00:00:00 <b_jonas> Happy New Year to the +00:00 timezone offset! Happy New Year HackEso.
00:00:19 <oerjan> `botsnack with cognac chocolate
00:00:53 <b_jonas> do any of the other bots have a well-defined timezone?
00:00:58 <lambdabot> Local time for b_jonas is Wed Jan 1 01:00:54 2020
00:01:04 <lambdabot> I live on the internet, do you expect me to have a local time?
00:01:42 <oerjan> lambdabot used to be even more snarky back when @vixen worked
00:01:49 <lambdabot> You won't have Nixon to kick around anymore, because, gentlemen, this is my last press conference.
00:01:57 <kmc> i find it hilarious
00:02:03 <kmc> that @vixen was removed for being offensive
00:02:07 <kmc> so now it auto-corrects to @nixon
00:02:13 <kmc> which is more offensive
00:02:15 <lambdabot> I can take it. The tougher it gets, the cooler I get.
00:02:17 <lambdabot> In a flat choice between smoke and jobs, we're for jobs...But just keep me out of trouble on environmental issues.
00:02:48 <oerjan> kmc: yeah but @nixon is just politically offensive, while @vixen was occasionlly nsfw
00:03:05 <oerjan> not that i actually consider nsfw more than an american obsession
00:03:19 <kmc> there are some choice quotes about the blacks and the jews in there
00:03:40 <b_jonas> when's the next new year? do we have anyone to the east of the big -05:00 timezone?
00:03:41 <oerjan> i suppose those could be nsfw as well
00:03:54 <HackEso> Canaima is a secret Venezuelan project to overrun #esoteric with incomprehensible people who have no idea why they're here.
00:04:19 <kmc> `? cannabis
00:04:38 <oerjan> are you implying venezuelans would be?
00:04:59 <oerjan> although i banned canaima users so there are a lot fewer than there used to
00:05:19 <oerjan> (they were pretty much entirely lost people)
00:05:50 <kmc> 23:20 < kmc> though i'm sure if you went through the logs you could find loads of embarrassing things i've said
00:05:52 <oerjan> occasionally someone gets through who has changed the default username
00:05:53 <kmc> 23:20 < kmc> @nixon
00:05:55 <b_jonas> oerjan: they would be, they're in -04:00 timezone offset, but I was more like asking HackEso because I don't remember what geographical place canaima was associated with
00:05:56 <kmc> 23:20 < lambdabot> I'm glad I'm not Brezhnev. Being the Russian leader in the Kremlin. You never know if someone's tape recording what you say.
00:08:28 <oerjan> quote of the century, that
00:08:46 <b_jonas> but even apart from that, there could be someone from the -03 or -04 timezones just randomly here. I know there are some south americans on the internet who speak English.
00:09:26 <b_jonas> I wonder why this channel has nobody from australia or new zealand by the way. maybe those countries are too sane and #esoteric attracts us crazy ones only.
00:09:47 <b_jonas> I mean in general, not during the current fires in particular.
00:09:48 <oerjan> b_jonas: itidus was australian, though not particularly sane
00:10:15 <b_jonas> like, some of them don't have internet access right now, or are evacuated and have bigger problems than chatting on #esoteric
00:10:42 <b_jonas> and HackEgo used New Zealand locale but UTC timezone I believe
00:10:59 <bunnyocto19> hm nah australia seems to have pretty high insanity rates
00:10:59 <oerjan> i suspect it may be just time zone making it awkward for them?
00:11:29 <bunnyocto19> maybe it's just the wrong kind of insanity
00:11:40 <b_jonas> oerjan: oh come on, we have people with the weirdest circadian rhythms here, like Europeans active during american times
00:12:05 <bunnyocto19> people who use python are logically insane
00:12:43 <oerjan> bunnyocto19: hm wait are you mroman in very slight disguise
00:13:25 <b_jonas> oerjan: it took me a long time to realize that as well
00:13:35 <oerjan> no, for blsq, but you spoke about the author in third person so i first thought it was _not_ you
00:14:00 <oerjan> but just now that australian thing got me to check your whois
00:14:39 <oerjan> (irc whois + unix whois, in combination)
00:14:54 <oerjan> bunnyocto19: it gives an ip which the other whois tells is swiss
00:15:07 <b_jonas> bunnyocto19: it says you're using webchat
00:15:59 <oerjan> sure, but a swiss who does burlesque? seemed more likely it was the same person.
00:16:02 -!- bunnyocto19 has changed nick to mroman.
00:16:45 <mroman> and by them I mean my insurance provider.
00:17:00 <HackEso> Wed Jan 1 00:16:59 UTC 2020
00:17:08 <HackEso> Today is Sweetmorn, the 1st day of Chaos in the YOLD 3186
00:17:22 <kmc> happy 3186
00:17:40 <mroman> oerjan: burlesque is getting maintained again at least
00:17:43 <kmc> what sets the year 0 of the discordian calendar, again?
00:18:37 <mroman> i'm on work disability
00:18:40 <oerjan> <b_jonas> oerjan: oh come on, we have people with the weirdest circadian rhythms here, like Europeans active during american times <-- yeah but it still stacks the probabilities against them
00:18:47 <mroman> not sure they would count chatting as work or something.
00:19:16 <fizzie> kmc: Hmm, I don't know. The calendar page just says "[1970 = 3136]".
00:19:43 <mroman> and legally the gov is allowed to spy on people on disability
00:19:50 <b_jonas> mroman: oh, only that? so it's not, like, you're inpatient in a hospital and banned from using the internet at certain times but smuggled in a device (come on, that's a serious possibility, people on #esoteric reported that)
00:20:10 <mroman> I used to be banned from the internet
00:20:32 <fizzie> kmc: Oh, apparently it's because the Curse of Greyface happened in the year 1166 B.C.
00:20:38 <mroman> that's part of the abuse story
00:20:40 <kmc> b_jonas: hm, I have a guess who that would have been
00:20:55 <mroman> which i'm legally not going to tell any details until the case is settled
00:21:11 <fizzie> "In the year 1166 B.C., a malcontented hunchbrain by the name of Greyface, got it into his head that the universe was as humorless as he, and he began to teach that play was sinful because it contradicted the ways of Serious Order."
00:21:23 <kmc> story checks out
00:22:09 <mroman> i mean most hospitals allow you to use your phones and laptopts
00:22:16 <mroman> heard different things about the US
00:22:17 <b_jonas> mroman: makes sense to not want that on a channel that is publicly logged forever
00:22:35 <b_jonas> mroman: yes, but I specifically said banned during part of the day
00:23:04 <b_jonas> and it's during the night in switzerland
00:23:08 <mroman> they only do that for punishments
00:23:13 <mroman> but not as a general rule
00:23:42 <mroman> basically if you're a 25y old adult who behaves like a 14 crappy teenager they'll do the "give me your phone" stuff with certain patients
00:23:59 <mroman> but adult patients know the rules: "during sessions don't use your phone. inbetween sessions use it"
00:24:11 <mroman> those who don't get that will get their phones confiscated
00:24:29 <mroman> so it's only really a problem for adults who aren't really adults
00:24:57 <mroman> there's a no TV until 4pm rule
00:25:02 <b_jonas> ok, this doesn't quite match my evidence, but it could differ between countries or between hospitals or between parts of a hospital I guess
00:25:10 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Lebster * New user account
00:25:21 <mroman> you're just not allowed to take pictures of other people
00:25:49 <oerjan> i'd be surprised if these rules were at all standardized across countries
00:25:56 <mroman> yeah I heard stories about the US where having your smartphone taken away is common procedure
00:26:04 <oerjan> beyond things bad enough to be human rights violations
00:26:12 <mroman> doesn't really happen here unless you have to go to isolation
00:26:27 <mroman> but even then... only under extreme circumstances
00:27:12 <mroman> if you're an immediate suicide risk you'll be put into isolation with all your clothes taken away and replaced through hospital clothes
00:27:18 <mroman> there'll be one mattress on the floor.
00:27:31 <mroman> all other items are taken away
00:27:48 <b_jonas> no pictures, sure, that applies to basically the whole hospital, because there are other people there
00:28:14 <mroman> that's usually just for one night or something and then you're transfered to a regular room
00:29:07 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68515&oldid=68487 * Lebster * (+234) /* Introductions */
00:29:08 <mroman> there was just one patient who had a smartphone ban but they used it for disciplinary stuff because that patient was a cranky teenager at 25 or something.
00:29:27 <mroman> well you can take pictures of the rooms here
00:29:31 <mroman> as long as they're empty
00:29:41 <mroman> some hospitals don't even allow you that
00:29:58 <mroman> what do you have to hide?
00:30:04 <mroman> or maybe it's a security issue
00:30:39 <b_jonas> mroman: even if the room doesn't have doctors or patients in it, it probably has stuff of other patients, because you're not getting a private room
00:31:09 <mroman> you just have to be crazy enough and you'll get a private room
00:31:21 <b_jonas> also it's easier to just ban pictures during the whole hospital without trying to discriminate the finer points
00:31:27 <b_jonas> no, you have to be rich enough for a private room
00:31:41 <mroman> luckily I could fake the first and I am the second
00:32:22 <mroman> but I don't use premium privileges from my insurance
00:32:46 <mroman> don't want special treatment even though it would be covered
00:33:15 <mroman> on the other hand you could argue that a 110CHF wasted a month
00:33:34 <esowiki> [[User:Lebster]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68516 * Lebster * (+106) Created page with "I'm '''Lebster''', and I like EsoLangs! == Created Languages == * StupidStackLanguage (work-in-progress)"
00:33:49 <mroman> I just use ear plugs at night and sleep is fine
00:34:11 <mroman> don't care if there are three other people in the room. As long as I can sleep who cares
00:34:16 <mroman> unless they're violent
00:34:46 <b_jonas> mroman: would the special treatment include beds that aren't so terribly uncomfortable to sleep on that I have to put my mattress on the floor and even then can barely sleep, put it back on the bed at dawn before a nurse sees it, all while the doctors explain how important it is for my health to get a good long sleep?
00:34:54 <mroman> 8 Months hospitalisation is definitely my record though.
00:35:11 <mroman> I don't know. Our beds were decent.
00:35:13 <b_jonas> and proper chairs or benches in a place with lighting on which I can read a book?
00:35:18 <mroman> and sometimes I literally slept on the floor anyways
00:35:35 <mroman> but I can sense that hungary isn't as luxurious as switzerland probably
00:36:01 <b_jonas> well the public hospitals really suck
00:36:31 <mroman> mental hospitals generally suck
00:36:31 <b_jonas> though I admit I hate soft mattresses and soft springy bed frames, I've slept on the floor in a hotel for that reason too
00:36:36 <mroman> except for the nice private ones
00:36:59 <b_jonas> yes, mental hospitals generally suck too
00:37:08 <b_jonas> because of the other patients
00:37:09 <mroman> but private ones don't take all the patients
00:37:17 <mroman> just the patients with little ailments
00:37:20 <b_jonas> and because of all the rules that they have to enforce because of the other patients
00:37:34 <mroman> insurances pay crazy amounts of money to them due to patients.
00:38:09 <mroman> you can't put a violent patient who routinely trashes the room into a fancy 5 star private clinic with 5k in furniture per room
00:38:19 <mroman> not unless you wanna loose 5k
00:38:41 <mroman> the public ones need to be equipped to deal with the worst of the worst
00:38:48 <esowiki> [[User talk:Lebster]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68517 * Lebster * (+0) Created blank page
00:38:57 <mroman> so they treat everybody as the worst of the worst :D
00:38:58 <b_jonas> mroman: which side did you fall on when you got out of the hospital? are you eating all sorts of food with just a spoon, without a fork and knife, because you learned how to do it and are used to, or, on contrary, eating every food with a knife and fork, because you're allowed to?
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00:39:48 <b_jonas> that's a weird mental hospital then
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00:39:54 <mroman> there are open wards and closed wards
00:40:03 <mroman> but even on the closed wards you have knifes
00:40:19 <mroman> see... the trick is that if somebody were to use a knife
00:40:25 <mroman> you just isolate him from other patients
00:40:49 <mroman> that's how it's done here
00:41:05 <mroman> if they have any reason to believe you'd use a knife to injure somebody you'll be locked up in isolation
00:41:46 <b_jonas> I don't see how that works, because (1) they can use a knife on themselves, (2) they aren't rich enough to have private isolation rooms for many patients, and (3) it may be too late after they use a knife.
00:42:08 <mroman> you don't let it come to 3.
00:42:25 <mroman> 1) not when in isolation no
00:42:43 <mroman> the closed ward here has 3 isolation units.
00:43:02 <b_jonas> maybe I just didn't meet the isolated patients, by definition
00:43:09 <mroman> violent patients are really rare
00:43:15 <mroman> in the sense of "murderers"
00:43:18 <b_jonas> actually violent ones are rare, sure
00:43:20 <mroman> violent patients aren't rare
00:43:34 <mroman> but "i'm gonna stab you" violent is rather rare
00:43:55 <mroman> so you isolate them or transfer them to a better suited clinic
00:44:18 <b_jonas> that's true, they're in a different clinic
00:44:54 <mroman> there are also huge cultural differences
00:44:59 <mroman> some cultures violence is accepted more
00:45:05 <mroman> such as violence to defend your honor or whatever
00:45:15 <mroman> so naturally those countries will have more issues with violent patients
00:45:20 <mroman> swiss are inherently anti-violent.
00:46:28 <mroman> no offense to americans
00:46:35 <mroman> but I'd say that americans are more violent than swiss
00:46:45 <mroman> just the concept of bar fights
00:47:00 <mroman> there's zero tolerance for that shit
00:47:16 <mroman> if you slap another person in the face
00:47:54 <mroman> unless it's a psychiatrist
00:47:58 <mroman> they can legally slap patients
00:48:06 <mroman> psychiatrists can do pretty much anything.
00:48:25 <mroman> with the exception of sexual violence and causing death
00:48:43 <mroman> those are the three things they are legally not allowed to do
00:49:10 <mroman> other than that they're specifically allowed to do anything.
00:49:49 <mroman> yeah... few people know this...
00:50:00 <mroman> also... psychiatrists generally don't use all the stuff they could do
00:50:11 <mroman> that's probably partly the reason why most people think that they can't do that
00:50:24 <mroman> they just usually really, really don't.
00:50:40 <mroman> but they have the legal right to.
00:51:11 <mroman> my guess is one of the reasons they don't is because if they would then more people would start reading the law and the law will be changed within a month
00:51:45 <mroman> for as long as they don't do it then people have no reason to read the law and except for a few laywers and whatnot complaining about it
00:51:53 <mroman> the public sees no immediate need to change the laws
00:52:23 <mroman> people are very biased.
00:53:05 <mroman> "You know they could legally slap you?" "That can't be right?" "They can!" "Well, I was never slapped and none of my other inpatients were slapped so I don't think there's a problem"
00:54:37 <mroman> or like "so maybe they could. They never do it." Well, until they do it and you learn that it's legal and that you're fucked.
00:55:05 <mroman> people don't want to bother with problems unless it personally impacted their own lifes.
00:55:55 <mroman> anyway the takehome message is: pretty much all countrie's mental health laws are crap. we need to revise them. Have a good night.
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01:13:16 <zzo38> Now I set up a Fossil repository for TeXnicard: http://zzo38computer.org/fossil/texnicard.ui/ I also set up a NNTP for TeXnicard, described on that web page.
01:13:42 <kmc> one thing i've been learning, while the American healthcare system is fucked up in many ways, every country has some fucked up stuff
01:16:33 <zzo38> Do you like TeXnicard?
01:17:33 <kmc> I have no opinion of TeXnicard
01:17:55 <zzo38> Do you have a opinion of Magic Set Editor?
01:18:55 <zzo38> (Magic Set Editor doesn't support CMYK, I think.)
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02:18:51 <oerjan> `learn The password of the month is only if lambda is a macro
02:18:55 <HackEso> Relearned 'password': The password of the month is only if lambda is a macro
02:19:18 <oerjan> fungot: i defer to you as the expert hth
02:19:18 <fungot> oerjan: love this song reminds me of stepbrothers... dang! many props!!!! i love this song is that so good
02:20:05 <fungot> Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld enron europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack oots pa qwantz sms speeches ss wp ukparl youtube*
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02:26:36 <oerjan> hm if i'd read the logs earlier i'd not have needed to ask
02:31:24 <oerjan> `slwd `fetch//s,Ego,Eso,
02:31:28 <HackEso> `fetch//`fetch [<output-file>] <URL> downloads files, and is the only web access currently available in HackEso. It is a special builtin that cannot be called from other commands. See also `edit.
02:45:10 <oerjan> <arseniiv> and this is very inconvenient and it lasts hours <-- have you looked at this remarkable new invention called a "towel" hth
02:45:31 <oerjan> just as well e's not here
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02:57:44 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68518 * Lebster * (+1892) Created page with "'''StupidStackLanguage''' (or SSL) is an [[esoteric programming language]] created by [[User:Lebster|Lebster]] in which all operations take place on a [[Stack]] SSL Uses the..."
02:58:08 <esowiki> [[Naz]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68519&oldid=68509 * Sporeball * (+359) prove naz's computational class
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02:58:22 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life.
03:09:25 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Lebster * uploaded "[[File:Ssl.png]]"
03:10:19 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68521&oldid=68518 * Lebster * (+39)
03:12:21 <esowiki> [[Naz]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68522&oldid=68519 * Sporeball * (-409) fixes
03:18:25 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68523&oldid=68521 * Lebster * (+145)
03:20:07 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68524&oldid=68523 * Lebster * (+68) /* Operations */
03:21:12 <esowiki> [[User:Lebster]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68525&oldid=68516 * Lebster * (+4)
03:24:53 <zzo38> I read that in Magic: the Gathering, "Creatures with power 5 or more have flying" doesn't work, because the layer system first checks for abilities and then power/toughness. However, I am not so sure. I would think that determining characteristics from text and copiable values always applies. Do you know if it does or not?
03:26:49 <zzo38> I would think that "The values of an object's characteristics are determined by starting with the actual object. For a card, that means the values of the characteristics printed on that card." means it is like I said.
03:33:47 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68526&oldid=68524 * Lebster * (+77) /* Operations */
03:34:10 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68527&oldid=68526 * Lebster * (+42) /* Operations */
03:46:40 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68528&oldid=68527 * Lebster * (+117) /* Operations */
03:46:53 <esowiki> [[User:Lebster]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68529&oldid=68525 * Lebster * (-19)
03:47:05 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68530&oldid=68528 * Lebster * (+1)
03:49:13 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68531&oldid=68530 * Lebster * (+3010)
03:50:06 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68532&oldid=68531 * Lebster * (+44) /* Implementation */
04:18:52 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68533&oldid=68532 * Lebster * (+32)
04:19:18 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68534&oldid=68533 * Lebster * (+0) /* Truth-Machine */
04:19:51 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68535&oldid=68534 * Lebster * (+0) /* Truth Machine */
04:38:29 <zzo38> Does the new C specification require that 'xy'=='x'*'\1\0'+'y'*'\0\1' for any character "x" and "y"? (Some people said that it is not a valid C syntax, but I don't believe them.)
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04:56:34 <zzo38> (And, if it doesn't, they should fix it so that it does, and furthermore that 'xy' is nonzero and '\0\0' is zero.)
05:13:14 * oerjan concludes from the logs that the channel has _two_ hungarians. the humanity!
05:20:15 <esowiki> [[Convergaptor]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68536 * Hakerh400 * (+10446) +[[Convergaptor]]
05:21:45 <esowiki> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68537&oldid=68504 * Hakerh400 * (+19) +[[Convergaptor]]
05:22:10 <esowiki> [[User:Hakerh400]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68538&oldid=68014 * Hakerh400 * (+19) +[[Convergaptor]]
05:26:47 <esowiki> [[Convergaptor]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68539&oldid=68536 * Hakerh400 * (+47)
05:33:40 <esowiki> [[Convergaptor]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68540&oldid=68539 * Hakerh400 * (+0)
05:46:59 <esowiki> [[Category:2020]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68541 * Hakerh400 * (+11) Category for the new year
05:50:26 <esowiki> [[Convergaptor]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68542&oldid=68540 * Hakerh400 * (+0)
06:24:50 <esowiki> [[Template:Yearcats]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68543&oldid=58960 * Oerjan * (+59) *Poof*
06:29:28 <zzo38> Why on NMOS 6502 the instructions that seem like they should write to an immediate (according to the pattern of the opcodes) instead read it, causing mainly doing nothing important?
06:42:31 <esowiki> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68544&oldid=68537 * Lebster * (+26) /* S */
06:48:00 <HackEso> The password of the month is only if lambda is a macro
06:48:23 <oerjan> i wonder if the lost submarine gang is about to find out what trogulus was really hiding
06:48:29 <int-e> Ah, good job, fungot.
06:48:29 <fungot> int-e: i've been waiting for one of them i say more to the pilot wanted to say about her career on a&e's new music and film show private sessions. it looks good.
06:48:59 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68545&oldid=68535 * JonoCode9374 * (+61) /* Examples */
06:49:18 <oerjan> i was wondering after last comic too, although maybe not quite as strongly.
06:50:59 <oerjan> or maybe they'll find out why england is sinking. or both.
06:51:18 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68546&oldid=68545 * JonoCode9374 * (+277) /* Find the Factorial of a Number */
06:58:41 <oerjan> int-e: the spoilers are all in your head. you are feeling sleepy...
07:00:29 <int-e> oerjan: One of these days you'll spoil something significant ;)
07:00:36 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68547&oldid=68546 * Lebster * (+58) Added comment support
07:00:59 <int-e> Rather than merely reminding me how early (timely) GG updates these days.
07:01:31 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68548&oldid=68547 * Lebster * (+14) /* Find the Factorial of a Number */
07:14:52 <esowiki> [[User:Lebster]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68549&oldid=68529 * Lebster * (+37)
07:23:17 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68550&oldid=68548 * Lebster * (+157) Added categories
07:23:32 <int-e> Hmm, did mroman explain his cgi problem further? I guess not... will have to wait for him to turn up again.
07:25:12 <esowiki> [[User:Lebster]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68551&oldid=68549 * Lebster * (+22) /* Languages I like */
07:25:19 <esowiki> [[User:Lebster]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68552&oldid=68551 * Lebster * (+1) /* Languages I like */
07:25:27 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Nite).
07:27:19 <int-e> Oh, I see what the problem is... hmm.
07:36:45 <zzo38> Recently I saw a telephone that you have to wind up. I think what I heard is that the winding causes electricity on the line. Is it possible to get it to work by fixing it so that it will just interrupt the line instead rapidly, or is there other problems such as impedance mismatch or otherwise?
07:38:20 <int-e> @tell mroman The burlesque.cgi should work again... lighthttpd added URL normalization which, if enabled, seems to normalize %2B -> '+' -> ' ' even in query strings. I didn't expect that.
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07:57:48 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68553&oldid=68550 * Lebster * (-21) /* Find the Factorial of a Number */
08:06:21 -!- blsqbot has joined.
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08:32:32 <bunnyocto> !blsq {1 2 3.14159}"Hi: `,009`! `,103`! `;009`1d"bf
08:32:32 <blsqbot> | "Hi: 000000001 112 3.1000000"
08:40:45 <int-e> bunnyocto: I think I fixed the cgi issue (mroman has a message about that)
08:41:32 <int-e> (Maybe if I was hosting more than one cgi... but I'm not.)
08:45:52 <int-e> Ah, it's great to have some fixtures in life. Schlock Mercenary starts the new year with a pun.
08:52:23 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68554&oldid=68553 * Lebster * (+58) added notes & comments
08:55:57 <blsqbot> | That line gave me an error
08:56:16 <bunnyocto> !blsq {3 4}"`$`! + `! is `m+;`!"bf
08:56:41 <bunnyocto> any crazy Ideas you ever had for sprintf or something
08:58:55 <int-e> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Format_string_attack comes to mind
08:59:23 <bunnyocto> !blsq {4 0 1}"Smallest three numbers are `<`!, `! and `!"bf
08:59:24 <blsqbot> | "Smallest three numbers are 0, 1 and 4"
08:59:24 <b_jonas> Happy New Year to everyone, including those who use american timezones
08:59:42 <bunnyocto> !blsq {5 4 0 1 6}"Smallest three numbers are `<`!, `! and `!"bf
08:59:43 <blsqbot> | "Smallest three numbers are 0, 1 and 4"
09:01:37 <b_jonas> "<kmc> every country has some fucked up stuff" => welcome to the Real World that's not a perfect utopia
09:01:40 <esowiki> [[ArrowFuck]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68555&oldid=65805 * Lebster * (+0) Corrected typo in table
09:03:45 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68556&oldid=68554 * Lebster * (+0) Moved to 2020 as > 80% of work on implementation and design of language was completed in 2020
09:04:24 <HackEso> The password of the month is only if lambda is a macro
09:06:42 <bunnyocto> !blsq {{1 4 -2 3 -10 99}}"Smallest number in `^`B is `m2;`!!"bf
09:06:42 <blsqbot> | "Smallest number in [1, 4, -2, 3, -10, 99] is -10!"
09:09:35 <b_jonas> also happy third year of the Brexit, may it not be the last
09:10:27 <b_jonas> `python3 -cprint(min([float(v) for v in "1 4 -2 3 -10 99".split()]))
09:12:20 <bunnyocto> hm. can I circumvent circular imports by adding a third module?
09:13:49 <kmc> happy New Year
09:24:53 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68557&oldid=68556 * Lebster * (-1) /* Implementation */
09:27:30 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68558&oldid=68557 * Lebster * (+0) /* Implementation */
09:28:54 <HackEso> Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEso `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, idris-bot ( , jconn ) , j-bot [ , bfbot =.
09:28:55 <fungot> HackEso: the flesh of fallen angels thing.anyways i dont think i just can't get over it no one on board
09:28:55 <fungot> Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEso `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, idris-bot ( , jconn ) , j-bot [ .
09:28:59 <HackEso> Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEso `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, idris-bot ( , jconn ) , j-bot [ , bfbot =.
09:30:33 <b_jonas> fizzie: it looks as if fungot and HackEso are listening to each other
09:30:33 <fungot> b_jonas: how can u say ppl died plz
09:33:24 <b_jonas> are we starting the new year with a hearty bot loop?
09:33:43 <b_jonas> ``` f=/hackenv/bin/STOP; >$f echo $'#!/bin/sh\nrm -v /hackenv/bin/botloop'
09:34:31 <b_jonas> ^def botloop ul (`botloop)S
09:34:37 <HackEso> botloop? No such file or directory
09:34:54 <b_jonas> ``` f=/hackenv/bin/STOP; >$f echo $'#!/bin/sh\nrm -v /hackenv/bin/botloop'; chmod -c a+x "$f"
09:34:57 <HackEso> mode of '/hackenv/bin/STOP' changed from 0644 (rw-r--r--) to 0755 (rwxr-xr-x)
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09:35:27 <b_jonas> ``` f=/hackenv/bin/botloop; >$f echo $'#!/bin/sh\necho no'; chmod -c a+x "$f"
09:35:29 <HackEso> mode of '/hackenv/bin/botloop' changed from 0644 (rw-r--r--) to 0755 (rwxr-xr-x)
09:35:37 <HackEso> removed '/hackenv/bin/botloop'
09:35:40 <HackEso> botloop? No such file or directory
09:36:19 <b_jonas> ^def botloop ul (`botloop)S
09:36:36 <b_jonas> everyone, to stop the loop, say: ^def botloop ul (no)S
09:36:40 <b_jonas> everyone, to stop the loop, say: `STOP
09:36:52 <b_jonas> ``` f=/hackenv/bin/botloop; >$f echo $'#!/bin/sh\necho "^botloop"'; chmod -c a+x "$f"
09:36:54 <HackEso> mode of '/hackenv/bin/botloop' changed from 0644 (rw-r--r--) to 0755 (rwxr-xr-x)
09:37:22 <b_jonas> fungot, you can listen to HackEso more than once
09:37:23 <fungot> b_jonas: ahahahahahahha im pretty sure there will be released soon ( yeah i am a hillary clinton looks more like a biker doing ballet, except for gay flight attendants...)
09:38:13 <int-e> Hah, https://esolangs.org/logs/ looks weird.
09:38:14 <b_jonas> right, HackEso puts a prefix to it
09:38:19 <HackEso> removed '/hackenv/bin/botloop'
09:38:56 <b_jonas> int-e: https://esolangs.org/logs/2019-12-31.html#l6b
09:39:03 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds).
09:39:19 <b_jonas> check out https://esolangs.org/logs/2020.html as well
09:40:14 <int-e> Did you mean 2021...
09:47:49 <HackEso> ehco? No such file or directory
09:52:46 <esowiki> [[!!Fuck]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68559 * Lebster * (+1055) Created page with "'''!!Fuck''' is a clone of [[Brainfuck]] that uses varying amounts of !'s to indicate commands. It is a member of the [[TrivialBrainfuckSubstitution]] family of programming la..."
09:55:37 <esowiki> [[!!Fuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68560&oldid=68559 * Lebster * (+672) /* Hello World */
09:58:41 <esowiki> [[User:Lebster]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68561&oldid=68552 * Lebster * (+63) /* Created Languages */
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10:43:47 <esowiki> [[OREO]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68562 * Kamish * (+2090) Created page with "<P><b>OREO</b> - esoteric language created by [[User:Kamish|Kamish]]</P> <P>This language is useless as and all my languages lol ;)</P> <P>All programs it is as you cook cooki..."
10:47:32 <esowiki> [[Joke language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68563&oldid=67919 * Kamish * (+33)
10:48:42 <esowiki> [[OREO]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68564&oldid=68562 * Kamish * (+0)
10:48:46 <esowiki> [[User:YamTokTpaFa]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68565&oldid=65881 * YamTokTpaFa * (+147)
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10:52:34 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Kamish * uploaded "[[File:Oreo.jpg]]"
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10:53:35 <kspalaiologos> because it stopped logging, but it seems like it's there
10:54:45 <b_jonas> then I woke for the Wiener Philharmoniker Neujahrskonzert
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10:55:24 <b_jonas> the log bot seems to be there
10:57:09 <esowiki> [[OREO]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68567&oldid=68564 * Kamish * (+35)
10:58:14 <esowiki> [[User:Kamish]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68568&oldid=59908 * Kamish * (+13)
10:59:03 <esowiki> [[A]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68569&oldid=66824 * Voltage2007 * (-3)
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11:00:00 <esowiki> [[Pxem]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68570&oldid=66995 * YamTokTpaFa * (+224) /* Implementations */
11:00:18 <esowiki> [[OREO]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68571&oldid=68567 * Kamish * (+0)
11:00:48 <kingoffrance> burning canine related philharmonic new year concert
11:00:59 <esowiki> [[Pxem]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68572&oldid=68570 * YamTokTpaFa * (-19) /* External Links */ Link renewed.
11:01:38 -!- mroman has joined.
11:03:26 <esowiki> [[Ases]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68573&oldid=58537 * YamTokTpaFa * (+80) +CATs PLEASE!!!!1!!!!
11:04:20 <esowiki> [[ALPACA]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68574&oldid=54705 * YamTokTpaFa * (+23) +CAT Languages
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11:08:16 <esowiki> [[RELATIONS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68575&oldid=59903 * YamTokTpaFa * (+24) +CAT Languages ...TBH I need more specifications....
11:11:07 <esowiki> [[BF busy beaver]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68576&oldid=12053 * YamTokTpaFa * (+96) +WIP, commented your header.
11:11:29 <esowiki> [[BF busy beaver]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68577&oldid=68576 * YamTokTpaFa * (+89)
11:11:46 <esowiki> [[BF busy beaver]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68578&oldid=68577 * YamTokTpaFa * (-13)
11:12:15 <esowiki> [[@text]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68579&oldid=55383 * YamTokTpaFa * (+23)
11:13:05 <esowiki> [[What a mess!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68580&oldid=57000 * YamTokTpaFa * (+25) STOP MISSING Category:Languages!!!! Gonna be hard to manage your articles!
11:14:29 <esowiki> [[Langlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68581&oldid=68484 * YamTokTpaFa * (+24) WTF! NO CATS!
11:15:29 <esowiki> [[LOLZ]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68582&oldid=58173 * YamTokTpaFa * (+49) WTF! NO CATS!? HOW DARE YOU!!!!1111111
11:16:03 <esowiki> [[Talk:Esoteric algorithm]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68583 * YamTokTpaFa * (+168) Created page with "== Categorization of this page == How should we categorize this article? --~~~~"
11:16:40 <esowiki> [[WARP]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68584&oldid=45423 * YamTokTpaFa * (+62)
11:17:30 <esowiki> [[SASM]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68585&oldid=55930 * YamTokTpaFa * (+45)
11:18:27 <esowiki> [[Cappuccino]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68586&oldid=57889 * YamTokTpaFa * (+28)
11:18:28 <esowiki> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68587&oldid=68388 * Lebster * (+39) added SSL
11:19:46 <esowiki> [[Aeon]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68588&oldid=65365 * YamTokTpaFa * (+2) /* External links */
11:21:08 <esowiki> [[Esoteric Processor/GPU]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68589&oldid=44414 * YamTokTpaFa * (+10) +Stub
11:21:42 <esowiki> [[Onov]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68590&oldid=47352 * YamTokTpaFa * (+24) At least +CAT Languages please!!!!!!!!!!!11
11:22:52 <esowiki> [[GreenBerry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68591&oldid=55412 * YamTokTpaFa * (+23)
11:29:11 <mroman> at least he's not adding links to porn sites
11:29:22 <mroman> and at least he's not spamming this channel with !blsq commands like some other moron
11:30:05 <mroman> but that does indeed seem very odd like why would it have to manipulate query parameters like that?
11:34:07 <int-e> Yeah it's definitely wrong.
11:35:17 <mroman> btw you gave me ssh access to it right?
11:38:40 <mroman> int-e: can you replace the key with https://mroman.ch/PUB.TXT
11:40:30 <int-e> mroman: fun comment.
11:40:45 <int-e> mroman: I think I've added it.
11:41:01 <mroman> puttygen created the comment
11:43:20 <mroman> "Server refused our key"
11:51:15 <int-e> mroman: the user name is burlesque
11:53:16 <int-e> Oh, the fun of looking at auth.log.
11:54:04 <int-e> "Disconnected from invalid user rpm"
11:55:31 <int-e> But also some puzzling ones... drenthe, misiek, arnfrid, minami, vismara...
11:55:57 <int-e> (the list goes on, obviously)
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12:00:55 <b_jonas> int-e: do you make ssh claim to allow plain text password login just to collect passwords?
12:01:27 <b_jonas> especially claim to allow plain text password for the user "root" but not actually accept anything?
12:03:03 -!- kspalaiologos has joined.
12:04:13 <int-e> b_jonas: No, that's not why.
12:06:55 <int-e> b_jonas: password authentication is enabled because I've used it for non-privileged users. root has a long random password that I don't know.
12:12:38 <b_jonas> there's one more before the encores
12:19:46 <b_jonas> int-e: Wiener Philharmoniker Neujahrskonzert, live on TV
12:20:01 <b_jonas> it's a New Year tradition to watch it live
12:24:40 <b_jonas> I mean, now it's actually the encores
12:34:25 <mroman> int-e: I guess it's not longer needed anyway. TIO has Burlesque too
12:34:44 <mroman> so if you don't want to maintain the shell I can just link to TIO
12:37:08 <b_jonas> mroman: in blsq, what is the function that takes a block and an integer index and gets the element from the block at that index?
12:37:24 <b_jonas> I have difficulty reading the docs again
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12:38:22 <b_jonas> !blsq {"2HBT" "wgJ5" "aB0S" "5v1v"}0!!
12:38:25 <b_jonas> !blsq {"2HBT" "wgJ5" "aB0S" "5v1v"}1!!
12:38:30 <b_jonas> !blsq {"2HBT" "wgJ5" "aB0S" "5v1v"}0!!
12:38:51 <b_jonas> and now for the grand finale, the best part
12:39:51 <int-e> mroman: I don't really care either way.
12:39:53 <blsqbot> | wait, blsqbot answers on the channel even if I send the command in a private message?
12:41:35 <b_jonas> mroman: perhaps you want to change that so that it's easier to experiment with the bot without spamming the channel
12:41:52 <blsqbot> | That line gave me an error
12:42:15 <blsqbot> | That line gave me an error
12:42:25 <esowiki> [[Asm2bf]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68592&oldid=68475 * Palaiologos * (+1061) bitop
12:43:09 <b_jonas> is there also a function that indexes the array backwards?
12:43:30 <esowiki> [[Asm2bf]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68593&oldid=68592 * Palaiologos * (+10) hotfix, lol
12:44:06 <mroman> you mean like negative indices?
12:44:12 <mroman> -1 being the last element?
12:44:30 <b_jonas> no, more like (\l i -> l !! (length l - 1 - i))
12:44:42 <b_jonas> so 0 is the index for the last element, 1 for the last but one
12:44:47 <b_jonas> as if you indexed the reverse of the list
12:44:49 <mroman> I mean you can always just reverse it
12:45:03 <mroman> but I don't think there's a builtin for that no
12:45:22 <blsqbot> | ERROR: (line 1, column 6):
12:45:40 <blsqbot> | ERROR: (line 1, column 6):
12:48:37 <b_jonas> ok, so I don't need spaces
12:49:01 <mroman> (You need to escape \ when it's ambigous)
12:50:50 <mroman> and a char has no closing '
12:50:59 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 ... 4}si"}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si
12:51:00 <blsqbot> | {"!blsq {" "\"" "\\" "'" "\"" "\"" "\\" "\"" "\"" "'" "\"" "\"" "!blsq {" "\"" "\"" "}{3 0 ... 4}si" "\"" "}{3 0 ... 4}si"}
12:51:15 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 ... 4}siQ"}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}siQ
12:51:16 <blsqbot> | ["!blsq {", "\"", "\\", "'", "\"", "\"", "\\", "\"", "\"", "'", "\"", "\"", "!blsq {", "\"", "\"", "}{3 0 ... 4}siQ", "\"", "}{3 0 ... 4}siQ"]
12:51:24 <b_jonas> no wait, I need a concat there
12:51:55 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 ... 4}si\[Q"}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q
12:51:56 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 ... 4}si\[Q"}{3 0 ... 4}si\[Q
12:52:32 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q"}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q
12:52:33 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q"}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q
12:53:13 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q"}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q
12:53:14 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q"}{3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}si\[Q
12:56:02 <b_jonas> yeah. it's a type of quine that I like to write because it's easy to write in most languages
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13:05:27 <blsqbot> | {__INTERNAL__:BlsqAutoBlock [BlsqIdent "L[",BlsqIdent "L[",BlsqIdent "L["]}
13:08:46 <mroman> This always confuses the noobs.
13:13:26 <b_jonas> you're saying that like a lot of people learn blsq
13:13:47 <mroman> sometimes somebody has a look at it
13:14:44 <int-e> mroman: Oh well. https://redmine.lighttpd.net/issues/2999
13:15:01 <mroman> but pretty much nobody
13:15:17 <mroman> I think clock and Hendrik are still golfing in it
13:15:26 <mroman> don't know of anybody else using it
13:15:55 <mroman> and almost never need hidden state for golfing.
13:16:41 <mroman> (it's usually more convenient to use the secondary stack I guess)
13:19:10 <mroman> b_jonas: but yeah. having achieved nothing in life. blsq is pretty much my only achievment so I may go overboard a bit with it.
13:20:37 <mroman> so blsq is pretty much my way to leave something in this world people will remember me for, even if it's just very few people.
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14:16:41 <fizzie> b_jonas: Thanks. fungot's manual ignore list doesn't persist automatically and I forgot to set it after restarting it the other day.
14:16:42 <fungot> fizzie: actually i have seen in a few other things probably
14:19:38 <blsqbot> | {ERROR: Burlesque: (_+) Invalid arguments!}
14:20:31 <blsqbot> | {ERROR: Burlesque: (_+) Invalid arguments!}
14:21:02 <mroman> you can't call pe on chars
14:21:39 <mroman> ps is not defined for chars
14:21:46 <b_jonas> how do I make a one-element list from a value?
14:23:52 <mroman> depends on your exact use case
14:30:37 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XX}si\[Q"}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q
14:30:38 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XX}si\[Q"}301200100200300404XX}si\[Q
14:30:46 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XX}si\[Q"}301200100200300404XX}si\[Q
14:30:47 <blsqbot> | {3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}
14:30:47 <blsqbot> | {"\"" "\\" "'" "!blsq {" "}301200100200300404XX}si\\[Q"}
14:31:18 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q"}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q
14:31:19 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q"}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q
14:31:28 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q"}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q
14:31:29 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q"}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q
14:31:42 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q"}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q
14:31:43 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q"}301200100200300404XXsi\[Q
14:31:46 <b_jonas> ok, that's a shorter quine
14:33:22 <b_jonas> [ 5#.3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4
14:33:23 <j-bot> b_jonas: 2331592587604
14:33:39 <blsqbot> | {3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}
14:33:51 <b_jonas> !blsq 301200100200300404XX
14:33:51 <blsqbot> | {3 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 3 0 0 4 0 4}
14:34:49 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q"}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q
14:34:49 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q"}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q
14:34:56 <b_jonas> !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q"}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q
14:34:56 <blsqbot> | !blsq {"\'""\""'""!blsq {""}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q"}2331592587604 5dgsi\[Q
14:36:16 <mroman> not sure if this helps you though
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14:37:40 <b_jonas> mroman: is there a shorter way to write {}j[+ ?
14:38:10 <b_jonas> a way that works for any type of input value, not just for an integer
14:38:28 <mroman> if you want to make a block out of a single element then bx
14:39:38 <b_jonas> and is there one that pops two elements from the stack and puts them in a block of length 2 as well?
14:40:50 <blsqbot> | ERROR: Burlesque: (+]) Invalid arguments!
14:42:35 <mroman> !blsq |[5 2 .+ 3 4 .+]|
14:42:54 <mroman> maybe this way could be shorter depending on what you're exactly doing
14:43:29 <mroman> unless you only have two numbers on the stack
14:43:47 <b_jonas> um, what are |[ and ]| are they like the postscript [ and ] ?
14:44:50 <mroman> {} doesn't evaluate inbetween
14:44:57 <b_jonas> they look like the postscript [ and ] then
14:45:35 <mroman> technically speaking |[ pushes a marker to the stack and |] collects everything up to that marker
14:46:00 <mroman> (the marker that |[ pushes is |[ itself)
14:46:02 <b_jonas> but those can be hard to use in a stack language because you may need annoying temporary variables
14:48:37 <blsqbot> | That line gave me an error
14:49:17 <mroman> yeh. blsq has many ways to deal with "i need this data later" or "don't destroy this during temporary calculations"
14:49:26 <mroman> most obvious one would be using variables
14:49:39 <mroman> but there's also stuff like M-, rs and C! etc.
14:49:59 <mroman> or secondary stack, hidden state (usable but not recommended)
14:50:27 <b_jonas> what is rs ? it doesn't seem to be in the reference
14:51:20 <b_jonas> is there an index to the reference that is sorted by command name (or name of the token for things that aren't commands)?
14:52:04 <mroman> currently the "best" documentation is the moonpage+the language reference combined
14:52:12 <mroman> I'm working towards documenting everything in the moonpage
14:52:26 <mroman> https://mroman.ch/burlesque/docs/BLSQ.html#blockaccess
14:53:35 <blsqbot> | ERROR: (line 1, column 5):
14:53:38 <blsqbot> | ERROR: (line 1, column 4):
14:53:38 <blsqbot> | expecting white space, "o", "begin asm", "begin lisp", "fancy", "%", "set", "g", "get", "s", "S", "call", "proc", "m{", "f{", "r{", "q", "{", "\"", "-", digit, "'", "(", "y", "k", "`" or "``"
14:54:56 <mroman> a syntax prefix to be precise
14:55:00 <mroman> it's neither a special nor a modifier
14:55:07 <b_jonas> but aren't the prefixes ) and : and @
14:55:48 <mroman> Those are in BLSQ-Terminology called specials
14:56:29 <mroman> !blsq {1 2 3 4}")"ps(?i)[+e!
14:56:35 <mroman> so ) is not a syntax prefix
14:56:39 <b_jonas> this language is confusing
14:56:52 <mroman> ) is a special and a runtime prefix
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15:01:35 <mroman> runstack is basically an eval with a predefined stack
15:03:14 <mroman> the top of the stack for rs is on the left apparentely
15:04:59 <mroman> rz{...}m[ is basically GZ
15:07:13 <blsqbot> | Ain't nobody got output fo' that!
15:08:19 <b_jonas> mroman: what's the foreach function, which takes a list block and a code block, and for each element of the list block, pushes it to the stack then runs the code block?
15:09:42 <mroman> but basically this is just a map followed by "push elements to stack"
15:10:05 <mroman> but what's exactly the difference between map and foreach?
15:10:24 <mroman> so that you have access to past results?
15:10:29 <b_jonas> mroman: map collects the results from the stack into an array
15:11:01 <mroman> ah. there's no foreach. But you can do m[ followed by p^ or ^p depending on what order you want
15:11:19 <mroman> and maybe use pa in some cases I don't know
15:11:34 <blsqbot> | {{2} {2 3} {2 3 4} {2 3 4 5}}
15:11:50 <blsqbot> | ERROR: Can't load non hidden state! Sorry.
15:12:28 <b_jonas> what is the syntax to store to a named variable and load from it?
15:12:52 <mroman> !blsq %foobar=5 %foobar?
15:13:16 <b_jonas> I want to pop the value from the stack
15:13:20 <mroman> !blsq 5?i"foobar"sv %foobar?
15:13:44 <b_jonas> !blsq 17 50 "a"sv "b"sv %a? %a?
15:13:54 <b_jonas> and are there shortcuts for a few short variables?
15:14:03 <b_jonas> !blsq 17 50 "a"sv "a"sv %a? %a?
15:15:14 <mroman> there are s0 up to s9 for set and g0 to g9 for get.
15:15:25 <mroman> I don't think they were documented.
15:15:35 <mroman> but lref.html is a recovered old version
15:15:44 <b_jonas> !blsq %a={10.*} |[ 4 %a! 2 %a! ]|
15:16:01 <b_jonas> are there shortcuts for running a named variable too?
15:16:13 <b_jonas> !blsq {10.*}s0 |[ 4 e0 2 e0 ]|
15:16:14 <blsqbot> | {4 ERROR: Unknown command: (e0)! 2 ERROR: Unknown command: (e0)!}
15:16:16 <b_jonas> !blsq {10.*}s0 |[ 4 c0 2 c0 ]|
15:16:17 <blsqbot> | {4 ERROR: Unknown command: (c0)! 2 ERROR: Unknown command: (c0)!}
15:16:19 <b_jonas> !blsq {10.*}s0 |[ 4 r0 2 r0 ]|
15:16:20 <blsqbot> | {4 {0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 8
15:16:24 <blsqbot> | ERROR: Unknown command: (G0)!
15:16:36 <b_jonas> !blsq {10.*}s0 |[ 4 G0 2 G0 ]|
15:16:37 <blsqbot> | {4 ERROR: Unknown command: (G0)! 2 ERROR: Unknown command: (G0)!}
15:19:17 <b_jonas> are there builtins to load or store a single value deep in the stack, by depth?
15:21:17 <mroman> except using Cl<index>!!
15:21:25 <mroman> or something like that
15:22:01 <mroman> but that's a trivially addable one :D
15:22:11 <b_jonas> I'm not sure if those are what I want anyway
15:22:22 <b_jonas> I don't know what I want, it's a strange language, works in strange ways
15:22:46 <mroman> or something like that
15:23:10 <mroman> yep. it's in the lref.html under MV with the name "Move"
15:23:13 <mroman> but it moves the element
15:23:23 <b_jonas> !blsq |[ 'a'b'c'd'e'f 4MV ]|
15:23:39 <b_jonas> is there an unmove that hides the element back?
15:25:35 <mroman> Can't remember one and I can't find something that would look like that in the source code
15:25:59 <mroman> you're free to request one through the github issues tho
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15:27:34 <mroman> there's an XSwap for some cases
15:28:04 <mroman> hm. nope. not even that.
15:28:31 <b_jonas> is there a way to set an element of a block by index, whether in place or by getting a copy of the block?
15:28:42 <mroman> there's a setat builtin
15:29:52 <b_jonas> !blsq "hello"XX 9 2.+bx1sa
15:30:54 <mroman> there's also d! and D! for nested blocks
15:31:24 <mroman> !blsq {"abc""def"}{1 0}d!
15:31:44 <mroman> !blsq {{'a'b'c}{'d'e'f}}{1 0}d!
15:32:11 <b_jonas> what other methods are there that you can do on named variables, besides "v"vs %v= %v? %v!
15:32:46 <b_jonas> are there other suffixes for %v
15:33:22 <b_jonas> !blsq 41 10 'asv 'bsv 'agv 'agv
15:33:38 <mroman> uhm... that depends on what mode
15:33:46 <mroman> in fancy mode there's also "set X to Y"
15:33:57 <mroman> there's also scoping rules btw
15:34:30 <b_jonas> sv and gv don't seem to be in the reference or the moon
15:35:11 <mroman> and the moonpage i started from scratch but I haven't come too far yet
15:35:29 <mroman> there are also many more map shortcuts and stuff
15:35:39 <b_jonas> is there one that appends to a variable (when that variable contains a block)?
15:36:05 <mroman> nothing directly works on variables
15:36:10 <mroman> you'll have to get and set
15:36:25 <mroman> blsq has function scopes to be specific
15:37:55 <b_jonas> why am I trying to figure all this out again?
15:38:36 <mroman> !blsq nmPp%___FILE?P_%__FILE?
15:38:41 <mroman> !blsq nmPp%___FILE?P_%___FILE?
15:40:14 <mroman> !blsq 9s0nmPp8s0g0P_g0
15:40:44 <mroman> in one scope 0 is bound to 9 and in the other it is bound to 8
15:41:07 <mroman> i.e. when you call an actual function you enter a new scope
15:45:19 <mroman> !blsq fancy def hi: \set X to {9} bar() \get X end def bar: \set X to {10} \get X end end %hi!
15:45:41 <mroman> in the scope of bar X is 10 in the scope of hi it's 9
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15:52:50 <mroman> !blsq fancy def hi: \set X to {9} bar() \get X end def bar: \P_ \set X to {10} \nm \Pp end end %hi!
15:53:02 <mroman> like that. Now you've altered X in the scope of bar to 10
15:53:29 <mroman> it's not recommended to alter to callee's scope but you can
15:53:51 <mroman> if this were serious programming
15:54:04 <mroman> but this is interesting
15:54:09 <blsqbot> | ERROR: Unknown command: (t )!
15:54:18 <blsqbot> | Ain't nobody got output fo' that!
15:58:23 <mroman> b_jonas: you can actually use call to call functions
15:58:31 <mroman> !blsq %f={?i} 5 call f
16:06:30 <blsqbot> | __INTERNAL__:BlsqAssign "" (BlsqInt 5) False False
16:07:04 <mroman> using () is a good way to inspect what's going on behind the scenes
16:07:10 <blsqbot> | __INTERNAL__:BlsqCall "f" True
16:07:17 <blsqbot> | __INTERNAL__:BlsqGet "f"
16:07:24 <blsqbot> | __INTERNAL__:BlsqCall "f" False
16:10:51 <mroman> the boolean for call determines whether a new scope should be created
16:12:20 <mroman> and command of the year since 7 years is ^/ (DupSwap)
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17:16:06 <esowiki> [[Marz]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=68594 * SoundOfScripting * (+4264) Began specification (still a bit unorganized)
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19:49:13 <esowiki> [[Marz]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68595&oldid=68594 * SoundOfScripting * (+6159)
19:49:59 <esowiki> [[Marz]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68596&oldid=68595 * SoundOfScripting * (+3) Moved "//Adding more later. Need a break." out of wikitable
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20:38:44 <zzo38> I would thought a better way to implement pictures in HTML would have been <a href="..." inline="2"> where the "inline" attribute is a hint (not a requirement) to make it inline, depending on the user settings, where 0 is the default and means not inline, 1 or 2 means inline depending on the threshold specified by the user (at least 1, at least 2, or never).
20:39:50 <esowiki> [[User:SoundOfScripting]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68597&oldid=65760 * SoundOfScripting * (+82) Added [[Marz]]
20:40:10 <zzo38> For icons, a different way would be used, which is a "icon" attribute on a <a> or <input> element. If the browser is willing and able to display the icon and the user has enabled it, then the icon is displayed instead of the text that it contains (for <a> or <input type="submit"> or <input type="reset">).
20:40:39 <esowiki> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68598&oldid=68544 * SoundOfScripting * (+11) /* M */ Added [[Marz]]
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21:10:14 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68599&oldid=68558 * Lebster * (+4) changed wording
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21:47:44 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68600&oldid=68599 * Lebster * (+169) /* Examples */
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22:14:36 <esowiki> [[StupidStackLanguage]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68601&oldid=68600 * Lebster * (+567) Added calculator script
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22:25:28 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * BN * New user account
22:34:36 <int-e> Oh, my lighttpd bug report got a reaction and a proposed patch :)
22:37:44 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=68602&oldid=68515 * BN * (+349)
22:40:24 <zzo38> What bug report is that?
22:42:19 <int-e> zzo38: https://redmine.lighttpd.net/issues/2999 ...
22:51:07 <zzo38> My character in the GURPS has five eyes, sharp beak, antennas, scales, feathers to fly, four fingers instead of five, spit poison, and eat blood. What will such monstrous creature be called and how to make up the language based on such physiology? Maybe the former question can be answered by first figuring out the latter question and then making the words into Old English and then into modern English from that.
22:56:58 <kingoffrance> it seems a chimerical hippogriffin sphinx-ish with some "five eyes" intelligence agencies thrown in
22:57:45 <kingoffrance> i dunno, i think if you just merge other things, the end result is monstrous
22:58:13 <kingoffrance> or at least, to the medieval mind, such multi-part things are either freak animals and/or gods
22:58:52 <kingoffrance> i mean find creatures with each individual characteristic, or nethack some creatures use "scientific names" (or pseudo-sounding anyways)
22:59:08 <kingoffrance> arguably anything in latin probably sounds more serious
22:59:30 <zzo38> I am not a biologist and do not know how to make up these "scientific names"
23:00:14 <zzo38> But, that can be a possibility, I suppose. (I don't know so much Latin either)
23:00:30 <kingoffrance> that is a problem i had with introduction to biology class in school: i thought the categories were arbitrary, why memorize them, why not learn the scientific names? they did finally almost admit as such
23:00:54 <kingoffrance> i.e. that things sometimes get "moved" when a better "fit", or when most of a prior group is gone, then it makes less sense to have only a few things still around, etc.
23:01:19 <kingoffrance> so ive always been in favor of enumerating all the characteristics and then working out "groupings" afterwards
23:01:25 <kingoffrance> rather than trying to shove into a group first
23:02:04 <kingoffrance> i dont, but looking up english in dictionaries should provide pointers
23:03:34 <kingoffrance> i should say, i thought the specie names made more sense to learn; the other hierarchy names is also somewhat "scientific" so "scientific names" probably applies to them all
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