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00:19:05 <Gregor> In principle, the libc.so auction has started.
00:19:11 <Gregor> In practice, IT HAS VANISHED FROM THE MATERIAL PLANE
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01:14:31 <Gregor> I have at least one active competitor for libc.so
01:15:23 <Sgeo> And it turned out.... IT WAS GREGOR FROM THE FUTURE
01:18:18 <oerjan> he was sent back to prevent Ulrich Drepper from getting it, but something went wrong in the planning
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04:11:33 <oerjan> today's xkcd reminds me of a dream i had that i may have mentioned here before
04:15:53 <Sgeo> Did you dream that xkcd would remind you of a dream?
04:16:32 <oerjan> no, the dream did not have anything to do with xkcd, afair
04:16:41 <oerjan> i'm not sure i'd heard of xkcd then.
04:17:41 <oerjan> it did include a wall map of the place i was in, that somehow became identical to the place itself.
04:18:57 <oerjan> and when something touched the spot of the map where the map itself was, everything started dissolving into pixels.
04:20:11 <oerjan> it was probably inspired by another comic i'd seen before with a similar theme.
04:21:09 <oerjan> (someone pointing to the "you are here" mark on a map, and people around them panicking as a giant finger appears from the sky)
04:23:45 <Sgeo> That sounds PBF-like, but I don't recall any such PBF
04:24:15 <oerjan> no, it's from the 90's at least. it may have been bizarro.
04:25:38 <oerjan> i mean i have a vague picture in my head that _looks_ like a bizarro comic
04:27:40 <Sgeo> "If my math is correct, I just helped pay off 10% of the debt. $1.50 divided by $15 trillion = 10% right?"
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04:28:04 <Sgeo> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2116548608/help-erase-the-national-debt-of-the-usa/comments
04:29:36 <zzo38> I found a code that displays "Just another _______ hacker" with the name of the programming language filled in, working for these programming languages: C, C++, Perl, Plain TeX, PostScript, LaTeX, zsh, Bourne Shell. (For TeX, PostScript, and LaTeX, it prints the text on the paper) Now we could add in even more, including some esoteric programming, too.
04:30:18 <Sgeo> I thought you hated LaTeX
04:30:39 <zzo38> Is true, I do not like LaTeX. However, I found this code. (I have not tested it at all)
04:31:53 <zzo38> (I did not write this code. I do not even know how to write a code in PostScript.)
04:33:16 <Sgeo> Oh, a polygot-like thing that prints whatever language it's being used as?
04:33:35 <zzo38> Sgeo: Yes, that is what it is.
04:33:37 <Sgeo> How does it differentiate between C and C++?
04:34:08 <Sgeo> I guess C++ has comments that C doesn't, hmm
04:34:21 <zzo38> No, that is not how it does it.
04:34:32 <Sgeo> Link to it maybe?
04:34:34 <zzo38> There it is: http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?displaytype=displaycode;node_id=520121
04:35:31 <zzo38> I guess there is a difference in sizeof in C++?
04:36:23 <Sgeo> How does %: avoid being a syntax error in C and C++?
04:37:26 <zzo38> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digraphs_and_trigraphs#C
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05:05:18 <oerjan> ah it was bizarro indeed
05:06:16 <oerjan> hm let me see if i can find that date on the web
05:06:49 <Vorpal> "++"+2*(1%sizeof'2') <-- that makes no sense to me
05:07:58 <Vorpal> is sizeof '2' not 1 in C++?
05:08:34 <Vorpal> wait a second. That doesn't work. It is division by zero then
05:08:58 <Vorpal> I can't see how that code can ever work for C++...
05:09:23 <Vorpal> unless it relies on undefined behaviour
05:10:29 <Vorpal> it is quite clear how it works for C, by advancing the pointer two steps you get the null string
05:11:31 <Vorpal> Sgeo, oerjan, zzo38: I'm confused, how can that code ever work for the C++ case?
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05:13:07 <Vorpal> oh well, have to leave, cya
05:13:39 <oerjan> it's March 21 1999, but i cannot find it on the web :(
05:17:24 <oerjan> you want 1%sizeof'2' to be 1 for c++ and 0 for c, i presume
05:18:03 <oerjan> assuming string pointers work the same in both
05:18:48 <oerjan> if sizeof'2' is anything > 1 in c++, that should work
05:20:44 <oerjan> oh wait i'm thinking backwards
05:21:31 <oerjan> !c printf("%d", (sizeof'2'));
05:21:51 <Sgeo> How is sizeof'2' 4?
05:21:53 <oerjan> !c++ printf("%d", (sizeof'2'));
05:22:11 <EgoBot> help: General commands: !help, !info, !bf_txtgen. See also !help languages, !help userinterps. You can get help on some commands by typing !help <command>.
05:22:21 <Sgeo> !help languages
05:22:21 <EgoBot> languages: Esoteric: 1l 2l adjust asm axo bch befunge befunge98 bf bf8 bf16 bf32 boolfuck cintercal clcintercal dimensifuck glass glypho haskell kipple lambda lazyk linguine malbolge pbrain perl qbf rail rhotor sadol sceql trigger udage01 underload unlambda whirl. Competitive: bfjoust fyb. Other: asm c cxx forth sh.
05:22:22 <EgoBot> languages: Esoteric: 1l 2l adjust asm axo bch befunge befunge98 bf bf8 bf16 bf32 boolfuck cintercal clcintercal dimensifuck glass glypho haskell kipple lambda lazyk linguine malbolge pbrain perl qbf rail rhotor sadol sceql trigger udage01 underload unlambda whirl. Competitive: bfjoust fyb. Other: asm c cxx forth sh.
05:22:35 <oerjan> !cxx printf("%d", (sizeof'2'));
05:23:15 <Sgeo> that's just bizarre
05:23:20 <Sgeo> Why is.. those things?
05:24:05 <oerjan> why is the size of a character constant 4 in C?
05:24:34 <oerjan> !c printf("%d", (sizeof'1'));
05:24:45 <oerjan> !c printf("%d", (sizeof('1')));
05:26:00 <zzo38> A character constant in C is "int" type
05:34:37 <fizzie> That's something C++ changes.
05:34:41 <fizzie> Oh, you tested that too.
05:37:24 <oerjan> yes, that seems to explain the c/c++ difference in the polyglot
05:37:39 <fizzie> C++ also has multicharacter literals of type 'int'.
05:37:48 <fizzie> !cxx printf("%d", sizeof('ab'))
05:38:20 <fizzie> (The actual value of such a thing is implementation-defined.)
05:38:42 <fizzie> !cxx printf("%04x", (unsigned)'ab');
05:39:19 <fizzie> That's I guess the obvious choice.
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05:45:11 <fizzie> I like how the polyglot uses the %: digraph for # in the #include <stdio.h> part.
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05:49:18 <fizzie> !c char *p = "unreadable"; if (1) <% printf("digraphs are so %s", &p<:2:>); %>
05:49:21 <EgoBot> digraphs are so readable
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12:36:01 <Gregor> OMG, this domain bidding site is evil/clever.
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12:37:05 <Gregor> "Please note that when the leader of an auction is outbid in the last 24 hours of the scheduled auction close, the auction will extend to close 24 hours after the leader change occurred."
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12:43:45 <Vorpal> Gregor, so how goes the auction?
12:44:14 <Gregor> I'm in the lead for libm but it now won't be closing 'til tomorrow, I'm not in the lead for libc but it's only at $60 and there's a week left.
12:45:13 <Vorpal> Gregor, so how much is libm up at then?
12:45:25 <Gregor> Too much already, $110 :P
12:47:45 <Vorpal> likely libc will go higher
12:47:54 <Vorpal> it is somewhat more famous than libm
12:48:47 <Vorpal> Gregor, is this the yearly cost or a one-time cost you are bidding for?
12:49:33 <Gregor> What sort of bizarre universe has a bid for yearly-cost on a domain name :P
12:49:41 <Gregor> I'm not paying hundreds/year on this shit :P
13:00:46 <Sgeo_> Is it acceptable to wear a shirt twice not in a row without washing?
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13:18:48 <variable> Sgeo_: depends on the type of shit
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14:50:17 <Gregor> El Cheapo Hosting Inc upgraded my plan X-D
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15:43:59 <oerjan> zzo reads godel's letter? http://rjlipton.wordpress.com/2011/03/09/tex-is-great-what-is-tex/#comment-11392
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16:03:21 <Ilari> APNIC down 0.19: 2M to Pakistan, 32k to Singapore, 1M to South Korea, 2k+/32 to Japan, 2k to Indonesia, /32 to Hong Kong.
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16:09:34 <Ilari> New depletion estimate (using the same random algo as the last time): Friday 15th April.
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16:29:34 <augur> whats it called when you have two programs battling for memory?
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17:41:11 <elliott> 05:21:31: <oerjan> !c printf("%d", (sizeof'2'));
17:41:15 <elliott> 05:22:35: <oerjan> !cxx printf("%d", (sizeof'2'));
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17:42:46 <elliott> 13:00:46: <Sgeo_> Is it acceptable to wear a shirt twice not in a row without washing?
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18:06:40 <Ilari> Whoop: 2.019 blocks this month. Crazy.
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19:26:47 <Gregor> glogbot is now backed by glogbackup, running on Fly By Wire VPS Survisses!
19:27:15 <Gregor> Rest assured, should glogbot go down, Fly By Wire Inc. has your data.
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19:29:22 <Ilari> APNIC relative allocations last 30 days: ~86%
19:33:46 <fizzie> Relative to what? Total amount of allocations?
19:34:43 <Gregor> HALP my advisor and the postdoc working on this project are both sitting AT MY DESK
19:34:55 <Ilari> RIPE NCC: 8.0%, AFRINIC: 3.5%, LACNIC: 1.4%, ARIN: 1.2%
19:35:03 <fizzie> It's all good as long as they're not sitting ON YOUR DESK.
19:38:36 <Ilari> At rate shown in last 30 days, RIPE NCC would deplete in about a year. Of course, there is considerable seasonal variation.
19:41:51 <Phantom_Hoover> <Gregor> glogbot is now backed by glogbackup, running on Fly By Wire VPS Survisses™! ← is that the ultra-cheap one?
19:42:43 <Phantom_Hoover> In other news, my idiot chemistry teacher has outdone herself.
19:43:04 <Phantom_Hoover> She incoherently argued with me for several minutes that relative atomic masses are unitless.
19:43:39 <Gregor> Phantom_Hoover: That's my name for the ultra-cheap one :P
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19:48:08 <Gregor> Phantom_Hoover: But so far it actually seems just fine. Very get-what-you-pay-for, but no real problems.
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20:04:42 <oerjan> <Gregor> I'M SURROUNDED D-8
20:04:49 <oerjan> clearly you must blast your way out
20:05:09 <Gregor> I'll do a barrel roll!
20:16:36 <Phantom_Hoover> Gregor is stunned into silence by the extremity of the measure.
20:17:22 <Gregor> No, I'm just STILL SURROUNDED >_<
20:20:11 <Sgeo> What is this the Device?
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23:42:48 <elliott> <elliott> If p is a pointer, is p[-1] defined equivalent to *(p-1)? I know array[-1] is undefined.
23:43:45 <Mathnerd314> I'd expect it to be that in practice... check a spec
23:47:22 <elliott> I suppose I'll find a pyrate C89 standard.
23:48:59 <Mathnerd314> there's a draft: http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/WG14/www/docs/n1256.pdf
23:49:43 <elliott> http://flash-gordon.me.uk/ansi.c.txt ;; is greppable.
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23:50:29 <elliott> Seems like [] isn't even defined for pointers X_X
23:51:09 <oerjan> um i'm pretty sure i've read that a[b] is precisely equal to *(a+b) ...
23:51:16 <coppro> elliott: array[-1] is only undefined because *(array-1) is out of bounds usually
23:51:22 <elliott> oerjan: i'm trying to find the definition for pointers :)
23:51:24 <oerjan> 3["abc"] and all that...
23:51:31 <elliott> oerjan: but the C standard is wily.
23:51:31 <coppro> elliott: actually, it isn't defined for arrays
23:51:35 <elliott> oerjan: anyway it is not precisely equal.
23:51:36 <coppro> it is equivalent for pointers
23:51:43 <coppro> arrays just decay into pointers
23:51:43 <elliott> foo[n] is only defined for 0 <= n < array length
23:51:53 <elliott> ofc, *(foo+n) is only defined for 0 <= n < array length
23:52:20 <elliott> int foo[3]; /* I very much doubt foo[3] is well-defined */
23:52:50 <oerjan> foo+n is for n <= array length, but you may not be able to dereference it i guess
23:53:06 <elliott> you just can't dereference it without UB
23:53:19 <elliott> actually i don't even want that, it seems :(
23:53:25 <elliott> struct foo { blah *foo[0]; }
23:53:28 <elliott> which is invalid right from the start
23:53:32 <elliott> and then I want to do x->foo[-1]
23:53:37 <oerjan> elliott: no, i vaguely recall that it is perfectly possible for pointer arithmetic outside those bounds to crash
23:53:37 <elliott> which is definitely invalid, I think
23:53:46 <elliott> oerjan: Errrrr, I hope not
23:53:49 <oerjan> even if you don't dereference
23:54:55 <oerjan> i'm pretty sure i've seen something like that
23:55:12 <oerjan> otherwise why include foo+array length as a specifically permitted case
23:56:02 <elliott> btw it's not so much "to crash" as "UB" ;D
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23:56:39 <elliott> maybe i'll just do the invalid thing :)
23:57:47 <oerjan> well i used crash as a synonym, of course