00:39:58 -!- oerjan has joined.
00:40:47 -!- augur has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
00:57:03 -!- coppro has quit ("I am leaving. You are about to explode.").
00:57:47 -!- coppro has joined.
02:08:28 -!- oerjan has quit ("leaving").
03:32:24 -!- fax has quit ("Leaving").
03:41:01 -!- Gracenotes has joined.
04:04:38 -!- augur has joined.
04:07:14 -!- Pthing has joined.
04:36:31 -!- Asztal has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
05:35:58 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
06:11:17 -!- AnMaster_ has changed nick to AnMaster.
06:11:40 -!- oerjan has joined.
06:39:20 -!- pingveno has joined.
07:00:00 -!- FireFly has joined.
07:00:49 -!- pingveno has quit (Remote closed the connection).
07:05:35 -!- oerjan has quit ("leaving").
07:37:28 -!- Asztal has joined.
07:56:50 -!- FireFly has quit ("Later").
07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended).
08:00:00 -!- clog has joined.
08:15:09 -!- kar8nga has joined.
08:26:31 -!- adam_d has joined.
08:45:38 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)).
08:45:47 -!- Slereah has joined.
09:06:47 -!- adam_d has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)).
09:24:27 -!- adam_d has joined.
09:59:27 -!- asiekierka has joined.
09:59:30 <asiekierka> i need an algorithm for the game of life without a need to store the previous copy (the one before processing) of the map
10:24:02 -!- ehird has joined.
10:28:06 <asiekierka> do you know an algorithm for the game of life without a need to store the previous copy (the one before processing) of the map
10:28:16 <ehird> Yes; that's every life algorithm ever.
10:29:47 <asiekierka> these require you to compare against the previous copy
10:29:47 <asiekierka> 2) process blocks against the duplicate
10:33:04 <ehird> asiekierka: You are totally wrong.
10:33:31 <ehird> ...Wait, what? Your steps make no sense.
10:33:33 <asiekierka> a 256x256x256 map takes up 400mb of ram thanks to perl
10:33:41 <ehird> Fix your data structures.
10:33:55 <asiekierka> also i don't feel like doing a rewrite of code by someone else
10:34:05 <asiekierka> and game of life is just an extra piece of code
10:34:27 <ehird> Well I was almost considering helping you but you went and censored brainfuck.
10:35:18 <ehird> That's the f-word, I can clearly see it and understand it as the f word and if it was meant as an insult I'd be just insulted (—except not really, because I'd be too busy laughing at the ridiculousness of censoring such an insult).
10:35:18 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the world ends: ais523 has actually been thinking about Feather | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | asiekierka is back.
10:35:30 <ehird> A few asterisks makes no difference, no matter what some idiotic prudes may think.
10:35:35 -!- ehird has set topic: the world ends: ais523 has actually been thinking about Feather | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D.
10:37:10 <ehird> Blargh, my keyboard is so sweaty.
10:55:30 -!- ehird has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)).
11:06:46 -!- ehird has joined.
11:13:09 -!- adam_d has quit ("Leaving").
11:59:19 -!- Asztal has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
11:59:19 -!- Asztal has joined.
12:02:52 <ehird> hmm, this idea could work. could work.
12:34:58 -!- fax has joined.
12:42:59 -!- kar8nga has quit (Remote closed the connection).
13:36:19 <ehird> My mouse is lagging when web pages load; queer.
13:46:51 -!- fax has quit (Remote closed the connection).
14:01:23 -!- ais523 has joined.
14:10:32 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ touch foo
14:10:32 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ ls -l foo/..namedfork
14:10:33 <ehird> ls: foo/..namedfork: Not a directory
14:10:33 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ ls -l foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:10:33 <ehird> -rw-r--r-- 1 ehird staff 0 14 Oct 14:10 foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:10:39 <ehird> Behold the befuddling bemusement of HFS+!
14:11:14 <ais523> presumably, ..namedfork is indeed not a directory, but can still be seeked into
14:11:45 <ehird> It's just syntactic sugar you can use to access the forks of an HFS+ file with regular filenames.
14:11:50 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ echo hi >foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:11:50 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ cat foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:12:03 <ehird> (..namedfork/rsrc being the resource fork.)
14:12:19 <ais523> resource forks are information that's bundled with a file?
14:12:27 <ehird> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resource_fork
14:12:31 <ehird> "Even in Mac OS X, resource forks are seldom used anymore.", though.
14:13:53 <ehird> ais523: Especially since, e.g. rsync and similar tools will just not look there, making them be lost on backup.
14:14:01 <ehird> Although Apple might have patched rsync at some point to do it.
14:14:13 <ehird> Of course, it fails if you copy data to another filesystem...
14:14:41 <ais523> that's sort-of like a Windows stringtable, except actually sensible
14:15:49 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ touch foo
14:15:49 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ ls -l foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:15:50 <ehird> -rw-r--r-- 1 ehird staff 0 14 Oct 14:15 foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:15:50 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ echo hi >foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:15:50 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ cat foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:15:52 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ rm foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:15:54 <ehird> override rw-r--r-- ehird/staff for foo/..namedfork/rsrc? y
14:15:56 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ ls -l foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:15:58 <ehird> -rw-r--r-- 1 ehird staff 0 14 Oct 14:15 foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:16:00 <ehird> [~/Junk]$ cat foo/..namedfork/rsrc
14:16:18 <ais523> also, why did rm ask to override the file permissions?
14:16:20 <ehird> [14:11] ais523: presumably, ..namedfork is indeed not a directory, but can still be seeked into
14:16:22 <ehird> it means foo isn't a directory
14:16:27 <ehird> so obviously you can't look at foo/..namedfork
14:17:58 <ehird> Good thing nobody uses this thing.
14:18:12 <ehird> ais523: well, icons are stored in a fork actually iirc
14:18:29 <ais523> Windows has something similar, but only for .exe files
14:18:33 <ais523> and they screwed up the implementation
14:18:43 <ehird> why'm I not surprised?
14:19:28 <ehird> ais523: There is a different attribute mechanism though.
14:19:46 <ehird> xattrs, which is from other Unices. Still used today.
14:19:58 <ehird> It *does* handle other filesystems:
14:20:06 <ehird> you get a file called ._{filename}
14:20:17 <ehird> ...and people extracting .zips from OS X users often see them, along with .DS_Store
14:20:31 <ehird> Oh, the ._{filename} stores resource forks too.
14:21:08 <ehird> % cp /Users/john/file2 .
14:21:08 <ehird> % xattr --list file2
14:21:11 <ehird> -rwxrwxrwx 1 john john 4096 Mar 24 22:09 ._file2
14:21:13 <ehird> -rwxrwxrwx 1 john john 15 Mar 24 22:09 file2
14:21:15 <ehird> —http://arstechnica.com/apple/reviews/2005/04/macosx-10-4.ars/7
14:21:19 <ehird> Well, that's a directory containing them all.
14:21:33 <Asztal> When I extract zips from OS X users it sets the file encryption attribute on the extracted files. :|
14:21:34 <ehird> I wonder in what circumstances they get put in a directory.
14:21:46 -!- ais523_ has joined.
14:21:55 -!- ais523 has quit (Nick collision from services.).
14:21:56 -!- ais523_ has changed nick to ais523.
14:22:02 <ehird> that's Jobs protecting his intellectual property.
14:30:39 -!- Sgeo has joined.
14:33:10 <ehird> AAAAAAAARGH! Capital letters!
14:33:23 <ehird> [14:21] Asztal: When I extract zips from OS X users it sets the file encryption attribute on the extracted files. :|
14:33:24 <ehird> [14:21] ais523_ joined the chat room.
14:33:24 <ehird> [14:21] ehird: Asztal: sweet
14:35:12 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
14:55:04 -!- zbrown has quit (Remote closed the connection).
14:55:28 -!- zbrown has joined.
15:15:05 <asiekierka> what esolang should be done for minecraft
15:30:56 <ehird> can't...stop...reading...
15:33:09 -!- ineiros has quit ("leaving").
15:33:24 -!- ineiros has joined.
15:41:26 -!- coppro has quit ("I am leaving. You are about to explode.").
15:50:23 -!- kar8nga has joined.
16:04:48 -!- FireFly has joined.
16:21:40 -!- adam_d has joined.
16:27:00 <ehird> I wonder why mini-filesystems aren't more widely adopted in OS design.
16:27:29 <ehird> For instance, you could implement a saved-search dealie as a real directory, usable by any tool using the standard fs API, just by implementing a few filesystem calls.
16:28:04 <ehird> Sure, you can do it with FUSE, and Plan 9 has similar stuff, but they're too heavyweight to be the best way to do such things without being just a fun hack.
16:31:43 -!- augur has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
16:34:23 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined.
16:37:20 -!- asiekierka has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
16:55:55 -!- augur has joined.
17:04:30 <ehird> i'm so hardcore, activating this key by pressing my fingernail on the circuit board
17:04:30 <ehird> because i can't get the keycap back on
17:06:20 <ais523> ehird: still having keyboard trouble?
17:06:36 <ehird> no, I'm just stuck with an obsessive compulsion to take keycaps off
17:06:56 <ehird> which will, I guess, be fine when i have a proper keyboard with separate keycaps and keyswitches :P
17:07:14 <ehird> the model m's even better there
17:07:17 <ehird> it has a keycap, with the label
17:07:22 <ehird> underneath, a plastic key
17:07:27 <ehird> and that rests on top of the buckling spring
17:07:35 <ehird> so you can rearrange the layout while keeping total full pressable keys
17:07:39 <ehird> (while rearranging)
17:07:49 <Deewiant> Rubber dome is terrible for that :-)
17:08:03 <ehird> scissor-switch atm, which is 50x worse
17:08:13 <ehird> because sometimes the switch sticks to the key, sometimes not
17:08:18 <Deewiant> Eh, you can still press it with your fingernail
17:08:19 <ehird> and it's a bitch to get it back on if it sticks to the key
17:08:23 <ehird> with all the connections
17:08:29 <Deewiant> With rubber dome you can't press it without some kind of utensil
17:08:36 <ehird> I can even put the rubber cap on and press that down.
17:08:47 <ehird> Scissor-switch degrades to bad rubber dome :P
17:09:08 <ehird> typing on a model m with just the springs would be fun
17:11:31 <ehird> I wish I'd never found geekhack or browsed elsewhere than the two tenkeyless Filcos on elitekeyboards; then I'd be considering people who spend $256 on a keyboard crazy instead of envying them :(
17:12:57 <ehird> Also, I wouldn't be wondering how to pronounce Topre
17:19:28 <Deewiant> It's 東プレ = topure so pretty much /topre/
17:20:43 <ehird> Yeah, I can't read IPA
17:23:24 <Deewiant> I guess [o] isn't a sound you're used to but [ɒ] is close enough (top, plop, hot, etc.)
17:23:43 <ehird> Oh, I had taken "toh" for granted, heh
17:23:53 <ehird> I was debating "top-er" vs "to-pray"
17:25:34 <Deewiant> [e] is another one which you might not know that well, instead [ɛ] like in "red", "bed", etc.
17:26:25 <ehird> So basically "toe press" without the Ss.
17:26:50 -!- jix has joined.
17:26:59 <ehird> The r in there is kinda hard to pronounce with the rest
17:28:17 <ehird> So, we're discussing the pronunciation of an expensive switch used in niche keyboards.
17:28:23 <ehird> Good afternoon, #esoteric!
17:28:43 <ehird> *computer keyboards
17:28:51 <Deewiant> It's [r], not the lame-ass [ɹ]
17:28:57 <ehird> So, we're discussing the pronunciation of the name of an expensive mechanical switch name used in niche computer keyboards.
17:29:01 <ehird> Good afternoon, #esoteric!
17:29:06 <ehird> Deewiant: Is that latter one the British r?
17:29:14 <ehird> If so, fuck you our Rs are awesome.
17:29:37 <Deewiant> Actually that might be the American one
17:30:24 <Deewiant> I'm pretty sure the British one is an approximant and not a trill anyways :-P
17:32:30 <Deewiant> Wikipedia sez [ʋ] is the "mostly idiosyncratic but somewhat dialectal" one, ɻ and ɹ being in "American dialects"
17:32:41 <Deewiant> Anyway, those are all approximants
17:33:16 <ais523> and a brilliant r it is
17:33:30 <ais523> unfortunately, pretty much only Scots can pronounce it, that's a relatively easy way to tell if someone's Scottish or not
17:34:11 <ehird> Scots always sound like they're being jerks and purposefully emphasising their silly accent to me
17:34:15 <ehird> Even if they're just speaking normally
17:37:06 <Deewiant> Well anyway you probably fail at 60% of the sounds in that word
17:37:32 <ehird> You are a horrible prson
17:45:44 * ais523 reads conspiracy theories about the Microsoft/Danger/T-Mobile thing
17:45:46 <ais523> http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2009/10/12/microsofts-sidekickpink-problems-blamed-on-dogfooding-and-sabotage/
17:46:06 <ais523> the theory is that the reason they couldn't restore from backups is that someone had deliberately sabotaged the backup process
17:46:15 -!- fax has joined.
17:49:43 -!- ehird has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)).
18:24:01 <Ilari> The backups thingy is too unbelievable to be explainable with incompetence? :->
18:24:30 <ais523> Ilari: considering that they're likely to get sued to oblivion over this, probably
18:24:43 <ais523> T-Mobile apparently had a SLA with Danger, that Microsoft inherited when they bought them
18:25:04 <ais523> and completely deleting all the data stored on a system is about the worst possible breach of an SLA you canget
18:32:39 <Ilari> Where did you hear that somebody issued commands to delete the data?
18:39:46 <ais523> Ilari: it's suggested by that article above
18:39:51 <ais523> which doesn't state it as fact
18:39:57 <ais523> I mentioned in here that it was a conspiracy theory
18:40:02 <ais523> and not one I necessarily believe
18:40:05 <ais523> but conspiracy theories are fun to read
18:43:13 -!- fax has quit ("Leaving").
19:09:19 <Ilari> Especially when those who write them are not incoherent frothing-from-mouth types...
19:42:11 -!- kar8nga has quit (Remote closed the connection).
20:07:15 -!- MigoMipo has joined.
20:34:26 -!- oerjan has joined.
20:53:02 -!- oerjan has quit ("Reboot").
20:55:44 -!- oerjan has joined.
21:04:02 -!- fax has joined.
21:23:44 -!- MigoMipo has quit ("Page closed").
21:24:17 -!- FireFly has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:17 -!- puzzlet has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:18 -!- EgoBot has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:18 -!- Slereah has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:19 -!- Cerise has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:20 -!- Gracenotes has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:21 -!- fizziew has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- ineiros has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- Asztal has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- Ilari has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- dbc has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- Deewiant has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- iamcal has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:25 -!- bsmntbombdood has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:26 -!- SimonRC has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:26 -!- jix has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:26 -!- augur has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:26 -!- adam_d has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:27 -!- Pthing has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:27 -!- AnMaster has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:28 -!- Warrigal has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:28 -!- HackEgo has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:28 -!- mtve has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:30 -!- zbrown has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:30 -!- ais523 has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:30 -!- sebbu2 has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:30 -!- fizzie has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:30 -!- MizardX has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:30 -!- Gregor has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:31 -!- pikhq has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:31 -!- Leonidas has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:31 -!- comex_ has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:32 -!- oerjan has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:35 -!- rodgort has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:24:35 -!- olsner has quit (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:25:07 -!- kar8nga has joined.
21:26:59 -!- fax has quit ("Leaving").
21:28:16 -!- fax has joined.
21:35:31 -!- oerjan has joined.
21:35:31 -!- jix has joined.
21:35:31 -!- augur has joined.
21:35:31 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined.
21:35:31 -!- adam_d has joined.
21:35:31 -!- FireFly has joined.
21:35:31 -!- ineiros has joined.
21:35:31 -!- zbrown has joined.
21:35:31 -!- ais523 has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Asztal has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Slereah has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Pthing has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Gracenotes has joined.
21:35:31 -!- AnMaster has joined.
21:35:31 -!- sebbu2 has joined.
21:35:31 -!- iamcal has joined.
21:35:31 -!- bsmntbombdood has joined.
21:35:31 -!- fizzie has joined.
21:35:31 -!- puzzlet has joined.
21:35:31 -!- SimonRC has joined.
21:35:31 -!- MizardX has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Gregor has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Cerise has joined.
21:35:31 -!- EgoBot has joined.
21:35:31 -!- rodgort has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Ilari has joined.
21:35:31 -!- pikhq has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Leonidas has joined.
21:35:31 -!- comex_ has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Deewiant has joined.
21:35:31 -!- dbc has joined.
21:35:31 -!- HackEgo has joined.
21:35:31 -!- mtve has joined.
21:35:31 -!- Warrigal has joined.
21:35:31 -!- fizziew has joined.
21:35:31 -!- olsner has joined.
21:36:06 -!- kar8nga has changed nick to Guest36861.
21:54:52 -!- Pthing has quit (Remote closed the connection).
22:10:27 -!- Guest36861 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
22:25:42 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
22:36:21 -!- jix has joined.
22:58:58 -!- adam_d has quit ("Leaving").
23:17:03 -!- FireFly has quit ("Later").
23:25:58 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
23:35:52 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)).
23:43:59 -!- Sgeo has joined.
23:44:02 -!- coppro has joined.