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00:22:41 <izabera> anyway my question was mostly about its signedness
00:25:21 <HackEgo> perpetual motion machine/Perpetual motion machines came with FreeFull's phone. They were hallucinated by Slereah's lack of entropy.
00:25:26 <lambdabot> quintopia said 5h 2m 56s ago: decided to go caving on saturday. sunday still ostensibly free.
00:26:10 <boily> quintopia: quinthellopia. I'll be in Québec City this weekend for Thanksgiving >_>'... 申し訳ありません
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00:29:35 <\oren\> AAAAAAAAAA nothing works!
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00:33:51 <boily> \HELLOREEEEEEEEEN\
00:33:57 <boily> please state your emergency.
00:37:19 <boily> you aren't stating very much. that can only mean a purple fish ate spaghetti next Thursday.
00:37:51 <\oren\> hmm my website was malfunctioning but now it's fine
00:41:54 <boily> speaking of fish, could you please add 紫,紺 and 碧?
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02:54:22 <shachaf> "hugs are good" was meant to be an acronym for "hug"
02:54:32 <shachaf> but now i realize that "are" doesn't start with "u"
02:54:50 <HackEgo> rm: cannot remove `/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/env/.hg/store/data/canary.orig': Is a directory \ Done.
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03:14:09 <Sgeo_> "The aim of right-shifting md_size is so that the compiler doesn't figure out that it can remove div_spoiler as that would require it to prove that md_size is always even, which I hope is beyond it. "
03:17:03 <zzo38> In what program is that?
03:18:43 <quintopia> so i just installed kubuntu onto a flash drive with portable virtualbox and it's running just fine in win10 host. what should i use it for?
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03:29:46 <zzo38> There seem to be a problem in aplay or something related to it; I get a message: Assertion 'pthread_mutex_destroy(&m->mutex) == 0' failed at pulsecore/mutex-posix.c:81, function pa_mutex_free(). Aborting.
03:30:35 <zzo38> This seems to happen only when I interrupt the program (by ^C) after it is already finished playing but before it stopped.
03:37:02 <zzo38> I think now they make LibreSSL though? Hopefully is better than OpenSSL
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03:56:15 <Sgeo_> zzo38, saner people are making LibreSSL
03:56:20 <Sgeo_> Not the OpenSSL people.
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04:05:30 <zgrep> Wasn't it OpenSSL person?
04:14:57 <HackEgo> hax0r/hax0r (see ¯\(°_o)/¯)
04:15:02 <HackEgo> primative/A primative is a reference to a value that you were robbed of.
04:30:30 <zzo38> They say it would be possible to write an entire book about TeX output routines.
04:35:05 <zzo38> It is probably true.
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06:18:28 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Kishan Kumar * New user account
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06:38:59 <zzo38> There are simple things such as adding page numbers, although you can also do other things including: footnotes, multiple columns, vertically centering the text on each page, skipping pages, overlaying a grid onto the page, making pages looser than normal, marks for cutting the page, reverse the order of pages, and a lot more>
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07:50:00 <b_jonas> zzo38: and making full height double column pages by buffering two pages TeX sends to the output routine and emitting them only once.
07:50:13 <b_jonas> oh, you mentioned "multiple columns", yes
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08:59:09 <rdococ> yay got pidgin to work again
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09:18:55 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0815]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44632&oldid=44595 * 178.8.154.25 * (+4)
09:19:26 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[XEec]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=44633 * 178.8.154.25 * (+6836) Created page with "'''xEec ''' is an esoteric programming language designed and implemented by [[Paulo Jorente]] in October, 2015. ==Language details== '''xEec''' has a set of 9 instructions. ..."
09:23:57 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Hello world program in esoteric languages]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44634&oldid=44619 * Paulo Jorente * (+85)
09:25:18 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[XEec]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44635&oldid=44633 * Paulo Jorente * (-1) /* Fibonacci sequence */
09:29:11 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[XEec]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44636&oldid=44635 * Paulo Jorente * (+1) /* Language details */
09:29:26 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[0815]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44637&oldid=44632 * Paulo Jorente * (+0) /* Registers */
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09:34:11 <VictorCL> marcogmonteiro is an esoteric lover
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10:17:52 <myname> http://t.co/iX0WPeh2AB
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10:45:02 <lambdabot> LOWI 081020Z 13004KT 090V190 9999 FEW015 SCT040 BKN072 14/10 Q1019 NOSIG
10:50:23 <lambdabot> CYUL 081000Z 34008KT 15SM SKC 04/01 A3017 RMK SLP216
11:02:12 <int-e> I guess so, but at this temperature it's hardly a burden.
11:02:31 <int-e> (76% according to one website)
11:02:51 <lambdabot> EGLL 081050Z AUTO 24004KT 200V280 9999 NCD 15/09 Q1022 NOSIG
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11:07:05 <boily> y'all with your warm weathers...
11:07:25 <boily> AnotherTest: AnothellorTest. which was your closest weather station?
11:07:35 <lambdabot> ENVA 081050Z 16014KT CAVOK 10/M00 Q1021 TEMPO 16018G30KT RMK WIND 670FT 18022KT
11:08:02 <boily> @tell oerjan your negative cow is humid.
11:08:13 <lambdabot> KATL 081052Z 09003KT 10SM SCT250 17/14 A3012 RMK AO2 SLP195 T01670139
11:08:18 <lambdabot> KSFO 081056Z 00000KT 10SM SCT200 16/12 A3008 RMK AO2 SLP186 T01560122 $
11:09:02 <lambdabot> RKSI 081100Z 28013KT 240V310 9999 FEW030 BKN100 20/14 Q1011 NOSIG
11:10:33 <lambdabot> CYOW 081100Z 35006KT 15SM FEW250 03/01 A3020 RMK CI1 SLP229
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11:16:22 <mroman> Can't gdb just do function stepping?
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11:18:56 <int-e> mroman: doesn't 'n' do that?
11:19:51 <int-e> or 'ni' if you're on the instruction level (skip over calls)
11:20:44 <mroman> no, next stepts to the next source line
11:21:08 <int-e> I guess I don't know what you mean by function stepping
11:21:22 <mroman> break right after every call obviously
11:21:38 <mroman> I wanna trace what functions are called
11:23:17 <int-e> okay... I don't think so (except that, obviously, you can set breakpoints on all functions of interest)
11:24:00 <int-e> Then again I'm not a gdb expert.
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11:28:00 <mroman> and does objdump have a switch so it outputs the assembly only
11:28:03 <mroman> without addresses and raw bytes
11:28:48 <Jafet> Use the universal remote control, perl -e.
11:29:34 <Jafet> Hmm, a language based on tensile strengths
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13:52:50 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[XEec]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44638&oldid=44636 * 176.6.115.121 * (+144) /* xEec instructions set */
13:54:36 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[XEec]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44639&oldid=44638 * 176.6.115.121 * (+0) /* xEec instructions set */
13:59:02 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[XEec]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44640&oldid=44639 * 176.6.115.121 * (-42) /* xEec instructions set */
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14:21:46 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[XEec]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44641&oldid=44640 * 46.114.10.209 * (+78) /* Cat */
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16:43:53 <lambdabot> boily said 5h 35m 51s ago: your negative cow is humid.
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17:32:23 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Beam]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44642&oldid=42097 * 69.193.26.210 * (+89) Added link to newer interpreter
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19:08:20 <izabera> \oren\: http://imgur.com/gallery/TWqZjnB add these
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19:35:48 <oerjan> is hackage slow as molasses for everyone
19:36:16 <Taneb> I've never seen any molasses
19:36:24 <Taneb> I don't even know how to pronounce the word
19:36:33 <Taneb> Is it molASSes? MOLasses?
19:36:44 <oerjan> i've been assuming the first
19:37:07 <Taneb> Well, it seems pretty speedy to me
19:37:29 <zzo38> How slow is molasses?
19:37:43 <Taneb> myname, I've been speaking English since I was very small, I know just how bad it is
19:38:03 <fizzie> Taneb: molASSes is kind of like how Google's TTS pronounced it to me.
19:46:26 <olsner> molasses is faster than people, when you have enough of it
19:47:25 <oerjan> Gregor: help HackEgo's repository browser page still redirects me to codu.org/ tdnh
19:48:01 <olsner> (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Molasses_Flood)
19:50:15 <fizzie> oerjan: But how can that be.
19:50:38 <int-e> oerjan: that's only happening to you, I believe
19:53:16 <int-e> oerjan: does your client "correct" codu.org to www.codu.org?
19:53:45 <fungot> ^<lang> <code>; ^def <command> <lang> <code>; ^show [command]; lang=bf/ul, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]; ^style [style]; ^bool
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19:54:55 <oerjan> int-e: i'm including the http:// part, so it shouldn't...
19:56:07 * oerjan tries adding www. to check if that changes anything
19:56:40 <zzo38> Did you try curl/wget/nc?
19:57:01 <int-e> oerjan: adding www. results in a redirect to the codu.org root for me, that's why I'm asking.
19:57:30 <oerjan> those would be on a different machine anyway
19:58:26 <int-e> interestingly, http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ now seems to time out from here. isn't that fun...
19:58:34 <oerjan> curl _does_ redirect to codu.org/
19:59:24 <oerjan> on a completely different machine (still in trondheim, though)
19:59:52 <oerjan> i somehow pasted the version with www.
20:00:04 <int-e> let's see. "www.codu.org has address 109.68.33.18" "codu.org has address 64.62.173.65"
20:00:26 <oerjan> ok now it's just stalling
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20:03:09 <int-e> other repos like http://codu.org/projects/egobot/hg/ work... hmm.
20:04:12 <int-e> so is the fshg thing a kind of proxy setup to the hackego host?
20:04:34 <int-e> I mean it stopped working about the same time as hackego left the channel
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20:13:52 <lambdabot> ENVA 081950Z 08005KT 030V120 CAVOK 08/01 Q1022 RMK WIND 670FT 15011KT
20:16:01 <oerjan> @tell Jafet <Jafet> Hmm, a language based on tensile strengths <-- i think that's a bit of a stretch.
20:18:24 <int-e> the puns and punches are flying low today
20:18:46 <int-e> (though I guess I have no right to complain about the former)
20:18:56 <zzo38> Is there the DVI->Fax program that does not use PostScript? A mode file for METAFONT that is suitable for faxes should also be used.
20:19:23 <oerjan> i'm just happy boily didn't see it twnhh
20:20:04 <b_jonas> zzo38: you could render a DVI to a bitmap image, and then pass that bitmap image to a fax program
20:20:17 <b_jonas> fax transmits a bitmap image afterall, right?
20:20:50 * oerjan must. remember. to. eat.
20:20:54 <b_jonas> I don't know what resolution those things have
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20:21:26 <b_jonas> I mean, I keep hearing of all the bureaucratic institutions that require using fax, but luckily I don't generally communicate with those.
20:21:47 <int-e> b_jonas: That's how metafont enters the picture, it's how tex's fonts used to be rendered to bitmap fonts at various sizes and resolutions.
20:22:03 <oerjan> hm the logs weren't as big as they looked
20:22:26 <zzo38> DVI isn't so complicated so I might try to make up my own program if it is needed, too.
20:22:30 * int-e recalls setting up special 100? maybe even 50? dpi modes to save disk space for those cached bitmap fonts...
20:22:48 <int-e> (which were only used for viewing stuff on screen)
20:23:10 <zzo38> You can use PK fonts to save disk space too
20:24:25 <int-e> I suspect I did that as well
20:24:43 <b_jonas> int-e: I can see why you'd want metafont settings to make a suitable font,
20:25:07 <b_jonas> but why would you need a new program for rendering the DVI? couldn't any DVI to bitmap program work, if you tell it the right fonts and resolution?
20:26:51 <fizzie> int-e: Also I didn't notice HackEgo left the channel, it was working for me just a while ago.
20:27:17 <fizzie> int-e: By "yes" I mean, yes, the fshg URL is a reverse proxy setup to www2.codu.org, or something like that.
20:27:20 <int-e> 21:53:57 --- HackEgo has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20:27:25 <int-e> 22:27:20 <int-e> 21:53:57 --- HackEgo has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20:27:48 <fizzie> Well, a "while" can be long.
20:27:51 <int-e> (I'm too lazy to compute the difference myself ;-)
20:28:07 <zzo38> I also have a "HP LaserJet P1102w" printer so what METAFONT modes can be used for it, and then how to tell dvilj to use those settings?
20:28:42 <fizzie> All three of codu.org, www.codu.org and www2.codu.org resolve to different addresses.
20:29:00 <int-e> b_jonas: sorry, I didn't think enough about how much of the problem rendering to bitmaps would solve... my bad.
20:29:38 <fizzie> The last one is where HackEgo lives, and also the repository browser, in a strictly physical sense.
20:30:03 <fizzie> The machine isn't answering SSH, which probably means our wiki is also down.
20:31:15 <zzo38> Making DVI->fax might be useful if you go to a hotel and your portable computer does not have a printer built-in, you could connect it to the telephone line and then send a fax to the front desk.
20:31:23 <b_jonas> what resolution does fax have?
20:31:25 <int-e> Hmm, my CaC VM is still running. Oh well.
20:32:39 <fizzie> b_jonas: They've got different levels in different standards.
20:32:49 <fizzie> But the most basic one is 100dpi, I think.
20:33:20 <int-e> @googe fax resolutions
20:33:22 <lambdabot> http://support.faxbetter.com/knowledgebase/articles/44704-at-what-resolution-ppi-dpi-do-you-transmit-and
20:33:22 <lambdabot> Title: At what resolution (ppi, dpi) do you transmit and receive faxes? – Feedback...
20:33:49 <b_jonas> fizzie: wait, is it the same horizontal and vertical resolution?
20:33:57 <fizzie> Wikipedia seems to say 100x100dpi for "basic", 200x100 for "standard", 200x200 for "fine", 200x400 for "superfine", 400x400 for "ultrafine".
20:34:14 <fizzie> (That's horizontal x vertical.)
20:34:29 <b_jonas> ah, and apparently it's not a bitmap, but a graymap!
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20:35:14 <b_jonas> in that case, you need something other than metafont, because you want a 100 dpi _graymap_ font
20:35:56 <fizzie> The resolutions at that @googe result are close, but slightly different. (204x98 and so on.)
20:36:09 <zzo38> It is not really a problem; you can still use a bitmap font, I expect.
20:36:27 <b_jonas> zzo38: you can, but at 100 dpi, graymap font would look much better
20:36:41 <b_jonas> I mean, 100x100 dpi with not very large letters
20:36:48 <fizzie> Also I thought it was a bitmap? (Except for old-fashioned analog faxes.)
20:36:49 <zzo38> Even if you do want grayscales, METAFONT can write arbitrary specials to output as well.
20:36:55 <b_jonas> bitmap can still work, but graymap could work much better
20:37:17 <b_jonas> fizzie: I don't know. apparently there are way more different fax formats than I ever imagined
20:37:23 <b_jonas> like, including digitally compressed ones and stuff
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20:37:27 <fizzie> 'pedia: "Later, other compression techniques were added as options to ITU-T recommendation T.30, such as the more efficient JBIG (T.82, T.85) for bi-level content, and JPEG (T.81), T.43, MRC (T.44), and T.45 for grayscale, palette, and colour content."
20:37:29 <b_jonas> I thought there would be only one or two
20:37:36 <zzo38> You could then make higher resolution and then downscale them into graymap fonts
20:37:48 <fizzie> JPEG in a fax, what a crazy world.
20:38:13 <b_jonas> zzo38: perhaps yes, if you're enoguh of a metafont hacker to make them look nice
20:38:47 <zzo38> You could make it to output special commands to help with such purposes
20:42:17 <zzo38> But I think faxes can use bitmap formats too; that is what I read and heard everywhere?
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20:45:16 <zzo38> I had used ASCII PBM format for including pictures in documents with TeX, but ASCII PBM files are very large and the output will also be very large; I want to see if I can make up the shorter format.
20:45:33 <b_jonas> zzo38: probably, in which case metafont is fine if you can make the right font
20:45:55 <b_jonas> um, that's for bitmap faxes
20:46:17 <b_jonas> zzo38: um, use a font that contains each combination of eight pixels in a column?
20:46:48 <zzo38> b_jonas: Yes, the METAFONT documentation describes such a font encoding actually
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20:51:00 <b_jonas> zzo38: I was also thinking that you could show bitmap images in VGA text mode by loading such a font and setting the font height to 2 or 1 (depending on whether the video cards can handle height 1).
20:51:51 <zzo38> It is called "gray font" format, and is intended for printing out proof sheets of fonts. However you have to consider the printer's resolutions as they may be different by printers.
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20:54:53 <b_jonas> zzo38: well sure, you want a resolution supported by the printer exactly.
20:56:58 <zzo38> Yes, and then it is not device-independent. That is why I made the .PBM parser
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21:02:18 <fizzie> b_jonas: The best reference I know for VGA register programming -- http://www.osdever.net/FreeVGA/vga/vgatext.htm -- says "Fonts are either 8 or 9 pixels wide and can be from 1 to 32 pixels high."
21:03:11 <int-e> well, the 9 pixels is a bit of a lie.
21:04:14 <fizzie> But there's a hack to make characters 0xc0..0xdf copy their 8th column to the 9th column, so you get continuous horizontal lines.
21:04:39 <fizzie> (For the others it's always blank.)
21:05:19 <int-e> I didn't remember the precise range of characters.
21:06:46 <fizzie> You don't get contiguous "grayscale" blocks, but I guess it would look bad anyway, since you couldn't continue the pattern.
21:08:10 <fizzie> The dot matrix printer I had (have?... actually, where is that thing) has a "graphics" mode that is based on sending bytes that describe one column of 8 pixels.
21:08:25 <fizzie> Pretty much the same thing, except the font is 1 pixel wide and 8 pixels high.
21:08:36 <int-e> does it also have another mode where you send two bytes and drive a 9th needle?
21:09:00 <fizzie> I don't think it had that. You're supposed to just set the line advance parameters so that it lines up.
21:09:31 <fizzie> I don't think it was very accurate about that, so everything printed had a slight stripeyness in it.
21:11:09 <fizzie> Now that I think of it, I think the printer is in our basement in Finland. I remember having plans to hook it up with a stack of paper as a permanent IRC log printer, but it was just too inconvenient.
21:11:34 <int-e> I recall my family's dot matrix printer coming with a manual that described how to use its various modes (escape sequences... I believe even some code examples)
21:11:55 <fizzie> This had no manuals by the time I got it.
21:12:06 <int-e> Times have changed so much.
21:12:12 <fizzie> But it was semi-compatible with something-or-another, so I got by with internet and experimentation.
21:12:38 <fizzie> Probably ESC/P something.
21:16:32 <fizzie> Although I have a vague impression it could've been something less common. I can't write the related sources anywhere.
21:17:16 <zzo38> I have used ESC/P and if there is emulator could use it to convert ESC/P into DVI
21:22:15 <int-e> we had some citizen swift 9 pin printer
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21:55:13 <fizzie> I think I had a Huyndai.
21:55:38 <fizzie> Last I looked, I could even find a photo, but at the moment "hyundai dot matrix printer" image search just turns up matrix printers from all kinds of other manufacturers.
21:57:57 <fizzie> Logs suggest it looked a lot like Hyundai HDP-920 but might not have been exactly that model.
21:59:33 <fizzie> http://ru.pc-history.com/wp-content/uploads/prn_hyundahdp-920.JPG <- like that.
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22:16:42 <oerjan> yes! adding www2. worked
22:18:24 <olsner> incidentally, I'll be in france next week
22:18:33 <oerjan> the repository browser still has trouble with actually including stuff
22:18:39 <boily> . o O ( hickeg? häppåre? )
22:19:06 <oerjan> boily: i just efficientized by greeting HackEgo simultaneously hth
22:19:45 <olsner> boily: häppåre = hej på dig = "hi on you"
22:20:10 <boily> olsner: td swedishly h.
22:20:37 <oerjan> i think that swedish is somewhat spoken colloquial
22:21:12 <boily> ça m'surprend pas vraiment là là.
22:21:23 <olsner> it would sound really weird to try to speak written swedish
22:21:59 <HackEgo> monittaan viiniimpärit väistanila pyöräisemmassa käytyväksemme peräisi havaksisi verokaan elälläni soviinsa taktiivimma spekistä syrjistuenne afaattamme täytyvä venevittämäämme rinänneisissa kilisimmat paneutteettämmässä tekehnoimissi
22:22:21 <boily> olsner: apparently, this thing is sold at our Ikeas → http://www.ikea.com/us/en/images/products/smorgaskaviar-fish-roe-spread__0145842_PE304961_S4.JPG
22:22:44 <fizzie> The Ikeas here sell fish and chips.
22:22:47 <fizzie> I guess it makes sense.
22:22:53 <olsner> oh, hmm, "I think that swedish" or "I think *that* swedish" changes the meaning of what oerjan said, not sure which was meant
22:22:56 <fizzie> I just got the meatballs.
22:24:01 <olsner> boily: I thought they sold kalles kaviar, but apparently they replaced that with ikea-brand kaviar
22:24:01 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/devious
22:24:04 <HackEgo> int-e int-e ais523 oerjan elliott Bike FreeFull ais523 ais523 shachaf
22:24:19 <fizzie> Also, they've got veggie balls, but maybe that's a more global new thing.
22:25:04 <fizzie> "Now there’s a ball for everyone"
22:25:05 <boily> olsner: wouldn't know. I only tasted that thing for the first time last week, and the packaging was completely different.
22:25:14 * oerjan has some kaviar in the fridge
22:25:24 <boily> HERESY! a meatball has MEAT!
22:25:30 <olsner> boily: what did you think about kaviar then?
22:25:39 <oerjan> not that brand, though.
22:25:41 <boily> olsner: very good! loved it!
22:26:00 <fizzie> boily: A metaball has metadata.
22:26:56 <boily> metaball... hmm... a Swedish turducken?
22:27:16 <oerjan> I,I "i didn't know fish had balls"
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22:27:27 <fizzie> There was some sort of a thing about the Finnish ads or packaging or something of Kalles kaviar ("Kallen mätitahna").
22:27:52 <fizzie> Like, they had cropped a image in a humorously interpretable way, or something.
22:28:09 <olsner> boily: boiled egg with kaviar is nice too
22:29:36 <olsner> or sandwich with sliced boiled egg and kaviar on top
22:36:18 <olsner> is the kaviar expensive over there?
22:40:15 <olsner> hm, I have no idea how much kalles costs here though, so I wouldn't be able to tell if it was expensive anyway
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22:42:49 <fizzie> Ikea SMÖRGÅSKAVIAR is £1.25/0.19 kg in the UK catalog.
22:43:00 <fizzie> I don't think I've seen the real one here.
22:43:27 <boily> it's CAD 2.49 + 15% tax per 0.419 lb.
22:43:42 <fizzie> There's a place called http://nordicbakery.com/ in London we've been thinking of visiting.
22:45:56 <fizzie> Also! The Ikea KANELBULLAR are rolled completely the wrong way, from the Finnish perspective.
22:46:41 <fizzie> They look like https://krausnickitchen.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/img_4711.jpg when they should look like http://40.media.tumblr.com/9229b5efa370474bc9994224799372e5/tumblr_mg5x9ok8eD1rog7oso1_500.jpg
22:47:05 <fizzie> I have to admit it doesn't affect the taste very much, but it still feels wrong.
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23:29:54 <\oren\> I've now noticed that some of my kanji don't line up
23:30:10 <\oren\> I'm gonna try to fix it
23:31:26 <boily> there's a kanjing lining to every font in the cloud.
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23:43:15 <HackEgo> bdsm/BDSM definitely isn't a kind of LARP and Taneb definitely did not invent it.
23:43:23 <HackEgo> lorem ipsum/Business Internet the it China Product Product NATO
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23:45:13 <olsner> fizzie: finland is doing it wrong, not ikea
23:45:44 <olsner> those finnish ones look like over-sized gifflar
23:47:28 <olsner> (e.g. https://d1vlhxry9oul9s.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/pagen_gifflar_cinnamon.jpg)
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