←2016-11-05 2016-11-06 2016-11-07→ ↑2016 ↑all
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00:21:56 <izalove> 32kb file with 900 lines of markdown
00:22:14 <izalove> how long do you expect the rendering process to be?
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00:23:49 <izalove> i'm trying several markdown things for terminals
00:23:55 <izalove> and none of them takes less than 2s
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00:36:39 <ais523> izalove: I can't see it taking enough time for a human to notice
00:36:47 <ais523> with a properly optimized implementation
00:37:07 <izalove> that's what i'm starting to write
00:42:21 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[BurgerFlipper]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=50159&oldid=50158 * Zemeckis * (+11)
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01:34:47 <zzo38> If I want to calculate quantiles of data that is arranged in an array where the sample data is the index and the value is how many samples have that value, is there any better way to calculate it than to put them into a list and then sort it?
01:35:59 <zzo38> (I also have the sum of the data, and the total number of samples, precalculated, in case that helps)
01:39:18 <oerjan> zzo38: aren't they already sorted, essentially?
01:40:34 <zzo38> oerjan: I suppose they are, yes.
01:40:56 <zzo38> It should not be too difficult to iterate through it.
01:41:02 <zzo38> I just forgot!
01:41:13 <oerjan> zzo38: in that case, calculate partial sums of number of samples up to each index, and from then you can use binary search.
01:41:17 <zzo38> But, you are correct; if the total number of samples is known, it is easy.
01:41:29 <oerjan> (if you want to calculate many)
01:42:29 <zzo38> oerjan: Yes, that is similar to what I thought of right after you mentioned they are already sorted.
01:44:21 <oerjan> in fact, calculating the partial sums also gives you the total, if you haven't already precalculated it.
01:45:03 <zzo38> Yes of course it does
01:46:50 <zzo38> My thoughts did not involve binary search though; I just thought, calculate partial sums until you come to 1/4 of the total number of samples and then that is the first quartile, and so on.
01:47:44 <oerjan> yes; binary search is only good if you want to be able to look up quantiles easily later.
01:55:54 <zzo38> (I don't know why I did not think of it until you mentioned that they are already sorted and then I realized?)
01:59:17 <zzo38> Once I saw some picture someone made of how they might arrange the buttons and so on on a TI-92 calculator if they were designing for games; but I also thought if you design for games you might also add a colour display and audio, and that these features will be useful even for stuff other than games, too, such as if you are plotting multiple functions on the same screen it can help to be different colours, and you might want it to beep when a long
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02:33:32 <hppavilion[1]> What's the OKest font?
02:33:36 <hppavilion[1]> @massages-loud
02:33:36 <lambdabot> tswett said 7h 54m 41s ago: That would have been helpful, if it weren't for the fact that I actually knew that already.
02:33:43 <oerjan> mezzacotta is topical today.
02:34:05 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Also, remember remember.
02:34:13 <hppavilion[1]> (Well, probably not for you anymore...)
02:34:27 <oerjan> "anymore"?
02:34:54 <oerjan> oh right
02:35:04 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: well, i _am_ the rememberlord hth
02:35:39 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Ah, yes
02:35:45 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: "anymore" is a word, isn't it?
02:36:02 <oerjan> i was just not connecting the bits hth
02:36:17 <hppavilion[1]> I've never been clear on whether "anymore" or "any more" is considered correct; I guess they're in the process of merging and I'm on the merged end?
02:36:47 <oerjan> itym mergedend hth
02:37:19 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: No, that'sn't merging yet
02:37:50 <oerjan> well hurryup
02:38:27 <hppavilion[1]> (Hm, "that'sn't" and other "-'sn't"s are actually a fairly nice group (or maybe semiring? I haven't proved it yet) of contractions... I thing I'll start using them...)
02:38:54 <oerjan> `? hppavilion[1]
02:39:02 <hppavilion[1]> (Also nice are the 'd-a and 'm-a contractions, like "I'd-a" "I'm-a")
02:39:09 <oerjan> HackEgo: WHYYYYYYYYYY
02:39:13 <HackEgo> hppavilion[1] se describe en las notas al pie. ¿Porqué no los dos? Nadie lo sabe. No es tan cluecless.
02:39:19 <shachaf> `? oerjan
02:39:20 <HackEgo> Your revertable itymologist gneiss rememberlord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
02:39:23 <hppavilion[1]> Taneb: Could you formally invent those contractions?
02:39:40 <hppavilion[1]> `? abyss
02:39:41 <shachaf> `revert
02:39:45 <tswett> `? tswett
02:39:51 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: What are you reverting?
02:40:03 <HackEgo> rm: cannot remove `/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/env/.hg/store/data/canary.orig': Is a directory \ Done.
02:40:05 <HackEgo> In Soviet Russia, the abyss gazes into you first. Other than that, it's pretty much the same.
02:40:06 <HackEgo> tswett is livin' it up with the penguins. He's a title under the cruxite in the lathe.
02:40:07 <shachaf> why is HackEgo slow again
02:40:14 <oerjan> `learn_append hppavilion[1] Él aspira a ser más incomprensible que esta sabiduría.
02:40:17 <HackEgo> Learned 'hppavilion[1]': hppavilion[1] se describe en las notas al pie. ¿Porqué no los dos? Nadie lo sabe. No es tan cluecless. Él aspira a ser más incomprensible que esta sabiduría.
02:40:36 <hppavilion[1]> `le/rn abyss/`? you
02:40:38 <HackEgo> Relearned 'abyss': `? you
02:40:41 <hppavilion[1]> `? abyss
02:40:41 <HackEgo> ​`? you
02:40:44 <hppavilion[1]> :)
02:40:45 <shachaf> oh man
02:40:51 <tswett> `? warrigal
02:40:51 <shachaf> now i can't use `now to show what i reverted
02:40:52 <HackEgo> ​#esoteric's resident dingo. Sometimes pretends to be a human.
02:40:55 <hppavilion[1]> Much funnier, imo
02:40:58 <shachaf> i guess it'll forever remain a mystery tdnh
02:41:01 <oerjan> `before
02:41:04 <HackEgo> wisdom/abyss//In Soviet Russia, the abyss gazes into you first. Other than that, it's pretty much the same.
02:41:10 <oerjan> `revert
02:41:10 <shachaf> `now wisdom/oerjan
02:41:15 <HackEgo> wisdom/oerjan//Your revertebrate itymologist gneiss rememberlord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
02:41:16 <HackEgo> rm: cannot remove `/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/env/.hg/store/data/canary.orig': Is a directory \ Done.
02:41:24 <hppavilion[1]> `? abyss
02:41:25 <HackEgo> In Soviet Russia, the abyss gazes into you first. Other than that, it's pretty much the same.
02:41:34 <shachaf> `before wisdom/oerjan
02:41:34 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Bah! Mine was much funnier.
02:41:38 <HackEgo> wisdom/oerjan//Your revertable itymologist gneiss rememberlord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
02:42:48 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: :,(
02:43:14 <oerjan> Taneb: please don't invent hppavilion[1]isms twh
02:46:43 <oerjan> `slwd warrigal//s/^/warrigal is /
02:46:45 <shachaf> `? Taneb
02:46:46 <HackEgo> warrigal//warrigal is #esoteric's resident dingo. Sometimes pretends to be a human.
02:46:49 <HackEgo> Taneb is not elliott, no matter who you ask. He also isn't a rabbi although he has pretended in the past. He has at least two backup keyboards with dodgy SHIFT KEys, cube root of nine genders, and above average, not too voluminous, but calm eyebrows. (See also: tanebventions)
02:46:55 <shachaf> oerjan: why is warrigal lowercased
02:47:09 <oerjan> shachaf: because it's a nick hth
02:47:19 <shachaf> Yes, a nick which is usually capitalized.
02:47:27 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: no it was not. besides we have heaps of those sorts of entries already.
02:47:47 <oerjan> shachaf: well it's not here very often. feel free to fix.
02:48:27 <\oren\> Jan. 12th, 2017. After an intense firefight over the golden gate bridge, President Trump's motorcade was overtaken by cavalry of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, assisted by Mexican drugloard artillery
02:48:29 <shachaf> `slwd taneb//s#(.*#He sometimes invents without noticing it (see: tanebventions).#
02:48:31 <HackEgo> taneb//Taneb is not elliott, no matter who you ask. He also isn't a rabbi although he has pretended in the past. He has at least two backup keyboards with dodgy SHIFT KEys, cube root of nine genders, and above average, not too voluminous, but calm eyebrows. He sometimes invents without noticing it (see: tanebventions).
02:49:02 <tswett> `slwd warrigal//s/w/W/
02:49:06 <HackEgo> warrigal//Warrigal is #esoteric's resident dingo. Sometimes pretends to be a human.
02:49:22 <tswett> AlWays capitalize the letter W; thanks.
02:49:41 <tswett> /nick tsWett
02:52:25 <oerjan> `? soviet russia
02:52:26 <HackEgo> Soviet Russia used to be a synonym for the Soviet Union. In reality, the Soviet Union dissolved. Meanwhile, Soviet Russia dissolved reality, and you are a figment of its imagination.
02:52:59 <oerjan> admittedly, this used to be one of them, until i got confused by it.
02:53:27 <shachaf> One of whom?
02:53:58 <oerjan> shachaf: those entries that are making fun of `? itself
02:54:06 <oerjan> `? `?
02:54:07 <HackEgo> ​`? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
02:54:31 <shachaf> Oh, right.
02:57:04 <shachaf> `? special relativity
02:57:05 <HackEgo> special relativity? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
02:57:08 <shachaf> `? tensor
02:57:09 <HackEgo> tensor? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
02:57:14 <shachaf> `? tanebventions: math
02:57:15 <HackEgo> Mathematical tanebventions include D-modules, Chu spaces, the torus, Stephen Wolfram, Klein bottles, string diagrams, the reals, Lambek's lemma, pointless topology, the long line, locales, and histograms.
02:57:23 <shachaf> `? tanebventions
02:57:25 <HackEgo> Tanebventions include automatic squirrel feeders, necessity, Go, submarine jousting, Fueue, the universe, special relativity, metar, weetoflakes, sand, dragons, persistence, the BBC, _46bit, progress, sanity, the Oxford comma, and this sentence. See also tanebventions: maths. He never invents anything involving sex.
02:57:29 <shachaf> Is special relativity mathematical?
02:57:34 <shachaf> How about the universe?
02:57:41 <oerjan> not entirely.
02:57:53 <shachaf> `? the universe
02:57:54 <HackEgo> The universe was invented by Taneb as an opposing force to oerjan. Escardó proved that it was indiscreet.
02:58:13 <shachaf> `? universe
02:58:14 <HackEgo> A universe is a poem in one stanza.
02:58:28 <shachaf> Hmm, which one of those shall I augment?
02:58:46 <oerjan> why would you do that
02:58:56 <shachaf> I want to mention that it's characterized by a universal property.
02:59:15 <shachaf> `? a universe
02:59:16 <oerjan> i'm not sure that fits in either.
02:59:16 <HackEgo> a universe? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
02:59:35 <shachaf> Well, indiscreteness is a universal property, I guess?
02:59:47 <shachaf> Indiscrete things are typically right adjoint to a forgetful functor?
02:59:55 <oerjan> i don't know.
03:00:20 <oerjan> i guess that one is harmed least, anyway, the other one sort of needs to be brief.
03:00:37 <shachaf> man, "harmed least"
03:00:43 <shachaf> thanks for your vote of confidence tdh
03:00:45 <hppavilion[1]> ...OK, what's Taneb's 0.08008382305190409th gender? (though, knowing #esoteric, either it's m or f or the other two are both neither m nor f...)
03:00:58 <oerjan> *MWAHAHAHA*
03:01:32 <hppavilion[1]> It has annoyed me ever since I noticed that "er" is for more and "est" is for most, but there's nothing for "less" and "least"
03:01:47 <shachaf> @wn versal
03:01:49 <lambdabot> No match for "versal".
03:02:08 <shachaf> "adjective: of or relating to a style of ornate capital letter used to start a verse, paragraph, etc., in a manuscript, typically built up by inking between pen strokes and with long, rather flat serifs."
03:02:13 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: last you brought it up someone gave a reference that it's a universal that _no_ language has inflections for those hth
03:02:27 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Then all languages are bad. hth.
03:02:38 <oerjan> thausible.
03:02:50 <shachaf> newspeak has words like ungooder and ungoodest
03:03:00 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Yes, but those aren't as good
03:03:00 <shachaf> it's pretty regular in that respect
03:03:11 <shachaf> they are better
03:03:28 <shachaf> four endings good, two endings better hth
03:04:08 * oerjan is forgetting to eat
03:04:18 <hppavilion[1]> (I like maybe -oss [o:s] and -ost [o:st]; "meanoss"; "biggoss, longoss, and cut")
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03:04:49 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: They're goodoss than this system.
03:05:08 <hppavilion[1]> (But then "most" sounds like it means "least")
03:05:15 <hppavilion[1]> *+...
03:06:47 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: maybe m can mean little hth
03:06:54 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Oooh,
03:07:15 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: "meanem", "biggem, longem, and cut"?
03:07:29 <oerjan> no, i meant to make m-ost fit
03:07:38 <shachaf> boilem mashem stickem
03:07:46 <hppavilion[1]> Ah
03:09:21 <oerjan> . o O ( buy this book by celebrated cook Ina Stew )
03:11:06 <shachaf> `? oerjan
03:11:07 <HackEgo> Your revertebrate itymologist gneiss rememberlord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
03:11:15 <oerjan> wait, it should be chef, obviously
03:11:32 <shachaf> oerjan: Is that true? Are you Glaswegian?
03:11:44 <oerjan> i'm definitely wegian
03:12:07 <oerjan> `slwd oerjan//s/remember/potato/
03:12:10 <HackEgo> oerjan//Your revertebrate itymologist gneiss potatolord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
03:12:15 <shachaf> are you part of the glasgow wegime
03:12:46 <hppavilion[1]> Pitte Reich...
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03:13:25 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: pitte?
03:13:29 <shachaf> `slwd oerjan//s43424
03:13:30 <HackEgo> oerjan//Your revertebrate itymologist gneiss potatolord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
03:13:35 <shachaf> hmm
03:13:36 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: As opposed to Dritte
03:13:48 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Dritte is third (I think), so Pitte is...?
03:13:49 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: still makes no sense afaict
03:14:00 <oerjan> absolutely nothing?
03:14:01 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Hint: The 'i' is [a:i]
03:14:20 <shachaf> `slwd oerjan//1s19121
03:14:23 <HackEgo> oerjan//Your revertebrate itymologist gneiss potatolord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
03:14:49 <oerjan> aww
03:14:55 <shachaf> `slwd oerjan//s4&4
03:14:57 <hppavilion[1]> π. It's pi, oerjan. The pith reich.
03:14:57 <HackEgo> oerjan//Your revertebrate itymologist gneiss potatolord oerjan is a lazy expert in suture complication. Also a Pre-recombination Glaswegian who passionfruitly dislikes Roald Dahl. Lately when he tries to remember a word, "amortized" pops up. His arch-nemesis is Betty Crocker. He sometimes puns without noticing it.
03:15:01 <shachaf> there we go
03:15:35 * oerjan beats up hppavilion[1] for suggesting pi is an ordinal. in a 'wegian way.
03:15:57 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: It's frequently used as an ordinal, so...
03:16:51 <oerjan> is it now.
03:16:53 <hppavilion[1]> And anyway, an sequence is basically a function from |N to <whatever it's a sequence of>, so generalization to |R is possible in many cases- for example, factorial to gamma
03:17:19 <shachaf> Do you know that a convering sequence is a function from the one-point compactification of N?
03:17:27 <shachaf> A continuous function, I mean.
03:17:35 <shachaf> That is, N with an extra point at infinity.
03:17:48 <shachaf> (With the appropriate topological structure.)
03:17:48 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Yes?
03:18:07 <shachaf> That's pretty good, huh?
03:18:13 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: itym converging?
03:18:24 <shachaf> yes, converging.
03:18:39 <shachaf> i,i it's compact, which means that every open converge has a finite subconverge
03:19:05 <oerjan> >_>
03:19:24 <hppavilion[1]> reich(3) = NAZIS
03:19:44 * oerjan is still forgetting to eat
03:19:53 <shachaf> I have the feeling that compactness is very important but I don't have sufficient intuition for it.
03:20:03 <hppavilion[1]> Also fun: pinary
03:20:43 <hppavilion[1]> 0p10 ≈ 3.14159265358979323846264338327950288419716939937510582097494459230781640628620899862803482534211706798214808651328230664709384460955058223172535940812848111745028410270193852110555964462294895493038196442881097566593344612847564823378678316527120190914564856692346034861045432664821339360726024914127372458700660631558817488152092096282925409171536436789259036001133053054882046652138414695194151160943305727036575959195309218
03:21:08 <shachaf> you're spamming the channel too much
03:21:09 <shachaf> this is your pinal warning
03:21:10 <shachaf> hth
03:21:28 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: How many warnings do I get? (or is pinal second-to-last?)
03:21:59 <shachaf> this is pinal tap
03:22:08 <hppavilion[1]> Hm, if "final" is last, assuming "fi" is one, then given "first, second, third"... well, second-to-last would be something different given that it has a different suffix
03:22:21 <hppavilion[1]> But "secnal" and "thirnal" sound nice
03:22:23 <shachaf> "final" is only last in finite cases.
03:22:25 <oerjan> shachaf: but i don't want to let him have 11 warnings
03:22:28 <hppavilion[1]> (Maybe 0πDD...D would be a better notation)
03:22:31 <shachaf> In an infinite sequence the last element would be infinal.
03:22:40 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Ah, yes
03:23:00 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Though, it's possible to have an infinite set (but not sequence) with a last element...
03:23:28 <shachaf> Sets don't have last elements.
03:23:32 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: second-to-last would obviously be senile hth
03:23:52 <shachaf> But a convergent sequence certainly has a last element, which is what it converges to.
03:23:55 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: poset/woset?
03:23:57 <shachaf> f(∞)
03:24:07 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: but which infinity tdnh
03:24:08 <shachaf> podude/wodude
03:24:20 <shachaf> I already specified that it's the one-point compactification of N.
03:24:25 <shachaf> So there's only one.
03:24:28 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Yes, I know
03:24:32 <hppavilion[1]> What's a pod-ude?
03:24:50 <zzo38> To calculate the quantiles I used a JavaScript code like: var rt=0; const qu=[]; var c; for(c=0;c<stat.length;c++) { rt+=stat[c]; while(rt && rt>=qu.length*count/quantiles) qu.push(c); }
03:25:08 <shachaf> zzo38: In modern JavaScript, you can use "let" instead of "var", which has better scoping behavior.
03:25:23 <shachaf> I didn't read past the first token in your code.
03:25:27 <zzo38> shachaf: I am aware of that, and do use let in those cases.
03:26:17 <zzo38> (At first I had "if" instead of "while", which sometimes resulted in a too short result, so I changed it to "while" and now it seems to be working OK.)
03:27:08 <shachaf> if twan van laarhoven invented an algorithm for computing quantiles, it would be called twantiles
03:27:11 <zzo38> In the case I used var here though it doesn't matter, because it is top-level code.
03:29:01 <zzo38> (Also, this isn't my actual code, although it shows the algorithm in use.)
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03:31:04 <hppavilion[1]> fneingott!
03:33:39 <zzo38> Does this algorithm looks OK to you?
03:37:15 <shachaf> `dowg zzo38
03:37:16 <HackEgo> 771:2012-10-06 <oerjän> revert \ 770:2012-10-06 <FreeFul̈l> run rm -rf wisdom \ 196:2012-04-08 <shachäf> revert 0 \ 194:2012-04-08 <shachäf> run rm -rf wisdom/* \ 0:2012-02-16 Initial import.
03:37:29 <shachaf> `cat bin/hlnp
03:37:29 <HackEgo> revset='tip:0 & ! (9071 | 9070 | 5897 | 5895 | 9075 | 9074 | 4530 | 4531)' \ hg log -r "$revset" "$@" | sed 's/\(<[^>]*\)\([^>]>\)/\1̈\2/'
03:38:00 <shachaf> `sled bin/hlnp//1s#..$# | 770 | 771&#
03:38:02 <HackEgo> bin/hlnp//revset='tip:0 & ! (9071 | 9070 | 5897 | 5895 | 9075 | 9074 | 4530 | 4531 | 770 | 771)' \ hg log -r "$revset" "$@" | sed 's/\(<[^>]*\)\([^>]>\)/\1̈\2/'
03:38:16 <shachaf> `sled bin/hlnp//1s#..$# | 196 | 194&#
03:38:18 <HackEgo> bin/hlnp//revset='tip:0 & ! (9071 | 9070 | 5897 | 5895 | 9075 | 9074 | 4530 | 4531 | 770 | 771 | 196 | 194)' \ hg log -r "$revset" "$@" | sed 's/\(<[^>]*\)\([^>]>\)/\1̈\2/'
03:38:21 <shachaf> `dowg zzo38
03:38:22 <HackEgo> 0:2012-02-16 Initial import.
03:39:17 <shachaf> `cwlprits zzo38
03:39:20 <HackEgo> nitia
04:03:22 <oerjan> wisdom of the ancients.
04:03:31 * oerjan now has food
04:03:41 <shachaf> `? food
04:03:42 <HackEgo> food? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
04:04:46 <shachaf> hmm
04:04:49 <shachaf> i can't make it work
04:05:09 <oerjan> make what work
04:05:26 <shachaf> The wisdom entry I was going to make for food.
04:05:32 <oerjan> too bad.
04:05:44 <oerjan> happens.
04:25:27 * hppavilion[1] . o O ( I want to give people almond-scented drinks and see how many of them try to shoot me )
04:33:54 <oerjan> when life serves you almonds, make almonade.
04:34:59 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: When life gives you capture by the Soviets, eat some almonds?
04:36:39 <shachaf> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cv57SfUVYAEp5cu.jpg
04:44:38 <\oren\> hppavilion[1]: I love almonds!
04:50:40 <hppavilion[1]> \oren\: Cyanide tastes like almonds hth
04:50:59 <hppavilion[1]> R.I.P. \oren\
05:04:00 <zzo38> Can you poison almonds with cyanide?
05:04:12 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: Definitely.
05:05:17 <hppavilion[1]> OK, wait, is Jehovah (a) [jɛ.hoʊ.vʌ] or (b) [dʒɛ.hoʊ.vʌ]? I always heard (b), but I've always assumed it was people being stupid about (a), but now Wikipedia says (b) but also mentions (a) without giving context
05:05:43 <zzo38> I have heard both
05:06:17 <zzo38> (as well as a third variant)
05:06:24 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: Oh?
05:06:37 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: Yahweh is different form Jehovah if that's what you're going for
05:07:15 <hppavilion[1]> I mean, I really can't see YHWH meaning (b); (a) just (read [jʌst] if punning) seems so much more likely
05:08:36 <zzo38> I know it is different
05:10:08 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: What's the third one you've heard??
05:10:17 * hppavilion[1] must knoooooow
05:10:43 <zzo38> It is like (a) but with a "w" sound
05:11:02 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: [jɛ.woʊ.vʌ]?
05:11:17 <zzo38> No, I mean in place of "v"
05:11:28 <hppavilion[1]> Ah
05:11:45 <hppavilion[1]> [jɛ.hoʊ.wʌ]... that seems more correct
05:11:57 <zzo38> (I can't send non-ASCII with this IRC client, although it can receive any ASCII-compatible character encoding just fine)
05:12:13 <zzo38> (as long as the terminal emulator supports it)
05:22:02 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: consider that the same pronunciation change has happened for all of "John", "James/Jacob", "Joshua", "Jesus", "Jude/Judas", "Jason" etc. ...
05:23:06 <oerjan> (all except the last from hebrew and probably from a prefix version of YHWH)
05:24:29 <shachaf> I found out that "Sean" comes from "John".
05:24:35 <oerjan> indeed
05:24:49 <shachaf> Which of course has its own rich etymological history.
05:25:36 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: "Sean" is pronounced "Seen" in my book. Parents are free to name their kid "Sean" and insist it's pronounced wrong, but it's no different from any of the other name misspelings
05:25:55 <shachaf> Your book is wrong.
05:26:10 <shachaf> The correct way to pronounce someone's name is however they want it to be pronounced.
05:26:39 <oerjan> and all of which would be pronounced with /j/ in norwegian, except James doesn't really exist.
05:27:47 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: Sean is irish spelling. they do _strange_ things with the vowels hth
05:28:04 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: The irish is wrong
05:28:28 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Yes, but the problem is the PARENT insists that it's spelled in a way incompatible with spelling
05:28:53 <shachaf> There is no such thing as "incompatible with spelling" in English.
05:29:14 <shachaf> If people are young enough that they haven't been able to make their own choice about their names, I have no opinion.
05:31:43 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: irish gaelic, to be specific.
05:32:02 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Gaaaaaaæeeeee
05:32:15 <hppavilion[1]> (I had trouble deciding how to drag an æ, so I did that...)
05:32:33 <oerjan> that's because you're gææææææææææææææææærn
05:32:45 <oerjan> (norwegian for craaaaaaaaaaaaaazy)
05:33:20 <oerjan> (colloquial spelling _and_ pronunciation)
05:35:29 <zzo38> I would think that the name should be pronouse how they want it to be pronounce. However, then you should write it down in proper way if you can know of. You should also to spell their name in the way they would intend to spell their name, too, if possible.
05:36:20 * hppavilion[1] . o O ( In norwegian they use ø. In swedish they use ö. German also uses ö, so by the law of analogy, German can be properly spelled with ø instead of ö )
05:37:04 <hppavilion[1]> (Don't question it, it's a joke. But given that I have an ø (still not sure whether to write "a" or "an" before "ø") key, I might just write german with ø in place of ö)
05:37:53 <zzo38> OK you can, but it does not mean you should, unless you intend to make the auto search/replace with it.
05:39:51 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: Nø, I just wånt tø ånnøy the Germåns. hth.
05:39:59 <zzo38> O, OK
05:40:17 <zzo38> Do you like to ignore the English too?
05:40:23 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: I'd say "itym Ø, ØK", but yøu can't ø, can you
05:40:26 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: A little?
05:40:50 <zzo38> OK
05:44:27 <shachaf> Instead of annoying people, I recommend that you don't try to be annoying.
05:45:18 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: ...*fine*
05:46:55 <hppavilion[1]> New definition: Fixpoint quine: A superset of quines where it is not required that the program itself output its own source code, but that it either outputs its own source code OR outputs a fixpoint quine in the same language
05:47:59 <shachaf> So every program is a "fixpoint quine".
05:49:07 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: How so?
05:49:20 <zzo38> I don't think so; some programs will output stuff that is not a valid code.
05:49:28 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: It has to be in the same language
05:49:30 <hppavilion[1]> zzo38: Yes, exactly
05:49:45 <shachaf> Depends on what counts as "in the language".
05:50:20 <shachaf> But every Jot program is a "fixpoint quine".
05:50:22 <zzo38> The following is not a valid C code: Hello, World!
05:50:27 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: You say it's a fixpoint quite in <language>, since all text is a fixpoint quine in some language
05:50:38 <shachaf> Also I don't like the word "fixpoint".
05:50:41 <shachaf> I don't know whether I should like it
05:50:44 <shachaf> Probably not.
05:51:03 <zzo38> I also probably don't like it in this context
05:51:05 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: It's a fixpoint in that if you repeatedly run the code, you eventually enter a point where the output it always the same
05:51:16 <shachaf> That's not true.
05:51:19 <hppavilion[1]> (...that's what a fixpoint is, isn't it? Like the Y fixpoint combinator?)
05:51:29 <shachaf> I'll continue to say "fixed point".
05:51:49 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: If there's a better word, switch to that
05:53:00 <hppavilion[1]> But it's just smartassy to make a quine by saying that what language to use is whatever-will-make-it-a-quine, or if the language is very quiney like cat
06:18:56 <oerjan> > (\n s->var$s++show(n+1)++show s)1"(\\n s->var$s++show(n+1)++show s)"
06:18:58 <lambdabot> (\n s->var$s++show(n+1)++show s)2"(\\n s->var$s++show(n+1)++show s)"
06:19:03 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: ^
06:19:10 <oerjan> never repeats.
06:19:30 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: ergo it's not a fixpoint quine
06:19:34 <oerjan> by your original definition, a fixpoint quine.
06:19:40 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Wait, what?
06:20:19 <oerjan> oh. you meant _smallest_ set. i interpreted it as the _largest_.
06:20:22 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: OK, can you repeat back to me what my definition is in your own words? I can't see...
06:21:04 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: when defining things recursively like that, you can interpret it as any set that fits. there's a smallest and a largest one.
06:21:17 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Oh, right, I see
06:21:50 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: I see the issue. I forgot something
06:21:52 <oerjan> that's sort of data vs. codata.
06:22:01 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: ...codata? wat?
06:23:08 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: example data: finite lists. example codata: lists which may be infinite.
06:23:19 <hppavilion[1]> Ah
06:23:23 <oerjan> haskell "data" is the latter, actually, because of laziness.
06:26:05 <shachaf> it's like the question about "this sentence is true" hth
06:26:19 <shachaf> I also interpreted it as the largest, which is obviously the best way to interpret it.
06:26:52 <oerjan> it seems like the most interesting yeah
06:27:21 <oerjan> because you can get a lot of strange stuff but you need to make sure it always parses...
06:27:56 <shachaf> I would say that a compiler error also counts as output.
06:28:13 <shachaf> For example I would call a program that generates a compiler error equal to its source code a quine.
06:28:27 <oerjan> we call that a "kimian" quine.
06:28:37 <oerjan> ...for some reason.
06:28:56 <oerjan> > fnord
06:28:59 <lambdabot> error: Variable not in scope: fnord
06:29:10 <oerjan> > error: Variable not in scope: error
06:29:12 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:21: error: parse error on input ‘in’
06:29:26 <oerjan> > <hint>:1:21: error: parse error on input ‘<'
06:29:29 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:1: error: parse error on input ‘<’
06:29:37 <oerjan> > <hint>:1:1: error: parse error on input ‘<'
06:29:39 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:1: error: parse error on input ‘<’
06:29:44 <oerjan> SUCCESS
06:29:59 <oerjan> now, is there more than one?
06:30:45 <oerjan> it would need a different format error, at least
06:31:35 <oerjan> hm is that actually a fixpoint in (except for erroring) hppavilion[1]'s sense?
06:32:14 <oerjan> > <hint>:1:21: error: parse error on input ‘in’
06:32:16 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:1: error: parse error on input ‘<’
06:32:26 <oerjan> i suppose it is.
06:32:43 <oerjan> hm it seems like > autostrips the initial space.
06:32:55 <oerjan> > (:)
06:32:57 <lambdabot> error:
06:32:57 <lambdabot> • No instance for (Typeable a0)
06:32:57 <lambdabot> arising from a use of ‘show_M764240908133430608317677’
06:33:06 <oerjan> argh
06:33:21 <oerjan> lambdabot: you're making this hard :(
06:33:30 <shachaf> `abc
06:33:32 <HackEgo> ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: abc: not found
06:33:32 <oerjan> > error: error
06:33:35 <lambdabot> error:
06:33:35 <lambdabot> • Couldn't match expected type ‘[[Char] -> a]’
06:33:35 <lambdabot> with actual type ‘[Char] -> a0’
06:33:44 <shachaf> `/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: abc: not found
06:33:45 <HackEgo> ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits:: No such file or directory
06:34:03 <shachaf> `/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits:: No such file or directory
06:34:04 <HackEgo> ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits:: No such file or directory
06:34:11 <oerjan> ha
06:34:16 <oerjan> ^]
06:34:36 <oerjan> [ hi
06:34:37 <ffj-bot> oerjan: |value error: hi
06:34:41 <oerjan> wat
06:34:47 <oerjan> [ |value error: hi
06:34:48 <ffj-bot> oerjan: |spelling error
06:34:48 <ffj-bot> oerjan: | |value error: hi
06:34:48 <ffj-bot> oerjan: | ^
06:35:02 <oerjan> grmbl so verbose
06:35:06 <shachaf> ( hi
06:35:06 <idris-bot> No such variable hi
06:35:11 <shachaf> ( No such variable hi
06:35:11 <idris-bot> builtin:Type mismatch between
06:35:12 <idris-bot> Dec prop (Type of No contra)
06:35:12 <idris-bot> and
06:35:12 <idris-bot> _ -> _ (Is No contra applied to too many arguments?)
06:35:12 <idris-bot> Specifically:↵…
06:35:30 <shachaf> ) hi
06:35:49 <oerjan> darn
06:35:50 <hppavilion[1]> Question: How many can there be?
06:35:53 <oerjan> ] hm
06:35:59 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: many what?
06:36:13 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: "there"?
06:36:22 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: The answer is "only one"
06:36:46 <oerjan> it has five letters hth
06:36:58 <oerjan> > Question: How many can there be?
06:37:01 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:33: error:
06:37:01 <lambdabot> parse error (possibly incorrect indentation or mismatched brackets)
06:37:29 <oerjan> @hi
06:37:29 <lambdabot> hitchcock ... Hitchcock's Bible Names Dictionary (late 1800's)
06:37:39 <oerjan> @hitchcock ... Hitchcock's Bible Names Dictionary (late 1800's)
06:37:40 <lambdabot> Sorry, look up one word at a time please.
06:37:42 <shachaf> @hi jacob
06:37:44 <lambdabot> *** "Jacob" hitchcock "Hitchcock's Bible Names Dictionary (late 1800's)"
06:37:44 <lambdabot> Jacob, that supplants, undermines; the heel
06:37:44 <lambdabot>
06:37:48 <oerjan> @Sorry, look up one word at a time please.
06:37:48 <lambdabot> Unknown command, try @list
06:37:55 <oerjan> @Unknown command, try @list
06:37:55 <lambdabot> Unknown command, try @list
06:38:41 <shachaf> ?Unknown command, try @list
06:38:41 <lambdabot> Unknown command, try @list
06:38:58 <shachaf> :t abc
06:38:59 <lambdabot> error:
06:38:59 <lambdabot> • Variable not in scope: abc
06:38:59 <lambdabot> • Perhaps you meant ‘abs’ (imported from Prelude)
06:39:03 <shachaf> bah
06:39:09 <oerjan> :t error:
06:39:11 <lambdabot> error:
06:39:11 <lambdabot> parse error (possibly incorrect indentation or mismatched brackets)
06:39:17 <oerjan> hmph
06:39:27 <shachaf> :k abc
06:39:28 <lambdabot> error: Not in scope: type variable ‘abc’
06:39:36 <shachaf> :k error: Not in scope: type variable ‘abc’
06:39:38 <lambdabot> error: parse error on input ‘in’
06:39:44 <shachaf> :k error: parse error on input ‘in’
06:39:46 <lambdabot> error: lexical error at character '\8216'
06:39:52 <shachaf> :k error: lexical error at character '\8216'
06:39:54 <lambdabot> error: parse error on input ‘'’
06:40:02 <shachaf> :k error: parse error on input ‘'’
06:40:04 <oerjan> loopy loop
06:40:05 <lambdabot> error: lexical error at character '\8216'
06:40:07 <shachaf> yep
06:40:20 <shachaf> not in scowpe
06:40:37 <oerjan> `? hi
06:40:38 <HackEgo> hi? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:40:41 <shachaf> fungot is most crucial bot because who can remember all the prefixes?
06:40:45 <oerjan> `? hi? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:40:46 <HackEgo> hi? ¯\(°​_o)/¯? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:40:51 <oerjan> NOPE
06:40:59 <oerjan> `prefixes
06:40:59 <HackEgo> Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEgo `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, idris-bot ( , jconn ) , j-bot [ .
06:41:18 <shachaf> !hi
06:41:26 <shachaf> Oh, not here, right.
06:41:26 <oerjan> i don't think there are any more that are actually here
06:41:36 <shachaf> @metar hi
06:41:41 <oerjan> even j-bo has been replaced
06:41:51 <oerjan> *+t
06:41:55 <shachaf> @metar
06:42:01 <shachaf> success?
06:42:10 <oerjan> ?
06:42:14 <oerjan> MAYBE
06:42:22 <shachaf> @list
06:42:22 <lambdabot> What module? Try @listmodules for some ideas.
06:42:31 <shachaf> @listmodules
06:42:31 <lambdabot> activity base bf check compose dice dict djinn dummy elite eval filter free fresh haddock help hoogle instances irc karma localtime metar more oeis offlineRC pl pointful poll pretty quote search
06:42:31 <lambdabot> slap source spell system tell ticker todo topic type undo unlambda unmtl version where
06:42:44 <shachaf> too many modules
06:42:55 <oerjan> @hoogle hi
06:42:58 <lambdabot> Data.Approximate.Type hi :: HasApproximate c_aj1A a_afRM => Lens' c_aj1A a_afRM
06:42:58 <lambdabot> package hi
06:42:58 <lambdabot> Agda.Auto.CaseSplit data HI a
06:43:21 <oerjan> @hoogle Data.Approximate.Type hi :: HasApproximate c_aj1A a_afRM => Lens' c_aj1A a_afRM
06:43:21 <lambdabot> No results found
06:43:29 <oerjan> @hoogle No results found
06:43:30 <lambdabot> No results found
06:43:41 <shachaf> @pl hi
06:43:41 <lambdabot> hi
06:43:56 <oerjan> that's pretty pointless
06:44:09 <oerjan> @elite hmmmm
06:44:09 <lambdabot> hMm/\/\/\/\
06:44:17 <oerjan> @elite hMm/\/\/\/\
06:44:17 <lambdabot> hmM/\/\/\/\
06:44:31 <oerjan> @elite hmM/\/\/\/\
06:44:32 <lambdabot> HM/\/\/\/\/\/\
06:44:40 <oerjan> @elite HM/\/\/\/\/\/\
06:44:41 <lambdabot> HM/\/\/\/\/\/\
06:44:51 <shachaf> @elite HM/\/\/\/\/\/\
06:44:51 <lambdabot> hm/\/\/\/\/\/\
06:45:02 <shachaf> does it really count if it's nondeterministic
06:45:14 <oerjan> mayhaps not
06:45:22 <shachaf> @time hi
06:45:38 <shachaf> @messages-loud hi
06:45:38 <lambdabot> You don't have any messages
06:45:43 <shachaf> @messages-loud You don't have any messages
06:45:43 <lambdabot> You don't have any messages
06:46:39 <shachaf> Those are some spectacularly bad type variable names for Approximate there.
06:46:56 <shachaf> Not sure why that's happening. http://hackage.haskell.org/package/approximate- just uses c and a
06:47:13 <shachaf> Why would it use the GHC identifier like that?
06:47:40 <shachaf> oerjan: is IRP too nondeterministic for this approach
06:48:09 <hppavilion[1]> Idea: "Choose Ye Own Adventure"; a choose-your-own-adventure style game where you control MULTIPLE characters, and try to manipulate events to a desired outcome
06:48:25 <oerjan> shachaf: is IRP to nondeterministic for this approach
06:59:06 <oerjan> @metar ENVA
06:59:06 <lambdabot> ENVA 060650Z 09006KT CAVOK M06/M11 Q1021 NOSIG RMK WIND 670FT 09012KT
06:59:14 <oerjan> i guess the rain is over for a while.
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07:23:37 <zzo38> Someone wrote about ignoring STRONGNAT (a Wikipedia guideline for an article about a country or something with strong ties to that country or is about an author, then that article should use the same language as that country or author if Wikipedia's language is the same language as that language or country) for dates. I do not quite agree because if it is not the pure numeric format then it is not ambiguous.
07:24:11 <zzo38> (But I think it makes sense to ignore STRONGNAT if following it would cause ambiguities.)
07:24:17 <zzo38> What do you think of it?
07:26:59 <zzo38> (I also prefer year month day as the order anyways when the date is written numerically; when writing in words, use whatever order you prefer.)
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07:48:43 <\oren\> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdYGQ7B0Vew
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09:05:12 <shachaf> @tell FireFly FireFlood
09:05:12 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
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09:16:42 <zzo38> Do you like this kind of card with Magic: the Gathering: {T}, Pay 1 life: You gain 1 life.
09:17:19 <Hoolootwo> seems like it could be abused for something...
09:17:38 <Hoolootwo> that's not a bad thing though
09:18:33 <zzo38> Yes, and that is why the cost includes {T}
09:18:55 <zzo38> (another variant is to put mana instead of {T})
09:19:33 <Hoolootwo> oh right, haven't played magic for a while
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09:21:54 <zzo38> There are things that can be done while the ability is on the stack (such as effects that exchange life totals), or you can use triggered abilities with it.
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09:26:43 <shachaf> zzo38: what if it was {T}, Gain 1 life: You lose 1 life.
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09:29:53 <zzo38> shachaf: Actually I did think of that too (but then decided against writing it too)
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09:31:17 <zzo38> It might give you life point to pay life for some other ability to be placed above it on the stack that will let you to win the game, or the ability could be countered, or possibly other purposes as well; the same thing with triggered abilities can also work.
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09:40:52 <shachaf> what if Transcendence is on the battlefield twnh
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09:46:07 <zzo38> Then its triggered ability causes you to gain 2 life; the timing depend which version you are using. If you can remove Transcendence in time then you might win. Various convoluted puzzles can be made up, too. Or, use Donate with Transcendence. Also if you have Transcendence then you can use my first version even with only 1 life point and don't lose.
09:46:41 <shachaf> I was talking about your first version.
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09:47:04 <zzo38> Yes, OK
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09:49:46 <shachaf> FixyourconnectionFly
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10:23:17 <int-e> fizzie is probably sleeping hmm
10:23:45 <shachaf> @time fizzie
10:23:46 <lambdabot> Local time for fizzie is Sun Nov 6 10:23:45 2016
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10:24:33 <int-e> oh well, for irrsi: /ignore FireFly JOINS PARTS QUITS
10:24:47 <shachaf> `? int-e
10:24:55 <HackEgo> int-e är inte svensk. Hen kommer att spränga solen. Hen står för sig själv. Hen gillar inte färger.
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10:28:06 <int-e> Oh the last bit is the colors thing.
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10:36:24 <shachaf> int-e kommet att spränga solen?
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10:36:44 <shachaf> Heute die Welt, Morgen das Sonnensystem.
10:37:45 <shachaf> idag spränga världen, i morgon spränga solsystemet
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10:37:56 <shachaf> solen
10:38:00 <shachaf> idag spränga världen, i morgon spränga solen
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10:42:30 <Taneb> Is FireFly OK
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10:44:08 <int-e> abridged version: <int-e> @google how to erase lines from IRC backlog <boily> int-ello. you can't erase. all lines are permanent. the Internet's Ink is indelible. <int-e> @google how to turn the Sun into a supernova full context is somewhere in http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/16.03.14
10:44:51 <int-e> So anyway it would be for a good cause.
10:49:20 <int-e> `? dowry
10:49:21 <HackEgo> A dowry is a pribe paid for a brice, or maybe a bribe paid for a pride.
10:50:45 <int-e> `` grep -r scow wisdom | wc -l
10:50:53 <HackEgo> 1
10:50:57 <int-e> `` grep -r scow wisdom
10:50:58 <HackEgo> wisdom/sbeef:sbeef is the culinary name for meat from scow
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12:23:40 <boily> `wisdom
12:23:47 <HackEgo> log//I think you might mean !logs
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12:54:13 <izabera> $ sudo blockdev --setrw /dev/mapper/CAC_VG-CAC_LV
12:54:15 <izabera> $ sudo mount -o remount,rw /
12:54:17 <izabera> mount: cannot remount /dev/mapper/CAC_VG-CAC_LV read-write, is write-protected
12:54:19 <izabera> halp
12:54:21 <izabera> what am i doing wrong
12:54:23 <izabera> blockdev succeded
12:56:38 <izabera> lvdisplay says it's in read-write mode
12:57:29 <boily> izabellora. what happens if you umount first, then mount in two steps?
12:59:29 <boily> http://unix.stackexchange.com/a/224732 ← read the kernel logs?
12:59:39 <boily> . o O ( where are the kernel logs? )
13:00:03 <izabera> i already did what that answer says
13:01:26 <boily> darn.
13:01:29 <boily> fungot?
13:01:34 <boily> no fungot.
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13:22:34 <ybden> fungoooooooooot
13:23:28 <boily> fizzie: fizziello. ↑
13:27:53 <int-e> `` dmesg | tail -n 1
13:27:54 <HackEgo> random: perl urandom read with 5 bits of entropy available
13:35:37 * boily commits sudoku for having forgot about dmesg
13:36:39 <int-e> oh FireFly stopped flooding
13:36:47 <FireFly> Yes, sorry :<
13:36:53 <FireFly> @messages-loud
13:36:53 <lambdabot> shachaf said 4h 31m 40s ago: FireFlood
13:37:01 <FireFly> heh
13:39:05 <boily> FirelloFly. you flooded?
13:40:17 <int-e> excessively, if the quit message can be trusted
13:40:25 <int-e> messages, really.
13:41:11 <int-e> boily: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/16.11.06 has recorded the deed
13:41:38 <int-e> (or not... the flooding seems to be hidden between the lines)
13:42:21 <FireFly> well, I was asleep
13:43:34 <boily> int-ello. that is professional flooding.
13:43:58 <boily> sleeping flood. slood.
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13:45:49 <int-e> FireFly: so is this the technical equivalent of snoring, then?
13:46:06 <FireFly> Haha
13:46:28 <FireFly> Mostly a poorly configured ZNC is to blame
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14:08:04 * boily does the fungot invocation dance. «ooga ooga wobble wobble ♪»
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14:11:41 * Zarutian has been thinking about how to decode morse, in an program, tapped out by a human.
14:11:58 <boily> I seem to have invoked a moon instead of fungot.
14:12:06 <moonheart08> boily, lol
14:12:25 <moonheart08> did i seriously snipe your invokation attempt? :P
14:12:44 * boily notes down the words to invoke a moon.
14:13:05 <moonheart08> what are they? :P
14:13:20 <boily> “ooga ooga wobble wobble”
14:13:26 <moonheart08> lol
14:13:52 <moonheart08> it may work better if you PM them to me. *adds those words to ping list*
14:14:39 <moonheart08> Client: HexChat 2.12.2 OS: Microsoft Windows 8.1 with Bing (x64) CPU: Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU N2840 @ 2.16GHz (2.16GHz) Memory: 3.9 GiB Total (1008.6 MiB Free) Storage: 378.4 GiB / 382.7 GiB (4.3 GiB Free) VGA: Intel(R) HD Graphics Uptime: 13h 42m 39s
14:14:42 <moonheart08> oh derp
14:14:45 <moonheart08> hit the wrong button
14:14:49 <moonheart08> >_<
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14:18:07 <moonheart08> boily, say it again, it should highlight me :P
14:18:09 * moonheart08 afks
14:20:35 <boily> ooga ooga wobble wobble
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14:25:43 <boily> `relcome super_bender
14:25:44 <HackEgo> super_bender: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.)
14:26:42 * Zarutian mutters something about 'leaky integrators' and 'two high marks'
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14:28:56 * boily gives some duct tape to unleak Zarutian's integrators
14:28:58 * Zarutian thinks he can dispense with the leaky integrators and just use two ints.
14:35:41 <moonheart08> boily, what
14:36:33 <boily> ?
14:39:00 <fizzie> boily: I think I will try to do that thing I talked about that might make fungot to not hang indefinitely, so that I could make it auto-restarting.
14:39:11 <fizzie> Although I haven't been writing Befunge in *so long*.
14:40:08 <boily> there should be a Befunge transpiler.
14:42:08 <fizzie> I'll need to figure out if I even have access to the 'O' instruction from SOCK at all, or if I've loaded some other fingerprint on top of it.
14:43:28 <fizzie> Should've documented these remappings.
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14:44:46 <fizzie> I think I'm loading SCKE, FILE and REXP after SOCK.
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14:55:33 <fizzie> TIL: KEEPALIVE backwards is EVIL-A-PEEK. Sockets are EVIL.
14:56:45 <moonheart08> lol
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14:58:03 <fizzie> I've done the first bit (setting SO_KEEPALIVE on), will see if it works first, before attempting to do the auto-join part.
14:59:38 <boily> fungot: nostril.
14:59:38 <fungot> boily:...) succeeded. ai-ai_canonname: " fnord scsi terminator: use this if you try to
14:59:56 * boily uses a fnord scsi terminator
15:22:51 * moonheart08 steals boily's mapole(s)
15:27:56 <super_bender> boily, thanks lol
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15:28:42 <boily> eille! touche pas à mes mapoles!
15:29:07 * boily glares at moony and grabs his precious mapoles back. «toé.»
15:29:53 * boily goes and hide them in a secure safe.
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16:23:46 <int-e> `? password
16:23:47 <HackEgo> The password of the month is ⛄
16:23:59 <int-e> `unidecode ⛄
16:23:59 <HackEgo> ​[U+26C4 SNOWMAN WITHOUT SNOW]
16:24:07 <int-e> subtle.
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17:03:35 <int-e> btw, I can no longer confirm the "without snow" part
17:04:03 <Taneb> :(
17:04:10 <Taneb> int-e, where are you?
17:04:38 <int-e> Innsbruck.
17:05:26 <Taneb> I went vaguely near there in August!
17:05:37 <Taneb> (visited Lienz)
17:05:51 <Taneb> (very vaguely near)
17:06:08 <int-e> (Austria... ~575m elevation, and today's rain brought some dripping wet snow with it... enough to cover cars in white, not cold enough for it to stay on the ground)
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17:07:44 <Taneb> I was staying in Moos over the border in Italy
17:08:36 <int-e> well, close enough
17:08:53 * int-e keeps mixing up Linz and Lienz though
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17:09:42 <Taneb> ...Lienz has a very similar population to Hexham
17:10:00 <int-e> that was very helpful. not.
17:10:57 <int-e> but true.
17:11:53 <int-e> is there a list of european cities ordered by population? hmmm.
17:13:11 <int-e> (extending all the way down to maybe 1000 people?)
17:13:16 <Taneb> It means I have a point of comparison for describing my hometown to the friend I was staying with
17:13:19 <int-e> or 10k, in this case.
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17:14:12 <int-e> half the population of Zerbst, now that would've told me something ;-)
17:17:31 <int-e> and now I'm trying to find out what the size of the area of Hexham is.
17:23:33 <int-e> haha, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexham,_New_South_Wales
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18:24:35 <FireFly> Heh
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19:00:42 <izalove> mats valk 4.74s
19:00:46 <izalove> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLksISrKtO8
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19:02:18 <PinealGlandOptic> hi everyone! does anybody remembers this? AFAIR, Don Knuth has an exercise in his book, to contrive sorting algorithm slower than any existing, but still correct and halting at finish. was it?
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19:05:44 <LKoen> PinealGlandOptic: http://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/79895/is-bubble-sort-the-slowest-sorting-algorithm#79902 ?
19:07:14 <PinealGlandOptic> LKoen: thanks, this seems what I'm looking for
19:07:42 <LKoen> I'll thank google for you
19:08:31 <myname> i have an easy one
19:09:11 <myname> consider a check of wether a sequence is sorted or not: a sequence is sorted iff each subsequence is sorted
19:09:24 <myname> that will give you a solid O(2^n) to start with
19:09:46 <myname> not make like bubble sort around it and check every iteration
19:10:03 <myname> won't matter much in face of 2^n, but still
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19:12:34 <PinealGlandOptic> I just found crippled Bubble sort implemented incorrectly, the case for Daily WTF website. wanted to compare it with Knuth's approach, haha
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19:16:19 <izalove> find max element, then compute the first 1 digits of pi
19:16:36 <izalove> find max element in the remaining vector, then compute the first 2^2 digits of pi
19:16:38 <PinealGlandOptic> these exercises looks like antichess, try to lose all pieces, but this can be tricky
19:16:38 <izalove> find max element in the remaining vector, then compute the first 3^3^3 digits of pi
19:17:09 <moonheart08> dhi
19:18:33 <myname> http://4cdn.hu/kraken/image/upload/s--4EkaxxR4--/6vtVAA1Q6CwFDZFUs.jpeg as a german, i find this funny
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19:20:23 * moonheart08 steals boily's mapoles while he/she is not here
19:21:06 <PinealGlandOptic> myname: Reductio ad Hitlerum? comparison of Stalin to Hitler is especially popular
19:21:35 <moonheart08> PinealGlandOptic, you new?
19:21:44 <myname> izalove: your algorithm is cheating since the digits of pi do not matter the slightest in the calculation
19:22:04 <myname> izalove: find an algorithm that is still correct if you omit a subset of lines
19:22:15 <izalove> any subset?
19:22:30 <myname> at best, yeah
19:23:08 <myname> i.e. there should not be a subset of code that still produces the right result on every given input
19:23:18 <myname> which your algorithm has
19:23:46 <int-e> myname: did you just negate the requirements?
19:24:30 <moonheart08> myname, i actually find that rather funny too, even tho im an American, i dont think either candidate are worthy of presidency :P
19:24:58 <myname> int-e: i guess not?
19:25:17 <myname> on izaloves algorithm, you can omit the calculation of pi
19:25:28 <myname> therefore it is not valid
19:25:50 <myname> since i can just put the subset of lines that do not compute pi and get a valid result
19:25:51 <int-e> myname: picking a subset and taking a subset away are the same thing, but first you wanted the results to still be correct, now you want them to be incorrect, something is wrong here, unless there are no possible inputs at all.
19:26:17 <myname> int-e: where did i want them to be incorrect?
19:26:40 <int-e> "i.e. there should not be a subset of code that still produces the right result on every given input"
19:27:05 <myname> int-e: i repeat: where did i want them to be incorrect?
19:27:11 <int-e> right there.
19:27:14 <int-e> not correct = incorrect
19:27:25 <myname> what i said is: each subset of code _must_ produce at least one wrong output
19:27:36 <myname> each real subset
19:27:51 <int-e> "find an algorithm that is still correct if you omit a subset of lines"
19:28:38 <int-e> but I feel I'm wasting my time on something not very interesting here... sorry that I barged in, will drop the topic.
19:29:02 <myname> that one was stupid, yeah
19:51:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[ObCode]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=50160 * Challenger5 * (+7276) Created page with "'''ObCode''' is a stack-based [[esoteric programming language]] created by [[User:Challenger5]]. It could be considered a [[Turing Tarpit]] if it is proven Turing Complete. I..."
19:52:51 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[ObCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=50161&oldid=50160 * Challenger5 * (-1)
19:53:26 <shachaf> a little hostile, don't you think
19:54:00 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[ObCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=50162&oldid=50161 * Challenger5 * (+1)
19:55:21 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=50163&oldid=50116 * Challenger5 * (+13) /* O */
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21:17:31 <hppavilion[1]> Shouldn't a Sequel be called a "Postquel"
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21:22:12 <Zarutian> I been wondering for a long time now what Sequel is sequel of? Because I am sure the original is much better.
21:24:42 <hppavilion[1]> Zarutian: You mean what the word for the original is?
21:24:54 <hppavilion[1]> (Or is there a movie called Sequel or..?)
21:25:37 <hppavilion[1]> A movie that takes place roughly coherently with another is an Equel
21:25:38 <Zarutian> hppavilion[1]: I meant in the sense of SQL -> Sequel and as anyone who has watched some movie series, the orignal are often better than the sequels
21:25:43 <hppavilion[1]> Zarutian: Oh xD
21:25:58 <hppavilion[1]> Zarutian: Not sure, but I think tswett is making the reboot
21:26:23 <hppavilion[1]> ("Equel", ntbcw "Equal")
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21:26:42 <Zarutian> trying to make a database language that is not based on "English prose"?
21:26:54 <hppavilion[1]> Zarutian: Yes, it looks very nice at the moment
21:27:06 <hppavilion[1]> Zarutian: Still in early dev. Let me see if I can find the linky
21:27:26 <hppavilion[1]> Zarutian: https://laserdb.blogspot.com/ hth
21:29:01 <Zarutian> then again SQL seems like it was written by whoever made COBOL
21:29:37 <wanderman> NoSQL please
21:33:35 <zzo38> I program in SQL, but there are other stuff too
21:36:33 <shachaf> zzo38: What do you think a good database query language would be like?
21:37:05 <shachaf> I shouldn't even say language. Database query API, and database query UI.
21:41:54 <zzo38> SQL seems good enough for most purposes, although a UI with autocomplete and split-screen and so on could help. API is also good, especially if you can have remote API; SQLite's virtual table API (with some extensions) could be of some help here. Having to prepare a SQL query to deal with a database in a programming language other than SQL doesn't make that much sense, but there are some advantages.
21:42:04 <Zarutian> what are tables other than arrays of records so to speak? Then the API should be similiar to how you can do stuff like .filter(), .map() etc
21:42:35 <zzo38> Yes, that does make some sense.
21:44:03 <zzo38> Some kind of JavaScript program or extension could perhaps to be written that can implement it like that. One thing that such thing won't do, but that SQLite's virtual table mechanism can do, is consumed constraints.
21:44:26 <Zarutian> but such would need analyses of code. If we take the .filter() example. It takes what exactly? An function?
21:44:43 <Zarutian> what is consumed constraints?
21:45:38 <zzo38> If it is JavaScript then for arrays, .filter() and .map() do take functions. (And, actually, now that I think about it, there is a way to do consumed constraints with it, if you implement them as functions that return functions that are marked in some way.)
21:46:31 <zzo38> Zarutian: What I mean is for example, in SQLite, the xBestIndex method of a virtual table implementation can see some parts of the WHERE clause, and can use those to implement its own filtering rather than to have SQLite retrieve all records and then filter some out.
21:47:21 <Zarutian> oh, I agree the filtering should happen where the data lives
21:48:32 <Zarutian> and with .filter() in ecmascript there is nothing preventing you from chaining them.
21:48:57 <zzo38> Zarutian: Yes I know you can chain them.
21:49:49 <Zarutian> which to me seems like what virtual table implementation seems to be used to achive in your example.
21:50:16 <zzo38> What I meant is something like that instead of writing .filter(x=>x[2]==3) you might write .filter(columnEquals(2,3)) instead; on something other than a database table it would act the same way.
21:50:50 <zzo38> (On a database table, the former would simply be slower, but would give the same result.)
21:52:00 <Zarutian> what other thing than a database table? I take that you can make an intermediary result table (that only lives conceptually) that further filtering can then be done on (or any other processing)
21:52:20 <zzo38> SQLite virtual tables can allow some filtering to occur "where the data lives"; however, you can't do this with LIMIT/OFFSET clauses (which would probably be useful if you are accessing the data over the internet).
21:52:51 <Zarutian> heck the database could be a continously streamed event-sourced records in the FlowBasedProgramming style
21:52:53 <zzo38> Zarutian: By "other thing than a database table" I mean calling columnEquals(2,3)(x) directly.
21:53:52 <Zarutian> x being like a row or record here?
21:54:17 <zzo38> Yes.
21:54:32 <Zarutian> sure
21:54:51 <Zarutian> I mean that I dont find that any special and it shouldnt be
21:55:48 <Zarutian> but the whole stuff with SQL is that it is not as easy to speficy that columnsEquals(2,3)(x)
21:56:11 <Zarutian> heck columnsEqual seems to me like an Curry-nator?
21:56:23 <zzo38> Because of how SQL works, you don't need to.
21:56:46 <zzo38> It is one kind of thing making SQL suitable for database queries.
22:00:08 <Zarutian> yes, but what it seems to me, at least from codebases I have seen, SQL is used from sort of text literal (often in some sort of sprintf style query builder) to get the first stage results which is then processed further by stuff native to the programming language the main program is written in.
22:00:38 <zzo38> Yes, and that isn't very good, I agree.
22:01:01 <zzo38> (Although, if you are doing that, you should use host parameters when possible rather than a string builder.)
22:01:07 <Zarutian> a similie would be like asking directory assitance to fax you the "Ab" section of the phonebook
22:01:52 <zzo38> I suppose it is somewhat.
22:01:55 <Zarutian> zzo38: I am talking about a host parameterizer or what it is called. Much better than just concatinating the query string together.
22:02:39 <zzo38> What I mean is as a stand-alone programming language for database operations, SQL works well.
22:02:46 <Zarutian> zzo38: but what I mean is that the 'whole' query isnt in the SQL sent
22:02:52 <zzo38> (If used stand-alone, then you won't be using (nor need) host parameters.)
22:03:48 <zzo38> Zarutian: Yes, although the SQL code does not have to be parsed again if the parameter changes, too.
22:11:15 <Zarutian> my point is that to a programmer handling data that lives in a database there is no impedience missmatch so to speak
22:12:14 <zzo38> O, OK
22:13:12 <zzo38> That makes sense
22:14:26 <Zarutian> it looks, superficially, like you are just dealing with arrays of records but in reality the proxy_objs are actually sending the most spefic query or update back to the database.
22:16:34 <Zarutian> heck, I recall there was this project at Google (dont recall its name though) that used esprima to parse functions passed to .filter() and co to construct map and reduce tasks.
22:16:40 <zzo38> Yes, that is what I thought of too
22:19:27 <zzo38> Although I don't know what is esprima and thought to use special functions (such as a function returned by columnEquals) instead.
22:21:43 <hppavilion[1]> Huh. Apparently, subvocalization (reading silently to yourself) is characterized by your speechers still wobbling a tiny bit
22:21:52 <hppavilion[1]> I think I found an information leak usable for mind reading >:)
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23:16:14 <hppavilion[1]> The plural of "wug" is "wux"
23:16:42 <myname> what even is a wug
23:19:46 <hppavilion[1]> myname: There was an experiment done to see how children acquire the rules of language; "This is a WUG. Now there is another one. There are now two ____"
23:20:16 <myname> okay?
23:20:30 <hppavilion[1]> myname: The expected answer is "WUGS", but english plurae are bizarre and random, so I declare the correct answer to be "WUX"
23:20:56 <myname> that does not answer my question
23:21:16 <hppavilion[1]> myname: It's a nonsense word intentionally having no meaning, but it appears to be presented as a bird usually
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23:23:28 <myname> i declare the correct plural to be gub, because why the fuck not
23:29:51 <boily> mynamello. what are gub?
23:30:30 <myname> boily: multiple wug, obviosly
23:30:59 <myname> wug is something hppavilion[1] came up to look for a plural
23:31:00 <hppavilion[1]> myname: That works too
23:31:13 <hppavilion[1]> myname: No, it's an actual experiment predating me
23:31:25 <hppavilion[1]> myname: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Berko_Gleason#Children.27s_learning_of_English_morphology.E2.80.94.E2.80.8B.E2.80.8Bthe_Wug_Test
23:35:51 <hppavilion[1]> I've never quite been clear on whether the SMBC guy's last name is Weiner or Weinersmith
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23:36:15 <myname> i didn't know he has a name
23:36:25 <Taneb> A lot of people do
23:36:35 <myname> yeah, it is likely
23:36:40 <Taneb> Even Zach Weiner(Smith)?
23:36:44 <myname> but that does not let me be sure
23:38:47 <hppavilion[1]> Taneb: Maybe Kelly (his wife)'s maiden name was "Smith" and his... Masculaiden name was "Weiner", so they just concatenated them into "Weinersmith" on marriage?
23:39:33 <boily> hellœrjan, Tanelle, hppavellon[1].
23:39:48 <hppavilion[1]> ahøily
23:40:42 <oerjan> boheily
23:41:27 <oerjan> portmarriage
23:41:55 <hppavilion[1]> o and ö are nøw øbsølete. All gløry tø the Ø.
23:42:10 <quintopia> helloily
23:42:15 <quintopia> why so busy
23:43:34 <quintopia> hppavilion[1]: your naming assumption is correct
23:43:53 <boily> quinthellœpia!
23:44:09 <boily> I was volunteering for an event yesterday, and today was mahjong.
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23:45:00 <quintopia> oh rait
23:46:07 <boily> my wallet was agonizing from the shock it received Saturday. I took it around the shed and did what I had to do.
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23:47:21 <quintopia> weird
23:47:53 <quintopia> i spent less than $100 saturday
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23:48:08 <boily> in USD, it's about...
23:48:53 <boily> > 120 * 0.7481
23:48:56 <lambdabot> 89.77199999999999
23:49:23 <quintopia> oh okay.
23:49:26 <quintopia> so did you
23:50:05 <quintopia> i gave 30 to nanowrimo and bought a clock and an mp3 player for a grand total of (undisclosed)
23:51:23 <myname> why do you give money to nanowrimo?
23:52:22 <boily> I got a sandalwood comb, a bottle of beard oil, and two boardgames.
23:56:01 <Phantom_Hoover> beard oil
23:56:04 <boily> 20 dollars from that was food.
23:56:13 <boily> Phantom_Helloover. beard oil :D
23:56:32 <boily> it's for smoothing the beard and make it smell good.
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