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00:00:29 <zzo38> I had started writing the server code for the web interface of sqlnetnews (called sqlwebnews); posting messages is not yet implemented, but I think I implemented the rest. The client code is not implemented yyet. This is the part of the implementation which generates the HTML interface: http://sprunge.us/6oJSuA
00:02:47 <zzo38> Hopefully, you can tell me if there is something wrong with this code, or tell me which IRC channel to try. (Even if JavaScripts are disabled it can still work, since there is the NNTP link.)
00:25:54 <esowiki> [[Pain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82461&oldid=82348 * RetroPain * (+0) /* Truth-machine */
02:02:50 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * New Army * New user account
02:04:56 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82462&oldid=82447 * New Army * (+153) /* Introductions */
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03:45:22 <zzo38> Determining the code page of a Free Hero Mesh class definition file potentially involves reading the entire file (and possibly other files too), and is not guaranteed to halt, due to using a Turing-complete preprocessor.
03:49:06 <nakilon> wtf is the "B.J." thing? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B._J._(given_name)
03:49:57 <nakilon> I knew the B.J. Blatzkowich from the videogame, now there is a haracter in the X-files episode -- the policewoman who everyone call as "B..J."
03:52:36 <zzo38> (It can mean that a editor plugin might not be able to determine the character encoding to use. However, usually this is not a problem because usually it would be able to determine it without too much difficulty and/or the file may contain only ASCII characters anyways.)
04:27:03 <b_jonas> nakilon: b_j is just two nice letters to put into your name. especially as J. can be initial for a lot of very common names, most importantly Joseph.
04:27:22 <b_jonas> there aren't all that many letters, so you'll find combinations that are common.
04:29:49 <esowiki> [[User:Zzo38/Programming languages with unusual features]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82463&oldid=82374 * Zzo38 * (+235) Free Hero Mesh
04:34:44 <esowiki> [[User:Zzo38/Programming languages with unusual features]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82464&oldid=82463 * Zzo38 * (+56) It is even worse than I thought at first
04:54:16 <esowiki> [[Vyxal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82465&oldid=80255 * Lyxal * (-15)
06:10:45 <zzo38> It is actually worse than that; sometimes it is not possible to determine which other files. Also, none of this was my intention when I added this feature; it is just what I realized today.
06:12:14 <zzo38> But, fortunately, external software could use a simplified method which will work in all of the most common cases.
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06:53:10 <esowiki> [[User:CatLooks]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82466&oldid=77155 * CatLooks * (+27)
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10:57:55 <b_jonas> zzo38: I don't think using *some* characters that aren't in unicode is enough of a reason to not use unicode. nevertheless, I'd like to see the details about that code. do you have a link to it?
10:58:37 <b_jonas> zzo38: this is re ‘PC-like code page for "old Germanic"’
11:27:24 <int-e> Hmmmm, is UINT_64C(1)<<(63 - popcount(b-1)) the most efficient way to reflect a bit? (b is a 64 bit value with exactly one bit set).
11:33:28 <fizzie> Instead of popcount(b-1), you could just use clz/ctz/ffs/bsf/bsr/whatever you want to call it.
11:34:57 <int-e> true... mumble... too many degrees of freedom
11:35:44 <int-e> huh, what's ffs?
11:36:09 <int-e> oh, clz with an off-by-one, at least for my purposes
11:36:21 <fizzie> Yeah. It's a POSIX function, short for "find first set".
11:36:41 <int-e> s/l/t/
11:36:48 <fizzie> Where "first" means "least significant", 1-based, and 0 if no bits are set.
11:37:50 <int-e> also hmm: https://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=50481
11:40:16 * int-e is pondering bitboards for Reversi for fun.
11:49:51 <fizzie> Apparently you can do a 64-bit reverse in SSE-land by splitting each nybble to a byte, using pshufb on the constant 0x0f070b030d0509010e060a020c040800 (with the nybbles as the shuffle mask) to reverse each nybble, and then collecting them back to 64 bits in reversed order. But I think that's quite unlikely to be better for reversing a known 1 bit.
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13:00:06 <esowiki> [[Help:Dottyweb]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82467&oldid=20409 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-13) Update URL
13:32:29 <zzo38> b_jonas: I wrote it on a paper and do not have it on the computer right now.
13:33:15 <b_jonas> ah
13:34:08 <zzo38> But, about the esoteric programming language that I was referring to, it is: http://esolangs.org/wiki/%E1%9A%B1%E1%9A%A2%E1%9A%BE%E1%9B%85%E1%9B%A6
13:36:52 <zzo38> However, the use of a custom encoding will reduce the file size to less than that of the Unicode representation. The pentimal runes can still be represented in the messy way mentioned there in Unicode, but they don't look good, at least on my computer. (When converting to/from Unicode, they must be converted from/to the proper codes for the pentimal runes.)
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13:44:06 <zzo38> int-e: It might depend on what instruction set you have, maybe.
13:45:13 <int-e> sure. unfortunately, x86_64 does not feature a builtin bit reversal instruction
13:51:15 <zzo38> Yes, although I don't know about RISC-V. (I remember reading about the proposed bit manipulation extension once, and I don't like it much; I think the way MMIX does it is better.)
13:52:03 <zzo38> MMIX doesn't have a bit reversal instruction either, but you can reverse the bits of an arbitrary 64-bit number with two instructions and one long constant.
14:07:29 <zzo38> MMIX also guarantees that if the shift amount is out of range that all bits are shifted out, like Glulx and some other instruction sets do, although not all do. I think that this behaviour is useful; there are a few uses for it, including to implement the ! operator of C to change 0 to 1 and other numbers to 0. (I don't know if any compiler will do this on an instruction set that supports it.)
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15:24:31 <b_jonas> zzo38: "if the shift amount is out of range" => defining shifts like that doesn't really help all that much. and this wouldn't work all that well on x86, because then you'd need an extra instruction when you want to use a single byte long shift count, because for historical reasons (z80 compatibility) single byte load or arithmetic instructions on x86 don't clear the high byte of the word
15:25:36 <b_jonas> zzo38: we already have other ways (comparisons) to change a 0 to 1 and other numbers to 0, both on MMIX and on x86: on x86 you use a TEST then a SETZ instruction
15:26:56 <esowiki> [[Pain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82468&oldid=82461 * RetroPain * (+56)
15:29:31 <b_jonas> zzo38: that said, AVX2 and AVX512 adds vector shift instructions VPSLLVD, VPSLLVQ, VPSLLVW (and the corresponding right shifts) that do consider the full shift amount (as an unsigned value) and will zero the output if it's too large,
15:32:06 <b_jonas> zzo38: oh, and in fact even the original SSE2 bitshift instructions PSLLW, PSLLD, PSLLQ work this way, taking a 64-bit unsigned shift count. I just never noticed this, even though I have used those instructions, but I didn't rely on that property
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15:50:13 <zzo38> OK, those considerations are valid, then. (Still, Glulx doesn't have another way to change 0 to 1 and other numbers to 0 with a single instruction, even though other instruction sets do. Also, this isn't the only case where shifting out all of the bits if the shift amount is out of range can be useful, I think.)
15:50:52 <zzo38> (Some algorithms might be optimized if they do not have to check that the shift amount is in range first, maybe.)
16:08:23 <zzo38> b_jonas: OK, here is the code page table now I put it into the computer: http://sprunge.us/dagQKR
16:13:18 <zzo38> The Free Hero Mesh preprocessor is Turing-complete even with only {define} and {call} (or only {append} and {call}), but is it Turing-complete with {define} alone or {append} alone, and/or other combinations?
16:13:33 <b_jonas> zzo38: I see
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17:12:34 <zzo38> (It is (probably) possible for the name of a macro to define to come from the expansion of another macro, so maybe it is possible to use this to make it Turing-complete; I don't know.)
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17:17:12 <esowiki> [[Ss]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=82469 * CatLooks * (+2805) Created page with "'''SS''' is an esoteric programming language created by [[User:CatLooks|CatLooks]]. ==Overview== Each line in '''SS''' is written in <code>int [byte]</code> style. It uses c..."
17:18:39 <esowiki> [[Ss]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82470&oldid=82469 * CatLooks * (-7)
17:19:50 <esowiki> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82471&oldid=82428 * CatLooks * (+10)
17:20:33 <esowiki> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82472&oldid=82471 * CatLooks * (-1)
17:22:12 <esowiki> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82473&oldid=82472 * CatLooks * (+3)
17:24:08 <esowiki> [[User:CatLooks]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82474&oldid=82466 * CatLooks * (+12)
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18:59:02 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Dreamvoyager * New user account
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19:13:54 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82475&oldid=82462 * Dreamvoyager * (+138) /* Introductions */
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19:33:27 <esowiki> [[User:Dreamvoyager]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=82476 * Dreamvoyager * (+551) Created page with "== it is dreamVoyager == ===== who is dreamvoyager? ===== i == Heading text == {| class="wikitable" |+ hi, i'm '''dreamvoyager''' and i |- ! i like coding !! ''yes'' !! i do..."
19:34:56 <esowiki> [[User:Xanman12321]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82477&oldid=55531 * Xanman12321 * (+2)
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20:00:57 <esowiki> [[Recipescript]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=82478 * Dreamvoyager * (+1184) Created page with "== RecipeScript == Recipescript is a Python-based [[Joke_language_list|joke esolang]] that can't actually be ran by any program. Instead, the compiler is the brain of whoever'..."
20:02:21 <esowiki> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82479&oldid=82353 * Dreamvoyager * (+84) /* General languages */
20:03:34 <esowiki> [[User:Dreamvoyager]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82480&oldid=82476 * Dreamvoyager * (+21) /* esolangs i made */
20:03:45 <esowiki> [[User:Dreamvoyager]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82481&oldid=82480 * Dreamvoyager * (+1) /* esolangs i made */
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20:05:06 <esowiki> [[Recipescript]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82482&oldid=82478 * Dreamvoyager * (+0) /* RecipeScript */
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20:06:14 <esowiki> [[Recipescript]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82483&oldid=82482 * Dreamvoyager * (+8) /* Mashed Potatoes */
20:07:48 <esowiki> [[Recipescript]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82484&oldid=82483 * Dreamvoyager * (+46) /* RecipeScript */
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21:06:21 <fizzie> https://0x0.st/-arU.txt -- pro: they've still got a fingerd up; con: the coke machine doesn't have a .plan file any more.
21:07:47 <fizzie> (A Finnish author of popular general-audience computing-related books had published a free PDF copy of his 1995 book on what the Internet is all about, got stuck reading it.)
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21:18:42 <zzo38> I checked it once too and found the same thing
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23:15:10 <esowiki> [[Recipescript]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82485&oldid=82484 * Xanman12321 * (+660) added my variant :P
23:16:19 <esowiki> [[Recipescript]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82486&oldid=82485 * Xanman12321 * (+16)
23:17:34 <esowiki> [[Recipescript]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=82487&oldid=82486 * Xanman12321 * (+83)
←2021-04-27 2021-04-28 2021-04-29→ ↑2021 ↑all