00:01:59 <kmc> `gccrun uint32_t h,l; asm("rdtsc" : "=d"(h), "=a"(l)); printf("%lu\n", ((unsigned long) h)<<32 + l);
00:02:11 <oerjan> ion: it's not a command in HackEgo's chroot at all, i think
00:02:13 <kmc> `gccrun uint32_t h,l; asm("rdtsc" : "=d"(h), "=a"(l)); printf("%lu\n", ((unsigned long) h)<<32 + l);
00:02:37 <ion> oerjan: Yeah, i inferred as much.
00:03:41 <oerjan> `interp c printf("Hello, world!\n"); /* Is this broken? */
00:03:58 <HackEgo> Does not compile. \ ./interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: fork: retry: Resource temporarily unavailable \ ./interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: fork: retry: Resource temporarily unavailable \ ./interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: fork: retry: Resource temporarily unavailable \ ./interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: fork: retry: Resource temporarily unavailable \ ./interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: for
00:04:40 <oerjan> Gregor: wtf is that error
00:05:09 <elliott> interp c calls interp c etc.
00:05:18 <kmc> elliott: so what should i do with my life
00:05:41 <elliott> kmc: how about find a way to give me lots of money
00:05:50 <elliott> and then execute that plan
00:06:00 <kmc> i'll get right on that
00:06:12 <elliott> i don't know what to do with my own life so this is about the best i can achieve under the circumstances
00:07:16 <Bike> have you considered cows
00:07:35 <elliott> kmc: you could rewrite other things as web apps
00:07:45 <elliott> http colon slash slash fing.er
00:08:13 <kmc> they call 'em fingers but i never see them fing
00:20:45 <Phantom_Hoover> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satoshi_Kanazawa#World_War_III
00:21:48 <HackEgo> -rwxr-xr-x 1 5000 0 183 Apr 13 23:55 bin/y
00:21:55 <HackEgo> Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet \ Jafet
00:22:24 <ion> @karma shachaf
00:22:28 <ion> `run y shachaf++
00:22:29 <HackEgo> shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ shachaf++ \ sh
00:22:31 <ion> @karma shachaf
00:22:40 <shachaf> ion...................................................................................................................................................................................................
00:23:12 <Bike> Phantom_Hoover: seriously read http://www.epjournal.net/filestore/kanazawa-statement.pdf to cleanse your pallette, most of the signatories have done pretty cool work
00:23:27 <kmc> wait was i gone
00:23:36 <Phantom_Hoover> "the guy is an idiot and wrong" is not really a revelation to me
00:23:38 <ion> hello, shichaf. hichaf.
00:23:47 <Bike> look up some of the signatories then
00:23:55 <Bike> anyone who isn't that guy really
00:24:13 <shachaf> wow i missed a lot of "kmc goodness" while i was away
00:25:44 <shachaf> kmc: I was at the American Society of Civil Engineers General Meeting at Berkeley where a couple of people were talking about their startup.
00:26:10 <Bike> a civil engineering startup?
00:26:13 <Bike> is that like... a town
00:26:26 <Bike> we need seed funding for this town we are going to build.
00:26:28 <Bike> very 19th century
00:26:29 <kmc> disrupt the bridge industry
00:26:32 <kmc> yeah seriously
00:26:43 <shachaf> I think it's a Mobile App for people doing construction of some kind.
00:26:47 <kmc> railroads were the 19th century startups
00:27:00 <Bike> that reminds me did you know the capitol of Burma was a fucking field before they started building in 2002
00:27:21 <kmc> but they all had names like The Shitsville and Aleghenny Railroad and not railroad.me or whatever
00:27:34 <kmc> but they were mostly investment bubbles and stock scams
00:27:40 <shachaf> <title>Railroad.me: The Leading Railroad Site on the Net</title>
00:27:46 <elliott> i should change my name to Ellio.tt
00:27:47 <kmc> which had a side effect of producing useful infrastructure that could then go into public ownership
00:27:53 <elliott> and then spend the $5000 and two yaks it costs to buy that
00:27:55 <Bike> i think the "getting land from the government" part is pretty interesting
00:28:14 <shachaf> elliott: Is that related to "the other tt".
00:28:24 <Bike> monopolizing trade in areas that don't exist until you monopolize trade in them
00:28:36 <elliott> it is related to trinidad & tobago
00:28:39 <kmc> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/ is an interesting online book about the early days of rapid transit in NYC
00:28:54 <kmc> if you want to hear about lots of stock market scams and oddly designed trains
00:29:19 <kmc> also cool old-timey photos
00:29:22 * Bike bookmarks for a rainy day, maybe
00:29:33 <Bike> not like i don't have forty fucking books bookmarked, but w/e
00:29:49 <elliott> Phantom_Hoover: haha wow that section
00:30:07 <elliott> "without a single American life lost"
00:30:19 <Bike> the important lives, as we know
00:30:22 <elliott> FINALLY someone happens upon the solution of "how about we just kill everyone else"
00:30:40 <Phantom_Hoover> because no true american would be in the middle east right
00:30:49 <Bike> it's seriously really disheartening to see people actually talk about vitrifying entire nations
00:30:53 <Phantom_Hoover> also it's not like there are any friendly states downwind of 'the middle east'
00:30:58 <Bike> like obviously they're stupid in addition to all around terrible, but gah
00:31:06 <shachaf> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig2-16.jpg LOOKS FAMILIAR !!
00:31:19 <kmc> yes i love that photo
00:31:22 <Bike> ...huh i've seen that image before too. is it a kmcism
00:31:23 <elliott> Phantom_Hoover: the middle east is officially defined as "the place terrorists come from"
00:31:34 <kmc> elliott: durka durka mohammad jihad
00:32:33 <Phantom_Hoover> elliott, so if you're in the middle east you're a terrorist?
00:32:44 <kmc> i'm sad i missed the era of elevated trains in manhattan
00:32:45 <elliott> Phantom_Hoover: why else would you be in the middle east...
00:32:50 <elliott> the exception is if you go there to kill people
00:33:22 <kmc> it's cool that they built the els out to what was then the middle of nowhere: http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig18-23.jpg
00:34:07 <Bike> sometimes i think it's funny that one of the major US allies in the region is a place where the leading religious authority thought the earth was flat through the 90s but then i remember that's actually pretty sad
00:34:21 <kmc> saudi arabia?
00:34:40 <Bike> Apparently one of the princes returning from orbit convinced him otherwise.
00:34:50 <shachaf> Bike[TYPOCLASS SUBSTITUTE]: http://www.ling.upenn.edu/~rclark/gorn.html
00:35:26 <lambdabot> SaulGorn says: A formalist is one who cannot understand a theory unless it is meaningless.
00:35:36 <kmc> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig21-13.jpg
00:36:07 <Bike> oh, and i saw some BBC article a while back that had a UK military guy say they "struggled to harmonize" saudi arabia's human rights abuses etc. with their selling weapons to them
00:37:23 <Bike> "Committee for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice " oh i'm reading about this again help
00:37:52 <kmc> at that salt mine outside kraków they had a bunch of centuries old horse powered machinery down in the mine
00:38:03 <Bike> the mine from the 14th century?
00:38:11 <kmc> "how do they get the horse back out?" "what do you mean, get him out? they put a horse in the mine and then he lives in a mine for the rest of his life and then dies"
00:38:22 <Bike> uh, well, wow.
00:38:28 <kmc> this one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wieliczka_Salt_Mine
00:38:34 <kmc> 13th century
00:38:45 <kmc> Phantom_Hoover: shove it down an unused bit of mine i think
00:39:05 <Bike> you could eat it
00:39:18 <kmc> the have a statue of Karol Wojtyła down there
00:39:21 <kmc> the pope as a pillar of salt.
00:39:25 <Phantom_Hoover> so if you realise you missed a bit of... minerals you had to run around in some tunnels full of dead horse? yuck
00:39:45 <Bike> salt, ph. it's a salt mine. it says "salt mine" right there
00:39:57 <kmc> uh salt is a kind of mineral *pushes up glasses*
00:40:10 <kmc> Wikipedia section: "Sister caves"
00:40:15 <Bike> kmc: it's weird to consider that JPII and Goethe could have been in the same room, for some reason
00:40:17 <kmc> my next band will be named Sister Caves
00:40:32 <Bike> whoa it's like a sister city relationship
00:40:36 <Bike> what the hell? awesome
00:40:55 <elliott> kmc: can i join sister caves
00:40:56 <kmc> 404 - Impossibile trovare il file o la directory.
00:41:01 <elliott> i just want to be able to say "i was in a band with kmc once"
00:41:11 <kmc> elliott: yeah
00:41:16 <Bike> Bassoon! Go for the bassoon.
00:41:21 <Bike> You'd be a perfect bassoonist.
00:41:29 <shachaf> http://bex.io/ <title>Bex.io || Own your own Bitcoin Exchange</title>
00:41:32 <kmc> trovare! like "treasure trove" in which "trove" is an adjective *pushes up glasses again*
00:41:50 <Jafet> `run echo 'char _start[] = "C\x8bL$\x08\x85\xc9u\x0b\x89\xe1f\xc7\x01y\x0a\xb2\x02\xeb\x0f\x89\xca\x8a\x02B\x84\xc0u\xf9\xc6B\xff\x0a)\xca1\xc0\xb0\x04\xcd\x80\xeb\xf8";' > y.c && gcc y.c -o bin/y -nostdlib -m32 && y 'amd64 sucks'
00:41:54 <Bike> elliott: just fyi electric <anything> is real and probably kinda cool.
00:41:55 <HackEgo> y.c:1:17: warning: hex escape sequence out of range \ y.c:1:17: warning: hex escape sequence out of range \ y.c:1:17: warning: hex escape sequence out of range \ bash: /hackenv/bin/y: cannot execute binary file
00:42:07 <kmc> shachaf: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15026825/php-mysql-how-to-prevent-two-requests-update is that where this code is from
00:42:30 <elliott> I have invented the world's first electric triangle. The project isn't totally complete yet, as I can't play full songs, but this is enough of a demo to prove that I did it.
00:42:32 <Bike> Can I exchange shares in market exchange strength records
00:42:35 <kmc> if($row['free']) { return true; } else { return false; }
00:42:43 <kmc> this code smells like roses
00:42:58 <kmc> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig21-9.jpg
00:43:19 <lambdabot> monochrom says: Time flies like an Arrow. Space leaks like a Monad.
00:43:21 <Bike> me on my way to steal yo girl
00:43:24 <lambdabot> monochrom says: Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana. Syntax rules like a macro.
00:43:28 <oerjan> <Bike> Apparently one of the princes returning from orbit convinced him otherwise. <-- this sounds like a method that could be used in more circumstances.
00:43:35 <kmc> you cannot steal that which is not owned
00:43:51 <kmc> yes let's send all the religious nutjobs to space and SPOILER ALERT leave them there
00:44:13 <Bike> is it time for another muslims in space discussion
00:44:23 <kmc> stross already did it
00:44:34 <Bike> the real world already did it
00:44:42 <Jafet> `run echo -ne '\x7fELF\x01\x01\x01\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\x02\0\x03\0\x01\0\0\0T\x80\x04\x084\0\0\0\x90\0\0\0\0\0\0\04\0 \0\x01\0(\0\x03\0\x02\0\x01\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\x80\x04\x08\0\x80\x04\x08\x7f\0\0\0\x7f\0\0\0\x05\0\0\0\0\x10\0\0C\x8bL$\x08\x85\xc9u\x0b\x89\xe1f\xc7\x01y\x0a\xb2\x02\xeb\x0f\x89\xca\x8a\x02B\x84\xc0u\xf9\xc6B\xff\x0a)\xca1\xc0\xb0\x04\xcd\x80\xeb\xf8' > bin/y && chmod +x bin/y
00:44:55 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /hackenv/bin/y: cannot execute binary file \ /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /hackenv/bin/y: Success
00:44:58 <elliott> muslim astronauts have problems praying i think
00:45:07 <oerjan> <Bike> salt, ph. it's a salt mine. it says "salt mine" right there <-- so you are saying the horse should be well preserved?
00:45:08 <shachaf> `run file bin/y; ls -l bin/y
00:45:10 <HackEgo> bin/y: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV), corrupted program header size, corrupted section header size \ -rwxr-xr-x 1 5000 0 126 Apr 14 00:44 bin/y
00:45:20 <kmc> imo bin/yhjulwwiefzojcbxybbruweejw
00:45:20 <shachaf> way to corrupt the program header, Jafet
00:45:21 <Bike> oerjan: yes exactly.
00:45:29 <shachaf> @yhjulwwiefzojcbxybbruweejw
00:46:19 <Bike> btw if someone says "saudi arabia" is ancient or tribal or something please punch them for me. thx
00:46:26 <shachaf> nooodl: REVEAL THE SECRET CHANNEL
00:46:26 <oerjan> <kmc> 404 - Impossibile trovare il file o la directory. <-- is that bad localization or do italians really call it "directory"?
00:46:32 <olsner> nooodl: yhjulwwiefzojcbxybbruweejw, hth
00:46:45 <elliott> kmc: that is a good diagram
00:46:53 <kmc> oerjan: i dunno, a lot of computing terms stay in english :(
00:47:08 <kmc> it's depriving the world of a lot of undoubtedly hilarious German compound words
00:47:16 <kmc> they just say Mobile-Telephone-Connectingcable or whatever
00:47:32 <shachaf> In languages with other alphabets it doesn't work unless you transliterate it.
00:47:44 -!- Mathnerd626 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
00:47:55 <kmc> whats the best alphabet
00:48:09 <Bike> Have you ever looked at it? You'll understand.
00:48:45 <shachaf> thai is "a l l l l l right"
00:48:53 <olsner> Bike: hmm, quite similar to voynichese
00:49:02 <nooodl> shachaf: bad news: theres no secret channel :(
00:49:12 <shachaf> nooodl: bad news YOURE LYING
00:49:34 <oerjan> <kmc> if($row['free']) { return true; } else { return false; } <-- i suppose you might want normalized booleans?
00:49:44 <kmc> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig9-10.jpg all of the el companies submitted engravings like this one and then some of them got sued when what they built was approximately 100x uglier
00:49:53 <kmc> oerjan: true. does !! work in PHP? it's a little weird anyway
00:49:54 <mnoqy> shachaf: ssshhh settle down
00:49:57 <kmc> it's a JS idiom though
00:50:12 <Jafet> `run echo -ne '\x7fELF\x01\x01\x01\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\x02\0\x03\0\x01\0\0\0T\x80\x04\x084\0\0\0\x90\0\0\0\0\0\0\x004\x00 \0\x01\0(\0\x03\0\x02\0\x01\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\x80\x04\x08\0\x80\x04\x08\x7f\0\0\0\x7f\0\0\0\x05\0\0\0\0\x10\0\0C\x8bL$\x08\x85\xc9u\x0b\x89\xe1f\xc7\x01y\x0a\xb2\x02\xeb\x0f\x89\xca\x8a\x02B\x84\xc0u\xf9\xc6B\xff\x0a)\xca1\xc0\xb0\x04\xcd\x80\xeb\xf8' > bin/y && chmod +x bin/y
00:50:27 <shachaf> mnoqy: i will never se'le downn until the secret channle is revealed
00:50:30 <Bike> olsner: i don't see it.
00:50:33 <HackEgo> 00000000 7f 45 4c 46 01 01 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 |.ELF............| \ 00000010 02 00 03 00 01 00 00 00 54 80 04 08 34 00 00 00 |........T...4...| \ 00000020 90 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 34 00 20 00 01 00 28 00 |........4. ...(.| \ 00000030 03 00 02 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 80 04 08 |................| \ 00000040 00 80 04 08 7f 0
00:50:48 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /hackenv/bin/y: cannot execute binary file \ /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /hackenv/bin/y: Success
00:51:07 <kmc> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig12-8.jpg i feel like this should be a Married to the Sea comic
00:51:14 <oerjan> <Bike> is it time for another muslims in space discussion <-- now i'm reminded of the great caliph in the valerian comic
00:51:17 -!- TeruFSX has quit (Quit: Leaving).
00:51:28 <shachaf> http://hdiff.luite.com/gloss/styrene/ HASKELL IN YOUR WEB BROWSER[*]
00:51:42 <kmc> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig6-2.jpg this man's grandson will grow up to be Transistor Man
00:52:08 <kmc> shachaf: so what is it
00:52:11 <kmc> haskell compiled to js?
00:52:22 <Bike> oerjan: valerian?
00:52:26 <shachaf> http://hdiff.luite.com/gloss/pong/
00:52:52 <kmc> http://hdiff.luite.com/gloss/styrene/out.js
00:53:09 <kmc> this could... use some minification
00:53:27 <shachaf> 17:53 <luite> ion: yeah this is the output from the first pass, without the optimizer
00:53:30 <shachaf> 17:53 <luite> which just uses the ghc-supplied unique names everywhere
00:53:39 <oerjan> <elliott> muslim astronauts have problems praying i think <-- i don't see why, they should be able to get perfect 3d direction to mecca which surely is even better?
00:53:51 <shachaf> (in response to (closing the parenthesis here so i can just paste):) 17:51 <ion> http://hdiff.luite.com/gloss/styrene/out.js could benefit from a bit of minification, just in case a client requests it without gzip compression. :-)
00:54:08 <HackEgo> 358f7740207e437860756331b4aa611e9ae230f4 bin/y
00:54:23 <ion> `shachaf1sum bin/y
00:54:24 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: shachaf1sum: not found
00:54:49 <kmc> i'll make my own National Institute of Standards and Technology! with blackjack! and hookers!
00:55:50 <kmc> '"As far as allegations of no hacking, I'm afraid that's just not true: We implemented the Rho and Pi steps of the brand new SHA3 standard algorithm "Keccak" inside the RAR archiver's internal virtual machine... It's worth noting that the materials used to consume laughing gas were actually already available at Noisebridge'
00:56:30 <Jafet> `fetch http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/38f6b5503e1b/bin/y
00:56:33 <HackEgo> 2013-04-14 00:56:32 URL:http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/38f6b5503e1b/bin/y [183/183] -> "y" [1]
00:56:43 <kmc> `run printf '#!/bin/bash\nsha1sum "$@" | tr a-z n-za-m' > bin/shachaf1sum && chmod +x bin/shachaf1sum
00:56:52 <kmc> `run echo '"hi"' | shachaf1sum
00:56:53 <HackEgo> 51091s1p8p2q0s7rq39s412p927p23rq41493328 -
00:56:56 <Jafet> `run chmod +x y && mov {bin/,}y && ./y hi
00:57:00 <HackEgo> bash: mov: command not found
00:57:05 <Jafet> `run chmod +x y && mv {bin/,}y && y hi
00:57:09 <HackEgo> bash: y: command not found
00:57:15 <kmc> `run ln -s /bin/mv bin/mov
00:57:25 <HackEgo> mov: missing destination file operand after `zig' \ Try `mov --help' for more information.
00:57:26 <ion> Btw, tr a-zA-Z n-za-mN-ZA-M
00:57:40 <kmc> that's much harder to prononuce
00:58:07 <ion> Also, UUObash
00:58:41 <Jafet> `run mv {bin/,}y && y hi
00:58:43 <HackEgo> mv: cannot stat `bin/y': No such file or directory
00:58:53 <Jafet> `run mv {,bin/}y && y hi
00:58:57 <HackEgo> bash: /hackenv/bin/y: cannot execute binary file
00:59:09 <Jafet> I should probably stop using at&t syntax
00:59:10 <oerjan> "Mongolian is written vertically. The Uyghur script and its descendants—Mongolian, Oirat Clear, Manchu, and Buryat—are the only vertical scripts written from left to right. This developed because the Uyghurs rotated their Sogdian-derived script, originally written right to left, 90 degrees counterclockwise to emulate Chinese writing, but without changing the relative orientation of the letters."
00:59:27 <Jafet> No wait, mv uses at&t syntax
00:59:46 <shachaf> That would be a good hash function.
00:59:57 <shachaf> http://assets.amuniversal.com/ec106b7c250a102d94d7001438c0f03b
01:00:00 <shachaf> http://assets.amuniversal.com/47a7a97c250c102d94d7001438c0f03b
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01:00:18 <copumpkin> kmc: oh I work with someone who you know vaguely
01:00:39 <Bike> oerjan: empires cause strange things
01:00:45 <oerjan> <kmc> [...] and then some of them got sued when what they built was approximately 100x uglier <-- :(
01:01:44 <Bike> oh, sorry, i misrepresented the mufti earlier
01:01:52 <kmc> copumpkin: who's that
01:02:00 <Bike> he didn't say the earth was flat, he took issue with a university saying it rotated and orbits the sun
01:02:11 <shachaf> kmc: twist, it's copumpkin
01:02:17 <kmc> also the elevated stations were just cool looking http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig16-27.jpg
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01:02:24 -!- Lymia has joined.
01:02:26 <kmc> the extant ones in the outer boroughs don't look like that
01:02:29 <kmc> (also the one in manhattan)
01:02:35 <kmc> they're all hella dilapidated
01:03:09 <Bike> man that's hella swanky though
01:03:16 <oerjan> <Bike> oerjan: valerian? <-- french space comic with lots of aliens and stuff
01:03:21 <kmc> i stayed in a tall hotel building in chicago and i could look down on the el loop and it was like my own miniature train set :3
01:03:27 <Bike> oh those crazy french comics
01:03:33 <kmc> preëmption and coöperation
01:03:56 <shachaf> do you expect me to coöperate?!
01:04:06 <Bike> "Treatise on the textual and rational proofs of the rotation of the sun and the motionlessness of the earth and the possibility of ascension to other planets" ha, ha
01:04:23 <Bike> i wonder if anyone's translated this, it could be fun to read
01:05:27 <Bike> oh he said it was ok to kill people who said the sun didn't move (nobody tell him about the galactic center0 that's less fun
01:05:37 <Bike> (you can't tell him he's dead now, pbuh)
01:06:07 <shachaf> Did she say the galactic center? Tell 'er I don't even know the galactic!
01:06:38 <kmc> shachaf...................................................................
01:07:31 <Bike> "Our exchange operates with hot data sets, completely in-memory.
01:07:32 <Bike> We have algorithms optimized for order execution speed and parallelization."
01:07:48 <kmc> bitcoinscale
01:07:59 <Bike> "our technology is secured by state of the art techniques such as OS-less deployment"
01:08:23 <shachaf> http://bex.io/images/feature01.png
01:08:28 <shachaf> that's the "security" picture
01:08:46 <Bike> psychic three-eyed soviet aliens to secure your bitcoins
01:09:04 <shachaf> "We are builders" http://bex.io/images/feature04.png
01:09:07 <elliott> Bike: i always read pbuh as like
01:09:18 <Jafet> They're probably more trustworthy than oracle bdb.
01:09:20 <elliott> like damn nobody thinks much of that mohammad guy
01:09:21 <kmc> shachaf: do the celebrate crayftsmanshipp
01:10:01 <Bike> elliott: me too >_>
01:10:22 <Phantom_Hoover> who the fuck even celebrated craftsmanship in the first place
01:10:49 <Bike> skilled labor unions
01:11:02 <kmc> copumpkin: no
01:11:26 <copumpkin> oh well he said he vaguely knew who you were, perhaps it wasn't mutual :)
01:11:33 <kmc> Phantom_Hoover: it entered my lexicon of things to mock via https://devcenter.heroku.com/articles/bonsai
01:11:39 <kmc> "Fast, elegant full-text search that celebrates your craftsmanship."
01:11:43 <kmc> also the word 'your' used to not be there
01:11:50 <kmc> copumpkin: hm, ok
01:11:53 <kmc> did he say how
01:11:58 <oerjan> <shachaf> Did she say the galactic center? Tell 'er I don't even know the galactic! <-- would you like to use your free non-swat now?
01:12:00 <kmc> i'm bad with names and people and stuff
01:12:08 <kmc> what years? what house(s)?
01:12:10 <shachaf> oerjan: I thought I already used it before.
01:12:25 <shachaf> Labor union? Is that like a bitcoin mining pool, but for pregnancies?
01:12:29 <copumpkin> kmc: not sure, sorry :/ I know it intersected your time there but probably not the same year, since he's a bit older
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01:13:05 <shachaf> copumpkin: uh you can't be older than kmc
01:13:13 <shachaf> kmc is literally the oldest person in the universe
01:13:36 <kmc> when 13 billion years you reach...
01:14:17 <copumpkin> …you start being able to pronounce miuaf?
01:14:30 <kmc> it's just the initials of my blog
01:14:31 <shachaf> I have no trouble pronouncing miuaf.
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01:14:33 <kmc> i'm bad at naming stuff
01:14:42 <Bike> wait so was kmc conceived at woodstock
01:14:44 <shachaf> Hey, I told you about that acronym.
01:14:59 <kmc> yesssssss Bike you are on top of my mythos
01:15:01 <shachaf> I mean I told kmc about it.
01:15:22 <Bike> kmc: please, call it a cosmogeny, it deserves it
01:15:35 <kmc> that's a five dollar word if I ever heard one
01:15:43 <HackEgo> http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.22362
01:15:53 <kmc> This article is about scientific theories of the origin of the universe. For mythical explanations, see Creation myth. For the Björk song, see Crystalline (song). For The Metal Machine Trio album, see The Creation of the Universe (album).
01:15:54 <elliott> miuaf is pronounced by meowing and then saying f
01:16:05 <Bike> kmc: that about sums it up
01:16:10 <kmc> itt Metal Machine Music
01:16:14 <shachaf> wow y'all're a bunch of ENGLISH SPEAKERS with no sense for PHONETICS
01:16:22 <Bike> metal machine music is the best shit ever
01:16:35 <shachaf> miuaf is pronounced: mi -- u -- af
01:16:39 <kmc> 'Metal Machine Music is generally considered to be either a joke, a grudging fulfillment of a contractual obligation, or an early example of noise music'
01:16:48 <Bike> kmc: have you actually listened to it it's fucking great
01:16:56 <Bike> it's literally just dumping feedback into a mic
01:16:59 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: logs: not found
01:17:11 <kmc> Helter Skelter 5 months ago
01:17:12 <kmc> still better than Nickelback
01:17:24 <Bike> i mean i listen to actual noise music and i still think it's ridiculous
01:18:27 <kmc> lou reed is a strange loop
01:19:35 <elliott> i should listen to metal machine music
01:20:09 <elliott> That same year, Reed announced his plans to re-release Metal Machine Music in remastered form.[3]
01:20:10 <kmc> apparently lou reed was going to play at coachella?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? but didn't
01:20:13 <kmc> same with The Rolling Stones
01:20:49 <Bike> if you listen to that you should also listen to zappa fyi
01:20:58 <elliott> Lou Reed never performed Metal Machine Music onstage until March, 2002, when he collaborated with an avant-garde classical ensemble at the MaerzMusik festival in Berlin, Germany. The 10-member group Zeitkratzer performed the original album with Reed in a new arrangement featuring classical string, wind, piano, and accordion.[11]
01:21:01 <shachaf> i've never heard of lou reed "am i a disnohor to this channel"
01:21:03 <Bike> have you ever seen a man play the bicycle
01:21:25 <shachaf> i always thought "the rolling stones" was a book by heinlein
01:21:54 <nooodl> Bike: can you explain noise music to me... i don't "get it"
01:22:16 <shachaf> nooodl: can you explain the secret channel to me. . . . . .
01:22:17 <Bike> nooodl: basically http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ztNOCjleqA
01:22:56 <pikhq_> nooodl: Well, you see, you maximize entropy.
01:23:05 <elliott> Bike: i think i can't be bothered with zappa as a sort of maximally lame protest against everyone else who knows anything in the universe liking zappa
01:23:20 <kmc> itt elliott takes a stand
01:23:34 <mnoqy> shachaf: shshhhh shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
01:23:35 <Bike> elliott: yeah i don't like listen to zappa regularly even
01:23:47 <Bike> i just like that one time when he was like 19 he appeared on TV in a suit and played musical bicycle
01:23:47 <kmc> http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/beach/fig2-6.jpg the two guys in the train are v. pissed that they had to take their hats off
01:24:07 <Bike> kmc: what the hell is that car.
01:24:08 <shachaf> elliott: i don't know zappa
01:24:19 <kmc> i think it's a 'pneumatic train'
01:24:23 <nooodl> it looks like it has a face on it
01:24:56 <Bike> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALfG9ftQorA also noise music
01:24:58 <elliott> i should probably listen to actual noise music
01:25:06 <Bike> spoiler there are probably "noise purists" who wouldn't like me for calling this noise
01:25:10 <elliott> instead of just things taht sort of toe the line sometimes
01:26:18 <Phantom_Hoover> all i know about zappa is that his daughter is called moon unit
01:26:44 <shachaf> to be frank, i know everything about zappa
01:26:53 * pikhq_ knows literally nothing about noise music.
01:27:07 <mnoqy> envious????? bet u wish u were called moon unit
01:27:19 <shachaf> mnoqy: am i called moon unit
01:27:33 <oerjan> `run echo 'I think you might mean !logs' >wisdom/log
01:27:36 <shachaf> from now on call me moon unit
01:28:03 <shachaf> `run echo 'I think you might mean !logs' | rainbow
01:28:05 <HackEgo> I think you might mean !logs
01:28:08 <shachaf> `run echo 'I think you might mean !logs' | rainbow > wisdom/logs
01:28:15 <elliott> Phantom_Hoover: come on moon unit is pretty much the best name imaginable
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01:30:31 <Bike> fasdf. RYOJI IKEDA
01:30:56 <Bike> LISTEN TO RYOJI IKEDA YOU ASDFUASDFBIU9E
01:32:01 <pikhq_> doushite ryoji ikeda kikanakute ha ikenai no
01:32:37 <Bike> sorry i don't speak jive
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01:38:57 <oerjan> @tell ThatOtherPerson <ThatOtherPerson> I've never really understood why Europe and Asia are considered to be separate continents <-- i think it's hysterical raisins. back when the ancients divided the known world into three parts russia was like barbarian wilderness, man
01:39:17 <Bike> continents are kind of silly anyway
01:39:32 <oerjan> just say no to plate tectonics
01:40:06 <oerjan> Bike: let's just use "islands of unusual size" instead.
01:40:30 <Fiora> plates need to stop drifting, they need to stay the course and stop flip flopping
01:40:55 <oerjan> Fiora: actually i haven't heard much about plates flip flopping. thank god.
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01:42:29 <Bike> continents are pretty good at staying on courses i think
01:42:54 <pikhq_> Such is the power of intertia.
01:43:02 <oerjan> i mean, not like flipping pancakes. although i'm sure it would be cool to watch.
01:43:34 <oerjan> australia, sunny side down
01:44:36 <Phantom_Hoover> i thought the urals represented some sort of reasonable tectonic boundary
01:45:30 <Bike> Phantom_Hoover: well so do the appalachians
01:45:41 * ion flips America
01:46:45 <Bike> Phantom_Hoover: http://geology.com/plate-tectonics.jpg welp.
01:47:03 <Bike> logically this means kamchatka is american now
01:47:43 <pikhq_> And Hawaii is a really small continent.
01:48:22 <Bike> hawaii just takes over the whole of oceania
01:49:04 <Bike> hm, i should find a map with all the boundaries. probably that's not really possible but hey
01:49:47 <oerjan> i didn't know most of the atlantic was considered part of the continental plates
01:50:11 <shachaf> is there a channel that's like all the other channels on freenode except good
01:50:20 <pikhq_> shachaf: Welcome to it!
01:50:23 <Bike> oerjan: Yeah, there's that whole gaping maw of the earth in the middle, you may recall.
01:50:34 <shachaf> pikhq_: Did you miss the bit where #esoteric is awful?
01:51:21 <oerjan> Bike: i sort of had got the idea that the mid-atlantic split had new oceanic plates on each side
01:51:47 <Bike> well you were close
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01:54:43 <HackEgo> #!/bin/sh \ topic=$(echo "$1" | tr A-Z a-z | sed "s/ *$//") \ topic1=$(echo "$topic" | sed "s/s$//") \ cd wisdom \ if [ \( "$topic" = "ngevd" \) -a \( -e ngevd \) ]; \ then cat /dev/urandom; \ elif [ -e "$topic" ]; \ then cat "$topic"; \ elif [ -e "$topic1" ]; \ then cat "$topic1"; \ else echo "$1? ¯\(°_o)/¯"; exit 1;
01:55:23 <HackEgo> ngevd is a fake wisdom entry. `? ngevd is special-cased in bin/?. leave this file alone Phantom_Hoover‼
01:55:24 <olsner> hmm, `? bothers giving an exit code? how polite
01:58:14 <HackEgo> Your evil overlord oerjan is a lazy expert in future computation. Also a lying Norwegian who hates Roald Dahl.
01:58:42 <Bike> what the hell is ‼.
01:59:15 <oerjan> `run sed -i 's/topic" =/topic1" =/' bin/'?'
01:59:26 <HackEgo> Ǐuݖ7. \ ԡ')or_2嘎Be#yNIq967~C$6/HiE5m\tGjfڅe)Anm}2K(4 \ ɓUttWz3ę+eJTmax/Ts|NX~#5~܅L~]w)B\>f$IfF||J=V/ϧ,J;.r9A">Ocҭp^PʾyUpk][vSN \ B.&L9Ȃ0.$wjcLaK(Nf8:
01:59:33 <shachaf> oerjan..............................................................
01:59:37 <shachaf> that was meant to be that way
01:59:58 <shachaf> oerjan more like makesthingsworsjan
02:00:06 <oerjan> well feel free to revert that.
02:00:57 <nooodl> ‼ is a haskell operator hth
02:01:18 <shachaf> ‼ is the cast-to-boolean operator hth
02:01:28 <olsner> what's "this elision thing"?
02:01:32 <pikhq_> Gotta love cast-to-bool.
02:01:58 <pikhq_> foo*=!!bar; fuck branches, man!
02:02:54 <kmc> itt we are programming GPUs in 2006
02:03:15 <nooodl> it's even better if you pretend *=!! is one operator
02:04:55 <ion> `run gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!*b; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:04:56 <HackEgo> bash: -c: line 0: syntax error near unexpected token `"%d\n",' \ bash: -c: line 0: `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!*b; printf ("%d\n", a);'
02:05:33 -!- constant has changed nick to variabl.
02:05:34 -!- variabl has changed nick to variable.
02:06:33 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!*b; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:06:36 <HackEgo> /tmp/gccrun.9uSs9JsT/command.c: In function ‘main’: \ /tmp/gccrun.9uSs9JsT/command.c:19: error: invalid type argument of ‘unary *’ (have ‘int’)
02:06:46 <nooodl> oh god. now i'm imagining the *...* circumfix operator
02:06:58 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!(*b); printf ("%d\n", a);
02:07:00 <HackEgo> /tmp/gccrun.FTGcl7lg/command.c: In function ‘main’: \ /tmp/gccrun.FTGcl7lg/command.c:19: error: invalid type argument of ‘unary *’ (have ‘int’)
02:07:02 <pikhq_> `gccrun int a = 42, *b=&a; a *=!!*b; printf("%d\n", a);
02:07:09 <oerjan> stop this, or y'all'll be translating lens to C
02:07:16 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!&b; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:07:24 <kmc> we stand today on the precipice
02:07:30 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!&++b; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:07:32 <HackEgo> /tmp/gccrun.h3E93cP2/command.c: In function ‘main’: \ /tmp/gccrun.h3E93cP2/command.c:19: error: lvalue required as unary ‘&’ operand
02:08:03 <pikhq_> And BTW, &b ain't an lvalue either.
02:08:09 <nooodl> `gccrun int *p; p=3; printf("%d\n", *p); *p*=3; printf("%d\n", *p);
02:08:12 <HackEgo> /tmp/gccrun.4GBYxEBW/command.c: In function ‘main’: \ /tmp/gccrun.4GBYxEBW/command.c:19: warning: assignment makes pointer from integer without a cast \ Segmentation fault
02:08:26 <nooodl> yeah i pretty much knew that would segfault
02:08:48 <nooodl> jeez i need to sleeeep
02:09:19 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!*&b; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:09:22 <olsner> `gccrun int *p = &p; printf("%d\n", *p); *p*=3; printf("%d\n", *p);
02:09:25 <HackEgo> /tmp/gccrun.7YcAFDgX/command.c: In function ‘main’: \ /tmp/gccrun.7YcAFDgX/command.c:19: warning: initialization from incompatible pointer type \ Segmentation fault
02:09:31 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!*&*&b; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:09:51 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!++*&*&b; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:10:00 <nooodl> maybe malloc a thingy and then do a thingy
02:10:51 <kmc> C life lessons
02:11:00 <ion> `gccrun int a = 42, b = 42; a*=!!++0[&*&b]; printf ("%d\n", a);
02:11:21 <kmc> `gccrun while(1){void*p=malloc(1);printf("%p ",p);}
02:11:24 <HackEgo> 0x601010 0x601030 0x601050 0x601070 0x601090 0x6010b0 0x6010d0 0x6010f0 0x601110 0x601130 0x601150 0x601170 0x601190 0x6011b0 0x6011d0 0x6011f0 0x601210 0x601230 0x601250 0x601270 0x601290 0x6012b0 0x6012d0 0x6012f0 0x601310 0x601330 0x601350 0x601370 0x601390 0x6013b0 0x6013d0 0x6013f0 0x601410 0x601430 0x601450 0x601470 0x601490 0x6014b0 0x6014d0
02:11:36 <nooodl> ah yes, the *=!!++0[&*&] operator
02:11:50 <kmc> itt i am a genius because i can write c codes that work the first time
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02:12:43 <zzo38> I think other people can, too
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02:12:45 <ion> `gccrun char *a = malloc(1); a[0x20] = 'z'; char *b = malloc(1); printf("%c\n", b);
02:13:04 <olsner> kmc: if you did that all the time you could probably make money out of it
02:13:05 <ion> `gccrun char *a = malloc(1); a[0x20] = 'z'; char *b = malloc(1); printf("%p %p %c\n", a, b, *b);
02:13:06 <pikhq_> `gccrun for(;;){void*p=malloc(1));puts(p);}
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02:13:08 <HackEgo> /tmp/gccrun.RTLXIOxG/command.c: In function ‘main’: \ /tmp/gccrun.RTLXIOxG/command.c:19: error: expected ‘,’ or ‘;’ before ‘)’ token
02:13:20 <pikhq_> `gccrun for(;;){void*p=malloc(1);puts(p);}
02:14:22 <ion> `gccrun ((char *)malloc(1))[0x20] = 'z'; char *b = malloc(1); printf("%p %c\n", b, *b);
02:16:04 <ion> `gccrun ((char *)malloc(1))[0x20] = 'z'; printf("%c\n", *(char *)malloc(1));
02:16:17 <kmc> also why did I even declare an intermeditae variable there?!?!?!?!? life is meaningless toil
02:16:37 <kmc> `gccrun while(1){printf("%p ",malloc(1));}
02:16:40 <HackEgo> 0x601010 0x601030 0x601050 0x601070 0x601090 0x6010b0 0x6010d0 0x6010f0 0x601110 0x601130 0x601150 0x601170 0x601190 0x6011b0 0x6011d0 0x6011f0 0x601210 0x601230 0x601250 0x601270 0x601290 0x6012b0 0x6012d0 0x6012f0 0x601310 0x601330 0x601350 0x601370 0x601390 0x6013b0 0x6013d0 0x6013f0 0x601410 0x601430 0x601450 0x601470 0x601490 0x6014b0 0x6014d0
02:16:42 <kmc> `gccrun while(1)printf("%p ",malloc(1));
02:16:44 <HackEgo> 0x601010 0x601030 0x601050 0x601070 0x601090 0x6010b0 0x6010d0 0x6010f0 0x601110 0x601130 0x601150 0x601170 0x601190 0x6011b0 0x6011d0 0x6011f0 0x601210 0x601230 0x601250 0x601270 0x601290 0x6012b0 0x6012d0 0x6012f0 0x601310 0x601330 0x601350 0x601370 0x601390 0x6013b0 0x6013d0 0x6013f0 0x601410 0x601430 0x601450 0x601470 0x601490 0x6014b0 0x6014d0
02:16:45 <kmc> hi variable!!
02:16:45 <olsner> `gccrun ((char *)malloc(1))[0x20] = 'z'; printf("%c\n", *(char *)malloc);
02:17:02 <kmc> is malloc(0) allowed to return the same address every time or no? inquiring minds want to know
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02:17:14 <kmc> (but can't be arsed to read ISO 9899)
02:17:49 <olsner> man malloc should give you a summary of the relevant standards?
02:17:51 <olsner> (but probably the union of 9899 and posix, so potentially the wrong answer anyway)
02:18:13 <ion> `gccrun ((char**)malloc(0))[0x20] = "hello world"; printf("%s\n", *(char**)malloc(0));
02:18:28 <kmc> > text "Segmentation fault"
02:18:30 <olsner> "If size is 0, then malloc() returns either NULL, or a unique pointer value that can later be successfully passed to free()."
02:18:31 <Bike> what did i walk into
02:18:32 <pikhq_> kmc: malloc(0) may either return a valid pointer or NULL.
02:18:35 <ion> `gccrun ((char**)malloc(1))[0x20] = "hello world"; printf("%s\n", *(char**)malloc(1));
02:18:40 <pikhq_> Well, "unique", not really "valid".
02:18:43 <olsner> I wonder which sense of "unique" they mean
02:19:03 <kmc> Muistialueen ylitys
02:19:19 <pikhq_> olsner: Does not compare equal to any other pointer.
02:19:28 <elliott> is it unique across all calls though
02:19:31 <elliott> or only across one given call
02:19:34 <kmc> Naruszenie ochrony pamięci
02:19:43 <variable> the space requested is zero, the behavior is implementation-defined: either a null pointer is returned, or the behavior is as if the size were some nonzero value, except that the returned pointer shall not be used to access an object.
02:19:47 <zzo38> As far as I am concerned, it would make sense that malloc(0) should be allowed to return 0 if free(0) is allowed, but it doesn't have to return 0; if free(0) is not allowed then malloc(0) is not allowed to be 0; this is what would make sense to me.
02:20:02 <variable> kmc: so yes, it may return the same value every time
02:20:04 <ion> Muistialueen ylitys seems to imply that the accessed memory was above allocated memory.
02:20:11 <Bike> wait what does free(0) have to do with anything
02:20:14 <pikhq_> If I'm reading the POSIX-speak right, it will not compare equal with any pointer returned by the allocator.
02:20:21 <kmc> itt we are polish segfaults
02:20:24 <elliott> variable: malloc(1) isn't allowed to return the same value every time!
02:20:28 <elliott> unless you freed in-between
02:20:29 <pikhq_> zzo38: free(NULL); is explicitly permitted.
02:20:37 <Bike> kmc: polish segfaults on the dance floor
02:20:38 <elliott> that quote seems to say to me that it may _not_
02:20:39 <kmc> oh man i could fry and eat a WHOLE KIELBASA right now
02:20:45 <elliott> "the behavior is as if the size were some nonzero value"
02:20:48 <pikhq_> variable: But only if that's NULL.
02:20:52 <shachaf> elliott: In which case it's still not really "the same value" in any observable way, is it?
02:20:54 <zzo38> pikhq_: Yes, I know that, but I mean hypothetically if it were not explicitly permitted.
02:21:03 <Bike> ok are there situations in which you'd want to malloc(0)
02:21:09 <elliott> shachaf: can you access the numeric value of a pointer after you free it? don't know
02:21:12 <variable> elliott: "or the behavior is as if the size were some nonzero value," I guess is your concern?
02:21:21 <elliott> I accept that if it is NULL it can return NULL every time
02:21:24 <kmc> related question: is sizeof(struct foo) guaranteed to be greater than zero
02:21:26 <shachaf> elliott: You can't even check if it's NULL.
02:21:39 <shachaf> If I remember correctly they don't agree on that.
02:21:41 <elliott> but if it's not, I believe it must be distinct every time, assuming you never free anything
02:21:42 <variable> elliott: I accept also that if it returns not NULL it must returm unique values
02:21:43 <kmc> related question: how much buggy code is there that happens to work on inputs "foo" and "bar"
02:21:44 <Bike> kmc: i' actually curious about empty structs >_>
02:21:51 <pikhq_> Bike: Generally if you're computing a size, it's slightly easier to *not* special case size 0.
02:21:55 <kmc> shachaf: yeah I'm pretty sure it's at least 1 in C++, but I don't know about C
02:22:00 <elliott> so what are the respective standards being quoted
02:22:05 <olsner> Bike: most commonly used when you consider it better to spend a day arguing about malloc(0) instead of adding an if in the right place
02:22:07 <kmc> ISO 9899 ain't nothin' to fuck wit'
02:22:15 <variable> elliott: N1570 Committee Draft — April 12, 2011 ISO/IEC 9899:201x
02:22:19 <zzo38> I think in GCC sizeof(struct foo) can be zero, but not in standard C.
02:22:23 <variable> elliott: I read this cover-cover over the summer :)
02:22:23 <Bike> olsner: quite common among programmers
02:22:39 <Bike> that sounds incredibly boring
02:22:57 <Bike> OK so speaking of that I need to talk about Darwin for a second.
02:23:25 <Bike> See his last book, it's about mold. Mold and earthworms. How earthworms produce mold and how mold influences natural history etc etc.
02:23:32 <Bike> needless to say it is a really goddamn boring book
02:23:45 <elliott> kmc: iirc the answer is yes re: sizeof
02:23:53 <Bike> but darwin was so popular that everybody bought it anyway
02:23:54 <kmc> which was yes
02:24:03 <Bike> so you had like thousands of victorian housewives reading about mold
02:24:15 <Bike> and sending letters to darwin about their own observations of mold in the garden
02:24:20 <elliott> did victorian housewives like, actually care about darwin
02:24:24 <elliott> it seems like a hard thing to care about really
02:24:26 <Bike> yes. it's baffling
02:24:43 <Bike> i've read this book, it's boring as shit. it has tables of which direction worms pull leaves into their burrows in
02:24:51 <variable> The contents are the same as the Standard C library header <stdlib.h>, with the following changes:
02:24:52 <Bike> it sold thousands of copies in its first week
02:25:31 <variable> and does not change anyting w.r.t. malloc(0)
02:26:56 <kmc> Bike: haha
02:27:09 <kmc> itt we are victorian housewives
02:29:06 -!- mnoqy has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
02:29:08 <Bike> relatedly it's really weird how britain has a bunch of roman shit laying around in it
02:29:35 <Bike> you have like four walls
02:29:41 <olsner> I have several walls, they are also pretty dull
02:30:55 <kmc> "walls worked for hadrian and ariel sharon"
02:31:25 <Bike> seriously it's like "hey here's this wall from four billion years ago. its foundations go twenty feet down"
02:31:34 <Bike> ("now let me investigate the impact of worms on this depth")
02:32:27 <elliott> i am thinking of the hadrian wall, prolly it would be less dull if half of it wasn't stolen because i guess people in the past were stricken by brick poverty
02:32:39 <kmc> scotland -_-
02:33:15 <elliott> i cannot imagine it stopping anyone really
02:33:18 <shachaf> What should I do with pollyanna@gmail.com?
02:33:23 <Bike> well thanks to the brick poverty no one could make a step to walk over it
02:33:25 <Bike> think this through.
02:33:39 -!- kmc has set topic: it's always better on holiday | am i rye? 'course i am! | Underhanded C Contest: http://underhanded.xcott.com/?page_id=5 | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/.
02:33:50 <kmc> elliott: horses
02:34:12 <olsner> I've seen horses jump on tv, they can probably jump in scotland too
02:34:21 <elliott> kmc: you could just like throw the horses over
02:34:48 <elliott> American author George R. R. Martin has acknowledged that Hadrian's Wall was the inspiration for The Wall in his bestselling series A Song of Ice and Fire.[19]
02:34:51 <kmc> olsner: those are pro horses
02:35:06 <Bike> so uh i thought the hadrian wall was in italy like the aurelian walls are
02:35:10 <kmc> what about roger waters
02:35:36 <olsner> but if I could choose, I'd probably invade the countries without walls first
02:36:05 <kmc> itt we start a land war in asia
02:36:19 <Bike> you know something weird about that
02:36:32 <Bike> two of the most successful conquerors in world history built everything on land wars in asia
02:36:40 <Bike> like... what's going on there. explain THAT, aphorism.
02:36:45 <kmc> khan and...?
02:36:56 <olsner> was that before or after the wall(s) in china?
02:37:16 <Bike> aka "khan two: kill harder"
02:37:25 <kmc> elliott: IAm the premier of China, AMA
02:37:33 <oerjan> <Bike> so uh i thought the hadrian wall was in italy like the aurelian walls are <-- the roman empire was fucking big hth
02:38:08 <oerjan> itt we are considering banning kmc for overusing itt
02:38:48 <shachaf> itt http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcbsk0O7MD1rqbdjwo1_500.jpg
02:38:56 <Bike> oh i guess there's also like the entire history of russia
02:38:57 <oerjan> but are afraid of the precedence set
02:39:04 <Bike> like, they didn't just start with siberia, people
02:39:10 <Gregor> `addquote <olsner> I've seen horses jump on tv, they can probably jump in scotland too
02:39:14 <HackEgo> 1027) <olsner> I've seen horses jump on tv, they can probably jump in scotland too
02:39:22 <shachaf> oerjan: what do you think "swatworthy??"
02:39:30 <olsner> Bike: what *did* they start with?
02:39:37 <kmc> Bike: how did i never know about Timur
02:39:41 <Bike> olsner: being lit on fire by mongols mostly
02:39:48 <Bike> kmc: you may have heard of "Tamerlane"
02:40:01 <Bike> but uh well he was turkish
02:40:08 <Bike> or uzbek i forget
02:40:12 <Bike> not exactly European is what i'm sayin'
02:40:28 <kmc> neither was ghengis khan......
02:40:37 <Bike> Yeah, but something Marco Polo.
02:40:44 <lambdabot> *** "avuncular" wn "WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006)"
02:40:44 <lambdabot> adj 1: resembling a uncle in kindness or indulgence
02:40:46 <oerjan> alexander also did pretty well in asia hth
02:40:48 <kmc> "Timur ordered that every soldier should return with at least two severed human heads to show him"
02:40:51 <kmc> classy move
02:41:13 <Bike> You should read about the French nearly teaming up with Timur against, I forget, probably the ottomans or some crap
02:41:38 <kmc> "they believe he was saving Christianity from the Turkish Empire in the Middle East"
02:41:45 <kmc> but he was a muslim................
02:41:52 <Bike> medieval europeans were
02:41:58 <Bike> kind of really fucking out of it, all around
02:42:37 <Bike> it's a place that actually forgot christianity existed in africa for god's sake
02:42:38 <oerjan> <shachaf> oerjan: what do you think "swatworthy??" <-- well, i don't want to encourage cousin' in the channel...
02:42:46 <Bike> maybe they were all just stoned out of their minds
02:43:16 <kmc> amanita muscaria
02:43:24 <Bike> "the shitty drug"
02:43:32 <Bike> that's right though all the good drugs were asian too
02:43:35 <Bike> man europe fucking sucked
02:43:40 <kmc> no potatoes
02:43:48 <kmc> or tomatoes or hot peppers
02:43:53 <shachaf> Bike: the good drugs were asian?
02:44:05 <Bike> opiates would be the obvious
02:44:12 <kmc> it's funny how all of the quintessentially 'old world' cuisine was impossible to make before 1500
02:44:15 <Bike> whatever coffee's made out of
02:44:54 <olsner> or where is coffee from again? I'm thinking south america
02:44:59 <kmc> more like قهوة
02:45:14 <shachaf> help my terminal is rendering that ltr! !!!!
02:45:32 <Bike> "Coffee cultivation first took place in southern Arabia;[4] the earliest credible evidence of coffee-drinking appears in the middle of the 15th century in the Sufi shrines of Yemen.[4]"
02:45:32 <kmc> shachaf: your terminal should check its privilege
02:45:36 <kmc> i think there's an ECMA-48 code for that
02:45:56 <Bike> 78: contemplate privileged status of terminals in the post-tty era
02:46:21 <shachaf> i set it to white-on-black does that affect anything
02:47:00 <kmc> the white man and the red hand
02:47:26 <kmc> 'Coffee became more widely accepted after it was deemed a Christian beverage by Pope Clement VIII in 1600'
02:47:30 <oerjan> kmc: at least europe had beer i think
02:47:31 <kmc> 'hey mr pope can we drink coffee'
02:47:33 <kmc> 'sure whatever'
02:47:49 <elliott> man imagine being that guy
02:47:52 <elliott> do you think he tasted coffee to check
02:47:59 <kmc> 'upon tasting it he instead declared that, "This devil's drink is so delicious...we should cheat the devil by baptizing it."'
02:48:03 <kmc> great logic
02:48:18 <elliott> that is better than any made up story i was about to tell
02:48:22 <kmc> 'The year often cited is 1600. It is not clear whether this is a true story, but it may have been found amusing at the time.[4]'
02:48:41 <elliott> i like how that works for basically every sin you want to do
02:48:42 <kmc> itt: all jokes have already been made hundreds of years ago
02:48:46 <Bike> kmc: you know about the pope and crossbows right
02:48:53 <Bike> well he banned them
02:48:56 <Bike> back in the 1200s
02:49:04 <shachaf> elliott: some sins are kind of unpleasant aren't they
02:49:09 <shachaf> help i don't really know what a sin is
02:49:09 <Bike> the man takin away mah guns
02:49:23 <Bike> it's easy to forget what a sin is in the middle of a channel
02:49:36 <Bike> kmc: ok do you know about the pope and geese
02:50:14 <Bike> ok well there's this kind of goose called a "barnacle goose" because back in the day they thought they spawned by falling off of grown barnacles
02:50:26 <oerjan> `addquote <elliott> that is better than any made up story i was about to tell
02:50:27 <kmc> i've heard of that
02:50:30 <HackEgo> 1028) <elliott> that is better than any made up story i was about to tell
02:50:31 <kmc> it makes approx. 0 sense
02:50:32 <Bike> and as the story goes the pope said these geese were okay to eat during lent
02:50:40 <Bike> because they weren't born of animal or w/e
02:50:51 <elliott> typed that as porn of barnacles at first
02:51:08 <Bike> Barnacles have the biggest penises relative to their body size of any animal.
02:51:17 <doesthiswork> (I mean they made the connection to geese because goose barnicles have necks)
02:52:02 <HackEgo> 550) <Phantom_Hoover> I mean, any organisation called the Scottish Defence League should be beating up English people, what other point would there be?
02:52:13 <HackEgo> 179) <elliott> quintopia: that's offensive, i was in a mirror accident and now my second half is a permanent mirror <elliott> typing is kind of difficult
02:52:14 <HackEgo> 530) <oklopol> king is something women are better at than men
02:52:14 <HackEgo> 534) <monqy> in the past few minutes I tried remembering what my dream last night was, but instead remembered I didn't sleep
02:52:14 <HackEgo> 276) <lament> elliott: well what i would do if i were omniscient and omnipotent would be to create an immortal woman with perfect tits and bang her for the rest of eternity
02:52:22 <Bike> elliott: I think 550 is what Hadrian's wall is for.
02:52:28 <Bike> who's lament. why is lament
02:52:32 <Bike> i lament lament
02:55:26 <kmc> dude not only do I have clean, drinkable water piped directly into my house, but it's so cheap that I can afford to fill up a big bowl with clean, drinkable water, take a shit in it, and then use more clean drinkable water to flush it away
02:56:00 <kmc> i am so insanely rich
02:56:10 <kmc> this is like lighting a cigar with a $100 bill
02:56:40 <shachaf> it becomes a bit less clean/drinkable between the two steps
02:56:46 <kmc> yes shachaf
02:56:49 <olsner> how do you light a cigar with clean drinkable water?
02:56:54 <Bike> shachaf has uncovered the joke
02:56:58 <kmc> olsner: something something hydrogen
02:57:34 <shachaf> In the US they don't even talk about conserving water, do they?
02:57:44 <kmc> they do in the west
02:57:48 <kmc> californee and such
02:58:55 <olsner> would you gain anything from setting up a second system of unpotable water for that kind of use?
02:59:04 <kmc> olsner: some buildings have that
02:59:07 <kmc> but it's not super common
02:59:15 <kmc> i think it's more something you do to show off how green you are
02:59:19 <kmc> rather than actually worthwhile
02:59:26 <kmc> Stata center at MIT has it
02:59:35 <kmc> "grey water"
02:59:37 <pikhq_> Or if you're in a region where potable water is actually relatively hard to come by.
02:59:52 <pikhq_> There's not much of that in the US.
03:00:04 <shachaf> there are so many stoners here that it's very easy to come by
03:00:20 <kmc> flush yr toilet w/ bongwater
03:00:22 <olsner> pikhq_: if you don't have potable water in the first place, no point in having two systems
03:00:33 <Jafet> `run echo -ne '\x7fELF\x02\x01\x01\0H\x8bt$\x10\xeb\x19\0\x02\0>\0\x01\0\0\0\x08\0\x01\0\0\0\0\08\0\0\0\0\0\0\0H\xff\xc7H\x85\xf6u<H\x89\xe6\xeb\x1b\08\0\x01\0\0\0\x05\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\x01\0\0\0\0\0f\xc7\x06y\x0a\xeb\x11\0\x86\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\x86\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\xb2\x02\xeb\x13H\x89\xf2\x8a\x0aH\xff\xc2\x84\xc9u\xf7\xc6B\xff\x0aH)\xf2H\x89\xf8\x0f\x05\xeb\xf9' > bin/y && chmod +x bin/y && file bin/y
03:00:37 <HackEgo> bin/y: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1, statically linked, corrupted section header size
03:00:44 <kmc> my next band will be named \x7FELF
03:00:45 <HackEgo> yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yyy \ yy
03:00:49 <ion> flush your bong with toiletwater
03:00:53 <elliott> kmc: can i join that one too
03:01:00 <pikhq_> olsner: "Hard to come by" meaning "there's actually point in the effort".
03:01:21 <shachaf> the Excessive Use of that Newfangled, Abominable, Heathenish Liquor called COFFEE ...has...Eunucht our Husbands, and Crippled our more kind Gallants, that they are become as Impotent, as Age.
03:01:23 <Jafet> `run y 'I get up, I get down'
03:01:25 <HackEgo> I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get up, I get down \ I get
03:02:28 <Jafet> Unuchen wird geunucht
03:02:48 <shachaf> `run echo f0VMRgIBAQBIi3QkEOsZAAIAPgABAAAACAABAAAAAAA4AAAAAAAAAEj/x0iF9nU8SInm6xsAOAABAAAABQAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABAAAAAABmxwZ5CusRAIYAAAAAAAAAhgAAAAAAAACyAusTSInyigpI/8KEyXX3xkL/Ckgp8kiJ+A8F6/k= | base64 -d | cmp - bin/y
03:02:58 <kmc> +5, Use of "eunuch" as a verb
03:02:59 <elliott> kmc: is ye-s the band after that
03:03:33 <shachaf> "would be a good name for a band" would be a good name for a band
03:03:37 <kmc> what do all these bins do
03:03:43 <shachaf> "would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation" would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation
03:04:02 <kmc> `addquote <shachaf> "would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation" would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation
03:04:06 <HackEgo> 1029) <shachaf> "would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation" would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation
03:04:33 <Bike> `run quote 1029; quote 1029
03:04:35 <HackEgo> 1029) <shachaf> "would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation" would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation \ 1029) <shachaf> "would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation" would be a good name for a band when preceded by its quotation
03:05:09 <ais523> kmc: if you can get a band to be popular enough
03:05:13 <HackEgo> wc: invalid option -- ' ' \ Try `wc --help' for more information.
03:05:36 <Jafet> ais523: won't work
03:05:42 <Jafet> Name it Main Page (disambiguation)
03:05:55 <ais523> Jafet: no, the idea would be to get Wikipedia to finally move the Main Page to Portal:Main
03:06:00 <ais523> I /almost/ convinced them to do that once
03:06:04 <ais523> basically, most of the main counterarguments are wrong
03:06:23 <ion> ITYM portal:main counterarguments
03:06:24 <ais523> quite a lot of people think it's technically impossible, even though it isn't
03:06:44 <ais523> I also tried to convince them to rename it to the null string, but apparently that /is/ technically impossible
03:07:22 <Jafet> Then, Valve announces Portal: Main
03:08:25 <ais523> Jafet: well the neat thing about that is that Wikipedia doesn't accept colons in names if they're preceded by a recognised namespace anyway
03:11:35 <zzo38> I think the space differs it though
03:11:36 <Jafet> Write a book named Talk
03:12:22 <zzo38> That seems is not a problem to write a book named Talk
03:12:25 <shachaf> "<something> (disambiguation)" would be a good name for a thing.
03:12:42 <shachaf> zzo38: what about, like, a book......... that was NAMED "book">...................................................................
03:12:43 <elliott> i think there is already a thing with (disambiguation) in the name
03:13:02 <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%98_(Disambiguation)
03:13:16 <zzo38> shachaf: Call the article "Book (book)" and then the article "Book" can link to "Book (disambiguation)" which then links to "Book (book)".
03:13:22 <shachaf> This article is about the Underoath album. For other uses of Ø, see Ø (disambiguation).
03:13:49 <elliott> now is the album named with (Disambiguation) or (disambiguation)
03:13:54 <zzo38> Well, but the capitalization is different.
03:14:12 <shachaf> Apparently it's a capital D. :-(
03:14:44 <elliott> name something Main Page (disambiguation)
03:14:48 <zzo38> If the lowercase is the correct spelling, the article should be named "O/ (disambiguation) (album)" or something like that (but use the proper slashed O; my client cannot send it)
03:14:49 <elliott> then you get to be at like
03:14:53 <elliott> Main Page (disambiguation) (book)
03:15:11 <shachaf> 20:05 <Jafet> Name it Main Page (disambiguation)
03:15:40 <HackEgo> elliott: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
03:15:48 <zzo38> Did they put "(Disambiguation)" in the name of the album because of Wikipedia?
03:17:01 <elliott> surely one of these citations must have the info
03:17:58 <zzo38> No, it has nothing to do with Wikipedia.
03:18:07 <zzo38> (The talk page mentions this)
03:18:40 <shachaf> imo name something {{Citation needed}}
03:19:34 <zzo38> Didn't xkcd do that?
03:19:54 <shachaf> yes, xkcd has also bested elliott
03:20:04 <shachaf> besting elliott is not difficult
03:20:26 <zzo38> No, I mean naming something {{Citation needed}}
03:20:30 <HackEgo> 465) <itidus20> well, you have bested me <zzo38> itidus20: Yes.
03:20:34 <elliott> sorry you don't get my refs, shachaf
03:20:45 <shachaf> elliott: well, you have bested me
03:21:08 <oerjan> <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%98_(Disambiguation) <-- heh when i click between the page and the disambiguation, IE doesn't add history either way...
03:21:26 <zzo38> Then IE is probably broken.
03:21:28 <kmc> ie...........
03:21:38 <shachaf> kmc: don't be browserist kmc
03:21:41 <kmc> itym ørjan
03:22:09 <elliott> i think ie is justb oring these days
03:22:42 <shachaf> elliott: btw i don't get your refs because "im 2 cool for this channel"
03:24:39 <shachaf> it shows like what, the it crowd?
03:24:55 <shachaf> i dont know alot of f f it shows. .
03:25:03 <oerjan> <zzo38> Then IE is probably broken. <-- yeah it messes up the history for all sorts of reasons
03:25:19 <oerjan> but this was unusually consistent
03:25:48 <shachaf> the joke is that everyone loves oerjan
03:25:55 <shachaf> except for people who used his free applicative
03:26:17 -!- TeruFSX has joined.
03:26:22 <shachaf> it turns out that this free applicative... has a higher total cost of ownership...
03:26:24 -!- TeruFSX has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
03:26:36 -!- TeruFSX has joined.
03:26:48 <oerjan> even _i_ haven't used my free applicative.
03:27:05 <shachaf> You wouldn't be able to stand the self-hate.
03:32:43 <kmc> We, alone on earth, can rebel against the tyranny of the selfish replicators.
03:32:52 <kmc> Pass it on.
03:36:19 <shachaf> ask not how kmc can help you, but how you can help kmc
03:37:13 <kmc> ….….….….….….….…
03:38:01 <Bike> GOMADWarrior: Stop that, please.
03:38:03 <kmc> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjecYugTbIQ
03:38:47 <Bike> In #lisp. It's dumb. Stop.
03:38:54 -!- doesthiswork has quit (Quit: Leaving.).
03:38:56 <shachaf> Bike: Oh, GOMADWarrior is doing "that" in #lisp?
03:39:05 <shachaf> They got banned from #haskell for doing something.
03:39:10 <kmc> "trolling"
03:39:15 <Bike> Yeah, that thing.
03:40:07 <Bike> It's a dumb question.
03:40:13 <Bike> and "show me the AI programs" is forty years out of date.
03:40:26 <shachaf> is GOMADWarrior really doing "that"
03:40:42 <kmc> would you always, maybe sometimes, make it easy, take your time?
03:40:59 <GOMADWarrior> I'm tired of hearing about that I wanna know the reason
03:41:19 <Bike> GOMADWarrior: If they say to use lisp because you want to do AI, they know shit-all about lisp or AI and you can ignore that advice.
03:41:22 <elliott> GOMADWarrior: you joined #haskell on the 2nd of this month to say
03:41:27 <shachaf> GOMADWarrior: i disrecommend you lisp
03:41:28 <elliott> <GOMADWarrior> Friendly reminder that no one in the enterprise uses a deprecated language like haskell.
03:41:31 <elliott> you can stop pretending you're not a troll now!
03:41:40 <Bike> What's even the point, man.
03:41:43 <Bike> It's just so boring.
03:41:47 <kmc> elliott: you would be a good lawyer
03:41:52 <kmc> or is that 'barrister' on your side of the 'pond'
03:41:57 <Bike> Programming languages. Who gives a fuck about which language you use.
03:41:57 <shachaf> oh boy elliott is a lawyer now?
03:42:02 <Bike> Why would you bother.
03:42:06 <kmc> programming languages are like assholes
03:42:20 <Bike> kmc: did i ever tell you about the man who taught his asshole to talk
03:42:52 <Bike> elliott: I like the idea that haskell is "deprecated" in favor of like, agda
03:43:10 <elliott> deprecated in favour of ruby, the hipper, newer language
03:43:23 <elliott> none of that stuffy 1990 academia
03:43:26 <Bike> looking for ruby ninjas with twelve years of haskell experience
03:43:27 <kmc> u know my plan to rebrand haskell
03:43:40 <elliott> haskelleton: like haskell but spookier
03:44:08 <kmc> it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a programming language discussion to produce useful insights
03:46:36 <kmc> in this thread we discuss linear feedback shift registers
03:46:51 <kmc> how are the maximal LFSR polynomials computed?
03:47:46 <kmc> proof by someone else did it
03:49:08 <shachaf> GOMADWarrior: Please don't.
03:49:48 <elliott> ps i think we may be being trolled
03:49:49 <GOMADWarrior> cuz im a noob wanting to learn my first language
03:49:53 <Bike> God dammit, are you a fucking teenager or something.
03:49:54 <elliott> by way of getting informed about this moronic trlling
03:49:59 <Bike> Just learn Python and go away.
03:50:00 <elliott> i am even participating by commenting on it!
03:50:01 <shachaf> Bike: Stop the ageism please. :-(
03:50:19 <Bike> shachaf: But, like, some of my best friends are teens. man.
03:50:27 <kmc> i'm with Bike (not re ageism tho)
03:50:28 <copumpkin> some of my best friends are assholes
03:51:16 <Bike> Ugh, I don't really know how to refer to the pattern of behavior I remember having as a high schooler and I've seen some adults have maybe without being an ass.
03:51:37 <kmc> 'undersocialized'
03:51:52 <kmc> itt we develop a modicum of respect for our fellow human beings
03:52:13 <shachaf> 20:50 <GOMADWarrior> anyone here?
03:52:24 <elliott> i am fairly sure i am the youngest person here right now and i don't really think it's necessarily problematic
03:52:25 <Bike> Nobody is here. We are all in your mind.
03:52:38 <elliott> like it's not "oh you're 13, you can't be very clever" or something ridiculous like that
03:52:39 <kmc> your mind is the scene of the crime
03:52:42 <Bike> elliott: "God dammit, are you fucking elliott or something"
03:52:53 <elliott> i can confirm that nobody is fucking me
03:53:03 <copumpkin> GOMADWarrior: no trolling of #scheme
03:53:37 <shachaf> elliott: It's 20:49 <Bike> God dammit, are you a fucking teenager or something.
03:53:43 <shachaf> That seems problematic to me.
03:54:24 <shachaf> Did you know I used to be 13. :-(
03:54:38 <elliott> i believe i am currently a teenager and you not in fact
03:55:18 <Bike> elliott: You should try fucking.
03:55:43 <kmc> fucking is p. cool
03:55:52 <elliott> shachaf: i already commented
03:55:59 <Bike> I mean, you don't have to if you don't want to, but it might be worth a shot.
03:56:26 <shachaf> elliott: Perhaps I'm more sensitive to ageism than you are by virtue of having been aged in that range for longer.
03:56:34 <elliott> that kind of behaviour and socialisation is something which is closely related to aging, i think any problem of ageism is more "X is Y years old, therefore"
03:57:28 * Bike sighs, tallies up another reason to think about what he says more
03:57:33 <kmc> yesterday i woke up sucking on a lemon
03:58:22 <kmc> age is tricky tho
03:58:23 <elliott> getting good points in the kmc game lately
03:59:00 <kmc> like, tech startups should be inclusive to women and racial minorities but it's really hard to see how they would not ever heavily skew torwards younger people
03:59:42 <Bike> Fran Allen should be convinced to start a startup staffed by (really) old school programmers.
04:00:00 <kmc> who's that
04:00:21 <Bike> first woman to win a turing prize
04:00:29 <elliott> like i think ageism is tangibly different to a lot of -isms
04:00:31 <Bike> for work on compilers in like the 50s or whatever
04:01:01 <elliott> since there is unambiguously a strong effect on behaviour and so on not inherently tied to cultural norms (though the form, pacing etc. of it can very well be)
04:01:55 <Bike> Well practically speaking. I think I probably shouldn't have said the thing. I should try to avoid dumb -> young since it's obviously linked to young -> dumb
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04:02:04 <shachaf> 21:01 <GOMADWarrior> someone recommended me scheme for AI
04:02:22 <elliott> oerjan: hi can you "stop it" so we don't have to hear about it from shachaf any more
04:02:29 <elliott> it = GOMADWarrior's presence in this channel
04:02:35 -!- copumpkin has joined.
04:06:01 <oerjan> it seems to me that you are asking me to ban someone here based on their behavior in another channel.
04:06:39 <GOMADWarrior> that doesn't make sense, it wouldn't stop him from using the other channel
04:06:41 <ais523> oerjan: well GOMADWarrior's behaviour here hasn't been particularly inspiring
04:06:47 <ais523> but it probably isn't banworthy yet
04:07:31 <HackEgo> slist: Taneb atriq Ngevd Fiora nortti Sgeo ThatOtherPerson alot
04:07:51 <elliott> ais523: this is not the first off-topic link he's linked in here.
04:08:03 <kmc> twilight of the mods
04:08:15 <ais523> elliott: have you linked more than two offtopic links in here? :)
04:08:20 <ais523> although I guess you do it less often
04:08:31 <elliott> ais523: hopefully i've said actually relevant things in here, and not just bragged about trolling other channels?
04:08:42 <ais523> don't worry, I'm not planning to ban you
04:08:47 <ais523> I'm just in the absurdist stage of tiredness
04:08:51 <elliott> there's also obvious lying
04:08:53 <elliott> like 04:49:49 <GOMADWarrior> cuz im a noob wanting to learn my first language
04:08:54 <shachaf> I've linked a few offtopic things in here.
04:08:59 <Sgeo> GOMADWarrior, it's like a BYOND game, except laggier!
04:09:06 <elliott> given that someone who doesn't know a language can, of course, not program a game in javascript
04:09:21 <ais523> elliott: well javascript hardly counts as a language :)
04:09:33 <Bike> kmc: frankly, i think discourse in #esoteric would be greatly improved if it was all sang in german
04:09:54 <ais523> GOMADWarrior: btw, are you planning to contribute usefully to the channel?
04:10:00 <shachaf> Bike: We'll surely avoid scurvy if we all eat an orange.
04:10:15 <ais523> GOMADWarrior: do you have some idea as to how?
04:10:23 <ais523> for instance, do you know what the channel's actually about? that's a start
04:10:25 <Bike> Sgeo: 21:07 < Sgeo> `slist ???
04:10:26 <kmc> Freude, schöner Götterfunken, Tochter aus Elysium, Wir betreten feuertrunken, Himmlische, dein Heiligtum!
04:10:42 <Bike> Yeah, OK, let's let this guy in for sure
04:10:42 <ais523> do you know how to esolang
04:11:05 <kmc> Mood: feuertrunken
04:11:24 <Sgeo> Bike, did you, like, even look at the update?
04:11:27 * ais523 hopes it isn't a BF derivative
04:11:42 <Bike> Sgeo: well yeah i was just curious what was The Deal
04:11:59 <oerjan> kmc: Von neunundneunzig Luftballons, auf ihrem Weg zum Horizont
04:12:05 <kmc> lift your skinny fists like antennas to heaven
04:12:25 <Bike> Oh, that'll be a nice change from the Battles I've been listening to for theh last thirty hours
04:13:12 <Fiora> kmc: http://bex.io/ I I I don't I don't know
04:13:26 <elliott> GOMADWarrior: please don't
04:13:35 <elliott> (i know what the language is)
04:14:17 <elliott> Fiora: i don't get it, is this a joke
04:14:35 <Bike> Fiora: the idea of stock exchanges being built and sold is kinda great tho
04:14:38 <Bike> elliott: is it goatse
04:14:49 <kmc> Fiora: stupid future
04:15:04 <kmc> 'our technology is secured by state of the art techniques such as OS-less deployment'
04:15:14 <ais523> you can check if it's goatse by visiting the page with images turned off
04:15:27 <shachaf> Wouldn't you need images turned on to check?
04:16:01 <oerjan> hm now there's an idea, a webpage that tells you if another webpage contains goatse
04:16:06 <Fiora> kmc: I think it's serious
04:16:21 <kmc> halp what's a "software craftsmanship enthusiast"
04:16:35 <Fiora> someone who has a high software crafting skill
04:16:47 <Fiora> Software level 57 and they can craft Mithril Software
04:17:00 <ais523> shachaf: normally you can tell by context
04:17:15 <ais523> people don't normally disguise their goatses as, say, legitimate discussions of programming
04:17:17 <shachaf> ais523: I wouldn't know. I've always avoided it so far.
04:17:17 <ais523> just with added goatse
04:17:24 <ais523> shachaf: I've seen like the top 20 pixels of it
04:17:32 <ais523> because someone managed to get me to follow a link to it but the connection was really bad
04:17:34 <Bike> geez, it's just an ass
04:17:40 <ais523> and I realised it was goatse and closed the page before it loaded
04:17:43 <kmc> body { background-image: url(/goatse.jpg); }
04:17:45 <Bike> well there's also a penis
04:17:52 <Bike> some other limbs and stuff
04:17:54 <zzo38> oerjan: I don't know if a *webpage* having such things would be useful, but a JSON or XML service might, possibly.......
04:18:10 <kmc> it's an ass being operated outside the Absolute Maximum specifications
04:18:22 <ais523> zzo38: a webpage has the advantage that it's reasonably easy to view with typically available clients
04:18:40 <Fiora> (I'm sorry, I really have no idea <.<)
04:19:11 <zzo38> ais523: JSON and XML are also plain text though
04:19:29 <ais523> although XML is frequently unreadable despite being plaintext
04:19:38 <ais523> I've been staring at a lot of those sorts of data representations recently
04:19:49 <ais523> typically I need to use a viewer/editor with a search function to read the JSON
04:19:49 <shachaf> What makes something plain text?
04:20:07 <Bike> It works in that one plain text scheduling program
04:20:10 <kmc> being written in english
04:20:18 <GOMADWarrior> Magic, created by User:GOMADWarrior in 2013, is a language where you summon spirits, which are objects with a list of instructions, to do your bidding, with spells which are the recipes of the spirits.
04:21:05 <Bike> «The worst story I've heard about this is someone who got a job at a top 5 place on a really strong solo-authored paper which quickly got an R&R at Econometrica. In the next 6 years he revised 3 times only to have it be ultimately rejected the September of his tenure year and then he didn't get tenure»
04:21:08 <zzo38> I suppose it can be, but Mozilla will format XML files for viewing, and JavaScripts on webpages could be used to format the JSON or XML data into other formats too (XSLT can also be used).
04:33:42 <kmc> i am jack's smirking revenge
04:39:07 <shachaf> For some reason people think references to things make things better.
04:39:36 <kmc> add a layer of indirection
04:39:40 <elliott> what kind of keegan is he anyway
04:40:10 <Bike> shachaf: Do you mean references like Monty Python jokes?
04:40:33 <Bike> it's an in-group marker
04:40:37 <shachaf> People think things have merit *just* by virtue of being a reference to a thing they like.
04:40:41 <ion> C only has pointers like Monty Python jokes.
04:40:57 <Bike> it is pretty awful but it's a natural part of society
04:41:10 <shachaf> yes but what if we made it illegal
04:41:22 <Bike> Mad Max would be real.
04:41:26 <Fiora> void make(Joke &montyPython)
04:42:01 <Bike> But seriously, if it makes you feel better you can think of it in exaggerated sociology terms.
04:42:15 <shachaf> Do you see it more in more awful communities?
04:42:23 <Bike> It's saying "I have experienced similar media (or whatever) as you, we have some similarities, you should like me"
04:42:24 <kmc> what if i find that pop culture references are the best way to express my feelings? and whose fault is that?
04:42:46 <shachaf> what if i find that i don't have feelings?
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04:44:03 <Bike> Fiora: "Thanks, ants."
04:44:04 <elliott> it's like thanks fiora but with fewer letters
04:44:06 <elliott> have you watched Look Around You
04:44:07 <kmc> http://www.thanksants.com/Fiora
04:44:24 <Bike> If you haven't watched Look Around You you should watch Look Around You.
04:45:02 <Bike> Fiora: It's a British science television programme.
04:45:18 <Bike> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2k9JwGpm1w
04:45:49 <Bike> Seriously, watch it, it's fantastic.
04:46:30 <shachaf> Fiora: You haven't watched Look Around You?
04:46:34 <shachaf> Fiora: You should watch it.
04:46:54 <Sgeo> I concur with the Look Around You recommendation.
04:47:00 <Bike> oh man i totally forgot about the soccer ball gag
04:47:12 <Sgeo> the Calcium one isn't the one with Thanks Ants though
04:47:25 <oerjan> i haven't watched Look Around You, and probably won't in a while, but i concur nevertheless.
04:47:34 <ion> fiora: Yeah, go and watch Look Around You. Do it now.
04:47:46 <Bike> Sgeo: it has the helvetica scenario though.
04:47:53 <Sgeo> Well, go watch season 1, at least. I don't know much about season 2.
04:47:53 <oerjan> ok i may have seen a little bit
04:48:10 <Sgeo> I've only seen one ep of season 2
04:48:40 <elliott> you've got your psilence and your "thanks, tchaikovsky"
04:48:43 <coppro> my sound in chrome is all scratchy and stuff
04:48:51 <Bike> oh is the tchaikovsky biti from season 2
04:48:59 <Bike> !! and the mouse song
04:49:05 <elliott> no that's season 1 i think
04:49:10 <Bike> i got the mp3 of that
04:49:10 <elliott> he returns in season 2 tho
04:49:12 <elliott> Bike: i hope you've seen machadynu
04:49:15 <kmc> if i could just leave my body for a night...
04:49:24 <Bike> i saw the whole music episode, anyway.
04:49:27 <elliott> the rap one whose name i forget. sexual interface.
04:49:29 <Bike> I think on Adult Swim.
04:49:34 <elliott> that was probably the best one of the second series i think
04:49:52 <Fiora> ;-; but do I have to
04:50:10 <Sgeo> That's the episode I've seen (Music 2000)
04:50:14 <elliott> Fiora: do you want to learn about calcium, maths, water, germs, ghosts, sulphur, music, iron and brain
04:51:39 <elliott> it's good! you don't have to watch it if you don't want to and wish to stay in the dark pit of unknowing eternally
04:51:44 <Bike> Fiora: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2k9JwGpm1w&t=5m40s this should give you the idea.
04:53:40 <Bike> keep watching to learn how calcium is produced
04:54:58 <Fiora> "because calcium perspires"
04:55:07 <Fiora> this is like. dada science education
04:55:36 <Bike> remember to study for your o-levels
04:55:59 <Fiora> "to prevent the possibility of helvetica"
04:57:12 -!- kmc has set topic: everyone's caught on to everything you do | am i rye? 'course i am! | Underhanded C Contest: http://underhanded.xcott.com/?page_id=5 | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/.
04:59:46 <oerjan> kmc: oh dear, that means i have to kill you
05:00:07 <Fiora> this entire show is just an absolute whaaaatttttttttt XD
05:00:28 <elliott> how 'bout remove the second section
05:01:33 <shachaf> Fiora: you have to heat it to a temperature of 20,000 BC first
05:01:49 <Fiora> I I j ust asdlkfslaals
05:03:18 <Bike> you understand the recommendations, i hope
05:03:42 <shachaf> Fiora: btw elliott was kidding, you have to watch all of look around you
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05:04:15 <Fiora> I'm not sure I can stay sane with this
05:04:59 <HackEgo> "But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked. "Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad." "How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice. "You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."
05:07:07 <shachaf> `run sed -i "s/You're/u/" wisdom/mad
05:07:15 <ais523> oerjan: incidentally, there's a quote from the Alice books at the start of every chapter of the old C-INTERCAL manual
05:07:19 <ais523> they do tend to generally fit
05:07:24 <kmc> GOMADWarrior: we, alone on earth, can rebel against the tyranny of the selfish replicators
05:08:18 * Sgeo has actually read that book a while ago
05:08:33 <kmc> Sgeo: good
05:08:42 <oerjan> selfish replicators r us
05:10:35 <GOMADWarrior> I'm thinking of making it an abstraction level higher
05:10:48 <HackEgo> Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`<command>", or "`run <command>" for full shell commands. "`fetch <URL>" downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert <rev>" can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/
05:11:18 <HackEgo> <elliott> that is better than any made up story i was about to tell
05:11:58 * oerjan swats both shachaf and elliott -----###
05:13:08 <GOMADWarrior> I'll make Magic the reference language for AI development
05:13:46 <pikhq_> That seems remarkably cruel.
05:16:18 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Good night).
05:16:32 <ais523> GOMADWarrior: fwiw, most of my AI programming has been in Perl
05:16:45 <ais523> something similar to but not exactly the same as Prolog would be useful, though
05:18:00 <Bike> GOMADWarrior: Stop, please. This is sad.
05:18:15 <kmc> all you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be.......................................
05:18:54 <shachaf> Look out for the release of the new albumen.
05:19:05 <elliott> you're meant to say it's out now
05:19:19 <shachaf> elliott: No, you're meant to say that.
05:19:32 <ais523> GOMADWarrior: there already is a programming MMO, it's called StackOverflow
05:19:59 <kmc> U+13FA75 UPRIGHT PRISM SPREADING RIGHTWARDS
05:20:03 <pikhq_> GOMADWarrior: But if you feed them enough they asplode!
05:20:18 <ais523> pikhq_: well StackOverflow seems to be based around using MMO principles to encourage people to make good FAQs
05:20:20 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:9: numeric escape sequence out of range at character '5'
05:20:33 <kmc> itym bad faqs
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05:20:36 <ais523> github's more the facebook of programming, than the world of warcraft of programming
05:20:37 <shachaf> kmc: your unicode character is out of range of unicode characters
05:20:44 <kmc> shachaf: fuck tha police
05:20:46 <ais523> kmc: just because it's encouraging people to do that doesn't mean it works
05:21:27 <shachaf> Uh oh, time to clear some disk space in /home
05:21:42 <kmc> i go forwards, you go backwards, and somewhere we will meet
05:21:57 <kmc> shachaf has a separate partition for /home
05:22:01 <kmc> 1985 style
05:22:03 <elliott> kmc: i'm imagining you listening to the stupidest medley mashup ever
05:22:33 <shachaf> /dev/sda5 448G 415G 12G 98% /home
05:23:42 <ais523> shachaf: use df or a GUI alternative to figure out what's taking up the most space
05:23:52 <ais523> especially things that can easily be redownloaded, like tarballs, can normally be deleted safely
05:24:08 <ais523> I keep getting those two muddled
05:24:13 <pikhq_> No, ais523 uses a partition for each file.
05:24:25 <ais523> or if you have multiple unpacked gcc distributions
05:24:29 <ais523> you can normally do without them
05:25:09 <shachaf> I have ghc-7.4.1, 7.6.1, 7.6.2
05:25:15 <pikhq_> And then you lose your c->bf compiler.
05:25:22 <shachaf> Also several old ~/.cabal/*
05:25:29 <ais523> pikhq_: nah, I keep one as-working-as-it's-got-so-far copy of that around
05:25:35 <ais523> sometimes only in compressed form though
05:25:38 <ais523> two was overkill, though
05:25:52 <kmc> use fsv!!!!!!!!!!!!!
05:25:54 <ais523> also, yeah, you have a 448G disk
05:25:58 <pikhq_> ais523: I assume you've not made any progress on that in forever?
05:26:09 <pikhq_> 448G? I'm at a terabyte and out of space.
05:26:20 <ais523> /dev/sda5 75316544 65730596 5760072 92% /
05:26:28 <pikhq_> Course, I've got like 100G of *music*, so. :P
05:26:33 <ais523> although I'm cheating slightly, that's only half the physical disk
05:26:44 <ais523> the other half, a different partition, I use for storing really large things
05:26:55 <shachaf> Hey, look at this, 20G of strace logs
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05:27:09 <ais523> why do you have 20G of strace logs?
05:27:12 <ais523> I tend to save those in /tmp
05:27:18 <ais523> because it's rare I'll want to look at them again
05:27:22 <shachaf> Because I was trying to track something down.
05:27:38 <shachaf> It was hard to reproduce and I wanted to be able to look at the logs again.
05:27:49 <shachaf> I still haven't tracked it down...
05:27:52 <shachaf> I'll keep the logs for now.
05:29:41 * kmc has about 3900 GB of music, but only 17 GB on this laptop
05:30:23 <shachaf> I should get an external hard drive.
05:30:28 <shachaf> And, uh, do backups or somethin'.
05:31:50 <pikhq_> kmc: I think you added a zero.
05:32:09 <pikhq_> Or keep all your music in 32-bit 88.1 kHz WAVs.
05:32:23 <kmc> 3.8T media/pub/music/
05:32:40 <kmc> there are... probably some duplicates
05:32:44 <pikhq_> I doubt I've heard *of* that much music.
05:32:53 <Fiora> like wow even the touhou lossless collection is like 1.2tb and that's only if you get the lossless variant and it's like 3 months
05:33:24 <shachaf> kmc: that's a lot of lyrics to quote into the channel
05:33:34 <coppro> I have a wonderful 1TB hard drive in this machine
05:33:45 <pikhq_> That better be at least FLAC...
05:33:45 <coppro> (which is lots for a laptop)
05:33:51 <kmc> pikhq_: it's a mix
05:34:06 <kmc> some flac, some not flac
05:34:15 <pikhq_> Have you heard all of it?
05:34:32 <kmc> probably less than 1%
05:34:41 <pikhq_> Do you just... download music compulsively?
05:34:55 <kmc> i copied a few big servers full of music
05:39:30 <lambdabot> Well me 'earties, let's see what crawled out of the bung hole...
05:39:33 <Fiora> I wonder what the least compressed practical music format could be
05:39:41 <ais523> kmc: you do realise that that amount of piracy is enough to actually destroy the world's economy?
05:39:50 <ais523> like, the value of that music is actually larger than the amount of money in the entire world
05:39:52 <Fiora> he's caused trillions of dollars worth of damage!1!
05:39:57 <kmc> hahahahahaha
05:40:00 <kmc> yesssssssss
05:40:15 <pikhq_> Why that figure, you ask?
05:40:21 <Fiora> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_Stream_Digital ?
05:40:22 <kmc> only one sub channel?!?!?
05:40:25 <pikhq_> That's enough to represent NTSC with PCM.
05:40:25 <kmc> are we animals?!?!?
05:40:34 <Fiora> pikhq_: ....... xD
05:41:03 <pikhq_> The mere idea of PCM NTSC is really silly. But hey, you could do it.
05:41:38 <ais523> "fed up of people treating audio as a mere side-channel on video, pikhq decided to make a point by doing the opposite"
05:41:58 <shachaf> OK, what's the easiest way to do du -s * | sort -n including hidden files?
05:42:04 <pikhq_> ais523: PCM doesn't realy refer to audio, it just refers to a way of encoding a wave form.
05:42:19 <pikhq_> In principle you could represent most any analog signal using it...
05:42:22 <ais523> but decided to say the quote anyway because it was funny
05:42:28 <Fiora> pikhq_: you can compress audio with video too, right?
05:42:33 <Fiora> I remember seeing a thing about that, and why it was such a bad idea
05:42:42 <ais523> well it's not actually a quote, obviously
05:42:58 <pikhq_> Fiora: What, you mean compress audio with h.264 or something?
05:43:16 <pikhq_> I guess you could do that but it'd be hilariously awful.
05:43:20 <Fiora> just like, compress audio as video? I remember seeing a post on it and how bad it was
05:43:42 <kmc> do you remember, there was some PC hardware for doing backups to VHS tape
05:43:59 <kmc> it could store several GB on one tape, which at the time was just an insane amount of storage
05:44:09 <pikhq_> No, but I do remember that one used to store digital audio on VHS tape.
05:44:19 <pikhq_> And this is actually where 44.1 kHz comes from.
05:46:00 <pikhq_> Basically, then the only practical medium was video tape. And 44.1 kHz came because, in PAL, there were: 294 lines/field, 50 fields/second, and 3 samples/line.
05:47:12 <kmc> interesting
05:47:34 <pikhq_> Though I think that equipment was using 14 bit samples instead.
05:48:04 <kmc> that's a lot of bits
05:48:22 <pikhq_> Yeah, that gets you fairly acceptable dynamic range.
05:48:38 <pikhq_> CD's better sure, but with dither 14 bits is quite good.
05:50:31 <Fiora> that's... really amazing
05:50:45 <Fiora> so 44100 was just because digital audio started when storing audio on PAL VHS tapes?
05:51:24 <pikhq_> You would've gotten the same figure on NTSC as well, except that color slowed the signal down.
05:51:29 <kmc> that's awesome
05:51:51 <pikhq_> The sampling rate from NTSC is 44056 Hz. Which is 44100/1.001
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05:58:05 <ion> pikhq: Interesting, i didn’t know about the origin of 44100 Hz.
05:58:50 <pikhq_> It also happens to be large enough for all sounds that humans can hear, so I guess nobody's figured it needs changing. :)
05:59:23 <ion> Well, most humans. True audiophiles can tell 384 kHz sounds better.
05:59:58 <pikhq_> But only with iridium cables.
06:01:08 <ion> $4495 / 8 m. http://www.audioquest.com/ethernet/diamond
06:02:20 <pikhq_> Makes the bits so much rounder.
06:07:00 <coppro> see, I might buy that amount of cable engineering *for analog audio*
06:07:28 <pikhq_> It's probably ridiculous even then. But at least improving the cable there can *do something*.
06:07:52 <coppro> I'm reminded of this thing that exists
06:08:34 <pikhq_> Even lower level than that.
06:08:43 <pikhq_> Ethernet frames are checksummed as well. :)
06:08:53 <pikhq_> A packet either gets there or it doesn't.
06:08:54 <kmc> itt UDP-Lite
06:09:24 <shachaf> GoogleWifi corrupts packets. :-(
06:09:39 <coppro> way to complain about free internet
06:09:57 <ion> shachaf: They should have used AudioQuest cables.
06:10:34 <pikhq_> Probably also a tank of AudioQuest air.
06:10:56 <coppro> and made sure that they used a Monster power bar to filter out distortion from the power lines
06:11:02 <pikhq_> Electrically neutral oxygen molecules make the signal have much less interference.
06:13:26 <kmc> #epaworldproblems
06:13:49 <shachaf> There's no GooglewiFi in EPA
06:20:24 <shachaf> /dev/sda5 448G 370G 57G 87% /home
06:21:01 <shachaf> ais523: Oh, wait, that's me with the 448G.
06:21:32 <shachaf> ais523: I have a bunch of DVDs ripped to directories. That's probably the biggest thing.
06:21:33 <kmc> xn--rjan-kn7o
06:21:53 <shachaf> Or maybe lossless music, though not kmcesque amounts.
06:24:42 <zzo38> I wonder how difficult it might be to compile MechaniQue programs into Z-machine?
06:32:33 <fizzie> /dev/mapper/vg_raid-home 798G 611G 187G 77% /home
06:32:44 <fizzie> (Why are we peeking at other people's /homes?)
06:35:59 <shachaf> fizzie: uh the game was "peeking at shachaf's /home"
06:36:06 <shachaf> are you shachaf(idon't think so!!)!
06:36:34 <fizzie> I didn't see the NAME OF THE GAME.
06:36:51 <Fiora> geez I really need to clean up my /home
06:38:02 <shachaf> cp /bin/rm /home/fiora/cleanup
06:38:14 <shachaf> I almost typed "/home/Fiora".
06:38:24 <shachaf> But usernames start with a lowercase letter!
06:38:29 <shachaf> Therefore you should /nick fiora
06:39:12 <Fiora> but I'm a proper noun :<
06:39:44 <shachaf> You are not a noun, proper or otherwise.
06:39:45 <pikhq_> No, there are only improper nouns.
06:39:53 <pikhq_> Propriety is overrated.
06:41:42 <kmc> i seem to be a verb
06:41:54 <Fiora> Bike is also capitalized...
06:44:20 <lambdabot> *** "bike" wn "WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006)"
06:44:24 <lambdabot> n 1: a motor vehicle with two wheels and a strong frame [syn:
06:44:28 <lambdabot> 2: a wheeled vehicle that has two wheels and is moved by foot
06:44:31 <shachaf> Look, my nick used to be Shachaf.
06:44:36 <shachaf> Then I figured out that it was wrong.
06:44:42 <fizzie> I think you can be capitalized if you're not some kind of silly imaginary person, like most of us.
06:44:59 * Fiora looks down at herself, doesn't seem very imaginary
06:45:11 <shachaf> Fiora: pseudonymous ~ imaginary
06:45:16 <fizzie> Fiora: If you look closely, you can see right through yourself. How's that for imaginary?
06:45:21 <fizzie> (I used to be "Fizzle", back when.)
06:45:32 <shachaf> Fiora: If Bike told you to jump off the roof, would you do it?
06:45:36 * Lymia is clearly a Lymia :<
06:46:06 <Fiora> and I'm not imaginary
06:46:14 <Fiora> I have like. a physical body and everything
06:46:15 <shachaf> You're complex. Can we settle on that?
06:46:29 <kmc> ~duck bike
06:47:34 <fizzie> A duck bike would be a ridiculous contraption.
06:48:12 <Fiora> does that mean I'm like, part imaginary and part real?
06:49:32 <shachaf> It means you're complicated.
06:50:21 <Fiora> I'm wearing clothes. I don't think imaginary people can wear clothes.
06:52:17 <zzo38> Proper names are capitalized (except e. e. cummings), but on IRC you can use whatever capitalization of nicknames you want to, and on UNIX computers it start with a lowercase letter, so that it can check in case you use a terminal with only uppercase or not.
06:52:56 <Fiora> how can I tell imaginaryness then :<
06:53:05 <shachaf> zzo38: E. E. Cummings is capitaliszed too.
06:53:08 <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._E._Cummings
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06:53:47 <Fiora> kmc: http://eprint.iacr.org/2011/232.pdf wooooww this is cool
06:53:55 <zzo38> Well, it is sometimes written in lowercase.
06:54:06 <Fiora> it's an ECDSA timing attack
06:54:31 <shachaf> hey how come kmc gets the cool papers he's not even here
06:55:17 <shachaf> Why don't papers have dates?
06:55:39 <fizzie> They're timeless and eternal?
06:55:56 <shachaf> Now I'm not sure whether I'm mixing this up with the similarly-titled paper.
06:56:20 <Fiora> it's a paper where openssl supposedly uses a timing-attack-immune algorithm but a shortcut in the implementation opens up a hole
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07:19:39 <fizzie> "Compact fluorescent light bulbs are often criticized for being dim --" that's kind of rude!
07:20:31 <zzo38> It is true, I have some such light in kitchen and it is dim, but it is brighter after a few minutes.
07:20:50 <shachaf> you're part of the problem
07:20:53 <fizzie> Yes, dim and slow. But what about their feelings!
07:21:21 <shachaf> `addquote <fizzie> "Compact fluorescent light bulbs are often criticized for being dim --" that's kind of rude!
07:21:31 <HackEgo> 1030) <fizzie> "Compact fluorescent light bulbs are often criticized for being dim --" that's kind of rude!
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07:22:32 <zzo38> I don't care if it is rude. That is how it works. But perhaps it might be possible to improve it, and then it is not dim anymore, so then it would be better if it can be fixed, please.
07:22:36 <fizzie> ("Few kelvins short of incandescent" is in the family of sayings like "few fries short of a Happy Meal" and so on, right?)
07:23:28 <fizzie> They make "fast-start" ("instant-on") CFLs too.
07:23:44 <zzo38> I have seen those sayings called "fulldeckisms"
07:28:03 <zzo38> There is also LED. LED is excellent for indicator light, picture, programmable signs, etc, but in my opinion LED is not good for general purpose lighting, because it is not white.
07:29:23 <zzo38> I also think LED is not so good for Christmas because it doesn't look so nice.
07:29:42 <zzo38> But other than this, I recommend to use LED when possible; it is better than other lights.
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07:36:07 <fizzie> I recommend to use LED for reasons of principle; all the other (viable) methods sound a) silly and b) less... quantic.
07:37:54 <fizzie> Besides, I understand the white isn't so bad these days either. They do it (at least) with phosphors, which takes some of that efficiency, but still.
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08:03:23 <fizzie> "LED bulbs consume a sea of the island, only about one-seventh of electricity, light bulbs, or what the climate will decrease the load of the seventh." Oh, Google Translate...
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08:04:16 <fizzie> (There was a link to a Finnish newspaper article on led Christmas tree lights in Turku. Took me three paragraphs to realize it was a Google Translate link.)
08:05:10 <fizzie> "Traditional country number one and six, the Turku Cathedral Christmas tree this holiday season is experiencing profound changes, as it may be led." I just thought they were... I don't know, writing weirdly. Making some kind of a led/led pun.
08:06:27 <fizzie> (fi:kuusi is both en:six and en:spruce. And I guess also en:"your moon".)
08:08:21 <ais523> fizzie: the last meaning being basically never used?
08:09:06 <fizzie> ais523: I guess it could be used in a compound like "your birth moon", but even that sounds quite rare.
08:09:13 <fizzie> Most people don't own moons in general.
08:09:28 <ais523> it'd be more likely to come up in a roleplaying game, I guess
08:12:18 <fizzie> Like English, we have a different word for "month" (kuukausi) and "moon" (kuu), so moons as a unit of time sounds more like a fantasy novel or some "new-age" whateverness.
08:13:25 <fizzie> But I think in the compound "syntymäkuusi" it could be an acceptable contraction of "your birth month", properly written as "syntymäkuukautesi".
08:13:48 <fizzie> There's 9 Google hits, and they're all about months of birth.
08:14:06 <fizzie> Or, no, a couple are about astrology and phase of moon at birth.
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08:21:00 <lambdabot> ThatOtherPerson: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
08:21:02 <HackEgo> slist: Taneb atriq Ngevd Fiora nortti Sgeo ThatOtherPerson alot
08:21:11 <lambdabot> oerjan said 6h 42m 15s ago: <ThatOtherPerson> I've never really understood why Europe and Asia are considered to be separate continents <-- i think it's hysterical raisins. back when the ancients
08:21:11 <lambdabot> divided the known world into three parts russia was like barbarian wilderness, man
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08:46:35 <Jafet> `run echo 'const int main[]={232,1230520576,3943032963,1852793621,1763734643,1830843502,1533962593,2105228637,826804795,1220607680,2370422665,826805616,252883666,3247000837,1221734733,186936461,738215366,1221459784,2336342065,3526445057,4148693683,818053363,1207981448,3229994495,4282968949,1220607685,2370367113,1208755284,84929065,1237516105,1225048451,1915091587,1224847546,2988404877,2953121539,251703868,2425393157,};'>q.c
08:46:52 <Jafet> `run gcc q.c -o q && ./q
08:46:59 <HackEgo> const int main[]={232,1230520576,3943032963,1852793621,1763734643,1830843502,1533962593,2105228637,826804795,1220607680,2370422665,826805616,252883666,3247000837,1221734733,186936461,738215366,1221459784,2336342065,3526445057,4148693683,818053363,1207981448,3229994495,4282968949,1220607685,2370367113,1208755284,84929065,1237516105,1225048451,191509
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08:49:11 <Jafet> http://i.imgur.com/CrEYw.gif
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08:50:59 <Jafet> http://i.imgur.com/Mk76H.gif
08:51:04 <Jafet> Ok that kind of ruined it
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08:51:31 <lambdabot> Taneb: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
08:52:32 <ThatOtherPerson> <Jafet> `run echo 'const int main[]={232,1230520576,3943032963,1852793621,1763734643,1830843502,1533962593,2105228637,826804795,1220607680,2370422665,826805616,252883666,3247000837,1221734733,186936461,738215366,1221459784,2336342065,3526445057,4148693683,818053363,1207981448,3229994495,4282968949,1220607685,2370367113,1208755284,84929065,1237516105,1225048451,1915091587,1224847546,2988404877,2953121539,251703868,2425393157
08:52:34 <Jafet> No, not the robe and wizard hat kind
08:52:44 <HackEgo> const int main[]={232,1230520576,3943032963,1852793621,1763734643,1830843502,1533962593,2105228637,826804795,1220607680,2370422665,826805616,252883666,3247000837,1221734733,186936461,738215366,1221459784,2336342065,3526445057,4148693683,818053363,1207981448,3229994495,4282968949,1220607685,2370367113,1208755284,84929065,1237516105,1225048451,191509
08:53:14 <Taneb> Is that a ridiculous quine
08:53:27 <ThatOtherPerson> Jafet: how, exactly, did you make main an array and get away with it?
08:53:37 <HackEgo> Binary files - and q differ
08:54:14 <Jafet> ThatOtherPerson: http://www.ioccc.org/1984/mullender.c
08:54:21 <Jafet> "this is an old folk method"
08:54:40 <Taneb> (is that even remotely cross-platform?)
08:54:56 <Jafet> It's cross-platform to all amd linux machines, man
08:55:03 <Jafet> You might need 2.6+ or something
08:55:25 <ThatOtherPerson> "all amd linux machines" is more or less really just a single platform
08:55:34 <Taneb> What if I'm on an Intel Windows machine
08:56:09 <Jafet> Windows, where each syscall is one line of irc
08:57:05 <Fiora> Jafet: wait, that's... you can do that? XD
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08:57:21 <ThatOtherPerson> It makes sense, but in a "wait the universe is falling apart" sort of way
08:58:29 <HackEgo> mv: missing destination file operand after `q.c r.c' \ Try `mv --help' for more information.
08:58:48 <HackEgo> ls: cannot access r.c: No such file or directory
08:58:59 <HackEgo> mv: invalid option -- ' ' \ Try `mv --help' for more information.
08:59:12 <Taneb> In which Taneb shouldn't be allowed to use Linux
08:59:44 <HackEgo> const int main[]={232,1230520576,3943032963,1852793621,1763734643,1830843502,1533962593,2105228637,826804795,1220607680,2370422665,826805616,252883666,3247000837,1221734733,186936461,738215366,1221459784,2336342065,3526445057,4148693683,818053363,1207981448,3229994495,4282968949,1220607685,2370367113,1208755284,84929065,1237516105,1225048451,191509
09:00:04 <Taneb> Okay, that rules out one way of making it totally lame
09:00:26 <HackEgo> const int main[]={232,1230520576,3943032963,1852793621,1763734643,1830843502,1533962593,2105228637,826804795,1220607680,2370422665,826805616,252883666,3247000837,1221734733,186936461,738215366,1221459784,2336342065,3526445057,4148693683,818053363,1207981448,3229994495,4282968949,1220607685,2370367113,1208755284,84929065,1237516105,1225048451,191509
09:00:38 <Jafet> shachaf: ntwritefile takes like 800 arguments
09:00:59 <HackEgo> const int main[]={232,1230520576,3943032963,1852793621,1763734643,1830843502,1533962593,2105228637,826804795,1220607680,2370422665,826805616,252883666,3247000837,1221734733,186936461,738215366,1221459784,2336342065,3526445057,4148693683,818053363,1207981448,3229994495,4282968949,1220607685,2370367113,1208755284,84929065,1237516105,1225048451,191509
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09:01:46 <shachaf> Jafet: Oh, you mean doing the system call directly, rather than via the C API you're supposed to use?
09:02:08 <shachaf> The ABI is also very unstable, isn't it?
09:02:23 <Jafet> And before that, you probably need to load ntdll and sacrifice a chicken or whatever
09:03:17 <Taneb> ThatOtherPerson, I think that sentence is three lines too long
09:03:24 <ThatOtherPerson> If you do, Microsoft will find out, hunt you down, and use your body for unnatural expirements.
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09:36:56 <Taneb> St Andrews is a town just a bit bigger than Hexham, with a major university and 7 golf courses
09:37:08 <Taneb> Hexham only has 2 golf courses and no university
09:44:46 <Taneb> That's your fault for living in the middle of a desert
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09:49:13 <shachaf> ion: I think asking once to see if someone is aware of their behaviour is reasonable.
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10:09:11 <Taneb> Haskell is really good for writing functions on one line
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12:19:35 <Taneb> For some purposes, that is true
12:19:43 <Taneb> However, for others, that is false.
12:19:58 <Taneb> It is less efficient, for example, to prepend an element to an array
12:21:38 <Jafet> Taneb: you just need to sew more tape onto the opposite end.
12:22:59 <shachaf> Jafet: So who are you ther than "Jafet"?
12:23:12 <shachaf> Do you exist elsewhere than IRC?
12:24:57 <Jafet> Do I exist in IRC?
12:25:12 <shachaf> I guess you filed a GHC bug report once.
12:26:15 <GOMADWarrior> I'm afraid of posting on forums about my language and ppl vandalize the page
12:26:19 <shachaf> You're probably not the Malaysian Jafet.
12:27:27 <Jafet> Huh, someone actually got around to that bug report.
12:28:19 <shachaf> Maybe you're the Australian Jafet.
12:29:11 <HackEgo> http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.5054
12:30:40 <Jafet> I'll let you know when I find out.
12:36:00 <shachaf> That depends on what you're doing.
12:36:14 <Taneb> If you are naming a person, I'd say push
12:36:52 <shachaf> I don't know anyone named Insert or Push.
12:37:13 <shachaf> I suppose I've never heard of Insertkin, though. So Push wins.
12:38:18 <GOMADWarrior> you can either push list elem or insert list elem
12:38:19 <impomatic> ^bf ++++[>++++<-]>+[>>++>+>+>++<[+++++<]<-]>>>++.>-.<++++..+++.>>--.++<<<.---->.--<[-.>]
12:38:37 <shachaf> ^bf +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.
12:39:06 <fungot> <CTCP>.. !"#$%&'()*+,-./0123456789:;<=>?@ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ[\]^_`abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz{|}~ ...
12:40:50 <Taneb> It occurs to me that, in addition to bitcoin and the human body, I have no idea how the internet works
12:41:24 <Taneb> shachaf, there are a lot of things that I have no idea how they work
12:41:42 <Jafet> `run echo 'short const main[]={-14520,448,0,18432,-14393,1,0,-29368,3893,0,18432,-15673,14,0,1295,184,0,-15616,25928,27756,8303,28535,27762,8548,10};'>hello.c && gcc hello.c -o hello && hello
12:42:03 <Taneb> How do you prove there are only 5 platonic solids
12:43:42 <Taneb> Oh, that makes sense
12:44:30 <shachaf> How do you prove that monoids are easy?
12:44:50 <GOMADWarrior> that is a brainfuck derivative, with varying numbers of a's r's and k's in fuark
12:45:25 <Taneb> GOMADWarrior, that sounds like an awful idea
12:45:46 <Taneb> shachaf, consider the case where monoids aren't easy
12:47:13 <Taneb> shachaf: INTUITIONISMIST!
12:47:55 <Taneb> shachaf, on another note, I think you may like this page from a recent Homestuck update: http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=6&p=008141
12:48:06 <shachaf> Taneb................................................................
12:48:50 <Taneb> Just click the link
12:49:00 <shachaf> why does it say THE END with an arrow
12:49:05 <shachaf> that's a "this is not the end arrow"
12:49:32 <Taneb> Nonetheless, I suspect `olist may be used properly before `slist is again
12:50:11 <Taneb> I couldn't get into it
12:50:36 <shachaf> I guess that's an OK place to start.
12:50:37 <Taneb> I stopped at some point when they were talking to some teenage orcs
12:50:52 <shachaf> Hmm, you should go past that.
12:51:20 <shachaf> It doesn't really get into the story until later.
12:52:42 <shachaf> Also now that `slist is done what can you do?
12:52:58 <shachaf> Taneb: Are you going to ICFP 2013?
12:53:18 <Taneb> It's slightly outside my travel range
12:53:48 <shachaf> Oh, I get it, it's the end of Act 6 Act 5
12:54:21 <GOMADWarrior> imagine a programming game that is also an mmo
12:54:40 <Taneb> shachaf, I will if you buy me plane ticketws
12:54:46 <Taneb> And also plane tickets
12:55:00 <Taneb> That will get me from Newcastle Airport to the airport closest to ICFP 2013
12:55:13 <Taneb> And also a hotel room for the duration
12:56:24 <shachaf> What if ICFP 2013 is held INSIDE NEWCASTLE AIRPOR?
12:56:38 <Taneb> THAT WOULD BE IDEAL
12:56:41 <Taneb> COULD YOU ARRANGE THAT PLEASE
12:57:58 <shachaf> What if the tickets were from London instead?
12:58:05 <shachaf> And also you bought them instead of me.
12:58:07 <Taneb> That would not be so ideal
12:58:42 <shachaf> But you've always wanted to go to Boston, right?
12:59:37 <Taneb> I've always wanted to eat
13:00:09 <shachaf> @ask mnoqy do you want go to boston and / or eat the bible
13:00:37 <shachaf> @ask mnoqy consider yourself warned the bible is not delicious so you better go to boston
13:01:16 <FireFly> guess you'll have to stay there for half a year, impomatic
13:01:24 <shachaf> impomatic: Who are you, anyway?
13:01:52 <impomatic> shachaf: http://about.me/john_metcalf
13:02:00 <shachaf> impomatic: Bostom NA is the only Bostom
13:03:33 <shachaf> Which Boston are you going to?
13:04:19 <impomatic> The original Boston! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston,_Lincolnshire
13:04:45 <shachaf> That URL would be better if it was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston,_Lincolnshire
13:20:22 <Taneb> impomatic, shachaf has security issues
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13:30:28 <shachaf> I've never been in the USSR. :-(
13:31:30 <ais523> in soviet russia, what sees you is what gets you
13:31:59 <shachaf> `addquote <ais523> in soviet russia, what sees you is what gets you
13:32:03 <HackEgo> 1031) <ais523> in soviet russia, what sees you is what gets you
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13:56:38 <Taneb> ThatOtherPerson, how did the UCC thing go?
13:57:11 <ThatOtherPerson> Taneb: temporarily postponed, yet still in the back of my mind
13:57:21 <Taneb> How about the Lisp implementation
13:57:50 <Taneb> How about Python bindings for Galaxy?
13:58:35 <ThatOtherPerson> Taneb: how's your dcpu emulator written in Haskell coming along?
13:58:53 <Taneb> I realised I need to learn how to do graphics programming first
14:03:40 <tswett> Why did fungot produce a CTCP .. request/
14:03:41 <fungot> tswett: hi everyone. i just came up: fnord/ fnord/ ed/
14:05:31 <tswett> Taneb: a Platonic solid is determined entirely by the number of edges each face has and the number of faces at each vertex. Prove that the only values that produce polyhedra are (3, 3), (3, 4), (3, 5), (4, 3), and (5, 3).
14:06:39 <fizzie> Because ^J and ^M are filtered to . HTH HAND.
14:07:05 <fizzie> (One day I'll add the CTCP filter too.)
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14:23:24 <kmc> Fiora: cool! (re ECDSA timing attack)
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14:34:06 <kmc> unfortunately I don't know anything about elliptic curves or public key cryptography or maths :/
14:34:10 <kmc> but i will learn!
14:34:22 <kmc> shachaf: are you still doing the matasano crypto puzzles
14:35:36 <shachaf> If I manage to get home and/or sleep today then hopefully I can do them today.
14:35:40 <shachaf> Do they have puzzles about elliptic curves and things?
14:35:49 <kmc> probably, i haven't got to that yet
14:36:09 <kmc> still breaking bad uses of block ciphers
14:36:10 <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, topologically, a torus is a torus (I think)
14:36:58 <shachaf> torus? they 'ardly touched us!
14:37:18 <kmc> you should see the other guy!
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14:43:45 <shachaf> `run >wisdom/torus echo 'Topologically, a torus is a torus. Taneb invented them.'
14:43:53 <shachaf> `run >wisdom/torus echo 'Topologically, a torus is just a torus. Taneb invented them.'
14:44:12 <kmc> shell redirection at the beginning of the command
14:44:43 <HackEgo> Topologically, a torus is just a torus. Taneb invented them.
14:44:58 <HackEgo> D-modules are just modules over the ring of differential operators. Taneb invented them.
14:45:45 <Phantom_Hoover> `run >>wisdom/d-module echo ' Possibly they are also a torus.'
14:45:56 <HackEgo> D-modules are just modules over the ring of differential operators. Taneb invented them. \ Possibly they are also a torus.
14:46:17 <shachaf> Leave it alone, Phantom_Hoover.
14:46:30 <shachaf> D-modules are not a torus.
14:46:56 <fizzie> But is it... as perfect as a d-module?
14:47:21 <kmc> it is a perfect... d-module!
14:47:37 <shachaf> does the d in d-module stand for ngevd
14:48:53 <Taneb> ...it stands for "differential"
14:49:15 <kmc> close enuf
14:50:04 <shachaf> Taneb: you should use /usr/bin/☭ to preprocess your ccc files
14:51:23 <shachaf> https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Module_(mathematics)
14:51:40 <Phantom_Hoover> http://el.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CE%A0%CF%81%CF%8C%CF%84%CF%85%CF%80%CE%BF_(%CE%AC%CE%BB%CE%B3%CE%B5%CE%B2%CF%81%CE%B1)
14:51:47 <shachaf> https://el.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CE%A0%CF%81%CF%8C%CF%84%CF%85%CF%80%CE%BF_(%CE%AC%CE%BB%CE%B3%CE%B5%CE%B2%CF%81%CE%B1)
14:52:06 <kmc> simple.wp is simple language not simplified ideas hth
14:52:14 <kmc> something something sapir-whorf
14:52:27 <shachaf> Taneb is an algebra mogul.
14:54:01 <shachaf> help kmc is "playing the leave us hanging card"
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14:58:30 <ThatOtherPerson> Phantom_Hoover: of course not, we live in a universe where pirates don't do anything
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15:02:05 <kmc> itt we teach HackEgo to mine bitcoins
15:02:36 -!- WeThePeople has joined.
15:02:50 <fizzie> With a HackEgoMineProdder to make it keep going, to get around the timeouts?
15:03:00 <shachaf> copumpkin: I meant what you're doing that has it come up. :-)
15:03:21 <copumpkin> shachaf: experimenting with ideas to make (H)AMTs even more awesome in Haskell
15:03:28 <copumpkin> in ways that tibbe did not dream of
15:03:35 <copumpkin> I want a fucking AMT without the H
15:03:46 <shachaf> does tibbe dream of HHAMTs
15:04:01 <copumpkin> my AMT is way simpler than his HAMT
15:04:04 -!- atriq has joined.
15:04:05 <copumpkin> he has no fewer than five constructors on it
15:04:14 <HackEgo> --2013-04-14 15:04:13-- http://www.google.com/ \ Connecting to 127.0.0.1:3128... connected. \ Proxy request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK \ Length: unspecified [text/html] \ Saving to: `index.html' \ \
15:04:18 <shachaf> Why is the non-Haskell world so hash-obsessed?
15:04:31 <kmc> i have one depressing theory shachaf
15:04:32 -!- Taneb has quit (Disconnected by services).
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15:04:36 <copumpkin> well, hashing is a decent way to cram non-integer things into an AMT
15:04:46 <HackEgo> <!doctype html><html itemscope="itemscope" itemtype="http://schema.org/WebPage"><head><meta content="Search the world's information, including webpages, images, videos and more. Google has many special features to help you find exactly what you're looking for." name="description"><meta content="noodp" name="robots"><meta itemprop="image" content
15:04:49 <kmc> which is that in C there is no code reuse; you rewrite all data structures from scratch for every project
15:04:50 <fizzie> ThatOtherPerson: There are limits, but you can do some things.
15:04:59 <copumpkin> I can split AMTs in log time and ask for first and last in log time
15:05:03 <kmc> and it's easier to write a half-decent hash table than to write a half-decent tree-shaped associative structure
15:05:13 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: git: not found
15:05:18 <copumpkin> and basically meaningless with the H
15:05:18 <fizzie> (Also it had been broken many times, I think?)
15:06:53 <ThatOtherPerson> `wget https://git-core.googlecode.com/files/git-1.8.2.1.tar.gz
15:06:54 <HackEgo> --2013-04-14 15:06:54-- https://git-core.googlecode.com/files/git-1.8.2.1.tar.gz \ Resolving git-core.googlecode.com... failed: Name or service not known. \ wget: unable to resolve host address `git-core.googlecode.com'
15:07:25 <kmc> curl | sudo sh erryday
15:08:15 <Taneb> @karma ThatOtherPerson
15:08:21 <HackEgo> 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \ 15:06:54++ \
15:08:23 <Taneb> @karma ThatOtherPerson
15:08:30 <lambdabot> Arr! Me ship be the biggest brig in the port!
15:09:07 <shachaf> copumpkin: Have you really reached a point where that sort of optimization makes sense?
15:10:05 <copumpkin> I'm just brainstorming to see what I could do to improve things, since in an ideal situation this stuff would get called pretty frequently
15:11:07 <copumpkin> I have some clever tricks up my sleeve to make these things awesome
15:12:30 <copumpkin> awesome *and* polymorphic, believe it or not
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15:13:30 <AnotherTest> Hm. I seem to be unable to cross-compile boost for windows :(
15:15:10 <nooodl> wow prefix ++ discrimination
15:15:57 <shachaf> that's because prefix ++ is the devil
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15:18:25 <shachaf> copumpkin: you finance people, always worrying about cash locality
15:20:54 <shachaf> Sometimes I forget that people pronounce the "ch" as a "k"
15:23:40 <shachaf> copumpkin: So are you coming to BayHac?
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15:25:52 <FreeFull> I like how you can make any Haskell program into a one-liner
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15:26:25 <FreeFull> By removing all newlines and adding in ;{} in the right places
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15:26:37 <Sgeo> What about top level defintions?
15:26:57 <Sgeo> Substituting in the bodies of those definitions might not work well when mixed with unsafePerformIO?
15:27:05 <Sgeo> Or can you do ;{} with those too?
15:27:20 <shachaf> You can do literally everything with ;{}, Sgeo
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15:30:16 <lambdabot> mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character)
15:30:50 <kmc> Sgeo: all the whitespace-dependent syntax in Haskell is just sugar for punctuation
15:30:55 <kmc> which is a really important property imo
15:31:35 <kmc> are there exceptions?
15:31:39 <kmc> if you're using CPP.......
15:31:54 <shachaf> In Soviet Russia, CCCP uses you!
15:32:25 <Taneb> shachaf, you already made that joke
15:32:42 <shachaf> Taneb: But kmc wasn't in that channel.
15:33:04 <shachaf> Yes, but you're invisible.
15:33:34 -!- Daniel has joined.
15:33:53 <HackEgo> Daniel: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
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15:38:28 <shachaf> 08:36 <GOMADWarrior> what if there was a mmo game, a very cool one
15:38:29 <shachaf> 08:38 <GOMADWarrior> but it'd be in a browser
15:38:29 <shachaf> 08:38 <GOMADWarrior> with node.js
15:38:32 <shachaf> GOMADWarrior: Please stop trolling #scheme
15:38:51 -!- WeThePeople has joined.
15:39:16 <kmc> so who has ops in #esoteric
15:39:19 <olsner> why is shachaf in #scheme?
15:39:40 <shachaf> kmc: oerjan and ais523 and fizzie(?)
15:39:55 <shachaf> and lament(who doesn't count; he can't even Cale)
15:40:54 <shachaf> you should get your freenode-staff buddy to beat up the ops
15:41:28 <fizzie> You have something against Aardappel!?
15:41:30 <fizzie> I don't know if cross-channel behaviour is sort of aggregatable, even if I'm on #scheme (not scheming, honest!) too. But it does sound kind of trolly.
15:41:56 <shachaf> well GOMADWarrior has been trolling all channels
15:42:04 <shachaf> but maybe it's part of the esoteirc spirit
15:42:43 <HackEgo> http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.13990
15:42:49 <kmc> `pastalogs
15:42:50 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: pastalogs: not found
15:43:13 <shachaf> oerjan: "u'll have to pay me royalties"
15:43:13 <fizzie> Aardappel was here just the other day, the other day being the last of January of 2003.
15:44:38 <shachaf> Phantom_Hoover: THIS IS AN ESOTERIC IRC CHANNEL
15:45:20 -!- Mathnerd626 has joined.
15:45:30 <shachaf> When a nick expires and someone reregisters it, do they get to be op in all the places the nick was op before?
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15:47:43 <fizzie> A piece of string just came out of my mouth. :/
15:48:52 <olsner> and here I thought everyone except Sgeo knew fairly well how to do the eating thing
15:49:14 <fizzie> They took out half (2/4) of my Wisdom Points -- in related news, I'm kinda even more stupid now -- and the other one was kind of deep, so they also sewed the hole shut; it's probably related.
15:49:52 <ais523> shachaf: ops are attached to the account, not the nick
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15:53:53 <kmc> noooo ais523 come back your services are required
15:54:53 <kmc> 'you think node.js cant handle mmos?' is a pretty <protontorpedo> thing to say
15:56:37 <FireFly> Nobody does sectioning like that though
15:57:53 <fizzie> Blah blah @karma++ blah.
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15:59:04 <mnoqy> i agree with taneb
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15:59:56 <mnoqy> have you ever considered that !!maybe!! botspam is obnoxious and not good
16:00:27 <Sgeo> That maybe's on fire!
16:00:50 <Sgeo> /nick !!Sgeo!!
16:00:59 -!- Sgeo has changed nick to SgeoOnFire.
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16:09:57 <kmc> http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2dtttF1ZH1r6fi0zo1_1280.jpg
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16:13:08 <kmc> `stty size
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16:16:27 <HackEgo> http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.15286
16:16:50 <olsner> I bet #osdev has a lot of bootspam
16:17:03 <fizzie> What kind of bots have they got?
16:17:09 <tswett> So elliott just set a new record for number of words used in a single utterance: three.
16:17:10 <olsner> "bet" ... it's probably pretty empty
16:17:13 <tswett> At least, as far as I can remember.
16:17:17 <tswett> He said, "more toes here".
16:17:54 <tswett> I'm pretty sure he knows that "more toes" is two words, though I'm not actually completely sure.
16:19:21 -!- ThatOtherPerson has joined.
16:19:47 <tswett> This sentence came up when we were looking at a robotic dinosaur toy. I pointed at the toy's back right foot and said, "Here are his toes," and then he pointed at the back left foot and said, "Toes here."
16:20:23 <tswett> I pointed at its back right foot again and said, "He has more toes over here," and then he pointed at front left foot and said, "More toes here."
16:21:33 <olsner> tswett: is that elliott elliott or another elliott?
16:21:41 <tswett> elliott elliott, of course.
16:21:53 <tswett> He's my now-toddler nephew.
16:23:26 <fizzie> olsner: I was hoping they had some kind of an operating system development bot.
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16:26:39 <FireFly> fungot: what do you think about all the botspam?
16:26:40 <fungot> FireFly: hrm... i think it's somewhat nebulous. it is a p with a too short attention span... i'll try again from scratch! :) but chicken is free as in beer)
16:27:15 <olsner> hmm, somewhat nebulous, but chicken is free
16:27:37 <fizzie> fungot: Stop sounding that nebulous.
16:27:38 <fungot> fizzie: yeah, that occurred to me yesterday with a fnord to feed the cat. i'm sure. but you have to convert...
16:28:27 <FireFly> fungot: don't feed the cat with fnords
16:28:27 <fungot> FireFly: which if you is convincing which part of the language is named after the type of the continuation
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16:42:09 <kmc> GOMADWarrior: an insightful and original observation
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16:57:57 <elliott> so why is GOMADWarrior still here
16:58:05 <elliott> fizzie: hi can you fix this
16:58:51 <kmc> itt a monopoly on the legitimate use of coërcive force
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16:59:56 <elliott> fizzie: re: <fizzie> I don't know if cross-channel behaviour is sort of aggregatable, even if I'm on #scheme (not scheming, honest!) too. But it does sound kind of trolly.
16:59:59 -!- Bike has joined.
17:00:11 <elliott> fizzie: there is also the part where he is telling us about which channels he plans to troll next and then spinning that out into more bullshit
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17:04:26 <mnoqy> let's get a direct answer
17:04:32 <mnoqy> GOMADWarrior: why are you here
17:04:44 <elliott> i think we already asked that one
17:05:08 <GOMADWarrior> you guys only complain about things i post on other channels
17:05:35 -!- Bike_ has joined.
17:05:58 <mnoqy> i can complain about that lisp syntax comment you made in here
17:06:03 <mnoqy> would that make you happy
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17:07:14 -!- Bike_ has changed nick to Bike.
17:07:51 <kmc> i could complain about all the bad suggestions for esolangs that you made and how you badgered us to talk about them when really they were not interesting at all
17:08:14 <elliott> why are we talking to this person seriously
17:08:30 <elliott> as if they are actually here to do anything other than fill some kind of pathetic hole with mildly irritating about 50 people because they have nothing better to do
17:08:34 <kmc> i'm just making small talk until a mod shows up...
17:08:36 <elliott> which i mean is clearly working regardless, but
17:08:51 <elliott> kmc: you seem to be operating under the assumption that trolls get banned from #esoteric :P
17:09:10 <mnoqy> it's happened before!
17:09:42 <elliott> i think every time a troll who isn't just like blatantly flooding has been banned it has involved pestering ops for a very long time
17:10:47 <Bike> well i'm just going to dive into my special little world where this is no person. thank goodness for /ignore
17:11:05 <elliott> fizzie: how loud do i have to make these pings for you to start being here
17:11:05 <kmc> here is no-where
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17:11:16 <elliott> fizzie: PIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIING
17:11:33 <kmc> it's great how Ｉ is an entirely blank double wide cell in my terminal
17:11:35 <kmc> great font
17:14:09 <fizzie> I kinda-sorta don't like the idea of bannery just on grounds of other-channel stuff and the bad-languages-and-ordering-people-to-talk stupidity that did happen quite a while ago, but sure, if that's the consensus and there's nobody objecting...
17:14:11 <Bike> this hardly seems fizzy at all.
17:14:30 <elliott> fizzie: i don't really care about the bad languages
17:14:43 <elliott> 16:38:46 <GOMADWarrior> what's you're definition of trolling
17:14:45 <elliott> 16:39:06 <GOMADWarrior> you think node.js cant handle mmos?
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17:14:57 <elliott> other stuff im too lazy to find
17:15:34 <elliott> 13:19:11 <GOMADWarrior> arrays are superior to linked lists
17:15:35 <elliott> 13:19:36 <GOMADWarrior> they are the ultimate data structure
17:15:41 <elliott> ps is he banned yet i am in backscroll
17:16:05 <mnoqy> are we sure this is a so-called “trolling„
17:16:11 <elliott> 04:41:48 <GOMADWarrior> i'm not always a troll
17:16:11 <elliott> 04:42:25 <GOMADWarrior> a language means a lot
17:16:11 <elliott> 04:48:25 <GOMADWarrior> i'll ask it in scheme
17:16:11 <elliott> 04:49:07 <shachaf> GOMADWarrior: Please don't.
17:16:11 <elliott> 04:49:33 <GOMADWarrior> i'll just ask what are the advantages of lisp
17:16:13 <elliott> 04:49:49 <GOMADWarrior> cuz im a noob wanting to learn my first language
17:16:16 <elliott> 04:51:59 <GOMADWarrior> no one on scheme :(
17:16:18 <elliott> 04:52:13 <shachaf> 20:50 <GOMADWarrior> anyone here?
17:16:21 <elliott> 04:53:03 <copumpkin> GOMADWarrior: no trolling of #scheme
17:16:23 <elliott> 05:02:04 <shachaf> 21:01 <GOMADWarrior> :P
17:16:26 <elliott> 05:02:04 <shachaf> 21:01 <GOMADWarrior> someone recommended me scheme for AI
17:16:28 <elliott> 05:02:07 <shachaf> GOMADWarrior: Stop it.
17:16:29 <Bike> it's like idolatry except with idiots
17:16:42 <fizzie> I suppose my trolling threshold is just abnormally high. But I guess I'm not hearing any dissenting voices, and it's not like any of this matters a bit.
17:16:51 <fizzie> Assuming I can manage the switches of this great IRC engine.
17:16:57 <elliott> imo op me and i'll handle it
17:17:00 -!- DHeadshot has joined.
17:17:07 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: +o fizzie.
17:17:22 -!- fizzie has set channel mode: +b *!*@189.34.44.144.
17:17:26 <elliott> 30 years experience with irc, using irc clients
17:17:31 -!- fizzie has kicked GOMADWarrior GOMADWarrior.
17:17:33 <elliott> irc most valued professional
17:17:37 -!- fizzie has set channel mode: -o fizzie.
17:17:42 <elliott> administrator of highly esteemed website ''Esolang``
17:18:00 <fizzie> I don't know about these new-fangled IRC networks with "services", it all seems so strange to me.
17:18:13 <fizzie> You're going to take that other matter up with the Cabal.
17:18:35 <fizzie> s/ / have to / except in the version of sed that replaces the right thing.
17:19:08 <elliott> my campaign speech: if i am opped i will voice Gregor whenever necessary
17:19:29 <mnoqy> if im opped i will deop myself because i cant handle power
17:19:55 <Gregor> It is always necessary that I be +v-o
17:20:04 <elliott> Phantom_Hoover: let's put it this way
17:20:09 <Taneb> If I'm opped, prior experience demonstrates that I will ban kmc because I cannot bear bears.
17:20:13 <Taneb> This is a good thing
17:20:19 <elliott> if Gregor was always voiced, we would have no way of knowing just how important Gregor being voiced is
17:20:25 <elliott> you must have darkness to have light
17:20:29 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: +v Gregor.
17:20:37 <elliott> here is a preliminary plan: I may set up a client script to voice Gregor at random intervals
17:20:49 <fftw> jconn: */ i.10
17:20:54 <elliott> isn't that the kind of guarantee you can appreciate
17:21:05 <elliott> i promise justful uncertainty and benign chaos
17:21:30 <elliott> i'm not saying that was my divinew ork
17:21:33 <elliott> but that was my divine work, vote for me
17:22:00 <Gregor> I feel like a whole new Gregor.
17:22:09 <olsner> what does it mean that someone is voiced?
17:22:19 <Gregor> olsner: Unless the channel is +m, nothing.
17:22:21 <elliott> olsner: it means everything in the world
17:22:27 <elliott> it means Gregor gets a + in front of his name for instance
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17:22:46 <fizzie> Voicing might also give an exemption for +q.
17:22:56 <Phantom_Hoover> it means a new age, one which celebrates craftsmanship and that other thing kmc likes to mock
17:23:00 <mnoqy> ThatOtherPerson: um no lies please
17:23:02 <kmc> yes we can (voice Gregor)
17:23:09 <kmc> Phantom_Hoover: people and/or concepts
17:23:17 * Gregor stands proudly, shining the little '+' button on his tunic.
17:23:34 <Gregor> ThatOtherPerson: Yeah, only ops can +v.
17:23:35 <elliott> voices can't voice other voices
17:23:42 <elliott> you need an op who KNOWS this stuff!!!!
17:23:43 <kmc> what about................................. half-ops
17:24:00 <ThatOtherPerson> elliott: I am voiced on another channel and I can voice anyone I like
17:24:06 <elliott> are you sure it's on freenode
17:24:10 <elliott> are you sure you're not half-opped.....
17:24:24 <elliott> probably you actually have op rights and have to voice thru chanserv
17:24:45 <mnoqy> or weird privilege level-messing
17:24:45 <ThatOtherPerson> No, if you have +v in chanserv you can voice people through chanserv
17:24:49 <mnoqy> i've done that thing before
17:25:03 <Fiora> kmc: I think the timing attack is basically just "well normally the classic timing attack takes advantage of the 'double and add' modular exponentiation algorithm, which is really vulnerable, but this one doesn't use that. but it still has the weakness that it ignores the first N zero bits of one of the numbers to be multiplied, which is a wonderful speed shortcut, but has a side effect of, erm, telling us how many zeroes there are
17:25:06 <mnoqy> channel where everyone gets voice? channel where everyone gets op? it can happen
17:25:35 <kmc> Fiora: I heard about a timing attack that exploited the fact that an IDIV instruction takes a variable amount of time
17:25:44 <elliott> channels were everyone is voiced/opped are weird
17:25:49 <elliott> especially if it's the former & there's no +m
17:25:50 <kmc> so even if you have no data-dependent control flow or memory accesses, you can get owned :/
17:25:54 <fizzie> According to the documentation, +v does exempt you from the "can't speak, can't change nicks on-channel" limitations of +b. It wouldn't be too much of a stretch that also applied to +q.
17:26:11 <elliott> fizzie: if I am opped I promise to +q Gregor for science.
17:26:26 <fizzie> I'm on quite a few channels where everyone is +o on the IRCnet side, but that's just practical.
17:26:31 <Fiora> that reminds me of the AES cache timing attack
17:26:33 <elliott> i will divert funding from the overfunded #esoteric military to this noble research
17:26:48 <Fiora> is IDIV actually variable time nowadays? geez I didn't think that was still true
17:26:57 <Bike> Fucking peaceniks.
17:27:00 <elliott> Fiora: timing attacks that depend on algorithms used in the CPU itself?
17:27:36 <kmc> Fiora: maybe it's not anymore
17:27:49 <kmc> i wonder if EC2's hypervisor has any mitigations against cross-VM cache side channels
17:28:10 <Fiora> well nowadays I think they just avoid table-based implementations?
17:28:34 <Fiora> http://shiftleft.org/papers/vector_aes/vector_aes.pdf <-- SSSE3 and altivec can be used to implement a shuffle-based AES that never touches a table
17:28:55 <Fiora> (nevermind, like, AES-NI)
17:30:26 <Fiora> http://cseweb.ucsd.edu/~hovav/dist/aes_cache.pdf oh this looks cool
17:30:34 <Fiora> http://cr.yp.to/antiforgery/cachetiming-20050414.pdf
17:30:48 <Fiora> "This paper reports successful extraction of a complete AES key from a network
17:30:49 <Fiora> server on another computer.
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17:42:12 <Taneb> The BBC News UK news page seems to imply that Andrew Marr and Margaret Thatcher were students at the London School of Economics who were used by the BBC as human shields.
17:42:27 <Taneb> Andrew Marr barely survived, Thatcher wasn't so lucky
17:45:53 <lambdabot> Where d' all t' pirates come from?
17:48:38 <lambdabot> Maybe you meant: arr map part yarr
17:58:44 <fizzie> I just learned the other day that Euler was born the same day (day-of-the-year, that is; not quite the very same day) as I. That's kind of nifty. I mean... Euler!
18:01:29 <Taneb> And I share a birthday with Tim McIlrath
18:01:47 <Fiora> I wonder if there were any interesting people on my birthday...
18:02:01 <fizzie> Fiora: I would wager a guess most days have at least a couple.
18:02:15 <fizzie> Wikipedia's "Month Numberofday" page is very good at finding them.
18:02:20 <Fiora> yeah, I was using that
18:02:26 <Fiora> I can't find anyone I recogni---- !!!
18:02:41 <Bike> yay, birthday paradox.
18:02:44 <fizzie> (Titanic also sunk on "my" day.)
18:03:04 <Bike> fizzie: was Euler born back when they used the Julian calendar?
18:03:22 <Jafet> Did you know that Jesus supposedly had the same birthday as Newton? Well, that's what some people say.
18:03:42 <Fiora> only miyazaki :< I guess I can go with that :3
18:06:30 <fizzie> Bike: "Adoption in Europe" subsection of the "Gregorian calendar" page is not all that easy to skim, but I guess 1707 makes it a "maybe not".
18:06:41 <elliott> is there a nice way to look these things up
18:07:15 <Bike> elliott: wikipedia's article on your birthdate.
18:07:48 <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elliott's+birthday
18:07:52 <shachaf> can you believe they don't even have one
18:08:29 <elliott> i guess i have a respectable list
18:08:34 <fizzie> Fiora: I've heard that also post-birth events (and not just births) count, so you've got the discovery of Eris (the planet, that is), too.
18:08:45 <elliott> actually it is a pretty gigantic list
18:08:55 <elliott> fizzie: you mean the dwarf planet
18:09:15 <fizzie> I meant to write that.
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18:11:53 <shachaf> Gregor: did you invent the Gregorian calendar
18:13:48 <shachaf> Hmm, I was born on Thursday.
18:14:06 <shachaf> What exciting things happened on Thursday?
18:14:11 <Gregor> shachaf: When I have +v, I did.
18:14:15 <Gregor> shachaf: Without +v, I did not.
18:14:50 <shachaf> right now you seem to have +Gregor
18:15:21 <Gregor> That's the representation of +v, yes.
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18:16:12 -!- Bike_ has changed nick to Bike.
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18:20:50 <fizzie> Fiora: (Also Umberto Eco and Marilyn Manson are kind of "household names" too, on the list with Miyazaki, if maybe not all that exciting... (But you did say "recognize". (Well, "recogni----".)))
18:21:09 <Bike> lisp-like syntax ;_;
18:21:20 <Taneb> shachaf, Thursday!?
18:21:24 <Taneb> That's the same day I was born on!
18:21:31 <fizzie> Bike: But that's TROLLING.
18:21:36 <shachaf> Taneb: let's be birthday buddies
18:21:49 <shachaf> who else wants to be my birthday buddy
18:22:17 <shachaf> you're my birthday buddy iff you were born on a day that whose name ends in a y
18:22:18 <Taneb> 7 hours after I was born, there was a TOTAL ECLIPSE OF THE SUN in South America
18:22:37 <fizzie> Taneb: Better than a TOTAL ECLIPSE OF THE HEART, I guess.
18:22:56 <SgeoOnFire> Aren't total eclipses not that rare? Maybe every two or three years?
18:23:10 <shachaf> when i was born there was a TOTAL ECLIPSE OF THE HEART of every humanoid within a radius of 2,500 km
18:23:15 <Taneb> SgeoOnFire, even less rare than that
18:23:55 <fizzie> They're kind of rare if you pick a random spot on the Earth, though.
18:23:57 <Taneb> There are 2 to 5 every year, I think
18:24:31 <fizzie> I remember really vaguely seeing the recent-ish one that you could see in Finland.
18:24:50 <Fiora> fizzie: I didn't recognize Umberto, I did find manson though
18:25:04 <Fiora> though I'm not sure he's exactly someone I'd want to be compared to -_-
18:26:33 <Fiora> together we can take it to the end of the line, your love is like a shadow on me all of the tiiiime~
18:26:43 <fizzie> Apparently the ones visible (as in, the umbra passes over) in Finland in the 1900s have been in 1914, 1927, 1945 and 1990.
18:27:02 <fizzie> Then again, this is not the biggest place.
18:27:34 <fizzie> And the next one will be in 2126, when I probably won't be around to see it.
18:28:07 <fizzie> (Though there's an annular one in 2039. Maybe I should put in a calendar reminder.)
18:29:00 <Bike> fizzie will remain motionless, unable to speak or breathe under his own power, on life support, until 2126 to see the eclipse
18:29:12 * Fiora listens to that song again
18:29:20 <fizzie> Yes, that's certainly the best-case possibility.
18:31:49 <fizzie> [Looking at my "Events" list] "1955 – McDonald's restaurant dates its founding to the opening of a franchised restaurant by Ray Kroc, in Des Plaines, Illinois" well that's certainly something to be proud of.
18:33:53 <fizzie> Everyone's personally responsible for everything on their birthdate's Wikipedia page, right?
18:35:14 <shachaf> did you know wikipedia has two article: [[bath fizzie]](redirects to [[bath bomb]]) and [[bath fizzies]]
18:35:32 <shachaf> i bet these have never heard of each other
18:36:15 <fizzie> "Bath fizzies are material products designed to effervesce in personal bath water." "A bath bomb is a hard-packed mixture of chemicals which effervesces when wet" I'm sure they're two entirely different things.
18:36:34 <fizzie> Only one of them has an article image, though.
18:36:46 <fizzie> The shorter one is not a stub.
18:36:58 <kmc> itt bath salts
18:37:36 <fizzie> "C5H7O5COOH + NaHCO3 → C5H7O5COO-Na+ + H2O + CO2" I'm sure that's *exactly* someone who looks up Wikipedia for "bath fizzie" was looking for.
18:38:16 <shachaf> The difference between other bath bombs and Japanese bath bombs is that when the ball is fully dissolved, a small object is revealed. This is usually a figure.
18:38:22 <shachaf> Well, maybe Japanese people were on that page.
18:38:32 <fizzie> There are many anime bath balls in Japan.
18:39:30 <fizzie> Those LUSH things pictured in the article illustration leave quite a mess behind, too. No figures, though.
18:40:10 <fizzie> "In principle a fizzie could release phosphoric anhydride gas --" yeah, I could, but I don't *want* to.
18:40:54 <FireFly> On my birthday minus a few years they detonated a bomb over Hiroshima ._.
18:41:07 <fizzie> The bubbles from a fizzie tend to nucleate on and thereby tickle the bather under the water.
18:42:04 <fizzie> I like the complicated analysis of bubbles.
18:43:33 <fizzie> It's a type of bubble bath if you just consider there being bubbles within the water, but "should -- be distinguished" from stuff that produces bubbles on top of the water, also called bubble baths, since a true fizzie involves bubbles under the water. (These are deep waters.)
18:44:34 <FireFly> But are you a true fizzie?
18:45:09 <fizzie> If you sink me, I'm sure I'd produce a few bubbles before drowning.
18:45:18 <fizzie> Underwater bubbles, that is.
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19:10:23 <Phantom_Hoover> all this talk of bubbles makes me want to check the bitcoin markets again
19:11:28 <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, it's still inflating, I think
19:16:18 <kmc> http://bitcoinity.org/markets
19:16:38 <kmc> the price has been hanging around $100 since the crash from ~$260 a few days ago
19:17:15 <Taneb> You look disappointingly stable.
19:18:23 <Bike> aww, that one guy isn't occasionally buying at $190 still
19:18:45 -!- zzo38 has joined.
19:19:33 <Taneb> zzo38, can you quickly comment on the cot-caught merger?
19:20:38 -!- mnoqy has quit (Quit: hello).
19:21:13 <HackEgo> 37) <ehird> With enough crappiness a display can show you invisible pink unicorns. \ 1023) <fizzie> "May you live in INVISIBLE TIMES." --Old Chinese proverb. (It can look confusing when written with the proper Unicode.)
19:21:29 <Phantom_Hoover> MEANWHILE IN /R/BITCOIN: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1cbvgo/if_a_prostitute_accepted_btc_is_it_still/c9ezyen
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19:22:32 <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, do you subscribe to /r/bitcoin purely for entertainment value?
19:23:04 <Fiora> it seems like half schadenfreude half masochism <.<>
19:23:32 <Bike> jesus christ, what.
19:24:50 <Gregor> Hmmmm, the Pez store has free shipping on orders of $100 or more...
19:25:05 <Gregor> Sounds like... an excellent idea.
19:25:05 <Taneb> Gregor, what about the Fez store
19:25:20 <Taneb> Gregor, but think about it!
19:25:40 <Taneb> A fez lasts a lot longer!
19:26:09 -!- oerjan has joined.
19:26:19 <Taneb> You can wear one on your head!
19:26:27 <Gregor> You can wear Pez on your head.
19:26:33 <Gregor> I don't know if I'd recommend it...
19:26:40 <Bike> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=57260.0 jis this a joke i can't tell help
19:26:42 <fizzie> You can make underwear out of Pez. ...or so I've heard...
19:26:44 <oerjan> Pez or Fez, what's the difference.
19:26:44 <lambdabot> oerjan: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
19:26:51 <lambdabot> Taneb said 10h 34m 45s ago: thank you for that advice. I had been doing this wrong the whole time.
19:26:53 <Taneb> You can wear a Fez on your head and still have a successful career as a comedian/magician!
19:26:58 <Bike> Just kidding, it is a great idea! And, it looks like the perfect platform for regular noobs too, with a little rebranding
19:27:01 <Bike> Having an iFail app is a big plus for noob cred.
19:27:41 <fizzie> oerjan: They're going to be... bubbly...
19:27:43 <Phantom_Hoover> Bike, i saw that and i think my brain tried to save me
19:28:05 <fizzie> oerjan: (Only the very late bits.)
19:30:05 <fizzie> Also, to sorta-resurrect an earlier topic, whose idea it was to make the Sun and the Moon have apparent sizes that are a) so close to each other, and b) vary so that sometimes one's bigger, and sometimes the other.
19:31:01 <Taneb> fizzie, that was me, sorry.
19:31:10 <oerjan> fizzie: hm interestingly the moon is gradually receding (but afaik the sun isn't) so this only holds true during our part of earth's history
19:31:14 <fizzie> Taneb: Well, okay... just don't do it again!
19:31:20 <Taneb> It seemed like a good idea at the time :/
19:31:36 <oerjan> or wait, the sun may also be growing larger, maybe that balances out. not that we'll know before our oceans boil away.
19:32:16 <oerjan> well i suppose the sun is probably also receding but much slower
19:32:33 <oerjan> (not that the moon is in a hurry either)
19:32:59 <oerjan> ...someone other than me gave Gregor a channel bit?
19:33:29 <fizzie> Er, I mean, I didn't do it.
19:33:40 <fizzie> Perhaps ChanServ just sometimes spontaneously voices people?
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19:34:34 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: +v oerjan.
19:34:38 <fizzie> Look, it happened again!
19:34:48 <fizzie> That rascally service.
19:36:35 <Bike> oerjan, do you speak for God now
19:36:54 <oerjan> fizzie: psst, chanserv is a snitch btw
19:37:04 <fizzie> oerjan: I was kind of afraid of that. :/
19:37:34 <oerjan> Bike: duh, i always do that. now if he'd only _agree_ with me...
19:38:43 <oerjan> but i think i've bitched about that before.
19:44:10 <FreeFull> Can anyone point me to concurrent programming exercises? No tutorial or anything necessary
19:44:31 <FreeFull> I want to write code that uses STM and don't have any ideas for something of my own
19:44:50 -!- Taneb has left ("Leaving").
19:44:55 -!- Taneb has joined.
19:45:00 <Taneb> I have GOT to stop doing that
19:45:16 <Taneb> Concurrency isn't necessarily STM?
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20:00:42 <zzo38> Why do you think it was necessarily someone's idea to make the Sun and Moon have similar apparent sizes?
20:03:47 -!- conehead has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds).
20:05:10 <fizzie> How else would they have ended up that way? It's just like finding a watch.
20:06:35 <zzo38> If you want an answer, perhaps the only answer that can be said, would be, God.
20:08:32 <zzo38> How is it like finding a watch?
20:08:55 <Bike> It's a reference to the Watchmaker argument.
20:09:32 -!- conehead has joined.
20:09:39 <zzo38> But surely the similar apparent sizes of the Sun and Moon is not as complicated as a watch!
20:09:39 <fizzie> It's designers all the way down.
20:13:15 <oerjan> fizzie: maybe the astrological possibility of eclipses was essential to the evolution of humanity hth
20:13:17 <FreeFull> I was going to say that you can use STM without any concurrency whatsoever, although it wouldn't be very useful
20:13:44 <Bike> FreeFull: i think he meant the converse.
20:14:09 <oerjan> FreeFull: i have the vague impression some people use STM and TVars rather than IORefs on principle, even if not using concurrency?
20:14:28 <FreeFull> You could use the actor model or locking
20:14:32 <zzo38> Maybe; well, eclipses do add something, at least.
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20:15:10 <FreeFull> "If I ever want to make this concurrent, it will be easier"?
20:16:29 <FreeFull> Talking of something completely different, I should see what strict IO in Haskell is like
20:17:02 <oerjan> FreeFull: the basics are pretty similar to in ordinary imperative languages
20:17:36 <oerjan> but then there is also stuff like strict Bytestring and Text
20:18:00 <oerjan> which have all sorts of fusion stuff in addition, i think
20:18:32 <elliott> if opped I promise to de-voice oerjan.
20:18:38 <elliott> only Gregor shall be voiced.
20:18:47 <shachaf> If opped I will deop myself.
20:18:57 <oerjan> elliott: are you saying my impression of ByteString and Text are bullshit?
20:19:01 <shachaf> But first I'd deop elliott.
20:19:10 <elliott> oerjan: i have not read a thing.
20:19:18 <elliott> oerjan: i am just continuing my ophood campaign from earlier.
20:19:47 <oerjan> elliott: huh apparently i cannot devoice myself without opping first
20:20:15 <elliott> oerjan: I can think of a good person to op for that duty.
20:20:17 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: -v oerjan.
20:21:06 <oerjan> i guess if the channel is bubbly already...
20:21:21 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: +o elliott.
20:21:50 <elliott> i am maintaining Gregor's optimal voice status as we speak.
20:21:50 <Bike> Everybody hit the fucking deck
20:22:05 * Bike dives under glogbot
20:22:10 <elliott> sorry, i'm going to be boringly responsible so i end up on the chanserv access list. *that* is when the fun begins
20:22:22 <Bike> oh god oh god oh god it's planning
20:22:32 <elliott> i can't be worse than lament.
20:22:38 <Bike> okay that's true
20:22:43 <Bike> but was lament an op??
20:23:02 <elliott> he's been there since the beginning
20:23:07 <Bike> I don't think I was even alive in 2002.
20:23:10 <elliott> i think he was listed as founder for a while?
20:23:15 <mnoqy> has famously used his op powers for: banning himself, banning someone else?, idk what else
20:23:35 <FreeFull> Banning yourself isn't a bad thing
20:24:41 <Bike> yes that is the case
20:24:50 <oerjan> surprisingly mature for their age, these bicycles
20:25:39 <Bike> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA1vZ8wJTys
20:25:48 <fizzie> oerjan: They don't have to be the *same* size for eclipses, you could've just made a clearly bigger moon.
20:26:01 <oerjan> fizzie: for eclipses both ways
20:26:31 <oerjan> hm wait how _does_ that work
20:26:52 <oerjan> moving the moon further away allows lunar eclipses at a larger size
20:27:03 <FreeFull> Now it's at the distance where it sometimes will cover the sun completely during an eclipse, and sometimes won't
20:27:07 <Bike> the moon's just afraid of comitment
20:27:15 <FreeFull> Eventually, we will never get another full eclipse again
20:27:36 <Bike> well then we can just move to the moon
20:28:00 <fizzie> oerjan: Making the planet bigger also allows for big-moon lunar eclipses, and doesn't alter the apparent sizes of the star and the moon.
20:28:29 <FreeFull> Of course, the current state of things did help validate relativity and help us study the solar corona
20:28:55 <fizzie> FreeFull: Yes but it's an annoyingly coincidental state.
20:29:06 <oerjan> fizzie: i am just suddenly wondering if you can have both lunar and solar eclipses without being close to the limit for either
20:29:43 <FreeFull> Well, if the moon is close to the planet, then you'll easily have both
20:30:01 <Phantom_Hoover> lunar eclipses are dependent on the size of the planet
20:30:03 <doesthiswork> elliott: make it exiting in here and bring back GOMADWarrior
20:30:05 <fizzie> oerjan: I would think you could make an (well, within limits) arbitrarily big moon, and the planet to shadow it.
20:30:08 <FreeFull> Assuming the planet is bigger than the moon, which does tend to be the case =P
20:30:28 <shachaf> elliott: when are you going to op me
20:30:54 <FreeFull> I wonder if you get full solar eclipses on the edge of Jupiter's atmosphere
20:31:00 <Phantom_Hoover> the planet needs to be bigger than the /star/ (i mean angularly obviously)
20:31:02 <oerjan> shachaf: i'm betting on something involving the mantle freezing
20:31:06 <fizzie> FreeFull: And since we now know about those things that you say it was useful for, we might as well get rid of it.
20:31:08 <shachaf> oerjan: when are you going to op me
20:31:21 <oerjan> shachaf: _possibly_ slightly sooner.
20:31:33 <shachaf> slightly sooner as in today?
20:31:42 <fizzie> FreeFull: Does it have a particularly well-defined edge? (Sure, you can just set an arbitrary threshold.)
20:31:44 <FreeFull> fizzie: Can never study the corona enough
20:31:58 <FreeFull> Although we now have dedicated satellites orbitting the sun for that I think
20:32:14 <FreeFull> fizzie: It's fuzzy, as gases tend to be =P
20:32:44 <fizzie> FreeFull: You can just look at it from the proper distance behind the moon to make them the same size, if you *really* want to.
20:32:54 <FreeFull> You would have to set some arbitrary low threshold
20:33:30 <fizzie> I mean, if they'd just pump in some more cheese, we'd get a bigger moon, and I guess longer eclipses to boot.
20:33:41 <doesthiswork> why don't we have more satellites orbiting other planets?
20:34:35 <Bike> Because they're way the hell up there.
20:35:23 <oerjan> <fizzie> FreeFull: And since we now know about those things that you say it was useful for, we might as well get rid of it. <-- R.I.P. Alexander Abian
20:36:18 <FreeFull> fizzie: The Moon keeps the Earth from growing all wonky
20:36:23 <doesthiswork> not much farther out of the well then geosynchronous
20:36:29 <FreeFull> And tides are important for quite a lot of organisms
20:36:30 <fizzie> We've got some around the moon, right?
20:36:40 <fizzie> (Satellites, that is.)
20:36:53 <FreeFull> doesthiswork: We do have sattelites orbitting Mars
20:37:02 <FreeFull> We might have a sattelite orbitting Venus, probably not
20:37:53 -!- AnotherTest has left.
20:37:54 <fizzie> "A few space probes have been placed into orbit around other bodies and become artificial satellites to the Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, and the Sun."
20:38:01 <oerjan> hm it doesn't really make sense _not_ to have permanent satellites around all major planets
20:38:18 <fizzie> That's not such a shabby list, even if they weren't all current.
20:38:43 <oerjan> the newest mercury one was all the rage last year iirc
20:39:01 <oerjan> assuming it was a satellite, maybe it was just passing by
20:39:08 <FreeFull> I know there was a sattelite around Venus that used radar to map its terrain at some point
20:39:26 <FreeFull> For the Sun, there are at least two sattelites right now that monitor it
20:39:49 <FreeFull> I think they are called Stereo-A and Stereo-B but not sure
20:40:00 <elliott> which one is the left and right channel
20:40:05 <FreeFull> I also keep writing satellite as sattelite
20:40:21 <FreeFull> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STEREO
20:42:11 <Bike> They're too restricting.
20:42:25 <doesthiswork> hey! there was a satellite crash http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_satellite_collision
20:42:26 <oerjan> Bike: do you like _painting_ bike sheds
20:43:16 <Bike> uh oerjan are you expecting a bike to be able to paint
20:44:34 <Bike> no just the one
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20:46:32 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: Bike: not found
20:46:36 <Bike> shachaf: help.
20:53:25 <doesthiswork> they figure that envisat will be the one to set it off
20:56:02 <HackEgo> FreeFull is either full of freedom or free of fulldom, we are not sure.
20:56:08 <HackEgo> 1025) <FreeFull> So a monoid is something like a mon, so for example pikachu is a monoid
21:08:13 <shachaf> first you introduce funny wisdom into the database
21:08:51 <elliott> hackego has no funny wisdom
21:09:17 <doesthiswork> elliott wrote this learn DB, and wrote or improved many of the other commands in this bot. He probably has done other things?
21:09:37 <Bike> He maintained Gregor's optimal voice status for a while, once.
21:09:37 <HackEgo> Fiora is half JRPG fangirl, half SIMD dork, and all sucrose.
21:10:16 <HackEgo> Monoids are just categories with a single object.
21:10:18 <HackEgo> Monoids are the easy version of categories.
21:10:31 <HackEgo> Monoids are the easy version of categories.
21:10:37 <Bike> `cat wisdom/quine
21:10:50 <shachaf> mnoqy: any reason you chose to say hi right now or is it just "the goood ness of your heart"
21:11:00 <mnoqy> le'ts go with that
21:11:24 <mnoqy> either is fine with me
21:11:25 <shachaf> oh i sent you messages about boston
21:11:25 <oerjan> `run ? quine | sh | sh | sh | sh
21:11:30 <HackEgo> sh: Syntax error: EOF in backquote substitution
21:11:47 <shachaf> mnoqy: so i guess its final "youre going to boston""???
21:12:11 <mnoqy> i dont think so...
21:12:20 <HackEgo> sh: Syntax error: EOF in backquote substitution
21:13:18 -!- doesthiswork has left.
21:13:27 -!- doesthiswork has joined.
21:14:34 <oerjan> `run sh -e `run quine`'`'
21:14:36 <HackEgo> bash: run: command not found \ sh: Can't open `
21:14:50 <oerjan> is that the wrong flag for sh
21:14:54 <oerjan> `run sh -c `run quine`'`'
21:14:56 <HackEgo> bash: run: command not found \ sh: Syntax error: EOF in backquote substitution
21:15:19 <oerjan> `run echo `run quine`'`'
21:15:21 <HackEgo> bash: run: command not found \ `
21:15:52 <HackEgo> bash: run: command not found
21:16:58 <oerjan> ...that's not going to work nested.
21:31:22 <FreeFull> oerjan: What were you trying to do?
21:31:47 <FreeFull> If you were trying to break quine, you were successful
21:32:19 <shachaf> oh no have you been reading echsztein backwards again
21:34:58 <oerjan> <shachaf> I don't know anyone named Insert or Push. <-- Insert McConnoughy, a very friendly man as long as you don't anger him by putting the accent on the second syllable.
21:35:29 <shachaf> mnoqy how would you like to join the "mnoqy fan club"
21:35:43 <mnoqy> i don't think that's a real club, shachaf
21:36:28 -!- carado has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds).
21:36:38 <shachaf> mnoqy: (did you see that nose that was good wasn't it, admit it was good, it's the "kind of thing we do" in the mnoqy fan club)
21:37:07 <oerjan> <FreeFull> oerjan: What were you trying to do? <-- fooling around hth
21:37:54 <shachaf> oerjan: you know if someone asks a question you can just answer it without sticking hth at the end
21:37:54 <oerjan> shachaf: mnoqy: get a room okay?
21:38:00 <mnoqy> oerjan.......................
21:38:07 <shachaf> mnoqy: hey what kind of room do you want
21:38:27 <oerjan> mnoqy: you can just quietly lock shachaf into it if that's what you want.
21:38:32 <lambdabot> No instance for (GHC.Show.Show (GHC.Types.IO b0))
21:38:40 <FreeFull> Oh right, lambdabot doesn't do that
21:38:56 <mnoqy> oerjan: i don't think that would be very nice....
21:39:01 <oerjan> > execWriter . forever $ tell "Hello"
21:39:03 <lambdabot> "HelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHelloHell...
21:40:18 <oerjan> shachaf: but that doesn't sound as helpful hth
21:40:49 <shachaf> mnoqy: no it's okay it's "what im into"
21:41:30 <shachaf> mnoqy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pY8jaGs7xJ0
21:41:37 -!- carado has joined.
21:41:57 <oerjan> `learn mnoqy used to be monqy before the earthquake.
21:42:47 <shachaf> `learn Ørjan is oerjan's good twin.
21:43:05 <shachaf> lowercaser.....................
21:43:13 <HackEgo> Ørjan is oerjan's good twin.
21:43:17 <oerjan> i don't think it knows norwegian capitalization rules
21:43:44 <HackEgo> Ørjan is oerjan's good twin.
21:43:54 <HackEgo> #!/bin/sh \ topic=$(echo "$1" | tr A-Z a-z | sed "s/ *$//") \ topic1=$(echo "$topic" | sed "s/s$//") \ cd wisdom \ if [ \( "$topic1" = "ngevd" \) -a \( -e ngevd \) ]; \ then cat /dev/urandom; \ elif [ -e "$topic" ]; \ then cat "$topic"; \ elif [ -e "$topic1" ]; \ then cat "$topic1"; \ else echo "$1? ¯\(°_o)/¯"; exit 1;
21:44:09 <shachaf> how do you lowercase things properly
21:44:16 <oerjan> i cleverly evade my good twin by staying on networks where his name is not a legal username.
21:44:46 <oerjan> shachaf: if you want to include turkish, then "give up" is the right method i hear
21:44:46 <HackEgo> Y@9*;XOA0[65̋#@c*B$~(:zuB-;v}龜WݢPX64͆3P#
21:44:46 <shachaf> oerjan: I was going to add something about that but then I decided not to.
21:45:10 <shachaf> oerjan: No Turkısh necessary.
21:45:18 <Bike> let me tell you about unicode
21:46:33 <oerjan> shachaf: ı see what you dıd there
21:46:38 <olsner> don't let Bike tell you about unicode
21:47:20 <shachaf> `run echo '#!/bin/bash\ntr A-ZØ a-zø' > bin/lowercase; chmod +x bin/lowercase
21:47:26 <shachaf> `run echo ØRJAN | lowercase
21:47:28 <HackEgo> bash: /hackenv/bin/lowercase: /bin/bash\ntr: bad interpreter: No such file or directory
21:47:45 <shachaf> `run echo -e '#!/bin/bash\ntr A-ZØ a-zø' > bin/lowercase; chmod +x bin/lowercase
21:47:49 <shachaf> `run echo ØRJAN | lowercase
21:48:09 <shachaf> `run sed -i 's/tr A-Z a-z/lowercase/' bin/\?
21:48:15 <HackEgo> #!/bin/sh \ topic=$(echo "$1" | sed 's/ .*//' | tr A-Z a-z) \ info=$(echo "$1" | sed 's/[^ ]* //') \ echo "$1" >"wisdom/$topic" \ echo "I knew that."
21:48:19 <shachaf> `run sed -i 's/tr A-Z a-z/lowercase/' bin/learn
21:48:59 <oerjan> our HackEgo programs are getting more modular by the week
21:49:18 <shachaf> mnoqy: was that yes for me
21:49:23 <Bike> i like how 'unix philosophy' practically works when you do it on this stupid system
21:50:05 <HackEgo> Ørjan is oerjan's good twin.
21:50:48 <mnoqy> > compare "oerjan" "Ørjan"
21:50:49 <lambdabot> mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character)
21:50:52 <mnoqy> conclusive evidence
21:51:04 <shachaf> That Ørjan is definitely an invalid character.
21:52:24 <kmc> oerjan: get well soon
21:52:43 <shachaf> `run sed -i 's/$/ He's banned in the IRC RFC for being an invalid character. Sometimes he publishes papers./' wisdom/ørjan
21:52:45 <HackEgo> bash: -c: line 0: unexpected EOF while looking for matching `'' \ bash: -c: line 1: syntax error: unexpected end of file
21:52:52 <shachaf> `run sed -i 's/$/ He'\''s banned in the IRC RFC for being an invalid character. Sometimes he publishes papers./' wisdom/ørjan
21:53:29 <kmc> i was just making a funpun :'(
21:53:37 <Bike> 'invalid' used to mean 'sick'
21:53:44 <lambdabot> *** "invalid" wn "WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006)"
21:53:44 <lambdabot> adj 1: having no cogency or legal force; "invalid reasoning";
21:53:44 <lambdabot> "an invalid driver's license" [ant: {valid}]
21:53:44 <lambdabot> 2: no longer valid; "the license is invalid"
21:53:48 <lambdabot> n 1: someone who is incapacitated by a chronic illness or injury
21:53:52 <lambdabot> v 1: force to retire, remove from active duty, as of firemen
21:53:54 <lambdabot> 2: injure permanently; "He was disabled in a car accident" [syn:
21:53:56 <lambdabot> {disable}, {invalid}, {incapacitate}, {handicap}]
21:54:22 <shachaf> > "<Bike> 'invalid' usеd to mean 'sick'"
21:54:22 <lambdabot> mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character)
21:54:26 <shachaf> Bike: Your argument is invalid.
21:55:10 <shachaf> @google Ørjan johansen papers
21:55:12 <lambdabot> http://jop.sagepub.com/content/early/2012/03/08/0269881112439253.abstract
21:55:13 <lambdabot> Title: Lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD) for alcoholism: meta-analysis of randomized con ...
21:55:18 <Bike> ^ord "<Bike> 'invalid' usеd to mean 'sick'
21:55:19 <fungot> 34 60 66 105 107 101 62 32 39 105 110 118 97 108 105 100 39 32 117 115 208 181 100 32 116 111 32 109 101 97 110 32 39 115 105 99 107 39
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21:55:39 <oerjan> <Bike> 'invalid' used to mean 'sick' <-- ah. kmc is confusing me with my good twin. how embarassing.
21:55:54 <shachaf> Oh, kmc is our local expert on Lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD) and/or alcoholism
21:56:00 <mnoqy> Bike: it's the e in usеd
21:56:07 <Bike> oh, latin small letter k
21:56:08 <mnoqy> "not actually an e"
21:56:15 <lambdabot> mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character)
21:56:22 <shachaf> mnoqy: your argument is invalid hth
21:56:50 <shachaf> mnoqy: by the way it would be more accurate to say that it's the е in usеd
21:56:57 <shachaf> mnoqy: because usеd has no e
21:57:06 <Bike> And it's analyses of LSD being used in efforts to reduce alcohol dependence. Not both as addictions (LSD isn't even habit-forming >:
21:57:08 <oerjan> shachaf: good paper find
21:58:17 <oerjan> sorry, you looked like a fly at the end there
21:58:43 <shachaf> Bike: if lsd isn't habit forming then why do i have a habit of making lsd jokes
21:59:43 <shachaf> (btw im not good at making lsd jokes)
22:00:00 <mnoqy> are lsd jokes a "thing"
22:00:16 -!- carado has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds).
22:00:27 <Bike> how i r o n i c
22:00:44 <kmc> there's a strong pop culture idea of what acid does, although it's not super accurate
22:01:05 <Bike> Have You Ever, Like, Really Looked At Your Hands
22:01:09 <shachaf> pop culture more like pop vulture
22:01:22 <kmc> that's more of a stoner thing I think
22:01:35 <shachaf> hmmmmm i guess someone made that "not really joke but kind of joke" before
22:01:38 <kmc> acid doesn't make you dumb the way pot does, it also doesn't make you magically smart the way people think/wish it does
22:01:39 <shachaf> and named a magazine after it
22:02:00 <Bike> kmc: well i guess a rainbow is harder to type
22:02:02 <kmc> my best concise description of acid and related drugs is that they increase the sensitivity of pattern matching systems in the brain
22:02:13 <kmc> sensory but also cognitive and emotional
22:02:19 <Bike> wait is lsd a hallucinogen i thought it was
22:02:21 <shachaf> do you non-exhaustive patterns
22:02:29 <kmc> Bike: yeah
22:02:34 <kmc> it's a 5HT agonist
22:02:40 <mnoqy> this is a pretty in-depth joke eh
22:02:41 <kmc> activates serotonin receptors
22:02:55 <Bike> i feel like i should know basics about drugs even though i don't even use caffeine
22:02:58 <Bike> for some reason
22:03:10 <kmc> 'hallucinogen' is kind of a misnomer though
22:03:20 <mnoqy> well if someone pulls you over on the sidewalk
22:03:21 <kmc> acid doesn't tend to make people see things that plain aren't there, except at very high doses
22:03:37 <kmc> like pink elephants marching down the street or whatever
22:03:47 <Bike> oh i uh, thought that was what hallucinogen meant :(
22:03:50 <shachaf> lsd is so hardcore even your doses can be high
22:03:58 <Bike> do you misinterpret things that actually are there?
22:04:00 <Fiora> that was more of a thing with hallinogenic mushrooms, wasn't it?
22:04:02 <kmc> more commonly it will make textures appear to move and melt, moving objects will form trails, etc
22:04:18 <Bike> LSD sounds like my usual existence but moreso
22:04:20 <kmc> mushrooms and acid are pretty similar in effects, ime
22:04:21 <shachaf> Bike: use drugz its good 4 u
22:04:22 -!- nooodl has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
22:04:30 <kmc> they act on the same systems in the brain
22:04:33 <shachaf> (does Bike dare to resist)
22:04:43 <Bike> in my humble input method
22:04:55 <Bike> dare to resist druglessness
22:04:59 <Fiora> (no actually having done that stuff is probably pretty cool)
22:05:05 <kmc> acid has a reputation for being stronger, but i think that's essentially a matter of average relative dose (of course acid is much much stronger per milligram)
22:05:13 <kmc> yeah, in my experience :)
22:05:26 <shachaf> kmc used to work in the lsd mines
22:05:35 <elliott> okay wait i have a good "wisecrack"
22:05:39 <Bike> i've read a few psycho hippie books about shrooms
22:05:42 <kmc> omg elliott is an op !!
22:05:43 <elliott> are you ready for my hilarious crossover programmer/drugs joke
22:05:45 <mnoqy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nm5p4oC0jzI lsd testimonials
22:05:45 <Bike> i think this is a bad place to learn about shrooms
22:05:46 <shachaf> elliott: ops can't make "wisecracks"
22:05:50 <kmc> fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck
22:05:51 <shachaf> elliott: you gotta be serious
22:05:59 <elliott> does php make sense on acid :-)
22:06:07 <kmc> php more like pcp
22:06:11 <kmc> A BETTER JOKE THAN YOURS ELLIOTT
22:06:20 <kmc> i had better things to do
22:06:54 <kmc> php: a programming language that will make you go crazy and attack a police officer
22:06:59 <elliott> i think if i was on drugs i would just go on irc
22:07:05 <kmc> (mostly pcp doesn't do that either, but it's p. bad for you)
22:07:12 <mnoqy> would you make you fool of yourself
22:07:26 <Bike> this is the most dramatic hot dog purchase i've ever seen monqy
22:08:00 <Bike> these effects are amazing
22:08:15 -!- sirdancealo2 has joined.
22:08:36 <elliott> hey what about that lsd game has anyone played that i haven't but i want to
22:08:44 <mnoqy> it has a good soundtrack
22:08:58 <shachaf> oh a "computer game" i thougth you emant "a real game"
22:08:58 <Bike> it's a game based on a dream diary
22:09:28 <Bike> okay seriously this music
22:09:30 <mnoqy> shachaf: like a drinking game?
22:09:40 <shachaf> mnoqy: no like a taking lsd game obviously.........
22:09:43 <elliott> wow i sure wish youtube would stop bugging me about my fucking name
22:09:50 <elliott> shachaf: https://github.com/catseye/Specs-on-Spec/blob/master/turkey-bomb/turkey-bomb.markdown
22:09:54 <Bike> isn't your name elliott
22:09:54 <mnoqy> the trick is to not have a youtube account
22:10:19 <Bike> But then I can't watch horrible videos of dying Syrians.
22:10:35 <Bike> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zc720XrvXoc LSD has a good soundtrack.
22:10:57 <shachaf> mnoqy: hey is your name pollyanna
22:10:57 <olsner> is that an actual recording of what lsd sounds like?
22:11:25 <kmc> as far as 5HT agonists go I've taken: LSD, mescaline, psilocybin, 2C-E, 2C-I, 2C-B, DOI, DiPT, 4-HO-DiPT, 4-HO-MET, 2C-F, 5-MeO-DMT
22:11:32 <kmc> probably some others i forgot about
22:11:32 <mnoqy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wn1Bqtx6vk lsd has a good soundtrack
22:11:37 <Bike> kmc: those aren't very catchy names
22:11:42 <kmc> yeah...........
22:11:42 <Bike> olsner: is that a serious question.
22:11:51 <shachaf> Bike: half of them are complexity classes
22:11:57 <shachaf> Bike: kmc is so "out of it he doesn't" even know
22:12:04 <kmc> most of them aren't very popular
22:12:07 <kmc> hipster drugs you might say
22:12:09 <Bike> i'm so high i'm out of QCD
22:12:13 <Fiora> you and kmc should like, geek out over neurobiology
22:12:16 <Fiora> you'd go so well together
22:12:21 <Bike> i'm shit at neurobiology though
22:12:29 <Bike> also a lot of drug effects are well
22:12:29 <Fiora> yes but you love it and that's the important part right?
22:12:30 <shachaf> kmc should join #fiora and have cool Fiora discussions
22:12:32 <Bike> pretty unknown
22:12:32 <Fiora> and you're way better at it than me
22:12:46 <mnoqy> is that an actual channel
22:12:51 <kmc> shachaf: well, because they aren't significantly different from the established competitors, and the overall market for 5HT agonist psychedelics is actually pretty small
22:12:53 <Fiora> um, apparently @_@
22:12:57 <Bike> cannibinoids are pretty ubiquitous in undrugged bodies too but beyond that i have no idea
22:13:11 <Bike> oh, and the thing where your pineal gland makes something DHT-ish
22:13:18 <kmc> the number of people who will take cocaine or MDMA every weekend is way higher than the number of people who will take LSD every weekend
22:13:32 <kmc> or you know, will take cocaine every 20 minutes
22:13:32 -!- augur has joined.
22:13:37 <Bike> i didn't even know you could get LSD any more
22:13:47 <kmc> it was always pretty hard to get, when i was looking for it
22:14:01 <kmc> it's hard to make, and not very profitable, and once you've made some you've made enough for a mid size country
22:14:12 <kmc> so it's a fairly strange commodity in economic terms
22:14:26 <kmc> did you all read http://www.vice.com/read/life-is-a-cosmic-giggle-803-v18n5
22:14:32 <mnoqy> taking cocaine every 20 minutes doesn't sound very healthy. cocaine's one of those "bad for you" drugs right.....
22:14:42 <kmc> mnoqy: la cocaína no es buena para su salud
22:14:50 <mnoqy> what does that mean!
22:15:02 <kmc> the cocaine is not good for your health
22:15:27 <mnoqy> ah..yeah that's what i've read
22:15:47 <shachaf> mnoqy: but have you tested it
22:15:51 <Bike> kmc: ok i'm ten words into this article and what the fuck.
22:16:00 <mnoqy> why would i "do" something that's bad for me!
22:16:14 -!- nooodl has quit (Client Quit).
22:16:16 <shachaf> kmc: Oh, I did read that article!
22:16:31 <shachaf> mnoqy: what if """""""""""the man" is trying to keep you down
22:16:32 <mnoqy> "lsd palace" sounds cool
22:16:47 <Bike> is... "goth stripper" a thing? i didn't realize
22:16:48 <kmc> crystal castles
22:17:10 <mnoqy> these drug puns are pretty bad
22:17:39 <kmc> i think most people who've ever taken LSD probably take it less often than once a year
22:18:04 <Bike> fun fact there are no good drug puns
22:18:09 <mnoqy> what's up with these quotes
22:18:13 <HackEgo> 1031) <ais523> in soviet russia, what sees you is what gets you
22:18:39 <shachaf> oerjan: did you see my CCCP 'russian reversal'
22:18:41 * oerjan swats doesthiswork for breaking the quote format in privmsg -----###
22:19:04 <kmc> does HackEgo's hg repository remember what IRC nick is associated with each change?
22:19:44 <shachaf> oerjan: Can we make a rule that you don't mess with the quotes in /msg "period"
22:20:05 <kmc> LSD is one of the most valuable bulk substances by mass
22:20:38 <olsner> does wikipedia have a list for that?
22:20:49 <shachaf> http://www.cockeyed.com/science/gallon/liquid.html
22:21:04 <shachaf> kmc: do you manufacture lsd
22:21:20 <kmc> can't chemistry
22:21:36 <Bike> "acre foot". this is new to me
22:21:37 <shachaf> kmc, web developer by day, lsd manufacturer by night
22:21:52 <Bike> He could be like that Grateful Dead dude.
22:22:00 <Bike> Except, well, not.
22:22:25 <oerjan> shachaf: assuming you don't simply mean quote 1031 above
22:22:39 <shachaf> 05:34 <Botje> mushi: are you seriously expecting me to figure out _your_ problem like this?
22:22:48 <shachaf> 05:34 <Botje> mushi: go to bed, take another look tomorrow.
22:22:52 <shachaf> <mushi> its dude in a hour~
22:23:29 <Bike> where the hell did she get that blood...
22:23:43 <olsner> ... from a children's hospital
22:24:05 <Bike> also i didn't know they even bagged whole gallons of blood
22:24:28 <olsner> more space efficient than keeping the blood in humans
22:24:43 <Bike> kmc: I think you and elliott should start a band, move to thailand, and start an LSD/cobra venom factory.
22:25:00 <shachaf> Bike: uhhhh scorpion venom is a billion times more valuable
22:25:25 <kmc> what concentration of LSD is that
22:25:28 <Bike> yeah so it's probably a billion times harder to make
22:25:31 <Bike> think this through bro
22:25:36 <kmc> itt supply and demand
22:25:38 <shachaf> Bike: well why not make water
22:25:51 <shachaf> it's like a billion trillion times easier to make
22:25:59 <oerjan> Bike: thailand is one of the places that has the death penalty for drug trade isn't it?
22:26:01 <kmc> imo water is pretty hard to make
22:26:04 <Bike> Because to measure it you'd need a whole acre of land to make a foot deep
22:26:08 <kmc> also it doesn't have much nutrients and that's why it's so cheap
22:26:13 <Bike> oerjan: Makes it more exciting.
22:26:40 <shachaf> oerjan: loophole: sell drugs instead of trading them
22:27:06 <oerjan> shachaf: that's the kind of geek-invented loophole that kills geeks
22:27:12 <kmc> i took one freshman chemistry lab, I managed to complete it without breaking all the glassware in one incident or pouring mercury-cobolt mixture down the drain
22:27:15 <kmc> so i did better than many of the students
22:27:38 <kmc> that was one of the most universally despised classes
22:27:40 <shachaf> kmc: You did better than all the other students put together!
22:29:34 <kmc> also despised because it usually started at 9AM
22:30:02 <Bike> sounds like a good time to make toxins
22:30:31 <shachaf> out with the bad, in with the worse
22:30:51 <kmc> new channel motto
22:31:21 <oerjan> <shachaf> oerjan: did you see my CCCP 'russian reversal' <-- now i did -----###
22:31:35 <shachaf> oerjan: HEY what was that for
22:31:59 <oerjan> shachaf: in soviet russia, CCCP swats YOU.
22:32:24 <kmc> CTCP swats you
22:32:35 <Bike> that's my basic experience with ctcp yeah
22:32:53 <kmc> how many gallons of blood does a child have anyway
22:32:55 <kmc> asking for a friend
22:33:11 -!- carado has joined.
22:33:17 <shachaf> kmc: just enough to leave you wanting more
22:33:25 <oerjan> Koen__: is that how many litters of children you need for a gallon of blood?
22:33:56 <Koen__> oerjan: it would be if I could be bothered with those weird units
22:33:56 * kmc can't give blood
22:33:58 <Bike> i should probably knowthis hm
22:34:10 <kmc> yep, too gay
22:34:17 <kmc> which is to say even a little gay
22:34:22 <Bike> yeah it's so bullshit
22:34:30 <kmc> i'll just hang onto my blood then
22:34:34 <Koen__> hey in france it's almost ok for gays to give blood
22:34:36 <kmc> fine by me
22:34:37 <Bike> don't worry i'll donate more blood
22:34:42 <Bike> just throw sacks of it at them
22:34:48 <kmc> it's one less thing to feel guilty about not giving
22:34:49 <shachaf> you can donate kmc's blood
22:35:00 <shachaf> are vampires allowed to donate blood
22:35:19 <oerjan> human immortality virus
22:35:20 <kmc> i should start privately banking my own blood like cosmo kramer or gus fring
22:35:30 <Koen__> not if they've changed sucking partners in the previous three months shachaf
22:35:34 <Bike> probably depends on whether they've been to romania
22:35:46 * kmc has been to Transylvania!
22:35:51 <kmc> i rode a horse there
22:35:54 <kmc> it was really nice
22:36:18 <kmc> ...t that i'm aware of
22:36:42 <shachaf> absence of presents is not presence of absents, hth
22:37:50 <shachaf> kmc: btw the last episode of season 4 of breaking bad was good
22:37:55 <Bike> you know i don't even know how that works
22:37:58 <kmc> shachaf: yes
22:38:04 <kmc> shachaf: also all the other episodes
22:38:08 <Bike> how do you donate blood in the UK? does the red cross just go "oh well fuck that mad cow bullshit"
22:38:15 <kmc> shachaf: more or less
22:38:46 <oerjan> Bike: they've just captured all the vegans and put them in blood factories hth
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22:39:13 <Bike> man i would love to visit a blood factory
22:39:29 <shachaf> Bike: twist, you are a blood factory
22:39:43 <shachaf> also most everyone you know
22:40:34 <shachaf> I wish I could go home right now. :-( I probably won't until tomorrow.
22:40:57 <shachaf> But it might be a bad idea.
22:49:52 <oerjan> <shachaf> oerjan: "u'll have to pay me royalties" <-- but i haven't started rounding up royals yet!
22:58:45 * oerjan points the firehose on SgeoOnFire ========================|>
22:59:13 -!- SgeoOnFire has changed nick to SgeoOnWater.
22:59:39 * oerjan throws SgeoOnWater into the freezer
23:00:13 * oerjan waits for this to evolve into disney suing
23:00:40 -!- SgeoOnWater has changed nick to SgeoOnLessDenseW.
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23:13:19 <shachaf> mnoqy: what do you think of axiom k
23:14:11 <mnoqy> equality is weird and i don't like thinking about it
23:14:57 <shachaf> well are you asking whether i'm equal to equality
23:15:58 <kmc> And if you're on fire, you're gonna need some water / And if you're underwater, you're gonna need some air / And if you're in the air, you're gonna need a place to land / And if you're on land, you can come and see my piece of shit band!
23:16:56 <oerjan> to land, perchance to band
23:21:37 <oerjan> <elliott> i will divert funding from the overfunded #esoteric military to this noble research <-- overfunded? it's not even big enough to invade canada yet
23:21:58 <Bike> don't you need infinite money to invade canada
23:22:25 <oerjan> i don't think so, Bike
23:22:25 <shachaf> Bike: only if you use canadian dollars
23:22:30 <mnoqy> invade canada by way of integrating into canadian society and living out a peaceful canadian life and death
23:22:36 <Bike> i mean because Existence Joke
23:23:00 <shachaf> is the joke that canada doesn't exist
23:23:04 <olsner> to invade canada you have to create it first
23:23:10 <oerjan> you'd think a nonexistent country should be easy to invade, but no
23:23:11 <shachaf> um canada definitely exists
23:23:14 <shachaf> you're thinking of england
23:23:58 <oerjan> england exists, at least gatthrow airport
23:24:27 <elliott> i can't deal with how awful gmail's new compose ui is
23:24:35 <oerjan> shachaf: next to dorothy's house?
23:24:46 <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada,_Kansas
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23:26:47 <oerjan> oh the louisiana purchase included most of kansas?
23:27:23 <oerjan> wow that was actually huge
23:27:30 <Bike> the louisiana purchase included most of everything
23:27:43 <Bike> because france had more or less just said half the continent was theirs, and all
23:28:00 <Bike> man that history though
23:28:04 <Bike> "For millennia, the land now known as Kansas was inhabited by Native Americans. In 1803, most of modern Kansas was secured by the United States as part of the Louisiana Purchase. In 1854,"
23:28:16 <Bike> just get those millenia out of the way real quick
23:28:19 <oerjan> wow imagine what history would have been like if that hadn't happened
23:29:11 <oerjan> the us wouldn't even have _got_ to the mexican parts without going through that
23:30:23 <oerjan> current us might have stayed divided between several countries
23:30:38 <Bike> look at the reasons for the louisiana purchase happening, too
23:30:49 <Bike> napoleon wouldn't just get rid of all that for no reason, y'know
23:31:00 <kmc> napoleon gotta get paid
23:31:20 <Bike> well i mean, it's often attributed to the slave revolt in haiti
23:31:53 <Bike> which destroyed much chance of major french colonization since haiti was the breadbasket
23:33:13 <Bike> so, why not sell it off, i guess
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23:36:11 <oerjan> "Louisiana remained nominally under Spanish control until a transfer of power to France on November 30, 1803, just three weeks before the cession to the United States."
23:39:19 <Bike> ~international politics~
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