00:02:47 <boily> fowl: I wrote “They are a sneaky kind of chicken.” in your section header.
00:18:15 <HackEgo> 307) <cpressey> `quote django <HackEgo> 352) <olsner> django is named after a person? <olsner> thought it would be a giraffe or something <cpressey> thankfully only one \ 308) <monqy> `quote django <HackEgo> 352) <olsner> django is named after a person? <olsner> thought it would be a giraffe or something \ 407) <cpressey> `quote django
00:23:17 <HackEgo> 819) <olsner> fungot: what's your view on angels and other otherworldly beings? <fungot> olsner: well i'm mentioning theoretical image to be dumped in rain forests of laukaa.
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02:35:45 <oerjan> no, blunt, that is not a good way to convince humans not to do something.
02:38:31 <oerjan> (this is freefall btw)
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06:56:53 <mroman> Is there a fast way to find a,b for u*a + v*b + ab = z?
06:58:32 <mroman> Bike: given that a != 0 and b != 0
06:58:41 <Bike> i mean, which of u,v,z
06:59:12 <lifthrasiir> well, it is equivalent to `(u+a)*(v+b) = z + u*v`, so it is really a factorization problem?
06:59:34 <mroman> and z != 0 for that matter :)
07:01:19 <mroman> so there's no way to solve it over the integer
07:01:23 <mroman> i.e. like diophantines?
07:01:35 <mroman> if it's a factorization problem then the answer is probably no.
07:02:39 <Bike> well it's diophantine but also linear, so probably not impossible
07:03:33 <Bike> um, i think so anyway.
07:06:16 <mroman> well, if you can solve it efficiently you might also be able to solve factorization efficiently ;)
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07:08:04 <mroman> would it help if a = b?
07:08:23 <mroman> i.e. u*a + v*a + a^2 = z
07:08:31 <mroman> that's a quadratic equation?
07:08:41 <Bike> yeah, i guess it's not linear anyway.
07:08:59 <Bike> but hey! that pretty fucking constrains the solutions
07:11:55 <mroman> too much of a constraint
07:12:34 <lifthrasiir> mroman, indeed; a^2 + (u+v)a - z = 0, so rational root theorem gives that `a` can only be one of +/- 1/z' where z divides z'.
07:15:47 <mroman> but a easier one than the original
07:15:51 <mroman> that was the point actually
07:17:01 <Bike> yes, i suppose square root is easier to compute
07:17:24 <lifthrasiir> mroman: just out of curiosity, what's the context of that problem?
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07:18:30 <mroman> Bike: not the square root
07:19:04 <mroman> lifthrasiir: prime factorization
07:20:18 <HackEgo> pbflist: shachaf Sgeo quintopia ion
07:20:27 <shachaf> should've signed up for deluxe
07:23:17 <mroman> but it also works for regular numbers too
07:27:59 <mroman> it's a silly thing though
07:28:27 <mroman> the closer together factors are the easier it is to factorize the number
07:32:19 <mroman> lifthrasiir: I was just looking for some really easy to implement factorization method that is faster than O(sqrt(n)) and doesn't require a table or large amounts of memory
07:38:28 <Bike> is this like, an instruction for your isa
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07:39:28 <lifthrasiir> something like http://stackoverflow.com/a/2274520 ?
07:39:31 <Bike> instruction set
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07:40:52 <Bike> well, rho doesn't need a table, it seems
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07:41:14 <Bike> nondeterministic, tho
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07:41:42 <Bike> oh, i remember reading about brent's cycle thing before...
07:42:19 <mroman> http://codepad.org/5sFOZjZB <- that's essentially it
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07:42:26 <mroman> u and v are guesses of two factors
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07:42:48 <mroman> and depending on how good you guessed the faster it is
07:43:09 <mroman> it also does a trial division "on-the-side"
07:43:18 <mroman> for numbers ilke 11*17*607*353*...
07:43:37 <mroman> which would take much more time by just adjusting the guess because there's a really small factor in it
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07:46:42 <Bike> seems like an odd thing to put as an instruction, too. "even polynomial evaluation would make more sense to me"
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09:53:55 <mroman> @ask Bike like horner?
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10:40:33 <mroman> one possible constraint would be u = v
10:40:39 <mroman> leading to (a + b)*u + a*b = z
10:40:49 <mroman> which is probably not easier to solve
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10:55:30 <Jafet> I should ask int-e to export gcdExtInteger so lambdabot can factor numbers
10:58:29 <nortti> read that as "godExtInteger" and got mildly confused
10:59:16 <fungot> Jafet: and, i've learned! i'll just move back here and never speak again in the next story. it's like david, and we never will! what's to be gained the ability to look back and be aghast at all the animals we kill and eat us probably! if not, we can make the cutest cards ever for a series of puns.
10:59:51 <nortti> how do I check what style is fungot currently using?
10:59:51 <fungot> nortti: t-rex, i don't know a few dollars! you're on! it only claims that there, chocochops have a different chemical makeup, but taste and never gets old and is everyone's favorite, without a little placard beneath that, " you must punch! i love drinking delicious punch, probably because of how it's so delicious because i like to keep my friends and status in society, i am, a little!
11:00:24 <fungot> Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld enron europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack oots pa qwantz* sms speeches ss wp youtube
11:01:28 <Jafet> Isn't it weird that a small corpus makes better fungot
11:01:28 <fungot> Jafet: as a man concerned, t-rex, that going shopping was your default activity?
11:01:58 <fungot> Selected style: darwin (Books by Charles Darwin -- you know, that evilution guy)
11:03:51 <Jafet> fungot can now select words naturally.
11:03:52 <fungot> Jafet: hon. john collier, for/ long- styled form,/ tubes were larger in every dimension. " 3? 3. falconer, that/ plants must have been a little timid in publishing their belief on this head: prof. fnord in.
11:04:21 <nortti> "plants must have been a little timid in publishing their belief on this head"
11:04:44 <nortti> also, where does the "fnord" come from?
11:05:44 <Jafet> `quote fnord fnord fnord
11:05:44 <HackEgo> 1183) <int-e> fungot has not done me any harm yet <fungot> int-e: no niinku pl niinku fnord niinku fnord fnord fnord
11:08:15 <Jafet> I wonder what choice word charlie had that was worthy of fnording out
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11:13:54 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Talk:Brainfuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39558&oldid=39557 * Maxdefolsch * (+444) /* My optimizing interpreter again */
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11:53:43 <mroman> > [[x|y<-[1..n],y `mod` x == 0]|n<-[1..10]]
11:53:45 <lambdabot> It could refer to either ‘L.x’, defined at L.hs:150:1
11:53:45 <lambdabot> imported from ‘Debug.SimpleReflect’ at L.hs:110:1-26
11:53:45 <lambdabot> (and originally defined in ‘simple-reflect-0.3.2:De...
11:54:13 <mroman> > [[x|y<-[1..n],y `mod` x == 0]|x<-[1..10]]
11:54:27 <mroman> > [[x|y<-[1..x],y `mod` x == 0]|x<-[1..10]]
11:54:28 <lambdabot> [[1],[2],[3],[4],[5],[6],[7],[8],[9],[10]]
11:54:49 <mroman> > [[x|y<-[1..x],x `mod` y == 0]|x<-[1..10]]
11:54:51 <lambdabot> [[1],[2,2],[3,3],[4,4,4],[5,5],[6,6,6,6],[7,7],[8,8,8,8],[9,9,9],[10,10,10,10]]
11:55:13 <mroman> > [[y|y<-[1..x],x `mod` y == 0]|x<-[1..10]]
11:55:15 <lambdabot> [[1],[1,2],[1,3],[1,2,4],[1,5],[1,2,3,6],[1,7],[1,2,4,8],[1,3,9],[1,2,5,10]]
11:55:28 <mroman> I officially won the record for most errors in a single line of code :D
11:59:02 <MDream> Hmm, there's no Zelda fungot.
11:59:03 <fungot> MDream: charles island. but it has not turned out far more crooked and confused than it is, however, were strongly affected;/ first having all/ tentacles but thirty-six inflected; after 6 hrs. surrounding fluid just tinged pink; they were then left in water for 24 hrs.
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12:00:12 <MDude> That does not sound like a good time to have tentacles.
12:00:33 <MDude> Might be even worse for boned limbs, though.
12:04:27 <boily> tentacle conjugation is ever so complex.
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13:38:08 <oerjan> octopi don't send spam. this is one of the many ways in which they are superior to humans.
13:39:13 <quintopia> this is only because they haven't figured out how to use keyboards yet
13:39:35 <quintopia> just you wait, one day octopodes will be the most pernicious senders of spam on the planet
13:39:40 <MDude> We jsut need to give them some that are water-resistant.
13:40:12 <int-e> (the last message before oerjan's "7" was something about tentacle conjugation, whatever that is.)
13:40:14 <quintopia> not only are they greedy, they have no compassion
13:41:27 <MDude> Would probably hlep to let them live longer than three years, since they'll spend a big chunk of that just growing up from tiny hatchlings and, then they need to learn how to read.
13:41:53 <MDude> That second comma should be one word to the left.
13:43:47 <quintopia> they only live three years: another one of the many ways in which they are superior to humans
13:45:58 <Taneb> People who know more about C, someone in another channel is asking whether "*(u8_t *)ADDRESS_LITERAL_MACRO[64]" is valid
13:54:56 <fizzie> I'm pretty sure that sort of depends on what ADDRESS_LITERAL_MACRO expands to, or is.
13:56:39 <fizzie> (Guessing from the name, probably not.)
13:57:21 <fizzie> The precedence goes *(u8_t *)(ADDRESS_LITERAL_MACRO[64]) anyway, so if it is something you can stick [64] after, then it's at least syntactically sensible.
13:58:25 <oerjan> i'd imagine the precedence, too, depends on what it expands to.
13:58:36 <Taneb> <Ajsdf> Taneb: it is something along the lines of 0x0450 being a hex representation of a memory address on a peice of hardware
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14:02:36 <fizzie> If it expands to an integer constant, then that's not okay.
14:02:51 <fizzie> (And I was about to come back to mention what oerjan said.)
14:04:31 <Taneb> <Ajsdf> perhaps (*(u8_t *)ADDRESS_LITERAL_MACRO)[64]
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14:04:50 <fizzie> That doesn't really make sense either, unless u8_t is a pointer type.
14:05:07 <fizzie> Plain *(u8_t *)ADDRESS_LITERAL_MACRO would be quite reasonable, and ((u8_t *)ADDRESS_LITERAL_MACRO)[64] wouldn't be too bizarre either, but that's about it.
14:05:47 <fizzie> The type of (*(u8_t *)ADDRESS_LITERAL_MACRO) is u8_t (not u8_t *), and it doesn't *sound* like something you can [64], but of course it *could* be.
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14:37:48 <Taneb> @tell fizzie Ajsdf says thanks
14:43:00 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Talk:Brainfuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39559&oldid=39558 * Oerjan * (+170) /* My optimizing interpreter again */ binaries
14:45:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[PHL 1.0]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39560&oldid=39554 * Oerjan * (+20) /* Examples */ links
14:46:28 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[PHL 1.0]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39561&oldid=39560 * Oerjan * (+4) /* Computational class */ another link
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15:16:10 <mroman> I hope this isn't just a coincidence
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15:26:17 <mroman> Taneb: (q + a)*(r + a) = b
15:26:30 <mroman> I'm trying to find q and r, so that the above equation holds
15:30:12 <Bike> this conversation makes the uncomputability of diophantines make a lot more sense
15:30:53 <Bike> mroman: yes, like horner. i was thinking of the perennial "lol CISC" instruction. http://uranium.vaxpower.org/~isildur/vax/week.html
15:33:31 <Taneb> mroman, So... (q + 1) * (r = 1) = b/a?
15:34:25 <Taneb> What do you know about all the values?
15:36:37 <mroman> they are all positive integers
15:37:55 * oerjan fails Taneb in algebra
15:41:20 * oerjan swats Taneb for responding with insufficient horror -----###
15:41:26 <oerjan> you should learn from boily
15:42:16 <oerjan> sorry, *not responding with sufficient
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15:44:18 * oerjan fails himself in grammar
15:44:23 <oerjan> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
15:47:34 <int-e> I think no matter how many A's you give yourself, it won't become a failing grade.
15:48:16 * oerjan fails himself in grading
15:48:17 <Taneb> oerjan, aaaaaah what did I do
15:48:21 <oerjan> FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
15:48:51 <oerjan> Taneb: i'm pretty sure (q + 1) * (r = 1) = b/a is not equivalent to (q + a)*(r + a) = b
15:49:17 <Taneb> Well, the = was a type
15:49:32 <Taneb> Oh dear god you are right
15:49:41 <Taneb> Some kind of monster evidently
15:49:57 <oerjan> thank you for relieving of the need to say so, Taneb
15:50:10 * oerjan fails himself in grammar again
15:50:38 <oerjan> i seem to be out of capital letters
15:50:44 <int-e> please don't relieve yourself on the channel?!
15:50:59 <int-e> english is a horrible language.
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15:58:02 <Taneb> mroman, if they're all positive integers, q > 1
16:01:27 <mroman> q and r are both always > 1
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16:17:47 <HackEgo> olist (952): shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti
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16:34:22 <FreeFull> The IP address of a website I wanted to visit is gone from DNS
16:36:24 <kmc> google's rubik's cube is made using CSS transforms
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16:40:07 <FreeFull> Dammit, I can't find anything on the internet indicating why the website is not accessible
16:40:24 <FreeFull> Other than that it seems that other people are also searching for why it isn't accessible
16:40:45 <kmc> I was wondering if it was WebGL, but I guess that's still not so widely supported
16:43:49 <FreeFull> I find physical rubik's cubes much easier to solve than computerised ones
16:48:05 <mroman> how do i rotate the cube?
16:49:09 <boily> you click in the emptiness and drag.
16:56:16 <quintopia> boily: this sounds like a philosophy of life
16:59:58 <boily> I prefer to ride a bike through the Lanes of Nothingness, under the Shade of the Void Trees.
17:03:02 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=39562 * John Misciagno * (+1261) Created page with "'''0(nop^)''' is a stack-based esoteric programming language with numeric function names. == Operators == '''+''', '''-''', '''*''', '''/''', '''%''', '''<''', '''>''', and ..."
17:05:24 <boily> interesting fishy etymology → http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abudefduf
17:08:14 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39563&oldid=39562 * John Misciagno * (+95)
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17:10:06 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39564&oldid=39563 * John Misciagno * (-25)
17:11:18 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39565&oldid=39564 * John Misciagno * (-38)
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17:21:48 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39566&oldid=39565 * John Misciagno * (-31)
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17:26:23 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39567&oldid=39566 * John Misciagno * (+68)
17:28:51 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39568&oldid=39567 * John Misciagno * (-8)
17:29:27 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39569&oldid=39568 * John Misciagno * (+16)
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17:38:44 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39570&oldid=39569 * John Misciagno * (+2)
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17:43:50 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39571&oldid=39570 * John Misciagno * (+31)
17:49:59 <impomatic> Is the only way to recurse / loop in 0(nop^) via ( ) and ^?
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17:56:27 <myname> if you really don't like java but have to write something for jvm, which language would you choose?
17:56:29 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39572&oldid=39571 * John Misciagno * (+250)
17:57:02 <boily> Cyragia: quite a few of us, yes. first time on #esoteric?
17:57:55 <boily> Cyragia: what brings you here? which esolangs do you like? are you working on some? do you like your steak rare, medium or well-done?
17:58:23 <myname> boily: i was told clojure software takes pretty long to start
17:58:36 <Cyragia> interst. FALSE. yes. well-done.
17:59:10 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39573&oldid=39572 * John Misciagno * (+21)
17:59:24 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39574&oldid=39573 * John Misciagno * (+1)
17:59:37 <boily> myname: I wouldn't know, but afaik clojure is the most active and interesting non-java jvm language out there. do you have performance needs?
18:00:25 <Cyragia> I'm making my first language/compiler, heavily influenced by FALSE and alike
18:00:25 <boily> Cyragia: good choice; have your taken a look at betterave? (shameless self-plug). care to give more details? you heretic!
18:00:47 <myname> boily: well, i am targeting android, so... yes
18:01:45 <boily> oh. hm. eeeeeh... you could go the phonegap way, but last time I checked documentation was scarce and not quite up to date.
18:02:45 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39575&oldid=39574 * John Misciagno * (-36)
18:02:52 <myname> boily: people recommended libgdx which looks somewhat usable
18:03:11 <myname> i know about phonegap, but tbh i do hate javascript, too
18:03:14 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39576&oldid=39575 * John Misciagno * (+0)
18:04:59 <Cyragia> boily: betterave looks, cool. But I'm making something stack-based
18:05:54 * nortti notices a trend of stack based langs in recent times
18:06:27 <Cyragia> I aslo noticed there are a lot of stack based esolangs, but barely any 'normal' languages
18:06:57 <mroman> that's because they aren't really practical
18:07:03 <nortti> well, there is a forth but it is borderline esolang
18:07:04 <mroman> at least purely stack based
18:07:12 <nortti> then Joe, which look interesting
18:07:17 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39577&oldid=39576 * John Misciagno * (+58)
18:08:21 <Cyragia> I'm trying to desing something that's as easy as possible to write a compiler for, yet relatively useable and pretty low-level
18:08:38 <nortti> yeah, in that case stacks just make sense (tm)
18:09:28 <Cyragia> My goal is to be able to compile every expression on it's own, in one pass preferably
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18:11:58 <Cyragia> I'm a bit stuck on how to do variables
18:12:34 <Cyragia> you mean allocate mem on stack, or just push/pop ?
18:12:35 <quintopia> boily: have you lost all your creativity? there have been no new vegetables on the wiki in a long time
18:13:08 <mroman> Cyragia: allocate mem on stack
18:13:43 <Cyragia> the allocation isn't really the problem, i could just add a data section to my elf file
18:14:22 <boily> quintopia: I'm background-cogitating on my next one. I still need a way to make it evil. *pouring rain* *thunder* *lightning* *hth*
18:14:36 <mroman> then what's the problem?
18:14:50 <quintopia> boily: what non-evilness have you got
18:15:06 <Cyragia> the problem is, either i put code and data in a single section and just put the variable wherever it is defined (at compile-time), but that's a bit messy
18:15:18 <mroman> https://bitbucket.org/mroman_/emulathor/src/fc48fe22fdade5777099eea372e5f06e2b4d2b2b/src/compiler/rlang.y?at=master <- it's crappy code but it's a working one-pass compiler
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18:15:24 <boily> speaking of forth, I remember reading a long tutorial a while ago. it was a text file à la RFC, and had nice ascii diagrams. but I can't find it :(
18:15:54 <mroman> the easiest thing to do for a one-pass is to compile everything the same way imo
18:16:04 <mroman> i.e use push/pop even if it's not necessary
18:16:08 <impomatic> Factor and Retro are pretty much stack based and appear to be popular.
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18:16:13 <mroman> that way you don't need register allocation or anything like that
18:16:19 <boily> quintopia: splitting the tokens and merging the parts together in a haphazard way. I want to make the whole thing aperiodic tiling.
18:16:27 <Cyragia> I could just give some mem region to the programmer and use something like defines to convert names into addresses
18:16:31 <impomatic> Cyragia: have you seen Mouse? If you like FALSE, you'll probably like Mouse.
18:17:27 <mroman> Cyragia: address resolution is your problem?
18:17:43 <quintopia> boily: one day you should make a metalanguage called "vegetale". instead of a scoping system, it just has "scoping" where you can define how scoping works. instead of a type system, it just has "typesystem" which lets you define your own type system. best language ever.
18:17:45 <mroman> are you compiling to asm?
18:18:02 <mroman> then the assembler can do the adress resolution :D
18:18:07 <Cyragia> straight to an x86 elf file
18:18:39 <boily> quintopia: Légume!
18:19:17 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39578&oldid=39577 * John Misciagno * (+8)
18:19:59 <mroman> Cyragia: Depending on how high-level your language should be you could just give the programmer some memory that is addressable by index
18:20:04 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39579&oldid=39578 * John Misciagno * (+1)
18:20:11 <Cyragia> yeah, i guess i'll do that
18:20:14 <mroman> i.e pushloc index and poploc index
18:20:27 <Cyragia> and just #defines or smth for names
18:20:32 <mroman> which is essentialy mem[index] = pop(); and push(mem[index]);
18:20:43 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39580&oldid=39579 * John Misciagno * (-1) /* Hello, world! */
18:21:21 <Cyragia> I already have : and ; for store and load
18:21:32 <Cyragia> so my variable would just be pointers anyway
18:22:00 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39581&oldid=39580 * John Misciagno * (-4) /* Hello world! */
18:24:03 <Cyragia> my current writeup of my language: http://pastebin.com/WNjpDgYr
18:24:31 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39582&oldid=39581 * John Misciagno * (+0) /* Hello world! */
18:24:48 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39583&oldid=39582 * John Misciagno * (+6)
18:27:13 <Cyragia> mroman: but when i'd just give the programmer a chunk of memory it'd probably be allocated somewhere around here: 0x08048000. so you can't just use 0, 1, 2, ... as addresses
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18:41:02 <mroman> you have to adjust for sizeof of course
18:41:17 <mroman> and you can use an offset
18:41:43 <Cyragia> but i also want it to be able to read any regular memory address
18:41:48 <mroman> something like that I guess
18:41:53 <Cyragia> so i can do low-level trickery
18:42:10 <mroman> depending on what assembler syntax you're used to :D
18:42:40 <Cyragia> like: push 0x08048123 (dereference) voila!
18:43:59 <Cyragia> or i could add the offset to the define and when you puch a regular address it would behave normally
18:44:56 <mroman> or you just let the programmer use low-level adresses
18:45:05 <mroman> i.e he has to know where his mem stuff is
18:45:39 <mroman> but how do you tell him where it is?
18:45:52 <Cyragia> but if the offset is something like 0x080484218 it get's quite complicated
18:45:56 <mroman> i mean you could add a command that pushes the offset to the local memory to the stack
18:46:09 <mroman> so he can calculate positions of stuff himself
18:46:15 <nortti> quintopia: in finland?
18:46:37 <Cyragia> I'd rather resolve it at compile-time
18:46:46 <quintopia> nortti: what is Topi usually short for
18:47:09 <nortti> I do not think it is an acronym
18:47:22 <nortti> yes, it is a man's name
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18:54:54 <Cyragia> mroman: I'll use the equivalent of: #define varname 0x20 (with the offset added at compile-time)
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19:13:32 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39584&oldid=39583 * John Misciagno * (+92)
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19:48:44 <impomatic> A few new players have entered the Core War Tournament so if you fancy having a go not everyone you'll be up against will be a pro :-)
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20:21:50 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39590&oldid=39589 * John Misciagno * (+59)
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20:33:36 <mroman> impomatic: what tournament?
20:37:20 <impomatic> mroman: Core War. You can enter by email. Tournament takes place at the computer museum in Cambridge, U.K. http://corewar.co.uk/spring2014.htm
20:37:48 <ion> nice https://firstlook.org/theintercept/article/2014/05/19/data-pirates-caribbean-nsa-recording-every-cell-phone-call-bahamas/
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20:42:14 <impomatic> mroman: eso hill would be http://esolangs.org/wiki/BF_Joust
20:42:22 <impomatic> !bfjoust shortsword (>++>--)*2(>)*6([-[+]]>)*20
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20:45:32 <mroman> "Entries can be up to 25 instructions"
20:46:43 <mroman> "Completely changing the program's behaviour or swapping / adding extra components for each core size is not allowed."
20:46:50 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39592&oldid=39591 * John Misciagno * (+26)
20:46:51 <mroman> if someone can do that in just 25 instructions
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20:47:34 <mroman> I can't switch to a different algo if CORESIZE > 800?
20:47:46 <mroman> that seems like an odd restriction
20:48:00 <mroman> I'll submit an imp then :D
20:48:13 <mroman> Everybody should at least submit an imp
20:48:24 <impomatic> mroman: the same program has to do well in each coresize. Otherwise it might as well be a tournament with three rounds!
20:48:41 <mroman> yeah "the same program"
20:48:53 <mroman> but why forbid if(coresize > 800) jump foo kinda stuff?
20:49:19 <impomatic> It's forbidden because you could just enter three completely different programs:
20:49:47 <mroman> but you're still limited to 25 instructions *TOTAL*
20:49:59 <mroman> so that only leaves 25/4 instructions per "sub"-program
20:50:20 <mroman> minus the overhead for the switch
20:51:36 <impomatic> I have two programs on the most active hill which are only 9 instructions. :-) http://www.koth.org/lcgi-bin/current.pl?hill94nop
20:54:42 <mroman> I guess I should at least submit some two stage bomber
20:55:01 <mroman> my vampire.red is much longer than 25 instructions and I know it sucks
20:55:15 <impomatic> Oneshots are easy to program. Just a scan loop (e.g. scan add #step, pointer / jmz.f scan, @pointer) followed by a clear (sequential wipe of memory starting whatever the scan found)
20:55:38 <mroman> impomatic: years ago, yes
20:57:32 <mroman> I think i submitted it to some koth.org hill
20:57:38 <mroman> but it performed badly
20:57:58 <mroman> mostly probably because it was too long and too slow for a vampire
20:58:05 <impomatic> Vampires have had trouble getting on the hills for years.
20:58:44 <mroman> I laid carpets of jmps into a SPL0 loop
20:59:10 <impomatic> However, a few new tricks have got the back on the hill again over the last few months.
20:59:14 <mroman> so the idea was to trick opponents to jump into my mem clear loop plus slowing them with the spl 0
21:00:22 <impomatic> I assume you have a DAT wipe after you've finished bombing?
21:01:01 <mroman> but I didn't know about fancy ><{} prefixes at that time
21:01:19 <mroman> I didn't know you could copy stuff around and also increment stuff in a single instruction
21:02:04 <mroman> my replicator wasn't much successful too :(
21:02:10 <impomatic> That makes a big difference to the score.
21:03:10 <mroman> 24th is pretty soon though
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21:03:39 <mroman> but shouldn't take more than an hour to write a bomber :D
21:04:02 <mroman> I just add an imp as a backup strategy
21:04:09 <mroman> after bombing transform to imp :)
21:04:49 <impomatic> Modern replicators normally run several parallel processes in code similar to paper spl somewhere, 0 / mov >paper, }paper ; all processes run the spl to split to the new copy. Then the run the mov to make the new copy.
21:04:52 <mroman> I don't know what you usually do after bombing?
21:05:02 <mroman> with a different offset probably
21:05:21 <mroman> I was just planning to throw spl 0 bombs with a bug offset
21:05:34 <mroman> and then make another bomb run with a slightly smaller offset
21:05:41 <mroman> then make a full mem clear
21:06:06 <impomatic> After bombing (or scanning), clear memory.
21:06:15 <mroman> spl 0 with big offset should catch replicators pretty well I think
21:06:28 <mroman> depending on how big they are and how fast they reproduce
21:08:01 <impomatic> A good 4 instruction clear is d-clear, SPL #0 / CLEAR MOV BMB, >POINTER / DJN.F CLEAR, >POINTER / BMB DAT 3-POINTER (where pointer is a few instructions before the clear)
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21:39:24 <oerjan> hm i'm not sure i like this apparent exponential spam growth
21:42:22 <shachaf> improve your life: HISTIGNORE='fg*'
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21:43:32 <oerjan> i don't think i've used fg much...
21:44:00 <oerjan> actually i guess i'd more likely have used %, the times i needed to
21:46:26 <oerjan> ah they're simply synonyms
21:47:29 <oerjan> or rather, the fg in fg %... is optional
21:47:39 <kmc> shachaf: did you know that rustc's parser is about 5,000 lines of hand-written Rust code?
21:47:46 <kmc> no grammar or anything
21:48:28 <shachaf> but that explains why they're not keeping the grammar in the manual up to date
21:48:44 <oerjan> kmc: sounds a little brittle. isn't rust powerful enough you could make parser combinators?
21:49:44 <kmc> yeah, I think there is a plan to fix this
21:53:58 <oerjan> <shachaf> `olist (952) <-- how did that sneak in just after i checked myself...
21:54:37 <shachaf> oerjan: is it just me or are olist updates p. far apart these days
21:56:17 <oerjan> <boily> you click in the emptiness and drag. <-- ooh
21:57:44 <oerjan> oh you don't have to drag, you can just click
22:02:04 <oerjan> <nortti> then Joe, which look interesting <-- itym Joy
22:06:25 <oerjan> <quintopia> boily: have you lost all your creativity? there have been no new vegetables on the wiki in a long time <-- wait betterave is a french vegetable?
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22:48:34 <oerjan> someone ought to perhaps tell john misciagno about the preview button.
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23:17:11 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0(nop^)]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39594&oldid=39593 * John Misciagno * (+5)
23:27:14 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Language list]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39595&oldid=39552 * John Misciagno * (+14)
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23:33:13 <kmc> hm, the google rubiks cube kind of runs like shit in firefox
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23:44:42 <Phantom_Hoover> kmc, the controls are fantastically awkward even if it works properly, just save yourself the pain
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