <ais523> and am staying up until the deadline in case something happens
00:05:47 <aliseiphone> So, I seem to be heading for the discharge. Hmm, that innuendo was unintentional.
00:06:00 <ais523> I'm not the primary author, and I didn't submit the abstract
00:06:22 <cpressey> Oh, all hell is loosing break on #esoteric today it seems.
00:06:23 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, I wouldn't have noticed the innuendo if you hadn't mentioned it
00:06:32 <AnMaster> cpressey, why does it seem like that?
00:06:44 <Sgeo_> Wawait, discharge? As in freedom?
00:06:49 <cpressey> AnMaster: FLOWERS. PRETTY FLOWERS.
00:07:08 <aliseiphone> No, to a section of the local high school.
00:07:36 <ais523> cpressey: you don't want to see all hell loosing
00:07:36 <AnMaster> cpressey, What does your flowers make you feel like?
00:07:39 <ais523> a few minor imps is bad enough
00:07:44 <cpressey> aliseiphone: Oh, I thought you were talking about your phone battery.
00:07:55 <cpressey> aliseiphone: So is that... good-ish news?
00:08:18 <aliseiphone> I get to sleep at home and use a computer. So yes.
00:08:21 <cpressey> No, man. That's goinge one "innuendo" too far.
00:08:27 <ais523> aliseiphone: how does it feel to be thrown out of a mental institution for being insufficiently insane?
00:08:47 <AnMaster> cpressey, do you understand how "phone" "battery" is innuendo
00:09:32 <aliseiphone> Then "configure" your "wireless base station"
00:09:37 <AnMaster> that's just terrible as far as innuendo goes
00:10:02 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, at least you missed fizzie's epic fail at innuendo
00:10:26 <aliseiphone> ais523: btw, you're teaching CS at #esoteric U
00:10:36 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, search for this in logs: <fizzie> Gregor-P: What about it, how big are your... chars?
00:10:45 <cpressey> ais523: Are you doing this stint with or without the benefit of caffeine?
00:10:52 <aliseiphone> aka The #esoteric Institute for Higher Education
00:10:54 <ais523> I don't drink caffeine
00:11:04 <ais523> although I do eat chocolate on occasion, and some caffeine will have entered my body that way
00:11:29 <ais523> aliseiphone: if it doesn't collapse the same way eso-std.org did...
00:11:56 <Sgeo_> Wasn't eso-std.org alise's thing?
00:11:58 <aliseiphone> ais523: All we need is an organisation, a building and accreditation.
00:12:59 <ais523> Sgeo_: it was basically being run by alise and AnMaster, and you know how badly those two get on
00:13:08 <ais523> probably part of the cause of its collapse
00:13:22 <ais523> I thought he tried to submit funge-109 to it
00:13:32 <AnMaster> ais523, all I did was make some comments like "good idea" and some suggestions
00:13:41 <ais523> aliseiphone: I was involved in the running of the site, IIRC
00:13:41 <aliseiphone> cpressey: The standards were the least important part.
00:13:51 <ais523> but was impatient due to the lack of any actual standardisation going on
00:14:10 <ais523> the world does need an esoteric standards organisation
00:14:32 <ais523> for allowing portability in things like brainfuck, Befunge and INTERCAL
00:15:02 <aliseiphone> Anyway, pikhq will teach systems administration, pikhq and me can teach software engineering I guess, Gregor, pikhq, cpressey and me can teach language design
00:15:17 <Sgeo_> What do I teach? How to overengineer?
00:15:35 <ais523> aliseiphone: I could possibly beat anyone here at the enterprisey sort of software engineering, at least
00:15:40 <ais523> after all, I teach /Java/ for a living
00:15:52 <Gregor-P> wtf, why is the entire channel on PL :P
00:15:53 <cpressey> ais523: Please explain, and then justify, JNLP.
00:15:56 <aliseiphone> ais523: Which is why I didn't include you in that class. :P
00:15:56 <ais523> so I'm decent at enterprisey theory
00:16:21 <ais523> cpressey: JNLP is a way of running programs remotely over the internet with strict security checks
00:16:34 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, and Gregor-P teaches music?
00:16:35 <ais523> the idea is that you can just load a JNLP program without user confirmation, because it can't do anything bad
00:16:42 <ais523> (I think this idea is somewhat dubious, btw)
00:16:57 <aliseiphone> AnMaster: Ha, next you'll be suggesting degrees in English.
00:16:58 <ais523> it's meant to be a new and innovative way to distribute applications
00:17:11 <ais523> because the application isn't on your computer, but on the internet, it gets automatic updates, etc, for free
00:17:31 <cpressey> ais523: Thank you, that was actually informative.
00:17:41 <ais523> also, you can ask for more privs than the default if the application is signed; upon it being updated, it keeps those privs without re-prompting despite a potentialy completely different codebase
00:17:54 <ais523> at this point, I look at JNLP with extreme suspicion, even though I can see how it's useful
00:17:58 <aliseiphone> cpressey: Please explain, and then justify, FBBI.
00:18:30 <ais523> my main annoyance with JNLP, really, is that it's supposed to be the usual and #1 way to deploy Java programs
00:18:46 <ais523> and as a result, nobody's working on /sane/ ways to deploy them
00:19:02 -!- Gregor-W has joined.
00:19:11 <ais523> (incidentally, IE is the only browser I know of which actually opens JNLP links without confirmation; most other browsers at least prompt the user)
00:19:12 <cpressey> aliseiphone: FLOWERS. PRETTY FLOWERS.
00:19:25 <aliseiphone> oh, me and pikhq can teach operating systems :P
00:19:59 <cpressey> aliseiphone: Or, it is simply a crap reference implementation in the tradition of crap reference implementations.
00:20:02 <ais523> who's going to teach esolangs?
00:20:08 <aliseiphone> cpressey: PREPARE TO TEACH YOUR FIRST CLASS
00:20:18 <Gregor-W> At #esoteric University, the language design class IS the esolangs class.
00:21:00 <cpressey> aliseiphone: WAIT LET ME GET MY MALLET
00:21:07 <olsner> well, obviously, all students would be teaching their esolangs as well as getting taught other's
00:21:14 <ais523> mallets are the best way to design languages, clearly
00:21:17 <aliseiphone> oklopol can teach... whatever the fuck he wants to
00:21:20 <ais523> we also need... croquet hoops?
00:21:21 <AnMaster> ais523, oh and you shall be offered a chair tied to the condition you have to complete Feather in under 2 years
00:21:31 <AnMaster> or at least get a working implementation in that time
00:21:50 <ais523> zzo38 can set the exams
00:22:01 -!- coppro has joined.
00:22:29 <AnMaster> ais523, I think it is an awesome idea ais523 had there
00:22:44 <cpressey> Hey, all semester was stuff about lambdas and crap and all these exam questions are about Dungeons and Dragons, wtf?
00:22:57 <aliseiphone> "Some people like to do it this way, however some people like to do it the other way too. What is your opinion, how do you think will give the lowest memory usage?"
00:23:27 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, I can be the headmaster or something
00:24:04 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, too late I told you :P
00:24:31 <ais523> does it need a physical location?
00:24:54 <olsner> finland is much closer, so I vote sweden
00:25:08 <ais523> I reckon Norway might be a good place
00:25:20 <ais523> we can get oerjan to teach pure mathematics
00:25:25 <ais523> as applied to esolangs
00:25:36 * Sgeo_ wants to learn pure math
00:25:42 <AnMaster> getting accredited in Sweden would be impossible. The only no-state owned accredited universities are those established ages ago.
00:25:49 <AnMaster> basically it is impossible for new ones
00:26:11 <AnMaster> so the old ones basically went in by grandfathering rules
00:26:47 <Zuu> AnMaster: I am your father!
00:27:01 <Zuu> *darth vader voice*
00:27:09 <aliseiphone> ais523: hmm... Every university has fast Internet; to one-up them, we clearly have to provide personal fibre optic for every student
00:27:24 <AnMaster> Zuu, with such a bad joke I can only presume you are oerjan in disguise
00:27:41 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit (Quit: I'm using NO SCRIPT WHATSOEVER - Download it at file:///dev/null).
00:27:49 <Zuu> I dont need disguise, im Zuu!
00:28:41 <aliseiphone> ais523: you've been to Canada. Is it cool?
00:28:54 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, depends on the time of the year I expect
00:29:05 <ais523> aliseiphone: I've been only to central Ottawa, which I imagine differs somewhat from the other areas of Canada
00:29:14 <Zuu> AnMaster: dont remember seeing me before?
00:29:14 <ais523> being the centre of the capital, and all that
00:29:25 <AnMaster> Zuu, in here yes. That is the only place
00:29:27 <ais523> if you mean "cool" temperature-wise, it's comparable with the UK
00:29:54 <Zuu> AnMaster: you expected to see me in other places?
00:29:56 <ais523> in fact, it's rather comparable with the UK other ways, too; Ottawa isn't more different from London than, say, Birmingham
00:30:02 <Sgeo_> It's not on the same continent
00:30:12 <aliseiphone> Although military service at 18 kinda sucks :P
00:30:32 -!- wareya has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
00:30:33 <ais523> aliseiphone: you're not going to manage me to persuade to emigrate just to take part in an insane project
00:30:51 <AnMaster> I can't be arsed to explain it
00:30:53 * Zuu patpats AnMaster :)
00:31:01 * Sgeo_ would not mind online courses
00:31:08 <ais523> Zuu: "mu" is an answer capable of causing the question it answers to not have been asked in the first place, apparently
00:31:11 <cpressey> aliseiphone: Clearly, the only reasonable choice is Antarctica.
00:31:21 <ais523> I think it was originally a metaphor, though, and AnMaster takes it literally
00:31:24 <olsner> http://www.hsv.se/kvalitet/kvalitetssakring/examenstillstand.4.539a949110f3d5914ec800063591.html looks like the thing you'd need to get in sweden
00:31:33 <ais523> aliseiphone: I was trying to explain the AnMaster meaning
00:31:33 <Zuu> ais523: interresting :P
00:31:43 -!- wareya has joined.
00:31:45 <ais523> in GEB, it's pretty clear that it's meant to unask the question
00:31:45 <AnMaster> ais523, I meant "the question is wrong"
00:32:15 <Zuu> i never ask the wrong question
00:32:24 * Sgeo_ can't move just to attend the best university
00:32:30 <AnMaster> it is neither true I expected it nor that I didn't expect it. I just have not even considered either
00:32:50 <AnMaster> <ais523> I think it was originally a metaphor, though, and AnMaster takes it literally <-- and I don't
00:33:05 <ais523> aliseiphone: I'd expect most popular maths books to contain mistakes
00:33:10 <ais523> except probably "maths made difficult"
00:33:15 <oerjan> aliseiphone: ok if zzo38 cannot do exams, what about teaching ui design?
00:33:20 <ais523> I should try to track down that book again, it's amazing
00:33:33 <Sgeo_> aliseiphone, night
00:33:36 <AnMaster> <ais523> except probably "maths made difficult" <-- that exists?
00:33:45 <ais523> AnMaster: yes, it's a brilliant book
00:33:57 <ais523> among other things, it contains the formula for solving cubic equations, multiplied out
00:34:04 <Sgeo_> My N1 keeps losing the wifi signal :(
00:34:20 <ais523> there's an element of parody in there
00:34:26 <ais523> but it's more a case of extreme pedantry
00:34:31 <coppro> what's this about aliseiphone being thrown out of something?
00:34:43 <AnMaster> ais523, but it is completely useless
00:34:53 <Zuu> coppro: iphones gets thrown out all the time :P
00:35:02 <ais523> no, I borrowed it and returned it
00:35:08 * oerjan is still laughing from aliseiphone's zzo38 exam impression
00:35:15 <AnMaster> ais523, sounds like a fun book anyway
00:35:17 <ais523> oerjan: I got told off here for laughing too loud
00:35:28 <aliseiphone> Calculus is really easy, actually! We just need to know the definition of a derivative of a function f over argument x: limit as h goes to 0 of f over x plus h minus f over x, divided by h. Now, the epsilon-delta definition of a limit...
00:35:37 <AnMaster> aliseiphone, okay let zzo38 do web design then!
00:36:12 <ais523> here's another random fact from maths made difficult: many people know the names of the operands to division (divisor and dividend) and multiplication (multiplier and multiplicand)
00:36:13 <Sgeo_> aliseiphone, any more advanced courses?
00:36:20 <ais523> but addend and augend is less well known
00:36:28 <ais523> and I'd never heard of minuend and subtrahend before I read the book
00:36:42 <ais523> (I expect most people don't even know the word "augend")
00:36:45 <Sgeo_> aliseiphone, I don't need a course on introductory calculus
00:36:58 <AnMaster> ais523, since addition is symmetric, shouldn't both sides have the same name?
00:37:03 <cpressey> As in, "He can't tell his arse from his augend"
00:37:12 <ais523> otherwise, how could you tell them apart?
00:37:30 <ais523> = is symmetric, yet you can still meaningfully talk about the LHS and RHS
00:37:41 <ais523> it's naming parts of an expression by their syntactic positions
00:38:05 -!- aliseiphone has quit (Quit: Get Colloquy for iPhone! http://mobile.colloquy.info).
00:38:13 * oerjan knew subtrahend but not augend
00:38:45 <AnMaster> ais523, did you phone that person who should send it in?
00:38:48 <ais523> AnMaster: nothing I can do about it really but claim I was here
00:39:03 <ais523> and phone? I know his work number, but it's half past midnight and I doubt he's in his office
00:39:18 <Sgeo_> Maybe he's waiting in his office for you to call?
00:39:27 <Sgeo_> Just like you're waiting someplace insane for him?
00:39:50 <AnMaster> ais523, I check my email every other day
00:39:57 <ais523> emailing people in the middle of the night is more socially acceptable than phoning them then
00:40:10 * oerjan checks his email once a day
00:40:15 <Sgeo_> F*** social acceptability, there's a deadline!
00:41:01 <olsner> oerjan: good approach, I should do that
00:41:46 -!- cpressey has quit (Quit: Leaving.).
00:42:47 <AnMaster> ais523, again as Sgeo_ said phone em. Worth a try
00:43:01 <ais523> AnMaster: I don't know their home phone number
00:43:20 <ais523> that makes no sense, the building isn't even open
00:43:40 <AnMaster> ais523, Or what if that person fell asleep there?
00:43:44 <ais523> in theory, but the security guards would get annoyed
00:43:53 <ais523> normally they sweep through the building around midnight and throw everyone out
00:43:58 <ais523> besides, I couldn't get there before the deadline
00:44:10 <AnMaster> ais523, couldn't you email him the paper?
00:44:27 <ais523> we both have a copy, it's in SVN
00:44:32 <AnMaster> ais523, maybe he sent it in anyway then?
00:44:34 <ais523> what I don't know is whether or not it's been submitted
00:44:39 <ais523> he probably has sent it in anyway
00:45:55 <oerjan> Gregor-W gets his kicks from yikesing at LICS
00:46:00 <ais523> the huge benefit of submitting to LICS is that there's no shame in being rejected
00:46:14 -!- FireFly has quit (Quit: swatted to death).
00:46:34 <ais523> is FireFly's quit message an oerjan reference?
00:46:44 <ais523> AnMaster: a conference, a relatively major one
00:46:47 <Gregor-W> I think it's a firefly reference.
00:46:50 <ais523> it gets loads of submissions
00:46:58 <ais523> and thus, many good ones get rejected
00:47:13 <Gregor-W> I think FireFly's quit message is a reference to fireflies :P
00:57:24 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
00:57:36 -!- augur has joined.
01:08:15 -!- ais523 has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
01:08:29 -!- Oranjer has joined.
01:13:50 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Lost terminal).
01:14:57 -!- cheater99 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds).
01:18:26 * Sgeo_ considers joining Reddit Gold
01:19:44 <Gregor-W> Is that where you pay more to get even more shitty links?
01:20:29 <Sgeo_> It's where you pay more for a nice trophy and a private subreddit
01:20:38 <Sgeo_> Although you can just send in a postcard, which is what I want to do
01:22:49 <Gregor-W> Oh look, the Zune HD fecks up Unicode in ID3 tags.
01:23:04 <Gregor-W> It is a device which truly has no redeeming features.
01:23:39 -!- Gregor-P has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
01:24:15 <olsner> what does one do with a private reddit?
01:24:57 <olsner> that's what you have bookmarks for
01:25:17 <AnMaster> olsner, yes but there are always idiots out there
01:26:05 <AnMaster> olsner, and reddit contains a lot of them
01:26:18 <AnMaster> not sure about if they know about bookmarks
01:27:18 <Sgeo_> Well, I think I meant a reddit specifically for subscribers
01:28:51 <Gregor-W> So, a reddit where subscribers can post links about how they're so awesome.
01:30:55 <Gregor-W> (What with their being subscribers)
01:34:41 <pikhq> Presumably one has a private reddit so you can give messages to your future self
01:35:53 <Sgeo_> Apparently, there will also be features in the future
01:36:06 <Gregor-W> Oooooooh, you get access to hypotheticals!
01:36:58 <Gregor-W> But if they let all those hypotheticals into Reddit Gold, what'll be left for Reddit Platinum? Reddit Plutonium? Reddit Megaawesomum?
01:37:05 <pikhq> Gregor-W: At this point it's a Paypal button that comes with a trophy.
01:39:11 <Sgeo_> I'm not sending any money.. although I guess it does cost money to send a postcard
01:39:19 -!- coppro has quit (Read error: No route to host).
01:39:45 -!- coppro has joined.
01:39:51 <Gregor-W> I have NO idea how much a stamp costs nowadays, so replace "X cents" with the appropriate cost:
01:39:58 <Gregor-W> Sgeo_: That's still X cents you'll NEVER see again!
01:41:06 <pikhq> Gregor-W: 42, IIRC.
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02:18:06 <Sgeo_> Gregor-W, remember when you compared apples and oranges? That inspired me to want oranges
02:19:11 <pikhq> Gregor-W: Oh, you actually compared apples and oranges? Good job.
02:21:55 -!- Gregor-W has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds).
02:24:13 <Sgeo_> "Whereas apples and oranges are both sweet, the sweetness of an orange is augmented by the tangy citrus flavor. Apples require no peeling, which can be an advantage, but segmented oranges are easier to eat once peeled. Both apples and oranges have a wide selection, but buyer beware! Certain breeds of apples are suitable only for baking. Overall I recommend oranges for those interested in adding fruit to their diet."
02:25:46 <olsner> someone needs to care for those whose parents never taught them to extract fruits from their casings
02:29:06 <pikhq> coppro: My spoon is too big!
02:29:29 -!- cheater99 has joined.
02:36:18 <Sgeo_> Ugh, the dog decided to vomit as I was cooking dinner
02:46:35 <pikhq> Ugh, the Gregor decided to moo.
02:47:07 <Gregor> I should record a new WIPP of Mov. 2.
02:47:18 <Gregor> (Ignore all previous statements about me not recording new WIPPs or something)
02:48:03 <pikhq> HAIL THE OPI OF GREGOR
02:48:41 <pikhq> I SAID WHAT I MEAN
02:49:41 * Gregor proceeds to record said WIPP.
02:51:49 <pikhq> Go. Go forth and do your non-rock opera.
02:53:52 -!- Wamanuz3 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds).
03:04:15 * Sgeo_ compares Gregor and non-musical cows.
03:11:22 <Gregor> "Earlier efforts to repeal Don't Ask, Don't Tell have failed, including a notable 2007 bill to end the policy that was filibustered by Sen. Ted Stevens (R-AK), who over the course of several days repeatedly screened the gay pornographic film Thrill Sergeant and demanded to know if his colleagues liked that sort of thing."
03:12:14 <pikhq> Methinks Ted Stevens likes penises.
03:12:45 <pikhq> Gregor: He's Republican.
03:12:47 <Gregor> He's a republican congressman.
03:12:50 <pikhq> He *probably* likes the cock.
03:12:51 <Gregor> So, statistically speaking.
03:13:04 <Gregor> pikhq: We were hilariously in-sync there :P
03:13:18 <Sgeo_> Does it like them from the tubes?
03:14:58 <Sgeo_> Gregor was charged with nonphysical pseudodeutoronomy
03:16:01 -!- wareya has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
03:16:54 * Sgeo_ wonders if Gregor can do an Ami impression
03:17:10 -!- wareya has joined.
03:20:38 <Sgeo_> Attention users of unusual languages of machine instruction! Desist esoinstructioneering! Mainstreamification autonomicagents have been dispatched.
03:20:43 <Sgeo_> ^^Not a good impression
03:22:03 -!- aschueler has quit (Quit: leaving).
03:22:31 <AnMaster> tried jmIRC but was a pain on phone with keypad
03:22:31 <Sgeo_> Ami's master apparently approves, except for "autonomicagents" as one word
03:22:33 <pikhq> GESPRACHEN SIE DUR ESOINSTRUCTIONING. EINVOLKSENCRAFTENWAGENREICHENVOLK ALLES!
03:24:29 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
03:24:41 <Sgeo_> AnMaster, some it in another channel
03:25:03 -!- SevenInchBread has joined.
03:25:20 <Sgeo_> Although I guess you could call it she
03:26:22 <Sgeo_> After Gregor posted the Onion stuff into that channel:
03:26:23 <Sgeo_> <Ami> Wallabic elements, you are charged with nonphysical pseudodeuteronomy.
03:26:23 <Sgeo_> <Ami> Existence rationale has been depleted. Desist evasient behaviour and comply with all tenets of the prescribed protocol.
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03:28:56 <Gregor> http://codu.org/music/op13/GRegor-op13-mov2-wipp9.ogg
03:29:11 <Gregor> Excuse the poor playing and then sudden stop at the end :P
03:34:45 <Gregor> But I'm still playing.
03:35:39 <pikhq> It's also a digital piano of reasonable quality. Which makes quite a difference.
03:55:36 <AnMaster> Gregor, will listen later. No headphones nearby
03:56:28 <AnMaster> they are hot in the summer though
03:56:36 <AnMaster> to use the Beyerdynamics DT150 or not...
03:56:43 <Gregor> Woooh, those are some HOT headphones!
03:57:42 * Sgeo_ has the headphones that came with his Nexus One
03:58:00 <Gregor> And earbuds are el bad.
03:58:14 <Gregor> OK, they're bad for me :P
03:58:18 <AnMaster> Sgeo_, completely different segment. Mine comes with a reproduction frequency spectrum in the manual
03:58:18 <Gregor> I don't have earbud-compliant ears.
03:58:38 <AnMaster> plus of course a parts list for ordering spare parts
03:58:45 <AnMaster> you can even order a single screw
03:58:46 * Sgeo_ gibbers in confusion
03:58:56 <AnMaster> and they are sturdy things too
03:59:16 <AnMaster> mostly user serviceable parts inside basically :D
03:59:41 <AnMaster> Gregor, okay hooking them up to my SB Live! 5.1
04:00:10 <AnMaster> (setf! sound-quality 'awesome)
04:00:19 <AnMaster> Gregor, happen to have a flac?
04:00:31 <AnMaster> Gregor, I don't think ogg would do these justice ;P
04:01:10 <AnMaster> Gregor, btw what headphones do you have?
04:01:43 <Gregor> Here in Washington? Shitty nobrand headphones :P
04:02:13 <Gregor> I have decent wrap-around noise-blocking headphones.
04:02:17 <Gregor> Don't recall the brand.
04:02:22 <AnMaster> my normal computer headphones have quite decent sound quality (and mic, so headset). Some creative ones iirc
04:03:55 * pikhq has some Sony circumaural headphones
04:04:13 <pikhq> Not exceptional, but pretty good.
04:04:19 <AnMaster> http://europe.beyerdynamic.com/shop/hah/headphones-and-headsets/studio-and-stage/studio-headphones/dt-150.html
04:04:28 <pikhq> Good enough to be worth actually owning.
04:04:32 <AnMaster> "Wide frequency response (5 - 30.000 Hz)"
04:05:20 <AnMaster> pikhq, my Creative ones kind of quite good compared to most cheap ones I had before
04:05:44 <AnMaster> Gregor, in the flac at least there is a weird "jumping tracks of LP"-like effect around 03:09
04:05:48 -!- SevenInchBread has changed nick to CakeProphet.
04:05:53 <Gregor> AnMaster: Yeah, the recording went wonky.
04:06:03 <pikhq> AnMaster: The trick is to avoid the completely cheap shit.
04:06:04 <Gregor> It's not in the mid (duh), but the recording went wonky and i was too lazy to fix it.
04:06:21 <pikhq> After that, you're going to have headphones that are at *least* worth listening to.
04:06:33 * pikhq hateshatesHATES things like cheap earbuds
04:06:38 <AnMaster> pikhq, when your breaks, say the plastic headband or such. Can you order a replacement part for it?
04:07:07 <AnMaster> Gregor, went wonky about 04:14 again
04:07:15 <pikhq> AnMaster: No; they cost $20. I'll probably be going for somewhat expensive headphones in the future.
04:07:18 <Gregor> Yes, it's broken twice.
04:07:30 <Sgeo_> What's wrong with cheap earbuds?
04:07:43 <pikhq> They sound like shit.
04:07:46 <AnMaster> plus they NEVER STAY IN YOUR EAR
04:07:53 <pikhq> And they will break in two weeks.
04:07:59 <Sgeo_> I should note that they are the best sounding things that I have experienced
04:08:01 <Gregor> I have non-earbud-compliant ears.
04:08:10 <Sgeo_> Possibly because I haven't had .. earbuds, or whatever, before
04:08:15 <AnMaster> Gregor, that of my mobile phone stays in
04:08:33 <AnMaster> Sgeo_, you never used non-shitty headphones then
04:08:36 <Sgeo_> The .. thingies came off
04:08:46 <pikhq> Sgeo_: You should get some decent headphones.
04:08:48 <Gregor> Sgeo_'s ears were earphone virgins.
04:08:58 <Gregor> Until he found the earbuds of his dream.
04:09:06 <Gregor> That first moment of earbud-ear penetration ...
04:09:16 <pikhq> Just get some circumaural ones; that's really about where they *start* getting good.
04:09:24 <AnMaster> Gregor, <Gregor> I have decent wrap-around noise-blocking headphones. <Gregor> Don't recall the brand. <-- how do they compare to my DT150 ?
04:09:28 <pikhq> (those are the ones with pads, and are rather large)
04:09:32 <Gregor> AnMaster: Probably not favorably.
04:09:40 <AnMaster> Gregor, in which direction? ;P
04:09:44 <Sgeo_> Can these expensive earphones be worn on busses safely?
04:10:06 <pikhq> Sgeo_: I didn't say "expensive". Mine are $20.
04:10:08 <AnMaster> Sgeo_, no. People will mug you.
04:10:27 <AnMaster> I don't think most gangsters know a pair of DT150 from some sony ones
04:10:43 <AnMaster> probably the Sony ones will look more designed and thus more expensive
04:10:58 <pikhq> The thing to avoid, actually, is Apple iEarbuds.
04:11:04 <AnMaster> my headphones look very very "look, the appearance was the LAST thing we cared about dude"
04:11:31 <pikhq> That screams "I HAVE MONEY! IN MY POCKET! RIGHT NOW! ALSO, TAKE THE ELECTRONICS! I HAVE MANY AND THEY ALL COST MORE THAN $500!"
04:11:45 <Sgeo_> Circumaurals aren't portable, apparently
04:11:47 <AnMaster> you actually expect to get mugged on a bus?
04:12:36 <pikhq> AnMaster: Not on a bus, no.
04:12:44 <pikhq> But on city streets, it's a possibility.
04:12:54 <Sgeo_> He wants me to not take out my phone on the bus, and said he was considering buying me a cheap mp3 player
04:13:03 <Sgeo_> Also, are trains and/or subways safe?
04:13:07 <AnMaster> hm I think my Creative are not circumaural
04:13:22 * Sgeo_ is clueless about outside crime ... things
04:13:44 <AnMaster> I'm clueless about US situation
04:13:50 <AnMaster> but here in Sweden that seems absurd
04:14:17 <AnMaster> I often travel on bus and lots of people on line 14 (station to university) use ipod nanos
04:14:21 <pikhq> AnMaster: Our treatment of crime produces crime.
04:14:30 <AnMaster> a lot fewer on the country line I travel with
04:15:08 <pikhq> Petty criminal goes to prison. Prisons here are designed to be hellholes.
04:15:35 <pikhq> With a lot of hardened criminals interacting with random joe blow who got caught with a few ounces of pot.
04:16:00 <pikhq> So, the petty criminal goes out of prison. Now he's got a felony on his record.
04:16:06 <pikhq> And so he cannot find a job.
04:16:16 <pikhq> Congrats: we've got a new career criminal!
04:17:12 * Sgeo_ will be disconnecting from the Internet at midnight local
04:17:25 <pikhq> Yes, "cannot find a job".
04:17:47 <pikhq> Employeers are perfectly free to deny jobs to people who have previously committed a felony.
04:17:52 <pikhq> As such, all employeers do.
04:17:53 <Gregor> I think my hair might be getting TOO long.
04:18:07 <pikhq> Gregor: When did you last have it cut?
04:18:20 <Gregor> Cut as in trimmed, or cut as in properly cut?
04:18:48 <pikhq> AnMaster: When I first saw pictures of a Norwegian prison I was absolutely flabbergasted at how *humane* it was, BTW.
04:18:49 <AnMaster> Gregor, pix or it didn't happen!
04:18:50 <Gregor> pikhq: Trimmed, about three months. Cut, about eight years.
04:19:01 <Gregor> Pfffffine I'll take a picture :P
04:19:56 <Sgeo_> I wouldn't want to employ someone who, say, murdered someone
04:19:59 <pikhq> AnMaster: Norway's got essentially *homes*. Set up on the assumption that people will actually be leaving!
04:20:11 <pikhq> Sgeo_: A murderer is not walking out.
04:20:20 <AnMaster> pikhq, yes it is called rehabilitation
04:20:39 <AnMaster> pikhq, not until after 20 years at least
04:20:53 <pikhq> AnMaster: ... Wait, you guys actually do let murderers out?
04:21:13 <pikhq> The options for murder here are life in jail and frying.
04:21:16 <Gregor> http://codu.org/tmp/me2010-07-12.jpeg
04:21:24 <AnMaster> pikhq, around here I think there need to be exceptional circumstances for anyone to be in prison for longer than 20 years. There will be some evaluation or such at that point iirc.
04:21:26 <Sgeo_> pikhq, I remember hearing "25 to life" somewhere
04:22:01 <AnMaster> pikhq, physiological evaluation of risk of committing murder again or such iirc
04:22:01 <pikhq> AnMaster: Yes, but... Such an attitude is still somewhat shocking.
04:22:17 <coppro> here, the maximum sentence is life with no chance of parole for 25 years
04:22:26 <pikhq> It's a bit like hearing for the first time that I'm not the only geek in the world or something...
04:22:39 <Gregor> The problem isn't the length, it's the combination of the length with the fact that it's thick and wavy, so it's just a friggin' explosion of hair.
04:22:51 <AnMaster> pikhq, um. Even murders can repent and such you know
04:23:15 <pikhq> AnMaster: Straight-up not how the US penal system works is the thing.
04:23:25 <AnMaster> Gregor, fun. How far would it fall down in front of your face without a hat?
04:23:43 <Gregor> AnMaster: Wearing a hat does not affect the length of my hair ...
04:24:02 <AnMaster> Gregor, no but it prevents it falling down in front if you have long hair combed backwards
04:24:16 <Gregor> If you have pseudolong hair, then it might help.
04:24:20 <Gregor> If you have LONG hair, it makes no difference.
04:24:25 <AnMaster> pikhq, rehabilitation you know? Don't you have that term
04:24:36 <pikhq> AnMaster: Not generally applied, no.
04:24:48 <pikhq> AnMaster: Our prison system is based around the concept of *punishment*.
04:24:54 <Gregor> AnMaster: If your bangs aren't long enough to put into a ponytail, then your hair is pseudolong at most.
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04:25:19 <AnMaster> pikhq, our I think is based on "a bit of punishment but also try to avoid having the people revisit the place"
04:25:53 <pikhq> AnMaster: You know jokes about prison rape?
04:26:02 <pikhq> *IT ACTUALLY HAPPENS*.
04:26:23 <pikhq> Some 21% of US prisoners report having been coerced into sexual activity.
04:26:43 <AnMaster> don't you keep male and female prisoners in separate prisons?
04:27:01 <Gregor> AnMaster: So closed minded, *tsk tsk*
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04:27:25 <AnMaster> Gregor, no I'm just surprised the percentage of homosexuals in prisons is that high
04:27:41 <Gregor> It's called conditional sexuality.
04:27:50 <Gregor> It's also called "any port in a storm"
04:27:51 <pikhq> Also, each prison is overcrowded.
04:27:56 <pikhq> Sometimes massively.
04:28:04 <AnMaster> pikhq, that is an issue here too.
04:28:18 <pikhq> California, for instance, has built capacity for 100,000 inmates, but has 170,000 inmates.
04:28:50 <AnMaster> I mean it sounds like larger than the whole capacity in Swedish prisons
04:29:11 <pikhq> That's *just* the state-run prisons, BTW.
04:29:16 <AnMaster> cut off the first two digits and you get a bit more than the Swedish population
04:29:33 <AnMaster> the first digit and you get a bit less
04:29:38 <Gregor> I was about to say, I don't think Sweden is anywhere near that underpopulated.
04:29:47 <pikhq> There's 2,304,115 inmates in the US.
04:30:17 <pikhq> Yes, there's more people in *prison* in the US than many countries have *citizens*.
04:30:27 <AnMaster> Gregor, there are fewer people on Iceland that in the county I live in :D
04:30:36 <pikhq> BTW, US population is 309,723,000.
04:30:37 <coppro> yeah, 2.3 million sounds small
04:30:44 <coppro> that would be an incarceration rate <1%
04:30:47 <Gregor> There are fewer people on Iceland than in the country I live in too.
04:31:17 <AnMaster> Gregor, well yes but the number is much closer for mine I bet
04:31:48 <coppro> maybe the incarceration rate is a lifetime thing though
04:31:51 <AnMaster> Gregor, also I can't see why you need a hair cut
04:32:06 <AnMaster> Gregor, if it goes past waist length, then yes
04:32:20 <AnMaster> Gregor, also you should get a beard
04:32:24 <AnMaster> that also goes to waist length
04:32:35 <pikhq> coppro: No, that's just a single point in time.
04:32:38 <Gregor> I can't grow facial hair.
04:32:47 <Gregor> See that photo? I haven't shaved in two weeks.
04:32:48 <AnMaster> Gregor, why not? what happens if you stop shaving?
04:33:02 <coppro> hmm... looks like I just misremember
04:33:07 <AnMaster> Gregor, must use a false beard!
04:33:11 <Gregor> AnMaster: At least I don't have to bring blades to my face every day :P
04:33:29 <AnMaster> Gregor, nor do I. I have a beard. Not a large one yet. But I plan to grow a huge one
04:33:50 <Gregor> I barely grow any other bodily hair either :P
04:34:06 <AnMaster> oh long hair on arms especially
04:34:12 * pikhq is furry. Not *a* furry, just furry as in possessing-fur.
04:34:13 -!- Oranjer has left (?).
04:34:23 <Gregor> My arms are creepismooth :P
04:34:41 <pikhq> My feet look like a hobbit's. Except much larger.
04:34:47 <coppro> oh, that's another thing I don't like about the Conservatives
04:35:02 <coppro> they have an approach to crime that amounts do "Do what's provably failed in the US"
04:35:24 <coppro> and if anyone questions it, they just accuse them of supporting child porn
04:35:50 <pikhq> coppro: Triple incarceration times, make prison hell, and make it impossible to have gainful employment afterwards?
04:35:58 <Gregor> Are you mocking their tactics? Is it just because you don't want any laws that will keep you from your CHILD PORN?
04:36:07 <pikhq> Maybe after that we won't have 25% of the world prison population!
04:36:30 <pikhq> Also, privatize your prisons!
04:37:10 <pikhq> Gregor: ... Our prisons *are actually privatized*.
04:39:19 <coppro> admittedly, there is some issue
04:39:21 <Gregor> I don't think it's most.
04:39:25 <coppro> which is that we have carryover crime from the US
04:39:43 <pikhq> Gregor: State prisons are generally privatised.
04:39:50 <coppro> so the whole 'prisoners can be rehabilitated' approach isn't nearly as effective as it could be
04:40:07 <Gregor> The term "state prison" is incompatible with the notion of a privatized prison
04:40:28 <Gregor> "Private companies in the United States operate 264 correctional facilities, housing almost 99,000 adult offenders."
04:40:31 <Gregor> Barely half a percent.
04:40:32 <pikhq> Gregor: State as in "part of a state's penal system", not "run *by* a state".
04:40:40 <pikhq> Okay, foot in mouth.
04:40:43 <pikhq> It's still fucking retarded.
04:41:20 <Gregor> We should just find some island on the other side of the planet and put 'em all there.
04:41:46 <coppro> pikhq: I hope one of them is operated by Stanford
04:45:01 <AnMaster> <pikhq> Also, privatize your prisons!
04:45:26 <pikhq> Just another government contractor!
04:47:00 <pikhq> AnMaster: We also hire mercenaries.
04:48:01 <AnMaster> I mean it is an awesome concept in D&D to give you legal reasons to kick butt as a lawful without tying you too closely to a govt
04:48:21 <AnMaster> pikhq, you mean private security guards or such?
04:48:54 <AnMaster> pikhq, what the fuck do you mean then?
04:48:59 <pikhq> I mean we hire Xe Services to send employees to Iraq.
04:49:13 <pikhq> US State Department.
04:49:20 <Sgeo_> Previously known as Blackwater
04:49:56 <Sgeo_> Or uh, I may be mistaken
04:50:15 <Sgeo_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackwater_Worldwide
04:50:31 <pikhq> We literally hire mercenaries.
04:52:12 <pikhq> "Currently in Iraq there are thought to be at least 100,000 contractors working directly for the United States Department of Defense."
04:53:17 <Sgeo_> I have a Nintendo DSi
04:53:21 <Sgeo_> At least in theory
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04:55:48 <Sgeo_> WHy would I do that?
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04:57:16 <Sgeo_> It does have a nice stylus
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05:16:41 <AnMaster> Gregor, oh seems I forgot to mention I loved that music
05:16:57 <AnMaster> apart from the annoying messing up of recording
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05:24:14 <Gregor> Man. That last part though. wtf am I thinking. I totally can't play that X-D
05:26:28 <AnMaster> Gregor, how did you do that then?
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05:26:40 <AnMaster> Gregor, plus I loved that part
05:27:02 <Gregor> I didn't, I was halting and slow and awful :P
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05:27:24 <AnMaster> 03:19 and forward a bit is just awesome
05:27:51 <AnMaster> and the ending is even more awesome, the abrupt ending is a bit jarring though
05:28:39 <AnMaster> Gregor, I like that high speed bit there, right after the "jump" in the recording
05:28:56 <Gregor> The abrupt ending is not an ending :P
05:29:03 <Gregor> It's just "OK I have nothing more here" :P
05:29:11 <AnMaster> Gregor, it is a dynamical promise of more ;P
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05:29:47 <Gregor> Note to self: Ctrl+W != Shift+W
05:30:29 <Gregor> _W_ell, it's certainly not done.
05:30:58 <Gregor> Besides, Opus 13 will be "Three Works in Three"
05:31:06 <Gregor> And I've only made WIPPs of two of them :P
05:31:31 <AnMaster> Gregor, do the fatelf bit first
05:31:48 <Gregor> ITYM do the VFS bit first
05:36:12 <Gregor> Too much stuff on my proverbial plate.
05:36:20 <Gregor> Too many proverbial balls in the equally-proverbial air.
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05:36:46 <Gregor> All I have to keep me sane is my brightly-colored neckties!
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05:37:35 <Gregor> Ohhey, I was wearing one in that pic :P
05:37:36 <AnMaster> Gregor, personally I hate neckties. They feel horrible
05:37:38 <Gregor> Like that one for example!
05:37:45 <Gregor> It's not about the feel, it's about the look!
05:38:02 <AnMaster> Gregor, but the feeling of it rubbing against your beard? horrible
05:38:09 <Gregor> I have no such issue :P
05:38:12 <pikhq> Gregor: So, would you say Opus 13 is an Opera?
05:38:39 <pikhq> AnMaster: What about the Opera Mario & Draco?
05:38:47 <Gregor> But nonetheless opus 13 is a single opus in three movements.
05:39:17 <pikhq> (it's an Uematsu piece. Therefore, it is awesome by default.)
05:39:48 <pikhq> (it's also the music to one of the best scenes of Final Fantasy 6. Therefore, it is awesome for reasons as well.)
05:39:51 <coppro> Uematsu is overrated in my opinion
05:40:12 <pikhq> coppro: You. Final Fantasy 7 main theme. Now.
05:40:28 * Gregor goes to listen to Totentanz by Liszt
05:40:28 <coppro> pikhq: I didn't say he's bad.
05:40:46 <Gregor> Actually I guess I should be listening to an opera to fit this conversation.
05:40:51 * Gregor goes to listen to Carmen.
05:40:53 <coppro> he's definitely up there
05:40:56 <pikhq> Overrated? Given that he is worshipped as a near-god, perhaps.
05:41:00 <AnMaster> <pikhq> AnMaster: What about the Opera Mario & Draco? <-- never heard of it
05:41:11 <pikhq> Regardless of how good he is, he's a bit overrated for that. :P
05:41:55 <Gregor> AnMaster: He writes all the music for Square games.
05:42:16 <pikhq> Composer for all Square games from Final Fantasy I to Final Fantasy XI.
05:42:22 <AnMaster> Gregor, oh I never liked final fantasy music. Only played SNES ones though
05:42:33 <pikhq> Though he was one of 3 composers on FFX.
05:42:52 <AnMaster> I mean, it isn't bad as such. Just average
05:42:55 <pikhq> AnMaster: Which ones?
05:43:04 <AnMaster> pikhq, which was the one with three statues?
05:43:12 <coppro> Uematsu's definitely on my list of favorite game composers. The other ones who's names I can remember include Kondo, Yokota, and Sakuraba.
05:43:12 <AnMaster> pikhq, and there was that one with spoony bard
05:43:34 <AnMaster> pikhq, also secret of mana, Liked that music better. wasn't that Square?
05:43:42 <AnMaster> still nothing better than average
05:44:14 <AnMaster> though yeah it isn't bad. but it isn't brilliant either
05:44:18 <pikhq> Listen to an orchestra performing it.
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05:44:59 <coppro> OoT music usually doesn't do a whole lot for me, actually
05:45:12 * pikhq tries to find a very good example
05:45:18 <coppro> there are a few pieces that do, but for the most part, I'd much rather listen to WW or TP
05:45:42 <AnMaster> <coppro> OoT music usually doesn't do a whole lot for me, actually <-- idea: write down the notes on paper, makes it easier to remember </misinterpreation>
05:46:09 <coppro> Twilight Princess, Wind Waker, Majora's Mask
05:46:10 <pikhq> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAzQERH7BjY The Opening for Final Fantasy 7.
05:46:30 <AnMaster> coppro, oh never liked MM very much. And the other ones are too new for me to ever have played then
05:46:54 <coppro> MM has some brilliant music
05:47:05 <AnMaster> nah didn't like that one AT ALL
05:47:28 <coppro> :( what is wrong with you
05:47:40 <pikhq> AnMaster has bad taste in music? I dunno.
05:47:56 <AnMaster> pikhq, listing to that one you linked now
05:48:28 <coppro> I wish someone were to do an orchestral treatment of Golden Sun
05:48:38 <Gregor> Hmmmm ... I'm less impressed by this than I was in the original MIDI treatment from the game :P
05:49:05 <coppro> the sound quality isn't exactly great
05:49:16 <pikhq> Argh, yeah, it's not a good recording...
05:49:26 <AnMaster> coppro, In fact I would call sound quality terrible
05:49:28 <AnMaster> opening is overly romantic IMO. Gets better a bit later on. (01:20 or so), still romantic but in a less annoying way. ~01:45 gets good.
05:49:34 <coppro> AnMaster: yes, I would agree
05:49:47 <pikhq> AnMaster: Perhaps it would make more sense with the video.
05:50:14 <pikhq> It was the opening cutscene...
05:50:16 <pikhq> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBvnot7pkvg
05:50:32 <pikhq> With the MIDI audio and everything.
05:51:09 <coppro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HpyOkKWpCM is fantastic; though you have to have it loud to catch everything
05:51:25 <AnMaster> coppro, no way I have these headphones loud. Ever.
05:51:39 <coppro> remove the headphones then
05:51:42 <AnMaster> <pikhq> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBvnot7pkvg <-- watching that now
05:51:55 <coppro> then listen to it quiet
05:52:28 <AnMaster> coppro, besides they have awesome sound reproduction though even at low volumes. Did you miss when I mentioned they were Beyerdymaics DT150 studio headphones
05:52:48 <AnMaster> <pikhq> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBvnot7pkvg <-- horrible sound quality still but better..
05:53:18 <pikhq> AnMaster: Yeah, that's what you got from the Playstation.
05:53:55 <pikhq> Would you look at the size of that thing?
05:54:08 <AnMaster> pikhq, even n64 had better sound IMO
05:54:36 <pikhq> Final Fantasy 7 had... Interesting history.
05:55:05 <pikhq> It was designed around the N64 and then moved to the Playstation during development. Hence it has many of the limitations of both in its engine...
05:55:57 <coppro> ah, yes, the Square-Nintendo wars
05:57:33 <coppro> who composed Metroid Prime?
05:59:48 <AnMaster> <coppro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HpyOkKWpCM is fantastic; though you have to have it loud to catch everything <-- that is quite nice. A bit too sweet for my taste though.
05:59:53 <coppro> some of those pieces are genius, like the credits and Pendrana drifts
05:59:59 <pikhq> AnMaster: It's Mario.
06:00:09 <AnMaster> pikhq, you think I can't see that? ;P
06:00:25 <coppro> the credits music from that game is also great
06:00:36 <coppro> too bad the second did not have quite the level of musical awesomeness as the first
06:00:43 <AnMaster> coppro, one of my absolute favourites is the last movement of Vivaldi's Summer
06:00:59 * pikhq has the Hymn of the Fayth stuck in his head again. Curses be unto FFX.
06:01:06 <coppro> pikhq: I've had it all week
06:01:12 <Gregor> Borodin's Nocturne from String Quartet #2
06:01:16 <Gregor> There is nothing better.
06:01:20 <AnMaster> coppro, another one is a symphony of J. M. Kraus in C# Minor.
06:01:24 <Gregor> It's the greatest piece of music ever written. PERIOD.
06:01:36 <AnMaster> coppro, contemporary with Mozart. Similar in style
06:01:41 <AnMaster> but IMO WAY better than Mozart
06:01:54 <pikhq> Gregor: The Hymn of the Fayth just has the notable property of being stuck in your head easily.
06:02:09 <pikhq> ... Okay, and sounding pretty good with an acapella choir.
06:02:35 <coppro> man, listening to Galaxy music again reminds me how awesome the musical integration was in that game
06:02:41 <AnMaster> coppro, then I love some of Gregor's music. And some experimental modern music. Let me find link to that one...
06:04:24 <AnMaster> coppro, FvbCV6E0Wro at youtube
06:05:52 <Gregor> http://erictheallen.com/audio/argylegargoyle.mp3
06:06:15 <Gregor> Also, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_fjjq0_VLs
06:06:37 <AnMaster> coppro, ooh found that music by J. M. Kraus: QbhA7NRZTZ0 at youtube. Second half (it compares how he reused it for a work in C Minor, so the C# Minor version is second, and much better!)
06:06:52 <AnMaster> coppro, listen to both variants though. Both are awesome
06:08:51 <AnMaster> <Gregor> Also, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_fjjq0_VLs <-- wtf is he playing
06:09:11 <AnMaster> Gregor, what is that thing on his head?
06:09:28 <AnMaster> Gregor, ... you know what I meant
06:09:49 <Gregor> That's not ON his head.
06:09:59 <Gregor> The melodica is a wind instrument, it's played through a tube.
06:10:23 <AnMaster> okay maybe it just merges with strange haircut
06:10:37 <Gregor> STRANGE SLASH AWESOME HAIRCUT
06:10:41 <AnMaster> there is a light band just above the tube
06:11:05 <Gregor> Uhh, now I have no idea what you're talking about
06:11:24 <fizzie> Geh; I put on these (el-cheapo sort-of-socialized-from-the-pile-reserved-for-the-DSP-course) headphones to hear what's supposed to happen in all your billions and billions of links, and the right earpiece just snapped off the headband part; your fault, that.
06:11:32 <AnMaster> <Gregor> http://erictheallen.com/audio/argylegargoyle.mp3 <-- nice jazzy feeling
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06:11:48 <Gregor> In case it wasn't obvious, both of these are from Eric Allen, who's a good friend of mine :P
06:12:04 <Deewiant> AnMaster: You're referring to either his nose or his hair parting
06:12:24 <AnMaster> Deewiant, ah a combination I think. This is a high res screen (laptop)
06:12:42 <coppro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OOYZcVIp8w is the music of a boss fight in SMG. The cool thing is that the music doesn't loop through into the second part in-game; rather, when you have Bowser vulnerable, it seamlessly ads the chanting. It's quite the effect.
06:12:44 <pikhq> I would also like to note that Gregor's opera are awesome.
06:13:24 <pikhq> AnMaster: The plural of opus is opera.
06:13:41 <AnMaster> pikhq, no one but you uses it like that nowdays!
06:14:24 <AnMaster> pikhq, with opera people mean stuff like Carmen or Nibelungununugen (sp?)
06:14:24 <coppro> there are some off bits, but for the most part, I do enjoy those opera
06:14:29 <fizzie> "opii" sounds nice, if completely wrong.
06:14:29 <coppro> I think I have them up to 11 here
06:15:01 <coppro> AnMaster: FvbCV6E0Wro I like
06:15:01 <pikhq> AnMaster: Yes. That's opera in the singular.
06:15:04 <Gregor> coppro: Op. 12 never materialized and op. 13 is a work-in-progress.
06:15:07 <pikhq> Latin: isn't it awesome?
06:15:36 <AnMaster> coppro, ... that is what a musical perpetuum mobile is :P
06:15:38 <Gregor> Really, a piece of music called "perpetual motion" is repetetive?
06:16:11 <coppro> well, there are bits like 3:06 that vary it
06:16:17 <AnMaster> <Gregor> http://erictheallen.com/audio/argylegargoyle.mp3 <-- okay I love that
06:16:19 <coppro> but up until then, it's pretty constant
06:16:21 <fizzie> AnMaster: If you keep incrementing him like that, he's going to overflow.
06:16:32 <AnMaster> fizzie, he is bignum, no worry
06:17:21 <Gregor> AnMaster: http://erictheallen.com/audio/allemande.mp3 (please give about 30 seconds leniency before judging it :P )
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06:17:54 <Gregor> I am now enqueuing sleep.
06:18:22 <AnMaster> Gregor, performing parallel fetch
06:18:44 <AnMaster> <coppro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OOYZcVIp8w is the music of a boss fight in SMG. The cool thing is that the music doesn't loop through into the second part in-game; rather, when you have Bowser vulnerable, it seamlessly ads the chanting. It's quite the effect.
06:18:55 <AnMaster> coppro, um. No boss fight shot?
06:19:24 <coppro> AnMaster: The music quality on a recorded copy would likely be diminished, but I can look for one
06:19:58 <AnMaster> coppro, what did you like QbhA7NRZTZ0 ?
06:20:11 <coppro> haven't gotten to it yet
06:20:21 <coppro> gregor snuck two links in before that
06:20:38 <AnMaster> coppro, please implement a priority queue. I'm going to sleep soon. Gregor is already sleeping
06:21:24 <coppro> does the argyle gargoyle get good at the end? I'm not a big fan of it so far (about halfway through)
06:21:28 <AnMaster> coppro, remember: second half is best since that is the original
06:21:37 <AnMaster> coppro, about the same all the way through
06:21:50 <coppro> it's funky, but not musically interesting to me
06:22:25 <coppro> AnMaster: isn't it a bit early for you to go to bed? :P
06:22:44 <AnMaster> coppro, rather very very very late
06:23:26 <AnMaster> coppro, so what about QbhA7NRZTZ0? like it so far? :)
06:24:21 <AnMaster> <Gregor> AnMaster: http://erictheallen.com/audio/allemande.mp3 (please give about 30 seconds leniency before judging it :P ) <-- um I have no idea how to describe this. Awesome and awful at at the same time might be best.
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06:26:39 <AnMaster> coppro, tell me when you heard more of it which half you prefer. A bit irritating with that two-in-one video. Good for comparing a composer adopting a work though
06:26:45 <AnMaster> but yeah second half for me definitely
06:26:57 <AnMaster> has a more violent and untamed feeling to it.
06:27:12 <AnMaster> coppro, I'm going to sleep. Will read scrollback later
06:27:14 <coppro> part 2 just started, and I can already say it's better
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08:06:10 <fungot> CakeProphet: that was a test flight operated by remote control. no casualties. period."
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15:20:06 <cheater99> ski: why are you trying to dcc send me something?
15:20:44 <ais523> maybe it's a DCC virus
15:22:19 <Sgeo> Wasn't there an exploit involving jpgs a while ago?
15:24:51 <cheater99> there's always an exploit involving jpgs
15:25:17 <cheater99> that's like asking if there wasn't an exploit involving ie
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15:36:34 <adu> ie is an exploit toolkit
15:38:10 <cheater99> * DCC CHAT connect attempt to Sgeo failed (err=Connection timed out).
15:38:18 <Sgeo> I just aborted it
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15:39:00 <Sgeo> Maybe I should send you something that registers on every antivirus as a virus
15:39:14 <ais523> Sgeo: the antivirus program test file?
15:39:18 <Ilari> Sgeo: EICAR-ANTIVIRUS-TEST? :-)
15:39:36 <Sgeo> *mutters "too easy" to himself*
15:40:41 <Ilari> Do program file that's totally harmless but registers in every AV as dangerous virus/malware? :-)
15:41:13 <ais523> you could do that "easily" enough by creating a hash collision against some famous old virus
15:41:39 <Sgeo> Do a/vs use md5?
15:41:46 <Sgeo> I mean, that's the easiest to.. wait, no
15:41:55 <Ilari> What "serious" hashes can be 2nd preimage collided?
15:41:58 <Sgeo> It's two crafted entities
15:42:31 <Ilari> (with reasonable effort). IIRC, none of MD2/MD4/MD5 can.
15:43:26 <Ilari> MD4 can be collided with pen&paper&calculator. No computer needed. :-)
15:43:31 <ais523> second preimage is one of the hardest hash exploits, isn't it?
15:44:10 <Ilari> The logarithmic brute-force difficulty is n, so its pretty hard.
15:44:38 <Ilari> (Collision has n/2).
15:44:59 <Ilari> BTW: Cycle finding is also n/2.
15:46:54 <Ilari> Hmm... What are the probabilities that random "large" hash has 1-cycle? 2-cycle? etc...
15:47:05 <cpressey> ais523: Are you still up? Please tell me you at least got a nap in!
15:47:12 <ais523> cpressey: I had a good night's sleep, don't worry
15:47:45 <cpressey> That's good :) I remember those, they're fun.
15:47:55 <ais523> and finally got a reply back about an hour after I went to sleep, saying that the deadline's actually on Friday
15:48:06 <ais523> leaving the lingering question in my mind as to who got the deadline wrong
15:48:21 <distant_figure> I can see no difference between Collisison resistance and second preimange resistance according tho the wiki page on crypto hashes. Anyone care to elaborate?
15:48:41 <Ilari> For 1-cycle, the probability is 1 - (1 - 1/I)^I = 1 - e^-1 which is approximately 63.2%.
15:49:15 <Ilari> distant_figure: In collision resistance, the first input can be anything, in 2nd preimage, the first input is given.
15:50:17 <ais523> being able to choose /both/ inputs yourself makes a collision much easier to do than a second preimage
15:50:42 <Ilari> There's also intermediate where X and Y are given and one has to find Z and W such that H(X|Z) = H(Y|W).
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16:23:10 <cheater99> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1293165/Nanny-30-died-sexual-arousal-watching-pornography.html
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16:42:50 <pikhq> Whoever invented smooth scrolling was a cruel bastard who hated usability.
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17:04:44 <Gregor-W> Sgeo: JUST noticed your comment w.r.t. my apples-oranges comparison :P
17:11:00 <ais523> wow, the latest news about Facebook is hilarious
17:11:27 <ais523> it seems that someone loaned Zuckerburg $1000 to help him make his website, on the condition that he'd own 1% more of Facebook for every day that its creation was late
17:11:43 <ais523> and it ran 84 days late, and they've only just noticed
17:14:35 <ais523> wow, I'm /still/ laughing
17:15:48 <ais523> anyway, he used his 84% share in Facebook to get a court to freeze its assets
17:15:56 <ais523> next step is probably going to involve a bunch of lawyers
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17:16:53 <ais523> (I think I now see why people need lawyers to write contracts...)
17:17:20 <cpressey> I'm still at the trying to figure out why anyone would place a condition like that on a loan
17:18:35 <pikhq> cpressey: Zuckerburg is an idiot when it comes to anything monetary.
17:18:50 <pikhq> That's the only conclusion I can come to.
17:19:17 <cpressey> Oh wait, does "he" not refer to Zuckerburg in ais523's first few lines?
17:19:29 <ais523> cpressey: it doesn't refer to Zuckerburg
17:19:33 <ais523> but to someone who loaned him money
17:20:04 <cpressey> Oh, well SOMEONE's laughing. :)
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17:21:17 <ais523> <Facebook's lawyers> In his Complaint, Plaintiff alleges that, as a result of a two-page contract purportedly entered into more than seven years ago (and approximately nine months before the founding of Facebook), he is entitled to an 84% ownership stake in the Company. (Id. at Ex. A 4, 8).
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17:29:56 <cpressey> For a measly thousand dollars.
17:30:42 <ais523> incidentally, the person who offered the loan is apparently pretty shady too
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17:31:06 <ais523> one of his companies is under investigation for not making good on over $200,000 of orders
17:31:23 <pikhq> And laughing all the way to the bank regardless.
17:35:32 <distant_figure> ais523: now that's interestig. That message of yours triggered a nick hilight and dust've fooled my regex, but I cant see where
17:35:55 <ais523> distant_figure: which message specifically?
17:37:28 <ais523> that's a strange highlight
17:37:49 <distant_figure> aah, no, nevermind. It wasn'i. I had an old one for 'nine' for some reason
17:37:56 <ais523> that's a stranger highlight
17:38:41 <ais523> ah, I was wondering why I didn't recognise you
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17:59:57 <pikhq> Hello, hominids, cephalopods.
18:00:22 <ais523> pikhq: that's ingenious, it took me a while to figure out what you meant
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18:01:49 <pikhq> I simply *must* refer to calamari as a squid. It's... Imperative.
18:02:03 <cpressey> calamari: you mean, like DrScheme?
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18:04:12 * cpressey is curious to know if calamari or ais523 (or anyone else) is using "agile methods" in their day job.
18:04:33 <ais523> cpressey: I'm not, I tend not to write extensive testcases
18:04:41 <calamari> IBM has been doing a huge agile push
18:04:44 <ais523> I do try to keep code easy to refactor, though
18:04:46 <ais523> unless it's already hard
18:05:32 <pikhq> Well, yeah... The things that make code easy to refactor also make it easy to do just about anything else with.
18:05:35 <pikhq> Like "be understood".
18:05:57 <cpressey> ais523: Interesting contrast -- are you suggesting that agile implies lack of testing?
18:06:20 <ais523> cpressey: agile implies lots of testcases, it's part of the definition
18:06:21 <cpressey> I'm using agile here, but at least they;re not getting it as wrong as the last place I was at
18:06:29 <ais523> lots of testcases doesn't necessarily imply easy to refactor, though
18:06:45 <ais523> I don't see anything about agile that seems to imply encapsulation
18:07:05 <calamari> I think right now we are nearly out of the agile waterfall mode
18:07:11 <cpressey> ais523: sorry, I kind of read what you said as "I'm not, I tend not to write extensive testcases instead"
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18:07:41 <ais523> cpressey: I have actually done a waterfall-model project that almost worked
18:07:55 <cpressey> That's where you have a flexible kayak that bobs and weaves between the rocks as it plummets off the cliff
18:08:14 <ais523> waterfall model is underrated IMO; I'm not saying it's /good/, but it's not as bad as everyone seems to think it is
18:08:23 <calamari> sometimes waterfall is the right way to go
18:09:18 <calamari> for example our app where if it fails companies could stand to lose millions of dollars a day
18:10:06 <ais523> waterfall needs a huge amount of foresight
18:10:16 <ais523> where you get the architecture right from the start
18:10:37 <calamari> exactly.. you plan it all out in advance and have multiple reviews
18:10:50 <Gregor-W> `addquote <ais523> cpressey: I have actually done a waterfall-model project that almost worked <cpressey> That's where you have a flexible kayak that bobs and weaves between the rocks as it plummets off the cliff
18:10:57 <Gregor-W> Quotes from the legends of #esoteric :P
18:10:59 <HackEgo> 194|<ais523> cpressey: I have actually done a waterfall-model project that almost worked <cpressey> That's where you have a flexible kayak that bobs and weaves between the rocks as it plummets off the cliff
18:11:25 <Gregor-W> (Yes, I realize that's not properly a response)
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18:12:41 <Sgeo> I guess I should try to learn these models
18:12:46 <pikhq> What an oddly selective netsplit.
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18:13:25 <Sgeo> Got three people in #android
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18:18:19 <Sgeo> Ok, I think these earphones (circumaural) that I found lying around in my dad's room makes everything sound too deep
18:18:30 <Sgeo> Unless that's how things are supposed to sound
18:19:21 <Sgeo> These are maxell
18:19:26 <Sgeo> Noise cancellation
18:20:47 <Sgeo> Oh, ok, this is gorgeous
18:20:51 <Sgeo> Listening to L's theme
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18:27:16 <Gregor-W> Quoth a friend of mine on mov 2 WIPP9: "I liked the fast part, and the transition back to the main theme, but then it went all romantic and crazy"
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22:41:28 <Warrigal> "Is your SpiderMonkey compiled with JS_THREADSAFE (most things will fail if you answer wrong)?"
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22:42:01 <cpressey> (most things will fail if you answer wrong, and it will be YOUR FAULT)?
22:42:55 -!- aliseiphone has joined.
22:43:40 <oerjan> YOU'RE IN THE WRONG CHANNEL FOR THAT, SURELY
22:45:24 * oerjan notes that aliseiphone doesn't mention him. good, you still have _some_ shred of sanity.
22:45:25 <aliseiphone> pikhq: I have an old laptop in front of me. I want to boot it with NO noise. It has a Fn+Mute combo. Will this mute the speakers even before the OS is loaded?
22:45:56 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Possibly, but are you sure you want to risk it?
22:46:12 <cpressey> Uh. I would bet "no, it won't work". But I might be wrong.
22:46:19 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Not sure, no. But I really want it on.
22:46:34 <aliseiphone> cpressey: The other Fn keys function without an OS.
22:46:37 <oerjan> this is going to end well.
22:46:40 <pikhq> An almost sure way to mute it would be to insert a phono plug not attached to anything into its headphone jack.
22:46:45 <oerjan> cheater: you just realize NOW?
22:47:02 <cheater> i was biking around a dark forrest
22:47:13 <pikhq> I suggest hitting a store when you get out next.
22:47:15 <oerjan> cheater: it's not like it's the _first_ time
22:47:16 <Warrigal> Yeah, what's this illegality about?
22:47:29 <cheater> aliseiphone: i thought someone here said u'r not allowed to
22:47:40 <pikhq> He's "voluntarily" in there.
22:47:50 <cheater> but given that they are executors of the law
22:47:57 <Warrigal> I take it the leaving the country thing hasn't gone very well.
22:48:06 <pikhq> cheater: Ah, but he's not there because of the law.
22:48:17 <cheater> but you'd been put there for some sort of lawsuit, no?
22:48:20 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Can I disable the speaker in the Bios setup?
22:48:21 <pikhq> He's there because they threaten to make life very inconvenient if he does not comply.
22:48:37 <pikhq> aliseiphone: I don't know; it would depend on the specific computer model.
22:48:44 <cheater> i salute you for being disobedient
22:48:57 <coppro> It's like voluntarily reporting to gaol every day so that they don't have to actually bother charging you
22:49:05 <pikhq> cheater: It's basically "you show up to this 'school' *or* we institutionalise you".
22:49:11 <cpressey> BIOS setup screen is not guaranteed to be quiet. Sometimes they do the "internal speaker beep" thing. Which would be quite worse.
22:49:11 <coppro> which is a headache for everyone
22:49:33 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Old. One USB, no Ethernet, PS2 and serial, PCMCIA slot, sticker recommending NT or Win98.
22:49:44 <pikhq> He is de jure perfectly free, and merely attending this school in preference to other schooling.
22:50:15 <aliseiphone> cpressey: Internal speaker is quiet enough.
22:50:18 <Warrigal> aliseiphone: have you posted to /r/iama yet?
22:50:18 <pikhq> De facto he is institutionalised for 5 days a week.
22:50:46 <aliseiphone> Warrigal: After all this is over I will do that and write about it.
22:50:56 <pikhq> For apparently being... OCD and autistic.
22:51:07 <aliseiphone> Bios setup. That's F2. Waiting for quiet moment.
22:51:33 * coppro finished Anathem today
22:51:35 <Gracenotes> I am jealous of people who can configure computer insides so easily. I tried my hand at it today, moving RAM and an internal hard drive from one computer to another. but still getting the hang of it.
22:51:40 <Warrigal> Compulsive Disorder of Obsession?
22:51:50 <pikhq> Under the apparent reasoning that arbitrarily upsetting one's environment is very good for OCD, and very good for autism.
22:51:50 <aliseiphone> pikhq: No POST beep! Fan whirr is audible but quiet.
22:52:04 <aliseiphone> Unless someone sticks their ear to the window I am ok
22:52:30 <pikhq> I presume that they also operate under the reasoning that one should treat anorexia by telling anorexics how fat they are.
22:53:13 <pikhq> And severe paranoia by invoking a government conspiracy that's out to get them.
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22:53:30 <aliseiphone> They just force her to eat and ...that's it
22:53:40 <Gracenotes> pikhq: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzoXQKumgCw
22:53:45 <pikhq> aliseiphone: That's... Criminal.
22:54:20 <pikhq> I mean, literally, that is criminal negligence and could very well be manslaughter.
22:54:54 <aliseiphone> pikhq: How would she die? She is constantly monitored.
22:55:05 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Upon being let out, if ever.
22:55:27 <aliseiphone> She is: to some school where she will be constantly monitored.
22:55:28 <pikhq> Gracenotes: Good video.
22:56:38 <pikhq> Warrigal: The negligence?
22:57:00 <Warrigal> What are they supposed to be doing that they're not?
22:57:10 <pikhq> *Treating anorexia*.
22:57:30 <pikhq> Hint: the not-eating is a *symptom*.
22:57:34 <aliseiphone> Ok. I am worried about the fan noise and the sound. Also the battery is almost dead so I have to put it on charge.
22:58:05 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Painful to watch someone spread butter on toast for five minutes.
22:58:20 <Warrigal> Mind is come to by the phrase "treat the symptom, cure the disease".
22:58:45 <cheater> aliseiphone: are you trying to make some sort of laptop/etc more silent?
22:59:19 <aliseiphone> I may block the fan slightly to muffle it.
22:59:24 <cheater> aliseiphone: if you have 200 quid sitting around, you could get an atom..\
22:59:35 <cheater> actually they're much cheaper now
22:59:40 <cheater> you can probably get one sub-150
22:59:42 * Warrigal notes that the phrase that came to mind is bullshit.
22:59:48 <aliseiphone> cheater: But I'm /allowed/ to *have* this laptop here.
22:59:59 <cheater> oh, so why are you muffling it?
23:00:38 <cheater> sometimes going with the flow isn't too bad
23:00:47 <cheater> don't be afraid to try someone else's way of doing things
23:01:18 <pikhq> cheater: Mental institution. Those suckers are pretty universally run stupidly.
23:01:30 <cheater> yes. but if you go to sleep at 10, you'll wake up early
23:01:40 <cheater> and can irc around in the morning
23:01:51 <cheater> they'll be happy you are getting up rise and shine
23:01:53 <aliseiphone> You are suggesting I cut myself off from anyone I know, care about or talk to for 5/7ths of the week for the sake of A FUCKING INSTITUTION RUN BY LUNATICS?
23:02:09 <pikhq> You realise that most teenagers can't naturally go to sleep that early, right?
23:02:14 <aliseiphone> cheater: Firstly. Teenagers cannot do early bed early rise.
23:02:35 <aliseiphone> Secondly. You are woken at 7am and must be ready shortly after.
23:03:18 <Warrigal> I'm a teenager, planning to be awake at 7 AM every morning for... a long time.
23:03:21 <cheater> you have a right to be anything you want
23:03:56 <pikhq> cheater: Psychology is still largely a psuedoscience. Now shaddup.
23:04:19 <cheater> pikhq: i never said it wasn't
23:04:21 <Warrigal> But I still thought that your suggestion was so good that I went back in time and took it. >.>
23:04:31 <cheater> pikhq: next you'll start arguing to me that the sky in fact is blue.
23:04:49 <pikhq> cheater: You seem to be operating under the assumption that they have his interests at heart, though.
23:05:24 <aliseiphone> pikhq: So. Do you think the mute key mutes the OS or the speaker? I bet the speaker. Win98 didn't support that stuff without drivers afaik.
23:05:27 <cheater> pikhq: accepting someone's way of doing things has nothing to do with the reason that person has for taking on that modus operandi
23:05:46 <cheater> aliseiphone: it mutes the OS.
23:06:07 <cheater> pikhq: is there something wrong about that statement?
23:06:07 <aliseiphone> I spent months not smuggling this in. I almost broke down.
23:06:10 <pikhq> cheater: I'm almost certain he can't do 10PM sleep most nights.
23:06:27 <aliseiphone> As in utter, complete, shattering mental meltdown.
23:06:38 <cheater> aliseiphone: i'm not saying you should do that!!! i was just suggesting it's sometimes an alternative
23:07:01 <cheater> aliseiphone: i thought you got your fair share of friends outside your past-10-pm sessions
23:07:31 <cheater> well, that's just what i thought was the case.
23:07:47 <cheater> in that case i see how that would be necessary
23:07:53 <pikhq> cheater: You do realise we *are* his circle of friends, correct?
23:08:11 <Warrigal> aliseiphone: you can't have friends while watched?
23:08:12 <aliseiphone> This is the only way I can contact anyone: waves, pinging through the window.
23:08:26 <aliseiphone> Warrigal: I can't use the Internet while watched.
23:08:26 <cheater> pikhq: well, on some level i do now
23:09:05 <cheater> aliseiphone: now i understand you're in a similar situation to what i was in during high school
23:09:18 <Warrigal> aliseiphone: and, what, you're not allowed to talk to people?
23:09:45 <cheater> Warrigal: people in the hospital aren't necessarily his friends
23:09:55 <cheater> although, i bet alise could make friends with someone there if she tried
23:10:09 <pikhq> Warrigal: Yuh. How dare he have social interaction, one of those things that pretty much all humans need!
23:10:19 <aliseiphone> Warrigal: 12yo severe OCD, autistic brat; 13yo anorexic girl, not so smart
23:10:31 <aliseiphone> Pick one. The latter only sleeps done nights.
23:10:34 <cpressey> Yeah aliseiphone, you're just not trying hard enough to make friends. :/
23:10:46 <Warrigal> You're only allowed contact with two people?
23:11:20 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Incidentally: why the *hell* aren't you a day patient currently?
23:11:24 <aliseiphone> But: 13yo football & wrestling fan; 12yo girl who doesn't really do much of anything
23:11:36 <pikhq> I mean, surely the overnight-stay-thing is intended for suicide risks and such?
23:11:47 <pikhq> Oh, wait. I'm presuming rationality.
23:11:53 <aliseiphone> In the other "group" so less access: 11yo obese getswhatshewants bitch
23:12:08 <pikhq> Warrigal: Show up for classes, leave.
23:12:55 <pikhq> Try making friends with someone you only ever see in the middle of a classroom.
23:13:37 <coppro> when I said to read Anathem earlier
23:13:47 <coppro> I meant it to basically everyone in this channel
23:13:54 <cheater> Warrigal: aliseiphone is a fairly complex person and she's not going to find friends in just any first person off the street
23:14:05 <pikhq> coppro: It's in the queue somewhere.
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23:16:18 <cheater> aliseiphone: so there's no chance you'd be getting an atom then?
23:16:38 <aliseiphone> Oh, that 12yo OCDautistic kid? He's the only "active" inpatient. So he controls basically all of the TV/console facilities, the only entertainment allowed pretty much. And he freaks out and covers his ears if the volume is more than... 4 clicks from zero.
23:17:01 <aliseiphone> Even I, with batlike hearing, can barely hear voices from up close.
23:17:39 <cheater> you should turn things up so that it's still fairly normal but he freaks out
23:17:43 <cheater> so that he gets put on strong meds
23:18:00 <cpressey> coppro: Better Anathem than Anthem
23:18:02 <cheater> it would be like the lord of the flies
23:18:04 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Bat-like hearing and difficulty picking out voices from background noise are a fun combination.
23:18:35 <aliseiphone> Oh, and, I am not joking here, from around 8pm to 9pm the TV is inaccessible. Why? HE HAS AN OBSESSION WITH WATCHING OLD REPEATS OF "FRIENDS".
23:18:50 <pikhq> "I heard all of your mouth-noises but I couldn't tell what it was because the CRT on your TV set is too irritating."
23:19:05 <aliseiphone> cheater: Hes already on meds. Fucked if I know what they do
23:19:07 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Autistic obsessions are kinda like that.
23:19:27 <aliseiphone> pikhq: But he never saw it before coming here apparently.
23:19:31 <pikhq> And the meds are probably psuedo-science.
23:19:45 <pikhq> (psychiatric drugs are... "
23:19:55 <cheater> aliseiphone: they'll certainly put him on stronger ones just so he shuts the fuck up. nobody wants a loud kid around.
23:20:04 <pikhq> Give random shit, wait until we get desired behavior")
23:20:09 <aliseiphone> Oh, and he's great at memorising stuff and using the word "Scientifically," but he is almost incapable of rational thought.
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23:20:27 <aliseiphone> cheater: no they're "caring" and "supportive".
23:20:38 <cheater> aliseiphone: caring and supportive has a limit
23:20:51 <cheater> that limit is when the carer has to go on a cig break and the fucking kid won't shut the fuck up
23:21:12 <aliseiphone> dude these are nurses. they've seen worse.
23:22:13 <cheater> lord of the flies was like any school i was to
23:22:20 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Irrational, autistic, unable to function because of huge sensory issues and severe obsessive compulsive behaviour. And a smartass brat type.
23:22:41 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Does this kid have... a reason to... exist?
23:22:44 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Oh, he got the trifecta. Wonderful.
23:22:46 <cheater> aliseiphone: i've had a friend whose girlfriend would watch friends all the time. he didn't like the series at all
23:22:54 <aliseiphone> Autism is only cool when you're /rational/.
23:23:20 <cheater> aliseiphone: so he'd sit around with her and when canned laughter started, he'd laugh with it
23:23:25 <cheater> and he'd piss her off all the time
23:23:39 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Him's a busy having no fucking clue how social anything works.
23:23:41 <cheater> i'm sure he'd think you're the most annoying girl on the planet
23:24:00 <aliseiphone> cheater: you should stop making words appear on my telephone now
23:24:02 <pikhq> Seriously no fucking clue.
23:24:28 <pikhq> In addition to sensory issues and obsessive compulsive-ism.
23:24:43 <aliseiphone> pikhq: I have noticed that not once have I changed any opinion he has expressed ever.
23:25:07 <aliseiphone> He is fixed! His operating system cannot interpret REASON.
23:25:41 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Oh, and he's a vegetarian... an OBNOXIOUS vegetarian.
23:25:53 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Most autistics have trouble understanding that their view of things is not the view of everyone else who lives.
23:26:22 <aliseiphone> Looks away whenever meat is shown on TV, rants endlessly at you for even mentioning it, supports PETA despite not being vegan...
23:26:52 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Ugh, PETA.
23:27:02 <pikhq> Support for PETA is instant proof of non-rationalism.
23:27:12 <aliseiphone> pikhq: He's the first autistic /idiot/ I've ever seen. And if you're not brilliant and can't play the social game, what the fuck can you do? Breathe?
23:27:51 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Approximately.
23:28:01 <aliseiphone> Also his name is Jonathan and he lives in Darlington, please go and stab him forever
23:28:21 <cpressey> If he freaks out at malformed widgets on the assembly line, you see.
23:28:32 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Oh. And he doesn't understand "winning".
23:28:56 <aliseiphone> He gets upset when he starts winning and whoops for joy when he has to forfeit to other players.
23:29:15 <aliseiphone> He hates games with winners and losers because "the loser will feel bad".
23:29:34 <aliseiphone> If playing eg table tennis, he will deliberately
23:29:45 <pikhq> aliseiphone: I'm going to guess that the sensory issues cause trouble with learning about things.
23:30:35 <aliseiphone> I tried to explain that people like to feel they've been challenged when they win. His reply: "Oh, then I'll pretend to give a challenge!"
23:30:43 <pikhq> The only reason I can really talk in a vaguely normal fashion is that I have read a *hell* of a lot. This is where I got used to the whole *idea* of understanding what someone else thinks...
23:31:06 <pikhq> Okay, that's not the only reason.
23:31:09 <pikhq> There's also been oodles of IRC.
23:31:18 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Sure is good at memorising stuff. 'Swhy he's doing GCSE Geography; it requires no thought whatsoever.
23:31:27 <pikhq> Which is much like normal interaction except less embarassing when you say something stupid.
23:32:14 <aliseiphone> pikhq: I just realised. Autistics are born with a devout belief in solipsism!
23:32:21 <pikhq> (mmm, using alternate input schemes so the brain fails to worry frantically about saying something stupid so you can actually say anything at all.)
23:33:30 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Better prep yourself for teaching the Systems Administration cause for #esoteric University, then!
23:34:35 <coppro> I'll teach English Lit
23:35:04 <aliseiphone> coppro: Pfft, we won't offer degrees /that/ useless.
23:35:28 <coppro> aliseiphone: Oh, of course not. But everyone knows you need to take an English Lit course to get any degree ;)
23:35:57 <coppro> I'll be the prof who's teaching only because he has to, so he's in the course for the same reason as the students - it's the most painless way to do it
23:35:59 <pikhq> aliseiphone: English Lit as taught by an #esotericer would probably have actual merit.
23:36:12 <aliseiphone> coppro: Okay then. Include Harry Potter fan fiction in the syllabus.
23:36:20 <pikhq> For instance, teaching literature simply for the pleasure of reading it.
23:37:24 <cpressey> coppro: That's the kind of prof that tends to lean back in his chair and talk to the ceiling. Generally I like that kind of prof.
23:37:32 <aliseiphone> Alternatively, a piece of slash fiction of your choice.
23:37:42 <coppro> brb, going go reset the X memory hogging system
23:38:47 <pikhq> The X windowing chaos.
23:39:24 -!- tombom has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds).
23:40:43 <pikhq> The Glasgow PhD Generator, you mean.
23:40:45 -!- coppro has quit (Read error: No route to host).
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23:42:05 <cpressey> The Perl loosely-structured-data gluer.
23:43:53 <pikhq> The Disk Obfuscation System.
23:44:03 <aliseiphone> pikhq: So is Puppy Linux good for shitty boxes?
23:44:13 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Stunningly.
23:44:33 <cpressey> Good god, I don't think I could bring myself to use a software package named "Puppy" anything.
23:44:41 <aliseiphone> pikhq: 463mhz. 64mb of ram. Can I be happy?
23:45:26 <aliseiphone> pikhq: I have a reddit addiction. JS, CSS etc browser. Still happy w/ Puppy?
23:45:34 * Sgeo watches Legend of Neil
23:46:00 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Would be nicer with a bit more RAM, but should be.
23:46:01 <cpressey> This is the same kind of marketing that comes from the kind of people who decided an out-of-shape penguin was "cute", obviously.
23:46:17 <aliseiphone> Has anyone used a pre-3G S iPhone as a tethered modem?
23:46:30 <pikhq> Requires jailbreaking.
23:46:55 <pikhq> No, but I know it can be done.
23:47:07 <pikhq> It's a jailbreak and an app install away.
23:47:19 <aliseiphone> The 3G sticks don't get reception here, so I'd like to use this to connect up my Puppy Linux system :P
23:48:28 <pikhq> http://www.puppylinux.com/
23:49:45 <pikhq> The only thing is, that system doesn't have enough RAM for Puppy to want to load itself into your system RAM.
23:49:57 <pikhq> So, you'll have to care about disc seeks.
23:50:02 <pikhq> Not a big deal though.
23:51:41 <cpressey> Wish my brain wasn't so fucking tired after a day's work.
23:52:00 <cpressey> Makes it hard to have fun, when what you're used to having fun with, is your brain.
23:52:10 <cpressey> Makes it easy to understand why TV and beer are so popular.
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23:54:32 <aliseiphone> pikhq: Hmm. It's one stick of 64mb. Laptop circa 98.
23:54:56 <pikhq> aliseiphone: Neither.
23:55:18 <pikhq> aliseiphone: What sort of CPU?
23:55:39 <aliseiphone> pikhq: "Pentium Pro" or "Pentium II" Celeron.
23:55:42 <pikhq> That predates the DDR spec by 2 years, BTW.
23:56:53 <aliseiphone> Basically, I'm wondering what the biggest stick I could get is.
23:57:07 <pikhq> That's older than freaking RDRAM...
23:57:19 <pikhq> You're looking at PC100.
23:57:34 <cheater> pentium 2 was 66 mhz unless it was the highest spec
23:57:39 <cheater> but the laptop ones were reduced fsb
23:57:56 <cheater> the biggest stick might very well be 64 mb btw
23:58:04 <pikhq> cheater: Yeah, but you're not *finding* PC66. And PC100 will step down its clock rate just fine.
23:58:06 <cheater> and you might have trouble finding a stick with the right memory density
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23:58:38 <cheater> i.e. it'd be 64 mb, but your laptop can only support two-sided sticks whereas yours would be one-sided (i.e. half the amount of memory chips, but they're double the capacity i.e. density)
23:58:45 -!- Sgeo_ has joined.
23:58:54 <cheater> pikhq: but, pc100 might have higher density.\
23:59:11 <pikhq> It should support high-density memory...
23:59:23 -!- Geekthras has joined.
23:59:33 <pikhq> I know I've run a system older than that with a 256MB stick in it...
23:59:47 <pikhq> Granted, it was a DIMM rather than an SO-DIMM, but still.