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01:05:29 <ehird> hey guys remember when psygnisfive called us all kids? that was funny
01:05:57 <psygnisfive> hopefully you dont think im using that in reference to your respective ages.
01:07:13 <psygnisfive> i call everyone "kids" or "children" for mostly humorous effect because of its odd inappropriateness from me (as i'm not in a position to call others kids, given that im only 22). its postmodern humor, ehird.
01:08:09 <psygnisfive> and if you get the jimmy carr reference in that, i love you forever and ever.
01:08:27 <ehird> hey guys remember when psygnisfive reacted to a joke with 5 long lines? that was funny
01:09:18 <psygnisfive> ehird: im bored. tell me about some new and interesting esolang.
01:12:48 <psygnisfive> nopol has never been much explained to me. i've never heard of muture.
01:13:17 <psygnisfive> well.. then i'll NEVER get an explanation :p
01:13:19 <ehird> oklopol makes pretty much all of the interesting esolangs nowadays
01:22:09 <kerlo> I'll have to make another esolang one of these days.
01:23:38 <psygnisfive> something that takes BF and comes up with bizarre but TC derivations
01:24:13 <psygnisfive> then we can just set it running and tell other people to not even bother with making BF-like languages ever again.
01:24:26 <ehird> make it an esolang description esolang
01:24:30 <ehird> you give it a template, it makes esolangs.
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01:27:04 <psygnisfive> i think the benefit of something like the language im designing is that it'd probably be especially good for creating DSLs
01:27:28 <ehird> ski__: have you sacrificed the goat yet? or are you earlier in the initiation process
01:27:43 <ehird> Looking at http://chalmers.se/, yes, i'd say it was.
01:27:46 <ehird> Now what on earth sparked that question...
01:28:04 <psygnisfive> well, he's logging on through them it seems.
01:28:13 <psygnisfive> which leads me to ask, ski__ what do you study?
01:28:24 <ehird> Generally people log onto IRC with network connections :p
01:28:35 <psygnisfive> yes, but his is a university network connection
01:28:42 <ehird> I guess we should have a descriptive topic what with all the newbies these days.
01:28:56 <ski__> (psygnisfive : yes)
01:29:11 -!- ehird has set topic: the international hub for enterprise esoteric programming language design, development and deployment ~ http://esolangs.org/wiki/ ~ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/.
01:29:14 -!- ehird has set topic: the international hub for enterprise esoteric programming language design, development and deployment ~ http://esolangs.org/wiki/ ~ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric.
01:29:14 <ski__> (depending on what you were asking ..)
01:29:28 <ehird> now it's semi-descriptive!
01:29:29 <ski__> ehird : which goat ?
01:29:36 <ehird> ski__: that one over there ------>
01:30:01 * ski__ see an elegant keyboard "over there" ..
01:30:08 <ehird> yeah, that's a goat.
01:30:13 <psygnisfive> ehird: im looking at http://www.vjn.fi/oklopol/muture.txt and not finding it to be especially.. insightful. :p
01:30:14 <ehird> trying to trick you. they're sneaky things.
01:30:20 <ehird> that's why we must sacrifice them.
01:30:34 <ehird> psygnisfive: it's oklopol, what did you expect?
01:30:35 <ski__> (<http://datamancer.net/keyboards/ergo1/ergo1.jpg>, if anyone wonders)
01:30:47 <ehird> ski__: that's a nasty goat, that
01:30:53 <ehird> you want to slay that pronto
01:31:05 <psygnisfive> they're normal keyboards with a steampunk veneer
01:31:06 <ski__> (ehird : as in .. SLAY Radio ?)
01:31:18 <psygnisfive> no, what i want to see is someone convert an old Corona
01:31:19 <ehird> no. as in kill. with your bare hands
01:31:25 <ehird> didnt they teach you anything in the initiation? ;-)
01:31:42 <psygnisfive> ski__ also kill your excessive parens. much as we love lisp, we dont need to speak in it
01:32:02 <ehird> parentheses are ((parenthical))
01:32:10 <ehird> ( parenthicalicious, even )
01:32:22 <ski__> (ehird : "parenthetical", itym)
01:32:30 <ehird> ski__: watch out for oerjan, by the way. he swats people indiscriminately.
01:32:30 <psygnisfive> it took me about 5 tries to say parenthicalicious
01:32:43 <ehird> psygnisfive: it would be hard if you have a lisp
01:32:48 * ski__ wonders what "swat" means
01:32:54 <ehird> he has a fly swatter.
01:32:56 <ski__> (psygnisfive : btw, yes)
01:33:01 <ehird> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flyswatter
01:33:14 <ehird> he swats people with it. normally after they make a pun that's worse than one of his.
01:33:42 <psygnisfive> ehird: also, if you love parens, theres a book written by some crazy french person who's used so many parenthetical asides that the text is incomprehensible
01:33:52 <ehird> psygnisfive: sounds excellent
01:33:56 <ehird> what I want is a book that is just like
01:33:56 <psygnisfive> single sentences have upwards of like 7 or 8 nestings
01:33:59 <ehird> Things happened.[1]
01:34:04 <ehird> [1] Specific things[2], in fact[3].
01:34:09 <ehird> [2] These thin (blah blah)
01:34:12 <ehird> [3] Where fact is subjective.
01:34:17 <ehird> the whole book is just nested footnoes
01:34:17 <psygnisfive> the bottom most nestings being like.. paragraphs sometimes
01:34:28 <ehird> for the whole book
01:34:33 <ehird> top-down book writing :-D
01:35:02 <psygnisfive> the whole book is a book of foot notes to a missing text
01:35:35 <psygnisfive> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/index.html?curid=2400949
01:35:59 <ehird> wiki/index.html?curid=2400949?
01:36:02 <psygnisfive> theres another book that consists entirely of reviews of the book itself.
01:36:02 <ehird> That's some old link.
01:36:11 <ehird> douglas hofstadter had that idea
01:36:15 <ehird> in godel, escher, bach
01:36:29 <psygnisfive> actually, that might be where i got it from :)
01:36:49 <psygnisfive> i can never be sure, because goodness knows its not as tho some poet wouldn't make something like that
01:38:33 <ehird> A Review: A Review. The review in question is an odd one, as it is entirely on the subject of itself. This creates an interesting metaness leaving no actual content beyond self-reference to the review. Wholly interesting. *****
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01:41:58 <ehird> psygnisfive: I just wrote it :)
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01:43:45 <comex> %eval (s (l (x) (l (y) he x y)) (l (x) x o) l)
01:43:46 <kerlobot> ([l (x) (l (y) (l (z) ((x z) (y z))))] (l (x) (l (y) he x y)) (l (x) x o) l)
01:43:54 <comex> ok, that was wrong
01:44:24 <comex> %eval (i (i a) (i b))
01:44:45 <comex> %eval (i (i a) (i b) (i c))
01:44:49 <comex> %eval (l (i a) (i b) (i c))
01:45:06 <comex> %eval (h (e l) (l o))
01:45:37 <comex> %eval (s (l (x) (l (y) (he x y))) (l (x) x o) l)
01:45:37 <kerlobot> ([l (x) (l (y) (l (z) ((x z) (y z))))] (l (x) (l (y) (he x y))) (l (x) x o) l)
01:46:48 <ehird> what are you doing comex
01:46:53 <comex> just screwing around
01:47:08 <ehird> %eval (f f f f f f)
01:47:17 <ehird> fold is messed up :D
01:47:59 <comex> %eval (l (x) (x)) (i)
01:48:03 <comex> %eval *(l (x) (x)) (i))
01:48:05 <comex> %eval 9(l (x) (x)) (i))
01:48:08 <comex> %eval 9(l (x) (x)) (i))
01:48:12 <comex> %eval ((l (x) (x)) (i))
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02:00:32 <kerlo> %eval (s (l (x) (l (y) he x y)) (l (x) x o) l)
02:00:33 <kerlobot> ([l (x) (l (y) (l (z) ((x z) (y z))))] (l (x) (l (y) he x y)) (l (x) x o) l)
02:00:46 <kerlo> %eval (s (l (X) (l (Y) he X Y)) (l (X) X o) l)
02:00:46 <kerlobot> ([l (x) (l (y) (l (z) ((x z) (y z))))] (l (X) (l (Y) he X Y)) (l (X) X o) l)
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05:46:19 <oklopol> http://www.vjn.fi/oklopol/muture.txt <<< psygnisfive, ais523 rev-enged it.
05:48:28 <psygnisfive> it looks very haskellish, obviously, but what im not sure about is the definition of sim
05:48:29 <oklopol> i should probably try to write a spec or something, muture i at least think i understand myself, as opposed to, say, contfuck and noprob.
05:48:44 <psygnisfive> i mean, on the one hand i sort of understand it
05:49:00 <oklopol> well it's more just general functional stuff with pattern matching.
05:49:07 <oklopol> | isn't what it is in haskell
05:49:26 <oklopol> but not what "or" is in imperative langs ofc. more like "one of these, i dunno which"
05:49:33 <psygnisfive> namely, the definition where its not x:xs y:ys but rather where its nil y:ys or x:xs nil
05:50:04 <oklopol> yeah that's actually a bug, although less serious than you think
05:50:07 <psygnisfive> for instance, sim [1] [1,2] will fail when it gets to sim [] [2]
05:50:40 <psygnisfive> it wont match sim [] [], nor sim x:xs y:ys
05:50:43 <oklopol> it will just be suboptimal because it'll have to match the last two elements together
05:51:09 <oklopol> well rrrright, if you call with exactly that
05:51:18 <oklopol> yes, of course, that will fail.
05:52:36 <psygnisfive> im also not entirely sure how your sim algorithm is supposed to work in full. what does it report for sim "a111" "111"?
05:52:41 <oklopol> but thanks for showing it, i never realized muture allows is robust enough to alow that
05:54:06 <oklopol> yes, the gist of the language is ">>" means "maximize" ("<<" for "minimize", for completeness)
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05:55:16 <oklopol> "maximize value of expression given all the possible nondeterminism allowed lol"
05:55:44 <psygnisfive> so its supposed to go through words, and find the one where sim "head" the_word is greatest
05:56:31 <oklopol> should be able to implement that with a search through the list and dynamic programming, in general it will do all kinds of search using the value of the expression as the heuristic.
05:57:05 <oklopol> err i need to go. lecture starts pretty sewn
05:58:27 <oklopol> decided to took one more course btw, "computer science and the society", who's a cute little masochist now, huh?
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09:09:06 <MizardX> {Marybelle} Hey all. I keep running into memory problems when querying a MySQL database. Any pointers?
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09:22:59 <AnMaster> MizardX, sure 0x3430536000 0x7fff0d6f2cb8 0x34304273c0
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09:35:44 * oerjan swats AnMaster -----###
09:36:01 <ais523> AnMaster: I don't get the reference
09:36:03 <oerjan> sorry, it's apparently become my job description
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09:37:16 <ais523> <Wikipedia API Help> This means that if, for example, "Main Page" is the first random page on your list, "List of fictional monkeys" will *always* be second, "List of people on stamps of Vanuatu" third, etc.
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11:24:20 <AnMaster> <ais523> AnMaster: I don't get the reference <-- hahah
11:24:40 <AnMaster> (that was obviously a joke about C++ references)
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13:45:43 <ehird> http://www.yucs.org/~gnivasch/life/article_cat/
13:45:45 <ehird> duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuude.
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13:47:44 <ehird> http://www.yucs.org/~gnivasch/life/article_cat/
13:47:45 <ehird> http://www.yucs.org/~gnivasch/life/article_cat/
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15:05:59 <ehird> For no discernable reason.
15:08:02 <ais523> which browser are you using now?
15:08:15 * ais523 runs through some likely possibilities in their head
15:08:23 <ais523> hmm... does Opera have a Mac version, I wonder?
15:08:30 <ais523> also, browsing via Telnet is great, if a little slow
15:08:38 <ehird> (I don't know why, I just realiased I never actually used Opera.)
15:08:57 <ehird> I should try every browser in evolt.org's archive.
15:09:03 <ehird> It even has the original TBL NextStep browser.
15:09:31 <ehird> ais523: Pretty ordinary, except it renders really fast.
15:09:42 <ehird> And a lot of the HTML5 people work on it.
15:09:48 <ehird> So it has a lot of support for that stuff.
15:11:08 <ehird> I wonder if I could get nextstep working in a VM.
15:11:10 <ehird> That'd be interesting
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15:24:14 <Asztal> edbrowse is the standard!
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15:55:45 <AnMaster> "The application must insure that no other SQLite interfaces are invoked by other threads while sqlite3_config() is running. " <-- "insure"? Shouldn't that be "ensure"?
15:56:21 <AnMaster> ais523, also "<ais523> AnMaster: I don't get the reference" was a C++ joke right?
15:56:56 <AnMaster> ais523, you don't know what xkcd strip I was talking about?
15:57:09 <ais523> I hardly know any XKCDs, apart from the ones which are linked nearly all the time
15:57:35 <ais523> they should teach XKCD in school, it's needed to make any sense of the interent
15:57:39 <ehird> you know the funny thing about people quoting xkcd verbatim all the time?
15:57:47 <ehird> It has a strip exactly about the annoying people who do that.
15:58:01 <ehird> http://xkcd.com/16/
15:58:34 <AnMaster> ehird, Isn't that about quoting Monty Python?
15:58:34 <ais523> ehird: that's about Monty Python, not xkcd
15:58:49 <ehird> yeah, um, because the point it makes totally only applies specifically to monty python
15:59:28 <ais523> ehird: it does, really
15:59:33 <ais523> because the point is about surrealist humour
15:59:40 <AnMaster> also that thing about the car accident makes no sense
15:59:43 <ais523> so if you're quoting something that isn't surrealist humour, the point doesn't apply
15:59:50 <ehird> < AnMaster> also that thing about the car accident makes no sense
15:59:55 <ehird> nor does goddamn monty python
16:00:11 <ehird> that's the whole point
16:04:51 <ehird> http://www.peta.org/sea_kittens/
16:04:54 <ehird> peta rebrands fish.
16:05:03 <ehird> hilaripidity ensures
16:05:13 <ais523> is anyone even paying attention to them on that?
16:05:38 <ehird> PETA are a bunch of fucked-up idiots.
16:05:49 <ehird> Creepy "animal rights" extremists.
16:05:58 <ehird> They acre more about animals than humans, and actually they don't care about animals.
16:06:01 <AnMaster> well what is wrong with animal rights?
16:06:08 <Slereah_> Sea kittens aren't thhat great.
16:06:12 <ehird> I'm talking about PETA.
16:06:18 <Slereah_> They're so fuzzy and delicious
16:06:34 <ehird> haha, I am so calling kittens land fish from now on
16:07:30 <ehird> #esoteric: Talking about eating kittens since 2009
16:07:48 <Slereah_> I'm pretty sure we did it before
16:16:28 <Ilari> Fry how? RF EM radiation, IR EM radiation, heat, HVAC or HVDC? :->
16:17:18 <Slereah_> Fry with a regular frying pan, through thermal conduction
16:17:25 <Slereah_> You know, phonon transmission.
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16:20:43 <ehird> http://isobamapresident.com/
16:21:14 <Slereah_> Quick, let's nuke the US before the negro!
16:21:34 <Ilari> One of those troijan-spreading sites?
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16:31:42 <ehird> I think #haskell has entered Eternal January.
16:32:18 <adimit> I'm watching. It's cruel.
16:32:34 <adimit> don't they know about ghci
16:33:10 <ehird> 15 year olds don't use ghci. It's an unwritten rule.
16:33:39 <AnMaster> <ehird> I think #haskell has entered Eternal January. <-- ?
16:33:50 <ehird> AnMaster: irritating noob in #haskell.
16:33:59 <AnMaster> ehird, also you are 13 and use ghc iirc?
16:34:19 <ehird> I said 15 year olds.
16:34:42 <AnMaster> ehird, so you will stop when you are 15?
16:34:50 <ehird> yes. Then restart again when 16
16:34:55 <ehird> I would be killed if I did not.
16:37:42 <AnMaster> ehird, also why "Eternal January", has this happened more than once?
16:41:39 <ehird> its an eternal september ref
16:41:50 <AnMaster> yes, but hopefully this will end soon
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17:07:25 <ehird> http://isobamapresident.com/
17:07:35 <ehird> i didn't even intend that
17:09:52 <ehird> Obama? Change? It changed?
17:09:54 <ehird> Ahahrahrharhahrahr
17:10:20 <AnMaster> right, read that as gedit for some reason...
17:10:29 <AnMaster> which iirc is some gnome based editor
17:10:36 <AnMaster> "Barack Obama has been president for 2009-1-20 12:07:00 GMT-05:00" <-- that makes no sense
17:11:10 <ehird> doesn't say that for me
17:11:18 <ehird> Barack Obama has been president for 4 minutes, 27 seconds
17:11:22 <ehird> guess you need scripts
17:11:31 <ehird> since it goes in realtime
17:12:32 <AnMaster> "(Changed protection level for "Barack Obama": to prevent premature declarations of presidency ([edit=sysop] (expires 17:00, 20 January 2009 (UTC)) [move=sysop] (indefinite)))"
17:13:06 <ehird> "BARACK OBAMA IS PRESIDENT"
17:13:09 <ehird> "NO HE IS NOT THERE IS 5 SECONDS TO GO"
17:13:22 <AnMaster> ehird, actually it was edited 17:02: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Barack_Obama&diff=265311244&oldid=265306761
17:13:28 <ehird> "[CITATION NEEDED]"
17:13:37 <ehird> "IM BARACK OBAMA THAT'S HOW I KNOW"
17:13:39 <AnMaster> ehird, and that protection was done 30 minutes in advance
17:13:43 <ehird> "ORIGINAL RESEARCH"
17:14:17 <ehird> "Is it in a scientific paper or a newspaper yet?"
17:15:40 <AnMaster> ehird, oh also it seems he was sworn in 17:05 (UTC) so that meant there was somewhat of an edit war between 17:00 and 17:09
17:16:08 <AnMaster> http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Barack_Obama&action=history <-- quite interesting
17:16:44 <AnMaster> also the protection changes in it doesn't quite match up
17:18:45 <ehird> <!-- PLEASE DO NOT CHANGE OBAMA'S NAME -->'''Barack Hussein Obama II'''<!-- PLEASE DO NOT CHANGE OBAMA'S NAME -->
17:19:11 <AnMaster> also wtf is up with that II? He isn't royal
17:19:39 <AnMaster> I only ever seen numbers after the names used for royals
17:19:40 <ehird> Someone call me when we've returned to intelligent discourse.
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17:25:19 <oerjan> ehird: i was just going to comment on your absense
17:26:17 <oerjan> heh curious you were only gone just as i joined
17:27:55 <oerjan> <ais523> <Wikipedia API Help> This means that if, for example, "Main Page" is the first random page on your list, "List of fictional monkeys" will *always* be second, "List of people on stamps of Vanuatu" third, etc.
17:28:04 <oerjan> wow the last one actually exists :D
17:28:27 <ais523> the second one presumably exists too
17:28:34 <ais523> I believe it is in fact telling the truth
17:28:39 <ais523> rather than coming up with facetious examples
17:29:30 <oerjan> um what is this about? random page selection being deterministic after the first page?
17:32:06 <ais523> AnMaster: it's to do with the way the randomization works
17:32:13 <ehird> page X always leads on to Y
17:32:15 <AnMaster> ais523, you mean the random page link?
17:32:15 <ais523> each page is given a random number
17:32:29 <oerjan> http://wiki.creativecommons.org/api.php
17:32:31 <ais523> if you generate one random page, you get a page whose random number is just above a random number
17:32:32 <Deewiant> AnMaster: heard of pseudorandom number generators and the way they always give the same results for the same seed?
17:32:35 <AnMaster> ais523, so random link from main page will always go to the same place?
17:32:37 <ais523> Deewiant: it isn't that
17:32:41 <ais523> AnMaster: no, not at all
17:32:46 <ais523> generating one random page at a time, it's random
17:32:56 <ais523> with differing probabilities for pages due to how the randomizer works
17:33:05 <ais523> let me explain the reason
17:33:12 <AnMaster> Deewiant, that would be too logical for mediawiki
17:33:18 <ais523> if you generate multiples, to save server time, then it takes the first n pages above the randomly-generated number
17:33:20 <ehird> AnMaster: actually, this _is_ logical.
17:33:29 <AnMaster> also why on earth would mediawiki api need random page thing
17:33:39 <ehird> Hey just guessing!
17:33:41 <ais523> so if main page is 0.5, then list of fictional monkeys is 0.50000000000000005 and list of people on stamps of Vanatu is 0.5000000000000059
17:33:43 <AnMaster> ehird, why would a bot need it
17:33:49 <ais523> AnMaster: random page patrolling?
17:33:54 <ehird> this is for things using the api
17:33:58 <ehird> like gregorr's Five Clicks to Jesus
17:33:59 <AnMaster> ais523, that would surely miss lots of pages
17:34:01 <ehird> that uses random pages
17:34:17 <AnMaster> ehird, also iirc the bot is mainly for the wiki bots?
17:34:27 <ehird> the API is for anything.
17:34:37 <AnMaster> sure you can use it for other stuff
17:34:56 <oerjan> <AnMaster> <ais523> AnMaster: I don't get the reference <-- hahah
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17:35:09 <oerjan> AnMaster gets a joke i didn't? what is the world coming to
17:35:11 <ais523> oerjan: is there some joke in that line I'm missing?
17:35:25 <ais523> AnMaster explained the pun he thought I'd added there, but it was unintentional
17:35:25 <AnMaster> oerjan, yes I thought it was a joke about C++ &-style references
17:35:30 <oerjan> wait he gets a _non-existing_ joke?
17:35:43 <ais523> oerjan: well, it explains why you didn't get it
17:35:44 <ehird> negative sense of humour
17:35:49 <oerjan> ais523: heh, it was obvious after he pointed it out
17:36:00 * AnMaster wonders what the smiley _D means
17:36:47 <oerjan> a smiling person who's just been stamped on by an elephant
17:36:54 <ehird> why are they smiling
17:37:08 <oerjan> they didn't see it coming, naturally
17:37:22 <AnMaster> oerjan, wouldn't they stop smiling after?
17:37:58 <oerjan> how do you stop smiling when your brain is crushed? duh.
17:38:11 <AnMaster> oerjan, yeah I guess it is always fatal
17:38:16 <ehird> maybe it's a gentle elephant
17:39:03 <ehird> aww. cute tiny elephant kitten.
17:39:09 <ehird> who's an elephant kitten? YOU ARE!
17:39:16 <ehird> you're a good little elephant kitten. yeeeeeeees!
17:39:36 <ehird> I am ashamed of this channel.
17:39:45 * AnMaster has decided to always talk about Garfield when someone mentions "cute kitten"
17:39:56 <AnMaster> just because I'm tried of that thing
17:40:05 <oerjan> AnMaster: you mean to change the subject quickly?
17:40:09 <AnMaster> seriously, what about cute dogs? It is time for a change!
17:40:15 <ehird> dogs are not cute.
17:40:26 <AnMaster> oerjan, certainly, and get rid of lolcats too
17:40:27 <ehird> You're a kitty cat! YES YOU ARE.
17:41:53 <AnMaster> is it possible to have two keyboard attached that are on different keyboard layout?
17:42:01 <AnMaster> say, one dvorak, and one qwerty
17:42:15 <ehird> 5. MOST VAMPIRES DON'T EVEN KNOW IF THEY ARE VAMPIRES!
17:42:16 <ehird> -- http://www.trueghosttales.com/paranormal/do-vampires-exist/
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17:43:35 <AnMaster> ok, then it is really fucked up
17:43:40 <oerjan> i have a slight suspicion i might be a vampire
17:43:47 <ehird> oerjan: Here's how to tell:
17:43:52 <oerjan> i sunburn so darn easily
17:43:53 <ehird> 1. Do you know if you're a vampire?
17:43:55 <ehird> Yes: You are not a vampire.
17:43:58 <ehird> No: You are a vampire!
17:44:59 <AnMaster> oerjan, what about blood? Like "blodpudding"
17:45:06 <AnMaster> don't know English word for that
17:45:17 <AnMaster> oerjan, it exists in Norway too?
17:45:20 <oerjan> i guess that settles it
17:45:33 <ehird> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_pudding
17:45:39 <oerjan> ehird: something like that
17:45:50 <oerjan> i suppose the recipe varies
17:55:14 <adimit> arguably though, Haggis is worse. I wouldn't eat any of it though...
17:55:30 <AnMaster> adimit, what about surströmming or lutfisk?
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17:57:00 <appletizer> does this channel happen to discuss real-time coding too? :)
17:58:01 <oerjan> otoh i won't eat cod tongue, which the rest of the family eats
17:58:33 <oerjan> and i've got a cousin who won't eat lutefisk
17:58:34 <ehird> define real time coding
17:58:46 <appletizer> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real-time_computing
17:58:56 <appletizer> or -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synchronous_programming_language
17:59:01 <ehird> ok, hows that relevant to this channel? :P
17:59:06 <adimit> AnMaster: nothing compares to Hakarl.
17:59:09 <AnMaster> coding != computing, real time coding would be writing when you write
17:59:11 <appletizer> lol is esoteric the name of a language or?
17:59:13 <ais523> well, a real time esolang would be kind-of interesting
17:59:23 <appletizer> i assume that esoteric meant less-known languages no other channels discuss :P
17:59:26 <ais523> appletizer: [[e:Esoteric programming language]]
17:59:31 <ais523> appletizer: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Esoteric_programming_language
17:59:32 <ehird> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esolang
17:59:33 <appletizer> and since real-time are esoteric by that nature... :)
17:59:38 <ais523> whoops, messed up shortcut
17:59:46 <ais523> well, esolangs tend to be even weirder than that
17:59:56 <ais523> less-known languages that were deliberately designed to be lesser-known
18:00:00 <appletizer> i would assume it would include things like esterel etc :)
18:00:09 <ehird> appletizer: esterel?
18:00:12 <ais523> hmm... this goes back to the old argument about BANCStar
18:00:23 <appletizer> a synchronous programming lang for real-time applications
18:00:25 <ehird> appletizer: well, if you're interested in odd programming languages you'll definitely fit in
18:00:29 <ehird> we're pretty lax about our topics here
18:00:44 <ais523> Esterel looks to me like an unintentionally esoteric language
18:00:48 <ais523> it takes itself far too seriously
18:00:56 <ais523> but then, the BANCStars of this world are great to talk about
18:01:01 <ehird> um, real-time languages have real use cases.
18:01:15 <appletizer> lol they usually do, RT codes are used in nuclear reactors to more mundanes like neurophysiological measurements
18:01:16 <ais523> so does Thutu, but I wouldn't call that non-esoteric
18:01:48 <ehird> I could never code something for a nuclear reactor or a hospital.
18:01:52 <ehird> That's far too much responsibility :P
18:02:00 <ais523> and you wouldn't in an esolang
18:02:06 <ais523> they're mostly deliberately designed to be impractical
18:02:16 <ais523> Underlambda, for instance, when I get round to speccing it
18:02:50 <ais523> ^bf ,[.,]!Hello appletizer!
18:02:51 <AnMaster> ais523, what about feather? It could be both :P
18:03:06 <AnMaster> ais523, encode the string in bf directly
18:03:17 <ais523> please, don't mention it in front of people who haven't heard of it already, it gives me headaches just thinking about it
18:03:21 <ais523> let alone trying to explain it
18:03:40 <ehird> fungot: say hello to appletizer
18:03:41 <fungot> ehird: but i must admit, i haven't have an epiphany about those :p.
18:03:41 <ais523> let alone trying to /implement/ it
18:03:44 <ehird> fungot: say hello to appletizer
18:03:45 <ais523> which i still want to do some way
18:03:45 <fungot> ehird: the better way is to grovel through the package underlying the srfi-26 structure by opening it or opening a structure that includes a predicate to test if elements are lists or non-empty strings or vectors of arbitrary sizes.
18:04:01 <ais523> ^ul (Hello appletizer!)S
18:04:08 <fungot> appletizer: " the structure with the associated code in isolation seems to work fine
18:04:11 <ais523> ehird: and that Underload was not cheating
18:04:16 <ais523> appletizer: yes, written in http://esolangs.org/wiki/Befunge
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18:04:26 <ais523> one of the most practical esolangs around
18:04:29 <ais523> which is to say, not very
18:04:46 <ehird> appletizer: http://zem.fi/~fis/fungot.b98.txt
18:04:47 <fungot> ehird: you have no imagination?)
18:05:09 <ehird> I'd tell you about the goat you have to sacrifice but I think looking at fungot will do
18:05:10 <fungot> ehird: i guess i really should finish sicp. time for sleep for me. what i also need to understand my brain because i have an idea... a quine in
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18:05:51 <appletizer> woah ehird, that's the most convoluted coding if i've ever seen one :)
18:06:10 <ais523> and Befunge is one of the more readable esolangs
18:07:30 <ehird> Not all esolangs are just about syntax :P
18:08:17 <AnMaster> ehird, you mean like Feather? ;P
18:08:18 <ais523> which doesn't even have an official syntax yet?
18:08:20 <AnMaster> actually that is only about syntax kind of
18:08:35 <ais523> incidentally, my guiding goal for Feather starting syntax is "looks vaguely like Smalltalk, but for different reasons"
18:08:40 <AnMaster> (in a not very much so kind of not kind of way)
18:09:00 <AnMaster> ais523, oh, interesting, I would never have ended up with feather by that
18:10:12 <AnMaster> appletizer, also I hope you realise by now this is not the right place to be serious (well not be serious seriously anyway, you can of course be serious in a not very serious way, such as java2k)
18:10:32 <AnMaster> http://p-nand-q.com/humor/programming_languages/java2k.html
18:10:36 <appletizer> lol AnMaster, yeah i sorta figured, though it could be cool if i bumped into some RT-ers :)
18:10:51 <appletizer> i guess this would be the place for brainfuck and the likes :)
18:10:55 <AnMaster> well, ais523 is working with some VHDL thing on the side.
18:11:07 <AnMaster> not the way you meant it though
18:11:25 <ais523> AnMaster: that isn't related to esolangs, but to my RL work
18:11:38 <ais523> it is rather weird, though, serious but weird, just like appletizer's realtime langs
18:11:41 <AnMaster> ais523, but would you call it "real time"?
18:11:59 <ais523> AnMaster: no, well arguably yes
18:12:03 <ais523> it can be very very realtime
18:12:13 <ais523> the fact that it has sleep-for-femtoseconds commands backs that up
18:12:51 <AnMaster> wait a sec. femtosecond would need the circuit to operate at a very high speed?
18:13:12 <ehird> circuits do operate at a very high speed
18:13:28 <AnMaster> how many Mhz do you need to get one cycle = 1 fs?
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18:13:45 <ais523> but 1fs is too fast even for VHDL-generated code
18:13:49 <ais523> it's just there as a catchall option, I think
18:13:55 <ais523> picoseconds are more commonly used
18:14:13 <AnMaster> well I guess you could want sub-cycle
18:14:38 <ais523> AnMaster: this is sub-cycle
18:14:43 <ais523> it's to do with decompiled code
18:14:58 <ais523> basically, it measures the lengths of the actual wires
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18:15:03 <ais523> and puts delays on accordingly
18:15:06 <ais523> so you can simulate properly
18:15:15 <AnMaster> appletizer, take a look at that link btw
18:15:37 <ehird> appletizer: I recommend you ignore AnMaster.
18:15:43 <ais523> meh, Java2K isn't really that interesting
18:15:55 <ais523> and it's worth pointing out that AnMaster and ehird are both upstanding and fine members of this channel
18:15:56 <AnMaster> ais523, no but it's introduction is
18:16:03 <ehird> wait, I'm upstanding and fine?
18:16:03 <ais523> but somehow end up bickering when you leave them in the same channel together
18:16:06 <ehird> what have I been doing wrong?!
18:16:11 <ais523> ehird: well, for you it's more dubious
18:16:40 <ais523> why does this worry me: "NEW VERSION 7.3 PRE-GAMMA RELEASED EARLY 2004, with a completely new interpreter written in Python. Finally, it is safe to embed Python in Webpages!"
18:17:05 <AnMaster> ais523, indeed, ehird is "fine" but not "upstanding". He said himself he was short.
18:17:22 <ehird> ais523: whaaaaaaaaat
18:17:34 <ais523> ehird: from the Java2K page AnMaster linked
18:17:51 <oerjan> AnMaster: "upstanding" is about vector direction, not magnitude
18:18:14 <AnMaster> oerjan, well that makes less sense in this context.
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18:19:14 <oerjan> AnMaster: he _could_ be reclining
18:19:22 <AnMaster> oerjan, subjective gravity? Sure some relativistic effects could maybe cause it, but this doesn't make sense for the rather "non-extreme" properties of this place
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18:25:25 <AnMaster> I just had an idea for a horrible joke if anyone is interested.
18:26:11 <AnMaster> (and totally unrelated to the current convo)
18:26:39 * ais523 objects to the deletion
18:26:51 <appletizer> i just looked at the article, nice one :)
18:27:11 <ais523> AnMaster: it's a Wikipedia pun
18:27:22 <ais523> oerjan will be deleted in 5 days if nobody objects
18:27:26 <AnMaster> China: Democracy considered harmful.
18:27:28 * oerjan prepares ye olde swatter
18:28:01 <ehird> AnMaster: that wasn't even funny
18:28:15 <oerjan> that's not even worth a swat
18:28:26 <ais523> the problem is that watching AnMaster trying to make a joke is in fact very funny
18:28:27 <ehird> Hey guys! I made a joke! AnMaster.
18:28:27 <ais523> even if the jokes arent
18:28:31 <AnMaster> oerjan, exactly. I'm testing how low one can sink when it comes to humor
18:28:31 <ehird> see, that was funny.
18:28:33 <ais523> so it serves the intended purpose
18:28:47 <AnMaster> oerjan, this is a scientific study
18:28:53 <ais523> oerjan: does the swatter need to be used before you can put it away
18:28:59 <ais523> kind-of like some D&D artifact swords?
18:29:17 <ehird> oerjan NEVER puts his swatter away
18:29:35 <ais523> I reckon he has it in some kind of quick-draw holster
18:31:32 * AnMaster imagines replacing "gun" with "swatter" in a old Clint Eastwood movie
18:32:02 <ehird> Should I link to the obligatory bash?
18:32:05 <oerjan> that sounds like something Larson would draw
18:32:25 <ehird> http://bash.org/?111338
18:32:26 <ais523> ehird: probably, I'm sufficiently Internet-insulated to miss all the obligatory quotes
18:32:27 <lament> replacing gun with swatter in the good, bad, ugly climax scene?
18:32:33 <ehird> ais523: it's not exactly SFW.
18:32:37 <ehird> Well, text can't be NSFW/
18:32:51 <ais523> ehird: actually I've seen that one before
18:33:11 <oerjan> AnMaster: in that case your total lack of humor is no longer surprising
18:33:47 <oerjan> actually, *would have drawn, since he quit in the middle nineties
18:33:53 <AnMaster> oerjan, wait the name does sound slightly familiar
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18:34:33 <AnMaster> ah yes I have seen that strip once I think
18:34:53 <AnMaster> oerjan, yes when I see the some of the google image results it looks slightly familiar
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18:38:14 <ehird> http://bash.org/?875652 I predict that one day, this quote will be in the top 100 of bash.
18:38:28 <ais523> ehird: what's it about?
18:38:35 <ais523> just asking this time in case it's an ASCII art goatse or something
18:38:47 <ehird> I doubt that would be accepted by the moderators
18:39:28 <ais523> ehird: you aren't giving much info
18:39:28 <ais523> I don't know how to interpret "evil" here
18:39:37 <ehird> it's not anything like that.
18:40:46 <ais523> surely the obvious answer is to report the person who set up the complicated scenario to the police?
18:41:13 <ais523> or possibly interfere while they're trying to set it up?
18:41:23 <ehird> I don't know, I mean, bacon.
18:41:30 <ehird> If you did that you might miss out on bacon.
18:41:37 <ais523> I can get my own bacon
18:41:41 <ehird> Perhaps you can't.
18:41:44 <ehird> Perhaps it is the last bacon left in the world.
18:41:47 <ehird> Had you considered that?
18:41:53 <ais523> ehird: no, because it's a silly consideration
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18:42:09 <AnMaster> ehird, actually I mean it, "dilemma" is for two options
18:42:18 <AnMaster> clearly you can't use it when there are three options
18:43:07 <jix> AnMaster: how is it a dilemma or trilemma... like you can get bacon...
18:43:26 <jix> AnMaster: if you chose bacon i mean
18:43:51 <AnMaster> and then as ais523 said, report this to the police
18:44:11 <jix> when the police comes they'll just eat the bacon
18:44:19 <ais523> I think you could save the person by shouting "Look out, there's a tripwire"
18:44:22 <ehird> AnMaster: save a person over kittens and bacon?
18:44:23 <ais523> while you were going to save the kittens
18:44:32 <AnMaster> jix, yes and? I can live without bacon
18:44:48 <ehird> That's simply _impossible_.
18:44:53 <AnMaster> ehird, I don't even like bacon
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18:44:59 <ehird> Two basic needs: water, and bacon.
18:45:21 <jix> AnMaster: think of fish!
18:45:31 <ehird> bacon serves as air.
18:45:53 <AnMaster> ais523, btw how goes ick development now
18:47:06 <ais523> AnMaster: very busy in RL atm
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18:47:14 <ais523> so no big improvements
18:47:18 <ais523> apart from the repo now being online
18:47:21 <AnMaster> also: http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/polls/poll0248.html
18:47:48 <oerjan> ehird: Osama bin Laden disagrees with you on the bacon issue
18:48:16 <ais523> AnMaster: that's quite some question
18:48:16 <ehird> Osama bin Laden is an anti-bacon extremist
18:48:25 <AnMaster> ais523, yes and the answers are funny too
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18:52:37 <AnMaster> ehird, um all the vegetarians doesn't eat any bacon
18:53:22 <AnMaster> also I don't eat bacon, I do eat meat though
18:53:36 <ais523> I do eat bacon sometimes
18:53:50 <ais523> but I wouldn't eat bacon over saving a person
18:53:54 <ehird> i don't t alk to liars.
18:53:59 <ais523> as for saving the kittens, I tend to get confused by Rube Goldberg machines
18:54:05 <ais523> but I'd probably manage it if I came to in time
18:54:19 <ehird> i'd feed the kittens to the human to give them the strength to escape
18:54:22 <ehird> then share the bacon with them
18:54:25 <AnMaster> ais523, hm RUBE is a nice lang
18:55:06 <ais523> ehird: *feed the kittens with the human?
18:55:39 <ehird> i don't think kitties eat bacon though.
18:55:52 <ehird> bacon is not meat, silly.
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19:27:46 <MigoMipo> I'm sorry for the nick war earlier.
19:28:16 <MigoMipo> It got quite silly at an another channel, and we probably forgot that it would mess up other channels.
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19:28:53 <ais523> Notify] ehird went offline (irc.freenode.net).
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19:34:01 * oerjan swats FireFly -----###
19:34:49 <ais523> MigoMipo: which channel?
19:35:15 <MigoMipo> ais523: our "private" at ##tullinge.
19:37:07 <oerjan> incidentally, "tulling" means stupid person in norwegian :D
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19:38:41 -!- IAmGreenAndAlsoF has set topic: Tullings.
19:39:25 -!- ais523 has set topic: Tullings | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric.
19:39:41 <ais523> IAmGreenAndAlsoF: what does the F stand for?
19:39:51 * ais523 guesses furious for no particular reason
19:40:30 <IAmGreenAndAlsoF> 19:28 -!- ehird changed the topic of #esoteric to: IAmGreenAndAlsoFortunate
19:40:53 <AnMaster> well MigoMipo is new here isn't (s)he?
19:40:58 <ais523> you typoed /nick for /topic?
19:41:20 <AnMaster> FireFly, also why did he join and excuse for the nick war?
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19:41:50 <AnMaster> IAmGreenAndAlsoF, why? why not?
19:42:08 <MigoMipo> AnMaster:Because apologies are a good thing.
19:42:21 <AnMaster> well, what prompted you to join here...
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19:42:47 <AnMaster> * MigoMipo (n=MigoMipo@84-217-3-141.tn.glocalnet.net) has joined #esoteric <-- ?
19:42:56 <oerjan> everyone expects the AnMaster inquisition
19:43:03 <AnMaster> IAmGreenAndAlsoF, I just connected to bnc then.
19:43:27 <AnMaster> IAmGreenAndAlsoF, well, whatever happened after made no sense
19:44:03 <oerjan> In Soviet Russia, you make no sense to this joke
19:44:10 <AnMaster> IAmGreenAndAlsoF, that is only because you are ehird
19:44:24 <IAmGreenAndAlsoF> AnMaster: everyone else seems to be having no trouble whatsoever understanding it.
19:44:36 <AnMaster> IAmGreenAndAlsoF, well it makes more sense after reading logs
19:45:18 <MigoMipo> Whats the point of this anyway?
19:45:43 <AnMaster> IAmGreenAndAlsoF, you just made that up
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21:32:20 <IAmGreenAndAlsoF> http://www.kongregate.com/games/squidsquid/the-irregulargame-of-life <-- amusing
21:33:33 <FireFly> Found out about that one in school a few months ago
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22:21:53 <IAmGreenAndAlsoF> "we have no doubt that Gdrive will become holy grail for privacy advocates around the world."
22:42:29 * ski__ wonders what the "map" is supposed to show
22:59:51 <ski__> -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- [#esoteric] Welcome to the esoteric programming channel! Check out the esoteric programmers map: http://www.frappr.com/esolang
23:00:19 <IAmGreenAndAlsoF> it's a map of the world with little pins for #esoteric denizens
23:00:20 <ski__> my w3m comes with no javascript
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23:53:57 <oklopol> http://www.kongregate.com/games/squidsquid/the-irregulargame-of-life <<< how utterly boring levels. ofc i doubt you could do much better, gol needs a crapload of bloat until you get to actually interesting stuff, like most automatons, they aren't very puzzly, more programmy.
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