00:00:04 <monqy> maxhp-10% per mutlevel
00:01:49 <monqy> maybe he'll splat on the orb run
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00:02:11 <monqy> wow, quaffing might instead of dropping sutff to get rid of his burden
00:02:49 <monqy> might expired, mmmm
00:02:53 <monqy> hopefully he gets mothzerked
00:03:03 <elliott> monqy: do those moths zerk
00:03:29 <monqy> they have "rage" melee which berks stuff they hit and they also berk stuff in los
00:03:38 <monqy> so you get stuff like berserk orb guardians, which hurt
00:03:43 -!- Deewiant has joined.
00:04:12 <elliott> 01:03 <Blade-> !lg * tiles 0.10 ntv=0 ktyp!=quitting|leaving|winning killer!=tentacled monstrosity|greater naga|naga warrior max=xl -tv
00:04:16 <elliott> what is with the killer exclusions here
00:05:06 <monqy> exclusion of constriction deaths; presumably tiles players die to constriction in a boring predictable fassion, thus its exclusion
00:05:45 -!- itidus20 has joined.
00:05:46 <elliott> im glad i never had the desire to use tiles for a roguelike ever
00:06:43 <monqy> wow use G1 not X< aaagh
00:06:53 <elliott> what's wrong with X1 (just so I know)
00:07:01 <elliott> oh because it can use upstairs that are closer to other upstairs?
00:07:21 <monqy> X< is bad because it only goes one level at a time so you go through the dungeon slowly and have to do it each level
00:07:26 <monqy> GD1 goes to dungeon level
00:08:19 <monqy> orb run is for the most part real boring
00:08:44 -!- itidus22 has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds).
00:08:47 <monqy> but sometimes it can be crazy if you get, say, a silly powerful panlord
00:08:58 <monqy> or a 1 or two on a weak character
00:09:15 <coppro> why is TeX so beautiful
00:09:20 <elliott> i like how that guy didn't
00:09:38 <elliott> (it still bugs me when i see others not)
00:09:53 <monqy> it's bugging me that he's not dying
00:10:01 <monqy> at this rate he'll ascend with (Hit _)
00:10:10 <elliott> "A sufficiently persistent player will eventually rack up a couple wins with their Felid Chaos Knight that remains loyal to Xom no matter what, but that doesn't change the fact that felids are terrible and Xom is terrible and they aren't any better when you put them together."
00:10:13 <elliott> maybe i'll just play feck of feck
00:10:17 <elliott> (im addicted to reading stupid tavern threads now oops)
00:10:57 <elliott> i see nobody's done a 15-rune feck
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00:11:42 <elliott> 01:11 <xgamer> ah didn't see :( was too involved in the game
00:11:59 -!- Deewiant has joined.
00:12:15 <ion> Now back to homowork.
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00:21:34 <ion> elliott: You can type ca to CHOP ALL THE CORPSES.
00:22:03 <monqy> that sure sounds useful eh
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00:31:52 <ion> Matrix of Solidity would be a great title for a game.
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00:36:51 <elliott> monqy: should i keep the chain mail on
00:36:57 <monqy> train armour if you want better ac/ev (you want better ac/ev)
00:37:20 <elliott> i was gonna train unarmed combat to 10 before training other things but
00:37:23 <elliott> maybe i should train armour as well
00:37:37 <monqy> training uc to 10 is sensible too
00:37:46 <monqy> i think it's sensible??
00:38:01 <elliott> i just picked 10 arbitrarily (i kept it on after that but i trained other thniings too)
00:38:09 <elliott> i don't really know what i'm doing :(
00:38:43 <monqy> no but that sounds pretty reasonable
00:38:57 <elliott> okbut in that case maybe i should switch back to the other armour for now :'(
00:39:14 <monqy> do whatever feels right??? i dunnnno
00:39:39 <elliott> i wish i could split it like
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00:42:01 <elliott> _One of your 3 potions of curing freezes and shatters!
00:42:52 <elliott> perhaps one day monqy will return to us
00:42:57 <lambdabot> Local time for monqy is Thu May 3 17:42:56 2012
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00:46:58 <elliott> _h - a scroll labeled PNYVEGAPRO {tried on scroll labeled PNYVEGAPRO}
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00:48:47 <elliott> monqy: You finish putting on the cursed -4 cloak of the Fifty Eyes {+Blink MR Str+1}.
00:49:12 -!- elliott has changed nick to elliptiott.
00:49:32 <elliptiott> 01:48 <faze> every time i see elliott i think i see elliptic
00:49:49 <elliptiott> great, I don't even have remove curse :D
00:50:17 <ion> Not going to get a god?
00:51:13 <elliptiott> in that sure seeing monsters behind walls and stuff was nice but it never actually got me out of a tight spot
00:51:35 <elliptiott> so i'm considering going with makhleb again
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00:55:57 <ion> Have you tried vacuuming the dungeon for Nemelex yet?
00:56:06 <ion> Have you tried a deep elf summoner yet?
00:56:54 <elliptiott> You may choose your destination (press '.' or delete to select).
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01:00:17 <elliptiott> I quaffed a potion of gain strength but instead I just decomposed because it counts as a mutation.
01:03:13 <ion> I expected you to move left. :-\
01:04:09 <ion> Play a DESu.
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01:05:56 <elliptiott> telnet crawl.develz.org 345, then w and select elliott's letter if you want to see.
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01:07:08 <ion> Bind \{6}armour\{13} to a free key such as “1”.
01:07:13 <NihilistDandy> solarized-dark is probably the wrong color scheme for this :D
01:07:16 <elliptiott> I don't have any configuration changes.
01:07:37 <ion> You don’t even need to change configuration.
01:07:44 <ion> Hit… err, was it ` or ~
01:09:25 <ion> I use 1 for searching for armour, 2 for searching for my main weapon (e.g. axes) and 3 for searching for corpses i can eat/offer.
01:09:58 <ion> Me, too, except when i fight a bunch of guys at once or simply forget.
01:10:18 <elliptiott> Patashu: Of nothing. I haven't found the Temple yet.
01:10:24 <Patashu> what do you plan on taking
01:10:40 <ion> You should also play a hill orc monk for the hilarious bot messages on ##crawl.
01:10:47 <elliptiott> My experience with Ashenzari was disappointing.
01:10:58 <Patashu> if you got 5/6 star ash piety ash is good
01:11:01 <Patashu> but you never bound yourself enough
01:11:04 <Patashu> so, try him again sometime
01:11:12 <Patashu> so you can bind your weapon
01:11:22 <Patashu> really really long range divination
01:11:32 <Patashu> you can use bucklers as UC
01:12:31 <elliptiott> Anyway, Makhleb's combat abilities seem more useful than Ashenzari's divination abilities for a melee fighter to me.
01:12:55 <Patashu> he's a monk so he starts with **
01:12:59 <Patashu> even though he doesn't worship yet
01:13:03 <elliptiott> But since I don't have a god right now, it's greyed-out.
01:13:53 <NihilistDandy> So is Crawl just netback with more weirdness and Sierra-like dickishness
01:14:04 <elliptiott> Crawl isn't all that much like NetHack.
01:14:25 <ion> patashu: Oh? That’s cool. I guess that has been done within the last six months.
01:14:35 <Patashu> nihilist: it's not much like nethack
01:14:44 <Patashu> if you want a game like playing nethack, I recommend adom
01:15:10 <NihilistDandy> Compare this game to something, I suppose. I might like to play.
01:15:21 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Crawl is like NetHack but with larger maps and probably more grinding; it's more regular in that there's fewer spoilers that aren't monster statistics.
01:15:28 <Patashu> a roguelike that's actually fun to play unspoiled
01:15:40 <Patashu> you don't need to memorize like
01:15:45 <Patashu> the cost of things in shops before they're identified
01:15:48 <elliptiott> I would get frustrated if I didn't ask Henzell about new monsters I encounter.
01:15:53 <Patashu> what all these scrolls will do when read while confused
01:16:07 <Patashu> yeah, crawl is definitely more fun with henzell/gretell
01:16:26 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: FWIW, Crawl is probably the most popular roguelike.
01:16:43 <elliptiott> I just killed two jackals with a piece of paper.
01:16:55 <NihilistDandy> And what with hanging out in #haskell and #esoteric, you know popularity is my first concern :D
01:16:59 <ion> elliott: No, you didn’t. You killed them with your secondary claw attack.
01:17:34 <Patashu> no way to turn off aux attacks
01:18:10 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: If you want to play and you're in America, you might like to play on crawl.akrasiac.org instead.
01:18:40 <Sgeo> I still need to make a Scumbag Ola Bini image
01:19:54 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Also Crawl has autoexplore and autofight.
01:19:59 <elliptiott> Which makes the grinding aspect a lot less tedious.
01:20:01 <Patashu> the two best things about crawl
01:20:11 <Patashu> it would be better if grinding was eliminated
01:20:13 <elliptiott> (In case you thought I was actually pressing the direction keys that quickly.)
01:20:15 <Patashu> but making the grinding trivial is just as good
01:20:32 <elliptiott> (The autofight isn't anything magically special, it just does the attack you would do yourself in one turn.)
01:20:38 <elliptiott> (So you can spam tab a lot for weaker stuff.)
01:20:40 <Patashu> crawl tells you what monsters will probably be a tough fight for you
01:20:45 <Patashu> dark gray, gray, yellow, red
01:21:06 <elliptiott> I like how I had curing and heal wounds.
01:21:14 <ion> elliott: DESu!
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01:21:45 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: (You'll have to q and select the letter again if you want to keep watching.)
01:21:58 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Oh, and Crawl comes with a lot of interface tweaks compared to NetHack.
01:22:10 <elliptiott> I'm playing with stock configuration and the autopickup, colours, travel etc. are all more or less how I like them.
01:22:32 <NihilistDandy> Colors are inline with my terminal colors, so that's good enough for me :D
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01:22:35 <Patashu> another favourite feature of crawl of mine
01:22:41 <Patashu> is the ability to put forced pauses on regexes
01:22:49 <Patashu> so I can tell the game I want it to pause whenever I miscast a spell
01:22:53 <Patashu> or whenever two slime creatures merge
01:22:56 <Patashu> or whatever silly thing I die because of
01:23:08 <elliptiott> I couldn't do that because I'd have to put every message on pause.
01:23:27 <elliptiott> The joke is that I die from everything.
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01:23:51 <elliptiott> Do butterflies ever attack under any circumstances?
01:24:00 <elliptiott> The only person Sequell knows to have tied from a butterfly is by inner flame.
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01:25:01 <Patashu> you could modify the game to give them an attack
01:25:04 <Patashu> but you'd be playing offline
01:25:34 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Xom (Henzell links to this in its Xom entry so I'm guessing it's not as terrible as some of the wiki.)
01:26:11 <Patashu> not everything in the wiki is bad
01:26:14 <Patashu> mostly it's the advice that's bad
01:27:46 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: (Not to say that Crawl isn't entirely free of Sierra-style stuff, btw; it's quite possible for a monster to decide to show up rather before it's reasonable to.)
01:28:00 <elliptiott> (But you can run away. Well, most of the time.)
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01:36:56 <Patashu> fast as anything else I guess
01:37:48 <elliptiott> Maybe I'll enchant that plate armour for later.
01:39:19 <Patashu> you should enchant secondary pieces of armour first
01:39:22 <Patashu> since you're the least likely to replace thrm
01:39:28 <Patashu> even plate might be replaced by dragon scale or cpa
01:40:00 <ion> Add ”hits you from afar” to force_more_messages.
01:40:02 <elliptiott> Because I have no viable getaway plan?
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01:40:26 <Patashu> they're the same speed as you
01:40:38 <Patashu> they WERE a tile away from you
01:40:41 <Patashu> until you decided to fight them
01:41:28 <Patashu> tele is risky on a mostly uncleared level
01:41:57 <Patashu> imo waste of a blinking scroll but ok
01:43:52 <elliptiott> So what is the penalty for a buckler exactly?
01:44:02 <Patashu> let me see if I can back that up with numbers
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01:44:26 <Patashu> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqvhLOPFHpiMdHFWbVpnU3F6M2VlQWV5Rk56UDNaNHc#gid=1
01:44:46 <Patashu> it looks like at shields 5 the penalty for buckler wearing vanishes
01:48:50 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: What server are you playing on?
01:49:13 <NihilistDandy> elliptiott: The first one you linked. Just died, though. Dropped through an escape hatch surrounded by monsters :/
01:49:33 <NihilistDandy> 77 NihilistDandy the Grave Robber (level 2, -1/19 (20) HPs)
01:49:41 <elliptiott> Yeah, try not to fall down escape hatches :P
01:50:44 <elliptiott> I started out as a Mummy Chaos Knight.
01:50:51 <elliptiott> That's not an endorsement of Mummy Chaos Knights.
01:50:55 <elliptiott> For the love of god, don't play a Mummy Chaos Knight.
01:51:38 <elliptiott> FWIW, the combinations that are Bad are greyed out.
01:51:43 <elliptiott> Once you pick a species or background.
01:51:43 <itidus20> non-trivially suboptimal (just kidding im not at all aware of it)
01:51:51 <elliptiott> That doesn't mean the remaining combinations are Good.
01:52:25 <elliptiott> Right now it's using terminal codes that make all your grey messages appear black to other terminals.
01:52:34 <Patashu> if you like hitting things hard, play a minotaur berserker or hill orc berserker. if you like casting spells and running away from things, try spriggan wizard or spriggan venom mage
01:52:38 <elliptiott> Because of silly tailor-to-the-terminal-you're-using stuff.
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01:53:42 <elliptiott> Dunno; you'll have to keep playing to tell.
01:54:07 <elliptiott> Also, "c" over a corpse to chop it into edible chunks.
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01:54:25 <ion> Which isn’t useful for vampires.
01:54:25 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Seriously, drop that leather armour and spear :P
01:54:43 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Uhh, dropping things takes one turn per item though.
01:54:46 <elliptiott> So be wary of doing that around monsters.
01:55:15 <elliptiott> You should have picked that gnoll off with a blowgun, really :)
01:55:28 <elliptiott> Gnolls are particularly nasty, so don't worry too much.
01:55:31 <ion> Try a less kynäniska berserker.
01:55:59 <elliptiott> I second the MiBe recommendation, despite having no experience with it.
01:56:15 <elliptiott> A lot of other combinations will require quite a bit more delicacy early on, methinks.
01:56:21 <ion> Also, TrBe is a tank.
01:56:34 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Also, with berserkers you worship Trog! He loves bloodshed and hates magic.
01:56:37 <ion> It might be fun in the early game.
01:56:39 <elliptiott> And you get to go berserk, which makes everything go red and you get stronger.
01:56:49 <elliptiott> (You get exhausted afterwards, but oh well.)
01:57:14 <ion> Yes, you get exhausted after berserking just like in real life.
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01:57:35 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Also, with ghouls you regain HP when eating.
01:58:27 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: BTW, G is the travel command. So once you've fully explored, G> gets you down quickly.
02:00:16 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Press p if you want to convert to Ashey.
02:01:02 <elliptiott> (It likes you cursing your items (which just means you can't take them off).)
02:01:12 <elliptiott> (In return you get info about the map and monsters nearby and the like.)
02:01:35 <elliptiott> (Also changing god brings down the wrath of the previous god on you, so you're pretty much stuck with Ashenzari.)
02:01:37 <ion> Hit ^ to see your boundness.
02:02:22 <ion> MiBe. Or TrBe. Or somethingBe.
02:02:52 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Oh yeah, you probably want to press m and adjust your skills.
02:02:59 <ion> You can berserk with a.
02:03:02 <elliptiott> Patashu and ion can advise about the best skills for MiBe.
02:03:13 <elliptiott> Don't use the arrow keys, just use the letters. :p
02:03:17 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Yeah, turn everything btu axes off.
02:03:31 <Patashu> and swap away from hthat hand axe asap, it's shit
02:03:47 <Patashu> war axe, broad axe, battleaxe and executioner's axe from worst to best
02:03:48 <ion> Switch to manual mode to make sure only axes are trained.
02:04:31 <ion> (But you might want to train fighting and armour as well at least at some point.)
02:04:51 <elliptiott> I hear Fighting got seriously nerfed recently.
02:05:05 <Patashu> don't train fighting until about xl16
02:05:21 <ion> You can move and fight diagonally with yubn.
02:05:36 <ion> Moving with hjkl when there’s an enemy diagonally next to you gives them free hits.
02:05:53 <ion> And escaping with hjkl when you want to move diagonally gives them free hits also.
02:06:00 <elliptiott> I bet NihilistDandy is using arrow keys.
02:06:44 <elliptiott> Don't convert to Ashey this time. Trog doesn't like that. :p
02:07:07 <ion> Now hit a. Trog likes it when you burn spellbooks.
02:07:22 <ion> No, you’re not supposed to.
02:07:29 <elliptiott> It was out of LOS when I said that, I think.
02:08:16 <elliptiott> Okay, that didn't actually get you a star of piety. But it got you a fraction of one!
02:08:22 <elliptiott> The more piety you get, the more nice abilities you get.
02:08:23 <ion> The leather armour is better than your animal skin.
02:08:46 <ion> d, to drop useless items, but you usually don’t need to drop rotting chunks since they’ll just rot away.
02:10:00 <ion> When in the situation @.X where X is an enemy, don’t move toward her. Let her move toward you. You’ll get the first hit.
02:10:27 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: (Use . to wait a turn. Also, 5 makes you rest to restore HP, which is useful if you run out of it and there's nothing dangerous around.)
02:11:00 <ion> You gave it two free hits.
02:11:18 <ion> Don’t go down yet.
02:11:59 <ion> Especially a +4 chain mail. :-P
02:12:24 <Patashu> skin/robe, leather, ring, scale ,chain, splint, plate, dragon/crystal
02:12:25 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: /msg Henzell ??scale mail
02:12:27 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: /msg Henzell ??ring mail
02:12:32 <Patashu> well, not all dragon armours
02:12:34 <Patashu> some are meant for casters
02:12:39 <elliptiott> The lower the EV is the better you have to be at armour to wear it effectively.
02:13:51 <elliptiott> (Also, see ??butterfly for the most important warning in the game.)
02:14:04 <elliptiott> (And ??butterfly[2], etc. for the next pages.)
02:14:47 * elliptiott has now proudly set NihilistDandy up for a life of avoiding butterflies.
02:14:54 <ion> Don’t drop the plate armour.
02:15:13 <elliptiott> But you're probably not good enough to use it yet.
02:15:21 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Try Ctrl+F axe<ENTER> to search for axes.
02:15:37 <ion> And use diagonal movement. :-P
02:16:27 <elliptiott> Numpad also works (but I'll laugh at you).
02:17:05 <elliptiott> Some people use numpad with the top number row.
02:17:17 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: If it lists an item, hit its letter and . to travel to it.
02:17:39 <elliptiott> (And if you get interrupted, G<enter> to continue.)
02:18:08 <ion> When in the situation @.X where X is an enemy, don’t move toward her. Let her move toward you. You’ll get the first hit.
02:18:19 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Read those scrolls, man.
02:18:32 <elliptiott> (r<letter> works too, and is quicker.)
02:18:46 <ion> Preferably with a weak enemy in sight, so certain scrolls that affect them are identified.
02:18:51 <elliptiott> Generally you should try and use them on potions (to discover a scroll of identify), or if you know identify then armour or something.
02:19:13 <ion> And preferably wearing a ring or an amulet, so the scroll that curses them is identified.
02:19:16 <elliptiott> Whoa, what happened to your display there?
02:19:23 <ion> And preferably wearing something that’s cursed, so the scroll of remove curse is identified.
02:19:59 <elliptiott> Again, r<letter> is the same as i<letter>r, but faster :P
02:20:20 <elliptiott> Since you tried it and it didn't id itself.
02:21:09 <elliptiott> The potions are the most important to id.
02:21:22 <elliptiott> But it's not nice to have to quaff-id potions at random when you're about to die.
02:21:44 <ion> d,<enter> to drop the useless potion.
02:22:34 <Patashu> bad potions are only useful to characters who learn the spell 'evaporate'
02:22:37 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Take that helmet and wear it.
02:22:48 <ion> I wouldn’t. :-P
02:23:10 <elliptiott> Patashu: Just in case I ever need to be slow, or degenerated, or poisoned.
02:23:38 <ion> I’d run away for now and come back when i’m more badass.
02:23:40 <elliptiott> You can either run or try to take him.
02:23:47 <ion> Oh, i remembered you have berserk.
02:24:21 <elliptiott> Well, you can go for it. But you might die :P
02:24:30 <elliptiott> Walk up to one square next to him slowly in case anything happens.
02:24:32 <ion> Don’t give him free shots.
02:24:51 <elliptiott> Leave a space between you and him, like ion says.
02:25:03 <ion> Now berserk.
02:25:40 <elliptiott> You probably didn't need the berk after all, but...
02:25:46 <elliptiott> Not sure what to increase for minotaurs.
02:26:29 <Patashu> I'm not even watching, should I be?
02:26:51 <ion> You might want to gain some intelligence so a cursed ring of Int-9999 doesn’t kill you.
02:27:27 <ion> I shouldn’t be watching, i should be doing homowork.
02:27:36 <elliptiott> ion: That's why I told him to identify rings before wearing them! ;)
02:27:43 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: OK, now rest off with 5.
02:28:06 <ion> Rest until you’re not slow anymore.
02:28:08 <elliptiott> You're slow and exhausted; not very good for combat.
02:28:27 <ion> Being exhausted doesn’t matter much, you just won’t be able to berserk AFAIU.
02:28:45 <elliptiott> The scythe isn't the right kind of weapon for you.
02:28:52 <elliptiott> The robe is not interesting if you're going heav armour.
02:29:10 <elliptiott> Oh, what's your armour situation again?
02:29:28 <elliptiott> It'll be a while before you'll want to switch to plate, I think.
02:29:40 <elliptiott> Maybe stick the armour skill on for a bit so you can wear the plate.
02:29:44 <elliptiott> OTOH, +4 chain might be better than +0 plate.
02:29:50 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Press b to train axes more, though.
02:30:02 <elliptiott> Also, you can't eat corpses unless you're hungry (or one of the races who don't care about that).
02:30:10 <ion> They seem to have the same AC bonus, actually.
02:30:13 <elliptiott> Yiuf is dangerous sometimes. But usually not.
02:30:31 <ion> With berserk you should be able to handle him.
02:31:36 <elliptiott> (You can also W to wear rather htan going through i.)
02:31:58 <ion> harcustangent
02:32:23 <elliptiott> If you're not hungry and have chunks, press p on corpses instead.
02:32:26 <elliptiott> It sacrifices them and makes Trog happy.
02:33:03 <ion> Now try the rings that aren’t cursed.
02:33:29 <ion> It says it’s uncursed.
02:33:40 <elliptiott> Now you don't have to bother training intelligence any more.
02:33:50 <elliptiott> You could wear that plate armour now, see if it has a nice bonus.
02:33:52 <ion> Well, unless you want another ring in its place. :-P
02:34:00 <ion> It’s cursed. It’s probably bad.
02:34:20 <elliptiott> Well, that's not bad. Even if the axe sucks.
02:34:26 <ion> They’ll only uncurse things you’re wearing IIRC.
02:34:47 <ion> It’s okay, now you’ll be able to read-id a scroll of remove curse.
02:34:49 <elliptiott> Uncurse armour scrolls arent uncommon.
02:35:05 <elliptiott> BTW, you'll want to take off the armour skill after a while.
02:35:28 <ion> I take o said it has explored everything on the previous level?
02:35:40 <elliptiott> Not sure, but Dungeon:[123] are so boring anyway.
02:35:56 <ion> Except when you find useful loot.
02:37:18 <elliptiott> There's 2 scrolls of id there; autopickup will get htem for you
02:37:44 <elliptiott> The potions are the priority, but iding the armour would be nice too.
02:37:52 <ion> Well, i’d just drop it.
02:37:55 <ion> the armour
02:38:03 <ion> A waste of an id scroll.
02:38:20 <ion> Isn’t it unlikely to be good?
02:38:23 <elliptiott> ion: I meant since the first one was multi-use.
02:38:55 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Ijyb is another unique.
02:39:28 <Patashu> he's a goblin but with more hp
02:40:05 <elliptiott> That sure is an enchanted crappy axe :D
02:40:25 <ion> A +7 hand axe would “sure” be an enchanted crappy axe. :-P
02:41:34 <ion> Do everything elliott suggests.
02:41:38 <ion> (That was a serious suggestion.)
02:42:00 <elliptiott> I only started playing like 11 days ago. :(
02:42:50 <elliptiott> (I end up chopping kobold anyway because I uncritically c most corpses.)
02:43:40 <elliptiott> Don't sacrifice when you're hungry, either :P
02:44:24 <elliptiott> (That's why I play ghouls, so I get HP for it. :p)
02:44:49 <ion> Nooo, offer it to Trog.
02:45:26 <elliptiott> (Can you even do Hand of Trog right now?)
02:45:58 <elliptiott> Might be worth doing that (and perhaps taking off armour.)
02:46:00 <NihilistDandy> Sidenote, have to disconnect quickly. Getting off the wifi and onto wired
02:46:57 <elliptiott> ion: Can you not train invocations with Trog?
02:47:02 <ion> Hit * to show all skills.
02:47:03 <elliptiott> It's been a while since I played a berserker.
02:47:08 <ion> And train armour.
02:47:30 <ion> Probably because he hasn’t used it almost at all so far.
02:47:49 <ion> That doesn’t affect which skills are shown by default.
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02:49:59 <AndroUser> Computer dropped me into initramfs's ash after reboot after a nasty kernel panic
02:50:09 -!- AndroUser has changed nick to SgeoN1.
02:50:21 <elliptiott> I thought you were Nihilist_ for a second.
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02:50:27 -!- Nihilist_ has changed nick to NihilistDandy.
02:51:25 <elliptiott> SgeoN1: It means your system is fucked.
02:51:36 <elliptiott> Don't bother chopping unless you're hungry.
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02:52:07 <elliptiott> Never berserk when you're squares away!
02:52:13 <elliptiott> It runs out fast, and even faster if you move.
02:53:44 <SgeoN1> Elliott, any chance that hd might not be seated proprrly?
02:53:53 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: You're having really bad axe issues.
02:53:58 <elliptiott> SgeoN1: I don't see why, if it can load the initramfs and all.
02:54:00 <SgeoN1> Or would it not even get to here?
02:54:32 <SgeoN1> il go use my windows comp
02:55:10 <elliptiott> You finish putting on the +0 pair of gloves of Keuschite {rPois Str+3 Int+2
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02:56:40 <elliptiott> You don't need to worry about non-ranged monsters when they're a few squares away.
02:57:08 <elliptiott> (Also, you probably should have rested before going on, but you didn't lose much HP, so it's not a big deal.)
02:57:48 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Orc wizards can be nasty.
02:57:59 <elliptiott> (Orc priests moreso, since they can smite you, which really hurts.)
02:59:17 <elliptiott> Crimson imps are annoying but not especially dangerous.
02:59:54 <elliptiott> Just spam tab and make sure you don't lose much HP.
03:00:04 <elliptiott> (BTW, tab will also move you closer to monsters.)
03:00:13 <elliptiott> So you can just tap it wildly until it dies.
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03:00:44 <elliptiott> 04:00 <Henzell> o[1/2]: This is the second-best button in Crawl. See {tab} for the best one.
03:00:46 <elliptiott> 04:00 <Henzell> tab[1/2]: This is the second-best button in Crawl. See {o} for the best one.
03:01:09 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: That's the ghost of another player.
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03:01:25 <NihilistDandy> elliptiott: That would be why Henzell knew nothing about it :/
03:01:36 <elliptiott> 04:01 <Sequell> 7. Surr, XL7 SEAM, T:5113: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/Surr/morgue-Surr-20120504-021257.txt
03:01:47 <elliptiott> It's... probably fairly dangerous; I don't know much about elves.
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03:02:32 <NihilistDandy> Surr's ghost (experienced Sludge Elf Arcane Marksman) comes into view.
03:02:52 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: (Did you not rest before exploring more?)
03:03:16 <coppro> http://magiclampoon.com/blog/2012/05/03/avacyn-returns-brings-dice/ true story
03:03:28 <elliptiott> If you lose any more health it's time to come up with a better plan.
03:03:57 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: You can quaff curing to stop being poisoned, but you haven't actually lost any more health yet.
03:04:17 <elliptiott> As I was typing: It might be worth quaffing heal wounds, though, but maybe you should wait until you lose some more HP.
03:04:44 <elliptiott> It doesn't seem to be much of a threat but it has too much HP for its own good.
03:04:45 <ion> No need to.
03:04:59 <elliptiott> All that axes skill is going to waste. :p
03:05:05 <ion> No, it isn’t.
03:05:34 <ion> Don’t step on shafts.
03:06:02 <elliptiott> Phantoms are like crimson imps, but more annoying
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03:06:46 <ion> Just saw them. Nice.
03:06:58 <ion> And drop the cursed plate armour. :-)
03:07:31 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Worms can hit hard ...but you have a lot of HP, so it doesn't matter.
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03:07:44 <elliptiott> Though you don't technically have to worry until you get to be starving.
03:07:58 <ion> But you can’t berserk if you’re too hungry.
03:09:04 <elliptiott> FWIW, you're doing pretty impressively for your 4th game.
03:09:12 <elliptiott> (Which will make your inevitably stupid death all the more crushing!)
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03:10:03 <ion> The (+1) means there’s one more item in that place (hit !a to see it).
03:10:21 <elliptiott> The orcish hand axe is probably not any better, because it is probably +0 and you are not an orc.
03:10:30 <elliptiott> (Even if it was +1, your current axe is +1 too.)
03:11:24 <ion> The race prefix doesn’t mean much if your race doesn’t match it. Dwarven items are more durable against acid, though.
03:11:38 <elliptiott> The Temple has a bunch of altars so you can get a god.
03:11:54 <elliptiott> You're with Trog, so (a) you don't need a god and (b) even if you wanted a god more than Trog, you're SOL, because Trog's wrath is nasty.
03:11:54 <ion> You might want to make your first stash in the temple. Monsters don’t spawn there (but they can follow you there).
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03:12:50 <ion> ^W0 at the < to make a waypoint at that place.
03:12:56 -!- Deewiant has joined.
03:13:04 <ion> ^G0 to return to it later.
03:13:24 <ion> ^G0 will keep working when you move the stash elsewhere.
03:14:17 <ion> At the moment you don’t need to since you’re strong and you’re not near the item number limit.
03:14:20 <elliptiott> I'm not sure you have much worthless stuff to drop.
03:14:58 <ion> But later you’ll have more stuff you can carry at once, or scrolls of enchant blah you’ll want to stash so they won’t get burned etc.
03:15:21 <ion> Kill the plants to get the stuff under them.
03:15:33 <ion> The ones with stuff under them.
03:15:55 <elliptiott> (You can tell there's stuff under them because of the inversion.)
03:16:12 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Wands you can id by zapping at weak things.
03:16:18 <elliptiott> (You don't need spellcasting skill for it.)
03:16:53 <ion> Zap at the wall adjacent the K in a way that hits the K.
03:16:59 <ion> That will identify wands of digging.
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03:18:09 <elliptiott> Once you start seeing a lot of red slow down with the tab spam.
03:18:15 <elliptiott> That ) probably has an orc corpse for you.
03:18:27 <elliptiott> Explore a bit more, maybe you'll find something to eat.
03:18:39 <elliptiott> Centaurs are nasty buggers at a distance.
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03:18:47 <elliptiott> Duck n-wards so that it has to run up to you.
03:19:09 <ion> Also, you can force multiple enemies to fight you one by one by getting them to a narrow corridor.
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03:19:38 <ion> Retreat to a narrow corridor.
03:19:45 <elliptiott> There's nothing faster than you, so press X.
03:20:14 <ion> One that’s in an explored area and one that you can escape from if needed.
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03:20:28 <elliptiott> It's to see where a narrow corridor is.
03:21:00 <elliptiott> Right, so you can retrat to that corridor.
03:21:12 <ion> (Centaurs are faster than you, though.)
03:21:15 <elliptiott> Make sure to cut all the corners, or you'll waste turns and get hit.
03:21:19 <elliptiott> ion: Yeah, but the centaur isn't in vision right now.
03:21:25 <elliptiott> And he's being crowded by other stuff, anyway.
03:21:49 <ion> Go SW twice and then west.
03:22:14 <ion> This one you can retreat away from.
03:22:17 <ion> to a known area
03:22:46 <ion> You can’t while starving.
03:23:11 <elliptiott> You'll probably need a ration as well, but you can eat all the corpses first
03:23:37 <ion> Try the ring and the amulet.
03:23:43 <ion> I thought they are the same. But i’m not sure.
03:24:09 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: BTW, eX also works for iXe, and similarly PX for iXp.
03:24:19 <ion> “Meat weighs 8, is 5000 nutrition. Bread weighs 8, is 4400 nutrition.”
03:24:48 -!- Sgeo has joined.
03:24:58 <ion> It does something, it just didn’t get identified immediately.
03:25:00 <elliptiott> It does something; you just don't know what yet.
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03:25:48 <ion> Keep it on, it might still get identified if it affects something noticeably.
03:25:50 -!- Deewiant has joined.
03:25:55 <elliptiott> Gnolls aren't really dangerous; a pack of gnolls is.
03:27:15 <elliptiott> It's probably overpriced rubbish, but check it out anyway.
03:27:16 <ion> Just hit o, it’ll go there.
03:27:48 <ion> I wouldn’t buy anything, but it’s worth keeping in mind if you’re starving at some point without food and with extra cash.
03:28:01 <elliptiott> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forward_(Obama–Biden_campaign_slogan) lol, the article got even tinier
03:29:07 <NihilistDandy> Henzell suggests that necrophages are not a huge deal? Or are they an enormous deal and Henzell is a master of understatement?
03:29:36 <elliptiott> Note that they're yellow; you shouldn't trust the colours, but you can trust them if Henzell backs them up.
03:29:48 <elliptiott> Case in point: orc warriors can be quite scary.
03:29:54 <elliptiott> Though probably not with the kind of strength you have.
03:30:35 <elliptiott> Maybe berk the warrior if it gives you any trouble.
03:30:52 <elliptiott> Just autoexplore if there's nothing in view.
03:31:09 <ion> Don’t fight them all at once
03:31:43 <elliptiott> OK, well, you're getting hit by the warrior's axes.
03:31:48 <elliptiott> That's why you keep one in to a corridor.
03:33:17 <ion> Eat what you need and offer the rest before resting, so they won’t spoil.
03:35:08 <ion> Set character_set = unicode in your config for Unicode goodness.
03:35:37 <ion> They’re hideous now. :-P
03:36:29 <ion> Just autoexplore
03:36:30 <elliptiott> You can walk right up to it if you want.
03:38:03 <elliptiott> You can probably kill ogres like nobody's business now.
03:38:35 <elliptiott> Fair enough. ion might be able to advise about training more.
03:39:13 <ion> In the past i’d have trained fighting as well, but i’m not sure what its effect is now.
03:39:29 <elliptiott> But you could add it, and focus armour too.
03:39:43 <ion> With unarmed combat you’ll get better aux attacks with horns. I don’t know how good they are.
03:39:46 <elliptiott> Yeah. Train it up a bit, no harm done.
03:40:02 <ion> You probably won’t need the others.
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03:40:45 <ion> fighting[1/1]: The Fighting skill gives you a bonus to accuracy and damage in melee, and improves your hit points by ((1+racial_factor/10) * Fighting * XL) / 8 (see {hp}).
03:41:24 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: When kobolds throw stuff, back up like you did.
03:41:30 <elliptiott> Then they have to run to you, and they're weaklings in melee.
03:41:42 <Patashu> fighting gives almost no boost to combat
03:41:44 <Patashu> you take it for the extra hp
03:41:47 <ion> Ditto for centaurs. Hide from them until you can get next to them and then melee them.
03:41:56 <Patashu> and it gives almost no extra hp until xl16+
03:41:59 <Patashu> so, don't train it until Later (tm)
03:42:22 <ion> Yeah, down.
03:42:28 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Swap your fighting for UC.
03:42:44 <ion> Perhaps Patashu can tell us how useful UC is for a minotaur.
03:42:49 <elliptiott> Though they can go invisible, which i sannoying.
03:42:49 <ion> I have no idea.
03:42:54 <elliptiott> Not a problem if you get them in a corridor.
03:43:12 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Just keep fighting upwards.
03:43:17 <elliptiott> It's invisible, but it's not going anywhere :)
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03:45:17 <elliptiott> Or you'll just end up eating, hungry, eating, hungry, etc.
03:45:30 <elliptiott> Wow, this is like the levl of annoying shit.
03:46:41 <ion> There should really be a status item for autopickup being off.
03:46:51 <elliptiott> That's if you're going Nemelex, which you aren't, because Trog would get really upset.
03:47:00 <ion> No, he won’t.
03:47:10 <ion> Oh, you meant for switching religions.
03:47:11 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Sacrifice those corpses, btw.
03:47:36 <elliptiott> Walk up to the centaur so it can't range you.
03:47:43 <elliptiott> Then kill it, the orcs, get the amulet, money, then run up the upstairs.
03:47:57 <zzo38> You cannot use ranged attacks in that game in only one range?
03:48:00 <elliptiott> If a name comes up on your screen, that's a bit scary :)
03:48:12 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: See ??duvessa and ??dowan.
03:48:16 <ion> Don’t run.
03:48:23 <zzo38> elliptiott: Then they need to fix it.
03:48:24 <ion> The orc priest will smite you from distance.
03:48:48 <ion> And one of the es is a mage, {,s}he’ll probably have some ranged spells, too.
03:49:20 <elliptiott> Eat some of them corpses before resint.g
03:49:30 <ion> ,, to see the items as a list.
03:50:15 <elliptiott> OK, get the amulet and money and scroll, then eat up some more.
03:50:19 <ion> Except the glowing axe.
03:50:22 <Patashu> have no bigger axes spawned yet?
03:50:29 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Actually, you could probably stay on this level, and then go up once you've explored it all.
03:50:42 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Pick up the amulet and money while waiting for the nausea to end.
03:50:43 <Patashu> what's the "? amulet of inaccuracy?
03:51:06 <Patashu> amulet of who-da-fuck-knows
03:51:26 <ion> ^F. to get a list of everything on this level.
03:51:58 <ion> I’d just go up and take care of the unfinished level, though.
03:52:02 <elliptiott> You don't have any curses to remove, though.
03:52:21 <zzo38> Does it have a scroll or potion to add a curse?
03:52:34 <Patashu> if you hit some things with it
03:52:36 <elliptiott> Wield the axe, go <, then eat a meat ration.
03:52:46 <ion> Be sure not to remove the amulet of faith, you’ll lose a bunch of piety that way. But you’ll gain piety (and get awesome gifts sooner) wearing it.
03:53:00 <ion> gain piety faster, that is.
03:53:18 <zzo38> In ADOM it is possible to curse items if you have a cursed watery potion or a cursed scroll of uncursing, but there isn't any good ways to guaranteed to get those things.
03:53:32 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Next time you see something weak, zap-test those wands.
03:53:46 <ion> There are scrolls to curse stuff, yeah.
03:53:48 <Patashu> zzo38: what items would you deliberately curse in adom?
03:54:29 <Patashu> he read a scroll of curse weapon
03:54:44 <elliptiott> Can you ^Faxe? I'm shocked nothing amazing has turned up.
03:55:02 <zzo38> Patashu: Potion of exchange is usually better when cursed (if you are using it carefully!), if your character is dark elf then spider bread is better cursed, and sometimes you may curse something so that when you sell it and then purchase it again later, it doesn't cost as much money.
03:55:05 <Patashu> it's always the first one that gets you
03:55:51 <zzo38> Patashu: Do you believe these things?
03:56:18 <zzo38> And these are not the only reasons to curse things.
03:56:31 <elliptiott> Hit _, you have an (old by now) message from me.
03:57:10 <ion> Burn the book when an O is over it.
03:57:27 <elliptiott> You gotta learn to look at your HP meter before hitting o.
03:57:46 <elliptiott> BTW, Trog's Hand is a useful ability you haven't used yet; it makes your HP regenerate faster and gives you some magic resistance.
03:57:54 <elliptiott> It's useful in slower-burning fights than you'd use berserk with.
03:58:00 <elliptiott> Also, you should probably eat a ration.
03:59:00 <elliptiott> What is that centaur doing with a wand?
03:59:02 <kmc> so this is pretty much #whateverthefuck-dungeon-game now?
03:59:07 <zzo38> But I suppose, there might also be reasons for cursing items when doing some kind of challenge games too
03:59:07 <Patashu> centaurs can have wands randomly
03:59:18 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy started playing after watching me.
03:59:43 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Zap-test those wands on that K.
03:59:47 <NihilistDandy> And I am doing mildly well, with elliott's guidance and occasional screaming
04:00:09 <elliptiott> N.B. I'm still terrible, but I've absorbed others' wisdom.
04:00:26 <elliptiott> You should probably zap it with the other wand.
04:00:37 <elliptiott> (It won't stay your friend for long and also it's weak as hell, so cruelty is fine..)
04:00:43 <elliptiott> You need to aim it at the kobold this time.
04:00:46 <ion> Remember to zap the wall adjacent to the monster in a way that hits the monster to identify wands of digging.
04:02:33 <elliptiott> Teleport traps are harmless unless there's dangerous stuff on the level.
04:02:43 <Sgeo> What's with Computer Science people and fruit?
04:02:49 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: You're two stars away from full piety, btw.
04:04:25 <elliptiott> General wisdom is to do them after the Lair.
04:04:43 <ion> Increasingly bad. The last level of branches tends to be much harder than the ones before it, too.
04:04:45 <elliptiott> And not all orcs are as easy as the three you've encountered.
04:05:03 <Patashu> orcish mines can randomly be really hard. the lair can randomly be really hard as well, but when orcish mines is hard you get boulders thrown at you
04:05:05 <elliptiott> You'd want a double-digit XL, at the very least.
04:05:08 <Patashu> when lair is hard you just have to run real fast
04:05:32 <elliptiott> I don't know how dangerous Maurice is.
04:06:03 <elliptiott> So maybe you should zap confusion at him.
04:07:38 <elliptiott> If you used W, you wouldn't have to mentally filter things ;)
04:08:43 <elliptiott> Oh. Don't bother until you have something better.
04:08:53 <NihilistDandy> I'm just a berserker, what kind of intelligence do you want from me? :D
04:08:59 <zzo38> Can Map be made a monad if the keys is monoid? Can it be applicative if the keys is monoid?
04:09:28 <Patashu> cloak of poison resistance? nice
04:09:43 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Eat that corpse then show Patashu your gloves.
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04:10:11 <Patashu> rpois doesn't stack, unfortunately
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04:11:11 <elliptiott> BTW, since you know a lot of scrolls now, when you go to read-test one, use \ to see which items you know (and - to invert it to see ones you don't know).
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04:11:19 <elliptiott> Some of them are nasty, so you can see what it might be.
04:11:25 <zzo38> Does the game have any mode which makes all items to be initially cursed?
04:11:43 <Patashu> if you like having your entire inventory cursed, you can do an ossuary portal vault
04:12:04 <elliptiott> That's what the green background means.
04:12:22 <ion> And make sure it’s next to you when you use stairs.
04:12:31 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: It's humour. Quite different.
04:12:36 <elliptiott> ion: Or just ignore it and let it evaporate.
04:12:42 <ion> It won’t evaporate.
04:13:08 <elliptiott> Sacrifice more corpses. Except you're hungry.
04:13:12 <elliptiott> This is why I hate Crawl's hunger system.
04:13:14 <pikhq_> Huh. More people live in New York City than live in Norway.
04:13:43 <Patashu> I hate crawl's hunger system too
04:13:57 <ion> You haven’t explored this one yet.
04:14:12 <zzo38> s/exploring/exploding/
04:14:40 <elliptiott> Patashu: Yeah, I only play things with different hunger mechanics (can eat corpses while not hungry, gets HP from eating, etc.) now.
04:15:17 <ion> You can make sure it goes into a corner and it won’t be able to hide from you.
04:15:50 <elliptiott> Et the corpse and let your abomination chase the beast.
04:16:41 <ion> nihilistdandy: You might want to set easy_eat_chunks = true, easy_eat_gourmand = true, auto_eat_chunks = true.
04:16:58 <elliptiott> ion: (That's not a good idea if you worship a corpse-loving God, surely.)
04:17:07 <NihilistDandy> Strictly speaking, I have no idea where to do that
04:17:09 <Patashu> elliptiott, they help a lot
04:17:19 <Patashu> it doesn't butcher for you
04:17:27 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: You edit it in the pre-game menu.
04:17:33 <ion> My config diffed against the defaults: https://github.com/ion1/crawl-config/compare/master-base...master#files_bucket
04:18:06 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: 05:18 <Henzell> erolcha[2/2]: <Danei> erolcha is your "crawl can and will try to kill you" warning
04:18:07 <NihilistDandy> A unique ogre magess spawned with a random set of spells, which include friendly things like banishment to the Abyss, paralysis, and LCS. Do not underestimate her
04:18:18 <elliptiott> I don't have much Erolcha experience, so ask ion and Patashu.
04:18:34 <elliptiott> Well, you could run downstairs, but she's probably worth a lot of XP. :p
04:19:03 <Patashu> well, first thing to do is
04:19:20 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: (He means Hand of Trog.)
04:19:31 <Patashu> stone arrow (3d12), sting (d8), blink, b.lightning (3d14), banishment, minor healing.
04:19:34 <Patashu> this is her spellset today
04:19:51 <elliptiott> I wonder if Brothers in Arms would be worth it.
04:19:55 <ion> Hand affects banishment?
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04:20:25 <Patashu> it won't be a very good BIA due to low piety, but it's worth trying
04:20:37 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: (It summons a monster to help you.)
04:20:43 <ion> It costs piety, though, and you’ll want to get gifts. Perhaps berserking is enough.
04:21:04 <elliptiott> You can get piety back easy; you can't undie.
04:21:18 <Patashu> now walk towards her slowly
04:21:45 <Patashu> small abomination tanked her
04:21:51 <Patashu> how is that even possible lol
04:21:58 <elliptiott> At least you have a berserk ogre friend.
04:22:05 <Patashu> a small abomination is about as tough as erolcha
04:22:20 <Patashu> Erolcha (O) | Spd: 10 | Int: normal (items) | HD: 6 | HP: 54 | AC/EV: 3/7 | Dam: 20 | Fl: spellcaster, see invisible | Res: magic(56) | Chunks: contam | XP: 804 | Sp: lots
04:22:20 <ion> Did Erolcha use any spells just now?
04:22:24 <Patashu> small abomination (x) | Spd: 7-15 | Int: plant | HD: 6 | HP: 14-40 | AC/EV: 0/0 | Dam: 23 | Fl: undead, evil | Res: magic(40), poison, drown, rot+++, neg+++, torm | Vul: holy++ | XP: 141.
04:22:28 <Patashu> she casted sting once and that was it
04:22:32 <Patashu> her HD is low so she doesn't cast very often
04:22:34 <Patashu> but when she casts she means business
04:22:53 <elliptiott> Your abomination took the hit, though.
04:22:54 <Patashu> you want to always act as though you have worst case erolcha, anyway
04:23:15 <ion> You might want to rest a bit so your x will heal.
04:23:20 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: If you run into anything tougher than the average monster, and you're in a corridor, swap places with your x.
04:23:26 <elliptiott> So it can -- haven't seen Psyche before.
04:23:41 <Patashu> Psyche (@) | Spd: 13 | Int: normal (items) | HD: 5 | HP: 39 | AC/EV: 0/12 | Dam: 7 | Fl: spellcaster | Res: magic(26) | Chunks: contam | XP: 371 | Sp: throw frost (3d6), cantrip, haste, throw flame (3d6), magic dart (3d4), invisibility.
04:23:45 <elliptiott> 05:23 <Henzell> psyche[1/2]: A purple unique magess that is generally unremarkable in both dungeon spawn location and ability, but can still be quite dangerous when she hastes herself and unloads a wand or chaos dagger on you. Or in the 25% of the time that her dagger is distortion.
04:23:49 <Patashu> and I think she's likely ot have a dagger of chaos
04:23:53 <elliptiott> Meh; swap places with the x and wait to see.
04:24:28 <elliptiott> "Be careful" =/= "run up and melee her", for god's sake.
04:24:37 <elliptiott> 05:24 <Henzell> chaos brand[1/9]: Imitates other brands, or can heal, polymorph, berserk, haste, invisify, petrify, paralyse, torment, cause miscasts and probably do a lot more to enemies. Added in 0.5, only gifted by Xom, Xom's vault guards, found on Pan lords, or on the uniques Crazy Yiuf (always) or Psyche (sometimes).
04:24:50 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Will that help you if you become an ant?
04:25:35 <elliptiott> BTW, Trog doesn't care about what corpses you give it, just that you give corpses.
04:25:35 <Patashu> weapons of chaos aren't particularly useful
04:25:43 <Patashu> since you can't use them on anything tough for fear of hasting/zerking them
04:25:44 <elliptiott> Patashu: Will anything else pick it up?
04:25:51 <ion> Well, you might pick it up so no-one else gets it on the level, and drop it before going to the next level.
04:25:53 <NihilistDandy> elliptiott: I know, but I figured he liked mages better
04:25:54 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Pick it up just in case.
04:26:01 <elliptiott> You can stash it somewhere if your inventory gets full.
04:26:20 <ion> Nope, it’s a light armour.
04:26:25 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Chaos fun: 05:26 <Henzell> chaos brand[4/9]: Gastronok fails to defend himself. You open Gastronok like a pillowcase!!! Gastronok suddenly stops moving! Gastronok is heavily wounded. Gastronok fails to defend himself. You open Gastronok like a pillowcase!!! You kill Gastronok! Gastronok instantly turns into a zombie! Your dagger of chaos parrots the noises around you.
04:26:47 <elliptiott> I love any game message with more than two exclamation marks.
04:27:13 <elliptiott> 05:27 <Henzell> pillowcase[1/1]: Linley Henzell doesn't know how to open these.
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04:27:35 <Patashu> yellow = contaminated (MAY make you nauseous)
04:27:45 <Patashu> green = poisonous (can't eat without rpois)
04:27:53 <Patashu> purple = mutagenic (will give you a random mutation instead of nutrition)
04:27:54 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: Oh, right, you can eat greens now.
04:28:01 <Patashu> red = bad (I don't want to know what happens if you try to eat this)
04:28:04 <Patashu> green turns white when you have rpois
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04:29:17 <ion> When in the situation @.X where X is an enemy, don’t move toward her. Let her move toward you. You’ll get the first hit.
04:29:33 <elliptiott> NihilistDandy: That's not better than what you're wearing.
04:29:50 <ion> elliott: I’m starting to feel like i should. :-P
04:30:02 <NihilistDandy> Red 5 will forever be burned in my memory as the most annoying thing besides a gray I
04:30:06 -!- elliptiott has changed nick to elliott.
04:30:14 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Blue p is a bit more annoying.
04:30:19 <elliott> Like I said, don't bother to think with crimson imps.
04:30:25 <elliott> Just keep whacking tab until it stops existing.
04:30:30 <elliott> Unless something terrible happens.
04:30:47 <elliott> Did I mention tab can also handle the moving-efficiently-towards-an-enemy for you?
04:30:52 <Patashu> why is unarmed combat on, btw
04:31:01 <elliott> We asked you whether it was worthwhile.
04:31:13 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Turn off UC. :p
04:31:16 <ion> You headbutt the centaur!
04:31:17 <ion> You kill the centaur!
04:31:23 <ion> Seemed to work with the centaur rather nicely. :-P
04:31:25 <Patashu> ion: it does that much damage regardless of UC skill
04:31:43 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Yeah, maybe de-focus armour.
04:31:53 <elliott> Leave it on, but defocus it.
04:31:59 <elliott> (Is there a better term for "focus"?)
04:32:23 <ion> untransmogrify
04:32:48 <elliott> Do you have anything to identify?
04:32:54 <elliott> Oh, the amulet you're not wearing.
04:33:00 <elliott> And the ring, I... suppose.
04:33:05 <Patashu> use your ID on potions if you have any
04:33:47 <elliott> He could spellcast, were it not for the heavy armour.
04:33:50 <Patashu> obviously you should ditch trog and learn some spells
04:34:00 <Patashu> trog won't mind, honest. he won't send berserk stone giants after you, honest
04:34:15 <NihilistDandy> Actually, I guess 10 Int is average human intelligence
04:34:22 <elliott> MiBes are badass enough to spellcast even if their gods hate it.
04:34:26 <Patashu> crawl doesn't follow the D&D stat scales
04:34:32 <elliott> You wouldn't let any puny god stop you using magic, right?
04:34:57 <elliott> I like how Trog doesn't mind wands.
04:35:02 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Goliath beetles hit hard.
04:35:06 <elliott> They're really tedious to fight.
04:35:13 <elliott> Just whack it and stop if it hurts you.
04:35:36 <Patashu> well, when you're not diesel
04:35:44 <Patashu> goliath beetles hit really hard but only act every other turn
04:35:50 <Patashu> so you can hit them once, step back, . until they're next to you and repeat
04:35:58 <HackEgo> 839) <Sgeo> hack and back? <Patashu> works on anything much slower than you <monqy> at the cost of: guilt, hating yourself, me sending you the message "hi" <Patashu> am I also forbidden to cast mephitic cloud and cblink <monqy> i will also send you "hi" if you: kite excessively, use mephitic cloud, -yes
04:36:36 <elliott> Wyverns are just, like, wyverns, you know?
04:37:31 <elliott> Just pick em off one by one.
04:37:36 <elliott> You didn't do the waiting thing.
04:37:52 <Patashu> does the orc warrior have a polearm?
04:38:01 <elliott> (Press Ctrl+P to see previous messages)
04:38:13 <Patashu> you'll want that once you pry it from his cold dead hands
04:38:27 <ion> When in the situation @.X where X is an enemy, don’t move toward her. Let her move toward you. You’ll get the first hit.
04:38:41 <Patashu> take the battleaxe; wield the battleaxe
04:38:46 <Patashu> if there's any plate armour wear that too
04:38:48 <elliott> Patashu: Uncurse the current axe first.
04:38:48 <ion> uncurse your hand axe
04:38:54 <elliott> Patashu: Plate armour? Naw.
04:38:59 <elliott> +0 plate is worse than his +4 splint.
04:39:11 <ion> Not splint
04:39:40 <ion> I thought it was a +4 scale mail.
04:39:53 <elliott> OK, I guess the plate might be better.
04:39:57 <Patashu> at ****** he'll start giving you good axes
04:40:06 <elliott> Let me check your current AC/EV to compare before/after.
04:40:43 <elliott> Maybe focus armour training some more?
04:40:50 <Patashu> gdr[1/1]: Guaranteed damage reduction versus melee attacks, conferred by body armor. Formula is 14 * sqrt(base AC-2)%. This percentage applies to the maximum potential damage for an attack, not the actual damage rolled. However, GDR will prevent at most AC/2 damage.
04:41:01 <Patashu> since you have a battleaxe now
04:41:04 <Patashu> and you need to get it to mindelay
04:41:14 <Patashu> 20 axes for mindelay battleaxe
04:41:20 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Wield that battlexae.
04:41:31 <ion> =isa to make it the letter a.
04:41:41 <ion> Drop the hand axes.
04:41:52 <zzo38> Let's use foot axes instead, please.
04:41:55 <ion> You can switch between wielding a and b with '
04:42:01 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Do you have any scrolls of enchant armour or whatever?
04:42:04 <elliott> That would be nice right now.
04:42:17 <ion> I’d spare them for even better stuff.
04:42:20 <quintopia> zzo38: axe body spray is far more useful against miasma
04:42:30 <zzo38> quintopia: OK, then use that instead.
04:42:43 <Patashu> zzo38: crawl does not have foot axes, but it does have curse toes
04:42:52 <ion> and death cobs
04:43:06 <NihilistDandy> Drop the cursed ring, or identify for possible bittersweet goodness?
04:43:07 <elliott> NihilistDandy: You can find all that stuff later with Ctrl+F.
04:43:12 <elliott> Keep the ring, it's not hurting anything.
04:43:13 <Patashu> it might be useful but cursed
04:43:42 <elliott> NOT THE FEARSOME HOBGOBLIN
04:43:59 <elliott> Well, hobgoblins are always weaklings. :p
04:44:15 <Patashu> when trog starts gifting you'll get a branded battle or exec
04:44:23 <ion> Just wait until you get an executioner’s axe of venom. :-)
04:45:01 <Patashu> ring of teleport isn't completely useless
04:45:05 <Patashu> you can evoke it for teleport on demand
04:45:08 <elliott> That gives you teleportitis.
04:45:15 <ion> Only when you wear it
04:45:16 <Patashu> it gives you teleportitis AND evoke for teleport
04:45:25 <elliott> But teleportitis is still annoying as a long-term thing :)
04:45:35 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Yaks hit hard but they're boring.
04:45:43 <elliott> They're basically like ogres with horns.
04:46:04 <elliott> Zerking gives you extra HP as well as the strength.
04:46:18 <elliott> Yaks also have hugs corpses!
04:46:18 <Patashu> it multiples your current hp by 1.333... when you use it
04:46:21 <Patashu> so a late zerk is pointless
04:47:13 <elliott> I think axes chop hydrae heads.
04:47:18 <elliott> Which means you'll be left with a more-headed hydra.
04:47:21 <elliott> Which delivers more damage.
04:47:32 <elliott> I'm not sure what minotaurs should do in this situation.
04:47:35 <ion> Use the wands or/and get reinforcements.
04:47:44 <elliott> Do BIA first, since you're right next to it, perhaps.
04:47:47 <Patashu> and hope for something good
04:48:00 <Patashu> it has a club so it won't make more heads
04:48:16 <Patashu> you can probably zerk it to death now
04:48:25 <elliott> I was thinking disintegration.
04:48:33 <elliott> Disintegration is bloodier.
04:48:56 <Patashu> (those are chunks of hydra you blew across the room)
04:49:21 <elliott> A roguelike with gibs is the funniest thing.
04:50:39 <elliott> NihilistDandy: How many turns in are you?
04:51:59 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Jellies corrode weapons, armour.
04:52:00 <ion> Blast it with a wand from distance.
04:52:02 <elliott> They are annoying as shit.
04:52:06 <elliott> ion: Why did you tell him to drop all his axes?
04:52:13 <elliott> He could use a backup right now.
04:52:13 <Patashu> elliot: it would just eat all the axes
04:52:19 <ion> elliott: BIA, wands
04:52:21 <elliott> Patashu: I didn't mean throw.
04:52:30 <Patashu> this is what wands are for imo
04:53:12 <Patashu> you should have retreated north instead of south
04:53:15 <Patashu> so you could have -kept- retreating indefinitely
04:53:20 <Patashu> (jellies are slower than you)
04:53:37 <elliott> You *could* save it but considering how rare axes are this game...
04:54:03 <Patashu> trog will gift him -plenty- of axes
04:54:03 <ion> He’ll get plenty from Trog in a while.
04:54:09 <Patashu> trog won't be able to fucking stop
04:54:27 <ion> or the other way around
04:54:40 <elliott> You're kinda wasting permafood... but I don't blame you, because Crawl's hunger sucks.
04:54:56 <Patashu> unless it's a fruit, then no one cares
04:55:12 <ion> Drop the chaos dagger first.
04:55:14 <elliott> You're more than strong enough.
04:55:21 <elliott> You can probably tabspam this lot.
04:56:02 <elliott> Wights drained him and there's an ogre.
04:56:08 <ion> and he keeps tabbing :-P
04:56:21 <elliott> I was the one who told him to tab them. But these wights are vicious. :(
04:56:22 <Patashu> is he standing on the staircase right now?
04:56:32 <elliott> But will he survive an ascent?
04:56:37 <elliott> Perhaps quaff heal wounds and then berserk.
04:56:41 <elliott> (Don't do that right away.)
04:56:44 <ion> Drink heal wounds, BIA, berserk?
04:56:55 <Patashu> so you're in a better position
04:57:21 <Patashu> hit the wight that's next to you
04:57:31 <Patashu> ok, situation's diffused now
04:57:46 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Lesson to be learned here: don't necessarily trust me when I say you might be able to tabspam something :)
04:57:49 <elliott> Go up the upstairs to rest.
04:58:02 <ion> Btw, you can hit ^X to get a list of items in your field of vision.
04:58:29 <ion> And ^F.<enter> to get a list of items in the level.
04:58:42 <elliott> NihilistDandy: That's all junk.
04:59:29 <elliott> Yaks aren't such a big deal.
04:59:33 <elliott> And that's not a chokepoint, anyway.
04:59:40 <Patashu> yeah, you're being hit by three yaks at once
04:59:50 <elliott> Why do you not look at the HP meter when it flashes red a billion times?
04:59:56 <Patashu> in this game called 'crawl' monsters can attack diagonally even past walls
04:59:57 <elliott> You don't close your eyes during tabspam :P
05:00:11 <elliott> they just reach over and poke you
05:00:28 <ion> Royal Canadian Yaksman
05:00:31 <NihilistDandy> I know they can. I didn't realize getting hurt made you unable to blind fight right away
05:00:49 <Patashu> so you don't kill yourself
05:00:54 <zzo38> In the game called KING, opponent pieces can move diagonally past walls, and line of sight and thrown rocks work diagonally past walls, but your piece is blocked
05:00:56 <elliott> If those three yaks gored you, you could have died the next turn.
05:01:24 <elliott> Worker ant zombie is harmless, just kill it and rest up.
05:01:30 <elliott> X zombie is weaker than X.
05:01:46 <elliott> Those shops might be interesting.
05:02:09 <Patashu> food shops are for when you eat all the permafood in the game
05:03:01 <zzo38> Corridors are not to be eaten.
05:03:28 <elliott> It's cursed, that just means you can't take it off.
05:03:39 <elliott> It's probably worse than what you have, so switch back.
05:03:40 <Patashu> it's not even necessarily a bad axe
05:03:49 <elliott> I would have kept the curse until you saw its stats.
05:04:04 <elliott> Don't get your hopes up, though.
05:04:25 <Patashu> it's random whether you find out or not per hit
05:04:51 <elliott> Well, just keep using this one.
05:04:55 <zzo38> In which games, is it possible, if you have scroll of item destruction, to use it to destroy a cursed item which you cannot get rid of, if you drop everything else other than the item you want to destroy and the scroll?
05:05:25 <elliott> It's probably going to be shit.
05:06:00 <zzo38> What color of wands?
05:06:20 <Patashu> ok, nothing really good in there
05:06:39 <Patashu> (really good = haste, heal wounds)
05:07:19 <elliott> Gnolls aren't really scary any more.
05:07:33 <Patashu> gnoll shamans are pretty forgettable
05:07:35 <elliott> Not to say you should tabspam them. But they're not going to do all th-
05:07:38 <elliott> dragons on the other end...
05:08:02 <elliott> But I want to instill the fear of dragons.
05:08:34 <elliott> No, that would be kind of dumb and you don't have to.
05:08:44 <Patashu> nice use of the chokepoint as always
05:08:46 <elliott> Zap confusion at that gnoll.
05:08:52 <elliott> It's blocked by deep water.
05:08:57 <elliott> 06:08 <Henzell> deep water[1/2]: This most corrosive of solvents will dissolve almost anything that falls in, even artefacts and hapless adventurers. It may be possible to {scramble} free, however. Also known as blue lava.
05:09:13 <elliott> I guess it can just stay there.
05:09:19 <elliott> You could disintegrate it, I suppose.
05:09:22 <elliott> But it'd be for entertainment only.
05:10:23 <elliott> Get that last chunk then rest off a bit.
05:11:59 <elliott> That's where it probably is.
05:12:13 <elliott> Don't open those two doors, I think it's a vault.
05:12:18 <elliott> Check out Trog's gift though.
05:12:32 <elliott> Not sure where it is, mind.
05:12:35 <elliott> NihilistDandy: No, it's on the floor.
05:12:58 <Patashu> war axe is worse than battleaxe since it's one handed
05:13:04 <Patashu> but 1) you can use it with a shield 2) it might have a neat brand
05:13:20 <Patashu> it goes hand axe < war axe < broadaxe (one handed) < battleaxe < executioner's axe (two handed)
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05:13:38 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Look at your goddamn HP.
05:13:46 <elliott> Why the fuck would you explore with that HP?
05:14:02 <Patashu> when you hit dudes with it
05:14:04 <Patashu> they can't cast spells anymore
05:14:07 <Patashu> otherwise the battleaxe is better
05:14:11 <elliott> Can you set autoexplore to refuse to operate if you're below 66% HP?
05:14:41 <Patashu> you can't close the door since there's an arrow on it
05:14:46 <ion> Move the battleaxe to position a and the antimagic war axe to position b and you’ll be able to switch between them with '
05:15:11 <elliott> Didn't realise your HP was like that
05:15:18 <ion> BIA might block his arrows.
05:15:36 <Patashu> meta-solution: don't do that in the first place
05:15:38 <ion> elliott: '
05:15:48 <elliott> You want that regen in a situation like this.
05:15:52 <elliott> (How did that centaur kill an ogre???)
05:16:20 <itidus20> sounds like the force is strong with nihilist
05:16:25 <Patashu> and don't be dumb around centaurs
05:16:30 <elliott> Battleaxe to a, war axe to b.
05:16:43 <ion> No, don’t rest. You should autoexplore some more.
05:17:03 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Wrong battleaxe, no?
05:17:05 <itidus20> he is still alive after all this sleeping i did
05:17:37 <elliott> Eat the centaur then check out your scrolls.
05:17:42 <elliott> You have some stuff to identify, I think.
05:18:06 <ion> He already has a plate armour.
05:18:32 <elliott> Do you really not have scrolls of identify?
05:18:32 <ion> It’ll rot away by itself.
05:20:14 <elliott> NihilistDandy: It's not terribly scary.
05:20:16 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Try Gretell.
05:20:28 <elliott> HP and damage being the most important.
05:21:15 <elliott> You need to diagonal better. :p
05:21:43 <elliott> Still no lair entrance, right?
05:21:51 <Patashu> it's not guaranteed until D:13
05:22:54 <ion> Also, use the antimagic against shamans etc.
05:23:01 <elliott> Sidenote: Wow, berserkers are much better when they have high HP.
05:24:36 <elliott> NihilistDandy: You know ogres?
05:24:48 <ion> When in the situation @.X where X is an enemy, don’t move toward her. Let her move toward you. You’ll get the first hit.
05:24:51 <elliott> Hill giants are meant to hit very hard.
05:25:32 <elliott> Probably not worth retreating; they're weaklings.
05:25:42 <elliott> It's time for ion's macro again ;)
05:26:27 <elliott> 06:26 <Gretell> Harold (@) | Spd: 10 | Int: normal (items) | HD: 9 | HP: 76 | AC/EV: 0/8 | Dam: 12 | Fl: spellcaster | Res: magic(60) | Chunks: contam | XP: 1238 | Sp: b.fire (3d17), blink.
05:27:00 <elliott> There's a corpse to sacrifice there.
05:29:01 <elliott> Running away doesn't stop bad things existing unless you're running somewhere in particular :)
05:29:25 <elliott> Patashu: You should probably watch this.
05:29:48 <ion> I was just about to say “and diffused”.
05:30:21 <elliott> 06:30 <Gretell> troll (T) | Spd: 10 | Int: normal (doors) | HD: 7 | HP: 25-53 | AC/EV: 3/10 | Dam: 20, 15, 15 | Fl: regen | Res: magic(28) | Chunks: contam | XP: 305.
05:30:27 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Hit kinda nasty, but otherwise harmless.
05:30:45 <ion> You can “reply” with :
05:30:58 <elliott> monqy: This is ND's fifth game.
05:31:04 <monqy> are you giving advice
05:31:15 <elliott> 06:31 <Sequell> 3. NihilistDandy the Grave Robber (L2 GhNe), worshipper of Ashenzari, slain by a worker ant in D:4 on 2012-05-04, with 45 points after 300 turns and 0:05:51.
05:31:17 <elliott> Oh, indeed, only the fourth.
05:31:28 <ion> monqy: It sucks.
05:31:36 <monqy> from ghne to mibe?
05:31:42 <monqy> at least, I assume that's mibe
05:32:08 <ion> Why aren’t the ##crawl bots on #esoteric⸘
05:32:13 <elliott> 06:32 <elliott> !lg nihilistdandy -2
05:32:13 <elliott> 06:32 <Sequell> 2. NihilistDandy the Sneak (L1 VpAs), slain by a gnoll (a +1,+1 spear) in D:1 on 2012-05-04, with 84 points after 200 turns and 0:02:58.
05:32:14 <elliott> 06:32 <elliott> !lg nihilistdandy -3
05:32:16 <elliott> 06:32 <Sequell> 1. NihilistDandy the Grave Robber (L2 GhNe), slain by a goblin (a +0,+0 orcish club) in D:3 (minmay three crescents) on 2012-05-04, with 77 points after 1013 turns and 0:24:08.
05:32:18 <elliott> He just picked randomly to start with. :p
05:32:30 <zzo38> ion: Unlike Haskell, they didn't put them there!
05:32:39 <elliott> (Wait, his first game lasted 24 minutes?)
05:32:42 <monqy> anyway I'm gone for a while or so
05:32:50 <lambdabot> Local time for monqy is Thu May 3 22:32:49 2012
05:32:51 <monqy> I'll wisdom etc once I get back
05:32:55 <elliott> monqy sure is away a lot today!!!
05:32:58 <monqy> maybe back at 23? maybe later
05:33:00 <elliott> NihilistDandy: monqy has 17 wins, you know.
05:33:01 <monqy> I'm away a lot always
05:33:27 <elliott> You get three runes from branches of the dungeon, go down to dungeon level 27,
05:33:42 <elliott> go back to dungeon level 1,
05:33:57 <elliott> Branches are themed stuff.
05:34:08 <elliott> So far you've just seen the plain dungeon.
05:35:35 <elliott> You don't need to chokepoint or run away from orcs.
05:36:19 <Patashu> more orcs implies orc warriors
05:36:22 <elliott> Patashu: Orc by induction?
05:36:39 <elliott> There are 0 orcs, and since if there's N orcs, there's N+1 orcs, there are an infinite number of orcs.
05:36:47 <elliott> NihilistDandy: It's not as powerful as it looks.
05:36:54 <elliott> I did tell you to check what unid'd scrolls were left at this point.
05:37:13 <NihilistDandy> I don't remember that, nor do I remember how to do it
05:37:29 <Patashu> it's either {, [, ], }, | or \
05:37:38 <elliott> NihilistDandy: When you go to "r", press \ in the list
05:37:43 <elliott> Then - to negate it, and you'll see unidentified items
05:38:39 <elliott> Now you see all the scrolls you don't know.
05:39:21 <elliott> Patashu: Is that a vault of some kind?
05:39:27 <elliott> Or is NihilistDandy fucked?
05:39:38 <Patashu> I wouldn't fight it right now
05:39:39 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Stats speak for themselves: 06:39 <Gretell> stone giant (C) | Spd: 10 | Int: normal (starting) | HD: 16 | HP: 69-108 | AC/EV: 12/2 | Dam: 45 | Res: magic(85), drown | Chunks: contam | XP: 2034.
05:39:40 <Patashu> close it and put an exclusion on it
05:39:49 <elliott> Patashu: I mean, is it a display case thing?
05:39:51 <Patashu> also, the stats don't tell you that stone giants hurl boulders
05:39:58 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Close is C.
05:40:06 <ion> or ctrl-direction
05:40:08 <elliott> You'll have to kill the rock worm.
05:40:18 <ion> Lure it out of the wall.
05:40:24 <Patashu> now put an exclusion on the door
05:40:24 <elliott> I haven't encountered those before.
05:40:30 <elliott> Patashu: You get to teach him how to use exclusions.
05:40:45 <ion> e’s effect will be more noticeable with X
05:40:47 <Patashu> now you won't autoexplore into it
05:41:26 <elliott> When did ND become so unstoppable?
05:42:11 <Patashu> btw, from now on at level ups raise dex
05:42:14 <elliott> That must be why you're so smart: you're a master craftsminotaur.
05:42:58 <elliott> Craftsminotaur: best word?
05:43:01 <elliott> Patashu: Some of that int is from a ring, mind.
05:43:26 <Patashu> elliott: there's still not much point raising int as a troglodyte
05:43:34 <Patashu> by the time stat loss is a problem you should have plenty of cures and carry them
05:43:38 <ion> His starting int was 4.
05:43:45 <elliott> ion: He went to university.
05:44:16 <Patashu> he got a degree in troglodology
05:44:24 <Patashu> and trog accepted him in a trainee position
05:44:35 <elliott> Ohhh, *that's* where "Trog" comes from.
05:44:44 <ion> Troglodology sucks as a palindrome.
05:44:44 <elliott> NihilistDandy: You opened the door
05:44:45 <NihilistDandy> So, in spite of the exclusion, it's driving me into the Giant room
05:45:08 <elliott> Not sure what's going on. Patashu?
05:45:20 <elliott> 06:44 <NihilistDandy> So, in spite of the exclusion, it's driving me into the Giant room
05:45:34 <Patashu> maybe place exclusions around it too, then
05:45:52 <elliott> That would result in you dying.
05:45:52 <ion> Driving you there? It didn’t open the door yet, did it?
05:45:54 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Remove the door exclusion.
05:45:57 <Patashu> you should probably leave it for later
05:46:03 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Then put an e on the door while in the X bigmap.
05:46:05 <ion> Interesting.
05:46:08 <Patashu> no sense in dying when you can live so easily
05:47:27 <ion> Do you have a scroll of magic mapping?
05:47:34 <ion> You have a limited time to reach the entrance.
05:47:42 <ion> Also, do you have food? :-P
05:47:44 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Don't do labrynths.
05:47:50 <ion> Labyrinths are great.
05:47:50 <elliott> monqy hates them and from what I've read I hate them too.
05:48:10 <elliott> Imagine a maze that changes, that you can't remember, and that you're stuck in until you reach teh end and fight a monster.
05:48:11 <ion> They have some potentially good loot.
05:48:42 <elliott> You don't have nearly enough.
05:48:47 <NihilistDandy> But I'll just be pressing o and doing whatever happens
05:48:50 <ion> Oh! You’re a minotaur!
05:48:55 <ion> Minotaurs can map the labyrinth.
05:48:58 <elliott> No autoexplore, as I understand it.
05:49:07 <elliott> Do they need magic mapping?
05:49:18 <elliott> So he can just autoexplore it?
05:49:29 <ion> Dunno if autoexplore works, but it shouldn’t forget the map.
05:49:43 <elliott> But it's immaterial if he doesn't find it, anyway.
05:49:50 <ion> I never skip labyrinths.
05:50:04 <ion> elliott: You haven’t even tried one. :-P
05:50:13 <elliott> But I read a bit about them.
05:50:17 <Patashu> autoexplore does not work in labyrinths
05:50:19 <Patashu> you have to manualexplore them
05:50:23 <Patashu> magic mapping doesn't work either
05:50:24 <elliott> Even if you're a minotaur? Bleh.
05:50:29 <Patashu> labyrinth is basically 'BOY I LOVE MAZES'
05:50:33 <Patashu> but the good thing about labyrinths is
05:50:40 <Patashu> they colour the walls by what euclidean distance they are from the exit
05:50:53 <ion> and the loot
05:50:56 <Patashu> so you can pretty quickly deduce which way yuou need to go
05:51:08 <elliott> How powerful is the minotaur at the end?
05:51:14 <elliott> And does he have enough food even if he can remember the maze?
05:51:18 <Patashu> you're diesel so no problem
05:51:19 <elliott> (And does the maze still change for a minotaur?)
05:51:22 <Patashu> (and if he is a problem you can bia)
05:51:32 <Patashu> well, how much food does he have?
05:51:35 <ion> It does change, but that’s not a real problem.
05:51:39 <elliott> He keeps eating permafood.
05:51:43 <ion> Even without mapping
05:52:00 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Do you have a scroll of magic mapping?
05:52:04 <elliott> You can't run away from something invisible.
05:52:15 <Patashu> must have been an unseen horror
05:52:18 <elliott> Is your autopickup still off?
05:52:34 <elliott> Press Ctrl+A and stop wasting time; the labyrnth gate expires.
05:52:40 <elliott> Do you have magic mapping?
05:52:58 <Patashu> in case there are friends in the black part
05:53:02 <ion> When he shoots a cloud at you, step away from it.
05:53:15 <elliott> NihilistDandy: I wrote that message before you replied.
05:53:21 <elliott> (Press _ to get rid of the annoying warning. :p)
05:53:49 <elliott> NihilistDandy: STOP IGNORING _ MESSAGES
05:53:51 <elliott> I hate people who do that.
05:54:05 <Patashu> I should send a funny message too
05:54:07 <elliott> Cyclopses are like stone golems but less scary.
05:54:18 <Patashu> helpful hint for cyclopes:
05:55:10 <elliott> NihilistDandy: that tock clicking
05:55:19 <elliott> it means the labrynth is running out
05:55:23 <ion> Don’t waste time, find the labyrinth.
05:55:31 <elliott> NihilistDandy: don't autoexplore if you want to find it
05:55:34 <elliott> use X to find the most likely places
05:55:54 <elliott> i'd suspect it's to the right but i don't really know
05:55:56 <ion> It was “long way away”, it won’t be in the immediate vicinity.
05:56:22 <elliott> He's not goingg to reach the lab at this rate.
05:56:27 <ion> Perhaps SW?
05:57:21 <ion> And offer the corpses to Trog after resting.
05:57:30 <zzo38> I started making something called WizardCard for implementing Magic: the Gathering and other similar things, this is what I have in a parser so far: http://sprunge.us/TJjZ
05:57:33 <elliott> NihilistDandy: Ctrl+F corpse
05:57:53 <elliott> that corpse isn't boring :(
05:58:30 <Patashu> when were mimics this strong
05:58:31 <elliott> NihilistDandy: this is your lesson in "mimics aren't pushovers"
05:59:00 <elliott> why are you chasing things
05:59:12 <elliott> you might be diesel but you're running out of gas!!!
05:59:33 <elliott> your unreasonable luck is depriving you of the helpful learning experiences that are YASDs
06:00:04 <elliott> ok, lair entrance must be on the next level
06:00:08 <elliott> explore out this one then go down to it
06:00:12 <Patashu> it might still be on this level
06:01:02 <elliott> NihilistDandy: just run up to it and bash them in
06:01:03 <Patashu> why are you using wand zaps on kobolds
06:01:11 <elliott> bashing kobolds to death is what you do best
06:01:24 <elliott> NihilistDandy: you'll find the lair a nice change
06:01:28 <Patashu> have you found no boots this game?
06:02:01 -!- zzo38 has left.
06:02:02 <elliott> you could have sacrificed that corpse
06:02:05 <elliott> NihilistDandy: god gifts go on the floor
06:02:31 <elliott> Patashu: he's already training axes exclusively
06:02:38 <elliott> oh it's antimagic too awesome
06:02:49 <ion> Some other brands are generally better than antimagic.
06:03:13 <elliott> that's not backing up that's just backing
06:03:16 <elliott> ahahaha how is he still alive
06:03:16 <Patashu> (you can pretend kobolds don't exist at this point)
06:03:23 <Patashu> elliott: we made him too diesel :(
06:03:31 <elliott> NihilistDandy: is that all the corpses
06:03:44 <ion> Search for what [Enter for "boots", or ? for help]? corpse
06:03:51 <ion> I read: ‘Enter for "boobs"’
06:03:54 <elliott> Patashu: he's making so many
06:04:00 <elliott> he's just too powerful to die to them
06:04:06 <elliott> he reminds me of a week ago except
06:05:27 <NihilistDandy> Wanted to save, didn't know that also made me quit
06:05:33 <elliott> NihilistDandy: It's a roguelike.
06:05:39 <elliott> You can suspend and resume.
06:06:54 <elliott> explore the whole level first perhaps
06:07:09 <Patashu> so, here's your lair notice
06:07:14 <Patashu> 1) don't do subbranches of lair before all of lair
06:07:19 <elliott> NihilistDandy: btw the lair is boring + hydrae
06:07:31 <elliott> just go to the lair water is such a pain
06:07:38 <Patashu> 2) monsters to watch out for: blink frogs (they're faster than you, appear in packs and blink), hydras (obviously), catoblepases (slower than you, when they breathe petrifying gas immediately move to an open tile)
06:07:46 <Patashu> eels shoot lightning at you
06:07:50 <Patashu> but they can't move out of the water
06:07:53 <monqy> 22:47:50 < elliott> monqy hates them and from what I've read I hate them too.
06:07:56 <monqy> labyrinths are awfu
06:07:59 <monqy> 22:47:50 < ion> Labyrinths are great.
06:08:14 <Patashu> also, the tengu are listed as gray
06:08:18 <Patashu> so you can probably just tab them
06:08:19 <elliott> 07:08 <Gretell> tengu (H) | Spd: 10 | Int: normal (items) | HD: 5 | HP: 16-39 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Dam: 10, 5, 5 | Fl: fly | Res: magic(20) | XP: 130.
06:08:24 <monqy> 22:33:34 < elliott> do the 5 Zot levels,
06:08:36 <ion> monqy: no u
06:09:01 <elliott> hungry ghosts make you more hungry
06:09:16 <elliott> 07:09 <Henzell> hungry ghost[1/1]: A ghost whose primary attack is to decrease your satiation level, by a quarter of your current satiation - it will rapidly reduce you to very hungry or near starving if its attacks connect. If you don't have ranged attacks and can't hit hard and fast, beware. Also eats corpses on the ground.
06:09:19 <Patashu> it's not like the monsters in shiren that make you incredibly hungry
06:09:31 <Patashu> I've absolutely never noticed it
06:09:41 <monqy> 22:51:14 < elliott> And does he have enough food even if he can remember the maze?
06:09:43 <Patashu> well if it was in melee range
06:09:47 <monqy> food doesn't really matter in laby
06:09:57 <monqy> laby is "free loot but you have to do this boring maze"
06:10:08 <monqy> oh and some labys have teletraps in their endings
06:10:20 <elliott> monqy: are you watching this i
06:10:22 <monqy> so you get teleported after finishing the laby
06:10:23 <elliott> have no idea how he's still alive
06:10:24 <Patashu> if they see you they shoot you
06:10:27 <Patashu> if they don't see you they move towards you
06:10:30 <monqy> dpeg is fervent about keeping them like that
06:10:32 <Patashu> if you are next to them they melee you which does almost no damage
06:10:41 <elliott> monqy: does he have any justification
06:10:45 <monqy> or at least he was, before he excused himself from devteam (that happened, right?)
06:10:46 <Patashu> well, you're bad at centaurs
06:10:53 <Patashu> have fun dying to the first centaur warrior pack you see
06:11:01 <elliott> NihilistDandy: the tactics that you don't need to bother with now
06:11:05 <elliott> will kill you in 5 turns later on
06:11:11 <elliott> no matter how many jokes you have
06:11:36 <Patashu> anyway, centaurs are easy if you
06:11:46 <Patashu> 2) engage when they're a few tiels or less away
06:12:12 <elliott> You open the centaur like a pillowcase!!!
06:12:12 <monqy> 23:04:10 < elliott> diesel
06:12:17 <monqy> wow elliott already says "diesel"?
06:12:24 <elliott> i didnt know it was a thing
06:12:44 <elliott> too gobsmacked by his still being alive to come up with other wrods
06:12:49 <elliott> you should melee that hydra with your axe :D
06:13:32 <monqy> 23:10:41 < elliott> monqy: does he have any justification
06:13:50 <monqy> but he sure got angry when minmay compared it to putting aliches on d:1
06:14:07 <Patashu> how did those arrows hit him for so much
06:14:45 <Patashu> reverse drinking game: feel like a dumbass every time you drink
06:14:47 <monqy> ok i'm finally caught up
06:14:53 <Patashu> he's dying to a centaur pack
06:15:03 <Patashu> he doesn't 'care' about centaurs because he's 'diesel'
06:15:16 <elliott> whack them and somehow survive
06:15:21 <elliott> the universe hates our advice today
06:15:38 <elliott> when you're not next to them
06:15:49 <elliott> NihilistDandy: what scrolls do you have good god
06:16:43 <Patashu> (he should have handed before resting, actually)
06:16:57 <elliott> walk behind ogre then hand
06:17:14 <ion> Get one more BIA
06:17:24 <elliott> there was no possible reason
06:17:30 <monqy> what are you dOING
06:17:43 <monqy> b was the wRONG CHOICE
06:17:44 <ion> Get one more BIA
06:18:00 <monqy> you could have gotten out of lose quicklier with nu
06:18:03 <elliott> i warned NihilistDandy about how this was going to kill him
06:18:19 <Patashu> there are a few normal centaurs left
06:18:26 <Patashu> and nd is really bad at crawl
06:18:27 <NihilistDandy> Centaur warrior is dead. Centaurs are made of babies.
06:18:29 <Patashu> so he'll find a way to die to them
06:18:29 <ion> I can’t fathom how he’s still alive.
06:18:37 <ion> with his style of playing
06:18:45 <monqy> nah lots of things are made of babies at 21hp
06:18:49 <elliott> ion: 26 str, +1,+4 antimagic executioner's axe
06:19:07 <elliott> i fucking hate you for surviving another situation against all logic
06:19:08 <monqy> d:1 trash for example is made of babies. on d:1 you don't even HAVE 21 hp
06:19:11 <quintopia> i think i need to watch this. someone link me the -cast
06:19:17 <Patashu> monqy: D:1 trash is not trash if you're, e.g., a felid
06:19:18 <elliott> quintopia: telnet crawl.develz.org 345
06:19:19 <monqy> elliott: mibe reasons
06:19:23 <Patashu> (I almost died to a hobgoblin)
06:19:24 <elliott> choose nihilistdandy's letter
06:19:34 <monqy> Patashu: d:1 trash isn't always trash on d:1
06:19:37 <monqy> Patashu: it's trash on d:13
06:19:42 <ion> elliott: But he has gone to 1/5 health a number of times and then danced in arrow rain and then survived by miraculous luck.
06:19:48 <monqy> Patashu: unless you get like an orc with disto that you somehow miss
06:20:01 <Patashu> did he even have cover he could get behind that time
06:20:13 <elliott> but he was so cavalier about it!!!
06:20:17 <Patashu> and since centaurs are faster than you
06:20:20 <Patashu> you can't go far for covers
06:20:26 <elliott> Patashu: do you really think he
06:20:26 <Patashu> (yaktaurs you see later will be same speed, otoh)
06:20:30 <elliott> thought out that reasoning in his head
06:20:42 <elliott> GL immediately before you meet another centaur warrior
06:20:47 <elliott> the lair has no centaurs, only hydrae
06:20:47 <monqy> I didn't see what happened but likely I would just have charged them
06:20:49 <NihilistDandy> Not done exploring and flying in the face of logic
06:20:58 <elliott> we've fed into this delusion too much
06:20:59 <monqy> backing up to cover can be worse than charging in many cases
06:21:18 <elliott> you didn't cut that corner
06:21:19 <monqy> now go for the kill
06:21:32 <monqy> they're too weak at your piety level
06:21:41 <elliott> NihilistDandy: you realise it burns piety right
06:21:48 <elliott> you have to sacrifice corpses for every bia
06:22:06 <elliott> Patashu: i love how he just runs around with no diagonals in realtime
06:22:14 <Patashu> diagonals. what are those.
06:22:15 <monqy> just play musu my god
06:22:25 <Patashu> watch out for that cyclops
06:22:36 <ion> I’ve been trying to get ellie to play DESu.
06:22:46 <monqy> musu was a joke, ion
06:23:07 <elliott> you want to blink or something not just
06:23:12 <monqy> how did this haPpen
06:23:22 <monqy> why did yoit's going to hit you with a rock and you will die
06:23:32 <elliott> NihilistDandy: yOU HAVE MESSAGES PRESS _
06:23:42 * ion is laughing out loud
06:23:50 <monqy> what use is checking messages if it's just squarelos greeting you
06:23:52 <elliott> ion: i've been laughing for the past
06:23:59 <monqy> ahahah did you really thingk it would be a good idea to rest there
06:24:13 <Patashu> wow, plowing through thos e blinking scrolls
06:24:20 <HackEgo> 2012-05-04.txt:05:16:20: <itidus20> sounds like the force is strong with nihilist
06:24:39 <Patashu> how can this possibly have happened
06:24:55 <ion> My cheek muscles hurt for laughing so much.
06:25:04 <elliott> i guess you can quaff curing
06:25:15 <elliott> you would die the next turn
06:25:19 <elliott> Patashu: would that help at this point
06:25:23 <elliott> or would it get a kick in first
06:25:29 <elliott> quaff curing for god's sake
06:25:37 <ion> Now go straight to <
06:25:38 <monqy> duck behind a wall or something
06:25:43 <Patashu> look at how much curing sucks
06:25:55 <Patashu> why are you goign that way
06:25:58 <monqy> do you have digging
06:26:07 <monqy> and go to the exit normally
06:26:50 <elliott> he doesn't have any curing potions left right
06:27:03 <monqy> then somehow survive
06:27:05 <monqy> so you can die to trog wrath
06:27:18 <elliott> reading fear is probably your best bet
06:27:22 <ion> It won’t work again so soon.
06:27:25 <monqy> nice fear collection
06:27:34 <monqy> that was tele, elliott. telliott
06:27:40 <elliott> Patashu: he practically is
06:27:40 <monqy> Patashu: he did bad things
06:27:46 <elliott> he's rested and run into the cyclops again about 5 times
06:27:47 <ion> Maybe fog, he says.
06:27:55 <Patashu> also, fog only helps against ranged attacks
06:28:00 <monqy> let the cyclops kill you
06:28:08 <elliott> want him to die to a rat or something
06:28:09 <monqy> you won't learn if you keep escaping death
06:28:19 <elliott> monqy: that's what i said btw
06:28:22 <monqy> i don't know if you will or won't learn if you keep escaping death but
06:28:25 <monqy> i just want you to die
06:28:30 <itidus20> this character can live on and become something glorious
06:28:31 <elliott> let us look at your inventory
06:28:39 <elliott> would enslavement work on a cyclops
06:28:43 <Patashu> it would, but MR check first
06:28:54 <monqy> it also might not hit for all the cyclops hp
06:28:56 <ion> ooh, a bread ration might work
06:28:58 <elliott> enslavement might be best because
06:29:04 <monqy> wield the chaos dagger
06:29:09 <monqy> "trust me on this"
06:29:18 <monqy> then hit the cyclops
06:29:21 <monqy> you might banish it
06:29:25 <monqy> come on it's worth a shot
06:29:26 <elliott> NihilistDandy: zap enslavement at the cyclops
06:29:33 <monqy> if you throw it the chaos won't "proc"
06:29:33 <elliott> but nothing else will either
06:29:35 <Patashu> it's probably out of rocks at this point
06:30:04 <monqy> either you'll kill it soon enough or die
06:30:05 <Patashu> it's how close it was to making the check
06:30:05 <HackEgo> 2012-05-04.txt:06:24:20: <HackEgo> 2012-05-04.txt:05:16:20: <itidus20> sounds like the force is strong with nihilist
06:30:07 <Patashu> aposfkofdijgofhjtiuhyjtdy8t
06:30:08 <ion> :-DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
06:30:26 <ion> I’m sure crawl’s source code has special dice rolls for NihilistDandy.
06:30:40 <monqy> let him fend for himself on this one
06:30:40 <Patashu> let's all stop giving him advice
06:31:02 <elliott> i think he's doing this purposely to upset us by this point
06:31:41 <elliott> im still giving advice but
06:31:41 <Patashu> until he starts being good at crawl spontaneously
06:31:46 <elliott> it'll be advice of me not clawing my skin off
06:31:59 <elliott> that he's going to win this game
06:32:07 <Patashu> but I bet he dies on vaults 8
06:32:39 <Patashu> he can do the lair whenever he wants, maaaan
06:33:52 <elliott> because it grew another head
06:34:10 <elliott> do you have heal wounds or whatever
06:34:16 <quintopia> what is the effect of a hydra growing a head?
06:34:23 <elliott> quintopia: it gets stronger
06:34:27 <ion> quintopia: It will become even more badass.
06:34:52 <elliott> NihilistDandy: try bia again
06:35:02 <elliott> does he even have any options here
06:35:02 * Sgeo plays with Bitlbee
06:35:15 <monqy> wow are you growing the hydra
06:35:15 <quintopia> what the hell is that picture squarelos sent
06:35:20 <Sgeo> elliott, who are you talking to?
06:36:29 <elliott> there's an upstairs right there
06:36:58 <Patashu> aren't staircases fucking amazing
06:37:02 <elliott> wait until a centaur warrior comes 'round the corner
06:37:30 <ion> I expected him to go back down the stairs without resting and then kill the wraith without dying.
06:37:38 <elliott> NihilistDandy: dude the lair has
06:37:42 <elliott> so many things you can eat
06:37:45 <elliott> it's crawling with minor bugs
06:39:15 <Patashu> so, let's take bets on death cause
06:39:31 <elliott> NihilistDandy: enxhant weapon
06:40:05 <elliott> and wasn't training armour
06:40:10 <Patashu> draining lowers your skills?
06:40:20 <elliott> NihilistDandy: can you please start taking our advice
06:40:27 <elliott> Patashu: i have no idea, i was just guessing
06:40:46 <NihilistDandy> I've been taking it seriously, I've just also been ignoring some of it for entertainment value
06:41:14 <elliott> i wonder if that cloakis better than yours
06:41:19 <Patashu> it was pretty funny when he did absolutely everything wrong
06:41:27 <Patashu> if he was xl27 it'd be a candidate for great near misses
06:41:51 <ion> Elven cloaks add stealthiness, but that’s irrelevant for your character.
06:41:52 <elliott> Patashu: if these aren't some of the most-watched tvs
06:42:18 <NihilistDandy> Oh, are there people outside this channel watching this shit?
06:42:21 <ion> The TV would need to have this IRC discussion merged to the game.
06:42:29 <elliott> NihilistDandy: no, but moments can be recalled for TV
06:42:39 <elliott> (it's usually used to laugh at tile players' stupid deaths)
06:42:44 <ion> quintopia: TWSS
06:43:02 <elliott> you have five viewers, so me ion quintopia monqy
06:43:09 <elliott> NihilistDandy: people who play with the graphical tilesets
06:43:34 <elliott> tiles are awful, people who use them are awful
06:44:16 <ion> I bought ten. http://www.ebay.com/itm/MACGYVER-Original-floating-home-used-Richard-Dean-Andersons-home-TV-series-/140738046722?afsrc=1
06:44:27 <Patashu> once you have axes at 26 or 27
06:44:29 <Patashu> turn on armour and fighting
06:45:03 <Patashu> lair generates a dungeon map
06:45:06 <Patashu> and then randomly adds noise
06:46:16 <ion> ^F.<enter>
06:46:20 <itidus20> "Due to the incredible response on this auction, we have contacted the Guinness Book of World Records to see if we can create a new category for "Most Views on a Single Item on eBay"."
06:47:29 <elliott> i assign Patashu to blink frog duty
06:47:56 <elliott> NihilistDandy: no point wandering around
06:48:00 <elliott> you can go downstairs, it just requires planning
06:48:47 <elliott> he's going to die, you have to arrange it to be enterataining
06:49:08 <NihilistDandy> Though knowing me, I might *not* die in the most hilarious way possible
06:49:52 <elliott> ion: if you don't advice him
06:49:55 <elliott> he'll start doing stupid stuff
06:51:22 <ion> he’ll “start doing stupid stuff”?
06:51:55 <ion> Press and hold tab
06:52:11 <NihilistDandy> Gonna go ahead and smoke a pipe while you guys confer. My strategy involves BIA and holding tab. Maybe some Hand
06:52:38 <ion> That was an awesome Freudian typo.
06:52:40 <elliott> NihilistDandy: press < and kill it
06:52:40 <Patashu> stairdancing is a great idea
06:52:42 <Patashu> now he only has to kill one thing
06:52:48 <elliott> ion: i suspect it was intentional
06:53:01 <elliott> sacrifice the other corpse
06:53:29 <Patashu> ugly things can appear in lair?
06:56:41 <Patashu> if it's alone you can tab it
06:56:58 <Patashu> your autocorrect -does- that
06:57:03 <Patashu> I thought you were just being annoying
06:57:21 <Patashu> (the 'sick' status turns off regen)
06:57:41 <elliott> monqy: are you watching this
06:57:59 <ion> Still no Trog gifts? I suppose not since you’ve been using BIA so much.
06:58:02 <elliott> things that don't even resemble chokepoints
06:58:04 <ion> I mean, new ones.
06:59:05 <elliott> ion: it's only 84/92 he's been worse
06:59:19 <ion> Against a wall, so it gets id’d if it’s a wand of digging.
07:01:03 <elliott> NihilistDandy: black mambas aren't that dangerous
07:01:09 <elliott> you have rpois; they just hit kinda hard
07:01:58 <ion> Try r on first.
07:02:05 <ion> if you have a scroll of remove curse.
07:03:28 -!- noseovertail has joined.
07:03:42 <elliott> `@ noseovertail ? esoteric
07:03:45 <ion> meh, anti-magic again
07:03:49 <HackEgo> noseovertail: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page
07:04:01 <HackEgo> noseovertail: This channel is about programming -- for the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.
07:04:02 <noseovertail> o I thought this was esoteric terrance mckenna style
07:04:06 <Patashu> now can you swap back to the exec
07:04:17 -!- noseovertail has left.
07:04:28 <elliott> I knew that guy was in the wrong place.
07:04:34 <elliott> The excitement of having found the right channel tipped my off.
07:04:43 <elliott> Nobody has trouble finding a channel about esoteric programming languages.
07:05:07 <elliott> you're not going to find a better axe
07:05:44 <Patashu> the only kind of axe you'd want at this point is speed, vampiric, or flaming (for hydras)
07:05:59 <Patashu> or maybe holy wrath but you're not getting that
07:06:58 <elliott> NihilistDandy: what were the two rings
07:07:29 <elliott> but not better than what you have
07:08:35 <Patashu> clearly you need to keep hitting the hydra that isn't hurt at all
07:08:46 <elliott> you're going to die next turn
07:09:12 <elliott> NihilistDandy: you are going to die
07:09:14 <elliott> if you do not listen to us
07:09:18 <Patashu> use hand to regen faster if you're in danger
07:09:22 <monqy> he's not going to die
07:09:34 <monqy> btw are you training armour and fighting yet
07:10:00 <Patashu> (I don't know if the 'min delay first' rule still applys for execs)
07:10:09 <monqy> having defenses and hp is important
07:10:14 <itidus20> <noseovertail> This is my channel!
07:10:14 <monqy> obsessing over mindelay is silly
07:10:18 <Patashu> turn on fighting and armour
07:10:30 <monqy> also: other benefits from Fighting
07:10:33 <monqy> like: damage etc etc
07:10:50 <elliott> i'd defocus axes and focus fighting
07:11:08 <elliott> NihilistDandy: ps you're near starving
07:11:12 <monqy> NihilistDandy: what armour are you in
07:12:53 <Patashu> > wait until not nauseous so you can finish your chunks > eat a ration instead???
07:12:54 <lambdabot> <no location info>: parse error (possibly incorrect indentation)
07:13:21 <Patashu> it is, but you didn't have to eat a ration either
07:14:02 <elliott> why does he never notice _
07:14:42 <Patashu> going up and down the stairs takes 1-2 turns
07:15:10 <Patashu> he died deliberately though
07:15:13 <elliott> NihilistDandy: i predict you will never reach that stage again
07:15:25 <elliott> 08:15 <jeanjacques> who is nihilistdandy?
07:15:29 <elliott> i don't know how to answer this question
07:15:31 <NihilistDandy> elliott: I think you will find that Trog provides for the ones who bring him blood
07:15:50 <elliott> 08:15 <jeanjacques> and why did they stairdance a hydra several times without any plan?
07:16:37 <itidus20> couldn't you go to bed without dying?
07:16:56 <elliott> NihilistDandy: telnet termcast.develz.org
07:19:22 <elliott> 08:19 <mikee_> this isn't bad for 5 games
07:19:24 <elliott> monqy: how can he ever understand
07:23:24 <elliott> do you even know what muck is
07:26:30 <NihilistDandy> Assuming we're still talking about text games, that is
07:26:39 <elliott> yes, but probably not what you're thinking of
07:27:00 <elliott> i'm referring to mummy chaos knight
07:27:31 <elliott> Patashu: no you're doing it all wrong
07:28:06 <elliott> not even monqy and all he plays is muck
07:28:13 <monqy> ragdoll rocks muck
07:28:42 <monqy> Patashu: you are going to disto a gsc and wield it right
07:30:54 <Patashu> I don't know if I want to win or have fun yet
07:31:31 <Sgeo> elliott, esolangs doesn't use php-cgi does it?
07:31:38 <Patashu> so, ogres can't use armour, right?
07:31:42 <Patashu> so I should go spell casting hybrid at some point
07:31:44 <Sgeo> elliott, bug, etc.
07:32:01 <elliott> "nginx+php-fpm are not affected" - so no.
07:32:22 <elliott> ?-s dumping source code would be irrelevant, anyway.
07:32:22 <lambdabot> Maybe you meant: . ? @ ask bf do ft id msg pl rc v wn
07:32:31 <elliott> The only exposed files are common MediaWiki stuff.
07:33:50 <pikhq_> Somehow, I think http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_Life is a more usable programming environment than http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BASIC_Programming
07:34:06 <elliott> Patashu: you're meant to dig or sth i think
07:34:37 <elliott> 08:34 <Henzell> Deleted sastopher[1/1]: Orc -> Elf -> Lair -> Swamp -> Snake -> Slime
07:35:16 <NihilistDandy> pikhq_: It's probably easier to make a game of pong, anyway
07:35:21 * Sgeo is now interested in zero-player games
07:35:45 <pikhq_> NihilistDandy: I'm not sure that BASIC Programming cart is even TC.
07:36:12 <pikhq_> While Game of Life, of course, is. Modulo infinite space, of course.
07:36:59 <Patashu> I have -five- heal wounds potions
07:37:18 <Patashu> 'You can now bend space around yourself.'
07:37:26 <kmc> that happened to me once
07:37:51 <elliott> kmc: you should play crawl so all this stuff makes sense to you
07:37:58 <olsner> don't you always bend space around yourself?
07:37:59 <kmc> drugs: like video game powerups for real life
07:38:33 <elliott> Sgeo: now ##crawl know my SECRET IDENTITY!!!
07:38:43 <NihilistDandy> 'You can now bend more space around yourself' just lacks panache.
07:40:18 <Patashu> that bend space sure helped!
07:40:27 <Patashu> ~first heal wounds quaff of the game~
07:40:40 <NihilistDandy> What, that you're a scientist who, in a tragic type-level programming accident, created the most chaotic IRC bot possessed of AI and a taste for text games ever seen?
07:41:31 <Sgeo> Does DF count as a text game?
07:41:47 <itidus20> Sgeo: well i was rambling in #gamedev the other day about non-interactive games
07:42:12 <elliott> Or rather, a glyph game or whatever.
07:42:19 <itidus20> and how flash movies on newgrounds might almost count as games
07:42:45 <itidus20> you guys are already familiar with the nature of my rants though.
07:43:05 <NihilistDandy> That flash is awful and shut up that is the end of the discussion?
07:44:06 <NihilistDandy> What do you imagine it would take to wipe PHP off the programming map?
07:45:50 <itidus20> humm.. drive it to near extinction
07:46:34 <elliott> Teapacks (also known as Tipex) (Hebrew: טיפקס) was an Israeli band that formed in 1988 in the southern Israeli city of Sderot. Originally the band was named after the correction fluid Tipp-Ex, but the name was then changed so as not to infringe on the well-known brand.
07:48:31 <pikhq_> Yeah, um, that's the first time I've seen "Tipp-Ex".
07:48:50 <Patashu> want to see how my first ogak died
07:48:55 <elliott> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AI_S0tswjWc
07:50:35 <Patashu> so I hit it a bunch but suck at combat
07:50:39 <Patashu> so I have to guzzle ?heal wounds like a moron
07:50:44 <elliott> NihilistDandy: this song is actually great
07:50:52 <elliott> for eurovision at the least
07:51:14 <Patashu> then I realize 'this isn't working'
07:51:17 <elliott> Patashu: your error was using mephitic cloud
07:51:18 <Patashu> so I back up and use the goblin as cover
07:51:23 <Patashu> until the goblin gets confused and stops being my meat shield
07:51:26 <Patashu> and then I just run for the stairs
07:51:49 <monqy> elliott: shachaf: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13786158/monqy.png
07:51:59 <Patashu> I got confused and fell down the stairs
07:52:00 <elliott> monqy: you neglected to misspell your name!!!
07:52:03 <Patashu> yet it still took like 3 turns for it to stop
07:52:09 <monqy> how do i misspell "monqy"
07:52:10 <elliott> is that what you look like
07:52:25 <monqy> i also "forgot" to put monqy before the thing
07:52:34 <elliott> its ok you get a special self-portrait
07:52:36 <monqy> maybe my "forgettings" cancel each other out
07:52:46 <elliott> im going to set that as the esolang wiki's background
07:53:13 <NihilistDandy> I'm thinking ghoul next time. I like getting health from consuming corpses
07:53:21 <monqy> & yes that is what i look at
07:53:24 <monqy> especially in real life
07:54:20 <NihilistDandy> We are all pears here. Pear-reviewed esolang discussion
07:57:33 <NihilistDandy> Oh, crawl? You guys should try it! It's a roguelike, but with no rules or strategies, just cowboys
07:59:32 <kmc> console cowboys?
08:00:06 <monqy> elliott: help should i use faith or clarity
08:00:29 <monqy> faith means xom acts more but clarity means he won't confuse me (assuming that bug's fixed where xom confuses through clarity) which means less lame deaths
08:00:38 <elliott> do you want to laugh or win
08:00:52 <monqy> ostensibly less lame deaths means more laughs
08:02:52 <lambdabot> Local time for monqy is Fri May 4 01:02:51 2012
08:07:32 <elliott> xom would make your play more NihilistDandy
08:07:36 <elliott> but i think you need to make it less NihilistDandy instead
08:07:47 <elliott> are you watching squarelos?
08:08:36 <elliott> this is the second time i've told you that
08:08:54 <elliott> the flashing square thing is his, that's not part of the game itself
08:09:07 <elliott> also he has both autoexplore and a custom autofight script on space and bashes it a lot
08:10:08 <elliott> monqy: running from sigmund? how could you
08:10:20 <monqy> I was slowed then got confused and then sandwiched with an ogre
08:11:45 <elliott> monqy: you should convert to chei
08:13:17 <elliott> imagine all the fun of xom and all the slow of chei
08:17:01 <elliott> 09:16 <absolutego> who's on squarelos?
08:17:04 <elliott> i don't understand this question
08:17:07 <elliott> monqy: has anyone but you ever been on squraelos
08:19:23 <elliott> monqy: you might want to tell NihilistDandy why muck is a bad idea even if xom
08:19:29 <elliott> LIKE YOU DIDN'T TO ME FOR MY FIRST FEW GAMES
08:19:29 <monqy> NihilistDandy: muck is a bad idea
08:19:41 <monqy> was i even around then
08:19:54 <elliott> i chose muck because of you though
08:20:18 <elliott> NihilistDandy: it's this bad: 09:20 <Henzell> muck[1/1]: Win this (without abandoning Xom) and you can win any argument before it starts.
08:21:12 <elliott> what a great grinder strategy
08:21:19 <elliott> monqy: watch nihilistdandy
08:21:25 <elliott> meleed grinder with 22 hp and died
08:21:32 <elliott> but xom revived him and gave him a crimson imp
08:21:44 <elliott> this is awful he's going to survive again
08:22:12 <elliott> just don't play mu with it
08:22:37 <elliott> you also can't quaff potions
08:22:44 <elliott> which xom makes even worse than it already is
08:22:50 <elliott> spear is the best starting weapon
08:23:33 <elliott> then thats the kind of thing youre doing on a regular basis
08:23:51 <elliott> don't you dare fucking survive
08:25:26 <monqy> elliott: chaos spear zerked the trol
08:25:56 <elliott> monqy: has anyone won muck with xom
08:26:04 <elliott> NihilistDandy: it doesn't matter
08:26:11 <elliott> pick anything, you will die the same
08:26:21 <monqy> elliott: contrary to popular belief, i'm not the best player, and i certainly got worse after my hiatus
08:26:39 <elliott> how else could you dispense such pure wisdom
08:27:34 <elliott> monqy: has anyone else made their player into a flashing square
08:29:12 <monqy> closest would probably be xomscumming (ragdoll), who uses a flashing M
08:29:46 <elliott> i know them because they died to a butterfly
08:29:57 <monqy> ah yes, I was around for that
08:30:20 <monqy> we had a "dying to things without attacks" party
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08:30:35 <monqy> like fungi and toadstools and plants and bushes and butterflies
08:32:24 <NihilistDandy> Is there a scroll with very specific requirements for use? I've used this one near enemies and walls, but it doesn't seem to do anything
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08:34:30 <monqy> elliott: have you tried smart kobold yet
08:34:43 <monqy> i'd say to termcast it but
08:35:01 <elliott> not-completely-terrible thing for that
08:35:06 <monqy> depends on your standards
08:35:24 <monqy> i use justin.tv because it's the first thing i found a hacky shell script thingy to stream with
08:35:32 <monqy> where by hacky shell script thingy i mean
08:35:43 <NihilistDandy> elliott: If you were watching a second ago, you'd have shit yourself with rage at my survival
08:35:45 <monqy> what to pass to ffmpeg to make it do streamy
08:36:03 <elliott> monqy: the os x thing is still a problem
08:36:07 <Patashu> turns out ogak is better once you know you can pray over corpses
08:38:23 <elliott> Now download libtcod1.5.0 and install into ../lib. You can copy the
08:38:23 <elliott> version in ../../linux/lib to ../lib to get this effect.
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08:39:44 <Patashu> I just met two ogres in a row and suffered no problems whatsoever
08:39:49 <Patashu> he's just suddenly...good???
08:40:20 <elliott> failing that i'll reboot i think i have a disused linux partition on here
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08:41:59 <elliott> Warning: Clang currently miscompiles some parts of Wine. If you have gcc, you
08:41:59 <elliott> can get a more stable build with:
08:41:59 <elliott> brew install wine --use-gcc
08:43:01 <elliott> monqy: i need squarelos entertainment for all this effort
08:48:21 <monqy> i didn't notice the water mocasine
08:50:31 <elliott> is smart kobold really hard to play :(
08:50:59 <monqy> depends on what you mean hard, play
08:52:31 <lambdabot> Local time for monqy is Fri May 4 01:52:29 2012
08:52:57 <monqy> why couldn't you just get libtcod is there no mac libtcod or something
08:53:42 <elliott> gave up after seeing it's not in homebrew
08:54:26 <elliott> should i just compile it myself
08:56:36 <monqy> http://doryen.eptalys.net/libtcod/ oh no wheres the sourc
08:56:50 <monqy> oh theres "svn" oh it's 404
08:57:11 <monqy> https://bitbucket.org/jice/libtcod sourc
08:58:08 <elliott> there's cmake crap and stuff here
08:58:17 <monqy> ive only ever just used the binarys
08:59:45 <elliott> An application has requested X11 to change the resolution of your display. X11 will restore the display to its previous state when the requesting application requests to return to the previous state. Alternatively, you can use the ⌥⌘A key sequence to force X11 to return to the previous state.
09:00:20 <monqy> i can make my language change every turn i think
09:00:38 <monqy> i discovered: crawl.setopt
09:02:45 -!- elliott has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
09:03:31 -!- elliott has joined.
09:05:05 <elliott> monqy: you should make it never choose the same one twice in a row
09:05:13 <elliott> also you didn't do the charset thing :'( (creibriadoses)
09:05:30 <elliott> monqy: wait i have a better idea
09:05:39 <elliott> monqy: make the layout of the stats display change every turn
09:05:54 <monqy> i'm going to make the hud panel change colours
09:07:04 <monqy> wow im going to make so many of my options random
09:07:06 <monqy> it's going to be great
09:07:53 <elliott> just change a random option randomly each tur
09:08:22 <elliott> monqy: change whether the messages are on top or bottom randomly every 50 turns or so
09:10:02 <elliott> ../dircontrol.h:41: error: ‘NAME_MAX’ was not declared in this scope
09:10:28 <elliott> ../firefly.cpp:65: error: ‘class TCODConsole’ has no member named ‘setBack’
09:10:52 <FireFly> That's the first time I've been highlighted because of a file name, I think
09:11:43 <elliott> monqy: im maybe going to reboot into os x; does the justintv shell script you found support streaming a single window
09:12:19 <monqy> no :( but if you make the streamy portion small and put your window in the top right of your screen it "works just fine"
09:12:34 <monqy> probably there are better shell scripts but i just haven't needed one
09:12:45 <elliott> ok i'll keep hacking this source
09:15:19 <monqy> do the binarys do they not work??
09:16:08 <elliott> http://doryen.eptalys.net/libtcod/download/
09:16:11 <elliott> do you see an os x binary here
09:16:39 <monqy> also a beta release
09:17:16 <elliott> uhhh do i have a virtual machine thing on here
09:20:17 <elliott> monqy: ugh this stuff looks like a pain
09:21:50 <monqy> where i found it was http://michaelchinen.com/2011/06/27/justin-tv-streaming-in-linux/ but searching for justin tv ffmpeg returns a lot more results which might be better
09:22:10 <elliott> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/10050988/haskell-removes-all-occurrences-of-a-given-value-from-within-a-list-of-lists
09:22:13 <elliott> scroll down to the last answer :D
09:22:20 <elliott> monqy: that's what i found too
09:23:25 <elliott> Thanks to your class mate I seem to have proof you are cheating on my coursework! Mr Badr expect 0% for your Haskell coursework and we may even remove the marks already attained in your previous coursework. Furthermore this username will be sent to other all the lectures who will check for plagiarism in for their coursework. You have been warned and have been told several times that you must not do this and their will be a severe pena
09:23:26 <elliott> lty! Your autumn modules will be reviewed too!
09:23:28 <elliott> Please Contact the your tutor who will give you advice on this situation.
09:26:55 <elliott> monqy: how did your configuration go
09:32:29 <monqy> wow changing status caption colour each turn makes it so they each get a different colour that applies when they're updated
09:33:40 <elliott> not quite good enough yet though
09:33:47 <monqy> right i've only just started
09:34:48 <elliott> Error: No available formula for zenity
09:36:06 <elliott> monqy: might have smart kobold running soon
09:38:42 <monqy> what else to randomis hm
09:39:22 <elliott> Unhandled exception: unimplemented function msvcp80.dll.??0?$basic_ifstream@DU?$char_traits@D@std@@@std@@QAE@PBDHH@Z called in 32-bit code (0x7b82756c).
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09:42:30 <elliott> ugh this installation is disused
09:43:50 <elliott> ./kobold_bin: error while loading shared libraries: libtcod.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
09:43:53 <elliott> i forget what this error means
09:44:43 <monqy> libtcod.so is in ../lib
09:44:53 <monqy> somewhere in there
09:45:15 <monqy> did you copy it onto your loadpath
09:45:21 <elliott> LD_LIBRARY_PATH=. works :p
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09:47:58 <elliott_> i start it and little lines of blue light dance at the top of the screen
09:48:53 <monqy> thers a togl full screen option
09:49:03 <elliott_> it does not show anything on my screen apart from the tiny lines of light at the top
09:49:32 <monqy> how did that happen
09:50:26 <elliott_> does anyone know how to force sdl to be windowed
09:50:39 <monqy> you could try wineing it
09:50:40 <elliott_> monqy: what exact keystrokes do i need from it starting to get it windowed
09:50:51 <elliott_> no, it doesn't work in wine, i tried on os x
09:50:56 <elliott_> it was an error with an unimplemented function
09:51:20 <monqy> jjjj<enter>jjj<enter>
09:52:09 <elliott_> how long do you have to wait before starting it for that to work
09:52:19 <elliott_> and does the music take a while to start for you too
09:52:30 <monqy> the music happens once you start playing the game
09:52:46 <elliott_> huh, it suddenly started working
09:55:34 <monqy> http://michaelchinen.com/2011/06/27/justin-tv-streaming-in-linux/ i had to change it a bit to get it working but
09:56:41 <monqy> i changed the qual line to
09:56:45 <monqy> QUAL="ipod320" # one of the many FFMPEG preset
09:56:55 <monqy> since thats a ffmpeg preset for me and "fast" is not
09:57:02 <monqy> and i changed the ffmpeg invokation to
09:57:06 <monqy> ffmpeg -f x11grab -s "$INRES" -r "$FPS" -i :0.0 -f alsa -ac 2 -i hw:0,0 -vol 4096 -vcodec libx264 -vpre "$QUAL" -s "$OUTRES" -acodec libmp3lame -ar 11025 -ab 128k -threads 0 -f flv "rtmp://live.justin.tv/app/$STREAM_KEY flashver=FMLE/3.0\20(compatible;\20FMSc/1.0)"
09:57:14 <monqy> because of i forget why
09:57:31 <monqy> thaaaaaaaats a bit broken i think
09:57:40 <monqy> because there's one part that I should have changed
09:57:45 <monqy> and II keep forgetting to
09:58:04 <monqy> the -vol thing i think it is
09:58:24 <elliott_> im like 3 seconds away from giving up on this and never playing smart kobold
09:58:28 <monqy> since i've gotten reports of my streams have hilaribad clippy audio
09:58:48 <monqy> at least play smart kobold, even if you don't stream it
09:58:52 <elliott_> how bad will the quality be at 960x600 anyway
09:58:58 <elliott_> i doubt you'll be able to see the individual tiles
09:59:43 <monqy> i just 20 for that
10:00:00 <monqy> (i havent messed with it)
10:00:11 <monqy> its one of the ffmepg flags
10:00:32 <monqy> im fine with awful clippy audio it's like home to me
10:00:56 <elliott_> please open up http://www.justin.tv/ehird
10:01:24 <elliott_> [rtmp @ 0x138d660] Server error: Authentication Failed.
10:01:34 <monqy> did you put your stream key in the stream key thing
10:01:57 <monqy> i don't know whats wronge :(
10:02:25 <monqy> i wont be using it
10:03:19 <elliott_> http://community.justin.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=7479
10:03:24 <elliott_> Long & short of it is simple - FFMpeg is NOT intended for streaming stuff on the Internet. Never was. It's only intended for playing stuff back locally.
10:03:24 <elliott_> Try not using FFMpeg. You'll be amazed at what will happen.....
10:04:12 <elliott_> you have to cut off the flashver apparently??
10:04:32 <monqy> your thing is flashing
10:04:39 <monqy> but not quite baordcasting yet
10:04:44 <elliott_> [libx264 @ 0x1690400] broken ffmpeg default settings detected
10:04:44 <elliott_> [libx264 @ 0x1690400] use an encoding preset (e.g. -vpre medium)
10:04:45 <elliott_> [libx264 @ 0x1690400] preset usage: -vpre <speed> -vpre <profile>
10:04:45 <elliott_> [libx264 @ 0x1690400] speed presets are listed in x264 --help
10:04:45 <elliott_> [libx264 @ 0x1690400] profile is optional; x264 defaults to high
10:04:47 <monqy> it's like it tried broadcasting but didnt quite make it
10:05:29 <monqy> i refreshed and it's still black
10:05:59 <monqy> it went offline and showed a pic
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10:07:02 <elliott_> perhaps that has something to do with it
10:07:28 <monqy> is it dropping all of your frams
10:08:15 <kmc> whatever game you were playing before, i'm pretty sure ffmpeg is a worse game
10:09:28 <itidus20> i didn't realize crawl had audio
10:09:41 <monqy> it does if you make it
10:10:01 <itidus20> you guys always take things to the next level
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10:13:02 <itidus20> it can play audio files. i dunno anything about streaming thouhg
10:13:27 <elliott_> monqy: maybe it's working now??
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10:16:09 <elliott_> what about now i set the resolution to something ridiculously low
10:16:35 <elliott_> it should be a hideously distorted view of my screen
10:16:44 <elliott_> adjust the resolution and stuff
10:17:06 <Phantom_Hoover> Oh fucking great, I have aura over half my field of vision.
10:17:06 <lambdabot> Phantom_Hoover: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
10:17:07 <elliott_> (that was a request for a screenshot)
10:18:11 <itidus20> aura as in that stuff i see sometimes when i get low blood sugar
10:18:18 <itidus20> or aura as in a video game effect :P
10:18:20 <monqy> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13786158/notsobad.png
10:18:35 <itidus20> obviously the answer isnt important to me
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10:19:29 <elliott_> how does it look & what's the fps like
10:19:56 <monqy> fps is good enough and i can see it "good enough"
10:20:46 <monqy> no it's on the quiet side and only in my right ear phone
10:20:48 <elliott_> ill tweak the settings slightly just to make them less completely terrible
10:23:19 <elliott_> i can lower the bitrate if it doesn't
10:25:37 <elliott_> also can you toggle fullscreen ingame
10:25:53 <elliott_> because if so i'll probably do that because of
10:26:26 <monqy> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13786158/takeii.png
10:26:29 <lambdabot> Local time for monqy is Fri May 4 03:26:28 2012
10:26:40 <monqy> you can togole with escap menu i think
10:27:47 <monqy> it was just like nonfullscreeen except in the upper lefthand corner
10:28:00 <monqy> or anything like that
10:28:17 <elliott_> i'll just leave it unfullscreened then
10:28:34 <elliott_> ok, brb one second and then let's get started
10:28:47 <elliott_> monqy: you're in charge of linking Phantom_Hoover to the stream
10:29:03 <monqy> Phantom_Hoover: http://www.justin.tv/ehird
10:29:40 <monqy> theres lots of that
10:29:43 <ion> Ｉ ＡＭ ＯＮ ＴＥＬＥＶＩＳＩＯＮ
10:29:55 <elliott_> lemme up the font size on this irc
10:29:57 <Phantom_Hoover> Well I *still* haven't said anything beyond 'oh' in the stream.
10:30:19 <elliott_> ok is everybody sitting comfortably
10:30:25 <monqy> it hasn't laagged to this side yet
10:31:14 <elliott_> monqy: you'll have to remind me of the keys as i go
10:31:39 <monqy> the keys are pretty simple
10:31:43 <ion> What’s that game?
10:33:33 <elliott_> i have no clue what the fuck is going on
10:33:47 <monqy> also you should search a lot but searching is pretty tolerable since it shows you where yous earch and searching is guaranteed to find traps and then the treaps are remove after searching
10:33:51 <monqy> the blue stuff is your hp
10:34:03 <elliott_> the stupidest hp display i've ever seen
10:34:58 <monqy> when you lose hp it turns brown and falls
10:35:12 <monqy> ellitt if you press s multiple times your search radius grows
10:35:15 <ion> There’s about 45 seconds of lag.
10:35:28 <elliott_> monqy: are you responding to all my old searches
10:36:21 <monqy> will 2fps make it unlaged
10:36:46 <ion> How crappy is your upstream bandwidth?
10:37:14 <elliott_> god it really doesn't feel like the future over here
10:37:21 <ion> You’re using H.264, right?
10:37:27 <monqy> approx. as crappy?
10:37:59 <monqy> crappier now that the fps is lower
10:39:08 <monqy> they should be in your PREFIX/share/ffmpeg directory
10:39:43 <monqy> you could find your copy of fast and make a copy of it with crappier everywher
10:40:09 <elliott_> let's see if ultrafast is better or worse
10:41:00 <Gregor> What the eff are you doing???
10:42:51 <monqy> about a while laggy
10:45:05 <elliott_> literally no way the quality can get shittier
10:47:19 <elliott_> im putting it back on and playing it deal with it
10:47:59 <elliott_> are Phantom_Hoover and ion watching
10:48:18 <ion> Kind of, but i’m about to fall assleap.
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10:50:12 <elliott_> do i really forget parts of the level as i go
10:50:31 <monqy> you "forget" them in a sense but
10:50:38 <monqy> that sense is that other parts of the level go over them
10:50:42 <monqy> it's a jefflaitism
10:51:13 <monqy> so you'll end up forgetting things when you overwrite them
10:51:24 <monqy> with knowledge of your current z-positioning
10:51:29 <ion> Remembering the level is available as DLC for just $19.99
10:51:44 <monqy> oh looks like you died
10:52:27 <elliott_> are all jeff lait games this difficult
10:52:46 <monqy> i'm blanking on most of them
10:52:58 <monqy> sword in hand is pretty difficult but not smart kobold difficult
10:53:05 <monqy> I've never really tried powder or jacob's matrix
10:53:10 <monqy> blanking on the rest
10:54:34 <elliott_> they're not going to let me chokepoint them are they
10:54:43 <monqy> they're smart kobold
10:55:51 <monqy> as you may have figured out, smart kobold is less of a game than an experience
10:57:00 <elliott_> i wasn't even killed by smart kobold that time
10:57:16 <monqy> that's because you walked through all those traps
10:57:32 <elliott_> but it's so boring to search all the time!!!!
10:57:39 <monqy> just hit keys faster
10:57:50 <monqy> also one thing you can do is use m to explore the levl
10:58:04 <monqy> its nice to see it before you alert all the kobolds
10:58:11 <monqy> and also what they do when you alert them
10:58:23 <monqy> m and then hjklyubn to look around
10:58:57 <monqy> depends on if you went over yourself
10:59:10 <monqy> i dunno if you get to keep it at all actually
10:59:42 <ion> I’ll continue to stream the video through the brain implant while sleeping. Goode nyghte.
10:59:52 <monqy> i wish i had one of those
11:01:05 <ion> Thanks, will do.
11:01:09 <elliott_> monqy: i correct that to "really really annoying and confusing"
11:02:11 <monqy> I forget if terrified baby kobolds become normal kobolds when they drop their pacifiers or not
11:03:38 <elliott_> monqy: oh, i see what you mean by z-level
11:04:21 <monqy> I've sure never won iut
11:04:24 <elliott_> will i derive any more enjoyment out of
11:06:53 <elliott_> your mouth went angular all of a sudden
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11:15:17 <elliott> monqy: wow that audio quality was good wasn't it
11:25:08 <elliott> smart kobold is an evil game
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11:36:20 <elliott> @tell monqy Yes, Smart Kobold is winnable: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfS6OwitNoM
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15:02:05 <HackEgo> esolang_1234: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page
15:02:36 <esolang_1234> I know :). I've read the wiki for a while now, but this is the first time on the chat.
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19:08:30 <Ngevd> Hello zzo38, fungot
19:08:32 <fungot> Ngevd: has anyone else read srfi-74 yet?) extra-www compliant. you can't rush these kind of limitations would be in the form of regions away from the swarm all the effects
19:09:46 <zzo38> I wonder how commonly the Show, Bounded, and Enum classes are used in Haskell for the purpose I am using them for in this WizardCard parser program with the BuiltinKeyword datatype.
19:10:01 <Ngevd> How are you using them
19:10:40 <zzo38> data BuiltinKeyword = KW_convert | KW_enum | KW_fail | KW_if | KW_macro | KW_section | KW_success deriving (Eq, Bounded, Enum, Show); builtins :: Map String Word32; builtins = M.fromList $ zip (drop 3 . show <$> [minBound..maxBound :: BuiltinKeyword]) [0..];
19:12:42 <Ngevd> Does <$> have a lower precedence than .?
19:12:48 <zzo38> Actually I could probably use fromDistinctAscList since the data is already sorted
19:13:24 <Ngevd> zzo38, how busy are you at the moment?
19:13:55 <zzo38> Ngevd: Not much. If you have something to tell to me then please do, regardless of how busy I am; if I cannot do so at the moment I say so.
19:14:23 <Ngevd> I was wondering if you could teach me category theory, or at leat introduce me to it
19:14:32 <zzo38> Ngevd: The precedence is correct in that code. It does work.
19:14:35 <Ngevd> Or tell me what I need to know first?
19:15:57 <zzo38> Ngevd: There are articles in Wikipedia. But in general: A category consists of a collection of objects, and a collection of morphisms, each morphism having an input and output object, such that there is an identity morphism of each object, and a composition operation which if you have a morphism (f : a -> b) and (g : b -> c) then you can compose them (g . f : a -> c).
19:16:19 <zzo38> Composition is associative and has the identity morphisms of the objects as identity leaving the other side unchanged.
19:16:41 <zzo38> So it is sort of like a monoid except that you need to indicate the object on each side.
19:17:00 <zzo38> Is this good to you so far?
19:17:47 <Ngevd> Can there be multiple morphisms with the same input/output objects?
19:18:39 <Ngevd> Okay, I think I know what's going on
19:20:03 <zzo38> A few examples: * The category of sets. Objects are sets, and morphisms are functions having elements of those sets as the inputs and outputs. * Any monoid can be made a category with a single object. * Any category has a dual where the input/output are reversed and composition is reversed. * Any directed graph makes a category, where objects are the nodes and morphisms are the ways to walk from one node to another.
19:23:21 <zzo38> And then there are functors, monads, and so on
19:24:53 <zzo38> A functor is a way converting objects and morphisms from one category to another. I will use (T x) to represent the object in the new category corresponding to (x) in the old category, and (fmap f) to represent the morphism in the new category corresponding to the morphism (f) in the old category.
19:25:16 <zzo38> A functor must satisfy the laws: fmap id = id and fmap f . fmap g = fmap (f . g) (same as in Haskell).
19:26:47 <zzo38> So that a morphism from (x) to (y) in first category becomes morphism from (T x) to (T y) in second category. It may be the same category in both cases in which case it is called endofunctor. (The Functor class in Haskell is for endofunctors on the (->) category.)
19:27:39 <Ngevd> What do you mean by the (->) category?
19:28:10 <zzo38> By the (->) category I mean the main category of Haskell; the category with types as objects and functions as morphisms. (In Haskell, categories can be identified using the type for their morphisms.)
19:31:22 <zzo38> A monad on some category is an endofunctor on that category with two additional operations eta (or return) and mu (or join), with eta :: (x -> T x) for any object x and mu :: (T (T x) -> T x) for any object x; these must also satisfy certain laws. For example the identity monad; the endofunctor converts all objects and morphisms to themself, and eta and mu are both identity morphisms (this works with any category).
19:32:49 <zzo38> There are also, morphisms which can be inverse of another; if f is inverse of g then f . g = g . f = id (possibly two different identity morphisms if they are different objects). And then, final objects, which means for each object x, there is exactly one morphism from x to the final object.
19:33:25 <zzo38> You can actually do a lot of things with category theory; you may be able to figure out some of these things by yourself, too.
19:35:57 <zzo38> In addition, the eta/mu operations of a monad are what are called "natural transformations"; Wikipedia has diagrams to explain what a natural transformation is.
19:38:03 <zzo38> I think there may be some other people on here who know a few things about category theory, too.
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19:56:49 <Ngevd> Would T (T x) be an an object in a category of categories?
19:57:13 <zzo38> Ngevd: No, T (T x) is an object in the same category as the base category, because T is an endofunctor.
20:00:36 <Ngevd> Phantom_Hoover, morbid curiosity
20:01:09 <Ngevd> And an endofunctor is a transformation from a category to the same category, right/
20:02:08 <Ngevd> But each object may not end up as the same object?
20:02:31 <zzo38> Ngevd: Yes, it might not.
20:03:44 <Ngevd> So, mu takes a category that has been transformed twice by the same endofunctor back one transformation?
20:04:46 <zzo38> Ngevd: Perhaps I am not explaining it so well. Ask someone understanding better, or look in Wikipedia. Also notice that these monad laws are the same as Haskell, in case you can understand better that way.
20:05:10 <Ngevd> I'm perhaps not listening very well either?
20:05:32 <zzo38> Ngevd: Yes, that too.
20:05:54 <Phantom_Hoover> Monads are just monoids in the category of endofunctors.
20:05:57 <Ngevd> Phantom_Hoover, who would you have asked?
20:06:39 <Phantom_Hoover> Ngevd, probably oerjan, if he's in; otherwise, either Google it, go into #haskell for resources or ask any number of people who aren't zzo.
20:07:09 <Ngevd> *I'm about to run out of battery, so I'll go now
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20:44:46 <Taneb> Do you know what time it is?
20:44:52 <Taneb> IT'S DWARF FORTRESS TIME
20:47:10 <Taneb> I think it crashed
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20:55:49 <Taneb> dwarf fortress time for realz?
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21:07:18 <lambdabot> elliott: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
21:07:29 <Taneb> elliott: dwarf fortress time
21:26:58 <Taneb> Yay happiness and marriage and love
21:27:23 <Taneb> I'm gonna let them have this party
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21:34:06 <elliott> hmm, uxterm is broken. why is uxterm broken?
21:34:21 <Kray> so that you could ask
21:34:48 <ais523> elliott: someone whe haven't seen here before, I expect
21:34:59 <HackEgo> KRAY: WELCOME TO THE INTERNATIONAL HUB FOR ESOTERIC PROGRAMMING LANGUAGE DESIGN AND DEPLOYMENT! FOR MORE INFORMATION, CHECK OUT OUR WIKI: HTTP://ESOLANGS.ORG/WIKI/MAIN_PAGE
21:35:08 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: ?welcome: not found
21:35:10 <HackEgo> Kray: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page
21:35:19 <Kray> I find these bots highly annoying
21:35:28 <fungot> \o| |o| |o/ \m/ \m/ |o/ \o/ \o| \m/ \m/ \o| |o| |o/
21:35:29 <myndzi> | | | `\o/´ | | | `\o/´ | | |
21:35:29 <myndzi> /< >\ |\ | /| >\ >\ | /< /´\ /<
21:35:47 <HackEgo> 758) <zzo38> Yes, it is true; I don't really like PHP either.
21:35:49 <Lumpio-> Kray: Feel free to make them less annoying, I'm sure they'll accept patches for fungot
21:35:49 <fungot> Lumpio-: are you making it with was just goddamn crappy browser. :p fnord/ fnord, but that
21:35:52 <fungot> http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98
21:36:21 <Gregor> Darn, it's case sensitive
21:36:35 <elliott> It's not really a rainbow.
21:37:02 <HackEgo> Kray: This channel is about programming -- for the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.
21:37:06 <elliott> We need more wisdom entries to spam newbies with.
21:37:16 <HackEgo> Kray: Finland is a European country. There are two people in Finland, and at least nine of them are in this channel. Corun drives the bus.
21:37:19 <HackEgo> Kray: Qiqj.uTp!1:42rz>G.isYy&.b.`..epgJ.*0"AA.$IlT.a@.jJoF.ۋL..cf.Քm!Yu!@9%4`p$6Kʋ.q)..R=tTm8N;.|\..,SORa!.v.3'.x.Ou>.Zl.'%JO6KE`ϔ..3(9}.j.3(+__֦.G]..%j]Db&.;Yb].!.|Ny2=VvcůakI.C].$h.>U.GHU?O\)[v+b?.G;#Lx C.`7cCѢ$ \ }'6E.ea|.
21:37:25 <ais523> elliott: it's possible they're here for talking about esolangs
21:37:27 <ais523> rather than messing with bots
21:37:37 <elliott> ais523: Well, then they're in the wrong place!
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21:57:41 <elliott> @dave4420 when u copy and paste from notepad++ it turns commas to semi. – Mike 9 hours ago
21:59:32 <elliott> By the way, my question appeared after reading this tutorial haskell.org/haskellwiki/IO_inside and this paper webcache.googleusercontent.com/…) – user1374768 8 hours ago
21:59:33 <elliott> An IO type defined as RealWorld->(a,RealWorld) is used here, so an action sequence is realized using the fake parameter RealWorld. But IMHO this model is impossible in pure language without outer compiler hacks. So I wonder why this implementation is used, hope that pdf has more clearly explanation. – user1374768 8 hours ago
21:59:43 <elliott> OK, http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/IO_inside should be deleted
22:00:09 <elliott> it's a whole page devoted to the State RealWorld "model"
22:00:42 <ais523> why don't you like that ""model""?
22:01:02 <elliott> ais523: because it's false, misleading, and not a model
22:01:10 <elliott> and many people believe it anyway
22:01:19 <elliott> (backed up by the fact that GHC *looks* like it uses it)
22:01:25 <ais523> there's actually a RealWorld type in GHC, isn't there?
22:01:30 <ais523> now I'm sort-of wondering what it represents
22:01:35 <elliott> it's State# RealWorld but it doesn't actually exist
22:01:48 <elliott> State# RealWorld -> (# a, State# RealWorld #)
22:01:52 <elliott> where (##) is an unboxed tuple
22:01:58 <elliott> but the thing is that that function arrow (->) is an *impure* function arrow
22:02:10 <elliott> and State# RealWorld is a 0-bit type, only used to keep the optimiser from reordering IO actions
22:02:18 <elliott> (because there's a data dependency on every previous result)
22:03:00 <ais523> I think I accept your explanation; it's sort-of State RealWorld except that it's not a Haskell State monad, but a State monad from some other language
22:03:10 <elliott> yes, but that's not even what the model is
22:03:21 <elliott> putStrLn :: String -> World -> ((), World)
22:03:33 <elliott> putStrLn s world = ((), modify_the_world_to_have_just_printed_s_on_your_screen world)
22:03:54 <ais523> it'd work for noninteractive IO
22:03:59 <ais523> but noninteractive IO is kind-of silly
22:04:00 <elliott> and, even if you accept that this works (it... doesn't), you can't do concurrency properly with it
22:04:07 <elliott> ais523: no, you extract the input from the world
22:04:23 <ais523> elliott: agreed, but I mean all-input-at-start-all-output-at-end IO
22:04:29 <Gregor> Why is the latest Freeman's Mind not available in HD yet >_<
22:04:34 <elliott> it "does" interactive IO too
22:04:38 <elliott> by "does" I mean doesn't do
22:04:39 <Gregor> I'm going nutty waiting for YouTube to fix the quality.
22:04:42 <elliott> anyway, it's not actually a model
22:04:48 <elliott> because it does not give any denotational semantics whatsoever or anything
22:06:12 <elliott> ais523: oh yeah, the biggest problem with the model
22:06:16 <elliott> is that it doesn't stop you duplicating World values
22:06:19 <elliott> or using past World values
22:06:27 <elliott> you need to enforce the linearity of Worlds (which is done in languages like Mercury)
22:06:32 <elliott> Haskell does not have linear types
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22:06:37 <ais523> elliott: that's what the monad is for, isn't it?
22:06:58 <elliott> hmm, this is the point where I realise I thought you understood but you didn't
22:07:01 <ais523> btw, nonlinearity is a monad too, there was a seminar on that on Tuesday
22:07:05 <ais523> elliott: I wasn't being serious
22:07:08 <elliott> obviously if you treat IO as an abstract black box it works
22:07:12 <ais523> sorry about that, I was trying to be a bit facetious
22:07:13 <elliott> the whole point is that we're trying to /explain/ IO
22:07:21 <elliott> which means we have to give it a model, which we aren't allowed to hide things about or restrict
22:07:39 <ais523> sorry, Poe's Law is bad enough without me trying to make it worse
22:14:46 <elliott> ais523: btw, I upgraded Esolang; you probably saw
22:15:42 <ais523> nah, I rarely read it in a web browser
22:15:55 <elliott> ais523: I posted on the community portal about it
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22:28:02 <elliott> "Hatfield is a city in Pipestone County, Minnesota, United States. The population was 54 at the 2010 census.[1]"
22:31:15 <kmc> yay you're back to arguing about how to explain Haskell IO
22:31:16 <kmc> i missed this
22:31:27 <elliott> kmc: There wasn't an argument!
22:31:39 <elliott> I quoted someone mislead by it because of a terrible page on the HaskellWiki and expressed sadness that the page exists.
22:31:52 <elliott> Then ais523 asked me what was wrong with State RealWorld because he didn't know.
22:33:22 <kmc> you should fix the haskellwiki
22:34:05 <elliott> kmc: I can't delete pages on it. :(
22:34:15 <kmc> you could replace it with the empty string
22:34:21 <elliott> I think it'd get reverted.
22:34:21 <kmc> or a link to a better explanation
22:34:51 <elliott> People tend to be overprotective about not deleting content on wikis, even if it's fundamentally wrong, and proven to mislead.
22:35:38 <kmc> so this will just remain shitty, forever
22:35:45 <elliott> Like http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Monad.
22:36:20 <kmc> the haskell community is too nice to ever figure out how to teach the language properly
22:36:57 * elliott would revert that page to its pre-"improvement" state (http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/index.php?title=Monad&oldid=33391) but expects that would get reverted too.
22:39:15 <zzo38> I do think they should delete things if they are entirely wrong, but I also think that pure wiki deletion should be used.
22:39:50 <zzo38> (Meaning the text that used to be on the page becomes not hidden)
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22:46:02 <elliott> coppro: voting for Murphy :P
22:46:14 <elliott> You and your quaint separation of powers.
22:47:41 <coppro> elliott: it's a rule, isn't it?
22:48:33 <elliott> We don't need rules like that.
22:48:48 * elliott thinks democracy has failed Agora.
22:48:57 <elliott> Bring on the Promotor-Assessors and voting golems.
22:50:28 <zzo38> Maybe I should add in the (>>=||) (>>=|||) (>>=|\/) (>>=\/) for if the function on right takes many parameters and the monad on left is the inside being a tuple with that many parts (I have to use "made up" roman numerals since you cannot use digits here)
22:50:49 <coppro> elliott: I suggest that the Bakor keep the Roll of golems
22:51:51 <tswett> I will assume that nothing important happened while I was away.
22:53:51 <kmc> probably Haskell needs some knowledgable person to not only provide a coherent explanation of everything, but directly attack the shitty explanations
22:54:23 <zzo38> kmc: The problem is that you would need different explanations for different purposes too
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22:56:26 <nortti_> it just feels so good to be here using a real client (even though that client is a piece of shit)
22:57:30 <nortti_> will try to get this SASL bullshit working on irssi
22:57:39 <zzo38> nortti_: Then use a different client if that one is no good
22:58:24 <nortti_> zzo38: this is the only one that supoorts sasl and doesn't want to spy on me on android
23:00:44 <zzo38> If you know how, you could modify any existing one with open-source to support SASL, I would guess
23:01:18 <nortti_> zzo38: I don't have android dev tools
23:01:55 <nortti_> and I don't think it would run on my computer
23:03:20 <nortti_> (This phone has better performace than my computer)
23:06:13 -!- jfischoff_ has joined.
23:08:00 <nortti_> And this client is at least better that webchat.freenode
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23:09:00 -!- jfischoff_ has changed nick to jfischoff.
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23:49:14 <nortti> I am writing a lisp interpreter on lambdastack
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23:54:34 <elliott> http://ompldr.org/vZG1rbg/stackoverflow.com-q-10029651.html
23:56:36 -!- augur has joined.
23:57:11 <elliott> Heh, Raymond Chen commented on it.
23:57:21 <elliott> (Click the "comments" links on the sides.)
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23:59:41 <jfischoff> I'm surprised there is a cloud suggestion but no GPU suggestion.