00:02:56 <shachaf> Taneb: you're twice as famous as i am in the hcar
00:03:14 <Taneb> shachaf, my goal for November is to be mentioned 5 times
00:03:23 <Taneb> shachaf, also one of my friends got in HWN this week
00:07:12 <Taneb> For his Book database, I think
00:10:18 <Taneb> See, not only am I famous, I have connections to other famous people!
00:21:21 * Taneb now has some chocolate :)
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02:55:51 <rdococ> how do I send messages via lambdabot?
02:58:36 <lambdabot> tell <nick> <message>. When <nick> shows activity, tell them <message>.
03:00:20 <rdococ> could I have just used the chat...???
03:04:21 <oerjan> these things always get out of hand
03:05:08 <rdococ> the way you shouted 'POSSIBLE' in all caps
03:05:24 <rdococ> it makes me feel like it would be a POSSIBLE future programming language...
03:06:52 * oerjan is now made of up to 80% self-produced memes.
03:07:02 <oerjan> or possibly self-stolen
03:09:02 <rdococ> probably wont use POSSIBLE
03:09:33 <zzo38> Can you help me to fix my level20.trope so that it is less straight if it is supposed to be less straight, or more straight if it is supposed to be more straight, or whatever else is wrong with it?
03:10:05 <rdococ> anyway, trying to get new ideas for a new language... function doesnt seem to be going well so I might scrap it...
03:10:15 <rdococ> all I really need is the name
03:10:52 * oren was briefly confused as to the meaning of 'straight'
03:11:21 * rdococ is still, more thoroughly, confused as to the meaning of a 'trope' file
03:12:18 <oerjan> i _think_ zzo38 is referring to the straight/subverted/etc. distinction used on trope sites.
03:12:50 <zzo38> That is what I am refering to.
03:13:36 <tswett> Have I already mentioned that my favorite esolangs are the ones that are built on one specific idea?
03:14:02 <zzo38> I don't know, but at least now you have done so.
03:15:20 <rdococ> ...wait... did I just dero?
03:16:02 <oerjan> The two steps of esolang construction: (1) Find one specific idea to base it around (2) Fill in the rest with _anything_other_than_brainfuck_
03:16:25 <zzo38> If you have the other stuff then yes it help
03:16:39 <tswett> I'm not sure if I've ever successfully come up with an esolang idea by specifically trying to do so.
03:17:18 <tswett> Lemme try to remember those esolangs I've come up with that I actually like.
03:17:25 <rdococ> umm... oerjan, you do know I try that all the time?
03:18:37 <oerjan> rdococ: this is general advice hth
03:18:59 <tswett> //, Al Dente, Proce. There have gotta be some more.
03:22:25 <tswett> I've rewritten the spec for Proce at least once. I'm still not sure about it.
03:23:38 <zzo38> This is what I was refering to http://zzo38computer.org/dnd/recording/level20.trope and this in turn refers to a wiki page, which can be corrected to match if needed too; I intend to update both with whatever tropes are applicable.
03:23:56 <tswett> I want to make sure that it's not possible to "cheat" in Proce by taking advantage of the fact that it's implemented as a series of time steps rather than a set of continuously changing analog signals.
03:25:09 <zzo38> Specify that the program can be worked with analog signals too
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03:29:23 <tswett> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Combienti%C3%A8m
03:29:31 <tswett> I like that one. It looks really confusing.
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03:31:35 <tswett> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Markont - oh god what the heck.
03:33:20 * oerjan vaguely recalls discussing Markont at some point
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03:37:27 <Lyka> so "Octopus 0003c LCD-Keypad-SD", whose commands match the newest incarnation of the Fourfuck language, has, like many previous versions of it, a double-sided reference sheet. Said reference sheet is in Courier New 6.5 and is full of text.
03:37:32 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Markont]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43106&oldid=36034 * Tanner Swett * (+27) Fixes
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03:41:05 <tswett> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Slide - ah, I love this.
03:41:50 <Sgeo> As ddrescue is copying this drive, I think it's failing more and more
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03:42:11 <Lyka> be glad that you are maing a copy
03:42:54 <Sgeo> Yes, but what of the data already lost?
03:43:01 <Sgeo> Also, could positioning of the drive be relevent/
03:43:10 <Sgeo> It's sitting outside any container on a piece of plastic
03:43:43 <Sgeo> Should I try repositioning it before a retry?
03:44:21 <Sgeo> I guess I should see how well the trimming thingy works
03:46:02 <tswett> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Minimum - pffheh.
03:48:25 <Lyka> if i add one more feature to the program, i will need a three-sided sheet of paper
03:49:06 <Sgeo> tswett, do you have Grandroids access? What do you think about Grandroids chemistry?
03:49:24 <tswett> I'm not familiar with Grandroids.
03:51:10 <Sgeo> Chemicals are strings made up of A, B, C, D, X, O. X and O can be operators, only the leftmost operator is relevent. O means the chemical is an enzyme, such that, say, AOB will combine A and B to make AB. X is for lysers, so AXB breaks apart AB into A and B
03:51:19 <Sgeo> AXXB breaks apart AXB into A and XB
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03:52:55 <Sgeo> I suggested an S to serve as an escape, like "the next character is not the operator", but it probably overcomplicates it and not being able to do certain things adds some flavor, although he said he'd look at it again if needed
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03:54:02 <tswett> One idea is to have multiple "strengths" of operators, and the relevant operator is the "strongest" one.
03:55:19 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Talk:Snack]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43107&oldid=23252 * Zzo38 * (+364)
03:57:35 <zzo38> People in NESdev wiki argue about whether or not RFC2119 should be used.
04:03:31 <pikhq> RFC2119 SHOULD be used; if you opt to not use it, you MUST NOT use its keywords for different purposes.
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04:28:22 <tswett> Doing so is the class-4 crime of Competing Standards.
04:30:13 <function> pikhq: how SHOULD one interpret those terms if has chosen that they MUST NOT use RFC2119
04:38:11 <zzo38> By not writing all uppercase if it isn't RFC2119
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05:05:03 <pikhq> "SHOULD" and such have quite precise meanings, while "should" and such merely have the common natural language meaning.
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05:07:49 <Elronnd|deminewt> If I come up with the concept for a joke programming language, am I allowed to put it on the wiki before I actually write the implementation?
05:08:18 <zzo38> You could, yes, there are many unimplemented stuff on wiki already
05:08:32 <zzo38> But you can also post it without adding into list until implementation is written if you prefer that way
05:09:10 <Elronnd|deminewt> Is it unfair if the implementation requires every implementation of every non-joke language to be installed on the user's box?
05:09:48 <zzo38> If it a joke language, it doesn't matter if it is unfair
05:10:28 <Elronnd|deminewt> I suppose a better question would be, where can I get a comprehensive list of all implementations of all non-joke languages
05:10:46 <zzo38> Not all of them are implemented yet sorry
05:12:47 <Lyka> Fourfuck needs to be removed from the wiki. It's become too spcialized
05:15:00 <Lyka> and won't work on anything other than an Arduino Uno + SD Reader + LCD1602 Keypad
05:15:16 <zzo38> Doesn't matter I think?
05:15:21 <Lyka> you haven't seen the current source code
05:15:25 * Sgeo once considered making an esolang based on Activr Worlds scripting
05:15:43 <Sgeo> Languages don't have to be defined based on the implementation
05:15:44 <Lyka> and i can always put it back
05:15:56 <Sgeo> *Active Worlds
05:16:05 <Lyka> if it ever becomes ready
05:18:30 <Lyka> [00=SIB0SOB0]00=Q000
05:19:31 * Elronnd|deminewt 's joke language is called "CompLANG", and will exit unless every implementation of every (non-joke) language parses the code with *no* warnings, will exit with an error
05:20:33 <Lyka> Elronnd|deminewt: i just typed a fourfuck line
05:21:19 <Lyka> well, an octopus line, fourfuc being the nme octopus seems to be called here
05:24:08 <Lyka> my personal name for it is octopus (personal joke), the esoteric name is fourfuck
05:35:32 <oren> definitely doesn't matter. some of the languages can't be implemented on any real computer, even in principle
05:36:45 <oren> (i think there was one explicitly requiring a halting problem orcale?)
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06:14:30 <Jafet> As they say, the joke is all in the telling.
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08:04:16 <ais523> idea: an esolang that is a derivative of itself
08:06:37 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[List of ideas]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43108&oldid=43062 * Ais523 * (+162) /* Derivative Ideas */ +1
08:06:38 <Taneb> ais523, like INTERCAL?
08:06:40 <ais523> actually, that's just Feather isn't it?
08:06:56 <ais523> Taneb: INTERCAL isn't a derivative of itself, it's a parody of other languages that existed in the early 1970s
08:09:24 <Taneb> I was thinking I call C-INTERCAL, CLC-INTERCAL, etc all INTERCAL
08:09:31 <Taneb> Whereas they are derivatives of eachother
08:09:47 <ais523> that counts, I think (although INTERCAL-72 isn't a derivative of any of them)
08:10:00 <ais523> I think you can describe newer versions of C-INTERCAL and CLC-INTERCAL as being derivatives of older versions of each other
08:10:07 <ais523> but there's no actual infinite regress there
08:10:11 <Taneb> But thinking about it I don't think it counts
08:10:45 <Taneb> (it's like calling sin x * cos x or something and going from there)
08:11:23 * ais523 is suddenly reminded of the double mockingbird, again
08:11:53 <ais523> about the best you can manage with a traditional type inference algorithm is to determine that its return value has the same type as itself
08:12:37 <Taneb> Anything you can do with a magic type inference algorithm?
08:12:56 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[List of ideas]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43109&oldid=43108 * Ais523 * (+92) /* General Ideas */ mention Snowflake
08:13:06 <ais523> Taneb: you can determine that it doesn't halt
08:13:23 <ais523> and therefore its return type is irrelevant
08:13:35 <ais523> (note: you don't need halting problem levels of magic to determine that /that specific term/ doesnt halt)
08:13:50 <zzo38> f(x)=e^x is the derivative of itself
08:14:18 <ais523> now I'm wondering if it's possible to define e^x like that
08:14:28 <ais523> is that the only function that's a derivative of itself?
08:14:31 <zzo38> I too was wondering about thing like that
08:14:43 <zzo38> Although f(x)=0 is also a derivative of itself
08:15:16 <ais523> ugh yes, for some reason I thought it differentiated to1
08:15:50 <Taneb> lim(h->0) (f(x+h) - f(x))/ h = f(x)
08:16:22 <Taneb> I don't think there is much we can conclude from that
08:17:11 <Taneb> But I am not good at this kind of thing
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08:17:44 <Taneb> I think we can define e to be the constant such that d/dx e^x = e^x
08:18:19 <zzo38> I have also seen it written as d(e^x) = e^x dx
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08:19:48 <zzo38> Although the first time I figured out that it is the derivative of itself, it is I figured it out by myself, because, I was in the school there is a separate "math class" and "calculus class"; I learned derivatives in the calculus class and while spare time in the math class I was looking through the textbook and found the series of e^x as well as sin x and cos x. Therefore I figured it out before the teacher told me later that year. (And also how e
08:20:48 <Taneb> zzo38, you were cut of after "(And also how e"
08:21:02 <zzo38> how e^(ix) is works!)
08:21:50 <ais523> doesn't that differentiate to ie^(ix)?
08:22:10 <ais523> although I just realised I probably missed the point
08:22:21 <zzo38> I meant how it is related to sin and cos functions
08:26:07 <Taneb> I can't seem to get Cairo's example program to compile...
08:26:15 <Taneb> ld is saying that none of cairo's names exist
08:27:06 <ais523> Taneb: missing a library dependency?
08:27:41 <Taneb> ais523, pkg-config finds Cairo
08:27:54 <zzo38> They did actually ask the question, what is the number k such as that: e^(kx) = cos(x) + k sin(x)
08:28:05 <ais523> Taneb: does it tell ld about it though?
08:28:12 <Taneb> ais523, I don't know
08:28:17 <Taneb> How do I check that?
08:28:35 <zzo38> I was able to answer the question (although it was not assigned); the answer was also given in the back of the book but it simply said square root of -1 but without any further explanation. Imaginary numbers aren't mentioned anywhere else in this book.
08:28:38 <ais523> well, are you doing anything to a) tell ld you want to link Cairo, or b) tell gcc to tell ld to link Cairo?
08:29:34 <Taneb> I am not very good at C, I was trying to follow Cairo's instructions, but I do not think I am
08:30:05 <zzo38> Then, learn to be good at C
08:30:05 <ais523> I'm personally not really a fan of pkg-config
08:31:09 <ais523> Taneb: however, the documentation implies that you'll need to place the output of "pkg-config --libs cairo" onto the command line that you use as part of the link (if you're building all at once, this will be the same command line as the compile)
08:31:24 <ais523> the output is, completely unsurprisingly, -lcairo which is how a normal package would do things
08:31:54 <Taneb> For me it is "-I/usr/include/cairo -I/usr/include/glib-2.0 -I/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/glib-2.0/include -I/usr/include/pixman-1 -I/usr/include/freetype2 -I/usr/include/libpng12 -lcairo"
08:32:23 <ais523> Taneb: --libs will give you just the -lcairo bit, I think
08:32:32 <ais523> I can understand why it uses pkg-config for the includes, though
08:32:47 <ais523> anyway, if you're giving -lcairo and it isn't working
08:32:53 <ais523> you're most likely missing the dev symlink for cairo
08:33:00 <ais523> on Ubuntu it'd be in a package called libcairo-dev
08:33:07 <ais523> along with the header files
08:33:20 <ais523> not sure which system you're on or what protocols it uses for this
08:34:28 <Taneb> "libcairo2-dev is already at the newest version"
08:35:08 <zzo38> What are you trying to make?
08:35:09 <ais523> try again specifying -lcairo manually just in case something stupid is going on
08:36:03 <Taneb> nathan@Nami:~$ cc -o c -lcairo C.c
08:36:03 <Taneb> C.c:1:19: fatal error: cairo.h: No such file or directory
08:36:03 <Taneb> #include <cairo.h>
08:36:03 <Taneb> compilation terminated.
08:36:26 <zzo38> Oops now make sure it is in the include path
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08:36:37 <zzo38> Or put in the directory of include path by yourself
08:37:27 <Taneb> Then I get the old error again
08:37:42 <Taneb> (with lots of undefined reference to ...)
08:38:15 <zzo38> I don't know how to work Cairo
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08:40:25 <Taneb> Me neither, evidently
09:21:58 <zzo38> I made up the way to convert JSON into RDF in case it is useful sometimes; it is possible also converting back other way.
09:22:05 <zzo38> For example: @prefix : <data:text/plain,>. [ :firstName "John"; :lastName "Smith"; :isAlive true; :age 25; :address [ :streetAddress "21 2nd Street"; :city "New York"; :state "NY"; :postalCode "10021-3100" ]; :phoneNumbers ([ :type "home"; :number "212 555-1234" ] [ :type "office"; :number "646 555-4567" ]); :children (); :spouse <xurn:null> ] <gopher://zzo38computer.org/1ns/meta:primary> ().
09:22:15 <zzo38> (This example is from the JSON example in Wikipedia)
09:22:44 <zzo38> Do you expect this is working OK?
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09:37:14 <mroman_> "joke language" is overused too much.
09:37:39 <zzo38> Maybe...or, maybe only a little bit too much
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10:38:49 <Jafet> "esoteric language"
10:41:36 <Jafet> @ask ais523 <ais523> an esolang that is a derivative of itself ; does ASCII Art- count?
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10:43:41 <Jafet> (Well, it's actually a derivative of a derivative of itself.)
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11:10:08 <Taneb> Help I am writing horrible C again
11:10:13 <Taneb> Is http://sprunge.us/DHOD portable?
11:11:27 <fungot> Jafet: supertux use it for screen? ( and which then generates scheme code) on how monads naturally arise as abstraction devices. anyone interested in coding computer games.
11:15:43 <Jafet> That looks legal. Clearly you need to obfuscate it more
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14:04:09 <oerjan> @tell ais523 <ais523> is that the only function that's a derivative of itself? <-- f(x) = C*e^x are the only ones
14:06:05 <oerjan> @tell ais523 so if you add f(0)=1 it's unique
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14:09:58 * oerjan tries to remember the "simple" proof
14:10:52 <oerjan> if f(x) = g(x)e^x, then (g(x)e^x)' = g'(x)e^x + g(x)e^x, so g'(x) = 0 and g is a constant.
14:11:14 <oerjan> @tell ais523 if f(x) = g(x)e^x, then (g(x)e^x)' = g'(x)e^x + g(x)e^x, so g'(x) = 0 and g is a constant.
14:11:53 <oerjan> @tell ais523 *+function
14:12:52 <oerjan> that's a pretty neat proof, really
14:16:38 <oerjan> iirc you can do similarly to find the solution for f''(x) = f(x) etc. (which includes e.g. sin and cos)
14:16:53 <oerjan> this vaguely remembered from differential equation class
14:17:40 <oerjan> although there's also a more powerful theorem you can use
14:18:07 <Taneb> Yeah, I sort of half remember something
14:18:26 <coppro> wait how does that actually prove that this is the only case where f(x) = f'(x)?
14:18:46 <oerjan> coppro: note that (g(x)e^x)' = g(x)e^x by assumption
14:21:41 <coppro> oh my god I just realized that the thieves' guild in discworld is a metaphor for government
14:23:48 <coppro> http://lmgtfy.com/?q=slowpoke.jpg
14:26:16 <oerjan> zzo38: ^ you might be interested to
14:29:05 <coppro> oerjan: what is the general solution to f(x) = f''(x)? f(x) = c_1e^{d x} + c_2e^{-d x} for |d| = 1?
14:31:35 <oerjan> more generally, for n differentiations, d is an nth root of unity.
14:31:53 <coppro> oh wait, no it doesn't
14:32:42 <oerjan> for 2, you can make a base change to use sin and cos instead
14:33:07 <oerjan> in all cases the solution set is a vector space of n dimensions
14:34:16 <oerjan> the second step negates
14:35:24 <oerjan> oh it's f''(x) = -f(x) which gets sin and cos, for f''''(x) = f(x) you still keep e^x and e^(-x) as well
14:35:25 <coppro> that's the misatke I made
14:35:40 <coppro> because +- i is a 4th root
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14:45:04 <Taneb> Hmm, I can get cairo programs to compile on my desktop (running Debian) but not my laptop (running Ubuntu0
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16:25:12 <oren> Does ?: create a sequence point?
16:29:27 <oren> I had an idea for an esoteric spreadsheet. The cells would be numbered by a mapping between N and Q+
16:29:43 <oren> e.g. that snakey path thing
16:31:20 <oren> Hmm I guess it has to be a bijection, not just a 'mapping'
16:33:15 <oren> Now, the fun part is, given you are at cell n, how to get the cell below, left, right or up?
16:35:33 <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cantor_pairing_function hth
16:37:51 <oren> so then, given cantors f, can we define a function g(z) such that if [x,y] = f(z) then [x+1,y] = f(g(z))
16:38:17 <oren> and what is the simplest expression of said function?
16:40:58 <oren> er, I suppose f above is the inverse.
16:41:12 <oren> so it should be f^-1
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16:49:06 <oren> hmm... z' = z + x + y + 1
16:50:40 <oerjan> afaik the tricky part is that you need an integer square root to find out which diagonal you're on
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16:52:38 <oerjan> so it's not going to be a very pretty formula
16:53:13 <oren> z' = z + floor((sqrt(8*z+1)-1)/2) + 1
16:53:38 <oren> yeah, not pretty at all
16:54:33 <oren> that's for z' s.t. y' = y and x' = x + 1
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16:59:10 <oren> prettier: z' = z + ⌊(√8̅*̅z̅+̅1̅-1)/2⌋ + 1
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17:01:44 <oren> and of course, to get z' for y+1 instead of x+1 you add one to the previous
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17:09:52 <oren> But this enables to represent a 2d array of data without reference to its dimensions... that might actually be useful
17:10:15 <oren> (for a given value of 'useful')
17:19:10 <oren> well, the performance for sequential access is pretty abysmal
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17:26:05 <lambdabot> CYUL 301700Z 22022G28KT 30SM FEW040CB FEW110 BKN240 29/19 A2987 RMK CB2AC1CI5 AC TR SLP114 DENSITY ALT 1800FT
17:28:08 <lambdabot> KOAK 301653Z 26006KT 10SM OVC006 12/10 A2999 RMK AO2 SLP155 T01220100
17:28:37 <lambdabot> LLBG 301720Z 32005KT CAVOK 22/14 Q1014 NOSIG
17:29:06 <lambdabot> oerjan asked 1d 15h 31m 36s ago: So, why did you study in hell, then?
17:29:26 <boily> @ask oerjan study?
17:30:34 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Microscript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43110&oldid=43105 * 72.74.32.143 * (+51)
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18:43:30 <oren> 2 byte time of day: rounded value of (hour*3600+minute*60+second)*65536/86400
18:44:47 <fizzie> oren: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexadecimal_time
18:45:43 <oren> everything old is new again
18:46:03 <oren> apparently Tang Dynsty old, wow
18:47:01 <MDude> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexadecimal#Verbal_and_digital_representations
18:50:13 <MDude> So they also used hexadecimal for a bunch of other things, which is neat.
18:54:30 <oren> it is approximately d1ea now
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18:59:16 <oren> hmm a hex second is 1.318359375 regular seconds...
18:59:56 <oren> the sixteens digit changes every 20 seconds.
19:01:40 <scoofy> what is hex time useful for?
19:01:51 <oren> to fit in only 2 vytes
19:03:29 <oren> the twofitysixes digit changes every 337 seconds or 5.6 minutes. the fortininysixes digit changes exactly every 1.5 hours
19:07:45 <oren> I wonder what the average and maximum conversion error is
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19:25:57 <oren> the avergae error in conversion to hex time and back is 1/4 of a second
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19:37:58 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Microscript]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43111&oldid=43110 * SuperJedi224 * (+31)
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20:16:07 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Treehugger]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43112&oldid=41558 * SuperJedi224 * (+54)
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20:34:00 <zzo38> LADSPA is a bit too simple and LV2 is a bit too complicated and both have a few other problems (although LADSPA does seem pretty reasonable for many stuff); if I make up my own based on something in between LADSPA and LV2 and Csound then what is it called?
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20:38:34 <zzo38> Ah, it is a bit long (but maybe it is OK, or can be shortened somehow)
20:38:51 <zzo38> I would drop "V2" at least.
20:43:30 <zzo38> Like LV2 we have plugins identified by URIs, and compatible plugins by the same URI (but, even plugins compatible with other systems can be identified: The same as the LV2 URI for LV2, "xurn:ladspa:" for LADSPA, "xurn:vst:" for VST, "urn:uuid:" for DirectX, and "xurn:rdn:" for AU).
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21:21:01 <zzo38> Let's try some other kind of name.....
21:21:32 <nys> does anybody here understand game semantics?
21:23:08 <zzo38> "Simple Extensible Audio Plugin System"? "Open Extensible Audio Plugin System"? I don't quite know?
21:23:40 <nys> i think i can sort of wrap my head around the interpretation in logic in terms of like, there is a winning strategy for a person defending a proposition or attacking the proposition
21:24:02 <nys> but i wonder if it gets significantly more involved when it comes to modelling something like PCF
21:24:32 <zzo38> I know a few things but hardly much
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21:28:18 <zzo38> I had a different idea though of game using sequent calculus: The initial state is any sequent. The first player selects a rule with the current state below the line, filling in parameters as necessary. The second player selects a sequent above the line to move to. A player who runs out of legal moves loses.
21:34:49 <zzo38> (Draws are broken in favor of the second player when it is necessary to break draws.)
21:46:40 <oren> So is MongoDB going to put relational databases out of business?
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21:57:15 <zzo38> I don't know, at least, I still like to use SQLite
22:06:04 <oren> "...However, because internally sort() uses the C++ strcmp api..." O_o "the C++ strcmp api" (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
22:06:40 <oren> it's not a C++ api, it is a C function!\
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22:07:31 <oren> yes, I'mma use the C++ qsort api to sort things too!
22:08:51 <oren> source: http://docs.mongodb.org/manual/reference/bson-types/#string
22:08:53 <Jafet> Just because you don't use C++ strcmp to program applications doesn't mean that no one else does.
22:11:24 <oren> I thing normally API implies something more than a C function... like maybe i might refer to "the C string.h API" but even that is pushin it
22:14:31 <zzo38> I have seen a chess problem where it is mate in 2, but it is not possible to mate in 1 from the position which results after both players make their first move in the first problem; it is again mate in 2. And then after both players make the first move in this second problem, the resulting position is again mate in 2.
22:15:50 <Jafet> That doesn't sound like a mate-in-2 then
22:16:48 <zzo38> By the next position I mean only the pieces on the board though, as is normal in chess problems.
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22:32:01 <lambdabot> ENVA 302220Z 09010KT 9999 -SHRA FEW025 SCT039 BKN051 09/04 Q1002 RMK WIND 670FT 10013KT
22:32:14 <oerjan> 20 degrees difference from boily
22:32:26 <oerjan> i think i prefer 9 to 29
22:34:12 <oerjan> @tell boily We already established Laval was there hth
22:36:47 <oerjan> fizzie: HackEgo is doing that thing again
22:37:15 <oerjan> @tell fizzie HackEgo is doing that thing again
22:37:58 <oerjan> Gregor: that's for you too, in principle
22:41:14 <shachaf> oerjan: how do you feel about 39 twh
22:41:44 <oerjan> how can i feel anything if i'm dead from heat tdnh
22:46:14 <shachaf> 40 degrees is totally survivable hth
22:46:39 <oerjan> oh i see you must be using fahrenheit
22:47:45 <shachaf> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eilat#Climate
22:47:58 <shachaf> in fact it's my father's idea of a good time hth
22:48:28 <oerjan> MDude: this is, in fact, not the #sleeping channel
22:53:11 <oerjan> <zzo38> (Draws are broken in favor of the second player when it is necessary to break draws.) <-- now i wonder if there are logics that are asymmetric like that
22:53:54 <oerjan> _one_ side can use law of excluded middle, but not the other...
22:54:17 <MDude> But then how do you decide whice player goes second?
22:54:38 <oerjan> MDude: um i assume you'd get two logics complementing each other, really
22:57:18 <oerjan> shachaf: wait he's actually there? i was trying to resist temptation for a negev joke
22:58:09 <oerjan> (norway isn't known for its deserts, really)
23:24:09 <zzo38> Do you know how would write .XM playing software?
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23:25:52 <nys> read the .xm specification. write a player.
23:26:18 <nys> .xm seems not as nice a format as .it
23:27:20 <zzo38> I do have .xm specification, the specification isn't very good to tell you playing much though
23:27:51 <zzo38> Also, .XM is the format that AmigaMML writes, and one advantage of .XM is that it can more easily be piped between programs than .IT format can be
23:33:22 <zzo38> I did however use the specification to make up a program to write .XM files, but I had to fix and add few things that were wrong/missing
23:48:45 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Brainfuck implementations]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43113&oldid=41855 * 155.133.12.236 * (+109) /* Normal implementations */
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