00:53:55 <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Souls hth
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01:14:41 <Jafet> http://www.kboing.com.br/fotos/imagens/49945052a453d.jpg
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01:29:00 <shachaf> The other day I heard a radio commercial about people who "disguise learning as fun".
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02:02:01 <Jafet> They should have disguised that message better.
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03:01:54 <zzo38> Why do VCRs newer than some certain date cannot record in LP speed?
03:02:42 <Bike> what the hell is a vcr
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03:04:11 <zzo38> I have a VHS/DVD combination, which can record all speeds on DVD but on VHS it won't record LP (but it does support the non-standard VP speed).
03:07:59 <shachaf> zzo38: Why would you use VHS?
03:09:07 <zzo38> shachaf: Some movies we have are on VHS. Also, I use it when I want to record a TV show that I don't need to keep. (If I want to keep the recording, DVD can be used instead.)
03:12:14 <Lumpio-> That's the thing normal people use for recording TV shows these days.
03:13:58 <pikhq_> Lumpio-: You're asking a guy who runs a gopher daemon.
03:14:00 <Lumpio-> It's harder and slower to use and has worse image quality.
03:14:09 <Lumpio-> pikhq_: Yes but he usually has some sort of reasoning for things
03:15:14 <zzo38> The image quality is good enough, although mainly this is we already have VCR/DVD so it can be used. If the recording needs to be permanent, then I will use DVD instead.
03:15:33 <Lumpio-> You just ignored the two other things!
03:16:23 <zzo38> No, it is fast enough, and it isn't harder. Especially this VCR has jet rewind, so it is faster than the other VCR anyways.
03:16:58 <pikhq_> Shame you can't get D-VHS equipment reasonably.
03:19:21 <pikhq_> Though i suppose with Bluray it's irrelevant now.
03:20:49 <zzo38> Well, what I have is good enough. Still, I don't know why they stopped making VCRs that record in LP speed (although for most shows SP is good enough, and we rarely need to record more than one show on a tape at once; it can just be recorded over). It can help though to have LP in case you want to record several TV shows while you are gone and don't want to reduce the quality too much to EP (unless there are enough shows that EP would be better any
03:21:08 <pikhq_> Though amusingly it'd not be if HD-DVD had won.
03:21:23 <pikhq_> (D-VHS had a higher bitrate than HD-DVD? Seriously?)
03:26:13 <zzo38> I didn't know that.
03:28:39 <pikhq_> Yeah. D-VHS had an absurdly high 30Mbps rate.
03:31:14 <zzo38> How can you add index marks to existing recordings in VHS tapes?
03:31:33 <kmc> pikhq_: what codec?
03:31:42 <pikhq_> kmc: MPEG-2, unfortunately.
03:32:00 <pikhq_> So HD-DVD *could* look better than it. Though it could *not*.
03:32:29 <pikhq_> At least MPEG-2 is halfway tolerable at that rate?
03:32:57 <pikhq_> (note, for 1080i and 1080p24 content. Obviously it's overkill at 480i)
03:33:05 <zzo38> Do you like "Worse-Is-Better" software design?
03:33:12 <kmc> i like worse is worse
03:33:26 <pikhq_> Personally, I just believe less is less.
03:33:40 <shachaf> worse isn't better. worse is better than better
03:33:57 <kmc> i believe that features I need are "pragmatic" while features you need are "bloat"
03:34:09 <pikhq_> I believe my stomach is bloated.
03:34:10 <shachaf> perhaps worse is better up to isomorphism
03:34:36 <zzo38> kmc: What software design is that?
03:35:00 <pikhq_> Biggest software is best software?
03:35:12 <kmc> the software that can be good is not the true software
03:37:42 <shachaf> kmc: oh, did you read that book
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03:39:06 <kmc> the one you lent me? no I didn't start yet :(
03:42:50 <Bike> sure, you SAY you want a nervou system, but that's just bloat. My sponges have differing behavior without a nervous system, without bloat
03:48:05 <shachaf> it talks about the tao etc.
03:49:40 <shachaf> kmc: do you need drugz to learn higher category theory
03:50:10 <kmc> i don't know any higher category theory
03:50:14 <kmc> so I cannot speak of this
03:50:55 <Bike> i hear amphetamines help w/ math
03:51:11 <shachaf> Bike: only mathamphetamines do that hth
03:51:12 <kmc> i think erdős was p. upset that people drew this conclusion
03:51:49 <shachaf> anyway it was just a drugz joke
03:51:55 <kmc> is the joke 'higher'
03:52:07 <shachaf> like left adjoint and forgetful functor
03:52:10 <Bike> we need some more in-depth drugz jokes, i feel
03:52:17 <shachaf> i have a ""limited vocabulary"" that intersects drugz and categories
03:52:21 <Bike> they're getting samey, in that they are all the same
03:52:22 <shachaf> given that i don't know much about either one
03:52:33 <kmc> i got a vaporizer today http://www.ploom.com/pax
03:53:47 <kmc> black anodized aluminum shell, "Designed in San Francisco" etched on the back, clearly trying to be Apple
03:53:52 <Bike> i honestly have no idea why someone would need this
03:53:55 <kmc> also it has easter eggs: http://vaporpedia.com/wiki/Pax#Party_Mode
03:53:57 <Bike> i'm great at drugz
03:54:18 <shachaf> kmc: you should help me come up with more categoriez/drugz jokez
03:54:24 <kmc> it vaporizes the active ingredients from tobaccy (or wacky tobaccy) w/o burning the plant material
03:54:24 <Bike> wow you can use it in your car
03:55:00 <kmc> so it's a lot healthier and produces basically no smell, definitely not the awful lingering smoke smell
03:55:09 <Bike> oh good i hate that smell
03:55:31 <shachaf> you can use it in your car / you can use it in a bar / you can smoke it in your house / you can smoke it with your spouse
03:55:37 <shachaf> hmm maybe it's not actually smoking
03:55:57 <kmc> apparently one of the big vape user forums is http://fuckcombustion.com/
03:56:23 <shachaf> To activate: Hold it horizontally in front of you and roll it towards you like 3 times.
03:56:30 <shachaf> i thought this was a wikipedia page at first
03:58:08 <Bike> i like combustion :(
03:58:12 <Bike> i mean, not with drugz. just in general.
03:58:58 <Fiora> I like my "vaporator". it dispenses albuterol sulfate <.<
03:59:20 <Bike> that sounds pretty hardcore
03:59:25 <shachaf> is an electronic version called an "evaporator"
04:02:49 <shachaf> kmc: Oh, can I review Pointless now?
04:03:20 <kmc> yes you can be the first!!
04:03:28 <kmc> https://plus.google.com/115755278795768575583/about
04:04:19 <Bike> it's a realtor called pointless topology?
04:04:23 <shachaf> why is it a "Vacation Home Rental Agency"
04:04:30 <kmc> fucked if i know
04:04:49 <kmc> Bike: it's my house, which decided to register itself as a business for some reason
04:04:58 <Bike> do you get a paycheck
04:05:07 <shachaf> kmc: should i suggest to change it to something
04:05:09 <elliott> can I buy shares in kmc's house
04:05:11 <shachaf> maybe "Housing Cooperative"
04:05:17 <kmc> http://pointlesstopology.com/ look how legit we are
04:05:19 <shachaf> there's no "Housing Coöperative" suggestion
04:05:38 <kmc> the use of twitter bootstrap alone should be worth a $2M seed round
04:05:46 <shachaf> Oops, it wants me to sign in.
04:06:18 <shachaf> hmm, maybe a housing coöperative is something else
04:06:45 <shachaf> actually maybe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Housing_cooperative is ok
04:07:00 <kmc> i've known of other places that are also "n friends living in a house" but actually incorporated and have house bank accounts and a credit card
04:07:14 <kmc> we just buy things individually and then get reimbursed through an accounting system based on a perl script and a makefile
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04:08:19 <shachaf> kmc: I submitted a request to change it to "Housing Coöperative"
04:08:32 <shachaf> Google kept trying to take my ¨ away but I think I managed to submit it.
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04:11:33 <shachaf> maybe i should suggest Working Hours too!!
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04:19:57 <zzo38> How do you make ephemeris program including rotation of Pluto and the other planets of the solar system? Swiss Ephemeris has only the rotation of the Earth, but I want to have the rotation of the other planets too (and of Pluto, which is now properly considered a dwarf planet, but it is still an object in the solar system regardless of what it is called), and possibly even the objects beyond Pluto.
04:20:22 <Bike> what about asteroids
04:21:40 <zzo38> I don't need those for what I am doing, but it would be good for such ephemeris to have asteroids too, so that it can be used for other purposes too.
04:22:04 <Bike> hey, i have a paper on what THC does to your head. neat
04:23:06 <Bike> "There is not a single, elementary manifestation of mental illness that cannot be found in the mental changes caused by hashish..."
04:29:47 <zzo38> I did remove the extra comma by now.
04:30:21 <zzo38> I think I have read somewhere that someone once removed an extra comma to avoid someone being thrown in prison, or something like that.
04:36:04 <Bike> i like how there's an entire class of important endogenuous chemical signals that are called "endocannabinoids" because THC and CBD happen to resemble them enough that a plant can get people high
04:37:08 <shachaf> kmc: Are you going to make udis86 bindings?
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04:41:46 <shachaf> JavaScriptCore uses a conservative GC right now too?
04:41:56 * shachaf is surprised so many things do.
04:42:29 <Bike> i wonder what a liberal GC would be like. data just disappearing everywhere
04:43:14 <shachaf> Er, not JavaScriptCore. I mean SpiderMonkey.
04:54:26 <kmc> communist GC
04:55:26 <Fiora> every object gets the same amount of memory
04:55:40 <Fiora> if it uses more memory than is allocated to it, it gets "garbage collected"
04:56:18 <shachaf> from each object according to its ability, etc.
04:58:17 <Bike> hey kmc do you have any personal reports on the effects of thc on memory
04:59:05 <shachaf> he used to, but then he was left adjoint by a forgetful functor
04:59:12 <shachaf> (you can't blame him -- it was free)
05:13:13 <kmc> what shachaf said
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05:27:33 <ChrisW> Must a machine be able to output any bit string in order to be Turing Complete, or will some subset suffice? I'm considering de Bruijn encoding of closed lambda expressions, where not all bit strings will be able to be generated.
05:28:32 <Bike> i don't see why you'd need all of them. you could have a machine that outputs a bunch of zeroes and then the usual, say
05:29:28 <ChrisW> You mean to say that as long as their is some kind of mapping between the subset of bit strings that can be output and all the possible bit strings, it can be Turing Complete?
05:29:38 <Bike> yeah, i think so.
05:30:04 <Bike> well, i don't know. naturals map to computable bitstrings i suppose, so that's useless
05:30:31 <ChrisW> Are there any restrictions on what that mapping is? I feel like you could cheat by making the mapping function itself Turing Complete
05:30:48 <kmc> the mapping should be computable
05:31:04 <Bike> i'm not sure about "output" either honestly, i mean classic UTMs just have a final tape state
05:31:33 <elliott> the only output you really need is "halt" or "not halt"
05:32:38 <ChrisW> Regarding de Bruijn encodings of lambda expressions, it is possible to count the encodings in sorted order, and construct a table which maps the encodings to their index, where the index is a natural number or bit string
05:33:37 <Bike> just do the usual i guess, have a machine that takes a description of a BCT program or whatever and returns a church encoding of a result, and call it good
05:33:48 <ChrisW> elliott, is that true? I haven't heard that before.
05:34:32 <ChrisW> Bike, I'm not sure I follow that. I know what church numerals are though
05:34:54 <Bike> ChrisW: i mean, the usual "it can do this turing machine thing, so it's turing complete".
05:35:01 <Bike> bct = bitwise cyclic tag, but you could use anything
05:35:23 <Bike> as for halt/not halt, basically you just need to be able to have partially computable functions, which, well, either halt or don't
05:36:59 <Bike> plenty of formalisms don't hve, like, "output", such as lambda calculus which just term rewrites, and that rewriting either has a normal form or doesn't
05:37:14 <ChrisW> Simulate BCT in order to prove Turing Completeness? I'm pretty sure Jot is Turing Complete, but I'm just wondering how to translate the resulting lambda expression into any possible bit string
05:37:38 <ChrisW> Yes, lambda calculus is exactly what I'm using
05:37:42 <Bike> why bother doing that
05:37:58 <ChrisW> The input is a bit string, and I would like the output to be a bit string as well
05:38:01 <Bike> lambda calculus doesn't "output" and has no bit strings at all and there's no doubt bout it being turing complete, see
05:38:47 <ChrisW> Couldn't you convert the resulting expression into a bit string using de Bruijn encoding to produce "output"?
05:38:50 <Bike> if you want to be able to output any bit string you could just define the map from encoded lambda expressions to naturals, nothing wrong with that
05:39:02 <Bike> yeah, but what's the point of calling that "output"
05:39:12 <Bike> you could also say it "outputs" the unencoded text
05:39:41 <ChrisW> Ok, thanks. By unencoded text you mean the lambda expression?
05:40:11 <ChrisW> I simply find it nice and symmetric to output the same form of data as the input, that is binary
05:40:26 <Bike> suit yourself. i'd just do the coding then.
05:40:42 <Bike> mapping to the naturals allows any bitstring, obviously
05:41:00 <ChrisW> Are you familiar with Jot? Every possible bit string is a valid program.
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05:41:14 <ChrisW> Yeah, that's probably the only way to do it
05:41:44 <Bike> not familiar with jot, sorry
05:42:46 <Bike> but since partial computable functions are enumerable you could define any formalism like that by having an encode natural to program step first
05:44:11 <Bike> there's certainly no notion of "bitstrings" in the old style math; i mean, turing machines can have N states, not just 2, obviously
05:44:30 <Bike> binary just happens to work "pretty well" with electromechanics
05:44:52 <ChrisW> Ah, basically it converts all "1"s into the terms "S K" and all "0"s into precedence operators for application. For example, "101" translates to "S K (S K)". Interestingly, the S and K combinators individually can be constructed using the bit strings "11111000" and "11100" respectively, which essentially proves Turing Completeness right there.
05:45:10 <ChrisW> What exactly is a partial computable function?
05:46:02 <Bike> sounds like you could use some basic computability class, lemme see if i can find something nice
05:46:53 <Bike> basically, a partial computable function is something a turing machine can do; or something µ-recursive; or a lambda expression; or any number of things like that
05:47:20 <Bike> intuitively you can think of it s something an idealized computer can do, i guess, you already have some idea of that
05:47:35 <Bike> and that includes not halting, which is what the "partial" is for; a total computable function "always halts"
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05:49:42 <Bike> unfortunately i mostly learned computability from wikipedia and dicking around, but "Kolmogorov Complexity and Applications" had a pretty nice review; i could dig through it's bibliography for something dedicated if you want
05:50:01 <Bike> you probably don't need much if you already understand how SK works and all.
05:50:12 <Bike> and de bruijn encoding and all these other things. sorry if i'm bugging you, on that note
05:52:10 <ChrisW> I'm not sure if I'm equipped to understand most of that. And really all I want to do is write some nifty Jot programs like a Fibonacci generator perhaps. I wrote an interpreter for Jot in Python, and I have been working on some code which converts Python's internal lambda structures into strings like (\ab.a (b a))
05:53:15 <Bike> hopefully "all of that" is equipment for helping you understand :)
05:55:33 <ChrisW> heh, I say that because I only started learning about lambda calculus a week ago, and scraping the Internet for this stuff isn't as easy as I thought it would be
05:56:07 <kmc> do you want some recommendations for computability / complexity theory books
05:57:10 <ChrisW> I'm not sure how deep into this stuff I really want to get. It's just a hobby of mine once in a while
05:59:48 <Bike> well, it can be nice to know where to look if you get interested later
06:00:14 <ChrisW> that's true, what do you recommend?
06:01:56 <kmc> _Introduction to the Theory of Computation_ by Sipser and then _Computational Complexity_ by Papadimitriou
06:02:02 <kmc> i really enjoyed both books
06:02:18 <Fiora> Scott Aaronsons blog has some interesting posts
06:02:25 <Fiora> there's also the complexity zoo wiki and stuff?
06:02:27 <kmc> they're both nicely self-contained but the latter covers a lot more stuff and is generally more challenging so I suggest both in order
06:03:18 <kmc> does Complexity Zoo have content beyond a listing of complexity classes?
06:03:42 <Fiora> I'm not sure? I use it as a reference mainly
06:03:47 <Fiora> like when something I read says like
06:03:56 <Fiora> and I'm like oh gosh what the heck is that
06:04:15 <kmc> it's complementary to the textbooks in that way
06:05:36 <kmc> shachaf: should I read the HoTT book
06:05:47 <kmc> or should I read the Smullyan book first
06:06:10 <Bike> complexity zoo hs cite doesn't it
06:10:02 <Bike> i guess papers aren't really that friendly, though.
06:12:04 <kmc> both of those textbooks are really good as far as presenting the field in a logical order from 'first principles' and explaining how things work and such
06:12:27 <kmc> i think just reading complexity zoo and research papers would be... challenging
06:14:28 <kmc> Erie Gauge War would be a good name for a band
06:15:20 <Bike> are your last two messages related
06:15:35 <Bike> and yeah i don't een understand most of complexity zoo >_>
06:16:08 <kmc> isn't most of complexity zoo like ultra special purpose stuff from someone's PhD thesis that five people in the world understand
06:16:28 <Bike> i have an addiction to such stuff. it's a problem
06:16:45 <kmc> remember when you could get a PhD just for inventing an esolang and then proving it turing complete
06:17:25 <Bike> now you have to invent a recursively enumerable family of esolangs and prove them monotonically increasing from presburger arithmetic to turing complete in the limit
06:17:28 <Bike> imo kids these days
06:18:31 <kmc> http://coq.inria.fr/V8.1/faq.html#htoc4
06:19:12 <Bike> huh, presburger evaluators have to have a worst case runtime that's doubly exponential. v. prctical
06:19:46 <Bike> "On the other hand, a triply exponential upper bound on a decision procedure for Presburger Arithmetic was proved by Oppen (1978)."
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06:55:03 <zzo38> I like the old rule of mana burn in Magic: the Gathering cards. Such as, make up a card like: {T}: Add {WUBRG} to your mana pool. This mana is unusable.
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07:02:12 <shachaf> kmc: i haven't read the HoTT book :'(
07:05:29 <shachaf> how about read both concurrently
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07:33:52 <Jafet> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belt-sander_racing
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07:34:28 <fizzie> "-- the growing field of power tool drag racing --"
07:34:31 <mnoqy> the growing field of power tool drag racing--yes
07:35:20 <shachaf> how come you're never here anymore
07:35:41 <mnoqy> is this the part where i sleep in the daytime or the part where i just don't say things
07:36:19 <mnoqy> recently, to avoid the heat
07:36:24 <mnoqy> it's much nicer to be awake at night
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13:28:18 <nerflils> Decided to write a little hacking/programming puzzle: Step 1: http://pastebin.com/TyV4Eqpa
13:28:40 <nerflils> decode that moves onto step 2, then step 3, 4 etc. etc.
13:28:50 <oerjan> hi person who cannot keep to one nick
13:30:50 <oerjan> i don't mind your puzzles though, although they're not my kind.
13:31:19 <nerflils> oerjan: This si more lateral thinking :)
13:33:43 <nerflils> oerjan: Get's more challenging :)
13:33:44 <oerjan> hm reminds me of the time i made a christmas crossword for the local gamer's club member magazine. i don't think anyone managed to solve that either. or maybe they just didn't say. and maybe i should have posted the solution in a later number, hm...
13:35:02 <oerjan> let's just say not everyone is good at estimating difficulty of things you make yourself.
13:35:27 <nerflils> What do you think of the challenge though?
13:35:53 <oerjan> i said it's not my kind. encryption seems too random for me.
13:36:06 <nerflils> oerjan: How is base64 random? :P
13:36:31 <oerjan> ok i guess i can see that it's base64
13:37:03 <nerflils> step 3: http://i.imgur.com/FX3fAd7.png
13:37:33 <oerjan> hey no spoilers now you've just convinced me to try a bit :P
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14:39:01 <nooodl> nerflils: mmm i'm solving it
14:39:13 <nerflils> it anagrams to "I am Lord Voldemort"
14:39:28 <nooodl> jeez stop spoiling your own damn riddle
14:39:35 <nooodl> i decoded the base64 now i'm trying to figure out what it means
14:40:30 <nooodl> what kind of solution am i supposed to be looking for here btw
14:41:51 <nerflils> like what comes after the pastebin.com/
14:42:21 <nooodl> oooh i was looking at the solution then, trying to figure out what it meant
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14:58:13 <Taneb> This time, I am going to practise before entering a SSBB contest
14:58:27 <nooodl> i think i found out how to apply the "tom marvolo riddle" clue to the base64 but it's not working so i probably need to use the integral thing somehow
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15:05:44 <Taneb> 9/0 and I'll handicap myself
15:05:50 <nerflils> nooodl: So you think you have figured it out? ;)
15:06:29 <nooodl> maybe. no idea what to do with the value i got from the integral
15:07:38 <nooodl> for the other two lines -- the second line refers to DEFLATE doesn't it?
15:08:07 <nooodl> so i tried to zlib.decompress the string i get when decoding the third line but it's not working :<
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15:43:33 <nooodl> the first clue is much too vague. i assume it's the tripledes key, but
15:43:46 <nooodl> -0.212611? 0.212611? 212611?
15:44:15 <nooodl> also how was i even supposed to know about it being triple DES?
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16:34:43 <Bike> say foo x:xs = foo xs, foo [] = "who cares"; is foo [1..] guaranteed to be bottom?
16:35:32 <comex> what else would it be?
16:36:09 <Bike> "who cares", due to a liberal optimizer
16:37:12 <pikhq_> That... cannot possibly be correct
16:38:18 <Bike> well, i can't think of why you'd want bottom, so i'm wondering.
16:38:35 <pikhq_> Infinite loops are one form of bottom.
16:38:45 <nerflils> Anyone able to solve the puzzle? :P
16:39:22 <Bike> yeah, but there's no side effects so why would you want that, is what i'm wonderin
16:39:45 <pikhq_> As specified it does not terminate.
16:39:52 <pikhq_> Therefore it shouldn't.
16:42:32 <Bike> hm... maybe you could want that as a sentinel so that a later summing doesn't eat memory with bignums, or something weird but conceivable like that
16:43:07 <oerjan> as specified it's a syntax error hth
16:43:29 <oerjan> (needs parentheses around x:xs)
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16:43:54 <Deewiant> I guess the question here is: what breaks if you assume that all lists are finite, other than some bottoms becoming something else
16:45:11 <Bike> the question i have is actually just to what extent if any are bottoms allowed to become something else.
16:46:08 <oerjan> Bike: foo x `seq` whatever would be a reasonable way to force spine strictness of a list, which can be useful.
16:46:39 <Bike> yeah that's what i meant (assuming spine strictness means finity)
16:47:16 <oerjan> it means that every cons cell has been _evaluated_.
16:47:30 <oerjan> which requires finiteness, but is something more.
16:47:57 <Bike> is that something more distinguishable, other than timing or something like that
16:47:58 <oerjan> well except there's no way to ensure finiteness without evaluating all the cons cells.
16:48:38 <Bike> the static analyzer could hypothetically do some analysis couldn't it
16:49:07 <Bike> [1..n] is finite (or bottom) and so on
16:49:22 <nerflils> Who can solve this? http://pastebin.com/WG0mSe6L
16:49:44 <Bike> please rephrase in the form of haskell ephemera
16:49:58 <Bike> wow i can't even read this, fuc.
16:50:08 <oerjan> Bike: anyway the rule in haskell is that recursions are defined as their denotationally least fixpoint, which is bottom if bottom _is_ a solution to the equation.
16:50:17 <Gracenotes> it is true that Haskell gets a lot of its performance out of aggressive inlining (whole-function-call-optimization, from the point of view of functions being called...)
16:50:37 <Bike> how's the order defined exactly?
16:51:40 <Gracenotes> Bike: scroll down for the pretteh graphs http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Haskell/Denotational_semantics
16:54:03 <Bike> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/File:List-graph.png oh ok got it.
16:54:08 <Bike> kinda sad i understand that.
16:57:15 <oerjan> "There is a mistake, ():[] appears twice. Only the one marked with a red ellipse is correct, the other one should be ():\perp."
16:58:03 <Gracenotes> So Haskell evaluation would be monotonic in this lattice, or something
16:58:32 <Gracenotes> which is actually a pretty boring statement
16:58:55 <Bike> well it was a boring and pedantic queestion on my part to begin with, so that works
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18:33:06 <FreeFull> According to http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Abbreviations HTH stands for Hope This Helps. I like Holy Toe Help or whatever it was better though.
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18:43:53 <nerflils> Who can solve this puzzle? http://pastebin.com/WG0mSe6L
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19:07:08 <zzo38> What would be the smallest Turing-complete sequent calculus?
19:07:28 <nerflils> Step 1: http://pastebin.com/TyV4Eqpa step 2: http://pastebin.com/kKn0mNNA step 3: http://i.imgur.com/FX3fAd7.png step 4: http://pastebin.com/WG0mSe6L
19:08:11 <zzo38> Why don't you post the URLs for raw access instead?
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19:47:49 <Taneb> I really need to get out of the habit of opening and closing my CD tray
19:48:50 <fizzie> As far as habits go, that really doesn't sound like the most destructive of them.
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19:53:01 <Taneb> Just did it while watching a movie
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19:53:32 <Bike> did it again while maintaining the network
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20:01:40 <Bike> http://laughingsquid.com/terrible-jpeg-compression-transforms-the-tragedy-of-romeo-and-juliet-into-tej-uqahdfsmenolcr-dlculfgr/ cute
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20:03:06 <elliott> Bike: I was typing a lame joke assuming that the URL just cut off after "into" and that the rest was a base 26 identifier type thing
20:03:07 <elliott> good thing I clicked first.
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20:06:32 <Sgeo> I have lost every game I have played on FICS, apparently
20:06:33 <Sgeo> http://ficsgames.org/cgi-bin/search.cgi?player=Sgeo&action=History
20:06:43 <Sgeo> At least the recorded ones
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20:24:25 <Taneb> Well, I've watched the Dark Knight
20:24:39 <Taneb> Tuesday night I'll watch Rises
20:32:09 <Taneb> Oh god I'm crying at Batman again
20:34:20 <Bike> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Erill_2011_EBM_Conference_Researchsome.png
20:34:29 <Taneb> Bike, why does Batman make me cry
20:34:49 <Taneb> Why can't the franchise be more like the Avengers and kinda cheery
20:34:52 <Taneb> That would be nice
20:35:03 <Bike> well batman is all about grittiness and sadness.
20:35:09 <Bike> you may recall that his parents are deeeeeead
20:35:29 <Taneb> But so are Iron Man's
20:35:38 <Taneb> Not quite deeeeeead
20:36:53 <Bike> iron man also works in the bright and cheery real world rather than gotham, land of darkness and not having a sun
20:37:33 <Taneb> "The definition of home use excludes the use of this DVD at locations such as... oil rig"
20:38:20 <Bike> but people live on oil rigs........
20:38:28 <olsner> just because you're at sea you shouldn't think you can simply watch DVDs you bought
20:41:47 <Taneb> In other news, I cannot wait for Thor 2
20:42:03 <Taneb> Or about half a dozen other movies coming out this year
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21:05:48 <zzo38> Does anyone on any channel of the IRC can answer my questions about the ephemeris?
21:06:18 <Taneb> I don't even know what the ephemeris
21:07:49 <zzo38> I was asking how to make/acquire the program to make ephemeris which is also including not only the position of the planets but also the rotation of planets (including Pluto).
21:08:35 <Taneb> Relative to the sun?
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21:11:21 <zzo38> I mean the rotations around their own axis. The positions can be relative to anything as long as it is consistent, although the position of the Sun still needs to be included, also relative to the same thing (it could be the Sun itself (in which case the Sun's coordinates are zero), or the barycenter, for example).
21:12:07 <Taneb> Well, you can approximate it with ellipses
21:12:39 <Taneb> But thanks to chaos theory and that it'll break down after a few thousand years or so
21:13:49 <Taneb> Well, it doesn't. but something else did, and I mayswell share this with you
21:13:59 <Taneb> I need to update my lists of things I need to thing
21:14:34 <zzo38> I know there are existing ephemeris such as JPL and Swiss Ephemeris (which will use data files and then interpolate), although I don't think Swiss Ephemeris can calculate the rotation of anything other than the Earth (neither can Astrolog; it will always display geocentric houses).
21:15:29 <Taneb> Do you also want to trace the path of the Galilean moons and possibly other moons too?
21:16:25 <zzo38> It would be a good idea to have them.
21:19:54 <zzo38> In what I am doing though, they aren't as important as calculating the rotation of Pluto.
21:20:05 <Taneb> I am going to sleep now
21:20:19 <Taneb> I will go on an adventure
21:21:13 <Taneb> I will embark on a train to the far-off city of Newcastle
21:21:25 <Taneb> From where I shall walk south, into the heart of Gateshead
21:22:50 <Taneb> When I get there, I shall receive a temporary boon in the form of clothing
21:23:05 <Taneb> And I'll play some Guitar Hero and Super Smash Bros and what have you
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22:16:22 <tswett> My next esoteric programming language shall be called ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,.
22:16:35 <tswett> > length ",,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,"
22:16:39 <tswett> Yeah. ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,.
22:17:00 <tswett> Now, what shall it be?????????????????????????????????
22:17:31 <tswett> I dunno. Probably something based on the idea of conservation of resources.
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22:43:18 <oerjan> ooh it has dropped http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0717/463097-trinity-college-dublin-pitch-experiment/
22:46:01 <Bike> Finally, my pitch swimming pool will reach fruition.
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