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01:03:26 <GregorR> kipple: I forgot to ask - do you mind if I stick your 99-bottles-of-beer in ORK under the ORK examples?
01:03:48 <kipple> of course not. go ahead :)
01:04:45 <GregorR> BTW, I've been formulating plans to make such things as LLLs possible.
01:04:52 <GregorR> I think I'll have a construct like:
01:05:17 <GregorR> What I mean is any object that needs a pointer to another object.
01:05:39 <GregorR> Anyway, constructs like this: A linear linked list can have a next which is a linear linked list.
01:05:40 <kipple> ah yes. that would be nice :)
01:05:50 <GregorR> Then you could set it like: My next is {blah}.
01:05:58 <GregorR> Or: I have a next. (to just make a new one)
01:36:45 <kipple> and then perhaps, you could do: Will is to write my next's next's next's next's next's value :)
01:45:02 <GregorR> Though if any of those were uninstanciated, you would not be very happy ;)
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03:03:17 <calamari> GregorR: unless your program is the universe.. :)
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03:56:06 <GregorR> That video defies all reason.
03:58:15 <GregorR> I just don't even get what he's doing ....
03:58:23 <GregorR> Is he hitting the strings with enough force to cause a vibration?
03:58:33 <GregorR> You'd think that would cause two (possibly dissonant) notes...
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06:02:35 <lament> GregorR-L: since pick-ups are only on one end of the string
06:08:56 <puzzlet> eh.. we have "Babel Fish Research Group" in Korea
06:09:16 <puzzlet> what we do is to research Babel Fish's behaviours
06:09:25 <puzzlet> such as http://www.puzzlet.org/puzzlet/BabelFish~Lama
06:09:54 <lament> oh wait, that's dopefish
06:10:16 <GregorR-L> lament: OH, that's right, it's electric.
06:10:23 <GregorR-L> For some reason that didn't occur to me.
06:10:35 <lament> GregorR-L: yes, and you can play any electric guitar like this.
06:10:42 <GregorR-L> Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
06:10:50 <lament> you can play acoustic ones like that too, it'd just be very soft
06:11:46 <lament> i'm not a guitarist, but i can play the guitar a bit
07:18:22 <puzzlet> hm, my best is http://www.puzzlet.org/puzzlet/BabelFish~%EB%AA%A8%EC%A7%81
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08:31:50 <pgimeno> what's that page about, puzzlet? I don't get it (and I don't understand Korean)
08:32:42 <puzzlet> some phrases are iteratively fed to Babel Fish
08:33:07 <puzzlet> and we archive interesting results
08:33:49 <pgimeno> what's the gnuplot/latex section supposed to graph?
08:34:34 <puzzlet> ah, that's supposed to show the words are increasing quadratically.
08:35:49 <puzzlet> and some other collections in http://www.puzzlet.org/puzzlet/BabelFish~BabelFishAutomata
08:36:10 <pgimeno> I don't see what makes them interesting though
08:36:53 <puzzlet> because it wasn't designed to behave that way
08:37:08 <pgimeno> what wasn't? BabelFish itself?
08:37:35 <pgimeno> oh, I think I'm starting to get it
08:37:55 <puzzlet> not at all, as a translation service
08:39:48 <puzzlet> and some of those phenomena have some strict rules, and we call it "Babel Fish automata"
08:40:49 <puzzlet> translating "Pink"(English) into "Pink-color"(Korean) causes another one: http://www.puzzlet.org/puzzlet/BabelFish~Pink
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08:45:14 <puzzlet> he is a member from Babel Fish Research Group
08:46:31 <pgimeno> aren't there more complex cycles?
08:46:35 <puzzlet> iterative translating manually is so cumbersome, so he and i made an irc bot to do that.
08:47:16 <puzzlet> http://www.puzzlet.org/puzzlet/BabelFish~ItItOfItIt
08:48:38 <puzzlet> we aim for sth like Turing Machine made out of it, but it would be hardly possible ;)
08:49:15 <pgimeno> oh well, Thue works by string substitution, maybe this can do something alike
08:50:05 <pgimeno> see http://catseye.webhop.net/
08:50:47 <puzzlet> ah, so many languages from cat's eye
08:51:01 <tokigun> pgimeno: it's new domain of Cat's Eye Technologies?
08:51:42 <pgimeno> it's a (hopefully permanent) redirector
08:53:09 <pgimeno> maybe cpressey himself can tell us more precisely
08:53:51 <lament> this channel sure has grown
08:54:05 <pgimeno> heh, it's about the first thing I notice when I first entered some days ago
08:54:40 * lament stomps on cpressey's head
08:54:50 <lament> i'm not sure if he's conscious
08:55:02 <pgimeno> if he was, now he isn't ;)
08:55:43 * puzzlet is reading Thue documentation
08:56:18 <lament> i had written a nice Thue interpreter in javascript
08:56:21 <lament> and then it vanished :(
08:56:35 <pgimeno> there's one in the wayback machine, is it yours?
08:56:57 <pgimeno> it's in my bookmarks, hold on
08:57:37 <pgimeno> http://web.archive.org/web/20031210145310/http://cyberspace.org/~lament/thue.html
08:59:12 <lament> okay, now the official home address is http://z3.ca/~lament/thue.html
08:59:42 <pgimeno> nice, I'll add it to my bookmarks (but I'll keep the wayback machine one just in case)
09:01:06 <lament> i think i wrote it at work :)
09:01:38 <lament> it's nice that wayback machine archives js as well as html
09:01:50 <pgimeno> and in some cases even .zip
09:02:27 <pgimeno> that's how I've managed to recover the True distribution (which is based, quite unsurprisingly, in False)
09:03:14 <puzzlet> Another Game of Text - http://puzzlet.org/tmp/pipe.htm
09:03:27 <puzzlet> Compare with http://puzzlet.org/tmp/braille.htm
09:07:38 <pgimeno> puzzlet, would you mind adding Arial Unicode MS to the list of fallback fonts?
09:08:27 <puzzlet> i just don't know much about unicode fonts
09:09:02 <lament> the sierpinsky triangle thue program has such a pretty memory state
09:09:21 <pgimeno> and Courier New just in case... the font that gets used here is not proportional :(
09:12:38 <puzzlet> i gotta be away from my keyboard
09:12:41 <tokigun> lament: links at http://z3.ca/~lament/ascii-art.html seem to be broken
09:13:50 <lament> i'll have to recover all that as well
09:13:58 <lament> just look at http://web.archive.org/web/20031218155802/cyberspace.org/~lament/ instead
09:14:15 <lament> mind you the page is 2 years old
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11:41:58 <pgimeno> I think it would be a good idea to write an ORK version of the CSS descrambler; ORK is just so verbose and explanatory that it could serve as a boost to the freedom-of-speech point
11:44:37 <kipple> are you volunteering? ;)
11:45:00 <pgimeno> an ORK interpreter is higher in my list of priorities
11:45:16 <kipple> initializing those arrays will be quite a lot of code...
11:45:31 <kipple> that would also be nice :)
11:46:34 <pgimeno> ORK is half the way towards an usable teaching language
11:52:26 <kipple> I somehow doubt that is Greg's intention
11:53:27 <pgimeno> well, he agreed that it was halfway usable for object-oriented programming teaching
11:53:42 <pgimeno> just I think that that's not his priority
11:55:38 <kipple> Wow. I just looked at the perl CSS descrambler on the CSS gallery. Perl has to be the most esoteric of the regular languages :)
11:56:36 <pgimeno> that's been commented here a few days ago
11:56:47 <kipple> then again, the tiniest C version is almost just as bad
11:57:55 <kipple> or good, depending on your point of view :)
11:59:48 <pgimeno> btw, the IOCCC has become a tiny coding contest these days... sorta lost some interest
14:01:06 <GregorR> It's curious that people have taken an interest in ORK ;)
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14:05:12 <Keymaker> it's weeeeeeeeeeekeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeend!!!
14:05:34 <GregorR> I haven't even gone to work on Friday yet >_<
14:05:55 <Keymaker> but notice when i'm worrying about monday
14:06:07 <fizzie> I just woke up, and it's 16:00.
14:06:22 <fizzie> I haven't gone to work on Friday yet either. :p
14:06:45 <Keymaker> may i ask how you managed to sleep so late?
14:06:55 <fizzie> I was pretty tired, what with not sleeping more than ~3 hours/night during the last week.
14:07:05 <GregorR> fizzie pulls out his marijuana - "And this helped too"
14:07:29 * GregorR has no clue whether that would actually help.
14:07:34 <GregorR> Is it an upper or a downer? Idonno
14:07:45 <fizzie> Besides, I slept only 0300 -> 1600, which is just 13 hours.
14:09:02 <GregorR> fizzie: I wouldn't if I didn't have to go to work.
14:11:15 <Keymaker> interesting stuff as there has been lately
14:11:33 <Keymaker> ORK version of decss would be worth of seeing
14:12:40 <Keymaker> lament: you know dopefish too?!
14:13:11 <GregorR> -ChanServ- Alternate: lament, last seen: 4 days (10h 4m 1s) ago
14:13:19 <GregorR> -ChanServ- Alternate: lament, last seen: 4 days (10h 4m 1s) ago
14:14:08 <Keymaker> as well, that cpressey stuff was fun
14:15:01 <Keymaker> puzzlet (and tokigun): that Babel Fish Research Group is really cool idea i think
14:15:20 <Keymaker> as well, publish some results in english ;)
14:20:21 <Keymaker> on a sidenote; has anyone seen a film called the Audition?
14:20:33 <Keymaker> it seems to be some horror movie
14:21:12 <Keymaker> i usually don't watch movies from tv, but just thought this one might be worth seeing
14:22:39 <GregorR> Never heard of it *shrugs*
14:22:55 <GregorR> How much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood? -> BABEL FISH -> How much wood is arctomys possible because arctomys it can the wood tap strike slightly?
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14:25:49 <Keymaker> "The last section of the film is one of the most brutal torture scenes ever put on celluloid, and it is definitely not for the faint of heart. But even in its gore-filled shockingness, the film is beautiful to look at, a monumental achievement by a director willing to take chances and challenge his audience."
14:25:54 <Keymaker> http://www.moviesonline.ca/movie_details.php?id=105
14:32:30 <fizzie> I'm trying to find a fixed point of the ps2pdf/pdf2ps conversion pair.
14:34:02 <fizzie> It is being difficult. Apparently each successive iteration adds 13 bytes to the postscript.
14:34:51 <fizzie> Hmm. The 13 bytes consist of the lines "0 0 0 0 re" and "f".
14:34:57 <fizzie> No, no, was just curious.
14:36:22 <fizzie> Interesting, though. The original postscript was 92603 bytes, after the first iteration it had increased to 99447 bytes, but after the second it suddenly jumped to 1714687 bytes.
14:36:36 <fizzie> (That's ~100k -> 1.7M.)
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17:46:11 <pgimeno> fizzie: have you managed to ever get a decreasing number?
17:46:57 <lindi-> fizzie: what version of ghostscript btw?
17:48:00 <pgimeno> I'm not the postscript-oriented kind of guy
17:50:55 <pgimeno> anyway I'm curious about what the results are with the conversion
17:51:17 <fizzie> ESP Ghostscript 7.07.1 (2003-07-12)
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18:09:31 <puzzlet> surprisingly Wikipedia had launched hieroglyph support
18:09:39 <puzzlet> http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:WikiHiero_syntax
18:09:55 <puzzlet> what it has to do with esoteric languages
18:11:28 <puzzlet> programming in hieroglyph seems classic, though :)
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18:24:20 <pgimeno> fizzie: about the size reduction, did you manage to get any?
18:36:48 <fizzie> No, the ps size is always monotonically increasing, and the pdf is quite constant.
18:36:51 <fizzie> See http://gehennom.org/~fis/ps2pdf.txt
18:49:20 <GregorR> Because I have waay to much free time, I've actually studied Hieroglyphs and the Ancient Egyptian language and grammar.
18:49:29 <GregorR> Aaaaand ... back to work :P
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21:01:43 <Keymaker> bf-hacks.org should be ready in 48
21:02:02 <Keymaker> seems i've received e-mail that told me that it should be functional in 48 hours :)
21:02:39 <Keymaker> better make some programs fast :)
21:04:22 <Keymaker> it's kinda neat how easy it is to do stuff via web.. like i just ordered the domain and paid it in web :)
21:06:35 <pgimeno> do you have any plans apart from the design?
21:07:10 <Keymaker> i have thought about making some section called "Study"
21:07:19 <Keymaker> which would have interesting stuff about brainfuck
21:07:32 <Keymaker> (the problem is to write this interesting stuff.. ;))
21:08:12 <pgimeno> oh well, it's easy, you know, just write it
21:08:38 <Keymaker> i guess i can get something done
21:08:51 <Keymaker> although that might appear long after the site is in web :)
21:09:01 <pgimeno> (that's true also for the Great Unification Theorem of Quantum Mechanics and Relativity, of course)
21:16:38 <pgimeno> is that spam or something? :P
21:21:12 <Keymaker> hmmm.. seems the audition (movie) starts in 15 minutes
21:23:27 <pgimeno> yes, I'm working in deep changes
21:24:12 <pgimeno> I wanted to write about my Malbolge adventure but there was no room for it, so I thought it was about time of updating it
21:24:29 <Keymaker> sounds like a good reading material
21:26:49 <Keymaker> seems i haven't managed to do almost anything in few weeks
21:27:07 <Keymaker> i wonder what i have been doing.. probably just chatting on this channel
21:27:36 <pgimeno> oh, surfing random websites is my source for inspiration
21:27:44 <pgimeno> did you read my Minesweeper article?
21:28:17 <pgimeno> it needs a bit of knowledge of logic gates
21:28:33 <Keymaker> yeah, i have some knowledge of those
21:28:41 <pgimeno> I just asked to show how I include lots of references of what I've visited
21:29:36 <pgimeno> just to prove my point that it's my source of inspiration :)
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23:45:07 <kipple> GregorR: which version of your page is the "official" one (i.e. which should I bookmark). befunge.org or formauri.es?
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23:50:13 <GregorR> kipple: http://eso.codu.org/ For the moment it points to befunge.org, but I'll change it if it becomes necessary to.
23:50:20 <GregorR> Hi and bye (back to work ;) )
23:50:54 <Keymaker> i hadn't guts to watch the movie :)
23:52:12 <kipple> speaking of which: Have you seen Braindead :)
23:52:27 * pgimeno prefers fuck rather than dead
23:52:34 <pgimeno> (sorry for the strong words)
23:54:27 <Keymaker> where was that minesweeper stuff again?
23:54:42 <GregorR> By the way, I got pointer support working in ORK, but as per usual I'm at work and can't upload it :-P
23:55:05 <pgimeno> http://www.formauri.es/personal/pgimeno/compurec/Minesweeper.php
23:55:15 <GregorR> I'm on a timecard, so if I leave, I get less 444
23:55:26 <GregorR> That I apparently can't type over VNC.
23:56:02 <pgimeno> GregorR: I have a few aspects to discuss with you about hosting, when you have the time
23:58:00 <GregorR> If you don't mind a slow, broken discussion, ask away ;)
23:58:44 <pgimeno> the main problem is that the server doesn't allow publishing directories
23:58:51 <pgimeno> http://www.formauri.es/personal/GregorR/
23:59:34 <pgimeno> pointing a link to a directory causes a 403