←2016-08-11 2016-08-12 2016-08-13→ ↑2016 ↑all
00:01:07 <quintopia> helloily
00:01:14 <boily> *munch*!
00:01:18 <boily> (quinthellopia!)
00:30:02 <moon_> helloily
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00:47:25 <boily> @metar CYUL
00:47:25 <lambdabot> CYUL 112300Z 22004G16KT 15SM FEW050TCU BKN250 31/20 A2989 RMK TCU1CI7 TCU TR SLP121 DENSITY ALT 1900FT
00:48:12 * boily does a rain dance. «Awéye! Mouille!»
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01:12:16 <boily> @metar CYUL
01:12:17 <lambdabot> CYUL 120000Z 25002KT 15SM FEW040CB FEW160 BKN250 29/20 A2988 RMK CB1AC1CI7 CB TR AC TR CB TOP SE SLP119 DENSITY ALT 1800FT
01:12:40 * boily dons pompoms and dances some more
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01:33:17 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Talk:MiniStringFuck]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=49119 * Darkrifts * (+175) Created page with "I believe this should be a joke language, since it seems to be on par with [[Deadfish]] ~~~~"
01:35:56 <boily> Deadfish ain't no joke!
01:36:43 <boily> how does one make somebody else join an IRC chännel? can we track their IP down, remote into their machine, install and launch a bootstrapped client that automatically joins them here?
01:37:24 <alercah> boily: that's called a botnet
01:37:56 <boily> alercahello. right.
01:39:35 <boily> (hellorcah? allorcah? alercahello?)
01:40:47 <fizzie> @metar KBOS
01:40:47 <lambdabot> KBOS 112354Z 23012G20KT 190V250 10SM FEW050 BKN230 32/24 A2994 RMK AO2 SLP137 T03170239 10356 20317 53004
01:40:52 <fizzie> It's too hot for fungot.
01:40:57 <fizzie> Hey, that rhymes.
01:41:16 <fizzie> Although doesn't make much sense otherwise, since fungot's not *here*.
01:41:56 <boily> wait. you're in Boston now?
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01:42:17 <boily> thizzie!
01:42:19 <fizzie> I'm just visiting.
01:42:21 <boily> fungot: o hai!
01:42:21 <fungot> boily: it might have been my primary hacking area anyways)
01:42:28 <fizzie> And Cambridge, actually.
01:42:46 <boily> do you like it there? does Quincy Market still exist?
01:43:34 <fizzie> I haven't managed to see much of it yet, been mostly confined to the hotel-office axis.
01:43:42 <fizzie> And the hotel's across the street from the office.
01:43:57 <fizzie> I'll have a free Saturday here though.
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02:52:19 <moon_> i personally think my bot has a good sqrt of 2 answer
02:52:20 <moon_> 1.414213562373095048801688724209698078569671875376948073176679737990732478462107038850387 5343276415727350138462309122970249248361
02:52:29 <moon_> thats 128 digits
02:55:01 <lifthrasiir> a square of that number is 2 + 1.2487297240530495370686529703... * 10^-127, so it is probably accurate
03:00:21 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49120&oldid=49111 * Oerjan * (+0) deorr
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03:11:12 <oerjan> @tell gamemanj <gamemanj> ...you'd have thought one of those characters would have triggered a bot... <-- yes. but not in that order hth
03:11:12 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
03:13:46 <oerjan> `quote hilarious
03:13:48 <HackEgo> 174) <ais523> I love the way zzo38's comment was cut off after the f of brainfuck <ais523> that's just the most hilarious place to cut it off in a discussion about censorshi
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03:20:06 <orin> I'm making changes to my font so that e.g. ㎆ won't look exatly like MB
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03:53:13 <tswett> `unidecode ㎆
03:53:14 <HackEgo> ​[U+3386 SQUARE MB]
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05:29:27 <oerjan> @tell boily i suspect gamemanj's "error" isn't one (those are all legal nick chars and, well, it's oren), although the original seems to have been expunged from HackEgo.
05:29:27 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
05:32:02 <oerjan> `` hog quotes | grep 'being hilarious'
05:32:11 <HackEgo> No output.
05:32:15 <oerjan> `` hog quotes | grep 'being hilarious'
05:32:17 <HackEgo> No output.
05:32:22 <oerjan> `hoq quotes
05:32:23 <HackEgo> ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: hoq: not found
05:32:28 <oerjan> `hog quotes
05:32:29 <HackEgo> ​<oerjan> addquote <Ken M> If we don\'t study the mistakes of the future we\'re doomed to repeat them for the first time :( \ <boily> addquote <izabera> if someone can, they\'re in this chan \ <int-e> addquote <fungot> int-e: all right...ill try not to think about your mind. best of luck with it \ <oerjan> addquote <fizzie> AIUI, one of the senio
05:33:01 <oerjan> `` hog quotes | grep 'hilarious'
05:33:02 <HackEgo> No output.
05:33:08 <oerjan> `cat bin/hog
05:33:09 <HackEgo> hg log --template "{desc}\n" -- "$@"
05:33:20 <oerjan> `` hog quotes | wc
05:33:21 <HackEgo> ​ 1175 17667 112886
05:33:44 <oerjan> `` rgrep hilarious wisdom
05:33:54 <HackEgo> No output.
05:34:01 <oerjan> `url quotes
05:34:02 <HackEgo> http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/file/tip/quotes
05:35:12 <oerjan> @tell boily oops, never mind, it's weirdly formatted otherwise, so grep doesn't find it
05:35:12 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
05:35:35 <oerjan> `quote h.*i.*l.*a.*r.*i.*o.*u.*s
05:35:36 <HackEgo> 14) <fungot> oerjan: are you a man, if there weren't evil in this kingdom to you! you shall find bekkler! executing program. please let me go... put me out! he's really a tricycle! pass him! \ 20) IN EINEM ALTERNATIVEN UNIVERSUM (WO DIE NAZIS WON): <ehird> So kann ich nur schliessen, dass es falsch ist, oder die Welt ist vollig BONKERS. Gegrusset s
05:36:02 <oerjan> hm something tells me that's too easy to match :P
05:36:11 <oerjan> `quote 1224
05:36:12 <HackEgo> 1224) <{\[oren]|}> zzo38:it will cause problems by being hilarious
05:37:12 <oerjan> @tell boily given this, you might want to double check hth
05:37:12 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
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06:20:44 <quintopia> oerjan what happened i missed it
06:23:00 <oerjan> on afterthought, i think what happened was gamemanj looked at 1224 in the wisdom.pdf and didn't realize it was supposed to look that weird.
06:23:30 <quintopia> ah
06:23:35 <oerjan> and then i blathered because i cannot manage to read to the end of the logs.
06:23:42 <oerjan> (before talking)
06:24:02 <quintopia> yes this seems to be a recurring issue with you
06:27:04 <quintopia> heres an interesting priblem for you: if you have twenty items and can sort five of them at a time, what is the smallest number of five-item sorts needed to do the job and what sequence of sorts will do it?
06:33:40 <oerjan> s/interesting/too complicated/
06:34:49 <oerjan> s/n//
06:35:48 <quintopia> the "how many" part is easy enough. the sequence is tricky
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08:36:02 <hppavilion[1]> The weird thing about my headphones is that it feels like one of the earpieces is completely silent
08:36:10 <int-e> quintopia: 9 is a lower bound, and you're suggesting that it's tight?
08:36:30 <hppavilion[1]> Because, due to clever positioning of everything I listen to, it sounds like the noise that is coming from the right one is /inside/ my head
08:37:00 <oerjan> hm...
08:38:07 <oerjan> indeed
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09:36:55 <izabera> what's a database with super low memory footprint?
09:37:00 <izabera> i don't need advanced features
09:38:57 <izabera> it should keep as little data as possible in memory and store the rest on disk
09:39:54 <izabera> features i need are literally only to set a value for a given key, and to retrieve a value based on its key
09:40:12 <izabera> no fancy sql is needed
09:42:16 <izabera> values are memory blobs of varying size, keys are 6 character alphanumeric strings
09:42:57 <izabera> i guess i can write this thing myself
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10:48:03 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Fourier]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49121&oldid=49113 * * (-3) /* Date */
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11:50:18 <boily> hppavellon[1]!
11:51:19 <hppavilion[1]> ahoily
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12:17:45 <boily> @massages-loud
12:17:45 <lambdabot> oerjan said 6h 48m 18s ago: i suspect gamemanj's "error" isn't one (those are all legal nick chars and, well, it's oren), although the original seems to have been expunged from HackEgo.
12:17:46 <lambdabot> oerjan said 6h 42m 33s ago: oops, never mind, it's weirdly formatted otherwise, so grep doesn't find it
12:17:46 <lambdabot> oerjan said 6h 40m 33s ago: given this, you might want to double check hth
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12:29:59 <fizzie> izabera: dbm's modern successors (GDBM & friends) would be the traditional choice for that sort of thing, though I don't know how they compare wrt. *super*-low memory footprint.
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12:53:24 <fizzie> izabera: Although I guess you could also just use a directory.
12:53:34 <izabera> that's what i'm using atm
12:54:12 <izabera> thanks for your suggestion
12:54:17 <izabera> about dbm i mean
12:57:58 <fizzie> Aside: traditional dbm tends to have fixed size limits for the values (in the "few kilobytes" ballpark), but at least GDBM doesn't. Although I've only really interfaced with these things via Perl's AnyDBM_File.
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14:28:47 <izabera> http://www.airguitarworldchampionships.com/ next week
14:29:05 <izabera> i mean in 2 weeks
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14:32:05 <FireFly> air guitar.. that's the one in Oulu, I think?
14:32:22 <FireFly> Right
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15:06:14 <izabera> how does one bruteforce this? http://codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/89541/14676
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15:08:37 <myname> i like it
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15:10:58 <FireFly> izabera: write a number of expressions with a few constants, bruteforce the constants for each expression?
15:11:25 <FireFly> so like (x ^ A) * B (and similarly for other expressions of x involving up to two constants)
15:11:50 <izabera> how did they come up with xor and multiply?
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15:12:16 <izabera> they tried all of them?
15:13:11 <FireFly> I don't know, it's what I would do
15:13:55 <FireFly> it's not really explained
15:14:21 <FireFly> you could make a comment and ask them to elaborate on how the expression was bruteforced
15:14:49 <izabera> i run out of comments long ago
15:15:16 <myname> i do think finding ^ and * to use that for sorting is reasonable
15:15:47 <myname> 12 values out of 2^8 is reasonable
15:16:24 <myname> you'd be able to do that for practically any set of 12 strings that are different enough
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16:20:13 <orin> the next version of my font will include playing cards
16:20:34 <orin> because I wanted to do more astral plane stuff
16:22:16 <orin> 🂡
16:23:48 <orin> ooh, what if we had a computer that had playing cards instead of bytes, and five card "words"
16:24:28 <izabera> ur drunk
16:24:49 <orin> actually, mever mind that. suppose a computer stored its state as a deck of cards. How big is that state, in bits?
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16:25:14 <orin> > log2(factorial(52))
16:25:15 <lambdabot> Not in scope: ‘log2’
16:25:15 <lambdabot> Perhaps you meant ‘log’ (imported from Prelude)Not in scope: ‘factorial’
16:26:27 <orin> > add(log([1 .. 52]))/log(2)
16:26:28 <lambdabot> Not in scope: ‘add’
16:26:28 <lambdabot> Perhaps you meant one of these:
16:26:28 <lambdabot> ‘and’ (imported from Data.List), ‘odd’ (imported from Prelude)
16:26:40 <orin> > sum(log([1 .. 52]))/log(2)
16:26:42 <lambdabot> No instance for (Show a0)
16:26:42 <lambdabot> arising from a use of ‘show_M73354184593098767806440’
16:26:42 <lambdabot> The type variable ‘a0’ is ambiguous
16:27:00 <orin> > sum(log([1.0 .. 52.0]))/log(2.0)
16:27:01 <lambdabot> No instance for (Show a0)
16:27:01 <lambdabot> arising from a use of ‘show_M54011832658531067726463’
16:27:01 <lambdabot> The type variable ‘a0’ is ambiguous
16:27:08 <orin> > sum(log([1 .. 52]))/log(2.0)
16:27:09 <lambdabot> No instance for (Show a0)
16:27:09 <lambdabot> arising from a use of ‘show_M47258435328389861236473’
16:27:09 <lambdabot> The type variable ‘a0’ is ambiguous
16:27:41 <orin> > sum(map(log,[1 .. 52])))/log(2.0)
16:27:42 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:24: parse error on input ‘)’
16:27:53 <orin> > sum(map(log,[1 .. 52]))/log(2.0)
16:27:54 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type ‘a0 -> b’
16:27:54 <lambdabot> with actual type ‘(Double -> Double, [Integer])’
16:27:54 <lambdabot> In the first argument of ‘map’, namely ‘(log, [1 .. 52])’
16:28:04 <izabera> i think you're just proving how drunk you are
16:28:10 <orin> > sum(map(log [1 .. 52]))/log(2.0)
16:28:11 <lambdabot> Couldn't match expected type ‘a0 -> b’ with actual type ‘[Integer]’
16:28:11 <lambdabot> In the first argument of ‘log’, namely ‘[1 .. 52]’
16:28:11 <lambdabot> In the first argument of ‘map’, namely ‘(log [1 .. 52])’
16:28:32 <orin> izabera: I'm just trying to bruteforce haskell syntax again
16:29:23 <orin> > (map log [1 .. 52])
16:29:25 <lambdabot> [0.0,0.6931471805599453,1.0986122886681098,1.3862943611198906,1.609437912434...
16:29:28 <alercah> would you like assistance?
16:29:36 <orin> > sum(map log [1 .. 52])
16:29:37 <lambdabot> 156.3608363030788
16:29:59 <orin> > (sum(map log [1 .. 52]))/(log 2)
16:30:01 <lambdabot> 225.5810031237028
16:30:09 <alercah> why are you trying to calculate the log base 2 of a deck of cards?
16:30:39 <orin> alercah: to find out how many bits it takes to store a randomly ordered deck
16:31:10 <int-e> > log (product [1..52])/log 2
16:31:12 <lambdabot> 225.5810031237028
16:31:36 <orin> the answer being, not enough to make a FSM based on said state interesting enough
16:32:07 <int-e> (double is large enough for the product)
16:32:51 <orin> wow, I would'nt have expected that. doubles are biiig
16:34:21 <orin> int-e: so I just found out that f(a,b) calls f with the tuple a,b?
16:35:26 <orin> apparently the correct mehtod to bind f with its arguments within an expression is (f a b) like in lisp
16:36:37 <orin> haskell seems more related to lisp than to algol
16:36:39 <shachaf> `olist 1048
16:36:46 <HackEgo> olist 1048: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas
16:39:37 <Jafet> > product [1..12]
16:39:38 <lambdabot> 479001600
16:39:46 <int-e> indeed Haskell may be less unrelated to lisp than to algol
16:40:39 <alercah> orin: doubles are exponential, remember
16:41:23 <alercah> they can store really big and really small numbers. Just don't mix
16:41:31 <FireFly> shachaf: o thanks
16:41:37 <orin> alercah: hmm, so the double can represent it because 225 fits into a double's exponent field?
16:41:49 <int-e> > (2^1023 :: Double, 2^1024 :: Double)
16:41:51 <lambdabot> (8.98846567431158e307,Infinity)
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17:06:16 <orin> Nigel Farage grew a moustache!
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17:15:41 <orin> what new plan does this moustachiod politician have?!
17:16:37 <gamemanj> That's not Nigel Farage
17:16:49 <gamemanj> That's his evil doppleganger from another universe
17:17:46 <orin> Rigel Barrage
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17:45:27 <prooftechnique> Dingo Garage
17:46:24 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Esolang:Community portal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49122&oldid=46125 * CodeMaster111 * (+235)
17:46:54 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Esolang:Community portal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49123&oldid=49122 * CodeMaster111 * (+2)
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18:51:52 <orin> Hmm, my poll averaging shows a very different result from the poll averaging the media is using
18:52:40 <orin> it shows turmp support holding steady at 41% about, while clinton declined over the lat week
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18:53:28 <orin> but is still ahead by 3-4%
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18:56:07 <orin> The poll averages are based on when the poll was released I think, while my poll averages are based on when the polls were conducted
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19:21:47 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Esolang:Community portal]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49124&oldid=49123 * Fizzie * (-2) Fix those links (but the "Information" heading is still very vague)
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20:46:36 <hppavilion[1]> Unfortunately, it's impossible to study the optimal Star Wars viewing order in an ethical way
20:46:57 <hppavilion[1]> Because to compare episodic and release orders, you have to have someone actually watch it in episodic order
20:47:06 <hppavilion[1]> Which no ethics committee would ever permit
20:51:10 <gamemanj> who needs ethics when you're a mad scientist
20:51:47 <gamemanj> also tell whoever wrote `? gamemanj that "Insert Name Here" was a joke and wasn't to be taken seriously
20:55:30 <hppavilion[1]> ...wow, I really don't get the SMBC favicon
20:55:51 <hppavilion[1]> `? gamemanj
20:55:56 <HackEgo> gamemanj is also the mad scientist I. N. Here.
20:56:46 <hppavilion[1]> We have mad scientists
20:56:52 <hppavilion[1]> But not sad scientists
20:56:58 <hppavilion[1]> Or glad scientists
20:57:07 <hppavilion[1]> Or bored, yet slightly aroused scientists
20:59:32 <int-e> gamemanj: sounds like a perfect wisdom entry then
20:59:42 <int-e> (a joke that could be taken seriously)
21:16:42 <int-e> Also I had to inquire about the meaning of "I. N." once before... it's not entirely obvious what it stands for, I think.
21:17:19 <gamemanj> Well, I said "Insert Name Here", then...
21:17:22 <gamemanj> `culprits gamemanj
21:17:24 <HackEgo> No output.
21:17:29 <gamemanj> ...that's not possible
21:17:41 <gamemanj> ...ok, whatever
21:18:41 <gamemanj> then whoever it was (I vaguely recall the name "oren", but I could be wrong) wrote "I. N. Here", presumably so it sounded like "the mad scientist in here"
21:19:30 <gamemanj> ``culprits *gamemanj*
21:19:31 <HackEgo> ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: `culprits: not found
21:19:36 <gamemanj> `` culprits *gamemanj*
21:19:37 <HackEgo> No output.
21:19:54 <gamemanj> `` culprits *g*a*m*e*m*a*n*j*
21:19:56 <HackEgo> No output.
21:20:00 <gamemanj> Nothing??!?
21:21:01 <int-e> `` echo *gamemanj*
21:21:01 <HackEgo> ​*gamemanj*
21:21:16 <gamemanj> ...wait.
21:21:19 <int-e> `` cwlprits gamemanj # presumably?
21:21:21 <HackEgo> oerjan oerjan
21:21:22 <gamemanj> ...I'm an idiot
21:21:45 <gamemanj> oren, if you are reading this, sorry I got you confused with oerjan.
21:21:47 <int-e> the u/w is a bit too subtle.
21:22:09 <gamemanj> oerjan, if you are reading this, well done, your joke made it into wisdom.pdf.
21:22:21 * gamemanj gives oerjan a biscuit
21:22:44 <gamemanj> Additional note. oerjan is apparently... NOT reading this.
21:22:54 <int-e> he might, later
21:23:01 <gamemanj> @tell oerjan well done, your joke made it into wisdom.pdf.
21:23:01 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
21:23:09 <gamemanj> Well, now he definitely will.
21:23:13 <int-e> in http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/16.08.12
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21:24:07 * gamemanj wonders what this "error" is about
21:24:39 * int-e wonders what that "error" is about
21:25:15 <gamemanj> oh
21:25:27 <gamemanj> the "wisdom.pdf error" I mentioned to boily
21:25:46 <moon_> What is it?
21:28:14 <gamemanj> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21184720/Screenshot_2016-08-12_21-26-44.png
21:28:42 <gamemanj> I'm pretty sure the font isn't intentionally different, in any case
21:29:00 <int-e> \item \verb!<{\[oren]|}>! \scalebox{1.2}[1]{zzo38:it will cause problems by being hilarious}
21:29:10 <int-e> I'm pretty sure the scalebox is intentional.
21:29:23 <gamemanj> ...ok, you have the TeX source, TeX source trumps screenshot.
21:29:41 <gamemanj> Now, why it's intentional...
21:29:58 <int-e> `quote will
21:29:59 <HackEgo> 1224) <{\[oren]|}> zzo38:it will cause problems by being hilarious
21:30:12 <gamemanj> ah, I see.
21:30:47 <gamemanj> New question: why on the planet would anyone choose to write that way...
21:31:18 <int-e> because it fits better with kanji
21:31:28 <int-e> hiragana etc.
21:31:39 <int-e> `unidecode w
21:32:10 <gamemanj> I'm not seeing how it fits better...
21:32:24 <gamemanj> like, I guess it makes them aligned with character cells?
21:33:16 <int-e> I'm not 100% sure. I'm used to narrow characters, not square ones.
21:48:07 <hppavilion[1]> `? os
21:48:08 <HackEgo> Os is the accusative plural of us. Also a municipality in Norway.
21:48:17 <hppavilion[1]> ...plural of us?
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21:50:26 <gamemanj> yes
21:50:30 <gamemanj> it's for groups of groups
21:51:24 <gamemanj> Os was defined by the committee of people interested in shutting up engineers to define the status on P = NP by simply abstracting it so conversation did not matter even if it is true or false
21:52:03 <hppavilion[1]> Ugh
21:52:07 <gamemanj> other things invented by the committee of people interested in shutting up engineers: Pi
21:52:11 <hppavilion[1]> Bracket is a terrible way to handle sports
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21:52:32 <gamemanj> then use a better one!
21:53:20 <hppavilion[1]> Clearly, if we're assuming that, given 4 teams A, B, C, D where A plays B to yield J and C plays D to yield K, then J plays K to yield V
21:54:01 <myname> wat
21:54:05 <hppavilion[1]> If A is better than (>) B and C > D, then V > D
21:54:30 <hppavilion[1]> If we're using that logic (which is obviously flawed due to rock-paper-scissors-style games)
21:54:53 <hppavilion[1]> Then there is a MUCH more efficient system
21:55:23 <hppavilion[1]> We put the teams in an order in a 1-dimensional list (presumably either at random or based on previous metrics)
21:55:43 <hppavilion[1]> We call one team L, and it is initially the first team in the list
21:55:56 <hppavilion[1]> Remove the first team in the list
21:56:34 <hppavilion[1]> Then, repeating until the list is null, pop a team and play it against L. The winner is saved as L and the loser is discarded
21:56:53 <hppavilion[1]> Once the list is null, L is the overall victor of the tournament
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21:58:06 <hppavilion[1]> gamemanj: Get it?
21:59:26 <hppavilion[1]> (essentially, if we don't require that the participating teams be partially ordered- which we clearly don't due to bracket tournaments- then we can do this MUCH more efficiently)
22:04:51 <gamemanj> Which team do you pop?
22:04:57 <gamemanj> The team at the top of the list?
22:05:06 <gamemanj> Also, this means all teams have to play against L.
22:05:21 <gamemanj> Until L changes, at least.
22:05:33 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Andrew Melrose]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=49125 * Andrew Melrose * (+265) About Andrew Melrose
22:05:45 <int-e> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_of_the_Hill_%28game%29
22:05:57 <gamemanj> On the one hand, this means a minimal number of matches are played - on the other, can this be parallelized?
22:06:41 <int-e> the bracket plays the same number of games... it *is* the parallelized version
22:07:14 <int-e> every game eliminates one player or team after all, so you need n-1 games to get from n to 1.
22:09:36 <int-e> (bonus points if you find the connection to binary trees, and the number of their leafs and internal nodes)
22:13:53 <hppavilion[1]> gamemanj: Yes
22:13:58 <hppavilion[1]> gamemanj: Exactly
22:14:25 <hppavilion[1]> gamemanj: I don't think it can
22:14:48 <gamemanj> ...so basically, your system is a step backwards unless you only have one playfield.
22:14:57 <gamemanj> There is also the secondary issue of wear levelling.
22:15:06 <gamemanj> "L" will get tired over time.
22:15:08 <hppavilion[1]> int-e: I don't think that the bracket plays less games...
22:15:09 <hppavilion[1]> Does it?
22:15:26 <gamemanj> For the defeater of L, this will be their first game.
22:15:46 <gamemanj> The bracket doesn't play less games, but it doesn't play more either because each bracket eliminates a team.
22:15:51 <hppavilion[1]> gamemanj: Yeah, but since when has real-world stuff mattered to the NFL or FIFA or the NBA
22:16:15 <hppavilion[1]> This system plays n-1 games, where n is the number of teams...
22:16:18 <hppavilion[1]> A bracket plays...
22:16:59 <hppavilion[1]> In a bracket... the winning team must play all the way to the bottom... but there are less steps...
22:17:05 <hppavilion[1]> I think the proper strategy is MATH
22:17:19 <gamemanj> Think about it this way.
22:17:23 <hppavilion[1]> If we have 8 teams, then 7 games are played in a season
22:17:30 <gamemanj> You have 4 teams, A, B, C, D.
22:17:33 <hppavilion[1]> gamemanj: It'd be easiest with an example, I think
22:17:44 <gamemanj> The brackets would be, as an example, [[A,B],[C,D]]
22:17:54 <gamemanj> A and B fight, C and D fight in parallel.
22:18:05 <gamemanj> The result of these two is A* and B*.
22:18:12 <hppavilion[1]> Using a bracket... each of the 8 teams is paired with another, so 4 games are played in the first round... then 2 in the next... then the finals... so 7
22:18:13 <hppavilion[1]> Huh
22:18:15 <hppavilion[1]> Weird
22:18:17 <gamemanj> A* and B* are equally worn out.
22:18:33 <gamemanj> You then have [A*, B*], and the game is resolved.
22:18:42 <gamemanj> This takes 3 battles.
22:18:52 <gamemanj> In your system, we start with [A, B], as per usual.
22:19:00 <gamemanj> In the worst case, A wins.
22:19:09 <gamemanj> This is because then they go on, but worn down,
22:19:14 <gamemanj> while C is "fresh".
22:19:28 <gamemanj> So then [A-, C] happens ('-' because A is now worn down and C isn't)
22:19:33 <gamemanj> If A still continues,
22:19:38 <gamemanj> [A--, D] happens...
22:19:50 <gamemanj> And thus who wins is highly order-dependant.
22:20:07 <gamemanj> Either way, 3 games are played.
22:20:07 <hppavilion[1]> True, true
22:20:20 <hppavilion[1]> But brackets are still broken because of non-transitive winning
22:20:44 <gamemanj> I suppose. It's less broken than sending a worn out football team against a completely fresh one, though.
22:20:52 <hppavilion[1]> gamemanj: Also, I think we assume that there's time between games
22:21:13 <gamemanj> If we eliminate the possibility of team morale and team weardown, then yes, the "list" approach is the best.
22:21:25 <gamemanj> (Though it cannot be parallelized as such without changing it intrinsically.)
22:21:37 <hppavilion[1]> Yes it is, unless you can parallelize, but you can't because all games have to be shown
22:22:02 <hppavilion[1]> (if you play multiple bracket games at once, then your ratings go down because you can't watch multiple games simultaneously)
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23:06:54 <hppavilion[1]> "You have been found guilty of conspiring to solicit the incitement of attempted cheque fraud. The penalty is death." -- a real sentence that could technically said by a judge under US law, assuming that certain laws are interpreted in an uncommon (but still acceptable) way
23:08:07 <hppavilion[1]> Because conspiring to commit a crime, soliciting a crime, inciting a crime, and attempting a crime are all the same level as the crime (so paying a hitman is still a felony. Attempts may be treated less badly, but they're still felonies)
23:08:13 <hppavilion[1]> Cheque fraud is a felony
23:08:58 <hppavilion[1]> And under the Felony-Murder rule, if you kill someone (whether or not you intend to) in the process of committing a crime, that is counted as premeditated murder (though the common interpretation requires that the crime be violent- but it isn't shared by everyone)
23:09:47 <hppavilion[1]> So if, by conspiring to solicit the incitement of attempted cheque fraud, a person dies (in this case, we're assuming it's by the cheque fraud, not by the conspiring), you can be held liable
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23:21:04 <hppavilion[1]> ...huh
23:21:14 <hppavilion[1]> England and Wales abolished Larceny as a crime
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23:28:02 <hppavilion[1]> Aggravated cheque fraud?
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23:55:28 <boily> @massages-loud
23:55:28 <lambdabot> You don't have any messages
23:55:46 -!- oerjan has joined.
23:57:55 <oerjan> @messages-
23:57:55 <lambdabot> gamemanj said 2h 34m 53s ago: well done, your joke made it into wisdom.pdf.
23:58:19 <oerjan> boily: i am confused. did it bypass HackEgo?
23:58:57 <oerjan> in that case, i may have to file a DMCA hth
23:59:26 <boily> hellørjan. which joke? which bypass? which DMCA?
23:59:35 <oerjan> alsello
23:59:45 <oerjan> boily: see the message
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