←2014-07-13 2014-07-14 2014-07-15→ ↑2014 ↑all
00:23:02 <^v> brainfuck masterrace
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00:33:28 <Sgeo> Is Ruby generally considered to be as good at runtime metaprogramming as Lisp is at statictime metaprogramming? (Yes I know I made statictime up, but compiletime is a silly word)
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01:44:35 <Guest66663> ^v: don't make jokes like that, thanks
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01:45:09 <^v> elliott, wat
01:45:39 <Bike> 'master race', probably. ethnic cleansing and all that
01:45:46 <elliott> 00:23:02: <^v> brainfuck masterrace
01:45:57 <^v> <_>
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02:27:19 <quintopia> eat a taco
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04:35:44 <Sgeo> Hmm, I'm not in love with content_type in this example: https://github.com/sinatra/sinatra/blob/master/examples/stream.ru
04:36:21 <Sgeo> That :txt obviouly does not contain text/plain, implying that content_type itself must be magically mapping :txt to text/plain
04:41:00 <Sgeo> Ah. Rack apparently has a MIME registry, and using symbols looks it up as an extension. Still a bit odd
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05:00:32 <Sgeo> This chart is garbage
05:00:36 <Sgeo> "Framework: ?"
05:01:49 <Sgeo> Dynamic typing is listed as a definite win.
05:02:10 <Sgeo> Static typing is also listed as a definite win.
05:02:35 <Sgeo> Maybe that's not what these colors actually mean, hmm
05:04:05 <zzo38> Or perhaps if you have both kinds then it is useful?
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05:10:39 <Sgeo> > 11111111111111111111111111111 - (length [])
05:10:40 <lambdabot> 4975542244881494471
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05:12:00 <Bike> deep
05:36:58 <FreeFull> :t length
05:36:59 <lambdabot> [a] -> Int
05:37:03 <FreeFull> That would be why
05:37:21 <FreeFull> > 11111111111111111111111111111 - (genericLength [])
05:37:22 <lambdabot> 11111111111111111111111111111
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05:59:45 <zzo38> Do you know anyone who is Traditional Chinese? I hope I can ask a question to them, because someone else who is not Chinese told me something but told me to forward it to someone who is actually Traditional Chinese.
06:00:11 <Bike> wht the hell does that mean
06:00:24 <Bike> do you mean someone who can read and write traditional chinese?
06:00:36 <zzo38> Yes
06:02:25 <Bike> it's not like, an ethnicity or something, just so you know
06:02:53 <zzo38> I know that traditional Chinese is the writing
06:05:35 <shachaf> zzo38: if cards and rules for Magic: The Gathering or a similar game were written in a programming language instead of in english, how would you design that programming language
06:07:43 <zzo38> shachaf: In most cases I don't like natural language programming, but in this case I would use a natural language programming which closely resembles the text on Magic: The Gathering cards as closely as possible, with [] for comments that print without the brackets, <> for program code that doesn't print, {} for symbols, and perhaps [- ... -] and [+ ... +] and so on for unnatural computer codes which do not print.
06:08:28 <zzo38> The English text would then convert into the kind of codes that go inside of [+ ... +] and I haven't quite thought of that yet, but it would have to involve ability, trigger, event, etc.
06:08:48 <elliott> Bike: he means someone chinese with conservative views.
06:08:49 <zzo38> And the ability to have words that can change. Maybe some kind of LISP-like stuff?
06:08:57 <Bike> elliott: honk
06:09:12 <zzo38> elliott: No, I mean the kind of writing by "traditional".
06:09:40 <shachaf> zzo38: well, i'm mostly wondering what the unnatural computer codes would be like
06:09:54 <shachaf> since most anything can modify most anything else
06:10:32 <zzo38> shachaf: Yes, I was trying to think of that too. And yes I thought of a kind of LISP-like
06:11:15 <zzo38> Which would be typed rather than typeless, though, to tell the type of what is used in each case, such as a keyword ability, what kind of parameter it takes, and then the code to override something, etc
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06:13:57 <zzo38> O, and when typing in the printable words, you might have to do such thing as "Destroy all non-white Human=s." so you need the equal sign for plural of creature types; when print out it will calculate the correct plural form and when converting to computer form it ignores that part so you know it means the "Human" subtype, because it is capitalized.
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06:15:25 <zzo38> (However, you would also be allowed to type "[Destroy all non-white Humans] [+ ... +]." and put the computer code in place of the "...")
06:16:11 <shachaf> i'm less concerned with how it would be printed and more with how the language itself would work
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06:18:05 <zzo38> Unfortunately I don't know, but I do have a few ideas. In cases where it query the text and abilities and so on of other objects, it could be something like the SQL queries in order to find something, but not quite SQL since the data is organized differently. Also it is a LISP-like, therefore you can read the code as lists of lists just as well, but having types rather than typeless.
06:19:13 <zzo38> And then it can override meanings as well as override text, for example to override the meaning of the Flying ability rather than the text, to have such values with different types, and literals with types, so you can tell if it is a color, keyword ability, number, etc.
06:19:22 <zzo38> Does this make any sense to you now?
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06:23:11 <shachaf> some
06:24:20 <zzo38> Do you have other ideas too, perhaps?
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06:31:09 <zzo38> You may then need the list of abilities, then it specifies each one that it is activated or whatever, and then that one takes as parameter the cost and action. But then there would need to be the things to indicate mana abilities, abilities which are played by others than the card's controller, etc.
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14:03:53 <oerjan> girl genius, now with a rail gun
14:04:35 <oerjan> no, it's not the usual kind.
14:07:15 <elliott> Raël gun, shoots ufos
14:07:29 <oerjan> not that kind either.
14:14:40 <Melvar> Looks rather like not a rail gun in the usual sense.
14:15:56 <oerjan> you've got to admit it fits the name, though.
14:16:05 <Melvar> More like an impossible variety of gauss gun.
14:16:20 <Melvar> Yes, it fits, just not in the usual sense.
14:20:37 <quintopia> is it a machine that makes actual rails? very quickly? "have instant I-beam!"
14:20:49 <oerjan> ding ding ding!
14:21:00 <oerjan> quintopia wins
14:21:05 <oerjan> assuming he didn't cheat
14:22:50 <Melvar> It looked to me like it accelerated the existing rail, but it’s hard to tell; certainly Agatha could build something that does create the rail.
14:23:17 <oerjan> well you'd know if you'd followed the story
14:24:49 <oerjan> technically she only improved the railway monk's invention
14:29:06 <Melvar> … I failed to connect that comment to this.
14:36:37 <Bike> RAIL!
14:42:06 <quintopia> oerjan: well i did look at it, but I don't follow the comic so I had to ask to be sure I understood what I was seeing.
14:42:47 <oerjan> good, good
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14:52:02 <quintopia> lucky him. i'm definitely actually late.
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19:22:12 <quintopia> :\
19:36:19 <Taneb> :/
19:37:00 <quintopia> inorite
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20:56:47 <zzo38> How difficult would it be to make a device which tunes and decrypts forty digital channels at once and converts them to forty analog channels on one cable?
20:57:38 <Bicyclidine> depends on the decryption you're doing, i would thnk
20:58:17 <oerjan> sounds like a hardware capacity question, count me out
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21:06:25 <oerjan> fizzie: Gregor: they are killing our bots!
21:07:04 <oerjan> those idelities are not reassuring
21:07:11 <zzo38> The decryption is whatever it is according to the service provider.
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21:11:17 <zzo38> What I wanted to do is that it can be used with all simple analog devices, without requiring the use of the service provider's OSD and user interface, even though the signal is digital.
21:11:25 <MDude> That depends on what the other requirements are.
21:12:25 <MDude> I mean could you just take 40 devices that each convert one channel and then hook them all up to whatever analog switch/muliplexer/whatever would merge them?
21:13:08 <fizzie> oerjan: The lack of answer to SSH is not reassuring either.
21:14:25 <fizzie> "We apologize for the delay in getting back to everyone on their support tickets in a timely manor but we expect everything to be back and better than ever early this week."
21:14:32 <fizzie> Oh well, at least the manor is timely.
21:14:59 <fizzie> And we will always have fungot.
21:14:59 <oerjan> to the manor born, and at the right time
21:14:59 <fungot> fizzie: ( not once, probably :)). i can't remember if sicp does, maybe the new one did not have the memory for spelling. so, instructions would be
21:15:06 <Bicyclidine> back and ever than better
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21:16:27 <zzo38> MDude: I know it would work, but that would probably be too expensive and inefficient.
21:16:30 <oerjan> oh hm that means there's point checking the wiki either
21:16:55 <MDude> Yeah.
21:17:05 <oerjan> (my brain went, if hackego is down i should check the wiki manually to see if something's happening)
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21:17:18 <MDude> I guess start with that as a theoretic design and see what could be simplified from there?
21:17:32 <MDude> Like what parts would be redundant and all that.
21:18:43 <MDude> Mostly I'm guessing you'd want to look at the capacity for each part, what needs to synchonise with what, and how much latencey it causes.
21:18:58 <oerjan> *\no
21:19:04 <oerjan> **+no
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21:35:59 <zzo38> I have managed to use ImageMagick to cause each sequence of eight bytes in a file to be duplicated.
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21:38:36 <zzo38> convert -size 8x256 -depth 8 gray:input.chr +clone +append gray:output.chr It can be used to convert PC font data into the Famicom format, even though this is completely different than what any of the options I have just specified are meaning!
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22:15:55 <quintopia> boily: hi!
22:28:12 <boily> quintopia: quinthellopia!
22:30:28 <quintopia> boily: did you hear about zzo38's abuse of imagemagick for font conversion for nintendos?
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22:36:04 <zzo38> Of course you can do other similar stuff with ImageMagick as well, such as to reverse the order of bits in each byte, or two swap pairs of consecutive bytes.
22:36:18 <zzo38> I have even once used it to process audio data.
22:39:47 <quintopia> who would have thought
22:40:23 <zzo38> However, it doesn't have any function to read/write audio formats, so you can only deal with raw headerless audio.
22:42:33 <boily> quintopia: let me suffer the shock of such a revelation for a while, and then I'll get back to you.
22:43:01 <boily> okay. enough suffering.
22:43:21 <quintopia> why not use ffmpeg zzo38?
22:43:26 <boily> zzo38: you are a monster! you are transgressing the laws of nature! also, which nintendos? like, only the original NES?
22:43:42 <oerjan> ah finally sane temperatures again
22:43:48 <oerjan> `sanetemp 30
22:43:57 <oerjan> um right
22:44:03 <oerjan> !sanetemp 30
22:44:05 <EgoBot> ​-1.1
22:44:07 <zzo38> boily: Yes only the original NES and Famicom
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22:44:45 <boily> ~metar ENVA
22:44:46 <metasepia> ENVA 142220Z 24005KT CAVOK 19/16 Q1005 RMK WIND 670FT VRB05KT
22:44:47 <zzo38> And these are not transgressing any laws of nature or otherwise, and I am not a monster, I only play one not on TV.
22:44:48 <boily> ~metar CYUL
22:44:49 <metasepia> CYUL 142200Z 27007KT 30SM FEW100 SCT160 BKN240 23/12 A2983 RMK AC2AC1CI4 SLP101 DENSITY ALT 1100FT
22:44:53 <zzo38> ~metar CYVR
22:44:53 <metasepia> CYVR 142200Z 20011G17KT 20SM FEW170 25/18 A3005 RMK AC1 HZ SLP177 DENSITY ALT 1000FT
22:45:45 <oerjan> boily: you aberration hater you
22:45:51 <quintopia> `commands
22:45:58 <quintopia> i forget how to hackego
22:46:11 <oerjan> quintopia: step 1: have it be here
22:46:13 <quintopia> oh there is no hackego
22:46:17 * quintopia sads
22:46:24 <zzo38> oerjan: Yes, that is the good first step.
22:46:36 <oerjan> step 2: `help
22:46:42 <quintopia> even with it here i forget
22:46:59 <zzo38> It depends what program you want to run on it!
22:47:04 <oerjan> step 3: `run rm -rf . # It's traditional
22:47:09 * boily is afraid he has to resort to punitive mapoling in the generic direction of Gregor
22:48:19 <boily> oerjan: of the aberrations I only hate the chromatic one.
22:48:29 <quintopia> boily: please remember zzo38's joke above so it can go in the quote list when hackego returns
22:49:04 <oerjan> zzo38: is kjigube (sp?) chromatic
22:49:11 <zzo38> oerjan: No.
22:49:24 <zzo38> But that isn't what "chromatic aberration" means anyways, clearly.
22:49:27 <oerjan> good, you're safe from boily then
22:50:10 <zzo38> I am not a lens.
22:50:33 <boily> I can't see you from here, therefore you are transparent, therefore you are a lens :D
22:50:40 <oerjan> are you a traversal then
22:50:59 <boily> quintopia: I'll try to remember it, after I remember to check for already there updates to the wisdom.
22:51:28 <quintopia> i would push updates to the wisdom if i felt confident enough to edit it
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22:52:16 <boily> YAAAAAAAAURGH!
22:52:30 * boily is wisdomblocked by a nefarious five-oh-three!
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22:52:58 <boily> quintopia: no problem. I always accept incoming modifications! (I may be a little bit anal afterwards concerning formatting, tho)
22:52:59 <oerjan> boily: the whole site containing hackego, the repository, and the esolang wiki is down.
22:53:35 <zzo38> Did you see the quiz file I recently made (and not finished yet) on Internet Quiz Engine? Can you answer the questions or to add more questions or choices for existing questions (no more than 26 each, please)?
22:53:36 <boily> nooooooooooooooon! enfer et damnation! maudit sois-tu, odieux Gregor!
22:54:00 <boily> zzo38: could you provide a link to, so I may try?
22:54:01 <oerjan> boily: it's not his fault, except possibly for being a cheapskate while choosing vps
22:54:11 <boily> oh, right. that vps thing.
22:54:40 <quintopia> isn't he on prgmr
22:55:03 <elliott> no, he's on cloudatcos
22:55:04 <elliott> t
22:55:16 <zzo38> boily: OK gopher://zzo38computer.org/1quiz.run*quiz01. is the link (including the period).
22:55:27 <quintopia> oh
22:55:41 <elliott> I feel like the wiki could use being on a higher-priority server...
22:56:09 <quintopia> okay you buy it and i'll help migrate
22:56:32 <oerjan> poor elliott, there is no escape
22:58:04 <boily> hm. missing overbite on this machine. let's go install it...
22:59:17 <zzo38> If you are on Windows you can also try using Visgopher, or on any system it isn't so difficult to write a gopher client.
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23:00:35 <boily> I use the penguin on all my machines.
23:00:40 <boily> (also, I got 5!)
23:01:43 <zzo38> Which ones did you miss?
23:02:23 <zzo38> (Select "download the source codes of this quiz" if you want to see which ones you missed.)
23:04:12 <boily> I missed the first, the second, the third, the fifth, the seventh, the tenth, and the eleventh.
23:04:35 <boily> I don't know where I learned the answer to the fourth one, but I knew it.
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23:04:59 <boily> (also knew the sixth, because long live geopolitics!)
23:05:25 <quintopia> good night boily!
23:05:31 <quintopia> bye everyone else
23:06:07 <zzo38> What did you previously think the answers are?
23:06:24 <zzo38> Can you perhaps suggestion additional question/choices?
23:06:58 <boily> quintopia: bontopia nuit!
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23:07:28 <boily> zzo38: yes. maybe. perhaps.
23:11:13 <zzo38> Do you like these kind of questions?
23:11:32 <boily> yup! It remotivates me to learn even more obscure stuff!
23:11:54 <boily> (if one aspires to become a writer, or a sadist GM, one has to learn things!)
23:12:13 <zzo38> O, OK, yes that is a good idea to learn such thing too
23:13:43 <zzo38> What were your guesses for the first, second, third, fifth, seventh, tenth, and eleventh questions? Do you know much about Z-machine?
23:14:11 <boily> random, with some bias towards the last choices per question. not at all.
23:14:34 <boily> I fear I haven't spent enough time to delve into the low-level machines and other stuff enough.
23:14:49 <boily> (by the way, can you make a random regular expression?)
23:15:13 <Bicyclidine> what, in general?
23:15:16 <zzo38> Out of what? What are you trying to make?
23:16:46 <boily> out of a multiple-choice regular expression, it returns one of the possible matches at random.
23:17:14 <Bicyclidine> I don't see why not?
23:17:22 <zzo38> O, probably it is possible to make a program to do such things
23:21:05 <oerjan> there's a maximal entropy probability distribution for a finite automaton, may be relevant?
23:23:06 <FireFly> Couldn't you enumerate all the strings matched by the regular expression, even?
23:23:39 <Bicyclidine> the language it generates, yes.
23:25:14 <oerjan> although i think that applies to infinite strings
23:25:20 <boily> time to food.
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