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00:53:09 -!- ehird has set topic: UTC leap second tomorrow, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60.
00:53:15 <ehird> (leave that there :P)
00:59:31 <ehird> It's easy enough to fix xntpd. It's also easy to fix localtime() to handle leap seconds. In fact, some vendors have already adopted Olson's time library.
00:59:31 <ehird> The main obstacle is POSIX. POSIX is a ``standard'' designed by a vendor consortium several years ago to eliminate progress and protect the installed base. The behavior of the broken localtime() libraries was documented and turned into a POSIX requirement.
00:59:35 <ehird> Fortunately, the POSIX rules are so outrageously dumb---for example, they require that 2100 be a leap year, contradicting the Gregorian calendar---that no self-respecting engineer would obey them.
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10:17:32 <oerjan> we go forward in leaps and bounds
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14:27:22 <ehird> gah quicklog doesn't fix the joinpart timestamps
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14:30:37 <ehird> anyone wanna help me fix that
14:42:59 <ehird> [[Debian GNU/Linux was the first project to be deliberately modelled on the principles of distributed software development]] what
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15:21:05 <ehird> AnMaster: i don't think you follow the erlang programming rules :D http://www.erlang.se/doc/programming_rules.shtml#HDR11
15:21:35 <AnMaster> ehird, I don't program defensively in erlang
15:21:50 <ehird> hm. why do you program defensively elsewhere, then?
15:21:58 <ehird> the rule there doesn't seem to apply specifically just to erlang.
15:22:03 <AnMaster> ehird, I don't really, I try to apply checks only where needed
15:22:23 <ehird> i seem to remember cfunge having quite a bit of that, it's ages since I looked at it though.
15:22:27 * ehird likes offensive programming
15:22:40 <ehird> ("try to make bad programs crash")
15:22:52 <AnMaster> ehird, hm? It *does* check for division by zero of course, since the funge specs state that
15:22:54 <ehird> e.g. there's a non-null-terminated string library, so it puts Z right at the end of the string
15:23:04 <ehird> so that programs that try and use it null-terminated will always break
15:23:12 <ehird> (because a lot of the time, there might be a \0 at the end by chance)
15:23:25 <AnMaster> ehird, nice, what is the name of that library?
15:23:37 <AnMaster> also I think <length>data is much saner
15:23:43 <ehird> I'm not sure, I think maybe a few of them do it. I read that code first in one of djb's libraries, I think.
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15:24:33 <ehird> It'd be nice if there was a debugger suited to offensive & non-defensive programming; instead of a step-through model it'd just dump as much info as it could in a nice format when the program crashes.
15:25:01 <ehird> (gdb ./p;start;cont;bt) partially achieves that.
15:25:47 * ehird searches for the lib he found the 'Z' in
15:25:48 <AnMaster> ehird, well core dumps is quite like that
15:26:13 <ehird> AnMaster: What I'm thinking is more like - being able to view the callstack, view the local variables at each point of the callstack
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15:26:39 <AnMaster> ehird, anyway the "defensive programming" in cfunge, I guess you could call assert() that, but that is just for debugging since release builds won't have those checks
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15:26:45 <AnMaster> and they *did* help catch a few bugs
15:27:05 <ehird> AnMaster: wouldn't they have even without the assert()? I mean:
15:27:12 <ehird> 1. if it's bad input, it'll crash your program anyway
15:27:17 <ehird> 2. why are you passing bad input to it?
15:27:30 <ehird> It should either come from inside your program or have been checked when it was receieved
15:27:52 <ehird> so assert() catches the "it comes from directly inside my program, but I made an error in calling it, and also it will just mess things up instead of crashing the program"
15:27:52 <AnMaster> ehird, I don't, the asserts are to check for bugs, like "current top of stack > size of stack", bugs *do* happen
15:27:57 <ehird> which seems quite a small case
15:28:31 <AnMaster> but better end that early than hard to debug memory corruption later
15:28:51 <ehird> thank gawd for out-of-band error signaling.
15:30:17 -!- ehird has set topic: UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60.
15:30:22 <AnMaster> huh, wasn't there one only last year or so?
15:30:23 -!- ehird has set topic: UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/.
15:30:29 <ehird> AnMaster: 2005 i think
15:30:39 <AnMaster> ah, well time files when you get older ;P
15:30:57 <ehird> i am going to try and run as many time-related programs on this machine as possible
15:31:02 <ehird> and maybe screenshot at the right moment
15:31:05 <ehird> to see how many manage it XD
15:31:21 <AnMaster> ehird, hm? I think ntp or such will just correct it a bit later
15:31:33 <AnMaster> such as jumping backwards a second a bit later
15:31:37 <ehird> AnMaster: posix specifies that leap seconds are explicitly ignored
15:31:49 <ehird> but apparently a lot of systems just ignore posix on that point because it's stupid
15:32:01 <ehird> (apparently POSIX specifies 2100 as a leap year.)
15:32:12 <AnMaster> ehird, hm, what exactly does "explicitly ignored" mean for leap seconds?
15:32:28 <ehird> AnMaster: "the second field is never 60"
15:32:35 <ehird> iirc a lot of systems handle that by _repeating time_
15:32:51 <ehird> it goes to 23:59:59.9, then back to 23:59:59.0
15:33:32 <ehird> AnMaster: that should be unix-alikes' new marketing strategy
15:33:36 <ehird> "So powerful you could TRAVEL THROUGH TIME"
15:33:52 <ehird> I'm going to find out, aren't I?
15:34:04 <ehird> Probably I should set my system clock forward and test, but that's cheating.
15:34:27 <AnMaster> iirc I did some test in 2005, and found out that the system just went on and then ntp corrected the time backwards with one second a few minutes after
15:35:00 <ehird> hooray for standards-specified idiocy
15:35:26 <ehird> AnMaster: ah, the "no functions" thing?
15:35:50 <ehird> that's not a dlsym stupidity, that's a "funcptrs don't neccessarily go in anything but a funcptr"
15:36:17 <ehird> AnMaster: posix gives functions as an example though http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/009695399/functions/dlsym.html
15:36:25 <ehird> but while it's valid posix
15:36:30 <AnMaster> well there are systems where sizeof(function pointer) != sizeof(data pointer)
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15:36:41 <AnMaster> but posix doesn't support them
15:36:44 <ehird> the correct solution is a dlsym specifically for functions.
15:37:14 <ehird> and maybe a nice wrapper that returns a struct{int type;union{void *var;blah *func}data;}
15:38:53 <AnMaster> The ISO C standard does not require that pointers to functions can be cast back and forth to
15:38:53 <AnMaster> pointers to data. However, POSIX-conforming implementations are required to support this, as
15:38:53 <AnMaster> noted in Section 2.12.3 (on page 541). The result of converting a pointer to a function into a
15:38:53 <AnMaster> pointer to another data type (except void *) is still undefined, however.
15:39:16 <AnMaster> Note that compilers conforming to the ISO C standard are required to generate a warning if a
15:39:16 <AnMaster> conversion from a void * pointer to a function pointer is attempted as in:
15:39:16 <AnMaster> fptr = (int (*)(int))dlsym(handle, "my_function");
15:39:29 <ehird> I suggest we assassinate the POSIX writers.
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15:42:14 <AnMaster> ehird, what would you prefer? win32 api being standard?
15:42:31 <AnMaster> I suspect that it would get even worse without posix
15:42:48 <ehird> I'm pretty sure people wrote cross-platform programs before POSIX, didn't they? :P
15:43:07 <AnMaster> ehird, yeah they did, with lots and lots of #ifdef
15:43:08 <ehird> Alternatively: how about an open effort to create a standard that doesn't require violating the C standard
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15:43:43 <AnMaster> ehird, and good idea, just one change needed: dlfunc() dldata()
15:44:05 <ehird> AnMaster: Okay, then they can get rid of all the POSIX cruft.
15:44:09 <ehird> Maybe fix the datetime stuff. :-
15:45:09 <ehird> Incidentally, I invented a weird game.
15:46:10 <AnMaster> ehird, 1) yes POSIX is quite good in many parts, a cleanup of it would be the best way 2) what game?
15:46:28 <ehird> Every player guesses a number. The winner is the player who guessed the number closest to the average (mean or median or whatever, I dunno) of all the guesses.
15:46:53 <ehird> Your guess may be initially best, but when it's entered, it may change the average, thus becoming less accurate.
15:49:40 <AnMaster> ehird, what if all players are equally close?
15:49:51 <ehird> That would be what we call a tie, AnMaster.
15:50:00 <AnMaster> but what are the rules in the game for that
15:50:30 <ehird> AnMaster: Just make an arbitrary rule
15:50:34 <ehird> like, whichever was higher
15:50:40 <ehird> if they're both equal... I dunno.
15:50:47 <ehird> AnMaster: do it as an elimination game
15:50:50 <AnMaster> you could have several rounds, the winner of each round wins one point, then what would happen in the case of a tie?
15:50:56 <ehird> each round, the player that made the furthest away guess is dropped
15:51:07 <ehird> if there are multiple with the furthest away, drop all of them
15:51:11 <AnMaster> (except I hate to play such games)
15:51:14 <ehird> when it's down to two...
15:51:39 <AnMaster> ehird, you could make many variations on this
15:51:48 <AnMaster> I think the concept has potential
16:02:48 <ehird> Incidentally, I use a piece of software written in Tcl every day/
16:03:18 <ehird> The whole thing -- right down to the portfiles -- is all tcl. It works great. (the portfiles look just like a homebrewed format; since Tcl is so freeform)
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16:17:23 <ehird> [[Jeffrey Mark Siskind, author of Stalin]]
16:17:43 <ehird> Meanwhile, I authored Hitler.
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16:20:35 <ehird> Huh, I think I'm having problems with emacs key bindings.
16:20:43 <ehird> That's odd, I rarely use emacs. Why would I be having issues?
16:21:07 <ehird> (Specifically, C-x C-f. No, I will not remap capslock to ctrl. ;P)
16:26:00 <AnMaster> ehird, eh what is the issue with C-x C-f exactly?
16:26:18 <ehird> AnMaster: Emacs pinkie, I believe it's called.
16:26:19 <AnMaster> it opens find file prompt in the minibuffer for me
16:26:39 <AnMaster> ehird, ah so no issue like "it doesn't work" or "it does the wrong thing"
16:26:39 <ehird> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Emacs#Emacs_Pinky
16:26:45 <ehird> It's not hurting, it's just awkward. :P
16:26:56 <AnMaster> ehird, it seems quite natural to me
16:27:09 <ehird> My hands are small, though.
16:27:14 <AnMaster> but I have big hands and this is a standard full size PC keyboard
16:27:34 <ehird> TextMate's completion shortcut is option-escape. I never use it for that erason.
16:27:50 <AnMaster> ehird, I can quite easily do Ctrl-Alt-Esc with one hand, iirc that was something used on pre-OS X macs
16:28:05 <ehird> i can do that but I have to contort my hands.
16:28:40 <ehird> http://www.google.com/search?q=define:contort
16:29:58 * ehird designates ~/Code/crap/foo.scm as his Chicken testpad.
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16:35:12 <ehird> http://chicken.wiki.br/sandbox Ooooooooh yes
16:35:46 <ehird> Shame about the lack of io tho.
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16:56:24 <AnMaster> hm chicken, isn't it r6rs iirc?
16:56:30 <AnMaster> or is it one of those that isn't
17:01:44 <ehird> It is a sideset of r5rs.
17:01:46 <ehird> (subset & superset)
17:02:02 <ehird> http://call-with-current-continuation.org/
17:02:11 <ehird> http://www.call-with-current-continuation.org/
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17:15:59 <ehird> 14:01:56 <oklokok> so cute i'm almost crying :)
17:37:39 <ehird> 15:12:32 <oklopol> i never understood these laws, at least 100% of 13-year-olds are having sex anyway
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18:11:55 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR KAZAKHSTAN.
18:12:12 <ehird> Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY OLD YEAR
18:12:21 -!- ehird has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY OLD YEAR.
18:12:41 * ehird steals oerjan's swatter
18:12:52 * ehird swats oerjan -----###
18:13:02 * oerjan watches ehird get eaten by the swatter
18:13:10 * ehird eats the swatter before it manages
18:13:22 <oerjan> it's distantly related to the Luggage, you see
18:13:55 * oerjan watches a big bump forming on ehird's stomach
18:15:15 * oerjan listens to something chewing inside ehird's stomach
18:15:33 <ehird> CAN'T CHEW A SINGULARITY
18:15:37 <oerjan> there _might_ be a bit of xenomorph in it, too
18:16:19 <oerjan> i'd say that was a singularly bad idea
18:16:30 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR BANGLADESH.
18:16:31 * ehird absorbs all light.
18:16:42 * ehird starts sucking in random shit and grows bigger.
18:17:04 * oerjan flies to the LHC to make an opposing hole
18:17:50 * ehird absorbs the LHC while it is turned on
18:18:00 <ehird> The black holes are trying to suck me in.
18:18:05 <ehird> But they are no match for I.
18:20:05 <oerjan> <ehird> ("try to make bad programs crash")
18:20:19 <oerjan> "try to make bad programs end life as we know it"
18:20:25 <oerjan> now _that's_ offensive
18:20:36 <ehird> Actually, that's what I'm doing right now as a black hole.
18:20:47 <oerjan> but, you're not a program
18:21:02 * oerjan retrieves his swatter from inside ehird
18:21:10 <ehird> You're in a black hole.
18:21:15 <ehird> how the fuck are you using the internet?
18:21:35 <oerjan> superluminal eta waves
18:21:42 <ehird> I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:BH-no-escape-3.svg
18:23:16 <ehird> 16:26:17 <lament> okay16:26:26 <lament> here's an actual question as opposed to a rant.16:28:21 <lament> nevermind16:28:24 <lament> here's some more ranting.
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18:29:53 <ehird> [20:18:57] < fizzie> we both have this weird habit of first writing a befunge interpreter when trying to learn a new language.
18:30:56 * oerjan did too, except with unlambda
18:32:56 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR INDIA.
18:33:12 <oerjan> one of those strange half-hour countries
18:35:18 <oerjan> freak natural accident?
18:42:19 <oerjan> <ehird> Your guess may be initially best, but when it's entered, it may change the average, thus becoming less accurate.
18:42:42 <oerjan> adding a guess equal to the average would tend not to change the average, at least for means
18:42:54 <ehird> oerjan: getting a guess -equal- to the average is very unlikely
18:42:57 <ehird> I'm talking about close to the average
18:43:21 <oerjan> if you add a number, the average is going to get closer to that number
18:43:34 <oerjan> so if it was closest, it must still be
18:43:52 <oerjan> probably true for median too
18:44:25 <oerjan> in fact that might be taken as an axiom for a reasonable average
18:45:32 <oerjan> have you heard about the mediocrity game?
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18:48:22 <oerjan> hmph why no google link
18:51:17 <oerjan> you'd think someone had purged the links :D
18:52:31 <oerjan> on level 0 everyone selects a number (1-10), say
18:52:41 <oerjan> the middle number wins that level
18:53:31 <oerjan> for level n: play m games of level n-1 mediocrity. the winner is the one with the middle number of n-1 wins
18:54:17 <oerjan> "The strategy for higher level games of mediocrity (3+) is extremely difficult."
18:54:24 <oerjan> http://everything2.com/title/Mediocrity
18:55:30 <ehird> oerjan: mine's cooler though.
18:55:38 <ehird> because it is meta about the actual bets
19:02:31 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR UZBEKISTAN.
19:03:03 -!- ehird has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR MOLVANIA.
19:05:48 <oerjan> rubbish. that's at least 3 hours yet
19:06:06 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR MALDIVES.
19:12:41 -!- ehird has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY BIRTHDAY MALDIVES.
19:32:16 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR AFGHANISTAN.
20:00:23 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR ARMENIA.
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20:07:32 <ehird> [02:36:28] < fizzie> hmm, got an idea. why not run all ietf drafts through a markov-process-like-word-mangler like the befunge psycho meta brain works. easy way to get an unlimited number of more internet-drafts.
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20:25:14 <Asztal> that amuses me because of the randomly-generated paper that got accepted into a conference this year.
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20:30:39 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR IRAN.
20:31:24 <oerjan> you really need to cheer up
20:39:52 <Asztal> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCIgen#Prominent_Results
20:40:05 <Asztal> I thought it was this year though, not 2005
20:40:40 <oerjan> yes it was on reddit recently
20:40:55 <oerjan> it was a computer generated paper
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20:41:52 <oerjan> oh it seems it was 2005. well typical of reddit
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21:01:26 <psygnisfive> 'On two occasions I have been asked,—"Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?" [...] I am not able rightly to comprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question.'
21:02:51 <ehird> psygnisfive: i read that quote when I was like in the womb.
21:03:08 <psygnisfive> i only just read it and i find it quite pithy
21:03:33 <ehird> it follows on from being indistinguishable from magic.
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21:04:25 <ehird> metazilla: are you the mooz_ of 2002 gone by?
21:04:48 <psygnisfive> ehird have you been around here since 2002?
21:05:02 <ehird> psygnisfive: no, but I have logs of dec 2002 from fizzie :P
21:05:10 <ehird> wish I was here in 2002 tho
21:05:25 <psygnisfive> i was gonna say, esoterica? when you were just 7? what nonsense is this
21:05:49 <ehird> birthday in august, so, 6
21:06:27 <ehird> under 16s here: ihope, deveah, ...
21:06:50 <ehird> psygnisfive: that's impossible, this place was way cooler then
21:06:57 <ehird> I mean, fizzie didn't use uppercase for chrissake
21:06:59 <ehird> that's the power of 2002
21:07:47 <ehird> I don't actually know how I typed when I was 6 (I didn't use any social communimacation machines on the interweb).
21:08:05 <psygnisfive> i didnt either but thats because when i was 6 we didnt have electricity
21:08:07 <ehird> But I typed basically all lower-case, punctuation-netspeak-clusterfuck of incoherency when I was 8.
21:08:35 <ehird> Reading back on what I said then, it was awful. I can't even figure out wtf I was saying.
21:08:43 <ehird> Needless to say, I was universally hated. :P
21:09:00 <psygnisfive> now it takes a more refined eye to detect your youth
21:10:01 <ehird> I was dreading my 13th birthday. Because non-retarded 13 year olds are slightly more common. :P
21:10:20 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR MADAGASCAR.
21:10:56 <psygnisfive> Madagascar 2 was a good movie, surprisingly
21:12:20 <oerjan> http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/warriorshtm/garble.htm
21:12:34 <psygnisfive> ehird have you seen my websites backgrounds?
21:13:00 <ehird> oerjan: no, I just came off as annoying and idiotic.
21:13:34 <psygnisfive> im considering using a massive 1D CA trace
21:14:10 <ehird> psygnisfive: just make it run game of life in the background.
21:14:25 <ehird> psygnisfive: pre-render it as an anigif
21:15:19 <ehird> psygnisfive: who cares
21:16:26 -!- metazilla has joined.
21:16:32 -!- moozilla has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
21:16:38 -!- metazilla has changed nick to moozilla.
21:18:42 <psygnisfive> as opposed to ones that use discrete time/space
21:18:51 -!- moozilla has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
21:18:55 -!- moozilla has joined.
21:20:35 <psygnisfive> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuous_spatial_automaton
21:21:45 <psygnisfive> continuous spatial automaton might describe the universe ;)
21:21:53 -!- ais523 has joined.
21:24:22 <ehird> YOU RUINED EVERYTHING
21:24:25 <oerjan> that's actually a genuine norwegian insult
21:24:32 <ehird> latsaup you, then.
21:24:49 <oerjan> or at least sounds like one
21:25:44 <ehird> [07:55:30] < lament> calamari: They're probably on crack, so your argument doesn't hold
21:26:04 <psygnisfive> http://handson.provocateuse.com/images/photos/christian_bale_10.jpg
21:31:30 <ehird> [02:47:45] < navigator> hey have any ascii anime porn links?
21:31:36 -!- moozilla has quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)).
21:39:04 <ehird> [20:14:16] < navigator> to use linux as the wa^H^Hgateway, mustn't i put 1 in /proc/sus^H^Hys/net/ipv4/ip_forward and that's it?
21:39:09 <ehird> those are literal ^Hs in the file
21:40:46 <oerjan> you mean those aren't attempts at irony?
21:40:59 <psygnisfive> choose something for me to use as my desktop
21:40:59 <oerjan> the wa^H shows some promise
21:41:22 <ehird> psygnisfive: generate a file with random noise pixels and use that
21:41:25 <ehird> 'swhat I did for a while
21:41:44 <ehird> no, random noise pixels
21:41:59 <ehird> psygnisfive: but multicolour.
21:42:03 <ehird> photoshop doesit :P
21:42:19 <ehird> it's awfully wonderful
21:42:56 <oerjan> that binary ring thing somehow disturbs me. take that.
21:44:40 <psygnisfive> i wonder what scales gaussian noise can be tiled at without looking repetetive
21:50:07 <psygnisfive> i need a way to script creating random noise
21:52:45 <psygnisfive> not impossible but its not as obvious as, say, 10px
22:03:58 -!- oerjan has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR ZAMBIA.
22:04:35 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined.
22:05:09 <oerjan> ah someone who hails from the future year 2009
22:05:25 <ais523> planning to celebrate the leap second?
22:09:24 <ehird> we will force you to.
22:10:09 <oerjan> don't worry, it will be a short torture
22:10:31 <oerjan> you mean star trek becomes real in 2009?
22:10:43 <psygnisfive> in 2009 we'll be flying around in space ships.
22:25:28 -!- kar8nga has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
22:33:55 <ehird> plz to be updating topicK?
22:34:27 -!- psygnisfive has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR GREAT ZIMBABWE.
22:34:45 <oerjan> there are no +1:30 timezones in the wp list
22:35:43 <psygnisfive> sinze +1:30 doesnt exist, we wish happy new year to an empire that doesnt exist
22:36:34 <oerjan> someone else should update next half hour as i will be going out to watch fireworks
22:49:25 <oerjan> i guess the :) means it's an exceptionally _good_ mood rather than the opposite
22:57:54 <ais523> who gets the happy new year at 23:00 UTC?
22:59:13 -!- psygnisfive has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR ALBANIA, ANDORRA, AUSTRIA, BELGIUM, BOSNIA AND HERZEGOVINA, CROATIA, CZECH REPUBLIC, DENMARK, FRANCE, GERMANY, GIBRALTAR, HUNGARY, ITALY, KOSOVO, LIECHTENSTEIN, LUXEMBOURG, MACEDONIA, MALTA, MONACO, MONTENEGRO, NETHERLANDS, NORWAY, POLAND, SAN MARINO, SERBIA, SLOVAKIA, SLOVENIA, SPAIN, EXCEPT CANARY ISLANDS, SV.
22:59:25 <ais523> psygnisfive: you're a few seconds early
22:59:46 <psygnisfive> HAPPY NEW YEAR ALBANIA, ANDORRA, AUSTRIA, BELGIUM, BOSNIA AND HERZEGOVINA, CROATIA, CZECH REPUBLIC, DENMARK, FRANCE, GERMANY, GIBRALTAR, HUNGARY, ITALY, KOSOVO, LIECHTENSTEIN, LUXEMBOURG, MACEDONIA, MALTA, MONACO, MONTENEGRO, NETHERLANDS, NORWAY, POLAND, SAN MARINO, SERBIA, SLOVAKIA, SLOVENIA, SPAIN, EXCEPT CANARY ISLANDS, SVALBARD AND JAN MAYEN, SWEDEN, SWITZERLAND, TUNISIA, VATICAN CITY, ALGERIA, ANGOLA, BENIN
22:59:46 <ehird> nobody cares about the logs
22:59:48 <psygnisfive> , BOUVET ISLAND, CAMEROON, CENTRAL AFRICAN REPUBLIC, CHAD, DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF THE CONGO, EQUATORIAL GUINEA, GABON, NIGER, NIGERIA, AND REPUBLIC OF THE CONGO!
22:59:51 <ehird> psygnisfive: BENIN-
23:00:16 -!- psygnisfive has set topic: Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/esoteric/ | UTC leap second today, Dec 31 @ 23:59:60 | try http://time.gov/ | HAPPY NEW YEAR OERJAN.
23:06:06 <oerjan> I'M OFFICIALLY A COUNTRY
23:06:26 <ais523> ehird: I care about the logs
23:06:56 <ais523> oerjan: oklopol is esolang programming
23:07:01 <ais523> therefore, this channel is actually about him
23:08:17 <oerjan> SVALBARD AND JAN MAYEN belong to norway, btw
23:09:09 <oerjan> jan mayen has our only volcano
23:11:42 * oerjan was going to say something about how countries with "democratic" in their names are rarely democratic
23:12:04 <ehird> oerjan: no more firevurkz?
23:12:19 <oerjan> then i checked up the republic of the congo without the democratic part and found out it's not much better
23:12:41 * oerjan decided fireworks are really stupid, especially when you need to go to the toilet
23:13:14 <ehird> man this place was so much better in 2002
23:13:18 <ehird> IT IS NOW 2002, OK
23:13:31 <ais523> no, it is officially 1993
23:13:34 <ais523> and has been all month
23:13:46 <ehird> it is exempted from eternal september
23:13:49 <ehird> oerjan: you can come.
23:14:03 <ehird> fizzie: calling you in.
23:14:07 <ehird> navigator, lament, mooz_: you too.
23:14:24 <ehird> #esoteric was basically just a conversation between fizzie, navigator and mooz_
23:14:30 <ehird> with lament and dbc occasionally butting in.
23:14:35 <ehird> they're talking about tibooks.,
23:14:44 <oerjan> AnMaster: i'll sneak you in the backdoor while ehird isn't looking :D
23:15:29 <oerjan> what's a tibook. any relation to springboks?
23:15:43 <ehird> Titanium Powerbook.
23:15:47 <ehird> From Apple computar.
23:16:03 <ehird> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerBook_G4
23:17:45 <oerjan> will eternal september end when the whole world has internet access?
23:17:51 <ehird> [23:22:07] < navigator> i'm not sure why to kill the neighbor's dog
23:18:16 <oerjan> because it's barking, or rather howling, half of the day
23:18:29 <oerjan> at least that's why _i_ want to kill the neighbor's dog
23:18:29 <ehird> [23:26:51] -!- mode/#esoteric [+o navigator] by ChanServ
23:18:42 <ehird> :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
23:18:53 <oerjan> and hasn't been seen for years?
23:18:53 <ehird> [23:27:58] < fizzie> IN SOVIET RUSSIA baby jesus makes os X and fvwm2 cry! (ok, that's it, no more /. for me)
23:18:57 <ehird> it was funny in 2002
23:19:21 <oerjan> i guess i'm still in 2002, as i laughed
23:20:17 <ehird> [00:31:37] < mooz_> hmm, esolang discussions are rather rare here
23:23:02 <ehird> Precedent PResident Prescient Creampuff Dreamstuff Green Spleen Mean Machine Bachine
23:23:04 <ehird> that is some machine
23:23:57 <oerjan> oh wait it is MOCHA in english
23:25:42 <ehird> [19:48:18] < IcemanX> Have you seen navigator?
23:25:42 <ehird> [19:49:20] < IcemanX> Hurry up please!
23:25:44 <ehird> [19:49:51] < IcemanX> Have you seen navigator?
23:25:46 <ehird> [19:50:04] < IcemanX> fizzie?
23:25:48 <ehird> thing with this is
23:25:50 <ehird> this guy comes in every few days
23:25:52 <ehird> and asks for navigator
23:25:54 <ehird> and never does anything else
23:25:57 <ehird> and they always miss each other by a few minutes
23:26:49 <oerjan> and no one notices that they look just the same except for glasses?
23:27:12 <psygnisfive> in phonology thatd be called complementary distribtion
23:27:27 <psygnisfive> which we'd use to infer that two things are really the same thing
23:27:50 <psygnisfive> obviously linguists in the Marvel universe is well aware of superman and clark kents sameness
23:27:55 <oerjan> another possibility is that navigator is psychic and _really_ doesn't want to see IcemanX
23:28:28 <oerjan> wrong universe, psygnisfive
23:28:54 <ehird> --- Day changed Wed Jan 01 2003
23:31:18 <ehird> [03:21:42] < lament> I am not the channel founder
23:31:18 <ehird> [03:22:01] < lament> navigator is.
23:31:20 <ehird> [03:22:09] * andreou == navigator
23:31:25 <ehird> I thought it was aardappel?????????????
23:32:44 <ehird> happy new year - 32 minutes
23:32:59 <ehird> happy new year - (60 - 32) minutes
23:33:04 <AnMaster> <oerjan> AnMaster: i'll sneak you in the backdoor while ehird isn't looking :D <-- ??
23:33:09 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined.
23:33:20 <ehird> we're going back to 2002
23:33:26 <ehird> when this place was cooler
23:33:31 <oerjan> AnMaster: you are not expected to understand this
23:33:53 <AnMaster> oerjan, I guess I was just a random victim then
23:34:03 <oerjan> no, i wouldn't say that
23:34:13 <AnMaster> oerjan, oh btw that wouldn't have worked I was just standing inside the backdoor around then
23:34:44 <AnMaster> oerjan, and I knew it was closed, too cold to have it open
23:34:55 <AnMaster> <ehird> happy new year - (60 - 32) minutes
23:35:00 <AnMaster> <ehird> happy new year + (60 - 32) minutes
23:35:08 <AnMaster> that would have worked for you
23:35:14 <ais523> AnMaster: happy 2008 for me. What's it like in 2009?
23:35:16 <ehird> it isn't new year yet here.
23:35:24 <ais523> I'm considering going there in about half an hour, could do with a review
23:35:34 <ehird> won't bother then.
23:35:39 <Warrigal> Happy hours away from the new year.
23:35:40 <AnMaster> ais523, however a very high amount of fireworks so far this year
23:35:55 <ais523> ehird: put it this way: AnMaster didn't recommend it, so I'd imagine you'd jump at the chance
23:36:01 <ehird> [05:29:40] * lament is away: my tarantula is molting!!!!
23:36:23 <AnMaster> ais523, hm would you say "counter clockwise" or "anti clockwise"
23:36:25 * ehird reading >3000 lines of logs from fizzie
23:36:42 <ais523> AnMaster: they're both correct, I hear anticlockwise more often
23:36:56 <ehird> i hear both the same
23:36:58 <ehird> I think it depends
23:37:02 <ehird> "turn the dial anticlockwise"
23:37:07 <ehird> "a reverse clock goes counterclockwise"
23:37:24 <ais523> ehird: nah, I'd say it went anticlockwise
23:37:27 <ais523> and therefore would be an anticlock
23:37:31 <ehird> ais523: that's because you suck
23:37:48 <AnMaster> it is like ned and ner in Swedish then (both means "down")
23:38:02 <oerjan> sheesh, an anticlock would make _time_ go backwards
23:38:19 <ehird> [18:05:22] -!- lament [~lament@h24-78-145-92.vc.shawcable.net] has joined ricotee
23:38:20 <ehird> [18:10:45] < lament> my tarantula molted!
23:38:30 <ehird> ricotee -> mangled #esoteric
23:38:33 <AnMaster> oerjan, and would cease to exist if it came in physical contact with a normal clock?
23:38:33 <ehird> vi is fucked up on this system
23:38:43 <oerjan> AnMaster: quite probably
23:38:46 <ais523> very messed up for you to typo it that badly
23:38:51 <AnMaster> ehird, I thought that was what vi always was
23:38:53 <ehird> not a typo, ais523
23:38:57 <ehird> vi actually displayed it as that
23:39:09 <ehird> I think it has miscalculated the number of columns in my terminal
23:39:11 * oerjan swats AnMaster -----###
23:39:28 <AnMaster> oerjan, oh you are not one of us enlightened emacs users?
23:39:36 <Warrigal> I used to think that counterclockwise is called counterclockwise because a counter clock goes that way.
23:39:52 * ehird has used both vi and emacs for months each.
23:39:56 <ehird> I prefer TextMate.
23:40:12 <ehird> psygnisfive: shut up, you're making me look bad by association.
23:40:31 <ehird> that is not shutting up.
23:40:52 <oerjan> all that moaning is rather noisy
23:40:53 <ais523> I use emacs as my main programming editor, gedit for quick notes, and vi every now and then (normally over ssh or telnet)
23:41:09 <ais523> vi is fine, just I haven't really got to know it yet
23:41:54 <AnMaster> emacs and kate for programming; kdevelop for programming too, but not as often; nano for quick config editing as root or over ssh
23:42:17 <ehird> i use emacs for lisp and haskell.
23:43:10 <ais523> AnMaster: vi is pretty much a universal editor for UNIX-alikes, and it fits in hardly any disk space
23:43:13 <ais523> which care good reasons to know it
23:43:28 <ais523> sometimes I use systems which don't have enough disk space to fit emacs on them
23:58:50 <oerjan> PLEASE BRACE FOR UPCOMING LEAP SECOND
23:58:55 <ais523> oerjan: is time.gov down?
23:58:58 <ais523> I can't seem to access it
23:59:15 <ais523> just didn't work the first time for some reason