←2021-11 2021-12 2022-01→ ↑2021 ↑all
2021-12-01
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00:09:42 <int-e> damn I already did this https://hack.esolangs.org/repo/rev/6586cfe4c003
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00:42:05 <b_jonas> it looks like I had set four monthly passwords so far
01:08:29 <int-e> ,cwlprits password
01:08:41 <int-e> `cwlprits password
01:08:44 <HackEso> b_jonäs b_jonäs int-̈e int-̈e oerjän arseniïv int-̈e int-̈e int-̈e int-̈e oerjän int-̈e b_jonäs int-̈e wib_jonäs int-̈e shachäf int-̈e int-̈e int-̈e arseniïv shachäf int-̈e shachäf Hooloovö0 int-̈e oerjän int-̈e ais523̈_ ais523̈_ arseniïv oerjän int-̈e shachäf int-̈e fizzïe int-̈e fizzïe int-̈e int-̈e b_jonäs int-̈e int-̈e oerjän oerjän int-̈e int-̈e oerjän int-̈e oerjän oerjän oerj
01:08:59 <int-e> what was the version of that command that counts?
01:10:18 <int-e> `culprits-c wisdom/password
01:10:20 <HackEso> ​ 1
01:10:57 <int-e> `culprits-c ../wisdom/password
01:10:59 <HackEso> ​ 33 oerjän 32 int-̈e 9 shachäf 4 b_jonäs 3 arseniïv 2 fizzïe 2 ais523̈_ 1 wib_jonäs 1 mromän 1 mroman̈_ 1 Hooloovö0 1 gameman̈j 1 boil̈y
01:12:02 <fizzie> TIL there's both 'culprits' and 'culprits'. (The difference is the same as that between 'hoag' and 'hoat'.)
01:12:15 <fizzie> ...'culprist' and 'culprits'.
01:12:24 <fizzie> It's hard to make an intentional typo, apparently.
01:14:32 <int-e> Ah, here's a candidate: `learn The password of the month is advent-ageous.
01:18:54 <shachaf> `culprits ../bin/culprist
01:18:56 <HackEso> shachäf
01:19:02 <shachaf> `culprist ../bin/culprist
01:19:04 <HackEso> shachäf
01:19:04 <b_jonas> isn't there also cwlprits for wisdoms and cblprits for bin and cqlprits for quotes and cilprits for interpreters and ...
01:19:11 <b_jonas> `cwlprits password
01:19:14 <HackEso> b_jonäs b_jonäs int-̈e int-̈e oerjän arseniïv int-̈e int-̈e int-̈e int-̈e oerjän int-̈e b_jonäs int-̈e wib_jonäs int-̈e shachäf int-̈e int-̈e int-̈e arseniïv shachäf int-̈e shachäf Hooloovö0 int-̈e oerjän int-̈e ais523̈_ ais523̈_ arseniïv oerjän int-̈e shachäf int-̈e fizzïe int-̈e fizzïe int-̈e int-̈e b_jonäs int-̈e int-̈e oerjän oerjän int-̈e int-̈e oerjän int-̈e oerjän oerjän oerj
01:19:23 <b_jonas> `cblprits ls
01:19:26 <HackEso> oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän int-̈e shachäf shachäf oerjän zzo3̈8 zzo3̈8 zzo3̈8 oerjän FireFl̈y oerjän zzo3̈8 oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän km̈c km̈c km̈c km̈c km̈c km̈c oerjän
01:19:31 <shachaf> I don't even remember what hoag vs. hoat is about.
01:19:36 <b_jonas> `? hoag
01:19:38 <HackEso> ​`[hd]o[aw][gt] [<filename>] is a set of commands for querying HackEgo hg logs. `hoag is the basic version. d adds revision numbers and dates, w looks only in wisdom, and t lists oldest first.
01:19:44 <b_jonas> ^
01:21:40 <shachaf> What a ridiculous convention.
01:21:47 <shachaf> Who would come up with nonsense like that?
01:32:35 <esolangs> [[User:Not applicable]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90262&oldid=81666 * Not applicable * (-6561) revamp v1
01:32:51 <b_jonas> ``` hg log -T "{rev}:{date|shortdate}:{desc}\n" -r 9006 # dunno, probably multiple users together. there's a whole lot of complex backstory behind them, like this.
01:32:52 <HackEso> 9006:2016-09-05:<shachaf> mkx bin/howg//echo "howg is deprecated! use hwag instead."; exec hwag "$@"
01:32:56 <Kit-ten> hey look thats me
01:33:03 <b_jonas> `? dowt
01:33:05 <HackEso> ​`dowt: See `hoag
01:59:53 <zzo38> For specifically displaying (not processing) text, my idea is to use a 64-bit "display code", with fields as (Width,Context,Accent,Language,Fallback) (and possibly others that I have missed); this also has an advantage similar to the "duocode" that someone else mentioned on here before. The text conversion library can convert other code pages into display codes.
02:00:27 <zzo38> And then software to display it can deal with it in whatever way is appropriate; some applications will not use all of the fields.
02:01:07 <zzo38> Actually, now I thought of some fields that I may have missed, including text direction and source offset, but I don't know if that should be handled differently maybe.
02:02:24 <zzo38> (I think duocode was just (Language,Fallback) but that seems insufficient to me.)
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02:51:55 <esolangs> [[Huby]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90263&oldid=72707 * Squidmanescape * (+25)
03:38:38 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * StampDanFan * New user account
03:40:56 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90264&oldid=90191 * StampDanFan * (+206) /* Introductions */
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04:48:00 <int-e> `? nonsense
04:48:05 <HackEso> nonsense? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
04:50:37 <aarchi> Anyone else doing Advent of Code in an esolang? I'm doing it in Whitespace: https://github.com/andrewarchi/ws-challenges
04:53:27 <zzo38> I have not tried to do the Advent of Code (yet)
04:57:40 <aarchi> Well it starts in two minutes :)
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06:48:35 <b_jonas> `? aoc
06:48:36 <HackEso> Advent of Code (AoC) is a series of programming puzzles that some regulars enjoy, found at "https://adventofcode.com/2020/about".
06:48:55 <b_jonas> `learn aoc Advent of Code (AoC) is a series of programming puzzles that some regulars enjoy, found at "https://adventofcode.com/about"
06:48:58 <HackEso> Relearned 'aoc': aoc Advent of Code (AoC) is a series of programming puzzles that some regulars enjoy, found at "https://adventofcode.com/about"
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08:40:53 <oerjan> `learn The password of the month is skipped due to being a common surname among Chinese paramount leaders.
08:40:57 <HackEso> Relearned 'password': The password of the month is skipped due to being a common surname among Chinese paramount leaders.
08:43:50 <oerjan> maybe i should have gone for subtle and skipped the last four words.
08:45:14 <oerjan> (seriously, afaict Xi isn't even in wikipedia's list of most common chinese surnames)
08:54:03 <oerjan> (ok so it is but as a nonstandard spelling for Cantonese)
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09:45:51 <esolangs> [[RASEL]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90265&oldid=88060 * Nakilon * (+4) /* Try it online */ racist IRC channel isn't worth mentioning anymore
09:49:49 <esolangs> [[Velik]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90266&oldid=88375 * Nakilon * (+20) racist IRC channel isn't worth mentioning anymore
09:52:21 <oerjan> my password timing may not have been the best for convincing anyone i'm not racist. then again, i don't think anything could convince nakilon.
09:53:18 <esolangs> [[User:Nakilon]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90267&oldid=87946 * Nakilon * (+1) racist IRC channel isn't worth mentioning anymore
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10:41:04 <esolangs> [[Talk:Entropy complete]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90268&oldid=90258 * Xradiation * (+316)
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10:51:15 <esolangs> [[Entropy complete]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90269&oldid=90257 * Xradiation * (+77)
11:03:01 <esolangs> [[Braintuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90270&oldid=90231 * Xradiation * (-6) fixed mistake
11:04:24 <riv> hahaha
11:08:02 <esolangs> [[Braintuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90271&oldid=90270 * Xradiation * (+370) /* Workings */
11:08:55 <esolangs> [[Braintuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90272&oldid=90271 * Xradiation * (+1)
11:26:47 <b_jonas> oerjan: that's for month 2021-12, right? the roman numeral for that month is traditionally XII
11:28:53 <riv> :O
11:29:10 <riv> the strongest passwords contain the number 4
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12:17:37 <esolangs> [[Braintuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90273&oldid=90272 * Xradiation * (+263) fixed interpeter
12:22:46 <oerjan> b_jonas: no, it's not roman numeral related, it's a reference to WHO's ridiculously transparent naming excuse for the latest covid variant
12:25:05 <oerjan> (i'm sure it's got to a meme already in places i don't frequent)
12:25:11 <oerjan> *to be a
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12:42:14 <fizzie> Welp, in the interests of tradition... added 2021 day 1 to the https://zem.fi/tmp/aoc/ charts.
12:42:19 <fizzie> Looks like at least based on day 1, the puzzles are being solved faster than ever... of course that might be purely due to increased popularity rather than any change in the content.
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13:13:26 <esolangs> [[Project Euler/4]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90274 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+1497) Created page with "{{Back|User:ProjectEuler}} '''Project Euler Problem 4''' is a problem related to palindromic numbers. The goal is to find out the largest palindromic number (in base 10) that..."
13:16:46 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * MathigonDec * New user account
13:19:46 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90275&oldid=90264 * MathigonDec * (+267) Answer to Dec 1 2021 is 70
13:20:54 <esolangs> [[User:ProjectEuler]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90276&oldid=90128 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+40) Problem 4 program is available
13:23:05 <riv> I thought the roman numeral joke was fab
13:24:54 <esolangs> [[Talk:Entropy complete]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90277&oldid=90268 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+188)
13:51:37 <b_jonas> olsner: ah
13:54:47 <b_jonas> I remember when we discussed whether the name of that greek letter should be spelled "kszí" or "xí" in Hungarian. The pronunciation is the same; both versions appeared in the few introductory mathematics and astronomy books that list the greek alphabet; I claimed that "xí" would be more logical, but others supported "kszí", I don't quire remember why.
14:16:10 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90278&oldid=90244 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+427) /* logOS */
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15:17:50 <esolangs> [[KonamiCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90279&oldid=89659 * GingerIndustries * (+25) /* Syntax */
15:22:19 <esolangs> [[KonamiCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90280&oldid=90279 * GingerIndustries * (+111) /* Syntax */
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16:44:27 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * CenTdemeern1 * New user account
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16:51:43 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90281&oldid=90275 * CenTdemeern1 * (+311) Introduce myself!
16:51:57 <esolangs> [[H]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90282&oldid=78890 * CenTdemeern1 * (+89) Add my compiler to the page with permission from the discord server
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18:10:26 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90283&oldid=90278 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+15) /* LOLGraphics */
18:12:25 <esolangs> [[LOLGraphics]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90284&oldid=90208 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+24) /* Code structure */
18:14:35 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90285&oldid=90096 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+18) /* L */
18:19:13 <esolangs> [[Hello world program in esoteric languages (nonalphabetic and A-M)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90286&oldid=89895 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+110) /* LOLCODE */
18:23:08 <riv> enod .. done
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18:36:36 <esolangs> [[Hello world program in esoteric languages (nonalphabetic and A-M)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90287&oldid=90286 * ~blu256 * (+152) Added Hello World example in Duh
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22:32:09 <esolangs> [[User talk:Chris Pressey]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90288&oldid=46663 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+438) /* Pull Request */
22:35:27 <esolangs> [[LOLGraphics]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90289&oldid=90284 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+438) /* Code structure */
22:41:53 <esolangs> [[LOLGraphics]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90290&oldid=90289 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+566)
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23:27:21 <int-e> `? password
23:27:24 <HackEso> The password of the month is skipped due to being a common surname among Chinese paramount leaders.
23:56:50 <esolangs> [[NLRNIS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90291&oldid=90228 * Fmbalbuena * (+1)
23:59:09 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90292&oldid=90261 * Zero player rodent * (+33)
2021-12-02
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02:02:18 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90293&oldid=90013 * DigitalDetective47 * (+110) Added link to WIP
03:18:58 <earendel> b_jonas: which modern english word is derived from "paucus"?
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03:54:37 <fizzie> "paucity" at least, I would imagine.
04:05:19 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90294 * DigitalDetective47 * (+2918) Created page with ":''This article is currently incomplete, and will be moved to '''PRG''' upon completion.'' '''PRG''' is an esoteric programming language created by [[User:DigitalDetective47]]..."
04:08:52 <earendel> i thought maybe pause. pau
04:18:29 <fizzie> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/paucus#Latin "Descendants: English: pauce (archaic), paucity, paucal"
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05:27:22 <int-e> lambdabot: eh?
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05:43:45 <int-e> @bot
05:43:46 <lambdabot> :)
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06:39:20 <b_jonas> earendel: "few" might be, but I don't need to claim that any one language has words from derived all four, just that each of the four appears in some language. French and Italian together probably covers all four.
06:40:16 <b_jonas> earendel: apparently also "poor" according to dictionary
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06:42:47 <b_jonas> earendel: the point is, French and Italian has *common* words derived from three of them, unlike English
06:42:54 <earendel> oh i that's not how i read you.
06:46:36 <earendel> there's no obligation for any claim here. i was wondering if there could be a distinction for which word was used. i think latin is a much more thought through and structured language as modern ones. with enlish being very inconsistent in what pre and suffixes it uses.
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06:47:58 <earendel> often french heritage then again more german. but with no regularity at all.
06:52:12 <oerjan> b_jonas: apparently both xi and ksi are used in norwegian, too
06:52:36 <oerjan> although ksi is the usual way it would be spelled according to norwegian rules
06:52:50 <earendel> recently i have written down all german prepositions. (i counted 26) .. and then took some basic verb. (like have, run, give etc.. what apes do most time of day) .. combining that prepositions with that verb .. was fun and very insightful. try it. maybe it works in swedish too!
06:57:41 <earendel> etymology .. wait etym true and logos word .. or true meaning .. iirc is entertaining to me. without being educated in that discipline at all. however when i came here to this place 10 years ago .. everyone was about to study linguistics.
06:59:34 <earendel> while i was proposing to move informatics together with pedagogics and social sciences. of course i was absolutely correct :P
07:01:08 <earendel> but also in maths. you have to use language quite excessively in maths and/or theology :)
07:01:26 <earendel> alighty iksi.
07:04:47 <earendel> but you should change the name back to #esoteric
07:05:44 <oerjan> `? itymology
07:05:50 <HackEso> Itymology is the science of understanding the true meaning of a statement.
07:07:42 <oerjan> i think it was changed to #esolangs because it's easier to argue that our community _owns_ that name, and so register it as a project
07:08:07 <b_jonas> https://xkcd.com/2549/ => oh wow, a declaration on your personal birthday by the BIPM. that's wild.
07:08:09 <oerjan> the old #esoteric name was pretty much just grandfathered
07:10:31 <oerjan> explainxkcd links to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birth_aboard_aircraft_and_ships
07:10:57 <oerjan> tldr: it's true that it's complicated
07:13:22 <b_jonas> (of course there's an older and simpler version of this, in Lázár Ervin, "A Négyszögletű Kerek Erdő", "Vacskamati virágja", where Vacskamati declares that her birthday is Tuesday, so that she can celebrate it every Tuesday.)
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07:56:55 <esolangs> [[Fairytale]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90295&oldid=90201 * Doubi * (+37) Added work in progress note
07:59:09 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90296&oldid=90285 * Doubi * (+16) Added fairytale
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08:07:22 <esolangs> [[LOLGraphics]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90297&oldid=90290 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+85)
08:10:02 <esolangs> [[LOLGraphics]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90298&oldid=90297 * Stupid Games Inc. * (-32)
08:57:58 <esolangs> [[Fairytale]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90299&oldid=90295 * Doubi * (-60) Sorry for wrong WIP node
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10:37:41 <esolangs> [[BF+BF]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90300&oldid=75932 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+2509) Reformatted and extended the page, and added a hyperlink to my implementation of the programming language on GitHub.
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13:23:50 <esolangs> [[Project Euler/7]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90301 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+879) Created page with
13:31:12 <esolangs> [[BF+BF]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90302&oldid=90300 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+17) Escaped the vertical bar character |.
13:33:30 <esolangs> [[BF+BF]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90303&oldid=90302 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+0) Modified the specification to disambiguate the circumflex ^, assigning its role in moving the data pointer to the visually similar letter A, while retaining its function as the XOR operator.
13:41:23 <esolangs> [[BF+BF]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90304&oldid=90303 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+414) Added two alternative solutions to the cat program as examples.
13:42:01 <esolangs> [[BF+BF]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90305&oldid=90304 * Kaveh Yousefi * (-1) Removed a superfluous comma.
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14:59:12 <esolangs> [[Vague/OliveIsAWord]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90306 * OliveIsAWord * (+2025) created the reference implementation
15:07:50 <Corbin> Ugh, another joke page that is (I assume intentionally) not marked as a joke page.
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15:20:33 <oren> When is magnus facing nepo again? no game today?
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16:11:25 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90307&oldid=90294 * DigitalDetective47 * (+363)
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18:22:53 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * KSPAtlas * New user account
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20:37:06 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Rootflier102 * New user account
20:39:02 <fizzie> Hmm. Anyone happen to remember if Burlesque has a single-command way of making a standard input that's a list of lines of integers a block of ints? `lnri` works fine, but is two commands. There are some coercing operations that don't need the explicit conversion, but not for everything. And I can never keep track of all that sp / sh stuff.
20:40:06 <fizzie> Oh, right: `ps` works for that.
20:43:37 <b_jonas> isn't the output always a single integer?
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20:48:35 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90308&oldid=90281 * Rootflier102 * (+241) /* Introductions */
20:49:57 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90309&oldid=90308 * Rootflier102 * (+204) /* Introductions */
20:50:29 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90310&oldid=90309 * Rootflier102 * (-161) /* Introductions */
20:51:11 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90311&oldid=90310 * Rootflier102 * (-72) /* Introductions */
20:51:47 <esolangs> [[User talk:Rootflier102]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90312 * Rootflier102 * (+30) Created page with "talk here. also PLEASE be nice"
20:56:56 <fizzie> The output of what?
21:08:17 <esolangs> [[Finif]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90313 * Rootflier102 * (+1694) Created page with "'''Finif''' is a joke language created by [[User:Rootflier102]] that is a simple esoteric language with some complex elements. It's not really an esoteric language, as Finif i..."
21:08:27 <esolangs> [[Finif]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90314&oldid=90313 * Rootflier102 * (+1)
21:08:57 <esolangs> [[Finif]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90315&oldid=90314 * Rootflier102 * (-43)
21:09:09 <esolangs> [[Finif]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90316&oldid=90315 * Rootflier102 * (-6)
21:10:03 <esolangs> [[Finif]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90317&oldid=90316 * Rootflier102 * (+12)
21:31:04 <esolangs> [[BF+BF]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90318&oldid=90305 * Kaveh Yousefi * (-1) Removed a superfluous comma.
21:42:20 <esolangs> [[ShiftbB]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90319 * KSP Atlas * (+2101) Creation
21:46:16 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90320&oldid=90296 * KSP Atlas * (+14)
22:26:44 <shachaf> `` ps o %p
22:26:46 <HackEso> ​ PID
22:45:44 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90321&oldid=90307 * DigitalDetective47 * (+525)
22:46:28 <int-e> `` (cd /proc; echo */)
22:46:29 <HackEso> 1/ 10/ 11/ 12/ 13/ 14/ 15/ 16/ 18/ 2/ 3/ 4/ 44/ 45/ 48/ 49/ 5/ 50/ 51/ 52/ 6/ 7/ 8/ 9/ bus/ driver/ fs/ irq/ net/ self/ sys/ sysvipc/ thread-self/ tty/
22:48:05 <fizzie> `` ps -o %p # and why exactly is there a difference between o and -o anyway?
22:48:06 <HackEso> ​ PID \ 48 \ 49 \ 50 \ 51 \ 52 \ 53
22:52:45 <int-e> `` PS_FORMAT=%p ps
22:52:46 <HackEso> ​ PID \ 48 \ 49 \ 50 \ 51 \ 52 \ 53
22:54:56 <b_jonas> fizzie: I think ps's crazy interface is from unifying two different legacy brands of ps, one of which takes options without a hyphen, the other with a hyphen
22:55:09 <int-e> `` env | grep ^PS
22:55:09 <b_jonas> fizzie: that's why you have silly commands like ps x -H
22:55:10 <HackEso> No output.
22:55:26 <b_jonas> fizzie: Advent of Code problems
22:55:29 <int-e> `` PS_PERSONALITY=sgi PS_FORMAT=%p ps
22:55:30 <HackEso> ​ PID \ 48 \ 49 \ 50 \ 51 \ 52 \ 53
22:55:38 <int-e> `` PS_PERSONALITY=sunos4 PS_FORMAT=%p ps
22:55:39 <HackEso> ​ PID
22:56:16 <int-e> ...do you like flexibility...
23:02:07 <shachaf> I do not. I would like less flexibility, please.
23:03:42 <fizzie> b_jonas: The output, but not the input. I was looking for something that'd go from "123\n456\n789\n" to {123 456 789}. Which `ps` did.
23:03:54 <fizzie> (Also sometimes it's a string rather than an integer. But pretty rarely.)
23:08:31 <fizzie> In 2020, there was but one string; in 2019, there were two cases where an Intcode program output a string using a 5x6 pixel bitmap font using '#' and ' ' or '.'; in 2018, there were two plain strings, four cases of comma-separated numbers (3 "a,b"s and one "a,b,c") and one "bitmap"; in 2017 there were 5 strings.
23:20:46 <b_jonas> fizzie: oh! I thought you wanted it backwards
23:21:03 <b_jonas> going from a list of numbers to newline-separated %d decimals
23:25:06 <fizzie> That one I know of (it's `un`), but yeah, that'd be unlikely for AoC.
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23:55:04 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90322&oldid=90292 * Zero player rodent * (+416)
23:58:00 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90323&oldid=90322 * Zero player rodent * (+66)
2021-12-03
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00:38:22 <b_jonas> fizzie: maybe blsq could have a built-in that takes the name of the file with your login cookies and it fetches the inputs for the latest AoC problem and splits it
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01:28:49 <esolangs> [[Vague]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90324&oldid=89928 * OliveIsAWord * (+80) added my implementation to the main page
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02:17:22 <esolangs> [[User:Salpynx/cc-church]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90325 * Salpynx * (+23160) asciitable for SKI Church numerals
03:12:03 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90326&oldid=90321 * DigitalDetective47 * (+5821)
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04:14:19 <b_jonas> fungot, out of "autumn" and "automn", which one is the english spelling and which one is the french spelling?
04:14:19 <fungot> b_jonas: what i have said. we do that with the fiscal fantasists, yet the government and to the country,
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07:35:30 <esolangs> [[User talk:Hakerh400/What we could do if we could solve the halting problem]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90327&oldid=90160 * Hakerh400 * (+831)
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08:00:37 <Corbin> fungot, am I allowed to be disappointed at that reply?
08:00:37 <fungot> Corbin: do the government have ensured the rights to vote. i have to work to the new regional centres, and the funding to do
08:01:47 <Corbin> I dunno. I have trouble understanding any of this page.
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08:41:15 <esolangs> [[User talk:Hakerh400/What we could do if we could solve the halting problem]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90328&oldid=90327 * Corbin * (+1074) Try again.
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09:19:13 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/What we could do if we could solve the halting problem]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90329&oldid=74403 * Hakerh400 * (+534) Clarify definitions
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09:24:51 <riv> https://www.insider.com/codex-seraphinianus-luigi-serafini-interview-40th-anniversary-edition-2021-11
09:48:32 <esolangs> [[LOLGraphics]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90330&oldid=90298 * Stupid Games Inc. * (+283) /* Truth-Machine */
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11:02:52 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * WireBot34 * New user account
11:12:55 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90331&oldid=90311 * WireBot34 * (+154) /* Introduction */
11:13:44 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90332&oldid=90331 * WireBot34 * (+89) /* Introductions */
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12:36:09 <esolangs> [[User:WireBot34/monobook.css]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90333 * WireBot34 * (+203) Change in color
12:48:26 <esolangs> [[User:WireBot34/monobook.css]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90334&oldid=90333 * WireBot34 * (+226) Minor color change
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13:57:49 <esolangs> [[CLE]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90335&oldid=89954 * Not applicable * (+36) add category
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15:43:04 <esolangs> [[ShiftbB]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90336&oldid=90319 * KSP Atlas * (-249) Replaced Hello World with optimized version
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16:42:15 <esolangs> [[User:KSP Atlas]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90337 * KSP Atlas * (+66) Created page with "I'm KSP Atlas, the creator of ShiftbB. This page is a placeholder."
16:42:28 <esolangs> [[User talk:KSP Atlas]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90338 * KSP Atlas * (+96) Created page with "hello --~~~~"
16:44:27 <esolangs> [[ShiftbB]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90339&oldid=90336 * KSP Atlas * (+22) added low level category
16:45:09 <esolangs> [[ShiftbB]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90340&oldid=90339 * KSP Atlas * (+1) fixed formatting
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17:58:47 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * DockedChutoy * New user account
18:06:55 <Corbin> I don't know how to search through the Brainfuck variants. Is there a Brainfuck with unlimited cell growth (WLOG growth only to the right of the starting cell) but only 0 and 1 for cell values?
18:18:35 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90341&oldid=90332 * DockedChutoy * (+200)
18:20:55 <fizzie> Boolfuck has an infinite tape of bits, though it's infinite to both directions.
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18:48:54 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90342&oldid=90326 * DigitalDetective47 * (+104)
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18:59:46 <Corbin> fizzie: Thanks. The linked languages from that page are good, too.
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20:22:35 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90343&oldid=90342 * DigitalDetective47 * (-364) /* Arrays */ Removed substituting arrays for values
20:28:02 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90344&oldid=90343 * DigitalDetective47 * (+245)
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22:00:37 <riv> I can hardly fathom a worse measurement system than imperial
22:02:22 <fizzie> Hmm. Surely there must be shorter ways both for getting from stack 'x {'a 'b 'x 'c 'd 'x} to {2 5} than {==}j+]fI, as well as from {2 5} {{'a 'b 'c 'd 'e 'f} {'g 'h 'i 'j 'k 'l}} to {{'c 'f} {'i 'l}} than {si}j+]m[.
22:02:30 <fizzie> Or for the whole thing from 'x {'a 'b 'x 'c 'd 'x} {{'a 'b 'c 'd 'e 'f} {'g 'h 'i 'j 'k 'l}} to {{'c 'f} {'i 'l}} than {==}j+]fI{si}j+]m[, I don't need it to have that specific intermediate step.
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2021-12-04
00:13:30 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90345&oldid=90344 * DigitalDetective47 * (+2953)
00:18:59 <esolangs> [[PRG]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90346 * DigitalDetective47 * (+12654) Created page with ":''This article is currently incomplete, and will be moved to '''PRG''' upon completion.'' '''PRG''' is an esoteric programming language created by [[User:DigitalDetective47]]..."
00:19:18 <esolangs> [[PRG]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90347&oldid=90346 * DigitalDetective47 * (-91) Removed incomplete notice
00:19:52 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47/WIP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90348&oldid=90345 * DigitalDetective47 * (-12545) Replaced content with "[No current project]"
00:20:12 <esolangs> [[User:DigitalDetective47]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90349&oldid=90293 * DigitalDetective47 * (+10) Added PRG
00:21:39 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90350&oldid=90283 * Squidmanescape * (+1) /* (top, height) */
00:24:31 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90351&oldid=90320 * DigitalDetective47 * (+10) /* P */ Added PRG
00:28:17 <esolangs> [[(top, height)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90352&oldid=90241 * Squidmanescape * (+1) /* Truth Machine */
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01:44:08 <b_jonas> is it just me, or does the announcement on IOCCC's website sound like IOCCC is jumping the shark? "Our goal is to build a smoother, more rapid process centered around GitHub. […] We plan to refactor and modernize the IOCCC web site." Did a marketing guy break into their system to post that?
01:46:12 <b_jonas> Also "We also plan to build a new and improved way to submit entries the next IOCCC." Do they mean they are putting up a web form lowering the bar to where automatic spambots will quickly fill their inboxes with nonsense, and they'll really have trouble finding the real entries becuse, you know, they're obfuscated so a valid one can be hard to distinguish from spam? Or the opposite, are they making it
01:46:18 <b_jonas> so hard to submit that real contestants will give up after a few times they fail the captcha?
01:46:23 <b_jonas> It's scary.
01:46:32 <b_jonas> Am I overreacting here?
01:57:20 <b_jonas> `? ioccc
01:57:22 <HackEso> The IOCCC is the Industrial Ordovician COBOL Conference Circuit. Not to be confused with OIC. See also ioccclist.
02:04:13 <esolangs> [[PRG]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90353&oldid=90347 * DigitalDetective47 * (+643) Added examples
02:12:37 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * 0noketa * New user account
02:12:42 <esolangs> [[Hello world program in esoteric languages (N-Z)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90354&oldid=89741 * DigitalDetective47 * (+383) Add PRG
02:14:43 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90355&oldid=90350 * DigitalDetective47 * (+154) /* Implementations */ Add PRG
02:17:15 <esolangs> [[Left-Right March]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90356&oldid=89238 * DigitalDetective47 * (+298) /* Examples */ Moved text dump program generator to the main page.
02:17:49 <esolangs> [[Left-Right March/Gallery]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90357&oldid=89240 * DigitalDetective47 * (-767) Replaced content with "Delete this page."
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03:17:35 <esolangs> [[PRG]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90358&oldid=90353 * DigitalDetective47 * (+1291) /* Examples */ Added integer-string conversion functions
03:18:28 <esolangs> [[PRG]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90359&oldid=90358 * DigitalDetective47 * (+20) /* List of reserved tokens */ Added RET to reserved token list
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03:31:49 <esolangs> [[PRG]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90360&oldid=90359 * DigitalDetective47 * (+216) /* Generic array functions */ Defined for empty array
03:32:53 <esolangs> [[PRG]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90361&oldid=90360 * DigitalDetective47 * (-2) Removed extra newlines in source
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03:40:14 <zzo38> Sometimes what you describe happens, so I don't know. There are ways to make it to work, but I think that they should not use GitHub (except for mirroring, perhaps), and don't use any of the modern things which are no good.
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03:54:24 <esolangs> [[PRG]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90362&oldid=90361 * DigitalDetective47 * (+891) /* Examples */ Add Fibonacci sequence
04:11:41 <esolangs> [[PRG]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90363&oldid=90362 * DigitalDetective47 * (+1358) /* Examples */
04:12:54 <esolangs> [[PRG]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90364&oldid=90363 * DigitalDetective47 * (+8) /* Ackermann function */ Added required second input to ACK
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05:43:20 <Corbin> Regarding recent discussion on Wolfram prizes for universal computation, I just came across this blast from the past: https://cs.nyu.edu/pipermail/fom/2007-October/012143.html
05:43:52 <Corbin> The entire thread is quite interesting, but this is the first message in the thread which is relevant.
06:11:50 <zzo38> `? ZZT
06:11:51 <HackEso> ZZT? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:11:54 <zzo38> `? TRON
06:11:55 <HackEso> TRON? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:11:57 <zzo38> `? Free Hero Mesh
06:11:58 <HackEso> Free Hero Mesh? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:12:31 <zzo38> `? PostScript
06:12:32 <HackEso> PostScript? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
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07:01:09 <esolangs> [[HARSH]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90365&oldid=62290 * ShareMan * (-1) Fixed typo and corrected table
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07:15:41 <esolangs> [[User talk:Hakerh400/What we could do if we could solve the halting problem]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90366&oldid=90328 * Hakerh400 * (+282)
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08:16:57 <zzo38> `? pokemon
08:16:59 <HackEso> A pokemon is a monster that you keep in your pocket. Taneb invented them.
08:17:59 <zzo38> `?
08:18:01 <HackEso> ​? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
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08:34:19 <riv> "proving that a program doesn't halt is even harder than proving that it does halt"
08:34:21 <riv> wow..
08:34:27 <riv> how is that?
08:38:28 <riv> i suppose you can just run it to prove it halts
08:38:53 <riv> but to prove it does not halt, you have to come up with a proof
08:39:22 <riv> so it's semidecidable vs undecidable
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09:45:33 <oerjan> <Corbin> fungot, am I allowed to be disappointed at that reply? <-- i think some people simply are incapable of understanding ordering of quantifiers, and therefore get horribly confused about math.
09:45:34 <fungot> oerjan: as of this year, extra care and remember riders may ride fnord over the two years, now totalling about 100 more in the house to do the same also applies to the fe system
09:51:49 <oerjan> hm looking at following replies, i'm not sure that's the actual sticking point here
09:53:19 <oerjan> another possibility in reverse is when the _intended_ order is so "obvious" that one doesn't notice an ambiguity in the statement.
09:58:57 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Oerjan * deleted "[[Left-Right March/Gallery]]": Author request: content was: "Delete this page.", and the only contributor was "[[Special:Contributions/DigitalDetective47|DigitalDetective47]]" ([[User talk:DigitalDetective47|talk]])
10:02:59 <b_jonas> I don't understand. which reply is that about?
10:03:03 <b_jonas> is it something on the wiki?
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10:14:28 <oerjan> b_jonas: Corbin was having a discussion on the wiki, yes
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13:03:30 <riv> hello!
13:03:43 <Taneb> Hi, riv
13:04:16 <riv> :)
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13:13:08 <Taneb> How's a riv
13:14:06 <riv> pretty good!
13:14:14 <Taneb> :)
13:14:15 <riv> im doing aoc in rust, not very eso but learning
13:14:17 <riv> how are you?
13:14:33 <Taneb> A bit sleepy. Spending the weekend visiting friends and I was up very late last night
13:14:59 <Taneb> I'm doing AoC in Haskell which is only marginally more eso than Rust, I think
13:15:07 <Taneb> Although I also did day 1 in J
13:15:14 <riv> ahh very nice!
13:16:03 <Taneb> I'm not proficient in J at all though so it was a bit of a struggle :(
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13:47:30 <fizzie> I'm doing them in Burlesque, and I'm not proficient in it either.
13:51:18 <fizzie> I've also been doing 2020 in Burlesque for practice. Here's what I've got so far, if you either (a) don't mind spoilers in general, or (b) don't mind spoilers in an unreadable language: https://zem.fi/tmp/aocblsq.txt
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14:56:46 <Taneb> fizzie: very nice
15:23:31 <int-e> > flip (zipWith (!!)) [0..] . reverse . words $ "lets ship that tree"
15:23:32 <lambdabot> "this"
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15:39:58 <Corbin> oerjan's patience is admirable. I wish I had their chill.
15:43:52 <int-e> Oh do we have another instance of https://xkcd.com/386/
15:46:39 <int-e> TBF "The confusion arises from your assumption that there exists a unique convention regarding the definition of the Halting problem." *is* offensive.
15:47:06 <Corbin> Sure. Somebody has dreamed that, *if* we could solve Turing's Halting probloem, then many possible changes to society could take place. I don't have a problem with people posting sci-fi about hypercomputation, but the author seemed to believe that hypercomputation is physically possible, and that could mislead other folks who come across the page later.
15:48:11 <int-e> (There are wrinkles, of course, but they exist because they *don't* make a substantial difference. Things like, do you consider Turing machines or maybe partial recursive functions or lambda expressions; do you fix an input or do you make that part of the problem instance...)
15:48:29 <int-e> So. Yeah I could easily fall into that trap. :)
15:48:56 <Corbin> (Right, the Turing-complete languages and systems form a single massive structure without any preferred entrance; there's no "simplest" Turing-complete formalism.)
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16:10:39 <shachaf> OK, so the idea behind LL and LR parsers is actually pretty simple, and I just never looked into it properly.
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18:45:11 <esolangs> [[PRG]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90367&oldid=90364 * DigitalDetective47 * (+1234) /* Examples */ Add factorial
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19:14:45 <esolangs> [[Rockstar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90368&oldid=73045 * Dylanbeattie * (-83)
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19:52:21 <myname> "bonfire peaks - a stephen's sausage roll lite" - i am intrigued
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20:26:45 <oerjan> <Corbin> oerjan's patience is admirable. I wish I had their chill. <-- i've spent about two decades learning that losing patience only attracts more of what annoys me. and yet i still regularly do it, when i don't remember to let go.
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20:35:44 <Taneb> myname: I saw Stephen's Sausage Roll, it looks interesting but not something I'd be good at at all
20:38:58 <shachaf> Taneb: Did you see A Monster's Expedition?
20:39:07 <Taneb> I did not!
20:39:16 <Taneb> Can you remind me on Monday afternoon please
20:44:49 <shachaf> Maybe someone else can? I have no memory.
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21:14:29 <shachaf> Would you say the Shunting Yard algorithm is top-down or bottom-up?
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21:43:41 <esolangs> [[SICKBAY]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90369&oldid=34873 * Chris Pressey * (+141) /* External resources */ Add sickbay.hs
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23:10:57 <esolangs> [[User:Fmbalbuena/lyxal]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90370 * Fmbalbuena * (+436) lyxal lyxal lyxal
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23:56:00 <int-e> fungot: do you dream of electric sheep
23:56:02 <fungot> int-e: at the time, madam speaker, with the house,
23:56:16 <int-e> fungot: I'll take that as a yes.
23:56:17 <fungot> int-e: a bill.
2021-12-05
00:08:29 <fizzie> fungot: You're not an android though.
00:08:30 <fungot> fizzie: that for the tax year,
00:08:49 <fizzie> fungot: The tax year doesn't end until April.
00:08:50 <fungot> fizzie: for the hon. member, officer or employee of such a body, of information disclosed in reliance of the scottish economy, and deliver in the public and the government? sir brian fnord, chairman of the ultimate security of our nation,
00:09:19 <fizzie> The UK tax year of April 6 of year N to April 5 of year N+1 is very "convenient".
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01:01:50 <b_jonas> fungot, shachaf says he has no memory, please help him
01:01:51 <fungot> b_jonas: what, then, is the plan. our foreign and home secretaries, the other being my first night of the year,
01:20:33 <int-e> fungot: do octopodes play bingo on an 8x8 square?
01:20:35 <fungot> int-e: that for the tax year, is amended.
01:23:37 <fizzie> Hung up on taxation, I see.
01:24:01 <fizzie> If octopodes play bingo on an 8x8 square, should be play it on a 4x4 one rather than a 5x5 one?
01:27:16 <int-e> But we evolved from creatures with tails
01:27:32 <int-e> Suggesting that Bingo is very, very old.
01:35:33 <fizzie> Yeah, I know they played it already in Rivendell.
01:35:38 <fizzie> > Just as Frito finished, Orlon suddenly roused himself and signaled for silence. "Bingo in the Elf Lounge," he said, and the feast ended.
01:35:40 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:23: error: parse error on input ‘,’
01:38:07 <fizzie> Out of curiosity, I tried plotting the runtime of all my Go solutions, but beyond a really vague upwards trend across the days (1 → 25), it's hard to see any sort of patterns: https://zem.fi/tmp/aoc/gobench.time.html
01:38:15 <fizzie> They also span some 5 orders of magnitude or so.
04:57:46 <esolangs> [[Rockstar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90371&oldid=90368 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+271) Added Project Euler Problem 6 code
05:00:10 <esolangs> [[Project Euler/6]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90372&oldid=90147 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+262) /* Rockstar */ Added example
05:29:14 <int-e> why does AoC give me such strong deja vus
05:30:36 <aarchi> From previous AoC years?
05:32:23 <aarchi> I've been doing AoC in Whitespace and it's starting to take increasing amounts of time as I am missing more standard library utilities and have to write them myself in my stdlib
05:47:35 <shachaf> `? @messages-loud
05:47:36 <HackEso> ​@messages-loud @messages-fond / @messages-flood @messages-bond // @messages-lousy @messages-sound / @messages-lost @messages-found // @messages-proud @messages-bold / @messages-good @messages-gold
05:55:15 <int-e> aarchi: hmm what do you use as the intermediate language? or is the "stdlib" a bunch of snippets to copy?
05:56:11 <aarchi> Here's where I've been solving the puzzles: https://github.com/andrewarchi/ws-challenges
05:56:18 <aarchi> And here's the stdlib: https://github.com/andrewarchi/wslib
05:57:01 <aarchi> I'm using “Whitespace Forth”, a thin layer above Whitespace that's less verbose than Whitespace Assembly and resembles Forth more
05:58:15 <aarchi> I have an ad hoc dependency system with imports and exports (written in bash and make!) that it quite a hack, but it gets the job done until my compiler is ready
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06:51:45 <shachaf> Is there a way to hand-write bottom-up parsers that isn't awful? Or is that just how they are?
07:01:18 <earendel> turn the sheet upside down?
07:02:06 <int-e> . o O ( you use a DSL like yacc )
07:04:07 <earendel> manu-script
07:04:26 <earendel> manu=hand :)
07:04:31 <earendel> just btw.
07:05:14 <earendel> you write your parsers with pen and paper?
07:05:25 <int-e> "manu" is a common enough prefix that it shouldn't need any explanation :P
07:06:32 <int-e> earendel: I may have done that at some point.
07:50:23 <riv> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-pg3xNfTMA
07:50:57 <riv> wtf
08:30:07 <myname> good old jan misali
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10:12:11 <esolangs> [[User talk:Oerjan]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90373&oldid=89787 * Guy Fawkes Rep * (+194)
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11:41:13 <esolangs> [[User talk:Oerjan]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90374&oldid=90373 * Oerjan * (+182) /* Aheui */
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14:28:15 <esolangs> [[HARSH]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90375&oldid=90365 * ShareMan * (+1032) Rewrote page
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15:12:09 <esolangs> [[Vaporware]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90376 * Oshaboy * (+222) Initial
15:12:28 <riv> how to solve aoc day5 fast?
15:13:12 <esolangs> [[Vaporware]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90377&oldid=90376 * Oshaboy * (-16)
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15:29:32 <esolangs> [[Fairytale]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90378&oldid=90299 * Doubi * (+56) Better description
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15:35:42 <esolangs> [[Syllad]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90379 * Treeplate * (+529) adding 'Syllad' page
15:38:15 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90380&oldid=90351 * Treeplate * (+13) adding 'Syllad' page to language list
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16:48:54 <esolangs> [[User:Oshaboy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90381&oldid=89906 * Oshaboy * (+92) /* My Esolangs */
16:49:02 <esolangs> [[User:Oshaboy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90382&oldid=90381 * Oshaboy * (+3) /* Interpreters */
16:49:14 <esolangs> [[User:Oshaboy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90383&oldid=90382 * Oshaboy * (-3) /* My Esolangs */
16:50:22 <esolangs> [[JUMP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90384&oldid=65562 * Oshaboy * (+57) Added my Implementation
16:50:38 <esolangs> [[JUMP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90385&oldid=90384 * Oshaboy * (+46) Forgot the link
16:51:02 <esolangs> [[User:Oshaboy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90386&oldid=90383 * Oshaboy * (+3) /* Interpreters */
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17:03:10 <esolangs> [[UM8]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90387&oldid=81512 * Matthilde * (+2002) Added my notes from my writeup
17:04:20 <esolangs> [[UM8]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90388&oldid=90387 * Matthilde * (+0) /* Cat */ Fixed typo
17:11:16 <esolangs> [[UM8]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90389&oldid=90388 * Palaiologos * (+6) fix deadlink
17:13:13 <esolangs> [[UM8]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90390&oldid=90389 * Palaiologos * (+119) more programs
17:35:15 <esolangs> [[TISolang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90391&oldid=90041 * McDude73 * (+83) /* Positives, negatives, and other notes */
17:39:00 <esolangs> [[TISolang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90392&oldid=90391 * McDude73 * (+0) /* TISolang exclusive commands */
17:44:19 <esolangs> [[TISolang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90393&oldid=90392 * McDude73 * (+0) /* TISolang exclusive commands */
18:04:47 <esolangs> [[Syllad]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90394&oldid=90379 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+9) Stub
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20:21:39 <fizzie> Hmm, I guess ln{"[0-9]+"~?ri2cop^Jx/j?-CL}m[{-]pdz?}f[{J++abj)sn{J?+}[[jE!}m^sg{[-nz}fl for part 1 and ln{"[0-9]+"~?ri2cop^Jx/j?-CL}m[{J)ab>]j)sn{J?+}[[jE!}m^sg{[-nz}fl for part 2 isn't _too_ bad, though it still feels bulky.
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21:16:30 <esolangs> [[Labra]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90395 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+4279) Created Labra
21:16:42 <esolangs> [[User:DoggyDogWhirl]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90396&oldid=89938 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+52) Added Labra, Hyla, and Della
21:19:04 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90397&oldid=89927 * PixelatedStarfish * (+221) /* Values */
21:20:14 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90398&oldid=90397 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0)
21:21:01 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90399&oldid=90398 * PixelatedStarfish * (+12) /* Values */
21:21:25 <esolangs> [[Forte]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90400&oldid=50803 * Ais523 * (+2412) /* Computational class */ a simpler proof (a side note wow, I came so close to discovering The Waterfall Model so many times before I finally "officially" discovered it)
21:26:57 <esolangs> [[Forte]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90401&oldid=90400 * Ais523 * (-2412) Undo revision 90400 by [[Special:Contributions/Ais523|Ais523]] ([[User talk:Ais523|talk]]): my proof was flawed because lines in Forte can't move themselves when executed, whereas waterclocks in The Waterfall Model always refill themselves when emptied; there's probably a simple-ish
21:55:15 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * SliceOfArdath * New user account
21:58:31 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90402&oldid=90323 * Zero player rodent * (+32)
21:59:55 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90403&oldid=84867 * Zero player rodent * (+188)
22:00:54 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90404&oldid=90341 * SliceOfArdath * (+342) /* Introductions */
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22:20:16 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90405&oldid=90402 * Zero player rodent * (+707)
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22:33:26 <esolangs> [[Minceraft]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90406 * SliceOfArdath * (+544) Minceraft
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2021-12-06
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01:07:44 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90407&oldid=90380 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+24) Added Arepo and Labra
01:55:55 <esolangs> [[Arepo]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90408&oldid=89597 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+90) Categorize /* Future plans */
03:09:12 <esolangs> [[User talk:Oerjan]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90409&oldid=90374 * Guy Fawkes Rep * (+262)
03:09:55 <esolangs> [[Talk:Entropy complete]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90410&oldid=90277 * Guy Fawkes Rep * (-4) Removed useless URL escape
03:11:12 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90411&oldid=90248 * Guy Fawkes Rep * (+54) Testing hidden text
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04:57:10 <esolangs> [[User talk:ColorfulGalaxy (disambiguation)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90412&oldid=89657 * ColorfulGalaxy (disambiguation) * (+49) Not able to log in for the past few days
04:58:18 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90413&oldid=90411 * ColorfulGalaxy (disambiguation) * (-77) The text appears to be offensive.
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05:40:00 <int-e> fizzie: here's a fun metric: almost 40 minutes for gold to overtake silver...
05:40:19 <int-e> (hard to measure though, and in principle this could happen several times)
05:47:33 <b_jonas> int-e: is this gold vs silver for just task 06, or some aggregate?
05:48:34 <int-e> b_jonas: just for today, doing this retrovertly would require access to the actual database.
05:48:41 <int-e> retroactively
05:49:47 <int-e> At least as far as I know; you can watch https://adventofcode.com/2021/stats live but not recover old states of that page.
05:50:00 <b_jonas> int-e: I mean you could add all the silvers and golds that people have right now
05:50:18 <b_jonas> for the six tasks
05:50:20 <int-e> "watch" meaning "constantly reload" of course
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05:50:42 <int-e> b_jonas: Oh but that's pointless because the old task will always dominate the fresh one.
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05:50:53 <b_jonas> it's early enough in the month
05:51:08 <int-e> there are way more gold stars than silver stars already
05:51:25 <int-e> it's a very safe bet that the total won't flip back
05:51:53 <b_jonas> ok
06:09:12 <int-e> I may have suggested the same thing last year, I wonder whether I did.
06:11:53 <b_jonas> by the way, what should we do with pbflist and bobadventureslist ? I think I can unilaterally delete bobadventureslist because I'm the only one who used to care about it, but pbflist actually has subscribers but nobody caring enoguh to ring it.
06:12:09 <b_jonas> ``` rm -v /hackenv/{wisdom,bin}/bobadventureslist
06:12:12 <int-e> `? slist
06:12:13 <HackEso> rm: cannot remove '/hackenv/wisdom/bobadventureslist': No such file or directory \ removed '/hackenv/bin/bobadventureslist'
06:12:15 <HackEso> Update notification for the webcomic Homestuck.
06:12:17 <b_jonas> wasn't there a third one that I made? I'll ahve to check
06:12:29 <int-e> `hwrl slist
06:12:30 <HackEso> https://hack.esolangs.org/repo/log/tip/wisdom/slist
06:13:26 <int-e> `? herbalist
06:13:28 <HackEso> An herbalist is a list of herbas.
06:13:40 <b_jonas> I created ioccclist but that can stick
06:13:43 <b_jonas> I mean stay
06:13:43 <int-e> `? keenlist
06:13:45 <HackEso> keenlist is notification for when Tom Hall acquires the necessary intellectual property rights to create the videogame series Commander Keen: The Universe is Toast
06:13:49 <b_jonas> `? ioccclist
06:13:51 <HackEso> ioccclist is update notification for when a new year of the International Obfuscated C Code Contest is announced, or the winners for a year is announced, or the source codes of winners are released. http://www.ioccc.org/#news
06:14:01 <b_jonas> oh yeah
06:14:07 <int-e> b_jonas: I'm not finding the one I'm looking for, but we have dysfunctional lists already...
06:14:36 <b_jonas> keenlist is functional as in TornadoGuard, I haven't forgot to ring it when I should yet.
06:14:40 <int-e> `? smlist
06:14:42 <HackEso> Non-update notification for the webcomic Super Mega.
06:14:45 <int-e> that's the one :P
06:15:52 <b_jonas> `? calesyta2016list
06:15:54 <HackEso> calesyta2016list? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:16:15 <b_jonas> ``` wc /bin/calesyta2016list
06:16:17 <HackEso> wc: /bin/calesyta2016list: No such file or directory
06:16:21 <b_jonas> ``` wc /hackenv/bin/calesyta2016list
06:16:22 <HackEso> ​ 2 13 76 /hackenv/bin/calesyta2016list
06:18:04 <b_jonas> got it, bardsworthlist. this is one I can unilaterally remove too I believe
06:18:15 <b_jonas> ``` rm -v /hackenv/{bin,wisdom}/bardsworthlist
06:18:18 <HackEso> removed '/hackenv/bin/bardsworthlist' \ removed '/hackenv/wisdom/bardsworthlist'
06:18:33 <int-e> https://store.steampowered.com/app/879850/Box_The_Game/ has a cute mechanic, but a horrible way of tracking score and unlocking levels
06:18:52 <b_jonas> and ehlist too
06:19:00 <b_jonas> ``` rm -v /hackenv/{bin,wisdom}/ehlist
06:19:03 <HackEso> rm: cannot remove '/hackenv/wisdom/ehlist': No such file or directory \ removed '/hackenv/bin/ehlist'
06:20:08 <b_jonas> I'll keep aglist
06:20:09 <b_jonas> `? aglist
06:20:12 <HackEso> aglist is update notification for the Abstruse Goose webcomic. http://abstrusegoose.com/
06:20:25 <b_jonas> that one actually has subscribers
06:21:00 <b_jonas> and I think I can keep listlist
06:24:37 <int-e> (You start a new game, and that puts you at level 1, and you can then play ; it tracks total moves taken, but there's no undo, only restarts, and restarting a level doesn't reset the move counter. Once you've reached a level that way, you can also play it individually. Solving a level individually does not unlock the next level.)
06:58:49 <b_jonas> `fromroman XV
06:58:51 <HackEso> 15
07:07:45 <b_jonas> `? lie groups
07:07:47 <HackEso> Lie groups are groups that try being too smooth for their own good.
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08:56:42 <b_jonas> stupid rant. we can glue wood well enough that the glued joint is at least as strong as the wood in general. if you take that to the extreme, that should mean that you can get something at least as strong as wood, in any shape and 3-d printable, by omitting most of the wood and using only the glue, though this may turn out to be more expensive than wood. particle board is kind of supposed to be like
08:56:48 <b_jonas> that, and it's even cheap, but it turns out that particle board is *weaker* than wood.
08:58:06 <b_jonas> ordinary metals are similar: people can weld metal so that the weld joints aren't weak points, they're at least as strong as the bulk metal. that means you should be able to make any shape from just welding, with no rods or plates as a basis, though this is probably too expensive. I don't know enough about metal 3-D printing to know if that's similar to this.
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09:00:11 <b_jonas> Stanisław Lem has stories about human bodies working this way, where, when a human suffers a fatal accident, the doctors harvest all the body parts that are still usable and stitch them together from multiple remains to as many living humans as they can.
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09:01:34 <b_jonas> Programming often also works this way, with many programs or libraries consisting of nothing but glue functions calling ever lower level functions, such that you can practically never find the bottom of what actually implements anything. And lambda calculus being TC shows that you can write any program from just functions calling other functions.
09:03:26 <b_jonas> Some food products also work this way, with there being meat products that contain more filler than actual meat, and meat replacement products with no actual meat in it; and the same can happen for dairy or wheat or fruit or any other food that's either expensive or some people don't want to eat the real thing for dietary or religious or moral reasons.
09:04:30 <esolangs> [[Omgrofl]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90414&oldid=84280 * DeeBo * (+2272) Add an Omgrofl FizzBuzz program
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09:13:31 <b_jonas> Oh, and I believe when people fix rubber inner tubes for bicycles, those fixes are at least as strong as the original rubber too, so that counts as one more example.
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12:45:05 <esolangs> [[User talk:ColorfulGalaxy (disambiguation)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90415&oldid=90412 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+537) /* Personal note */ Sign and reply
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13:20:53 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Chillaxe * New user account
13:22:36 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90416&oldid=90404 * Chillaxe * (+60) Added introduction
13:28:02 <esolangs> [[Befunge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90417&oldid=82376 * Chillaxe * (+146) Added Number Guessing Game
13:32:05 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Blackhole927 * New user account
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15:44:52 <esolangs> [[Befunge]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90418&oldid=90417 * Chillaxe * (+5) Fixed number guessing game
15:58:09 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90419&oldid=90416 * Blackhole927 * (+113) /* Introductions */
16:03:55 <esolangs> [[User:AdityaV]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90420&oldid=70526 * AdityaV * (-156) Replaced content with "{{db-u1}}"
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16:09:58 <esolangs> [[User:Blackhole927]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90421 * Blackhole927 * (+93) Created page with "Hi there! I'm Blackhole927! I program in python, and want to make some programming languages!"
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16:50:52 <esolangs> [[User:Matthilde]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90422&oldid=88999 * Matthilde * (+51) /* Esoteric programming languages */
16:52:58 <esolangs> [[User:Matthilde]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90423&oldid=90422 * Matthilde * (+284)
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18:10:11 <esolangs> [[User:Blackhole927]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90424&oldid=90421 * Blackhole927 * (+26)
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18:29:16 <esolangs> [[Befunge]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90425&oldid=90418 * Chillaxe * (+29) Changed Hello World Slightly
18:29:37 <esolangs> [[Befunge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90426&oldid=90425 * Chillaxe * (+1) /* Hello, World! */
18:29:56 <esolangs> [[Befunge]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90427&oldid=90426 * Chillaxe * (+3) s
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19:47:15 <fizzie> Huh, that's a new bug for me. Out of nowhere, exactly half of the lines of the left monitor froze to their current contents. In an interlaced fashion, as in it's either the even or odd ones.
19:47:33 <fizzie> A very trippy effect. It's like a 50% transparent thing from a distance.
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20:11:01 <esolangs> [[User talk:ColorfulGalaxy (disambiguation)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90428&oldid=90415 * Oerjan * (+376) /* Personal note */ Ping ais523
20:11:43 <oerjan> Please don't slip on my sarcasm twh
20:13:26 <river> hth
20:13:29 <river> hpoe that hurts
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20:18:06 <oerjan> `
20:18:08 <HackEso> ​? Permission denied
20:18:12 <oerjan> oops
20:18:15 <oerjan> `? hth
20:18:18 <HackEso> hth ([ʰtʰh̩]) is help received from a hairy toe. It is not at all hambiguitous.
20:20:39 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] revision * Oerjan * Oerjan changed visibility of a revision on page [[Esolang:Sandbox]]: content hidden: Inappropriate comment
20:20:58 <oerjan> just felt like it
20:23:14 <oerjan> also feel like banning em again but that's probably what e's aiming for anyway.
20:25:14 <Corbin> I wonder what the practical purpose of two accounts is. I don't know much about modern Great Firewall problems.
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20:30:09 <oerjan> Corbin: did you just make a third theory. also, are you also them?
20:30:38 <oerjan> i'm pretty firm on the [citation needed] side of that Chinese claim, too
20:32:09 <Corbin> oerjan: No, I'm not them. And I have no idea where they are, either; it's just a guess.
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20:51:31 <shachaf> Taneb: It is Monday afternoon.
20:51:47 <shachaf> Taneb: Did you see A Monster's Expedition?
20:53:08 <river> I forgot to remind about that
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21:09:52 <Taneb> shachaf: I have not!
21:14:28 <esolangs> [[Befunge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90429&oldid=90427 * Tux1 * (-10) all infinite loops are literally infinite loops
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21:50:10 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90430&oldid=90407 * L3viathan * (+12) add Aceto
21:52:21 <esolangs> [[User:L3viathan]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90431 * L3viathan * (+21) Created page with "* [[Aceto]] * [[OIL]]"
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22:02:58 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Nph * New user account
22:05:48 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90432&oldid=90419 * Nph * (+121) nph
22:18:54 <esolangs> [[Binary ///]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90433 * Nph * (+505) Created page with "'''Binary ///''' is a derivative of [[slashes]] that operates directly on bits, and only uses <code>1</code> and <code>0</code>, the equivalents of <code>/</code> and <code>\<..."
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22:33:02 <fizzie> On another note, today was suitable for Burlesque. I got ',;;ri{{Jz?{6.+9}if-.}m[}80E!L[ for part 1 and (since that sort of thing just won't fly for 256) ',;;ri{8rz?-)z?}m[tp)++{RTJ[~jJ6!!x/.+6sa}256E!++ for part 2.
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23:03:52 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90434&oldid=90405 * Zero player rodent * (+46)
23:04:15 <esolangs> [[Binary ///]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90435&oldid=90433 * Nph * (+20)
23:09:16 <shachaf> Taneb: Did you see my neighbor's cute kitty cat?
23:15:48 <oerjan> . o O ( since when does Taneb live in shachaf's neighborhood )
23:17:09 <oerjan> mind you, i haven't paid attention to either of your movements, if you have revealed any
23:25:47 <Taneb> oerjan: as far as I am aware I do not live in shachaf's neighbourhood, although seeing as there seem to be cute kitty cats in proximity to both of us it's a possibility
23:38:51 <int-e> cats are well versed in the art of teleportation, aren't they
23:52:03 * oerjan looks up where Cheshire is
23:54:25 <oerjan> i suspect that's closer to Taneb than shachaf, but i do not know.
2021-12-07
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00:20:47 <esolangs> [[Talk:Human's mind have sex with someone]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90436 * PixelatedStarfish * (+31) Created page with "What's the story with the name?"
00:21:36 <esolangs> [[Talk:Human's mind have sex with someone]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90437&oldid=90436 * PixelatedStarfish * (+28)
00:25:30 <esolangs> [[Binary ///]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90438&oldid=90435 * Nph * (+24)
00:26:10 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90439&oldid=90430 * Nph * (+17)
00:28:49 <esolangs> [[Talk:Human's mind have sex with someone]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90440&oldid=90437 * Oerjan * (+224) See: stupid
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01:21:41 <fizzie> Oh, that's silly, for part 2 I can just ',;;ribc8rz{CN}Z]{RTJ[~jJ6!!x/.+6sa}256E!++ instead of mucking around with that {8rz?-)z?}m[tp)++ nonsense for the preprocessing.
01:21:44 <shachaf> oerjan: Taneb does not live in my neighborhood as far as I know, so it seems pretty unlikely.
01:21:54 <shachaf> But the kitty cat is really very cute, so it was worth checking.
01:34:06 <oerjan> okay
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01:50:24 <esolangs> [[Smileyface]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90441&oldid=87719 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+144) Corrected the example program 99 bottles of beer, added a hyperlink to my implementation on GitHub, and changed the category from Unimplemented to Implemented.
01:54:11 <esolangs> [[Smileyface]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90442&oldid=90441 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+54) Added missing argument separators (:>) to the Flow control table, amended some orthographic mistakes, and improved the formatting of code tokens.
01:57:53 <esolangs> [[Smileyface]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90443&oldid=90442 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+112) Amended some orthographic mistakes and improved the formatting.
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02:08:49 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Exeon * New user account
02:32:05 <earendel> could you not disable creation of new accounts altogether? or review new acc requests manually? i believe them aren't good at inventing/impersonating personalities.
02:42:38 <earendel> .. at some point i stopped added ppl to ignore list. i even created a whitelist plugin for hexchat. on freenode it started like 1-2 years ago. and i remember the troll accounts were apparently created years ago. i thought they either hacked some services, or .. some staff personal were onboard/complicit. .. then we moved to libera. but what did andrew lee mean with truth will come out? .. yeah, and freenode chans got registered by whoever was
02:42:38 <earendel> first to do so. changing owners.
02:44:50 <earendel> and they got a lot of sand in the vagina. [pardon me]
02:45:24 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90444&oldid=90432 * Exeon * (+72) /* Introductions */
02:45:32 <esolangs> [[Minil]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90445 * Exeon * (+13447) Made page
03:38:58 <b_jonas> fizzie: your monitor broke too? good luck with that.
04:15:02 <esolangs> [[Project Euler/6]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90446&oldid=90372 * ColorfulGalaxy * (-42) Changed variable names
04:15:30 <esolangs> [[Rockstar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90447&oldid=90371 * ColorfulGalaxy * (-20)
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04:30:40 <esolangs> [[Project Euler/2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90448&oldid=90142 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+400) /* Rockstar */
04:33:12 <esolangs> [[Rockstar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90449&oldid=90447 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+400) Added Project Euler Problem 2 code
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05:05:09 <esolangs> [[Rockstar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90450&oldid=90449 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+144) Added Truth machine) (I am not a Rockstar Developer.
05:08:01 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90451&oldid=90355 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+127) /* Rockstar */
06:54:46 <int-e> Hmm, a power outage, haven't seen that in a while...
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08:52:21 <int-e> Pfft, I totally missed that the December Ponder This! challenge used a sum (which makes no sense because that would make the problem trivial) instead of a product in its scoring function.
08:52:41 <int-e> I just used a product and the example looked okay :P
08:58:36 <esolangs> [[Deadfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90452&oldid=90064 * Oshaboy * (+3535) Added C-Intercal Implementation
09:00:42 <esolangs> [[EsoInterpreters]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90453&oldid=89908 * Oshaboy * (+19)
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13:51:24 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * 0x286 * New user account
13:53:33 <river> hello :)
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14:34:01 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90454&oldid=90444 * 0x286 * (+30) /* Introductions */
14:35:41 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90455&oldid=90454 * 0x286 * (+89) /* Introductions */
14:36:11 <esolangs> [[Tundra]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90456 * 0x286 * (+1014) Created page with "== What is tundra? == tundra is an esoteric, two-dimensional programming language based on BrainFck and DeadFish. == Why "tundra"? == tundra came as a programming language id..."
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14:54:41 <esolangs> [[Tundra]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90457&oldid=90456 * 0x286 * (+74)
14:55:17 <esolangs> [[Tundra]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90458&oldid=90457 * 0x286 * (+2)
14:55:59 <esolangs> [[Tundra]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90459&oldid=90458 * 0x286 * (+10)
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15:35:21 <esolangs> [[Minil]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90460&oldid=90445 * Exeon * (+425) added more instructions
15:37:12 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90461&oldid=90439 * Exeon * (+12) added minil language to list
15:52:32 <esolangs> [[Minil]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90462&oldid=90460 * Exeon * (+646) /* Programs in Minil */ added truth machine
16:33:02 <esolangs> [[Minil]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90463&oldid=90462 * Exeon * (+100) /* Language Characters */
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16:38:39 <CenTdemeern1> Hey yo hello
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17:55:59 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Nld * New user account
18:03:19 <river> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FGAUcLIXMAsdBld?format=jpg&name=large
18:04:56 <b_jonas> WTF are you serious?
18:05:52 <b_jonas> "Since version 2.26 sfdisk supports MBR (DOS), GPT, SUN and SGI disk labels, but no longer provides any functionality for CHS (Sector) addressing. CHS has never been important for Linux, and this addressing concept does not make any sense for new devices."
18:06:29 <b_jonas> of course, but I'm not always running linux and I want to run an emulation of an old computer with an old disk image and just want to read this effing partition table
18:06:32 <b_jonas> come on
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18:33:26 <fizzie> I think that's the same fungal computing paper that I saw.
18:34:02 <fizzie> Think it must've been an on-channel discussion, because where else would people be talking about the topic?
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18:40:39 <esolangs> [[UCanCode]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90464 * Viba * (+10226) Created page with "'''UCanCode''' is a programming language created in 2021 for Windows Poop Edition 3.0, an operating system by CrapOS (which is still in development at the time of writing). Ou..."
18:43:25 <esolangs> [[UCanCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90465&oldid=90464 * Viba * (+43)
18:44:12 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90466&oldid=90461 * Viba * (+15)
18:45:24 <esolangs> [[UCanCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90467&oldid=90465 * Viba * (+1) /* Hello world */
18:45:32 <esolangs> [[UCanCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90468&oldid=90467 * Viba * (+1) /* Truth machine */
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19:05:21 <esolangs> [[UCanCode]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90469&oldid=90468 * Viba * (+0) fix some minor things
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19:23:39 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90470&oldid=90455 * Nld * (+220)
19:24:14 <esolangs> [[DG]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90471 * Nld * (+2590) Created page with "DG (named after a great computer-science teacher) is a language designed with principles known from lisp. All programms are written in normal text-files. == Basic syntax == D..."
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19:30:06 <esolangs> [[Your]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90472&oldid=72937 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+200) Improved formatting, added a hyperlink to my implementation on GitHub, and changed the Unimplemented category to Implemented.
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19:37:38 <CenTdemeern1> Alright, so for anyone who hasn't heard yet
19:37:38 <CenTdemeern1> Which is probably most of you
19:37:39 <CenTdemeern1> I'm working on a "Black box" esolang
19:37:39 <CenTdemeern1> I'm literally calling it Blackbox
19:37:45 <CenTdemeern1> And I think it's almost done
19:37:57 <river> What are its internal workings?
19:38:13 <CenTdemeern1> That's a mystery!
19:38:20 <river> lol
19:38:23 <CenTdemeern1> The idea is that it'll be a mystery language
19:38:32 <CenTdemeern1> I'll only provide a part of the documentation
19:38:45 <CenTdemeern1> and you all (as the esolang community) will have to figure out the rest
19:38:54 <CenTdemeern1> I'll also be providing hints of course if needed
19:39:21 <river> fun ;P
19:39:25 <CenTdemeern1> The only problem is is that this community is so... separated
19:39:42 <CenTdemeern1> I don't know where to drop the final executable program to start the challenge
19:40:48 <CenTdemeern1> I don't know if there is one place I can put it where everyone can access it
19:40:55 <CenTdemeern1> Actually now that I think about it
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19:41:00 <CenTdemeern1> maybe I could drop it on the wiki
19:41:10 <CenTdemeern1> and then have everyone get it from there
19:41:32 <CenTdemeern1> everyone from all the discord servers and all the IRC channels and stuff
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19:42:34 <esolangs> [[User:Blackhole927]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90473&oldid=90424 * Blackhole927 * (+212)
19:42:46 <esolangs> [[User:Blackhole927]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90474&oldid=90473 * Blackhole927 * (+1)
19:43:03 <esolangs> [[User:Blackhole927]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90475&oldid=90474 * Blackhole927 * (-1)
19:44:08 <CenTdemeern1> I think I should open the esolangs wiki page first
19:45:33 <b_jonas> CenTdemeern1: we already have https://esolangs.org/wiki/Burn , and maybe one of the tasks in the ICFP contest 2004
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19:46:35 <CenTdemeern1> oh wait this is not discord I can't mention someone like that
19:46:46 <CenTdemeern1> b_jonas I know
19:46:48 <CenTdemeern1> there we go
19:47:07 <CenTdemeern1> I am well aware of those
19:47:12 <CenTdemeern1> Burn wasn't created intentionally
19:47:23 <CenTdemeern1> or at least
19:47:28 <CenTdemeern1> not intentionally as a black box
19:49:57 <esolangs> [[User:CenTdemeern1]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90476 * CenTdemeern1 * (+162) Add my page
19:50:30 <CenTdemeern1> Bruh
19:52:47 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90477 * Blackhole927 * (+282) Created page with "Nutrition Facts is a joke language formatted off of a nutrition facts label Made Blackhole927 This language is a WIP. Done: Nutrition Facts Program Essentials (Lines to..."
19:53:20 <esolangs> [[Blackbox]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90478 * CenTdemeern1 * (+272) Claim the page and add part of the explanation
19:53:29 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90479&oldid=90477 * Blackhole927 * (+2)
19:54:08 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90480&oldid=90479 * Blackhole927 * (+6)
19:54:35 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90481&oldid=90480 * Blackhole927 * (+49)
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20:02:33 <CenTdemeern1> I hate getting disconnected every 5 minutes due to this stupid LAN cable
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20:03:54 <int-e> have you tried duct tape
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20:06:49 <CenTdemeern1> lmao
20:07:09 <CenTdemeern1> It's not actually directly caused by th cable itself
20:07:13 <CenTdemeern1> the cable itself is fine
20:07:27 <CenTdemeern1> it's just that it disconnects once every 5 minutes for some reason
20:07:35 <CenTdemeern1> might be the router it's connected to?
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20:12:28 <esolangs> [[Blackbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90482&oldid=90478 * CenTdemeern1 * (+637) Add details and stuff I've explained before
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20:54:03 <esolangs> [[Tundra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90483&oldid=90459 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+36) Category, lowercase title
20:54:07 <esolangs> [[Minil]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90484&oldid=90463 * Exeon * (-4) /* Truth Machine */
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20:54:56 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90485&oldid=90466 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+22) add
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22:07:54 <esolangs> [[Minil]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90486&oldid=90484 * Exeon * (+18) added user who made language (me :P)
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22:22:23 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/block]] block * Ais523 * blocked [[User:Guy Fawkes Rep]] with an expiration time of indefinite (account creation disabled): alternate account of indefinitely blocked [[User:Trump Bot]]
22:23:56 <oerjan> ooh
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22:25:26 <Corbin> ais523: Thanks for your hard work.
22:25:45 <ais523> oerjan: sorry for not checking earlier
22:26:12 <ais523> I hadn't considered whether it might have been an alt of a /different/ banned user, but as soon as I saw the check result I realised that I should have thought of that earlier
22:26:18 <oerjan> aha
22:26:52 <oerjan> although this still doesn't explain why ColorfulGalaxy says he couldn't log in.
22:27:42 <ais523> indeed – note that there's at least one clear piece of evidence in the publicly available logs that ColorfulGalaxy (disambiguation) was /not/ caught in a ban of Guy Fawkes Rep
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22:27:52 <ais523> although this could just be down to dynamic IP addresses
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22:28:52 <oerjan> in other (not very) news, there's this user who's been trying and failing for _ages_ to introduce themself, from the diffs i think they are chinese and are having trouble understanding the instructions, but otherwise seems an honest esolanger.
22:29:13 <ais523> we could make an exception in the filter, I guess – once they have any edits we can remove it
22:29:55 <river> im confused about AOC day 5
22:30:32 <river> i implement a version where i paint lines into a m x m bitmap, and also a version where i count all O(n^2) line intersections
22:30:34 <earendel> good reasoning :)
22:30:37 <river> but the bitmap version is faster
22:30:48 <river> i was told the line intersections would be faster
22:31:44 <earendel> how many are you? *pundits .. you can talk to them sometimes. i tried with some something simple. like asking their favorite color.
22:31:49 <earendel> i got multiple replies!
22:32:42 <oerjan> . o O ( blue. no, red. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA )
22:32:51 <earendel> AAA xD
22:32:59 <earendel> right <3
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22:34:12 <fizzie> I did both the bitmap and the line intersections too, and the bitmap was faster.
22:34:23 <river> thanks!
22:34:28 <river> did you expect that?
22:34:40 <river> did you try the big boy data sets? https://the-tk.com/project/aoc2021-bigboys.html
22:34:58 <river> btw, how did you implement line intersections? my code for that is very bad
22:35:07 <ais523> (I assume Trump Bot is actually banned, not just blocked, right? "the user is blocked and no admin is willing to undo the block" makes for a pretty good ban criterion)
22:35:29 <fizzie> Well, strictly speaking the line intersections were faster than a very naive hashmap of (x, y) coordinates, but slower than a bitmap. And no, I've just tried the official puzzle inputs.
22:35:37 <river> ok
22:35:51 <river> for me bitmap won in all cases (except I did not run the largest data set of all)
22:36:13 <fizzie> Anyway, I'm sure it depends on things like how long the lines are.
22:36:23 <river> yes the line length
22:36:25 <river> so
22:36:46 <river> w the width of the bitmap, n the number of lines, l the average line length
22:38:39 <river> bitmap is O(w^2) space, O(nl) time I think
22:38:53 <river> intersections is ... O(n^2 l')
22:39:05 <river> where l' is the average line overlap
22:39:08 <river> for want of a better term
22:41:02 <fizzie> Well, my initial bitmap solution calculated the answer by iterating over the bitmap, which I guess would mean O(nl+w^2) time. And I guess depending on how you think of it, initializing the bitmap takes O(w^2) time as well. Unless some part of it is never accessed, which is harder to quantify.
22:41:41 <river> I avoided looping over the bitmap
22:41:48 <fizzie> I did so too, eventually.
22:42:07 <fizzie> But _something_ inherently has to clear the memory used for it.
22:42:18 <river> i see
22:42:27 <river> so I think the disadvantage of the intersections method is when you have two long lines overlapping
22:43:26 <fizzie> The disadvantage of the intersections method is also having to consider all pairs of lines.
22:43:41 <river> yeah
22:43:48 <river> but n << w
22:44:37 <fizzie> It's 500 lines and a width of <1000 pixels, that's not really <<.
22:44:42 <river> fair :P
22:44:47 <river> okay thanks for corroborating!
22:44:50 <river> and discussing it with me
22:44:52 <river> ttyl
22:45:28 <fizzie> I think my day 5 Burlesque solutions were pretty scrappy. :/
22:45:40 <fizzie> Interestingly, part 2 is shorter than part 1.
22:46:53 <oerjan> ais523: exception added
22:47:01 <fizzie> Well, maybe it's not that interesting, given that it's basically the same problem except in part 1 you need to filter out diagonal lines. And I couldn't come up with any particular shortcuts from having only horizontal/vertical lines.
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23:58:32 <zzo38> Wikipedia says about EUC-JP, that "In EUC-JIS-2004, the second plane of JIS X 0213 is encoded [as code set 3], which does not collide with the allocated rows in standard JIS X 0212." What are the code ranges of JIS X 0212 and JIS X 0213 and how are they represented in EUC-JP?
2021-12-08
00:03:32 <zzo38> Actually, I found some information in Perl documentation
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00:37:05 <esolangs> [[Tundra]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90487&oldid=90483 * 0x286 * (-1136) Blanked the page
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01:58:23 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Hydrazer * New user account
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03:06:35 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90488&oldid=90470 * Hydrazer * (+84) /* Introductions */
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03:09:04 <esolangs> [[Deadfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90489&oldid=90452 * Hydrazer * (+875) added raku implementation for deadfish
03:28:50 <esolangs> [[Deadfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90490&oldid=90489 * Hydrazer * (+22) /* Raku */
03:29:03 <esolangs> [[Deadfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90491&oldid=90490 * Hydrazer * (-2) /* https://www.raku.org/ Raku */
06:07:19 <int-e> > 2558/(2558+9204)
06:07:20 <lambdabot> 0.21748002040469308
06:08:44 <int-e> `"
06:08:47 <HackEso> 1/1:73) <Warrigal> Making a small shrine to Lawlabee in my basement is something I should get around to at some point. \ 1240) <fizzie> I was watching a pair of otters, and somehow the name "Harry P. Otter" hasn't left my brain since.
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08:14:34 <b_jonas> it's actually "Parry Otter", mentioned specifically in Deathly Hallows chapter 22
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08:51:47 <esolangs> [[Your]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90492&oldid=90472 * CenTdemeern1 * (-26) Removed wrongly applied tag
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10:02:54 <esolangs> [[User talk:Guy Fawkes Rep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90495&oldid=90494 * Guy Fawkes Rep * (+32) Shpx PbybeshyTnynkl!
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11:15:44 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Nxe * New user account
11:20:13 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90497&oldid=90488 * Nxe * (+138) /* Introductions */
11:27:32 <esolangs> [[User:Nxe]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90498 * Nxe * (+697) Created page with "== Bonjour == Hi I'm nxe (she/they). I spend more time coding than sleeping; draw you down conclusions from that. I really enjoy esolangs and just how broad they can be. I've..."
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13:43:57 <esolangs> [[Can]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90499 * Nxe * (+6814) Initial page
13:45:24 <esolangs> [[User:Nxe]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90500&oldid=90498 * Nxe * (+8) Added link to can
14:00:29 <esolangs> [[Can]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90501&oldid=90499 * Nxe * (+38) Added interpreter GitHub repo link
14:00:49 <esolangs> [[Can]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90502&oldid=90501 * Nxe * (+0) i'm an idiot
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15:26:27 <esolangs> [[^^ 16h 35014ng 15 th15]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90503 * Epidemic7 * (+2862) Created page with "{{wrongtitle|title=^^_16h_35014ng_15_th15}} '''^^_16h_35014ng_15_th15''' is an esoteric programming language made by User:Epidemic7. It's commands are based off of what the Ch..."
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15:35:10 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90504&oldid=90485 * Epidemic7 * (+29) /* Non-alphabetic */
16:00:50 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90505&oldid=90399 * PixelatedStarfish * (+92) /* Error Messages */
16:01:45 <sprout_> https://github.com/egel-lang/aoc-2021/blob/main/day8/task2.eg <- AoC day 8 task 2. took me around 3 or 4 hours..
16:02:02 <sprout_> I am proud of it so sharing is caring!
16:02:47 <sprout_> it's still a very slow interpreter...
16:14:28 <esolangs> [[User:Epidemic7]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90506&oldid=86813 * Epidemic7 * (+62)
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16:40:34 <esolangs> [[^^ 16h 35014ng 15 th15]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90507&oldid=90503 * Epidemic7 * (+452)
16:41:40 <esolangs> [[^^ 16h 35014ng 15 th15]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90508&oldid=90507 * Epidemic7 * (-2)
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18:01:25 <b_jonas> fungot: The maid told the butcher boy. The butcher boy told the crowd at the square. Then one of the palace guards overheard. A cat that could play? A mouse that could waltz? Good heavens! The emperor couldn't believe his ears!
18:01:27 <fungot> b_jonas: this is the secretary of fnord members, the hon. member, of the wto, of the house,
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18:24:37 <fizzie> sprout_: It's probably not as slow as my Burlesque solution for day 8 task 2: %PM={jbc{{j!!}j+]m[}Z])><}"v#\\l-jz$~n"XX{**+.2dg<-{}fI}m[s0ln{WD{XX)**97?-}m[S16rzr@{g110.+PMg0=s}fej11.-PM{g0jFi}m[10ug}ms
18:24:40 <fizzie> (Completely unoptimized, just made it work.)
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19:37:31 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90509&oldid=87556 * TJC games * (-135) /* Operations */
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19:49:06 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90511&oldid=90395 * DoggyDogWhirl * (-1) Changing language of interpreter; Haskell is weird
19:49:36 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90512&oldid=90510 * TJC games * (+113) /* Usage */
19:50:11 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90513&oldid=90512 * TJC games * (-8) /* Operations */
19:50:37 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90514&oldid=90513 * TJC games * (+12) /* Operations */
19:51:52 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90515&oldid=90505 * PixelatedStarfish * (+1679) /* Tests */
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19:53:02 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90517&oldid=90516 * PixelatedStarfish * (-19) /* Tests */
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19:58:35 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90519&oldid=90518 * TJC games * (+1) /* Operations */
20:00:38 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90520&oldid=90517 * PixelatedStarfish * (-1568) /* Tests */
20:01:29 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90521&oldid=90520 * PixelatedStarfish * (+69) /* Tests */
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20:11:02 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90523&oldid=90522 * GingerIndustries * (-23)
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20:40:44 <esolangs> [[OIL]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90526&oldid=75283 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-170) /* Examples */ Format
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20:48:52 <sprout_> fizzie: there are only 7! permutations to test so I just construct 7! maps from words to digits and select the correct one. rougly 5040/2 * log 10 = 7500 times some small unknown constant comparisons I think. not a lot of work but slow interpreter
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20:58:28 <sprout_> map is overkill.
20:58:31 <sprout_> ;rl
20:58:34 <sprout_> uh
20:59:09 <sprout_> map is overkill probably for such a small function. lists would have been okay too, and way shorter/easier to construct
21:00:21 <sprout_> I wanted to test the datastructure I created for AoC.
21:02:44 <sprout_> https://github.com/egel-lang/egel/blob/master/include/map.eg <- size balanced binary tree. roughly tries to marry best of most world. O(1) constant access to size, O(log(n)) lookup. Since the size is there I try to balance on that
21:03:15 <sprout_> old idea. no idea whether it works well. seems to work for small trees.
21:06:55 <sprout_> also, don't do to much work balancing of course.
21:07:00 <sprout_> *too
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21:12:00 <fizzie> That's what the Burlesque does too.
21:16:19 <fizzie> 6rzr@ is the 7! permutations of {0 1 2 3 4 5 6}, and the {g110.+PMg0=s}fe finds which permutation, when applied to the first ten words of the line, produces a list that's equal (ignoring order) to the known set of 10 digits (which has been encoded in "v#\\l-jz$~n"). And then the remaining 11.-PM{g0jFi}m[ applies the same permutation to the last 4 words and looks up their indices in the set of
21:16:20 <fizzie> digits.
21:19:07 <int-e> > map S.fromList $ words "abcefg cf acdeg acdfg bcdf abdfg abdefg acf abcdefg abcdfg"
21:19:09 <lambdabot> [fromList "abcefg",fromList "cf",fromList "acdeg",fromList "acdfg",fromList ...
21:19:27 <int-e> . o O ( non-esoteric digits )
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21:26:15 <fizzie> > flip (showIntAtBase 2 intToDigit) "" . (1+) . ord <$> "v#\\l-jz$~n"
21:26:16 <lambdabot> ["1110111","100100","1011101","1101101","101110","1101011","1111011","100101...
21:26:54 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90527&oldid=90524 * TJC games * (+566) /* Usage */
21:27:01 <fizzie> With segments numbered top, top-left, top-right, middle, middle-left, middle-right, bottom, starting from the least significant bit.
21:27:22 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90528&oldid=90527 * TJC games * (+10) /* Usage */
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21:31:44 <fizzie> > (fst <$>) . filter snd . zip [0..] . (('1' ==) <$>) . flip (showIntAtBase 2 intToDigit) "" . (1+) . ord <$> "v#\\l-jz$~n" -- more elaborately
21:31:46 <lambdabot> [[0,1,2,4,5,6],[0,3],[0,2,3,4,6],[0,1,3,4,6],[0,2,3,4],[0,1,3,5,6],[0,1,2,3,...
21:33:00 <fizzie> I think I numbered those the wrong way around.
21:33:10 <int-e> > let digits = words "abcefg cf acdeg acdfg bcdf abdfg abdefg acf abcdefg abcdfg" in M.fromListWith (+) [(c,length cs) | cs <- digits, c <- cs] -- hmm, fingerprinting segments?
21:33:11 <lambdabot> fromList [('a',43),('b',34),('c',38),('d',38),('e',24),('f',44),('g',40)]
21:33:21 <int-e> I didn't try to optimize much at all.
21:33:48 <fizzie> Because in the "v#\\l-jz$~n"XX{**+.2dg<-{}fI}m[ there's a <- to reverse before getting indices.
21:35:06 <fizzie> My "actual" solution doesn't do any guesswork, it just straight deduces in order which segment must be which based on knowing which digits are 1, 4, 7 and 8. But that'd almost certainly take more code.
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21:35:38 <int-e> perhaps the most terrible bit I wrote (`m` is the map from 'a'...'g' to the actual segment, also in 'a'...'g'; digits is as above, as sets (sorted lists would've been enough)): map (S.fromList . map (m M.!)) ys >>= (`elemIndices` digits)
21:36:16 <fizzie> (The top segment is the only one in 7 that's not in 1; the top right is the one in 1 that occurs 8 times, and the bottom right's the other one; and so on.)
21:36:30 <int-e> (>>= is shorter than catMaybes)
21:37:29 <int-e> I did something that starts out like this, https://paste.debian.net/1222646/
21:37:41 <int-e> with 8 cases left to check
21:38:32 <sprout_> the whole solution I gave is pretty terrible code. but ah well. got to test the map
21:38:40 <fizzie> My Go thing goes like https://0x0.st/-FPc.txt with really nothing to check. But it's a lot of lines of code.
21:38:40 <int-e> But that was after I submitted the solution which I obtained by complete brute force.
21:39:04 <sprout_> heh
21:39:04 <int-e> > 5040*200
21:39:06 <lambdabot> 1008000
21:39:34 <sprout_> yah 5040/2*2log(10)*small constant
21:40:03 <sprout_> map is overkill for such a small container. only 10 elements. who cares? use a list
21:40:09 <sprout_> but well
21:40:35 <int-e> sprout_: But my template already imports Data.Map.Strict :)
21:40:48 <sprout_> 5040/2*2log(10)*small constant _comparisons_
21:40:56 <int-e> And I am fairly fluent in using it... I'd struggle more with Data.List.lookup stuff :P
21:41:08 <int-e> (doing this in Haskell)
21:41:40 <sprout_> 29 secs in Egel. should be around 300ms for Haskell
21:41:50 <sprout_> I think I am two orders off
21:41:55 <sprout_> dunno
21:42:09 <int-e> 2 seconds, interpreted
21:42:33 <sprout_> for the 7! approach?
21:42:42 <int-e> yeah. 500ms compiled with -O2
21:42:58 <sprout_> one order off is really not bad for my completely unoptimized brain-dead interpreter
21:43:03 <sprout_> oh right
21:43:10 <sprout_> too early...
21:43:15 <sprout_> depression sinks in
21:43:25 <int-e> I didn't optimize a thing.
21:43:38 <sprout_> I mean egel vs ghc
21:44:38 <sprout_> I want to gain one order by rewriting the runtime once and that'll be it. but not sure I'll ever get around to that
21:45:35 <sprout_> the runtime now is a c++ class hierarchy. compact but bit of a silly approach for a rewriter
21:45:55 <sprout_> ah well. kiss. and all that
21:46:49 <int-e> Did anybody else define the digits before realizing that that wasn't needed for part 1
21:47:39 <sprout_> raises hand?
21:48:01 <int-e> (my part 1 solution has this, unused: digits = words "abcefg cf acdeg acdfg bcdf andfg andefg acf abcdefg abcdfg" ...can you spot the typos)
21:48:13 <sprout_> sure. you know you'll end up modelling the problem anyway for part 2
21:48:18 <sprout_> andefg
21:48:59 <int-e> and I did that same thing twice too
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21:59:18 <fizzie> I counted up the part 1 solution without defining digits (or anything else) in a Python repl, just to see part 2 of the description.
21:59:28 <fizzie> Not that there were any surprises.
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22:00:24 <int-e> yeah part 2 was the obvious task for that input... part 1 was the surprising one ;-)
22:00:49 <int-e> "uh we both know where this is headed but let's keep it simple for now"
22:02:04 <fizzie> And of course it makes part 1 in Burlesque a _lot_ shorter. I've currently got ln{WD11.-)L[2 4r@7+]INL[}ms
22:03:21 <fizzie> 2 4r@7+] being slightly shorter than {2 3 4 7}, and IN is nominally set intersection but in practice would seem to do the right thing if one operand has repeated elements.
22:03:50 <int-e> Heh I wrote [2,4,3,7]
22:04:59 <int-e> (which obscures the consecutive 2..4 part)
22:09:01 <int-e> > let digits = words "abcefg cf acdeg acdfg bcdf abdfg abdefg acf abcdefg abcdfg" in [x | [x] <- group (sort (map length digits))]
22:09:03 <lambdabot> [2,3,4,7]
22:12:41 <fizzie> I've got a similar trick in an earlier Burlesque solution where I use 105fC1+] as a shorter way of writing {1 3 5 7}.
22:13:37 <fizzie> It's a shame Burlesque doesn't have builtins for even/odd, otherwise that'd be 7ro:ZZ where ZZ stands for hypothetical `odd?`.
22:14:16 <int-e> that would suggest... 42fC4+] for [4,2,3,7]?
22:14:38 <fizzie> Hmm, I didn't even think of adding the 4 "manually".
22:14:49 <fizzie> I just looked "oh, there's a 4 in it, I can't use that trick".
22:14:56 <fizzie> Even though the other one had that 1.
22:16:25 <fizzie> Yeah, that works, and saves one character.
22:16:53 <int-e> and adds an accidental cultural reference
22:16:59 <int-e> win-win-win
22:17:12 <fizzie> It also gets rid of a space, which is nice, because spaces look ugly in Burlesque chunks.
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22:32:24 <esolangs> [[QKAS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90529&oldid=70970 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+358) Amended some orthographic mistakes, improved the formatting, and remarked that the GitHub repository files have not been archived.
22:36:22 <esolangs> [[QKAS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90530&oldid=90529 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+1882) Added an implementation of QKAS in Common Lisp.
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22:51:33 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90531&oldid=90511 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+80) Fixed Hello, world! program
22:53:30 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90532&oldid=90531 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+0) Fixed Fibonacci program
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23:33:25 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90533&oldid=90525 * GingerIndustries * (+51) /* Example */
23:34:00 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90534&oldid=90533 * GingerIndustries * (+29)
23:35:12 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90535&oldid=90534 * GingerIndustries * (+103) /* Instruction table */
23:52:15 <int-e> > nub " space sex "
23:52:16 <lambdabot> " spacex"
2021-12-09
00:14:55 <fizzie> Hah. I tried using the same building blocks but put together differently (take a cross product of the lines and permutations, apply it to the entire line, then just arrange for the result to be 0 if the first 10 values don't match the digits), and after all that trouble the end result was... exactly as long as the original.
00:15:24 <fizzie> Except it's even slower, since it doesn't terminate early.
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01:49:15 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90536&oldid=90532 * DoggyDogWhirl * (-1) Renamed function
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03:42:52 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90537&oldid=90536 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+61) Updated implementation info
04:40:16 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * DrKickflip * New user account
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04:57:35 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90538&oldid=90497 * DrKickflip * (+166) /* Introductions */
04:57:55 <esolangs> [[UponThem]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90539 * DrKickflip * (+1454) Among Us Language
05:08:24 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90540&oldid=90537 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+169) Added link to interpreter
05:09:05 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90541&oldid=90540 * DoggyDogWhirl * (-2) Fixed link
05:09:34 <esolangs> [[Labra]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90542&oldid=90541 * DoggyDogWhirl * (-131) Removed outdated information
05:11:31 <esolangs> [[User:DoggyDogWhirl]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90543&oldid=90396 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+107) Added GitHub link
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08:44:04 <esolangs> [[Project Euler/2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90544&oldid=90448 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+2000)
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09:28:30 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Local Kings * New user account
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09:39:43 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90545&oldid=90538 * Local Kings * (+173)
09:44:18 <esolangs> [[User:Local Kings]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90546 * Local Kings * (+55) Created page with "Hello there! I created an esolang called [[LinuxLang]]"
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09:57:25 <esolangs> [[LinuxLang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90547 * Local Kings * (+523) Created page with "'''LinuxLang''' is an esoteric programming language designed and implemented by [[User:Local Kings]]. It was inspired by script kiddies who think that Linux is a programming l..."
09:59:43 <esolangs> [[LinuxLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90548&oldid=90547 * Local Kings * (+94)
10:01:49 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90549&oldid=89737 * Local Kings * (+57)
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10:04:44 <esolangs> [[LinuxLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90550&oldid=90548 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+0) Fixed Capitalization in category link) ("LinuxLang" wasn't in the category page, so I added it.
10:10:04 <esolangs> [[Truthlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90551&oldid=87631 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+0) Fixed capitalization in category link
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10:11:20 <esolangs> [[Cheese]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90552&oldid=87307 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+0) Fixed capitalization in category link
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10:13:31 <esolangs> [[^^ 16h 35014ng 15 th15]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90553&oldid=90508 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+40) Added display title
10:18:37 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90554&oldid=90528 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+357) Added category link
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11:50:15 <b_jonas> silly idea: we should tell youngsters that supercomputers around 1970 had tens of thousands of cores, thus the rumors that your mobile phone is more powerful than any 70s computer is false, since it only has 8 cores or so
11:55:52 <esolangs> [[User talk:Guy Fawkes Rep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90555&oldid=90496 * ProjectEuler * (-246) Unexpected error) (****hidden for security reason****
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12:15:37 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/block]] reblock * Fizzie * changed block settings for [[User:Guy Fawkes Rep]] with an expiration time of indefinite (account creation disabled, cannot edit own talk page): alternate account of indefinitely blocked [[User:Trump Bot]]
12:21:52 <fizzie> (I just toggled the "can't edit own talk page" flag on, because there were a few nonsense rot13 quasi-political comments post-blocking.)
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12:25:22 <fizzie> Not sure how I feel about that attempt at making the UI look confusing with an "Unexpected error) (****hidden for security reason****" edit message.
12:27:58 <fizzie> (And I've entirely lost track of the plot re ColorfulGalaxy / ... (disambiguation) / ProjectEuler.)
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12:32:57 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] revision * Fizzie * Fizzie changed visibility of 4 revisions on page [[User talk:Guy Fawkes Rep]]: content hidden, edit summary hidden and username hidden: hiding spam + a revert w/ a summary that attempts to spoof the wiki UI
12:33:56 <fizzie> Aw, that didn't quite work out right. :/
12:35:30 <esolangs> [[User talk:Guy Fawkes Rep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90556&oldid=90555 * Fizzie * (-490) Reverting to the 06:34, 20 November 2021 revision.
12:35:57 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] revision * Fizzie * Fizzie changed visibility of a revision on page [[User talk:Guy Fawkes Rep]]: content hidden, edit summary hidden and username hidden: edit summary attempts to spoof wiki UI text
12:36:48 <fizzie> Close enough.
12:39:02 <esolangs> [[Prelude]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90557&oldid=78991 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+55) Made a correction according to a test on Try It Online
12:41:05 <esolangs> [[Talk:Prelude]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90558&oldid=68337 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+175) Please read the talk page
12:46:40 <esolangs> [[User talk:Fizzie]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90559&oldid=81464 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+301) What is "spoof the wiki UI"?
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12:56:14 <esolangs> [[User talk:Fizzie]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90560&oldid=90559 * Fizzie * (+945) /* Spoof the Wiki UI */ Reply.
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13:14:26 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[File:AlphabetCrossword.png]]": unused, uploaded by banned user
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13:36:11 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90561&oldid=90535 * GingerIndustries * (+289)
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13:39:33 <esolangs> [[Hoverfly]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90562&oldid=90256 * Kemuri * (+153) /* Hoverfly */
13:39:45 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90563&oldid=90481 * Blackhole927 * (+296)
13:40:37 <esolangs> [[Hoverfly]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90564&oldid=90562 * Kemuri * (-19) /* interpretor */
13:41:42 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90565&oldid=90563 * Blackhole927 * (+78)
13:41:59 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90566&oldid=90565 * Blackhole927 * (+4)
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15:04:04 <esolangs> [[Interfrac]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90567&oldid=72994 * Ais523 * (+259) known computational class (although one that doesn't have a category yet)
15:07:21 <Corbin> ais523: I'll stub the page on NP-completeness. Maybe not right now, but sometime today.
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15:28:23 <sprout> https://github.com/egel-lang/aoc-2021/blob/main/day9/task2.eg <- day 9. not as nice as some haskell, also, needed to implement impure maps
15:34:06 <esolangs> [[Flow of Holes]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90568&oldid=67195 * Ais523 * (+1) /* Data storage */ terminology fix; "to" is directional in this article, but the sentence didn't mean to imply a direction
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16:33:31 <esolangs> [[Nutrition facts]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90569&oldid=90566 * Blackhole927 * (-4)
17:13:32 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90570&oldid=90561 * GingerIndustries * (+930)
17:16:05 <int-e> import qualified GHC.ST as ST (ST(ST)) <-- gotta love the redundancy
17:20:38 <b_jonas> wait, ST(ST) ? can't you write that only for an enum?
17:20:55 <b_jonas> an enum with an exported constructor that is, the innermost ST would be the constructor name
17:21:19 <b_jonas> um, a data. it would be a data in Haskell, not an enum
17:22:27 <int-e> it's a newtype (a datatype whose constructor has no representation, but abstracts from the embedded type for type checking and the like) newtype ST s a = ST (STRep s a)
17:25:40 <esolangs> [[Vague]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90571&oldid=90324 * MattiDragon * (+117) Add JVague to list of implementations
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18:00:12 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Perbehaps * New user account
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18:30:09 <river> new biblaridion drops in half an hour
18:38:25 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90572&oldid=90570 * GingerIndustries * (+132)
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19:11:29 <int-e> fungot: how do you get paid for making puns
19:11:30 <fungot> int-e: we have to be as one on that, and that suppliers, particularly small and the benefits to the people and the government of the time.
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19:38:27 <zzo38> What is the proper way to mirror several files from Wayback Archive with wget? Sometimes the numbers are changed, so might consider it a different file even though it shouldn't be a different file, and also if the download is interrupted can it be made to not download files that you already have and to instead read the local copy for the purpose of recursive retrieval?
19:47:11 <int-e> deja vu
19:47:48 <int-e> so let's just mention my best bet from last time https://github.com/hartator/wayback-machine-downloader
19:48:13 <zzo38> OK, I will look, thanks
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19:55:37 <zzo38> Although in the case I have, also some (but not all) of the pictures are missing from the web pages that I am trying to download. (I think they contain important information too, such as instruction encodings)
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20:24:50 <fizzie> Today's "2D" thing has been kind of hostile towards Burlesque. I've only managed part 1 so far, and it looks like an absolute ass:
20:24:52 <fizzie> ln{XX)**}m[S1J-]L[jL[j_+?dS0p^rzjrzcp{J{?+}j+]3952 3dg?d2cojm[{Jg0j?-.+<]0>=}f[{g1jd!}m[<]jg1jd!J47.-jx/.<.*}ms
20:25:12 <fizzie> It'll probably trim down a _little_, but I don't think it's going to be pretty at any point.
20:27:57 <fizzie> Although as a highlight 3952 3dg?d2co encodes the von Neumann neighbourhood via ternary digits (3952 -> {1 2 1 0 2 1 0 1} -> {0 1 0 -1 1 0 -1 0} -> {{0 1} {0 -1} {1 0} {-1 0}}), that was shorter than the other alternatives I had like filtering the cross product of {-1 0 1} and itself to those with length 1 with 2rzJcp?d{)ab++1==}f[ and whatnot.
20:29:08 <fizzie> ...
20:29:27 <fizzie> Except now that I looked at it, 2rzJcp?d2en gets there even shorter.
20:29:52 <fizzie> (That's just taking every second element of the cross product, they're in the right order for that.)
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20:41:38 <fizzie> (The bit that filters the neighbours to those that are in bounds also takes a lot of characters, pretty sure it'll be shorter if I just pad the array.)
20:42:55 <int-e> oh the wonders of parity
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21:03:16 <river> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyrse6ygMgQ
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21:16:44 <fizzie> Hmm, well. Switching to padding did save 3 characters, but I was hoping for more. lnJL[rojJ-]L[roj{'X+]'X[+XX)**}m[J-]?i+]J[~?i[+s0cp{J{?+}j+]2rz?dJcp2enjm[{g0jd!}m[<]jg0jd!J47.-jx/.<.*}ms currently. Maybe I just need a more efficient way to pad.
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21:20:58 <river> The code looks really cool fizzie
21:24:16 <int-e> fungot: did your computer ever get locked up for running Windows?
21:24:17 <fungot> int-e: we, of course. so this means anyone under the age of one but after 28 days, but extending that to the crown under clause 7 of the bill,
21:30:56 <esolangs> [[List of complexity classes]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90573&oldid=87981 * Corbin * (+1784) Stub classes NP, PSPACE, and EXP.
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21:54:08 <zzo38> OK, I managed to install the wayback-machine-downloader now. Does it support starting downloading from a subdirectory and only things inside of that directory and its subdirectories, instea of an entire domain?
21:55:35 <zzo38> O, OK, apparently there is --only but that doesn't seem very good; it isn't a part of the URL and doesn't have stripping directory components like wget has?
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21:58:52 <zzo38> O, I will just try to download all of them anyways, I suppose; I figured out that only one directory isn't quite right anyways
22:01:10 <zzo38> It seems to be working now; thank you for linking to that file so that now I can use that.
22:02:38 <esolangs> [[NP-complete]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90574 * Corbin * (+259) Stub a redlink. Not sure what to put here.
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22:28:06 <zzo38> How to find archives of FTP files (from University of Tokyo)?
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22:43:37 <fizzie> IDGI. I feel like {...}<m should do exactly the same thing as J{...}m[z[{1!!}<m-] at least as long as ... is well-behaved, but it doesn't seem to.
22:43:39 <fizzie> The former's a "minimumBy" with ... as the key-extracting function, the latter explicitly makes a copy, maps ... over it, zips the results, runs "minimumBy" with a block that just pulls the result of the mapping, and then takes the head of the pair it found. But the latter works while the former returns a result that doesn't seem to be sorted by anything.
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22:54:15 <fizzie> Well, it's very silly, but at least it works for part 2: lnJL[rojJ-]L[roj{'X+]'X[+XX)**}m[J-]?i+]J[~?i[+s0cp{Jg0jd!57.<{0j{jvvJJ{?+}j+]2rz?dJcp2enjm[j+]{Jg0jd!CL}m[<]1!!}{!=}w!vv}if}m[sg)L[<>3.+pd
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23:04:58 <fizzie> Blah. The direct <m works in a small-scale test, it just doesn't work in the actual context for some reason. Weird.
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23:21:23 <fizzie> Ugh-blah. It's because the special map isn't usable in SortBy. {xxx}s0{yyy}{g0jd!}<m gives a different result than {yyy}{{xxx}jd!}<m
23:22:17 <fizzie> But {yyy}{jd!}g0+]<m does work.
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2021-12-10
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00:18:10 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Oerjan * deleted "[[Category:Joke Languages]]": Category redirections do not really work.
01:19:01 <esolangs> [[UponThem]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90575&oldid=90539 * DrKickflip * (+65)
01:29:08 <esolangs> [[(top, height)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90576&oldid=90352 * Squidmanescape * (+482) /* Code Examples */
01:31:08 <esolangs> [[(top, height)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90577&oldid=90576 * Squidmanescape * (+199) /* Hello World! */
01:45:49 <esolangs> [[(top, height)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90578&oldid=90577 * Squidmanescape * (+217)
02:00:21 <esolangs> [[(top, height)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90579&oldid=90578 * Squidmanescape * (+0)
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02:34:36 <esolangs> [[( )fuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90580&oldid=78294 * Squidmanescape * (+1973)
02:35:14 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90581&oldid=90521 * PixelatedStarfish * (+22) /* Tests */
02:35:42 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90582&oldid=90581 * PixelatedStarfish * (+26) /* Tests */
02:35:57 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90583&oldid=90582 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2) /* Tests */
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02:38:52 <esolangs> [[( )fuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90584&oldid=90580 * Squidmanescape * (+47)
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03:27:18 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Conjectures]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90585&oldid=80625 * Hakerh400 * (-866)
03:27:22 <esolangs> [[User talk:Hakerh400/Conjectures]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90586&oldid=90161 * Hakerh400 * (+160)
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05:16:32 <b_jonas> oh heck I just realized how you can beat the stupid European style copyright laws. I just have to publish a license that the work can be distributed under the CC-0 (as-if public domain) license 70 years after now or publication, whichever is later, and then people/corporations are no longer subtly incentivized to cause me to die earlier.
05:17:00 <b_jonas> I should do that for all creative works that I publish or have published
05:18:47 <b_jonas> I don't have to somehow abuse USA copyright law which in some difficult to achieve conditions starts the timer from publication, I just need to issue a license. that's much simpler.
05:19:27 <zzo38> What is the difference of the law that is the significance? I don't know what the copyright law are in different countries?
05:20:09 <int-e> basing copyright expiration on death of author rather than publication
05:21:46 <int-e> though I don't think this is much of an incentive to expedite the death of an author
05:25:44 <b_jonas> zzo38: nothing much anymore, it's usually based on the death of the author everywhere in the world now, including in the US. I'm saying European style because the US adopted that rule later, but that only matters for works in the past.
05:26:27 <b_jonas> of course the problem is that most of the ways that get authors killed earlier, like wars, aren't targeting individual authors, so just me giving a license won't save me from such collective problems
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05:27:58 <b_jonas> this would work better if I could convince all authors to give such licenses. but that is unlikely to happen: some of the suthoers are too indifferent about this issue and won't bother, and some actively care about how much money their works earn after their death
05:28:16 <b_jonas> but still, it's better than nothing
05:30:20 <int-e> your family (if any) is the greater danger anyway :P
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05:31:26 <b_jonas> int-e: if you mean in the sense that my child (or a relative's child) will kill their parent to get their inheritance, then that can happen for any kind of property, not just creative works
05:31:41 <int-e> of course
05:36:35 <zzo38> What I would want to do is that nobody can copyright/patent it, except relicensing by GNU GPL or GNU AGPL (but that only applies to the modified work and not the original), and otherwise there is no restriction (so that attribution is not required, and so that you cannot be sued except being countersued due to an invalid claim).
05:40:59 <zzo38> (And, maybe also CC-BY-SA 4.0 might be allow too since it also allows GNU GPL; however, maybe to be restricted to only if it is needed for the license compatibility.)
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06:34:50 <b_jonas> also I'm not a lawyer and nothing that I say on this channel is legal advice
06:36:04 <int-e> `' lawyer
06:36:06 <HackEso> 285) <crystal-cola> (im not a lawyer) <crystal-cola> (im just making stuff up
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14:20:09 <river> I propose a new unit of measurement, the pizzaslice
14:25:54 <Taneb> What does it measure
14:26:03 <river> that's the fun part
14:26:23 <river> it can measure basically anything
14:26:38 <Taneb> How many pizzalices in a pizza
14:27:01 <river> that would be a regional parameter
14:28:57 <esolangs> [[UponThem]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90587&oldid=90575 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+71) /* Truth Machine */ categorize
14:40:49 <fizzie> Hmm. Couldn't really figure out any shorter way of writing {0 3 57 1197 25137} than {0 3 57 1197 25137} itself.
14:41:25 <fizzie> Tried {3 19 21 21}{pd}pa0+] but that's longer.
14:43:37 <b_jonas> @pf [0,3,57,1197,25137]
14:43:37 <lambdabot> Maybe you meant: pl bf
14:43:39 <b_jonas> @pl [0,3,57,1197,25137]
14:43:40 <lambdabot> [0, 3, 57, 1197, 25137]
14:43:51 <b_jonas> @unpl [0,3,57,1197,25137]
14:43:51 <lambdabot> [0, 3, 57, 1197, 25137]
14:43:57 <b_jonas> @golf [0,3,57,1197,25137]
14:43:57 <lambdabot> unexpected "[": expecting number, "d" or "("
14:44:01 <b_jonas> @djinn [0,3,57,1197,25137]
14:44:01 <lambdabot> Cannot parse command
14:44:07 <b_jonas> lambdabot can't get it shorter either
14:44:31 <fizzie> But I've now gotten more Burlesque solutions for 2021 than 2020: https://zem.fi/tmp/aocblsq.txt
14:44:55 <b_jonas> yay
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15:27:22 <b_jonas> zzo38: I'm watching https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL-_93BVApb59FWrLZfdlisi_x7-Ut_-w7 , which is a documentary about restoring an Apollo Guidance Computer, the computer that was used in space on the Apollo missions for moon landing.
15:27:28 <b_jonas> Apparently it's a 15-bit computer.
15:27:57 <b_jonas> The RAM and ROM are made of 15-bit words.
15:29:08 <b_jonas> word sizes were weird back then
15:48:06 <fizzie> We had some Motorola DSP56k dev boards for a "intro to DSP programming" course at the university, they have 24-bit words which isn't _that_ weird, but at least it's a non-power-of-two size.
15:48:41 <fizzie> The C compiler for it has 24-bit `char`, `short` and `int` types (sizeof == 1 for all of them), and a 48-bit `long` type. (No `long long`.)
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15:52:43 <b_jonas> oh, and all those videos are _after_ they emulated it in software, the videos are about restoring original hardware
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16:31:22 <b_jonas> oh, and it works with one's compliment arith instead of two's compliment
16:48:08 <b_jonas> heck, apparently it uses both one's compliment and two's compliment
16:48:10 <b_jonas> great
17:10:52 <sprout> https://github.com/egel-lang/aoc-2021/blob/main/day10/task2.eg <- day 10 task 2 of advent of code in egel
17:22:11 <b_jonas> jesus. apparently it disables interrupts while a signed overflow is flagged so that the interrupt routines don't have to save the overflow flag. that sounds eldritch.
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17:49:46 <esolangs> [[User:Anthonykozar/A language inspired by Adar]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90588 * Anthonykozar * (+5757) A new language inspired by Adar in the early stages of design.
17:57:27 <esolangs> [[User:Anthonykozar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90589&oldid=63576 * Anthonykozar * (+248) Adding link to my in-progress language design.
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18:59:57 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * 0Nera * New user account
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19:25:54 <earendel> fungot: kennedy was killed by mutants
19:25:55 <fungot> earendel: from the very first time, included the resolution, what efforts the government have a very ambitious and we should be in the customs union,
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20:10:56 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90590&oldid=90434 * Zero player rodent * (+210)
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20:59:30 <esolangs> [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90591 * B jonas * (+9580) (this will have to be proofread later, but I'm tired)
20:59:52 <esolangs> [[AGC]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90592 * B jonas * (+38) Redirected page to [[Apollo Guidance Computer]]
21:05:18 <fizzie> Automatic Gain Control.
21:06:21 <esolangs> [[Eek!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90593&oldid=90590 * Zero player rodent * (+1053)
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21:08:42 <esolangs> [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90594&oldid=90591 * B jonas * (+49) /* Hardware */
21:11:55 <int-e> Adventure Game Creator
21:14:15 <b_jonas> apparently the other computer on board the Apollo spacecraft was called AGS or AEA, but its original name was BUGS for "backup guidance system"
21:14:30 <b_jonas> they didn't like the acronym so they changed it
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23:02:03 <b_jonas> also now I know where MIX got its load negative instrutions from.
23:05:18 <b_jonas> I mean specifically where MIX got the idea of apparently wasting one eighth of its precious instruction encoding space on load negative instructions
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2021-12-11
00:10:00 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Yeetb01 * New user account
00:14:57 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90595&oldid=90545 * Yeetb01 * (+201) be yeet, stay yeet, forever yeet
00:15:56 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90596&oldid=90595 * Yeetb01 * (+74) fix
00:17:30 <esolangs> [[User:Anthonykozar/A language inspired by Adar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90597&oldid=90588 * Anthonykozar * (+616) Formatting changes and minor wording changes
00:17:57 <Soni> is ICMP turing-complete?
00:30:31 <esolangs> [[User:Viba]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90598 * Viba * (+58) Created page with "i am viba and i made these * [[UCanCode]] * [[FakeScript]]"
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00:43:43 <oerjan> b_jonas: i find the idea that anyone would care enough about the copyright status of your works 70 years from now enough to kill you utterly bizarre and would suggest you get some more realistic concerns hth
00:45:25 <oerjan> . o O ( like getting hit by meteorites )
00:46:12 <oerjan> (putting that in . o O ( ) because i'm not going to actually estimate the relative probability)
00:47:23 <oerjan> especially since the people who would normally care most would be the one who _own_ the copyright and would be incentivized to keep you alive longer
00:47:42 <oerjan> *ones
00:49:36 <oerjan> scratch that "especially", even their care should be absurdly low, it's 70 years into the future
00:51:09 <oerjan> @golf
00:51:10 <lambdabot> unexpected end of input: expecting number, "d" or "("
00:51:23 <oerjan> @golf 3d6
00:51:24 <lambdabot> oerjan: 5+2+6 => 13
00:51:47 <oerjan> 1d8
00:51:47 <lambdabot> oerjan: 5
00:53:16 <fizzie> Why is that "@golf"?
00:55:37 <fizzie> @roll 2d6
00:55:37 <lambdabot> fizzie: 1+2 => 3
00:55:46 <fizzie> Oh.
01:02:06 <oerjan> oh dear today's girl genius
01:03:23 <oerjan> i suspect madwa is responsible, but if not she's sure to notice them now
01:39:22 <earendel> i don't know. the tragic death of an artist can significantly boost the sales.
01:42:44 <earendel> maybe you've seen josie and the pussycats. a nice parody on the evil practices of music industry:)
01:45:28 <esolangs> [[User:Yeetb01]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90599 * Yeetb01 * (+72) e
01:52:50 <oerjan> no i haven't. hm...
01:53:05 <oerjan> i may have misunderstood b_jonas's intent
01:55:51 <oerjan> hm no, still don't understand how his license achieves anything that really matters
01:56:51 <oerjan> earendel: i don't think b_jonas suggested license helps with that sales boosting problem
01:57:13 <oerjan> * b_jonas's
02:00:30 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck+3]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90600&oldid=90103 * Squidmanescape * (+533) /* Implementations */
02:00:32 <oerjan> which is to say, although some people might conceivable care enough about the sales _now_ to kill him, they won't care whether the copyright then expires slightly earlier
02:00:41 <oerjan> *ly
02:05:40 <earendel> i'm afraid i missed his part entirely. didn't care to look for it in the logs. i recall that after some decades after the death of the author, you don't need to pay license fees nor ask for permission to use their work. but apparently you as well won't be able to make a new patent, or claim ownership otherwise. was it 70years? should be less, imo. i guess that was your point too?
02:08:22 <Corbin> Hm. The law already covers murdering for profit, doesn't it?
02:10:26 <oerjan> Corbin: you'd think
02:12:14 <earendel> yes. max sentence. planful and "lower motives", like greed.
02:14:14 <earendel> not sure what would make a noble motive. confusion maybe :p
02:15:00 <oerjan> tyrannicide. which can go any way as far as sentence goes :P
02:15:14 <oerjan> (dependent on whether the regime survives)
02:15:55 <earendel> yes.:)
02:17:03 <oerjan> also, not every country has the same law, although you'd expect similar rankings.
02:17:19 <oerjan> ( b_jonas is hungarian, for one thing. )
02:20:13 <Soni> we just actively attempt to dismantle copyright in its entirety
02:21:20 <earendel> life-sentence is 15 years in germany. but there's exception to that. like for people expected to repeat their crime. mostly some psychotic people not in control of themselves. they can be locked indefinitely long. (or until the doctors say you somehow changed for good)
02:22:12 <earendel> in germany there's a difference between authorship and copyright. authorship for instance is not disposable at all.
02:22:32 <esolangs> [[( )fuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90601&oldid=90584 * Squidmanescape * (+2003)
02:23:42 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90602&oldid=90171 * Squidmanescape * (+0) /* Languages I Want to Implement */
02:26:18 <Soni> what can they do to prevent you from disposing of it?
02:26:37 <esolangs> [[!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90603&oldid=81230 * Squidmanescape * (+28) I feel like this is a joke language about censorship.
02:26:40 <earendel> and of course that is not the point. you should be able to make profits from immaterial goods. but your grand-grand-children should eventually be forced to let off their grip of evil menace.
02:27:10 <esolangs> [[!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90604&oldid=90603 * Squidmanescape * (+0)
02:28:20 <earendel> soni: you can give away licenses like do what you want with it license. but the authorship is yours. and remains yours. nobody can take it away from you.
02:30:42 <Soni> earendel: sure but what can they do to stop you from using something like [shameless self-promotion] https://ganarchy.github.io/
02:31:26 <earendel> i never use morals in argumentation
02:31:37 <earendel> you should know by now.
02:31:57 <Soni> this isn't about morals, this is about practicality
02:32:17 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90605&oldid=90602 * Squidmanescape * (-16)
02:33:50 <earendel> besides. i don't see what would be wrong about seeking beauty. all the flowers in bloom. all the sweet fruits do attract me. there is nothing to compromise with.
02:34:32 <esolangs> [[User talk:Squidmanescape]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90606 * Squidmanescape * (+40) Created page with "I have decided to create this talk page."
02:35:00 <Soni> we guess you don't actually have to deny authorship to be able to use our software, and even we don't, but eh
02:41:05 <earendel> are you saying there is nothing comparable in your country?
02:47:00 <earendel> i guess you can maximaly give away all copyrights and whatever to somebody. not sure how it is when you're paid for creating immaterial goods on behalf of some company. probably the authorship then belongs to that company as well. but i'm not sure.
02:56:46 <earendel> most open-source licences require you to give some credit, or require your product to be puslished under certain licences as well. but to fuel your excitement: i think humanity never got closer to the idea of comunism as with the upcoming of computers, the www or open-source.
02:57:30 <earendel> however non-profit does not mean all is working for free.
03:00:32 <earendel> sure there is definitely merit to the idea of free market. if somebody doesn't like the product, your agenda or the color of your socks, he mustn't buy it, right? what could be more democratic.
03:06:22 <esolangs> [[Hello world program in esoteric languages (nonalphabetic and A-M)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90607&oldid=90287 * Squidmanescape * (+500) Added (top, height)
03:07:34 <earendel> you for instance are doomed.
03:08:10 <earendel> you think the world needs me more than i do.
03:10:48 <Soni> earendel: we mean, we have git commits with our name on them
03:11:13 <Soni> that's basically authorship yeah?
03:18:51 <earendel> if you correct a typo in a text, that's not authorship. also i don't know if authorship is the correct term. in germany it is 'urheber-recht' without the hyphen. i don't remember the exact text, but slightly changing a composition without significant merit wouldn't count. similarily to how patents apply or not. in last instance some court would need to decide. and there are a lot of edge cases, .. ad absurdum.
03:24:45 <earendel> soni: if you create a new repo you are asked for the license type. i guess such a license may also cover eventual contribution regulation. however i think if you're selling your workforce to a company, of course the company has some privileges or even ownership over that stuff. however i dont remember a company ever having won the nobel price.
03:26:17 <Soni> our favorite license is still "This software shall only be used in violation of this license." :p
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03:29:55 <zzo38> Soni: What is that license called?
03:31:46 <Soni> the license paradox
03:31:51 <zzo38> OK
03:33:28 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90608&oldid=90583 * PixelatedStarfish * (-465) /* Tests */
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03:34:38 <zzo38> I don't want to require anyone to give credit, or to do anything else; I only want to prohibit someone else to add further restriction. What is that license called?
03:35:34 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90609&oldid=90608 * PixelatedStarfish * (+142)
03:45:47 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90610&oldid=90609 * PixelatedStarfish * (+513) /* Interpreter */
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03:48:01 <Corbin> I still want to find licensing situations that basically require folks to join the community. https://opensource.stackexchange.com/q/11840/18097 was my last inquiry.
04:04:44 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90612&oldid=90611 * PixelatedStarfish * (+266) /* Interpreter */
04:04:54 <int-e> Isn't that basically a DRM scheme?
04:08:49 <Soni> zzo38: get rid of copyright?
04:11:54 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90613&oldid=90612 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2023) /* Test Cases */
04:12:22 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90614&oldid=90613 * PixelatedStarfish * (+17) /* Test Cases */
04:12:24 <earendel> i think if you don't declare the license it may not be binding. but i think all you need is to declare it. (even if it may not be legit. like: all men using this software are pigs! would not necessarily be a legit clause)
04:12:57 <earendel> because of the all pigs are equal act.
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04:16:49 <earendel> yes. go to bed. i will keep these skandinavian rascals in check.
04:16:53 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90618&oldid=90617 * PixelatedStarfish * (-221) /* Test Cases */
04:16:54 <earendel> :p
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04:26:50 <zzo38> Soni: It is similar yes, but want to do as a license so that it can be used in jurisdictions with copyright as well as those without. Actually, there are a few other terms I want to add as well, such as also the patents (if any) can be freely used, support for license compatibility with projects using (A)GPL/CC-BY-SA, and non-endorsement in situation where that becomes important.
04:29:41 <esolangs> [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90627&oldid=90594 * B jonas * (+60)
04:34:26 <b_jonas> oerjan: I firstly, they wouldn't outright kill me, because that would come with a criminal liability that's not worth the value they could get, they just might make my life slightly harder, but multiple different people (including corporations) all may have an incentive to do that independently, which adds up.
04:35:23 <b_jonas> secondly sure, maybe my creative works aren't worth enough, but by that logic you can also say that I'm not rich enough for anyone to steal from my house so I don't need a door lock.
04:36:10 <b_jonas> and yes, the 70 year delay is mostly the saving grace that makes this not already have had a too bad effect on artists who actually have valuable creative works.
04:37:26 <b_jonas> and no, this is not about the sales boosting effect of my death
04:38:05 <b_jonas> earendel: the timeout is usually 70 years, it depends slightly on what country you first publish your creative work in
04:39:58 <earendel> if it adds up, could the corporations make my penis harder as well?
04:40:13 <earendel> it would certainly pay off soon.
04:40:27 <earendel> not even slightly?
04:42:59 <earendel> seriously. what market incentives would make corporations want to make somebodies life harder.
04:44:09 <b_jonas> earendel: again, the incentive is that if I die earlier, then my published creative works lose most of their copyright protection earlier, and so they would acquire a right to use those creative works earlier
04:44:43 <b_jonas> I mean that's the copyright side; there are lots of much better reasons why a company would want to make your life harder
04:44:50 <b_jonas> but those aren't relevent here
04:45:46 <b_jonas> what you have to realize is that while this probably helps very little, the cost is also very little to me. I give away a little bit of the potential profits from the creative work in exchange for a little bit of potential longer life. I think it's a win.
04:46:36 <earendel> ah ok. i get it making life harder could have a negative impact on health. i get it. they may also want to reward me so it is a win win situation. right?
04:47:17 <earendel> without a doubt.
04:47:24 <b_jonas> earendel: yes, if they want to buy a copyright license for your work then they may want you to live longer actually
04:48:57 <earendel> well making one life's harder really only make sense if you're out to wait 70 years, and then you would need to compete with anybody else gaining the right use my work.
04:49:33 <b_jonas> but only if they buy a perpetual copyright license, which is not that common outside of software really
04:50:10 <earendel> u will have a hard time to convince your shareholders of the 70 years plus strategy.
04:57:08 <b_jonas> earendel: you have to understand the emotional side of my argument. most of the authors whose works are out of copyright died in or around world war II, and often either *from* the war or from the Nazi holocaust. the people who decide about war or peace do probably care 70 years in advance.
04:57:37 <b_jonas> admittedly they are also governments who may have extra incentives to keep my works under copyright protection, to increase their tax income.
04:59:36 <b_jonas> if you're a big film studio, it's absolutely worth for you to start a war in order to get film rights for all the books out there 70 years later
05:01:18 <earendel> wikipedia says: 'The original holder of the copyright may be the employer of the author rather than the author himself if the work is a "work for hire".' here we go.
05:03:01 <earendel> 'the most recent major overhaul of copyright in the US, the 1976 Copyright Act, extended federal copyright to works as soon as they are created and "fixed", without requiring publication or registration.'
05:03:02 <b_jonas> yes, the law says that, that applies to eg. software that I write during my job. in that case, in theory the company that pays me could have an incentive for me to live longer, but this probably only applies to film studios, software will be worth nothing in 70 years.
05:04:31 <b_jonas> earendel: that's technically how it already works here, as in the nominal copyright holder is fixed, but that matters only for very few practical reasons, because you can give licenses that transfer *almost* all the rights from copyright to someone else after the fact, as in the rights to distribute copies and copies of derivatives,
05:04:55 <b_jonas> and the remaining few rights are the ones that mostly never expire and have little money associated with them
05:08:25 <earendel> yes. but there is obviously a distinction between holder and "creator". which would be synonymous with how i used "author". as just for the case of that 70 years, the holder is not relevant.
05:09:20 <b_jonas> correct, except in old US works
05:09:41 <b_jonas> only the authors matter to determine the expiry time for works created now
05:09:43 <earendel> i guess the picant details are in fact the weak exception on "work for hire". i bet marx could elaborate
05:11:14 <b_jonas> this makes sense because nobody wants to determine when the corporation that you work for dies, so times are tied to your death or publication time
05:11:24 <earendel> b_jonas: i think this is not correct. authors can give their work out for free instantly.
05:11:45 <earendel> they remain the creator even after that expiration date as well.
05:12:00 <b_jonas> earendel: what is not correct?
05:12:28 <earendel> "only the authors matter to determine the expiry time for works created now."
05:12:31 <b_jonas> yes, you can use a copyright license to give your work away for free
05:12:56 <earendel> they dont. "creator-ship" doesn't expire.
05:13:08 <b_jonas> yes, only most of the rights expire
05:13:19 <b_jonas> the remaining few rights like being the author don't expire
05:13:35 <earendel> only the copy right protection, which they may give away at any time expires.
05:13:36 <b_jonas> only most of the copyright protection, as in people by default not being allowed to copy your work
05:20:53 <earendel> the other reason, as mentioned before is to prevent others of claiming a patent or copyright on works which copyright expired.
05:21:33 <earendel> however that making your life difficult .. is utter bullshit.
05:23:40 <earendel> there are laws that further restrict possible exploitation of copyright. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use
05:26:44 <b_jonas> earendel: and they vary from one country to another and have some *seriously* weird clauses, the low point being the one specifically about using works as scenery or backdrops in broadcast television only
05:28:15 <earendel> [..] for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research, is not an infringement of copyright. '
05:28:56 <b_jonas> the high point is seriously lifting restrictions if you copy printed works for use by blind people, either in print form or braille or audiobooks, which is why we have an entire partly government-sponsored library that has audiobook copies of lots of works for which they don't have a copyright license, on audio casettes, but they aren't allowed to loan them to anyone but people who are blind or close to
05:28:58 <earendel> i guess that's where you in doubt better get some consultance of some lawyer.
05:29:02 <b_jonas> it
05:30:37 <b_jonas> the other high point is where some exceptions about when you can copy a work for personal non-profit use are such that you're allowed to photocopy or digitize parts (chapters) of a book, but not the whole book together, however, you're allowed to make a handwritten copy of the whole book
05:30:38 <earendel> creating and patenting a vaccine for a deadly virus and not giving out any licenses for it, but prefer to be burried with it and your money could as well be regarded as not beneficial for the commonwealth.
05:31:13 <earendel> just for instance.
05:31:21 <b_jonas> that law is a worthy read, you can chuckle a lot on its many anachronisms
05:33:20 <earendel> you seemed to step down from it a bit by now.
05:33:30 <earendel> well i chuckled a lot reading your wet corporate making life harder thesis.
05:34:37 <b_jonas> earendel: again, it's cheap for me. if you think a corporation doesn't care about profits that they can realize 70 years from now or later, then don't you also think that I don't care about profits from my own works that I can only realize 70 years from now, and so it's cheap for me to give away that profit?
05:34:47 <b_jonas> this is a low impact intervention, but is also cheap
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05:35:53 <earendel> i think if you can't break even in max five years, you need the state to support your back. otherwise you will have fucking hard time.
05:37:19 <earendel> you suck at economics.
05:37:21 <earendel> ;)
05:41:46 <earendel> yw. instead of investing their limitless capital in renewables to gain control of the new market they prefer to stalk greta thunberg in some chatrooms. :)
05:42:03 <earendel> but .. could be an explanation.
05:42:33 <earendel> we'll see if that'll be crowned by success.
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05:44:18 <earendel> ps.: no, i'm glad it's tesla and not edison ;)
05:44:28 <earendel> all good.
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06:38:17 <Corbin> I think the problem is working-for-hire and letting corporations hold the rights to art.
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07:07:34 <esolangs> [[CYOA]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90628 * TheJonyMyster * (+1368) Created page with "== Overview == CYOA is a stack based semi-2d esolang. Operates on two stacks of bits, the first initialized with input (or empty if no input is given), the second starting em..."
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08:48:26 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck+3]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90631&oldid=90630 * Squidmanescape * (+6) /* Examples */
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10:08:48 <esolangs> [[User:Salpynx/Galveston]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90635&oldid=83729 * Salpynx * (+35) formatting
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10:25:05 <esolangs> [[Finites at Fredy's]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90638&oldid=84541 * Salpynx * (+3453) /* Examples */ simple output example
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10:32:57 <esolangs> [[Finites at Fredy's]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90639&oldid=90638 * Salpynx * (+165) /* Description */ add ! convention
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10:35:24 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90641&oldid=90637 * Squidmanescape * (+173) /* Languages I Want to Implement */
10:35:48 <esolangs> [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90642&oldid=90634 * B jonas * (+47) /* Instruction set */
10:38:41 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90643&oldid=90641 * Squidmanescape * (+42) /* Implementation Planned */
10:40:55 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90644&oldid=90643 * Squidmanescape * (-48) /* Languages I Explicitly Won't Ever Implement */
10:49:10 <esolangs> [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90645&oldid=90642 * B jonas * (+153) /* Hardware */
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11:07:27 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90647 * Hakerh400 * (+2327) Created page with "This is the proof of the correctness of the algorithm described in [[User:Hakerh400/Bijection_between_reals_and_the_powerset_of_naturals]]. === Definitions === A bit is eith..."
11:08:24 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90648&oldid=90647 * Hakerh400 * (-5)
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11:17:27 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90650&oldid=90649 * Hakerh400 * (-28)
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11:36:55 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90653&oldid=90652 * TJC games * (+112)
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12:05:40 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90658&oldid=90656 * TJC games * (+116) /* Operations */
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12:14:09 <esolangs> [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90661&oldid=90660 * TJC games * (+11) /* Hello world */
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12:51:57 <Soni> zzo38: ah you want it to be everything-free
12:55:37 <Soni> zzo38: https://mobile.twitter.com/SoniEx2/status/1469511388355833858
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13:52:03 <Soni> unrelated https://twitter.com/NanoRaptor/status/1469432382247763968
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14:51:42 <fizzie> Blerg, pretty bad Burlesque solutions today. Ended up with: %f9={J-.0>.j+.9<.r@}ps)XX{9rzJcp{j+]{Jx/Jx/d!+.J10==#Rj{JPp}ifjD!}r[p\CLp\PP{p^f9jf9cp}\m}{L[}w!vv{{J9<=.*}m[}m[J\[0CNj}100E!vvCL++
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15:49:19 <fizzie> Hmm, it's a bit shorter (and slower) if I switch the method of generating the Moore neighbourhood by filtering all grid cells by distance rather than attempting to clamp the X/Y coordinates independently: ps)XX{9rzJcpS0{j+]{Jx/Jx/d!J9==#Rj{JPp}ifj+.D!}r[p\CLp\PP{{?-)ab>]1<=}j+]g0jf[}\m}{L[}w!vv{{J9<=.*}m[}m[J\[0CNj}100E!vvCL++
15:53:17 <b_jonas> more blsq?
15:55:46 <fizzie> Yep. After the last round of trimming, day 11 is shorter than day 9 part 2, which I might just call good enough: https://zem.fi/tmp/aocblsq.txt
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17:56:56 <esolangs> [[P]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90667&oldid=75430 * OrichalcumCosmonaut * (+18) use the LaTeX equivalent of [[File:P.png]] instead of a static image,
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18:24:06 <esolangs> [[Can]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90668&oldid=90502 * Nxe * (+24) /* Hello World! */
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18:41:32 <fizzie> Ooh, <math>.
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19:00:56 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90669&oldid=90650 * Hakerh400 * (+1)
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19:44:13 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90670&oldid=90644 * Squidmanescape * (+0)
19:46:12 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90671&oldid=90670 * Squidmanescape * (+93) /* My Languages */
19:46:50 <esolangs> [[Hacrzyk]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90672 * Squidmanescape * (+134) Created page with "Hacrzyk is a language heavily based on [[Crazy]], but it is smaller and therefore easier to implement. [[Category:Works-in-Progress]]"
19:47:35 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90673 * NickDev-1666 * (+730) Xml syntactical c. Made for Tobi
19:47:59 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90674&oldid=90673 * NickDev-1666 * (+2) /* TobiLang */
19:48:12 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Squidmanescape * moved [[Hacrzyk]] to [[Haczyk]]
19:50:20 <int-e> Oh I could've just set a flashing octopodes to -9 and clamp at 0 once things stabilized...
19:52:40 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90677&oldid=90675 * Squidmanescape * (+401)
19:53:14 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90678&oldid=90677 * Squidmanescape * (+34)
19:53:45 <fizzie> The Burlesque version increments the flashing ones again because it's easier to generate the 3x3 square than the 8-cell neighbourhood, but that doesn't matter because of the `J9<=.*` that clamps everything >9 to 0 at the end of the step.
19:53:47 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90679&oldid=90671 * Squidmanescape * (-1) /* My Languages */
19:54:24 <fizzie> Well, actually, now that the neighborhood is generated based on the distance, it'd be just as easy to make the right one, and even marginally more efficient.
19:54:37 <fizzie> (Just a matter of `1==` instead of `1<=`.)
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20:00:52 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90680&oldid=90674 * NickDev-1666 * (+65)
20:03:22 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90681&oldid=90680 * NickDev-1666 * (-18)
20:03:46 <int-e> fizzie: I did that too, but then I have to keep track of octopodes that have already flashed
20:04:26 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90682&oldid=90678 * Squidmanescape * (+56)
20:04:45 <int-e> which got me thinking of ways to track that information with just the world grid.
20:05:20 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90683&oldid=90681 * NickDev-1666 * (+55)
20:05:27 <fizzie> I don't keep track of octopodes that have already flashed in any separate way.
20:05:49 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90684&oldid=90683 * NickDev-1666 * (-5)
20:05:57 <fizzie> An octopus will flash (once) when it increments from 9 to 10, that's all.
20:06:40 <fizzie> Or alternatively (what I had before I put that in the innermost loop) an octopus will flash when after one sub-round it has changed from a value that's <= 9 to a value that's > 9.
20:06:49 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90685&oldid=90684 * NickDev-1666 * (+82)
20:07:00 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90686&oldid=90685 * NickDev-1666 * (+4)
20:07:23 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90687&oldid=90686 * NickDev-1666 * (+3)
20:07:34 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90688&oldid=90687 * NickDev-1666 * (-3)
20:08:16 <esolangs> [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90689&oldid=90688 * NickDev-1666 * (+5)
20:08:20 <int-e> fizzie: Ah, but I process octopodes in bulk, so it might jump from 9 to 11 which is indistinguishable from jumping from 10 to 11 post-hoc.
20:09:00 <fizzie> Well, yes, I guess you could call storing the bitmap of values <= 9 before a single update pass "keeping track" as well.
20:09:18 <int-e> "bitmap"
20:09:25 <int-e> :t S.fromList
20:09:26 <lambdabot> Ord a => [a] -> S.Set a
20:09:38 <int-e> (actually it was just a plain list)
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20:09:48 <fizzie> The J{9<=}fIPp...J{9.>}fIPPIN check I had for that approach broke when I switched from a 1D block and plain indices to a 2D block-of-blocks with {y x} indices; generating neighbours was shorter with the latter.
20:10:19 <fizzie> I'm a little sad I lost the "fIPPIN" part, it was funny.
20:10:55 <fizzie> ("Find indices, pop from secondary stack to main stack, do set intersection.")
20:11:59 <esolangs> [[Another Finite State Brainfuck]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90690 * Oshaboy * (+1476) Initial
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20:12:55 <esolangs> [[User:Oshaboy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90691&oldid=90386 * Oshaboy * (+59) /* Original(-ish) Esolangs */
20:13:35 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90692&oldid=90682 * Squidmanescape * (+1207)
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20:16:23 <fizzie> I'd like Burlesque to have a 2dup. As far as stack management words go, it's got less of them than Forth.
20:16:42 <fizzie> There's even a three-element rotate in only one direction.
20:17:37 <fizzie> x/ goes from `a b c` to `b c a` (top of stack on the right), but there's no single builtin to get `c a b`.
20:18:00 <river> could you do x/x/
20:18:08 <fizzie> You could, but it's twice as long.
20:19:19 <fizzie> And that Jx/Jx/ nonsense in the day 11 solution is just to get from `a b` to `b a a b`, that's where I'd like a dup2 in.
20:23:51 <fizzie> Forth also has nip ( a b -- b ) and tuck ( a b -- b a b ) which I think I've wanted in earlier solutions. The Burlesque equivalents are I think jvv (swap drop, not too bad) and Jx/x/ (dup rot rot, pretty terrible).
20:24:27 <fizzie> Burlesque does have a full-stack rotate both left and right (#r and #R) though. It's just inconvenient if there's something else relevant still on the stack.
20:25:58 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90693&oldid=90626 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2111) Undo revision 90626 by [[Special:Contributions/PixelatedStarfish|PixelatedStarfish]] ([[User talk:PixelatedStarfish|talk]])
20:27:02 <fizzie> I'm sure if I tried to actually do AoC puzzles in Forth, the better stack words wouldn't really compensate for the lack of higher-order builtins like map, filter and reduce, as well as lazy lists.
20:31:22 <b_jonas> fizzie: there's also the opposite end, https://esolangs.org/wiki/GML where the only stack rearrangement operations are binding to a new local variable and pushing a local variable. not even swap or dup or pop builtins.
20:31:36 <b_jonas> it's at least consistent.
20:32:22 <fizzie> Does binding a local variable consume it from the stack?
20:32:51 <b_jonas> yes
20:33:38 <fizzie> Mm. There are Forth implementations with locals, that work a little like that -- in Gforth, for example, you can write : swap { a b -- b a } b a ; to reimplement swap.
20:33:44 <b_jonas> also even though [ and ] seem at first to work like in postscript to make an array from the stack contents, the language defines them in such a way that [ isn't an actual value on the stack and you can't assign it to a local variable
20:34:14 <b_jonas> fizzie: I think it's based more of postscript, which has /x to assign to a variable x, and then x to retrieve that variable
20:34:24 <b_jonas> or something like that, maybe it's /x def or something
20:34:45 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90694&oldid=90693 * PixelatedStarfish * (-18) /* Test Cases */
20:34:46 <fizzie> `( in -- out )` is the convention for a stack effect comment, so `{ in -- out }` binds the locals listed on the left side; the right side is still a comment. And then just mentioning them pushes them on the stack.
20:34:48 <HackEso> rm: cannot remove 'canary': No such file or directory \ /hackenv/bin/(: eval: line 4: syntax error near unexpected token `in' \ /hackenv/bin/(: eval: line 4: `in -- out )` is the convention for a stack effect comment, so `{ in -- out }` binds the locals listed on the left side; the right side is still a comment. And then just mentioning them pushes them on the stack.'
20:34:52 <b_jonas> yes, it's not local variables, but the contest has *functional* in its name so they had to do that
20:35:24 <fizzie> I should learn not to start with a backtick.
20:35:48 <fizzie> (Where did "cannot remove 'canary': No such file or directory" even come from there?)
20:37:15 <b_jonas> `(
20:37:16 <HackEso> rm: cannot remove 'canary': No such file or directory
20:37:38 <b_jonas> ``` type \(
20:37:39 <HackEso> ​( is /hackenv/bin/(
20:37:42 <b_jonas> `cbt (
20:37:43 <HackEso> ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm canary; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl
20:38:00 <b_jonas> oh
20:38:10 <b_jonas> that should be changed to reference canary in the right directory
20:38:25 <fizzie> Yeah, I guess it's for running something without making a commit?
20:38:35 <b_jonas> yeah
20:38:56 <b_jonas> and when I put $HACKENV/ everywhere, I looked for wisdom and quotes and ibin and stuff like that, but not for canary
20:39:08 <b_jonas> ``` grep -wl canary bin/*
20:39:09 <HackEso> grep: bin/*: No such file or directory
20:39:20 <b_jonas> ``` grep -wl canary /hackenv/bin/* # ok, I deserved that one
20:39:22 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/bin/(
20:39:44 <b_jonas> `? (
20:39:46 <HackEso> ​(? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
20:40:59 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90695&oldid=90694 * PixelatedStarfish * (+44) /* Test Cases */
20:41:36 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90696&oldid=90695 * PixelatedStarfish * (-39) /* Test Cases */
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20:47:52 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90697&oldid=90696 * PixelatedStarfish * (+11) /* Test Cases */
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20:48:41 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90698&oldid=90697 * PixelatedStarfish * (-11) /* Test Cases */
20:54:45 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90699&oldid=90698 * PixelatedStarfish * (+395) /* Test Cases */
20:56:05 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90700&oldid=90699 * PixelatedStarfish * (-20) /* Test Cases */
21:03:08 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90701&oldid=90700 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* Test Cases */
21:04:33 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90702&oldid=90701 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0)
21:04:55 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90703&oldid=90702 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2) /* Test Cases */
21:05:26 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90704&oldid=90703 * PixelatedStarfish * (+10) /* Test Cases */
21:09:26 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90705&oldid=90704 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* Interpreter */
21:15:05 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90706&oldid=90692 * Squidmanescape * (+243) /* Description */
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21:49:43 <b_jonas> `cbt (
21:49:44 <HackEso> ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm -- "$HACKENV/canary"; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl
21:50:32 <b_jonas> `( seq 10 | tee cXsR
21:50:35 <HackEso> 1 \ 2 \ 3 \ 4 \ 5 \ 6 \ 7 \ 8 \ 9 \ 10
21:50:41 <b_jonas> `cat cXsR
21:50:42 <HackEso> 1 \ 2 \ 3 \ 4 \ 5 \ 6 \ 7 \ 8 \ 9 \ 10
21:50:47 <b_jonas> hmm, that didn't work
21:50:50 <b_jonas> `rm cXsR
21:50:51 <HackEso> No output.
21:50:54 <b_jonas> `cat cXsR
21:50:54 <HackEso> cat: cXsR: No such file or directory
21:51:09 <b_jonas> fizzie: ^ doesn't seem to work
21:51:21 <b_jonas> I'll have to revert it so it at least gives an error message
21:52:31 <b_jonas> `cbt (
21:52:32 <HackEso> ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm canary; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl
21:52:57 <fizzie> I think the problem's really that no commit is needed any more for files in the current directory (/hackenv/tmp), so the command becomes slightly pointless.
21:53:11 <b_jonas> ah
21:53:13 <b_jonas> right!
21:53:17 <b_jonas> then I shouldn't revert it
21:53:32 <b_jonas> `cbt (
21:53:33 <HackEso> ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm -- "$HACKENV/canary"; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl
21:53:53 <b_jonas> `( echo cr7xRqXRGr1o > /hackenv/X4_D
21:53:56 <HackEso> No output.
21:54:02 <b_jonas> `cat /hackenv/X4_D
21:54:04 <HackEso> cat: /hackenv/X4_D: No such file or directory
21:54:08 <b_jonas> good, it is working
21:54:22 <b_jonas> thanks for the reminder
21:54:33 <fizzie> The chances of someone successfully using it for its intended purpose are pretty slim, but of course it's the principle of the thing.
21:55:17 <b_jonas> sure, the fallback if we can't fix it is to make it always give an informative error message and not execute its comman
21:55:28 <b_jonas> if nobody wants to use it, that doesn't hurt
21:55:34 <b_jonas> but this is even better
21:57:52 <b_jonas> ``` cd /hackenv/bin; ln -sv ../../bin/true ./\:
21:57:54 <HackEso> ​'./:' -> '../../bin/true'
21:58:00 <b_jonas> `: ignore this please
21:58:01 <HackEso> No output.
21:58:21 <b_jonas> apparently that's only a shell builtin, it doesn't exist as a standalone executable
21:58:25 <b_jonas> ``` type -a :
21:58:27 <HackEso> ​: is a shell builtin \ : is /hackenv/bin/:
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21:58:31 <b_jonas> ``` type -a true
21:58:32 <HackEso> true is a shell builtin \ true is /bin/true
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22:09:24 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90707&oldid=90706 * Squidmanescape * (+25) /* Description */
22:16:04 <esolangs> [[KonamiCode]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90708&oldid=90280 * Conor O'Brien * (-12) Given proof of TC, edit tag
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22:37:49 <earendel> `relcome
22:37:51 <HackEso> Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <https://esolangs.org/>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.)
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23:45:09 <esolangs> [[P]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90709 * OrichalcumCosmonaut * (+21) redirect from double-prime character to two separate prime characters
23:54:18 <esolangs> [[P]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90710&oldid=90667 * OrichalcumCosmonaut * (+37) correct structured program theorem redlink to point to wikipedia article (which was probably intended)
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2021-12-12
00:20:23 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90711&oldid=90705 * PixelatedStarfish * (+314) /* Word Generator */
00:20:59 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90712&oldid=90711 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* External Links */
00:21:41 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90713&oldid=90712 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* External Links */
00:22:06 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90714&oldid=90713 * PixelatedStarfish * (+20) /* External Links */
00:24:27 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90715&oldid=90714 * PixelatedStarfish * (+8) /* External Links */
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01:15:14 <sprout> https://pasteboard.co/ieIg2fUTVQ1T.png <- aoc day 11, task 2 - after I muddled about a bit with the libraries
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01:30:21 <fizzie> int-e: I wasn't going to do it since I couldn't have started it from the beginning, but I went ahead and did it anyway: https://zem.fi/tmp/aoc/stats.aligned.ratio.html
01:30:25 <fizzie> (There's also a "non-aligned" version where the X axis is just purely the time when the stats were grabbed, and a "trajectory" plot that puts one-star / two-stars counts as the X/Y axes, and a plain chart of the number of solutions, aligned and not.)
01:31:05 <fizzie> I hope they'll be slightly more interesting-looking once there's >> 1 day's worth of data.
01:32:25 <int-e> oh cute
01:35:28 <fizzie> I may need to widen the charts once there's a whole month in there though. Or (for the "aligned" ones) make the time-since-unlock log-scale.
01:40:29 <int-e> fizzie: does the thing support non-decimal units? 24h is a more natural interval than 20
01:41:30 <fizzie> Hmm, maybe-probably. What it definitely doesn't support is the "timedelta" types though.
01:42:31 <int-e> (the time scale seems to be the best way to disambiguate the colors there)
01:44:32 <fizzie> Maybe I'll just convert it to be in terms of days, then it'll probably pick 1.
01:45:51 <int-e> Though ideally the chart should be interactive (hover or click over a day -> highlight that particular curve). I imagine that would be quite a bit of effort on an upstream framework though.
01:46:28 <int-e> So... just throwing that out there as an idea that I have no expectations of happening.
01:46:54 <fizzie> Well.. Altair/Vega is pretty featureful, and I've seen their example charts with stuff like sliders that let you "animate" the chart. The biggest problem usually seems to be in deriving the cryptic incantations to make it happen.
01:47:22 <fizzie> In particular, the lower-level framework (Vega, or Vega-Lite I think it is) definitely would support that, but whether it's exposed in Altair is another thing.
01:48:36 <int-e> Do you get to pick the colors? Going through the rainbow each week might be an improvement.
01:49:04 <fizzie> Yeah, if I can figure out the syntax for the color scales (again; I knew it once).
01:49:44 <fizzie> One interactive thing that seems easy is tooltips on the chart, so it could show a "Day: 11" box when you hover over a line in the chart. Not sure about highlighting what's being hovered over in the legend though.
01:51:13 <fizzie> Added the tooltips (experimentally).
01:53:37 <fizzie> https://altair-viz.github.io/gallery/interactive_legend.html <- guess it's in theory doable.
01:54:34 <fizzie> (Uses clicks rather than hover though.)
02:07:47 <fizzie> Can't quite figure out how to map to a color scheme cyclically though. There's a few examples, but they involve explicitly setting the colors. Could do that, of course.
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02:19:05 <fizzie> Okay, now it (in theory) highlights if you click on the legend lines. Which isn't really discoverable, but... likewise, it doesn't undo the highlight by clicking on the same row again (like I'd expect), you need to click somewhere else in the legend, like the 'day' label.
02:20:22 <int-e> fizzie: I wonder how terrible this is: vega.scheme('rainbow28', ['#ff0000','#eeac06','#ceee0c','#13ff32','#19d1d1','#1f6aff','#d326d3','#ff2c2c','#f1bb33','#d7f139','#3fff59','#46dada','#4c88ff','#dc52dc','#ff5959','#f4c95f','#e0f466','#6cff7f','#72e2e2','#79a5ff','#e57fe5','#ff8585','#f7d88c','#e9f792','#99ffa6','#9febeb','#a5c3ff','#eeacee']);
02:21:18 <fizzie> I wonder if that's any different from what I get with just scheme 'rainbow'.
02:21:22 <fizzie> https://vega.github.io/vega/docs/schemes/
02:22:00 <fizzie> FTR, the thing I put there now is an 8-element categorical scheme (#dark2).
02:22:07 <int-e> fizzie: cf https://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/scale.html
02:23:12 <esolangs> [[User:DoggyDogWhirl]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90716&oldid=90543 * DoggyDogWhirl * (+8) Added River
02:25:38 <fizzie> Switched it to that color scheme.
02:26:45 <fizzie> Hmm, on='mouseover' on a selection might make it act on hover rather than click, let's try that too.
02:26:53 <int-e> Hmm, it's amazing how small the difference between 1 and 8 turns out to be.
02:27:12 <int-e> colors are hard :)
02:29:55 <fizzie> The mouseover thing doesn't work out quite right. It highlights on hover over the line in the chart, not in the legend.
02:30:22 <int-e> hmm. that's better than nothing?
02:31:12 <fizzie> I don't know if I prefer it or not. It's a little busy. And also deselects what you clicked in the legend if the cursor enters the chart.
02:31:26 <fizzie> But it does make individual lines easier to pick out I guess.
02:32:19 <fizzie> Hypothetically I could make the legend-clicking and the chart-hovering two independent selections.
02:35:56 <fizzie> Yeah, I think that's better. Still very undiscoverable that you can click on the legend though.
02:37:58 <fizzie> Though it does have one drawback, now that they're independent, when you do the chart-hover you don't see in the legend which line it is you've highlighted.
02:39:23 <fizzie> That's enough for today, I think.
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02:51:47 <earendel> martian advent?
02:52:11 <earendel> hm. when is xmas on mars?
02:52:50 <earendel> wintersonnenwende
03:32:02 <int-e> > let rb = [(0xff,0x00,0x00),(0xee,0xaa,0x00),(0xcc,0xee,0x00),(0x00,0xff,0x22),(0x00,0xcc,0xcc),(0x00,0x55,0xff),(0xcc,0x00,0xcc)]; rb' = take 28 [(f r, f g, f b) | ((r,g,b),i) <- zip (cycle rb) [0..], let f v = (v*(40-i) + 255*i) `div` 40] in rb' >>= \(r,g,b) -> printf "'#%02x%02x%02x'," r g b :: String
03:32:03 <lambdabot> "'#ff0000','#eeac06','#ceee0c','#13ff32','#19d1d1','#1f6aff','#d326d3','#ff2...
03:32:18 <int-e> (now I can find it in the logs ;-) )
03:34:42 <oren> I have been doing the advent of code in freebasic this yer
03:35:39 <oren> why are we doing floodfill over and over
03:39:20 <int-e> It's the only advanced algorithm that people know? :-P
03:48:13 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90717&oldid=90707 * Squidmanescape * (-21) /* Description */
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04:10:59 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90718&oldid=90717 * Squidmanescape * (-2079) Blanked the page
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05:40:36 <esolangs> [[Talk:1L]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90719&oldid=19317 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+142) Category
05:49:40 <int-e> fizzie: so #haskell came up with this annoying question... how long can the octopodes take to synchronize in the worst case? (they don't always synchronize; ignore those cases)
05:51:30 <int-e> (also the actual instances that are generated seem to use only 1..8, which probably changes the answer)
05:54:31 <int-e> I don't see anything clever to do for that question though... only generate and test. Which so far has turned up https://paste.debian.net/1223091/ with 29734 steps before synchronization
05:56:43 <int-e> A simple looping example has 3444444443 in the top row and the rest all 0.
06:32:41 <esolangs> [[Aheui Turing-completeness proof]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90720 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+1824) Proof
06:55:47 <b_jonas> oren: freebasic? does that have a built-in sort statement?
06:56:06 <b_jonas> (there's at least one dialect of BASIC that does)
07:03:29 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * TreborHuang * New user account
07:06:35 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90721&oldid=90596 * TreborHuang * (+180)
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07:38:42 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90722&oldid=90718 * Squidmanescape * (+537)
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07:39:27 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90723&oldid=90679 * Squidmanescape * (-18)
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07:42:32 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90724&oldid=90723 * Squidmanescape * (+11) /* Newer than 2018 */
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10:06:35 <int-e> day 11 with SSE3: https://paste.debian.net/1223102/
10:07:51 <int-e> (not quite day 11, this is looking for bad initial configurations)
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10:17:55 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90725&oldid=90722 * Squidmanescape * (+498)
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10:40:11 <esolangs> [[Aheui]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90726&oldid=90150 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+51) Proof
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11:40:01 <river> it takes 6 to 8 hours to digest a pizza
11:40:31 <river> WR: Lamon T. ate a slice of pizza in one minute, 12.69 seconds
11:41:02 <river> ikt can also measure angle, a number of people
11:41:16 <river> can also measure weight
11:47:38 <earendel> the fuck are you making innuendos about my weight?! :o
11:48:00 <earendel> you snfsmutther.
11:48:59 <river> it also is a measure of calories
11:49:24 <river> your ppd would be a scale of how many cals you intake a day
11:49:29 <earendel> or kJ
11:49:52 <earendel> W=h*f
11:49:55 <earendel> W=f*s
11:50:14 <earendel> W=P*t
11:51:07 <earendel> W=F*s ..pardon.
11:54:05 <earendel> how much kJ has an apple?
11:54:22 <earendel> compared to a glock?
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13:08:29 <fizzie> int-e: First squiggle in https://zem.fi/tmp/aoc/stats.trajectory.html :)
13:08:40 <fizzie> Also made a log-scale version to zoom in on that, https://zem.fi/tmp/aoc/stats.trajectory.log.html
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13:12:28 <fizzie> (Wonder how many people did the same thing as I did, and read part 2 instructions as allowing to visit all small caves twice, rather than just one of them.)
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16:33:55 <sprout> https://github.com/egel-lang/aoc-2021/blob/main/day12/task2.eg <- advent of code, day 12, task 2. after I made all the mistakes possible
16:34:15 <sprout> fizzie: didn't. I always solve the puzzles without any hints.
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16:45:18 <sprout> https://pasteboard.co/iWFNT5RvtYvZ.png <- with colors
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17:35:22 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:DFA-er Proof 1.png]]": First part of the proof of DFA-er's computational power
17:36:17 <earendel> :)
17:39:11 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:DFA-er Proof 2.png]]"
17:40:34 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] overwrite * Largejamie * uploaded a new version of "[[File:DFA-er Proof 2.png]]"
17:41:27 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] overwrite * Largejamie * uploaded a new version of "[[File:DFA-er Proof 1.png]]"
17:42:22 <esolangs> [[Proof of DFA-er's Computational Power]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90731 * Largejamie * (+69) Created page with "[[File:DFA-er_Proof_1.png|center]] [[File:DFA-er_Proof_2.png|center]]"
17:42:25 <fizzie> I've got ln{'-;;J<-}m[{-]"end"!=}f[s0{{"start"}}{J{Jbcj[~{-]==}[[g0jf[)[~{[+}Z]{J)zzINJNB=s}f[}\m}{L[}w!CLFL"end"CN and ln{'-;;J<-}m[{J-]"end"!=j[~"start"!=&&}f[s0{{"start"}}{J{Jbcj[~{-]==}[[g0jf[)[~{[+}Z]{J)zzINsg)L[?d++1<=}f[}\m}{L[}w!CLFL"end"CN today, haven't been inspired to trim them down.
17:42:38 <fizzie> Also, part 2 takes ~17 minutes on my puzzle input.
17:43:29 <esolangs> [[DFA-er]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90732&oldid=82645 * Largejamie * (+60) /* Computational Class */
17:43:45 <esolangs> [[DFA-er]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90733&oldid=90732 * Largejamie * (-12) /* Computational Class */
17:45:19 <fizzie> Also added to my notes a funny "combined" view of the Burlesque solutions -- https://0x0.st/-F4e.txt -- to show what they have in common.
17:45:42 <esolangs> [[Proof of DFA-er's Computational Power]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90734&oldid=90731 * Largejamie * (+20)
17:45:53 <esolangs> [[Proof of DFA-er's Computational Power]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90735&oldid=90734 * Largejamie * (+1)
17:47:36 <esolangs> [[Proof of DFA-er's Computational Power]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90736&oldid=90735 * Largejamie * (+18)
17:54:50 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:PDA-er Proof 1.png]]"
17:55:48 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] overwrite * Largejamie * uploaded a new version of "[[File:PDA-er Proof 1.png]]"
17:56:29 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:PDA-er Proof 2.png]]"
17:56:54 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:PDA-er Proof 3.png]]"
17:57:13 <esolangs> [[Proof of PDA-er's Computational Power]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90741 * Largejamie * (+143) Created page with "[[File:PDA-er_Proof_1.png|center]] [[File:PDA-er_Proof_2.png|center]] [[File:PDA-er_Proof_3.png|center]] [[Category:Proofs]] [[Category:2021]]"
17:57:54 <esolangs> [[PDA-er]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90742&oldid=82163 * Largejamie * (+48) /* Computational Class */
17:58:36 <sprout> part 2 in 109 seconds. I hope to rewrite the runtime once from a C++ object hierarchy to something smallish
17:58:45 <sprout> but first I want the mobile code
18:11:22 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 1.png]]"
18:11:37 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 2.png]]"
18:11:55 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof (1) 02 00.png]]"
18:13:03 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 3.png]]"
18:14:36 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 4.png]]"
18:15:18 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 5.png]]"
18:15:50 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 6.png]]"
18:16:10 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 7.png]]"
18:16:29 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 8.png]]"
18:16:46 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 9.png]]"
18:17:05 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Largejamie * uploaded "[[File:Airline Food Proof 10.png]]"
18:17:48 <esolangs> [[Proof of Airline Food's Computational Power]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90754 * Largejamie * (+449) Created page with "[[File:Airline_Food_Proof_1.png|center]] [[File:Airline_Food_Proof_2.png|center]] [[File:Airline_Food_Proof_3.png|center]] [[File:Airline_Food_Proof_4.png|center]] File:Airl..."
18:18:39 <esolangs> [[Airline Food]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90755&oldid=85870 * Largejamie * (+54) /* Computational Class */
18:21:59 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Largejamie * moved [[Proof of Airline Food's Computational Power]] to [[Airline Food Turing-completeness Proof]]
18:22:31 <esolangs> [[Airline Food]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90758&oldid=90755 * Largejamie * (-5) /* Computational Class */
18:24:09 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Largejamie * moved [[Proof of DFA-er's Computational Power]] to [[DFA-er Finite State Automaton Proof]]
18:24:51 <esolangs> [[DFA-er]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90761&oldid=90733 * Largejamie * (-2) /* Computational Class */
18:25:16 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Largejamie * moved [[Proof of PDA-er's Computational Power]] to [[PDA-er Pushdown Automaton Proof]]
18:25:48 <esolangs> [[PDA-er]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90764&oldid=90742 * Largejamie * (-6) /* Computational Class */
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18:44:44 <fizzie> The Go version takes 0.043 seconds for parts 1 & 2 combined, but maybe that's not quite fair.
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19:06:54 <sprout> yah well. Egel was once developed to show that you can piggyback on C++'s memory management but I guess I am at a point to let go of that
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19:09:36 <sprout> I thought about tweaking the C++ code somewhat (roll out specialized vector implementation/code representation) but in the end that'll only be tweaks
19:10:17 <river> I learned about C++ concurrency
19:10:35 <sprout> ?
19:10:49 <river> I watched ayoutuve video about it
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20:36:26 <esolangs> [[Varigen]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90765&oldid=81340 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+37) /* Program format */ .
20:36:46 <esolangs> [[Varigen]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90766&oldid=90765 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-14) /* Program format */ .
20:43:06 <int-e> Oh for day 11, I should flash even rows, then odd rows, for better data parallelism (20% speedup, not too shabby)
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21:01:04 <fizzie> I made the Go day 12 faster by a factor of 14 without changing the algorithm at all, just by switching from my general-purpose `util.Graph` (bunch of string-keyed hashmaps) to a simple "vertices labeled from 0 to N-1, edges as array of ints" representation.
21:01:38 <fizzie> Not that it really matters whether it takes 43 milliseconds or 3. Usually I've started to care about efficiency once the runtime sneaks past half a second.
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21:10:55 <int-e> fizzie: Yeah I got drawn into a number crunching task which made this seem... somewhat worthwhile. (See above, truing to find bad initial configurations that take long to synchronize.)
21:12:37 <fizzie> Right, that thing.
21:15:55 <int-e> Let's put this somewhere updateable: https://gist.github.com/int-e/27962eb9a9d1980cc5b4ba8baad59a42
21:17:01 <int-e> (there's two configuration because the instances from the website seem to only use 1..8, not 0 nor 9)
21:18:13 <esolangs> [[User:PythonshellDebugwindow/TemplateWikipediaXML]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90767&oldid=72625 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+735) put content
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21:24:24 <esolangs> [[Talk:Gaot++]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90768 * Anthonykozar * (+1893) Questions and comments about no-op commands, looping, and branching.
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21:37:34 <int-e> fizzie: the amazing bit is that I found that 29734 step configuration after 440k tries. I've generated, hmm, about a billion configurations without any improvement...
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21:41:23 <esolangs> [[Gaot++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90769&oldid=90260 * Anthonykozar * (+941) Added an example of how to multiply two numbers.
21:49:01 <int-e> Unless I'm having RNG troubles, hmm.
21:52:24 <int-e> But I don't think I do.
22:03:11 <esolangs> [[Snack]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90770&oldid=87608 * Larryrl * (+899)
22:03:48 <esolangs> [[Snack]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90771&oldid=90770 * Larryrl * (+0) /* ANOTHER SIMPLE INTERPRETER */
22:04:45 <esolangs> [[Snack]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90772&oldid=90771 * Larryrl * (-2)
22:08:06 <esolangs> [[Snack]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90773&oldid=90772 * Larryrl * (-7) /* Another simple interpreter */
22:08:33 <esolangs> [[Snack]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90774&oldid=90773 * Larryrl * (-1) /* Another simple interpreter */
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23:57:25 <fizzie> I don't get why this one (horizontal bar) chart just loses all data if I set the X axis scale to logarithmic. It happens normally if there's 0s in it, but this time the bounds are [1.6e-5, 0.42], which should be just fine. And the values are floats. And there's no NaNs.
23:57:30 <fizzie> Would be nice to get some sort of an error message.
23:59:05 <fizzie> Oh, it does in fact print logs to the console.
23:59:30 <fizzie> "Cannot stack non-linear scale (log)." Doesn't say anything at all to me, but maybe it's searchable.
2021-12-13
00:01:47 <fizzie> Oh, it's something to do with the fact that I encode one thing as color and another as the Y axis, so it produces what's nominally a "stacked" bar chart, even though it happens to be the case that one implies the other, and none of the "stacks" have more than one thing.
00:03:08 <fizzie> I'll just keep it linear.
00:03:18 <fizzie> I wonder if there's a lot of bad maths puns about "keeping it real".
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00:43:51 <esolangs> [[User:Roc0ast3r]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90775 * Roc0ast3r * (+16) Created page with "i made [[Mmiri]]"
00:52:40 <esolangs> [[Talk:1L]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90776&oldid=90719 * Oerjan * (+206) /* Category */ Apparently yes
00:54:42 <esolangs> [[1L]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90777&oldid=35032 * Oerjan * (-104) /* See also */ I must have missed the "two-dimensional" part back when I added this.
01:05:59 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90778&oldid=90664 * Nxe * (+10) Added can language to language list
01:29:38 <esolangs> [[Campbell]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90779 * Doesthiswork * (+562) new joke language
01:30:15 <esolangs> [[Campbell]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90780&oldid=90779 * Doesthiswork * (+15) /* Example programs */
01:31:23 <esolangs> [[Campbell]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90781&oldid=90780 * Doesthiswork * (-45) /* Example programs */
01:31:33 <oerjan> !
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01:42:18 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90782&oldid=90715 * PixelatedStarfish * (+101) /* External Links */
01:44:50 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90783&oldid=90782 * PixelatedStarfish * (+88) /* External Links */
01:45:05 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90784&oldid=90783 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* Dictionary Sources */
01:45:15 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90785&oldid=90784 * PixelatedStarfish * (+1) /* Dictionary Sources */
01:45:42 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90786&oldid=90785 * PixelatedStarfish * (+27) /* External Links */
01:47:13 <esolangs> [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90787&oldid=90786 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* External Links */
01:48:13 <esolangs> [[Beatnik]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90788&oldid=71310 * PixelatedStarfish * (+27) /* External resources */
01:49:12 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90789&oldid=89782 * PixelatedStarfish * (-96) /* Unimplemented Languages */
01:49:25 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90790&oldid=90789 * PixelatedStarfish * (+95) /* Implemented Languages */
02:57:58 <esolangs> [[Binary ///]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90791&oldid=90438 * Pppery * (+27)
03:06:10 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90792&oldid=90725 * Squidmanescape * (-109)
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04:27:29 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90793&oldid=90792 * Squidmanescape * (-327)
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06:50:21 <esolangs> [[Splinter]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90794&oldid=40481 * Im-a-user * (+51) Added newer interpreter
06:50:41 <esolangs> [[Splinter]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90795&oldid=90794 * Im-a-user * (+6)
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09:17:04 <esolangs> [[Another Finite State Brainfuck]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90796&oldid=90690 * Oshaboy * (+2)
10:10:05 <esolangs> [[Subleq]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90797&oldid=89560 * Oshaboy * (+0) typo
10:10:22 <esolangs> [[Tandem]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90798&oldid=75629 * Oshaboy * (+0) typo
10:11:10 <sprout> https://github.com/egel-lang/aoc-2021/blob/main/day13/task2.eg <- day 13, task2, egel solution. just waste cycles on it
10:12:45 <sprout> https://pasteboard.co/WUoK7G5rKdWk.png <- with colors!
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11:23:13 <esolangs> [[Confusion]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90799&oldid=46924 * H3LL * (-1) removed wrong semicolon from if statement
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11:43:46 <fizzie> Unsurprisingly for Burlesque it takes more code to do the parsing/outputting than the task. I've got "\n\n";;p^',' r~ps2coj"[xy]|[0-9]+"~?2.+^prij"y"=={J0!!2.-ab2j.-0sa}j0jr~j2jr~m[NBL[ for part 1 and "\n\n";;p^',' r~ps2coj"[xy]|[0-9]+"~?2coj+]{^prij"y"=={J0!!2.-ab2j.-0sa}j0jr~j2jr~m[}r[JJ)-]>]+.' j.*XXj)[~>]+..*+]{'#D!}r[)\[uN for part 2.
11:57:24 <fizzie> Oh, SetAt works on a string too? Well, that shortens the printing bit from JJ)-]>]+.' j.*XXj)[~>]+..*+]{'#D!}r[)\[uN to JJ)-]>]+.' j.*j)[~>]+..*+]{'#D!}r[uN at least.
12:03:22 <fizzie> And for making the empty block of spaces, Jtp)>]?ip^' j.*j.* is shorter than JJ)-]>]+.' j.*j)[~>]+..* -- I should stop staring at this.
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12:56:22 <esolangs> [[^^ 16h 35014ng 15 th15]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90800&oldid=90553 * Epidemic7 * (+1)
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13:27:27 <esolangs> [[Niblet]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90801&oldid=79184 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+163) Added a hyperlink to my implementation of niblet on GitHub and changed the category tag Unimplemented to Implemented.
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13:46:13 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90802&oldid=90666 * GingerIndustries * (+233) /* Instruction table */
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14:13:55 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90803&oldid=90802 * GingerIndustries * (+31) /* Constants */
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14:15:30 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90804&oldid=90803 * GingerIndustries * (+157) /* Instruction table */
14:15:53 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90805&oldid=90804 * GingerIndustries * (+20) /* Constants */
14:18:12 <river> i find it amazing that you are doing this stuff fizzie !
14:18:19 <river> you're really working hard solving all these
14:18:29 <river> i did only 8 days and stoped
14:18:47 <river> the code looks extremely compact and interesting too, although I can't read this language
14:18:57 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90806&oldid=90805 * GingerIndustries * (+35) /* Constants */
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14:25:33 <fizzie> As with many languages, Burlesque is a lot easier to write than read.
14:26:54 <fizzie> Getting rid of the "[xy]|[0-9]+" regex for parsing the folds got part 1 down to "\n\n";;p^',' r~ps2cojln-]J:><rij'y~[{J0!!2.-ab2j.-0sa}j0jr~j2jr~m[NBL[ where 'y~[ is "contains the character 'y'" and :><ri is "filter string for any digits and parse as integer".
14:28:52 <river> hah
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15:14:17 <Sgeo> `olist 1250
15:14:19 <HackEso> olist <https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1250.html>: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas
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15:35:52 <sprout> I am amazed at fizzie too!
15:36:00 <sprout> now give me some compliments
15:36:06 <sprout> this is _hard_ work
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15:40:06 <Franciman> ggwp sprout
15:40:43 <sprout> a compliment in burlesque? all I could ever hoped for!
15:40:50 <sprout> lemme google that
15:41:20 <sprout> oh right. thanks!
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20:32:40 <esolangs> [[User:Threesodas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90807&oldid=87653 * Threesodas * (+289)
20:53:46 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Bomoko * New user account
21:03:58 <esolangs> [[Unlabels]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90808 * Threesodas * (+1942) Created page with "[[Category:Joke_languages]] [[Category:2021]] "''Why sit around and think of a label?''" is the tag line of '''Unlabels''', the language that follows C syntax (almost) where y..."
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21:21:23 <esolangs> [[Laddermaker]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90809 * Threesodas * (+877) Created page with "Ever wanted to climb a ladder?<br> With laddermaker you can achieve your dreams.<br> First we must create a step +--+ which represents our very beginning.<br> Next we need st..."
21:21:50 <esolangs> [[Laddermaker]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90810&oldid=90809 * Threesodas * (+46)
21:22:16 <esolangs> [[Laddermaker]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90811&oldid=90810 * Threesodas * (+39)
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21:27:12 <river> interesting optimization problem came up
21:27:36 <river> lets say 00, 01, 10, 11 are all 4 yibs
21:27:53 <river> and we have a 8 bit word aabbcc00
21:27:58 <river> a,b,c are all different yibs
21:28:06 <river> the goal is to calculate the missing yib
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21:29:44 <river> I think that one algorithm is to map aa to aa000000, bb to 00bb0000, etc.
21:30:02 <river> or even aa to 1, bb to 10, cc to 100
21:30:14 <river> that reduces it to finding a missing bit
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23:29:56 <zzo38> One way might be to XOR them together, maybe. The optimization might also depend what instruction set is in use too, some might have a more efficient way for some kind of bit manipulations, than others will have (for any kind of bit manipulations, not only this one)
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23:34:32 <fizzie> Sounded like a use case for a 64-element look-up table to me.
23:36:04 <zzo38> Yes, that would also work.
23:36:09 <fizzie> (Also, I thought two bits was a crumb?)
23:36:17 <fizzie> I guess it's not that established as a term.
23:36:28 <zzo38> Yes, I also read that "crumb" somewhere, too
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23:43:03 <esolangs> [[A.R.T.I.C.L.E.]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90812&oldid=82877 * SoicBR * (+1) Updated link to the new official interpreter
23:46:46 <int-e> more adventure in dumbo octopus land: there are *long* loops: https://paste.debian.net/1223336/
23:48:18 <fizzie> I'm kind of happy I didn't get stuck exploring that. :)
23:49:23 <fizzie> Not that byte-shaving Burlesque solutions is particularly more productive. (Day 13 part 1 now at ln{""};;^p-]J'y~[s0:><s1{',;;Jg0!!g1|-abg1j|-g0sa}m[NBL[ after some more work.)
23:51:42 <int-e> fizzie: I can stop any time!!!1
23:53:08 <fizzie> Kind of feels like there's probably some shorter way of saying {...}m[NBL[ but not sure what it'd be.
23:53:54 <int-e> fizzie: I'm not sure which is worse though... hyperoptimizing a toy problem or exploring the intricacies of Burlesque :)
23:54:31 <fizzie> Huh, weird: sa (which is normally SetAt, ( block e idx -- block ), setting the idx'th element to e) also has the function of JL[, as in, dup length.
23:55:18 <fizzie> There's four `JL[` sequences in my solutions so far, which can all be replaced by `sa`.
23:55:24 <fizzie> That's so arbitrary.
23:55:38 <fizzie> (Maybe "sa" is in fact short for "so arbitrary".)
23:59:06 <int-e> fizzie: basically I got annoyed that my program didn't collect *any* statistics, so now it tracks averages and loops: 52.9% of initial configurations loop eventually (without synchronizing); those that do synchronize take an average of 166.6 steps to do so; average loop length is 72.8
23:59:32 <fizzie> Have you considered plotting charts of these statistics?-)
23:59:34 <int-e> the next step would be collecting actual distributions... and I think I'll pass
2021-12-14
00:01:10 <int-e> at least for now, since I actually do have another useless thing to work on
00:13:42 <fizzie> I probably need to downsample those stats, because I've got less than two days worth of data (at the 5 minute granularity), but the HTML files are already 4.5M.
00:15:01 <fizzie> Though the thing is, it needs more resolution at the start. Maybe I could keep 5-minute data for the first day after unlock, then hourly data for the first week, and then daily for the rest.
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00:24:48 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * MiguelEX3 * New user account
00:53:05 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * New user account
00:57:09 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90813&oldid=90721 * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * (+303)
01:07:07 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90814&oldid=90813 * MiguelEX3 * (+284)
01:08:03 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck implementations]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90815&oldid=90017 * MiguelEX3 * (+154) Adding Brainoof Interpreter
01:12:37 <esolangs> [[AnalLang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90816 * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * (+20461) Created page with "AnalLang is an esoteric joke programming language made by Unzor. Its interpreter is written in Node.js, and the language itself is the emojis "" repeated in a sequence..."
01:17:56 <esolangs> [[AnalLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90817&oldid=90816 * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * (+130)
01:18:45 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Monotools * New user account
01:30:33 <esolangs> [[AnalLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90818&oldid=90817 * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * (+76)
01:38:03 <esolangs> [[AnalLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90819&oldid=90818 * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * (+857)
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03:47:43 <esolangs> [[Staircasemaker]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90820 * Threesodas * (+2207) Created page with "[[Category:Joke_languages]] [[Category:2020]] [[ '''staircasemaker''' is the sequel to '''laddermaker''' (''staircasemaker'' is often referred to as '''[[laddermaker]]++''').<..."
03:48:05 <esolangs> [[Staircasemaker]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90821&oldid=90820 * Threesodas * (-5)
03:49:00 <esolangs> [[Unlabels]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90822&oldid=90808 * Threesodas * (+38)
03:54:46 <esolangs> [[User:Threesodas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90823&oldid=90807 * Threesodas * (+73)
03:54:55 <esolangs> [[User:Threesodas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90824&oldid=90823 * Threesodas * (-1)
03:55:19 <esolangs> [[Backsharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90825&oldid=82595 * Threesodas * (-37)
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04:25:24 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90826&oldid=90724 * Squidmanescape * (-22) /* Implementation Planned */
04:26:32 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90827&oldid=90826 * Squidmanescape * (+22)
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04:44:43 <esolangs> [[Suzy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90828&oldid=16324 * Squidmanescape * (-12) If it can represent Brainfuck, isn't it Turing-complete?
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04:52:25 <esolangs> [[Aheui Turing-completeness proof]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90829&oldid=90720 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+0) Replaced placeholder characters
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07:43:28 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90830&oldid=90793 * Squidmanescape * (+2194)
07:45:22 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90831&oldid=90827 * Squidmanescape * (-396)
07:45:31 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90832&oldid=90831 * Squidmanescape * (+1) /* Special Pages */
07:45:47 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape/Unimplemented By Date]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90833 * Squidmanescape * (+297) Created page with "==Languages I Explicitly Won't Ever Implement== {| class="wikitable" |- ! Reason !! Applicable Languages |- | I don't understand the specifications. | [[(0)]], Turinf machin..."
07:45:57 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape/Unimplemented By Date]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90834&oldid=90833 * Squidmanescape * (+0) /* 1994 */
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08:02:14 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape/Unimplemented By Date]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90835&oldid=90834 * Squidmanescape * (+57) /* 1995 */
08:10:00 <esolangs> [[2Deadfish/Constants]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90836&oldid=90167 * Squidmanescape * (-18)
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10:40:33 <esolangs> [[MGIFOS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90837&oldid=75707 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+186) Reformatted some text as code and added a hyperlink to my implementation on GitHub.
10:41:31 <esolangs> [[BF+BF]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90838&oldid=90318 * Kaveh Yousefi * (-2) Changed the category tag Unimplemented to Implemented.
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11:35:04 <arseniiv> have a nice bye
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15:07:49 <esolangs> [[Ecstatic]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90839&oldid=88672 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+260) Added a hyperlink to my implementation of the Ecstatic programming language on GitHub.
15:16:15 <sprout> https://github.com/egel-lang/aoc-2021/blob/main/day14/task2.eg <- Advent of Code, day 14, task 2, solution in Egel. though dicts are overkill on this problem
15:16:18 <sprout> https://pasteboard.co/6fErCUImZtkF.png <- 'pretty' colors
16:18:49 <esolangs> [[So simple dollar]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90840 * Threesodas * (+772) Created page with "[[Category:Joke_languages]] [[Category:2021]] [[Category:Unusable_for_programming]] '''so simple dollar''' is among the simplest programming languages. It only uses <code>$</c..."
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16:19:57 <esolangs> [[So simple dollar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90841&oldid=90840 * Threesodas * (+30)
16:20:05 <esolangs> [[So simple dollar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90842&oldid=90841 * Threesodas * (-30)
16:20:36 <esolangs> [[So simple dollar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90843&oldid=90842 * Threesodas * (+38)
16:21:45 <esolangs> [[Staircasemaker]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90844&oldid=90821 * Threesodas * (-3)
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16:32:57 <esolangs> [[AnalLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90845&oldid=90819 * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * (+724)
16:33:54 <esolangs> [[AnalLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90846&oldid=90845 * UnzorTheLangDevGuy * (-2)
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19:03:00 <fizzie> Part 1 can be done quite compactly in Burlesque, I got lnJ2.-s0-]{J2CO{J{~!}j+]g0jfe[~[]~]}\mj[~[+}10E!f:)-]J>]j<].- without trying to optimize it at all.
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19:10:21 <fizzie> It's basically just for every consecutive pair (2CO), look up the rule that starts the same ({~!}j+]g0jfe), insert the new letter and recompose the word; repeat 10 times ({...}10E!), count letter frequences (f:)-]) and subtract the minimum from the maximum (J>]j<].-).
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19:24:06 <river> > (Also, I thought two bits was a crumb?)
19:24:08 <lambdabot> error:
19:24:08 <lambdabot> A section must be enclosed in parentheses
19:24:08 <lambdabot> thus: (I thought two bits was a crumb ?)
19:24:13 <river> ok good to know much better than my name
19:24:41 <fizzie> lambdabot, you're silly.
19:24:47 <river> xor is a nice idea
19:25:05 <river> like xor against 01010101 and then look for 11 in any of the 4 slots
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19:27:21 <fizzie> 00 ^ 01 ^ 10 = 11, 00 ^ 01 ^ 11 = 10, 00 ^ 10 ^ 11 = 01 and 01 ^ 10 ^ 11 = 00, so if you do really know the least significant two bits are always the missing ones, `x |= (x >> 6) ^ (x >> 4) ^ (x >> 2) & 3` will fill up the missing one.
19:28:04 <river> OMG :D
19:32:55 <fizzie> `` python3 -c 'tests = [0b01_11_10_00, 0b00_10_11_00, 0b11_01_00_00, 0b01_00_10_00]; print(list(f"{x|(x>>6^x>>4^x>>2)&3:08b}" for x in tests))' # just checking
19:32:56 <HackEso> ​['01111000', '00101101', '11010010', '01001011']
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19:42:19 <zzo38> What fizzie mention is like what was also what was my idea when I mention the XOR
19:45:07 <fizzie> Yes, to be clear, I only thought of that because of zzo38's comment on xor'ing them together.
19:45:28 <zzo38> OK
19:52:38 <fizzie> It does make sense; xor'ing together _all_ bitstrings of a given length N >= 2 must give 0 (because for each bit position, there are 2^N/2 ones, and that's even for N >= 2); and if you omit exactly one of them, that's the same as including that missing one twice, but on the other hand that's also the same as 0^missing, or just missing.
19:53:14 <river> fantastic
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20:13:07 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90847&oldid=90669 * Hakerh400 * (+91)
20:21:53 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90848&oldid=90814 * Lukalot * (+207) Introduce myself
20:22:13 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90849&oldid=90778 * Lukalot * (+13) Add Unilot to language list
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20:48:52 <zzo38> (On MMIX, a single MXOR instruction can be used.)
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21:01:22 <esolangs> [[Bananaban]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90850 * 1hals * (+1456) create
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21:18:41 <esolangs> [[Bananaban]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90851&oldid=90850 * 1hals * (+19) add reference to Set page
21:31:33 <fizzie> Meh, surely there must be a prettier way to turn a list like {{a x1} {b y1} {c z1} {a x2} {b y2} {a x3}} into {{a x1+x2+x3} {b y1+y2} {c z1}} than what I came up with, ><{-]j-]==}gb{)[~++j-]-]CL}[m.
21:33:33 <fizzie> Which basically has the steps {{a x1} {b y1} {c z1} {a x2} {b y2} {a x3}} → {{a x1} {a x2} {a x3} {b y1} {b y2} {c z1}} → {{{a x1} {a x2} {a x3}} {{b y1} {b y2}} {{c z1}}} → {{a x1+x2+x3} {b y1+y2} {c z1}}.
21:36:06 <b_jonas> fizzie: I think you could carryless multiply by 21, then right shift 6, then add 2, then bitwise and with 3 to get the missing number, but that's probably not the best method, it's just a particularly funny one
21:36:20 <b_jonas> for river's problem that is
21:36:31 <b_jonas> but test this before you use it, I may have got it wrong
21:41:53 <river> what :D
21:41:56 <river> why the heck would that work
21:49:41 <esolangs> [[A.R.T.I.C.L.E.]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90852&oldid=90812 * SoicBR * (+24)
21:53:17 <zzo38> Can GCC or other compilers optimize any C codes into MOR and MXOR instructions of MMIX (or other instruction sets that have those, if any (I think 64-bit WebAssembly might have)), even when not explicitly specified in the C code?
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23:07:45 <int-e> Oh cool, leaking memory is safe :-) https://doc.rust-lang.org/std/boxed/struct.Box.html#method.leak
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23:22:56 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90853&oldid=90847 * Hakerh400 * (+17837) Finally add the proof
23:23:39 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90854&oldid=90853 * Hakerh400 * (+2)
23:30:00 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400/Bijection between reals and the powerset of naturals]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90855&oldid=87875 * Hakerh400 * (+84)
2021-12-15
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00:46:44 <earendel> Int-e: would a language which can't produce memory leaks not be turing complete? .. what's the pupose? i don't understand "useful for data that lives for the remainder of the program’s life"
00:48:30 <oerjan> i think in some sense a language cannot be TC without having the potential for memory leaks
00:48:55 <oerjan> because you will be able to encode program for which it is _undecidable_ whether they leak memory
00:48:58 <oerjan> *+s
00:49:40 <oerjan> *will have to be
00:55:38 <int-e> earendel: depends on how you define a memory leak
00:56:44 <int-e> (garbage collectors use reachability from a certain set of roots that include global variables and the stack and the registers)
00:56:51 <int-e> (usually)
00:57:24 <int-e> So you can define "leak" relative to that approximation, and then deliberately leaking something feels a bit odd. It is, however, useful :)
00:57:35 <earendel> how can the purpose depend on how i define it. a usual goal is to avoid them.
00:58:02 <int-e> you can have a language that can't produce memory leaks and is TC
00:58:22 <int-e> if you define "leak" in terms of such a computable approximation.
00:58:34 <earendel> so what is a purpose of leaking memory be design.
00:58:39 <int-e> (approximation of... uhm... neededness)
00:59:16 <int-e> It's an escape hatch in a programming language that tends to underapproximate neededness.
00:59:40 <earendel> if you want to produce memory leaks, in order to test for possible consequences?
00:59:45 <int-e> (the compiler assumes something becomes not-needed if it can no longer see any reference to it...)
01:01:54 <int-e> Or is the question why I would want an object that I can no longer access? That's because there's a design pattern that attaches non-memory resources to objects in memory. Things like open files... or other kinds of handles... which I might *have* but which the compiler may not be able to connect to the memory object.
01:04:43 <int-e> The concrete instance I had is this: https://play.rust-lang.org/?version=stable&mode=debug&edition=2021&gist=9889c7441c66a1c1b918e69dca142a42
01:11:28 <int-e> And I realized that since I don't care about the SDL TTF library being deinitialized, I can just use Box.leak() to create a static reference to it and call it a day, establishing the abstraction boundary I wanted (only the ui object/class knows about SDL stuff)
01:29:27 <sprout> most of the early java libraries leaked. because people thought: hey, automatic memory management. great! no worries anymore
01:29:59 <sprout> turns out it makes sense to set references to null when you don't use them anymore
01:30:23 <sprout> otherwise you just keep consuming memory, worst case
01:30:51 <sprout> having gc != not needing to think about memory consumption anymore
01:31:32 <int-e> it's just a garbage collector, you still have to put your bags outside ;)
01:31:38 <sprout> right
01:32:10 <int-e> it was touted as "automatic memory management"... that term has to have died, mostly... at least where I cand see
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01:42:40 <b_jonas> oerjan: yes, but usually you want libraries that are reentrant in that they don't have global state and you can initialize a copy and deinitialize it properly, and when you deinitialize it, it cleans up all the memory that it used, and that's achievable (even automatically in a high-level language, though not necessarily in an efficient way) even while the library can be turing-complete
01:46:30 <ISO-4683-1> yeah memory leaks are a side product of tc components messing up, generally
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01:49:17 <ISO-4683-1> or a side effect of components messing up, i mean. a pda can leak memory by never using part of its stack, for example.
02:13:06 <earendel> or a Box::leak() method
02:16:07 <int-e> fizzie: oh I just realized how different the scales of the axes on the trajectory graph are
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02:43:46 <earendel> they axes of evil.
02:47:28 <earendel> constitute*
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04:47:26 <esolangs> [[Talk:Seed]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90856&oldid=46632 * Salpynx * (+1678) Ruby version of Seed converter
04:48:21 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90857&oldid=90830 * Squidmanescape * (+8)
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04:59:31 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Dtp09 * New user account
05:03:36 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90858&oldid=90848 * Dtp09 * (+204)
05:25:53 <oerjan> recent girl genius: somehow i had missed that the great cetacean previously pictured had arms
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08:22:28 <river> would love to read these comics i just always lose my place..
08:23:01 <int-e> there must be browser addons for this
08:23:17 <int-e> my personal "workflow" is that I bookmark the latest page that I've read
08:24:10 <int-e> (so... select comic in bookmark manager, by whatever name, bookmark when I'm caught up, remove old bookmark... it's actually less terrible than it sounds... or so I like to think)
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08:25:52 <zzo38> I had just edit an existing bookmark when I will need something like that, rather than deleting it.
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08:26:35 <int-e> uh that sounds cumbersome
08:27:29 <int-e> (as in: it takes way too many clicks or key presses to do a dozen times every day)
08:30:43 <zzo38> I don't do it a dozen times every day though, and at least in the cases I have done, it is easily to predict the URLs.
08:31:31 <int-e> Well, I do what I wrote a dozen times a day.
08:31:54 <zzo38> Still, being able to save session files might be helpful for this and other purposes; if you do not use the "save as" function then it can overwrite the file that you have opened with the new session data, but if you use "save as" then you can save the modified session in a new file instead.
08:32:13 <zzo38> Yes, I suppose your use is different.
08:32:59 <int-e> I'll readily admit that it's peculiar. But it works for me :)
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09:04:44 <BarryNL> Hi everyone!
09:04:48 <river> hi
09:05:25 <BarryNL> I am looking for programming language experts. I assume I am in the right place?
09:07:19 <river> which programming language
09:07:33 <BarryNL> My own one :)
09:08:03 <BarryNL> Sorry, I misunderstood.
09:08:25 <BarryNL> I meant experts of developing programming languages in general.
09:09:23 <river> right place
09:10:21 <BarryNL> I am looking for a enthousiast with programming language expertise who is willing to spend a few hours helping me with my own programming language idea.
09:14:15 <BarryNL> I realize that might already be a bit much to ask.
09:14:42 <river> yes im too lazy to get involved in anything
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09:16:05 <BarryNL> But you do have expertise in developing programming languages?
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09:16:38 <BarryNL> (or are you also to lazy to chat a bit? ;) )
09:16:53 <BarryNL> *too
09:17:25 <river> a bit
09:17:32 <river> i made a few interpreters and compilers
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09:18:35 <BarryNL> Also professionally or in your spare time?
09:18:44 <river> just fo fun
09:19:23 <BarryNL> Are there pages on esolangs.org for those? Where I might read about them?
09:23:08 <BarryNL> Or didn't you give them names?
09:23:57 <BarryNL> Were they procedural or declarative programming languages?
09:26:54 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90859&oldid=90857 * Squidmanescape * (+2297)
09:27:05 <esolangs> [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90860&oldid=90859 * Squidmanescape * (-32) /* Implementation */
09:29:59 <BarryNL> Do you know any other place where I might find someone with expertise on programming language development?
09:37:16 <BarryNL> Is the discord more active?
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10:18:45 <esolangs> [[Talk:Seed]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90861&oldid=90856 * Salpynx * (-2) /* Ruby version of the reference Seed converter */ tidy range
10:30:48 <BarryNL> Mmm...discord account requires phone number. That's annoying.
10:32:02 <int-e> oh yeah the ubiquitous "second factor"
10:32:21 <int-e> which in reality is more of a "globally unique id" (at least for most people and the next half year)
10:35:20 <BarryNL> They probably just want to farm my data for commercial purposes. Or is discord non-commercial.
10:36:20 <b_jonas> BarryNL: you don't seem to understand how internet forums work. you can't get people to pre-commit to helping you. instead, you have to show your work. write down what you already have, and the problems that you need help with, with as many specifics as possible. put it somewhere that we can read, and then maybe someone gets interestd.
10:37:05 <BarryNL> Thanks jonas_b, I understand.
10:37:07 <b_jonas> BarryNL: if you have a specific question that's quick to explain in a few lines, you can just ask it here directly; otherwise I recommend putting all the info on a website, such as our wiki. design specifications, source code, whatever you have.
10:44:21 <BarryNL> jonas_b: Ok, thanks for pointing that out. I am willing to invest, so I will create a page on the wiki. I already have quite some resources (syntax, code, tests) so that should not be a problem.
10:45:47 <BarryNL> I am not looking for people to commit, just people with knowledge giving some feedback.,ecause although I am
10:47:04 <BarryNL> convinced I have something nice, I realize that is bot at all
10:47:33 <BarryNL> (damn small keyboard on my phone, sorry)
10:48:10 <BarryNL> nevermind, I'll create the wiki. Thanks!
10:53:32 <b_jonas> oh, and we shouldn't forget this tradition
10:53:34 <b_jonas> `welcome BarryNL
10:53:38 <HackEso> BarryNL: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <https://esolangs.org/>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.)
10:54:04 <BarryNL> Thanks!
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11:15:26 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * BarryNL * New user account
11:16:24 <BarryNL> Nice CAPTCHA with Befunge! First tried to do it by hand, but then decided to just run the code.
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11:24:27 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90862&oldid=90858 * BarryNL * (+344) Introduced myself.
11:44:54 <esolangs> [[Posset]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90863 * BarryNL * (+628) Created page with "'''Posset''' is the perfect programming language according to user [[BarryNL]] and the name is an abbreviation from '''''Pos'''sibility '''Set'''''. Its features: * [https://..."
11:59:17 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90864&oldid=90849 * BarryNL * (+13) Adding Posset to the Language list.
12:12:57 <esolangs> [[Posset]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90865&oldid=90863 * BarryNL * (+295) Adding some categories.
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12:15:31 <esolangs> [[Posset]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90866&oldid=90865 * BarryNL * (+5) Correctly refer to my username.
12:16:15 <esolangs> [[Posset]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90867&oldid=90866 * BarryNL * (+34) Try again.
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12:40:03 <esolangs> [[Posset]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90868&oldid=90867 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-147) Use wikilinks
12:40:27 <esolangs> [[Posset]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90869&oldid=90868 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+5) user
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13:28:39 <esolangs> [[Posset]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90870&oldid=90869 * BarryNL * (+1487) Adding a first introduction.
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14:04:26 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90871&oldid=90864 * GingerIndustries * (+11) /* A */
14:06:13 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90872&oldid=90806 * GingerIndustries * (+139)
14:06:41 <esolangs> [[Category:Programming languages using polish notation]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90873 * GingerIndustries * (+0) Created blank page
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14:31:06 <esolangs> [[Posset]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90874&oldid=90870 * BarryNL * (+2915) Added variable and runtime description.
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15:02:15 <esolangs> [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90875&oldid=90872 * GingerIndustries * (+530)
15:02:15 <esolangs> [[Posset]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90876&oldid=90874 * BarryNL * (+569) Adding disclaimer.
15:03:54 <esolangs> [[Posset]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90877&oldid=90876 * BarryNL * (+1) Move contents upward.
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15:24:07 <esolangs> [[Knight]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90878&oldid=85585 * GingerIndustries * (+58)
15:31:06 <esolangs> [[Talk:Posset]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90879 * Corbin * (+270) Take a guess at the formalism.
15:39:53 <esolangs> [[Posset]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90880&oldid=90877 * BarryNL * (+2244) Adding some examples of the syntax.
16:09:03 <esolangs> [[Posset]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90881&oldid=90880 * BarryNL * (+693) Adding the performance section.
16:12:52 <BarryNL> Hi all, I have started a description of the Posset language on the esolangs wiki. As I mentioned before, I am looking for feedback from other experts or enthousiasts, because I am still convinced myself
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16:13:20 <BarryNL> that it is a revolutionary idea :)
16:18:57 <Corbin> BarryNL: I left a link on the talk page. I'm wondering about the relationship to probability monads, particularly when implemented as clouds of samples.
16:19:45 <Corbin> The ideas with logic programming are interesting. The main obstacle I envision is that unifying two probability distributions is undecideable (I think?)
16:20:45 <BarryNL> Hi Corbin, thanks! I am not familiar with the talk page, so I'll take a look.
16:23:04 <BarryNL> Aha, found it. I'll take a look. I am not that familiar with monads, so not sure if I understand it.
16:26:31 <Corbin> Then this paper might not be especially easy either: http://webyrd.net/scheme-2013/papers/HemannMuKanren2013.pdf
16:27:05 <Corbin> But, given how often monads can be composed, I wonder whether there is some sort of logic+probability monad which combines the two approaches.
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