00:00:23 <luserdroog> I've since come up with a syntax and execution model. It operates byte-wise, as a TAG-system, applying function trees upon the program input stream.
00:01:01 <luserdroog> rough draft interpreter (doesn't implement function trees): http://codepad.org/wqOOdShZ
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00:02:27 <luserdroog> But trying to implement anything is exceedingly painful. I can't seem to make an adder since everything operates bitwise.
00:02:56 <luserdroog> There's no nice way to propagate data from one bit to another.
00:04:27 <luserdroog> Maybe it needs an association mechanism so you can store functions in variables and not have to spell everything out literally. ... Then I could make a standard library with adders and stuff....
00:05:55 <luserdroog> string-rewriting seems much more tedious than stack-based systems. I'm not sure if there's anything I can do to alleviate that with fancy syntax.
00:06:47 <luserdroog> So that's the mess that brought me here! Not sure if I really have a question in there ... :)
00:08:14 <luserdroog> Currently, to make a loop, you have to make a quine. :)
00:08:31 <oerjan> well that much isn't so unusual in esolangs
00:09:03 <oerjan> i'm too tired to understand yours right now
00:09:38 <oerjan> have you seen /// by the way
00:10:01 <oerjan> (string rewriting + making quines are the bread and butter of it)
00:10:25 <luserdroog> I see. I didn't work with it enough to realize that.
00:11:44 <luserdroog> Of itself, that doesn't seem too terrible. ... But I'm not even sure how to do it with my language as currently defined.
00:12:21 <luserdroog> I suppose I should let the unconscious work on it for a while.
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00:25:26 <Sgeo> Two blocks of code, A and B, where B has a comment implying it needs to be below A. I decide B needs to be above A. The meaning of one of B's lines changes, and the comment needs to change... but the line in question still means what I need it to mean, even though it's something different from what it originally meant
00:26:15 <Phantom__Hoover> you pick the most bizarre points in a problem to resort to irc Sgeo
00:26:36 <Sgeo> I wasn't asking for IRC's assistence
00:26:48 <Sgeo> I was noting something funny that happened
00:27:00 <kmc> that is pretty cool
00:27:29 <Sgeo> I think I don't know if I should have made the change though, before the change was what got QAed, although I felt it was less correct
01:08:55 <coppro> does anyone else sometimes use 'mv /path/to/file/name_{old,new}'
01:09:08 <shachaf> isn't that the standard thing
01:09:28 <kmc> that's good yes
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01:09:34 <kmc> KMC Seal of Approval
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01:10:33 <kmc> shachaf: i've started doing rm -fr instead of rm -rf
01:10:47 <kmc> what's with that
01:11:11 <FireFly> I use {,~} and {~,} with mv rather often
01:11:43 <kmc> you mean République française?
01:12:48 <oerjan> coppro: i keep using that on HackEgo, anyway.
01:13:10 <oerjan> (usually when someone's misnamed a wisdom entry)
01:13:15 <Taneb> Anyone know a website on group theory that's like, "Here's an interesting starting point, see where you can go!"
01:16:57 <oerjan> Taneb: now i'm reminded of oskar's cube
01:17:22 <oerjan> i played it on the web many years ago
01:18:01 <Phantom__Hoover> Taneb, find out how the orbit-stabiliser theorem works or something, that got me hooked
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01:24:36 <oerjan> bah i found a java applet (perhaps the same as years ago) and IE's security settings refuse to run it.
01:25:09 <oerjan> or perhaps it's actually malware, who knows.
01:26:54 <Taneb> type Lens s t a b = forall f. Functor f => (a -> f b) -> s -> f t
01:27:04 <oerjan> lambdabot: you have competition
01:27:32 <Sgeo> Blah, I don't think Racket has convenient functors
01:28:47 <Sgeo> I can't just use the function functor, can I? For some reason I was thinking of a lens as a modifier
01:29:13 <Sgeo> I have put 0 thought as to what having f be (-> r) would mean in this case
01:30:59 <Taneb> You could use data-lens style lenses?
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01:36:28 <kmc> (-> r) is a contravariant functor isn't it? unless you meant ((->) r)
01:36:31 <kmc> "best syntax ever"
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02:25:12 <Sgeo> I should totally attempt to write a maccall for Racket
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02:34:49 <kmc> what's that
02:42:32 <Sgeo> funcall for macros... evaluates the first expression in the transformer environment then applies the result to the rest of the body of the maccall
02:42:47 <Sgeo> No idea if that's actually a good idea
02:43:49 <Sgeo> http://docs.racket-lang.org/reference/syntax-util.html?q=syntax-ev&q=eval#%28def._%28%28lib._racket%2Fsyntax..rkt%29._syntax-local-eval%29%29
02:43:53 <Sgeo> syntax-local-eval
03:02:00 <Sgeo> Hmm. I think the Racket core language is well specified in terms of its syntax, but not what primitive functions exist :(
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03:13:37 <Sgeo> http://codu.org/webmidi/gen/15570254295359/15570254295359.ogg
03:13:50 <Sgeo> Is this some well-known classical music that I just never thought of in those terms?
03:13:57 <Sgeo> Or some other well-known piece?
03:16:32 <quintopia> from gregor? i wouldn't think so...
03:17:23 <Sgeo> The .ogg was generated by his WebMIDI service
03:27:18 <kmc> Sgeo: what's funcall
03:28:01 <Sgeo> kmc: Common Lisp function that lets you call value that represents a function
03:28:34 <Sgeo> Assume compose is adequately defined. ((compose f g) 1) won't work, but (funcall (compose f g) 1) does
03:28:40 <Sgeo> The first item in the list has to be a function name
03:28:49 <Sgeo> (I think literal lambdas count as function names)
03:31:29 <luserdroog> Sgeo: parts of that music reminds me of Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition
03:34:34 <Bike> Sgeo: there's a special case to allow ((lambda ...) ...), yeah.
03:34:38 <quintopia> Sgeo: thanks for reminding me how bad midi instruments on webmidi sound
03:34:50 <Sgeo> quintopia: blame sonivox
03:34:51 <kmc> Sgeo: oh this is a Lisp-2 thing?
03:35:04 <kmc> #justlisp2things
03:35:18 <Bike> though it's sometimes nice to do (map #'funcall ...) and such.
03:35:29 <kmc> what's the advantage of lisp-2 again
03:35:37 <quintopia> Sgeo: was it made in canada? its not worth laying blame unless i can blame canada
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03:35:54 <Bike> kmc: better for small talk than the weather
03:35:57 <Sgeo> Bike: In Haskell, you do have ($)
03:36:34 <Bike> i didn't mean that was special to cl o'course
03:36:48 <Sgeo> So I guess funcall isn't totally a Lisp-2 thing, but it's not as needed in a *-1
03:37:08 <Sgeo> Or, well, not needed for all the use-cases CL needs it for, anyway
03:37:22 <Bike> i can think of some reasons to want it in kernel, but yeah
03:37:28 <Bike> not a terribly interesting function
03:37:53 <Sgeo> kmc: Well, one is no overlap with non-hygienic macros between functions, which aren't often letted, and other lexical variables
03:38:05 <Sgeo> Not sure if that's the one most CLers would point to
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04:26:20 <kmc> "One-person protests are legal in Russia, and the two activists holding signs were spaced far enough apart that neither was arrested."
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04:26:53 <Bike> admirable planning!
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04:55:46 <shachaf> kmc: -fr is the scow of rm options
04:56:38 <shachaf> kmc: i bought some KMC brand card sleeves
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05:02:57 <shachaf> as in the worst specimen of something
05:03:38 <kmc> why is it the worst
05:03:49 <kmc> why is it worse than -rf or -r -f or --recursive --force
05:04:01 <kmc> Recursive Force is my new superhero team name
05:04:38 <shachaf> why is "xzvf" the right order for tar options?
05:04:54 <kmc> everyone knows that
05:05:21 <kmc> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dsfjdssdfsd -- The dsfjdssdfsd list provides a venue for discussion of randomness in IETF protocols
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05:23:05 <oklopol> shachaf: as in garbage scow!
05:24:59 <oklopol> i promise to use it someday
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05:36:40 <newsham> someone should write a fun esolang on top of https://microcorruption.com/login
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06:40:20 <kmc> hi newsham
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08:24:23 <oklopol> hmm, wonder if i said a lot of random stuff here, accidentally put my mouse in the top left corner again and all the programs formed a grid
08:24:27 <oklopol> this time i can't get back
08:24:42 <oklopol> so now i can use all the programs at once, but i can't exactly see what i'm doing
08:24:46 <quintopia> int-e: i just manually rediscovered the 62816281 oscillator :P
08:25:16 <quintopia> oklopol: your example for Clue looks a lot like Wouter's example from the screenshot of Aardappel
08:25:36 <quintopia> i think we should have a battle of the programming-by-example languages
08:25:49 <oklopol> guess i have to take the battery out because the power button just opens a "shut this system now" window and the mouse doesn't do much
08:25:52 <oklopol> wish i could read your replies
08:26:16 <oklopol> can you write in like huge walls of letter
08:28:38 <olsner> shachaf: I would put z first, or skip it entirely since (gnu) tar autodetects compression
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08:29:16 <olsner> I also always do rm -fr, which apparently is much less common than rm -rf
08:30:11 <oklopol> "<quintopia> oklopol: your example for Clue looks a lot like Wouter's example from the screenshot of Aardappel" it does?
08:30:33 <oklopol> i recall reading some of aardappel's documentation, but i thought it was a much weaker kind of programming by example
08:30:45 <oklopol> like, i never even realized they have something in common
08:30:53 <oklopol> i wonder if i just plagiarized the whole thing
08:31:01 <oklopol> which example are you referring to?
08:31:15 <shachaf> kmc: did you know http://hackage.haskell.org/package/regex-compat-0.95.1/docs/src/Text-Regex.html#subRegex uses a regex to search for backreferences in the replacement string
08:31:43 <shachaf> also the whole haskell regular expression thing is ridiculous
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08:32:12 <Bike> iirc one of the examples in the snobol manual was a snobol grammar, i appreciated that
08:32:27 <kmc> shachaf: you should solve it by making a new api in a new package
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08:33:36 <shachaf> (=~) :: (RegexMaker Regex CompOption ExecOption source, RegexContext Regex source1 target) => source1 -> source -> target
08:34:03 <kmc> yeah I remember complaining about that a lot
08:34:13 <kmc> shachaf: https://twitter.com/MuseumOfTypes
08:35:46 <oklopol> quintopia: the big difference is that in aardappel, you actually describe exactly what the program flow is; it's just written in terms of concrete examples. the point of clue is that there is no direct way to control program flow.
08:36:08 <oklopol> aardappel actually makes a lot of sense; not that i have any idea whether it's any nicer to program in than clue.
08:37:17 <oklopol> (of course, in practice, you program in clue by splitting your function into a million subfunctions, but in theory that's only because my compiler is kind of crappy)
08:40:04 <oklopol> oh cool, kate has sessions
08:40:28 <oklopol> maybe next time my computer throws a fit i won't have to spend half a day opening files
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09:16:12 <quintopia> ^tel nooodl 434043 is actually infinitely extendable. 4340434043 or 43404340434043 etc. all are period 2.
09:16:20 <quintopia> ^tell nooodl 434043 is actually infinitely extendable. 4340434043 or 43404340434043 etc. all are period 2.
09:16:20 <fungot> I think you mean @tell instead?
09:16:32 <quintopia> @tell nooodl 434043 is actually infinitely extendable. 4340434043 or 43404340434043 etc. all are period 2.
09:16:40 <fungot> quintopia: but you'd expect a comic, but fnord seals help. thanks to the wonderful world of metric units... they're as specific as possible
09:17:44 <fizzie> fungot: What makes a unit more specific?
09:17:45 <fungot> fizzie: i use both hands
09:23:19 <shachaf> kmc: did you see the series of posts starting at http://conway.rutgers.edu/~ccshan/wiki/blog/posts/WordNumbers1/
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10:10:53 <fizzie> @tell Bike "After several years of successful events worldwide, MATLAB EXPO comes to the Nordic region for the first time in 2014." Aren't we lucky?!
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12:48:29 <oerjan> <shachaf> kmc: -fr is the scow of rm options <-- i tried googling if "is the scow of" was a new meme, but in fact there's only two hits, one of which is a literal scow and the other of which is a misspelling.
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12:54:27 <fizzie> I think the second is a misOCRing, actually.
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13:25:22 * oerjan realizes phil foglio writes pretty funny blog posts
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13:51:03 <int-e> http://www.bergfex.at/tirol/wetter/stationen/innsbruck-flughafen/ then.
13:55:13 <Taneb> Should I get myself Purely Functional Data Structures? Hmm
13:57:17 <int-e> Okasaki, hmm. The thesis can be downloaded, maybe look at that and then make your decision.
13:58:53 <Taneb> Okay, I'm ordering it
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14:05:02 <oerjan> oh wait these posts were actually by kaja, not phil.
14:05:37 <oerjan> actually the tagging is confusing.
14:06:13 <int-e> here's hoping that the tagging is acyclic.
14:07:12 <oerjan> well it's tagged phil's blog but uploaded by kaja.
14:08:41 <oerjan> hm i think that does mean phil wrote it, since others are tagged "kaja's blog".
14:23:25 <fizzie> http://sprunge.us/NCKS <- crazy.
14:23:37 <fizzie> (I heard of a similar thing somewhere in I think Sweden.)
14:24:00 <int-e> You said all there is to say about that service.
14:25:36 <fizzie> "The German banks sued Sofort for inducing their customers to break their terms and conditions by disclosing passwords, but the case failed when the Federal competition authorities intervened and told the court that competition with the payment card cartel was welcome."
14:25:40 <fizzie> I don't exactly have a great love for banks in general, but that all still feels weird.
14:26:25 <int-e> So now the banks will go after their customers?
14:27:06 <fizzie> I don't know if they've started to just systematically refuse all fraud claims from anyone who's used that thing.
14:27:17 <int-e> How is a customer supposed to tell the difference between a benign, honest payment proxy service and a dishonest one?
14:27:29 <fizzie> (But it sounds like something they could conceivably do.)
14:28:30 <boily> good terrifying morning!
14:28:45 <int-e> is there an rsync source for the logs?
14:29:17 <fizzie> There was a hg source, wasn't there?
14:29:42 <fizzie> Don't think there's public rsync, but could be wrong.
14:31:02 <HackEgo> ` \ `? \ \ _̰̆̓_̦̻̖͍̟̖̅ͭͭͬ͡_͉̭ͧ͒̐_̯͙̬̬̦̯͂͋͒ͧ͋̋_̴̝̔̉̅ͨ͞ \ ? \ ?? \ @ \ \ \ ⌨ \ ⊥ \ ☃ \ 🐐 \ ̸̸̼͚͇̮͕̳̞̤̜̯̪̪̱̣̠̺̹͍̩̝͚͕͓͚̙͓̪̮̟̜̣͙̪̂ͭ̎̏̔ͦ͒ͪ͌̾ͦͨ̚̚͢͢͠ͅ҉̴̢_͙̣͎͎͙̪̪̝̖͉̟̭̻̥̫̗̱̗͍̳̦̮̟̲̥͔̿̊ͣ̉ͣͪ͒̓̐͊̏ͫ̓̚̚҉̕͜͠͠
14:31:10 <boily> hm... I wanted the special case here.
14:31:15 <HackEgo> ` \ `? \ \ _̰̆̓_̦̻̖͍̟̖̅ͭͭͬ͡_͉̭ͧ͒̐_̯͙̬̬̦̯͂͋͒ͧ͋̋_̴̝̔̉̅ͨ͞ \ ? \ ?? \ @ \ \ \ ⌨ \ ⊥ \ ☃ \ 🐐 \ ̸̸̼͚͇̮͕̳̞̤̜̯̪̪̱̣̠̺̹͍̩̝͚͕͓͚̙͓̪̮̟̜̣͙̪̂ͭ̎̏̔ͦ͒ͪ͌̾ͦͨ̚̚͢͢͠ͅ҉̴̢_͙̣͎͎͙̪̪̝̖͉̟̭̻̥̫̗̱̗͍̳̦̮̟̲̥͔̿̊ͣ̉ͣͪ͒̓̐͊̏ͫ̓̚̚҉̕͜͠͠
14:31:42 <HackEgo> http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/file/tip/wisdom/
14:32:03 <int-e> (Though the banks themselves are not much better. I believe I've mentioned 3dsecure here before ...)
14:32:20 <boily> int-e: you mentioned that horror before.
14:32:34 <boily> meanwhile, IEUAAAAAAAARGH!
14:33:33 <fizzie> I've probably missed any mentions of 3-D Secure, but I see it quite a lot these days. A grandiose name it's got, at least.
14:33:42 <oerjan> sofort sounds like a good idea with horribly insecure implementation.
14:35:32 <oerjan> boily: ah yes, that's quite annoying...
14:36:04 <HackEgo> #!/bin/bash \ if /bin/ls -id "$@" 2>/dev/null | grep -q ^969195 ; then echo 'As the wisdom directory contains many files named after nicks, listing it in public annoys people. Try https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf instead.'; else exec -a ls /bin/ls "$@"; fi
14:36:05 <fizzie> At least the 3-D Secure banking account query comes directly from the bank. Well, when it isn't a phishing scam version, anyway.
14:36:17 <oerjan> `run /bin/ls -id wisdom
14:36:27 <int-e> fizzie: it still looks like cross site scripting and does not play well with NoScript.
14:36:38 <oerjan> `run sed -i 's/969195/790887/' bin/ls
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14:36:43 <HackEgo> As the wisdom directory contains many files named after nicks, listing it in public annoys people. Try https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf instead.
14:37:18 <HackEgo> bin/ls: Bourne-Again shell script, ASCII text executable
14:38:14 <boily> oerjan: the special case is both useful and not at the same time. I think I'm trying to solve the wrong problem here.
14:38:37 <oerjan> int-e: do that and it'll tell you the rsync by notice
14:38:42 <boily> what I'm trying to get is a list of mtimes for wisdom entries, in order to fulfill my duty as a Wisdom Lexicographer.
14:40:26 <oerjan> boily: alas the repository browser is currently broken due to being connected to the old HackEgo server
14:40:31 <oerjan> or something like that
14:43:28 <oerjan> and i think Gregor said the http proxy is also broken, which means basically there's no way to get information out of HackEgo except through irc lines
14:47:01 <int-e> so \ you \ have \ to \ ex \ fil \ trate \ slow \ ly.
14:47:26 <int-e> (I counted the number of syllables and then decided against using actual newlines. I hope you all appreciate my restraint.)
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14:55:06 <boily> int-e: «qu' \ est- \ ce \ qui \ a \ be \ soin \ d'être \ ex \ fil \ tré?» (what needs to be exfiltered? (sorry for the French, it's easier for me to count syllables so.))
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15:13:36 <HackEgo> [U+1E49 LATIN SMALL LETTER N WITH LINE BELOW]
15:14:08 <int-e> `uniencode EQUALITY SIGN WITH LINE BELOW
15:14:08 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: uniencode: not found
15:14:42 <boily> `unicode EQUALITY SIGN WITH LINE BELOW
15:15:45 <int-e> ⪠ (hmm, invisible in my terminal)
15:16:42 <boily> that is one fungot of a character.
15:16:57 <boily> fungot: indeed. a bunch of lines sitting on top of each other.
15:16:57 <fungot> boily: you can implement one in c
15:17:08 <boily> fungot: well, everything can be implemented in C.
15:17:08 <fungot> boily: or maybe talking about government or media schemes *ponder* where did you get their... basics. oh, and it
15:17:31 <boily> fungot: the government ponders and spies on its citizens, as usual. nothing new there.
15:17:31 <fungot> boily: erc doesn't seem to be wanting to restrict yourself that way? :o) so, i'm switching off python
15:17:50 <boily> fungot: Python can't be switched off. Python is the Eternal Light.
15:19:02 <HackEgo> [U+26C3 BLACK DRAUGHTS KING]
15:20:28 <int-e> `unicode SHORT LEFTWARDS ARROW ABOVE RIGHTWARDS ARROW
15:20:44 <HackEgo> [U+2942 RIGHTWARDS ARROW ABOVE SHORT LEFTWARDS ARROW] [U+2943 LEFTWARDS ARROW ABOVE SHORT RIGHTWARDS ARROW] [U+2944 SHORT RIGHTWARDS ARROW ABOVE LEFTWARDS ARROW]
15:21:09 <int-e> I don't get it. Why add 3 of four combinations?
15:22:19 <boily> because the fourth was banned by the [REDACTED] branch of the Second Schism of the East-North-Eastern Quasi-Orthodox Sub-Russian Christian Amalgamated Church.
15:23:18 <int-e> (My fault, I still haven't given up the idea that Unicode is supposed to make sense.)
15:23:36 <elliott__> int-e: when in doubt, the answer is back compat
15:23:43 <int-e> Honestly, I should know better.
15:24:46 <int-e> I should instead marvel at the perfectly regular Braille range.
15:32:50 <int-e> Oh I think screen destroyed those.
15:37:33 <int-e> they were supposed to be dominoes
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15:40:30 <boily> second attempt at dominating: 🀱🀲🀳🀴🀵🀶🀷
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15:41:21 <ion> https://www.quakenet.org/articles/102-press-release-irc-networks-under-systematic-attack-from-governments
15:42:40 <int-e> boily: if you check the logs you'll see that both attempts worked:
15:42:47 <int-e> http://codu.org/logs/log/_esoteric/2014-02-06
15:43:02 <boily> int-e: my local weechat logs seem to bork them, sadly.
15:43:28 <boily> (or probably not. an hexdump has them all.)
15:44:16 <boily> strangely, myndzi 69ed his stick figure.
15:46:20 <ion> They are right in my Weechat buffer and logs.
15:49:34 <boily> something is wrong here. very wrong.
15:50:55 <oerjan> the stick figure looks completely sfw here
15:51:31 <boily> oerjan: it is. the characters ‘6’ and ‘9’ are displayed twice before the body.
15:51:49 <oerjan> ah the log thing is because of some irc codes that don't show up in browsers
15:54:03 <oerjan> you can see the same kind of thing whenever someone `relcomes
15:54:59 <HackEgo> `relcome: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
15:55:07 <oerjan> i assume myndzi's codes are to make the figures look good in more clients
15:55:11 <boily> I am now illuminated.
15:55:30 * FireFly moves the flashlight away from boily's face
15:55:42 <ais523> `relcome doesn't need welcoming, it's been here for ages
15:55:53 <HackEgo> HackEgo: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
15:55:54 <int-e> ^Cnnn[,nnn] switches colors in mIRC, but color 69 is not defined. ^O switches back to the original.
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15:56:03 <int-e> looks like a complete waste of bandwidth to me.
15:56:03 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to ais523.
15:56:22 <FireFly> int-e: presumably to avoid bots interpreting it as a command
15:56:26 * boily grabs back his precious flashlight from FireFly, thank you very much.
15:56:36 <int-e> FireFly: plausible, thanks
15:57:05 <FireFly> But I think just ^O should do it, really
15:57:48 <Johnnie> Minor dilemma...should I switch all of the syntax on my language to Morse Code, or leave it as Amateur Radio Callsigns? (In other words, do I really need to be nice?)
15:57:59 <int-e> FireFly: yes, but given the channel's background, sneaking in a 69 that noone is ever likely to see is kind of cute.
15:59:10 <boily> Johnnie: I like the ARC words.
15:59:34 <boily> int-e: a “thausible” thing is one that is theoretically plausible.
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16:00:19 <FireFly> That seems thausible to me.
16:01:30 <Johnnie> I do too, boily. I think I need to emphasize SPAM/1 as a morse code language somehow. How about this...ARC words in defining syntax and examples, and morse code in coding examples?
16:01:39 <ion> thausiblee
16:02:52 <boily> Johnnie: sounds good.
16:03:41 <boily> `run echo 'A thausiblee is the recipient of a thausible action.' >wisdom/thausiblee
16:04:12 <ion> Also: thausiblee = thausible and only thausible
16:04:39 <Johnnie> I feel like I'm on a roll. I'm going to define more of the mathematics section tonight. I felt I needed to deal with output of large and small numbers first and get that out of the way, at least.
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16:57:27 <quintopia> boily: i was looking at a similar triangles worksheet with a flagpole problem on it and my brain reported the word as "mapole" the first time i scanned it.
16:57:47 <quintopia> boily: you are a breeder of memetic viruses
17:05:40 <FireFly> boily: define the mapole problem
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17:09:51 <quintopia> did you see the queue machine thing i made up?
17:10:30 <quintopia> it seems like the kind of thing you are capable of proving things about and i am woefully poor at
17:15:49 <quintopia> there are lots of links related to it, but all discussion happened right here yesterday .... would have been about 6pm UTC
17:16:16 <quintopia> i was going to make a wiki article but haven't decided on a name yet :P
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17:48:56 <shachaf> oerjan: it is among a small group of people, and they have grown tired of it
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17:58:04 <quintopia> ais523: boily: int-e: which name do you like the best: Copper, Resplicate, Pocopure
18:03:25 <boily> it sounds like res publica. the Res Plicate: the Thing of the Plic.
18:03:58 <boily> also, I'm glad that your brain was memetised :D
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18:09:05 <quintopia> boily: it's a chimæra actually. a portmanteau of slice, replicate, and splice
18:14:00 <quintopia> what do you call a device that does the same thing over and over, and the thing it does may or may not be capable of arbitrary computation
18:14:40 <quintopia> fractran is an example, but the wiki describes it as a "computational model" presumably because it is known to be capable of arbitrary computation
18:15:38 <quintopia> hmm maybe computational model is what i want
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18:17:40 <boily> quintopia: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/thing.png
18:20:31 <FireFly> Did you just design the logo of Resplicate?
18:21:55 <quintopia> while waiting for that to load i became aware of just how crazy the temporal dithering of my monitor on the particular shade of grey firefox uses is
18:22:22 <boily> temporal dithering?
18:22:39 * boily imagines palette dithering techniques applied to the time dimension. “ow.”
18:29:45 <int-e> It's just generalised PCM.
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18:30:09 <FreeFull> quintopia: I don't notice the temporal dithering on my laptop unless I look really closely
18:30:23 <FreeFull> I don't think my old laptop actually does any temporal dithering at all
18:31:06 <int-e> Add a low pass filter (like rod cells and nerves) and you won't notice a thing.
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18:38:26 <quintopia> how to wikify images floating to the right of the text
18:38:37 <ais523> quintopia: I like Copper best
18:39:09 <ais523> also [[Image:foo|thumb|right|description]] IIRC, but I haven't done it for ages
18:39:17 <ais523> so there may be minor mistakes there
18:39:21 * boily mapoles the heretic-ais523 away “Long Live Resplicate!”
18:40:36 <quintopia> nooodl: i mean are you going to vote on the name of the queue game/computational model/language thing
18:40:48 <quintopia> nooodl: which name do you like the best: Copper, Resplicate, Pocopure
18:41:10 <FireFly> I think nooodl 'has to' vote for Pocopure
18:41:29 <quintopia> FreeFull: FireFly: how are you voting
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18:43:38 <quintopia> it also has the best logo. but Copper is the name of my dog, and i have a picture of him wearing my mustache which could also be a good logo!
18:44:30 <FireFly> You make a convincing argument
18:44:53 <HackEgo> spiette: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
18:50:55 <boily> FreeFull: quintopia seems frozen.
18:51:01 <metasepia> KATL 061752Z 00000KT 10SM BKN140 BKN200 BKN250 05/M04 A3026 RMK AO2 SLP256 T00501044 10050 21017 58012
18:51:09 <boily> FreeFull: at least, refrigerated.
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19:15:32 <metasepia> EFHK 061850Z VRB02KT 8000 NSC M10/M11 Q1003 NOSIG
19:17:09 <metasepia> CYUL 061900Z 22011KT 30SM FEW020 FEW120 BKN220 M12/M18 A3024 RMK CF1AC1CI4 CF TR SLP242
19:17:11 <fizzie> I went out and took a picture of the moon, and indeed there were No Significant Clouds.
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19:18:29 <metasepia> --- Possible commands: dice, duck, echo, eval, fortune, metar, ping, yi
19:20:41 <fizzie> Curiously enough, the phase of the moon turned out -- completely by coincidence -- to be pretty much exactly the same it was in 2009 when I did the same thing on a previous camera: just shot the moon with no telescopes or whatnots.
19:24:05 <boily> fizzie: I badly photographed the moon a few years ago: http://boily.deviantart.com/art/Fuzzy-super-harvest-moon-180200524
19:25:46 <fizzie> boily: Here's my old and new ones: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/113389132/Misc/20140206-mooncomp.jpg
19:27:23 <fizzie> You can almost see the US flag! (Not really.)
19:47:11 <int-e> fizzie: that raised an interesting question. cf. http://www.rocketroberts.com/astro/flag_on_moon.htm
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19:55:10 <oklopol> is it possible to prove there's a flag on the moon from the earth?
19:55:38 <fizzie> Does it count if you send (from the Earth) some kind of a thing up there that sends back pictures?
19:55:58 <olsner> depends on what proof you need ... can you even prove that the moon exists from the earth?
19:56:02 <boily> shine a very bright laser on the flag. if it bursts up, then there was one.
19:56:20 <fizzie> They do the "bounce a laser through the retroreflectors" experiment quite often, AIUI.
19:56:21 <oklopol> it seems int-e's link is about exactly this
19:56:41 <fizzie> Though that only proves there's something retroreflectorey up there, and not a flag.
19:57:31 <oklopol> so there's a specific place on the moon that retroreflects?
19:57:41 <oklopol> that sounds like some kind of proof that someone's been there at least
19:58:02 <boily> `echo 'The Moon is an unprovable celestial object that is not very retroreflectorey.' >wisdom/moon
19:58:02 <HackEgo> 'The Moon is an unprovable celestial object that is not very retroreflectorey.' >wisdom/moon
19:58:04 <fizzie> I'm not sure how narrow a beam they shoot.
19:58:08 <boily> `run echo 'The Moon is an unprovable celestial object that is not very retroreflectorey.' >wisdom/moon
19:58:20 <fizzie> But I suppose they do target one of the reflectors when doing that.
19:58:23 <oklopol> perhaps the people who doubt space travel aren't the same people who own space lasers
19:58:24 <fizzie> (There's several of them.)
19:58:55 <int-e> "The typical red laser pointer is about 5 milliwatts, and a good one has a tight enough beam to actually hit the Moon—though it’d be spread out over a large fraction of the surface when it got there." http://what-if.xkcd.com/13/
19:59:09 <fizzie> oklopol: Yes, and the "proof" comes in from of a computer screen where slowly a hump becomes visible in a graph.
19:59:28 <fizzie> oklopol: So obviously the scienceperson doing the experiment is just faking it.
19:59:32 <int-e> (you need a better laser. oh and plenty of power to be able to actually see any of the reflected light.)
19:59:51 <oklopol> fizzie: but in theory, you could do the experiment from scratch in your own home
20:00:26 <fizzie> Well, I suppose. The moneys and the expertise, that is.
20:00:49 <oklopol> it seems unlikely that people find out that you're using the lasers you buy to check for retroreflectors and rig them to shoot lasers that retroreflect from stone if they are being shot toward the moon
20:01:10 <fizzie> Some of the moon landing hoax debunk pages list evidence like that; I think there's photos from moon-orbiting satellites that show some of the landing sites.
20:01:40 <fizzie> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-party_evidence_for_Apollo_Moon_landings
20:02:07 <fizzie> (Of course that's just evidence that the conspiracy is larger.)
20:03:00 <HackEgo> A cocoonspirator is a collaborator wrapped in caterpillar silk
20:03:31 <HackEgo> A racoonspirator is a collaborator wrapped in fur
20:03:50 <boily> the Moon Landings are a mystery wrapped in an enigma wrapped in cosmic butterflies.
20:03:56 <fizzie> `echo 'A coonspirator is a colloquial term for a racoonspirator' > wisdom/coonspirator
20:03:57 <HackEgo> 'A coonspirator is a colloquial term for a racoonspirator' > wisdom/coonspirator
20:04:02 <fizzie> `run echo 'A coonspirator is a colloquial term for a racoonspirator' > wisdom/coonspirator
20:04:24 <int-e> `` echo 'A coonspirator is caterpillar silk wrapped in collaborators.' > wisdom/coonspirator
20:04:47 <boily> going to go with int-e for that one.
20:05:07 <boily> `? conspirabiology
20:05:07 <HackEgo> conspirabiology is where moth colourings form a dot matrix display to send you subliminal messages.
20:05:45 <olsner> sounds like a cococoonspirator
20:06:29 <olsner> and conspirabiology moths are probably postcocoonspirators
20:07:14 <boily> I should subliminatically inspire the Crawl devs to include Conspirabiology Moths in the next release :D
20:07:33 <boily> (now that Suppression Moths are to be removed. bummer.)
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20:08:33 <nooodl> isn't "cocaterpillar silk wrapped in llaborators" how oyou're supposed to make that terrible joke,
20:10:07 <olsner> I think co is like negation and something similar to demorgan's rule applies, but how to apply it is ... not always obvious
20:10:20 <olsner> at least not everything flips all the time
20:10:41 <int-e> nooodl: the opposite category has the same objects as the original one. only the arrows are inverted.
20:11:06 <int-e> and co-properties are usually properties in the opposite category.
20:24:10 <olsner> hmm, did I do something wrong?
20:24:37 <FireFly> I'm guessing `hello is GNU hello
20:24:41 <olsner> fungot: can you haskell
20:24:42 <fungot> olsner: we all knew that already... with pattern matching). its a program which used packrat.
20:24:59 <FireFly> olsner: clearly. They even know how to pattern-match
20:25:09 <coppro> why is reasoning about haskell designs so goddamn hard
20:25:25 <olsner> FireFly: I think fungot's an it
20:25:25 <fungot> olsner: it would be not starting the homework until it is needed. :p anyway, the test is easy to use with w3m? w3?
20:25:45 <FireFly> I just like using singular they
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20:26:10 <olsner> I have noticed them FireFly do like they, they do
20:26:49 <boily> fungot: do you low-pass your retina?
20:26:49 <fungot> boily: ( open file ' ./linguine/ linguine.py': errno 13 permission denied
20:27:01 <fungot> boily: i'm robert fnord. here take a piece of freenode furniture
20:27:43 <FireFly> Good. This channel could use some more furniture
20:29:03 <olsner> `addquote <fungot> I'm Robert Fnord. Here, take a piece of freenode furniture.
20:29:03 <fungot> olsner: ok i loaded srfi 13 now. i should have no syntax errors: lisp! :)
20:29:04 <HackEgo> 1166) <fungot> I'm Robert Fnord. Here, take a piece of freenode furniture.
20:30:07 <fungot> FireFly: yes, somewhat. the s-expr version would take about a page of elisp tutorial
20:30:30 <boily> fungot: are you the George Foreman of furniture now?
20:30:30 <fungot> boily: mmm. so good :)
20:30:36 <boily> fungot: it must be!
20:30:36 <fungot> boily: same thing. the only pleasing parts of the file. what exactly are those continuations that multi passes?
20:30:48 <boily> fungot: I don't understand continuations.
20:30:49 <fungot> boily: everything? :o) where
20:30:57 <boily> fungot: in Haskell. they hurt my brain.
20:30:58 <fungot> boily: if you want the with-alist. code?
20:31:08 <boily> fungot: there is a list?
20:32:12 * boily shakes fungot “WHERE IS THE LIST?”
20:32:54 <ais523> that bot has flood control
20:33:01 <ais523> it'll stop responding to any given person after a while
20:33:16 <olsner> boily apparently doesn't have flood control
20:33:23 <nooodl> fungot: do you hate boily
20:33:23 <fungot> nooodl: did the glass suffer damage? :) ( of course, i could
20:33:25 <boily> ais523: I know. I just like molesting bots.
20:33:35 <boily> `quote damn your mother
20:33:36 <HackEgo> 950) * fungot has joined #esoteric <boily> woohoo! the one and only fungot is back! <fungot> boily: damn your mother! <boily> ok. never saw that one coming.
20:33:48 <nooodl> boily: fungot could hate you!
20:33:49 <fungot> nooodl: in theory, you could simply enter a new definition
20:34:06 <FireFly> Just redefine boily and everything will be fine
20:34:29 <boily> I won't be redefined! that is categorically unthausible.
20:34:40 <fungot> olsner: i guess :) i haven't found them.) is very difficult for math people to let go of sysrq but not of the form
20:35:02 <int-e> > let begin c = c []; push xs x c = c (x:xs); bin (?) (a:b:xs) c = c (b?a:xs); add = bin (+); sub = bin (-); end [v] = v in begin push 1 push 2 push 4 add sub push 3 sub end
20:35:04 <lambdabot> Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: a0 = t0 -> a0
20:35:19 <int-e> oh. monomorphism etc.
20:35:31 <boily> ~eval let begin c = c []; push xs x c = c (x:xs); bin (?) (a:b:xs) c = c (b?a:xs); add = bin (+); sub = bin (-); end [v] = v in begin push 1 push 2 push 4 add sub push 3 sub end
20:35:37 <boily> ~eval let begin c = c []; push xs x c = c (x:xs); bin (?) (a:b:xs) c = c (b?a:xs); add = bin (+); sub = bin (-); end [v] = v in begin push 1 push 2 push 4 add sub push 3 sub end
20:35:38 <metasepia> Error (1): Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: a0 = t0 -> a0
20:36:04 <olsner> I read something about the next GHC disabling MR by default, so it seems finally the future is here
20:36:20 <int-e> > let begin c = c []; push xs x c = c (x:xs); bin (?) (a:b:xs) c = c (b? a:xs); add = bin (+); sub = bin (-); end [v] = v in begin push 1 push 2 push 4 add sub push 3 sub end
20:36:23 <fungot> \o| c.c \o/ ಠ_ಠ \m/ \m/ \o_ c.c _o/ \m/ \m/ ಠ_ಠ \o/ c.c |o/
20:36:23 <myndzi> | c.c.c | ¯|¯⌠ `\o/´ | c.c.c | `\o/´ ¯|¯⌠ | c.c.c |
20:36:23 <myndzi> /< c.c >\ /| | | /| c.c |\ | >\|/| c.c /|
20:36:55 <Slereah_> what's the c.c thing supposed to be
20:36:56 <int-e> implicit arguments make b?a a function application.
20:37:17 <FireFly> Slereah_: a multiocular o, I believe
20:37:19 <int-e> boily: bin (?) ... <-- it was an argument name.
20:37:27 <kmc> Slereah_: it's a combination of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiocular_O and the "c.c" emotiwhatever
20:37:36 <kmc> which is like "eyes looking away in vague disapproval"
20:37:53 <olsner> https://github.com/ghc/ghc/commit/5bda0d08d8fec86433917b65a93836d2372a5b5c
20:38:02 <olsner> it only says ghci though
20:39:44 <int-e> olsner: I misdiagnosed the problem anyway
20:42:33 <int-e> In any case it'd be MonoLocalBinds I think. But it wasn't :)
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20:56:13 <boily> ~eval 2 ** 8 * 3 ** 2
20:57:05 <olsner> ~eval 2 ** 2 ** 3 * 3 ** 2
20:57:51 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type `[a0 -> b0]'
20:57:51 <lambdabot> with actual type `(a1 -> b1) -> [a1] -> [b1]'
20:57:51 <lambdabot> In the second argument of `map', namely `map'
20:57:52 <boily> how do you define a function in lambdabot again?
20:57:57 <lambdabot> (Functor f, Functor f1) => (a -> b) -> f (f1 a) -> f (f1 b)
20:58:02 <FreeFull> :t fmap fmap fmap fmap fmap fmap fmap
20:58:03 <lambdabot> (Functor f, Functor f1, Functor f2) => f (a -> b) -> f (f1 (f2 a) -> f1 (f2 b))
20:58:22 <FreeFull> At some point adding more fmaps loops you around to an earlier state
20:58:39 <int-e> @define boily = 42
20:58:46 <int-e> it seems that works, too
20:59:02 <boily> int-e: I thought I mentioned that I wasn't to be redefined, you fiendish scalliwag.
20:59:29 <boily> @let factorMap = fromList . map (head &&& length) . group . primeFactors
20:59:30 <lambdabot> `IM.fromList' (imported from Data.IntMap),
20:59:30 <lambdabot> `M.fromList' (imported from Data.Map),
20:59:37 <boily> @let factorMap = M.fromList . map (head &&& length) . group . primeFactors
20:59:38 <lambdabot> .L.hs:143:50: Not in scope: `primeFactors'
20:59:56 <FreeFull> @let import Data.Numbers.Primes
20:59:56 <lambdabot> Failed to load interface for `Data.Numbers.Primes'
20:59:57 <lambdabot> Perhaps you meant Data.Number.Fixed (from numbers-3000.2.0.0)
20:59:57 <lambdabot> Use -v to see a list of the files searched for.
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22:37:51 <oerjan> <boily> `run echo 'A thausiblee is the recipient of a thausible action.' >wisdom/thausiblee <-- <public_announcement> that could have been done with `learn</public_announcement>
22:39:05 <ion> `learn</public_announcement>
22:39:06 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: /hackenv/learn</public_announcement>: No such file or directory
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23:00:10 <oerjan> <fizzie> Curiously enough, the phase of the moon turned out -- completely by coincidence [...] <-- surely that particular phase has the effect of making you want to photograph the moon hth
23:02:54 <oerjan> @tell boily `learn now removes english articles hth
23:03:33 <HackEgo> A szoup a szilárd tápszereknek híg alakban való elkészítése a célból, hogy könnyebben emészthetők legyenek; a hígító anyag a viz, mely feloldja s magába veszi a tápanyag legértékesebb részeit.
23:03:40 <oerjan> also one hungarian one
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23:09:31 <oerjan> <oklopol> it seems unlikely that people find out that you're using the lasers you buy to check for retroreflectors and rig them to shoot lasers that retroreflect from stone if they are being shot toward the moon
23:10:17 <oerjan> i'd say the idea someone can make lasers that retroreflect from a non-manmade substance is a conspiracy in itself.
23:21:12 <HackEgo> gaszpacho is a polish soup, traditionally szerved cold for hot szummer days
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23:24:00 <HackEgo> 1166) <fungot> I'm Robert Fnord. Here, take a piece of freenode furniture.
23:24:10 * oerjan cannot remember a number for five seconds
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23:25:04 <FireFly> `qoteadd <oerjan> `quote 1146 <HackEgo> 1146) <oerjan> OKAY
23:25:05 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: qoteadd: not found
23:25:07 <HackEgo> *poof* <fungot> I'm Robert Fnord. Here, take a piece of freenode furniture.
23:25:28 <oerjan> `addquote <fungot> boily: i'm robert fnord. here take a piece of freenode furniture
23:25:29 <fungot> oerjan: i never understood method decorators... monkey prostates. the problem is of course true. and yet it does
23:25:30 <HackEgo> 1166) <fungot> boily: i'm robert fnord. here take a piece of freenode furniture
23:25:45 * oerjan swats olsner for fake quoting -----###
23:26:07 <fungot> FireFly: sorry. seems the changes i propose:
23:28:14 <ion> `addquote * oerjan loves olsner to fake quoting <3<3<3<3
23:30:06 <FireFly> `addquote <oerjan> `quote 1146 <HackEgo> 1146) <oerjan> OKAY
23:30:08 <HackEgo> 1167) <oerjan> `quote 1146 <HackEgo> 1146) <oerjan> OKAY
23:30:24 <FireFly> I have a feeling that one won't stay for too long
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