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00:10:12 <wob_jonas> Argh, this stupid cycle, when I add disinfectant liquid (iodine-based) to the wounds on my hand, then I try to wash (with warm water) the liquid from the parts of the skin where it's not needed (it has some side effects), then add disinfectant liquid again to the wounds where it accidentally washed off (warm water solves it really well, and both wa
00:10:12 <wob_jonas> ter and the disinfectant can spread out on my hand so they're hard to localize), then wash it off again.
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09:54:54 <wob_jonas> The Magyar Tudományos Akadémia I. Nyelv- és Irodalomtudományok Osztálya (Hungarian Academy of Sciences, I. Section of Linguistics and Literary Scholarship) weren't such a collective holy paladins trying to uphold the rules they extrapolate from tradition, despite that the extrapolation is chaotic and their choices often have no reason.
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10:13:11 <wob_jonas> They don't have much power on language use, because most people just ignore their rules, but they do control the Hungarian part of allowing giving names to people in official IDs. They insist that a name can only be used as a Hungarian given name if it is either unambiguously male name or unambiguously female name, despite that they already have pr
10:13:11 <wob_jonas> ecedents that go against this, namely "Abigél" as a female given name when "Abigail" is used as both male and female elsewhere.
10:17:24 <wob_jonas> How are we supposed to slowly erode the stupid traditional distinction of male and female given names (with a much worse choice in female give names too) if they insist on that, and we have to use one of the several loopholes nominally involving foreign cultures or foreign countries to put other given names in our ID cards?
10:19:41 <wob_jonas> For reference, MTA I. Oszt. summarizes those rules on http://www.nytud.hu/oszt/nyelvmuvelo/utonevek/alapelvek.html
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12:10:59 <wob_jonas> This is getting ridiculous. The president of Kazahstan has declared that their country will urgently start using a latin letter alphabet for writing the kazak language, and he has announced three alphabets so far, in 2017-09, 2017-10, and 2018-02 respectively, each of the three different from each other and every latin writing or transcription used
12:10:59 <wob_jonas> for the kazak language before, and apparently each time with not enough details to figure out the correct writing of every word.
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12:16:29 <wob_jonas> Even apart from what the poor schoolchildren have to endure if the change of writing system is actually carried out in the impossibly fast pace like the president suggests, I wonder if the President at least personally went and queued in the local government office to get new ID papers with his middle name written with a starting Ә, Ae, Aʼ, and Á r
12:17:44 <wob_jonas> You know, to serve as a good example for his people, like communist dictators should do.
12:21:25 <wob_jonas> Nah, that sucks. My snarky comment after the 2017-10 about Orwell and re-engraving all the marble statues and entering in people's houses to replace their instructions for use of their washing machine was better.
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13:33:40 <esowiki> [[Pxem]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57772&oldid=57770 * YamTokWae * (+117)
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13:46:42 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Strona * New user account
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15:13:43 <int-e> TIL that the US hyphenation of "analysis" is "anal-y-sis"; the British respect etymology and use "ana-ly-sis". *sigh*
15:14:27 <Taneb> int-e: ooh, that's a subtle difference I hadn't noticed
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19:29:59 <john_metcalf> Is something like this considered bad programming practice in C?
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19:38:09 <izabera> the only way to know is to get a job as a c programmer in a team with other people and try to get it past code review
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19:47:30 <john_metcalf> I live in the middle of no-where. No tech jobs here!
19:59:43 <\oren\> it is bad programming practice chiefly because it's hard to tell from a glance what it is doing
20:02:20 <pikhq_> I'm also reasonably sure it's UB, since it modifies the same variable twice without an intervening sequence point.
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20:14:20 <int-e> pikhq_: IIRC assignments are sequence points
20:14:50 <pikhq_> I did not see them listed as such.
20:14:59 <pikhq_> (I might've just missed it though)
20:15:11 <pikhq_> Of course, even if it's defined behavior it's awfully naughty to do that.
20:15:19 <pikhq_> (see also: we're debating whether it is. :))
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20:17:23 <int-e> pikhq_: Nah it looks like I was wrong. I guess it was wishful thinking on my part.
20:18:39 <wob_jonas> \oren\: it's part of a code that attempts to compute the GCD of machine integers, or integers in machine floating points. Isn't that obvious? It's a version of Euclid's algorithm.
20:19:21 <wob_jonas> I don't know what code you have to put around it to make it correct, or if it ever can, but what it is _trying_ to do is obvious enough.
20:20:56 <int-e> see the first runner-up at http://www.underhanded-c.org/_page_id_16.html
20:21:18 <wob_jonas> The xor-swap thing isn't even wrong here, because if this is C and there are no macro tricks and it compiles, then a and b are distinct objects and the compilers knows that, and a good modern compiler will know that it's effectively a swap and optimize it correctly.
20:22:18 <wob_jonas> If you use the xor-swap thing on objects that are sometimes the same, that's generally bad code, but on objects known at compile time to be non-overlapping it's not a problem.
20:22:55 <int-e> and it's still bad code
20:23:19 <pikhq_> You know what's more important than the compiler?
20:23:23 <wob_jonas> int-e: that runner-up uses xor-swap on objects that may be the same, and that's the bug in it (or one of the bugs).
20:23:37 <wob_jonas> pikhq: sadly, humans knew the xor-swap thing before compilers did.
20:23:49 <pikhq_> *Some* humans know the xor-swap thing.
20:24:15 <pikhq_> If your code relies on the reader knowing this "one weird trick", and there's little to no benefit from doing it other than showing you're clever, it's bad code.
20:24:38 <int-e> how about... x = x + y; y = x - y; x = x - y;
20:25:18 <int-e> it almost works for floats, works for unsigned integers, and can cause undefined behavior for signed integers
20:25:27 <pikhq_> Still bad, when there's tmp = x; x = y; y = tmp; which is rather more obvious. :)
20:25:42 <wob_jonas> int-e: that can be undefined behavior because of overflow if x and y are integrals that aren't unsigned, and can produce incorrect result for floats, and I've no idea what it does for bools in C
20:26:33 <int-e> thanks for repeating what I wrote?
20:26:41 <FireFly> What does the while loop with the %= a actually do?
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20:26:50 <FireFly> Like I recognised the xorswap, but I'm not sure what it accomplishes in full
20:26:58 <int-e> FireFly: euclidean algorithm
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20:27:06 <int-e> (which has been mentioned before)
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20:28:11 <int-e> gcd(int a, int b) { for (;;) { if (b == 0) return a; b %= a; if (a == 0) return b; a %= b; } } // yay, no swaps.
20:28:55 <int-e> gcd(int a, int b) { for (;;) { if (b == 0) return a; a %= b; if (a == 0) return b; b %= a; } } // yay, no swaps, and not dividing by 0...
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20:39:30 <wob_jonas> int-e: yes, but there's rarely a point to do either. division by a machine-sized variable is always so slow that unless you're micro-optimizing for decoded instruction cache or something crazy like that, you should probably use the algorithm with the bitwise shift and subtraction (TAOCP ch. 4.5.2 Algorithm B) instead.
20:40:26 <wob_jonas> Or just get one of the free software libraries implementing a fixed-integer gcd for you from the internets.
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