←2020-04-01 2020-04-02 2020-04-03→ ↑2020 ↑all
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02:35:39 <esowiki> [[FiM++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70579&oldid=69638 * Salpynx * (+16) /* Collatz sequence */ 5yr old pointed out a logic bug in my code. Fixed.
02:36:47 <kmc> lol
02:38:45 <zzo38> I am reading the SIGBOVIK proceedings. There is something about chess, giving an example with Fischer Random where the king is moving to the cell where the rook currently occupies, but nevertheless you are required to move the king first and then move the rook. One way I think might be to pick up the king with some fingers and use other fingers on the same hand to move the rook.
02:40:40 <b_jonas> zzo38: yes, there are two articles by tom7 this year
02:44:19 <b_jonas> no I'm wrong
02:44:23 <b_jonas> there are three
02:45:14 <b_jonas> or who the heck knows really
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03:45:01 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Hommecitrons * New user account
03:47:24 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70580&oldid=70575 * Hommecitrons * (+129) /* Introductions */
03:51:54 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70581&oldid=69580 * Hommecitrons * (+50)
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07:16:14 <esowiki> [[Babalang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=70582 * RocketRace * (+3268) Begin writing the article. Will keep stub status until I am finished.
07:17:36 <esowiki> [[Talk:Babalang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=70583 * RocketRace * (+176) Created page with "Hello. This article is incomplete. I will continue writing to it once I have free time. ~~~~"
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08:41:47 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Javaveryhot * New user account
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09:49:07 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70584&oldid=70580 * Javaveryhot * (+121)
09:49:36 <esowiki> [[Kentarg]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=70585 * Javaveryhot * (+1412) Created page with "Kentarg is a programming language created by ~~~. The project was started at 6 February 2020 and released (with version 0.0.0) at 14 February 2020. Kentarg program files use..."
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10:21:06 <esowiki> [[Kentarg]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70586&oldid=70585 * Javaveryhot * (+1805)
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10:31:48 <esowiki> [[Int**]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70587&oldid=70122 * Hakerh400 * (+22)
10:38:25 <esowiki> [[Self-modifying Turing machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70588&oldid=70425 * Hakerh400 * (+642) Explain an edge case in details
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11:10:44 <esowiki> [[Halt halt halt]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=70589 * Hakerh400 * (+2106) +[[Halt halt halt]]
11:10:49 <esowiki> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70590&oldid=70556 * Hakerh400 * (+21) +[[Halt halt halt]]
11:10:52 <esowiki> [[User:Hakerh400]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70591&oldid=70505 * Hakerh400 * (+21) +[[Halt halt halt]]
11:13:34 <esowiki> [[Halt halt halt]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70592&oldid=70589 * Hakerh400 * (-38)
11:17:55 <esowiki> [[Halt halt halt]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70593&oldid=70592 * Hakerh400 * (+44)
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13:30:08 <int-e> Oh, Halt halt halt... Let's wait for an example program that exercises all 3 values (assuming ZFC is consistent).
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14:23:50 <esowiki> [[Duck Duck Goose]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70594&oldid=42970 * LegionMammal978 * (-963) fixed examples, added categories
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15:27:26 <esowiki> [[Talk:Flurry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70595&oldid=70559 * Yul3n * (+209)
15:37:14 <esowiki> [[Cthulhu]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70596&oldid=66590 * Yul3n * (+128)
16:49:29 <zzo38> O, in Magic: the Gathering now they made up cards that you can cast from your sideboard if certain conditions are met.
17:07:31 <b_jonas> zzo38: oh jesus they're making permanents made of multiple cards (like B.F.M.s or SNOT or meld or host) in black-bordered magic. in common. this will be a rules nightmare.
17:09:13 <b_jonas> also wtf is a Hero. it used to be a defunct creature type, but apparently there's now a card type, outside of standard-legal expansions, named the same.
17:09:48 <b_jonas> I really can't keep up with all this nonsense that wizards creates these days
17:10:17 <zzo38> I don't know all of the rules yet, but I am guessing it is similar to meld for the purpose of zone changes, although I don't know what happens to the spell once a permanent is mutated, since the permanent is an object that already existed, presumably it remains the same one, just with different characteristics.
17:15:24 <b_jonas> why the heck would they name something that goes onto the type line the same as a defunct creature type?
17:15:55 <b_jonas> unless it's for the same purpose, like Legendary named of Legend I guess
17:15:55 <zzo38> I don't know. I don't know what it means either, if anything.
17:17:30 <zzo38> I don't like all of the rules of Magic: the Gathering myself, such as rule 202.3b looks messy to me, and the rules prohibiting creatures from being attached to anything is also messy to me.
17:18:18 <zzo38> (Also, instead of [ability] counters, I would have made the rules [ability] tokens: An [ability] token is a Aura enchantment token with "enchant permanent" and "enchanted permanent has [ability]".)
17:18:27 <b_jonas> that's even worse than making an "Avatar" creature type
17:18:38 <b_jonas> because "Avatar" at least wasn't in the type line
17:19:02 <zzo38> What do you think about [ability] counters?
17:20:41 <b_jonas> I'm less afraid of those. they won't cause rules problems. they may cause playability problems, but wizards is aggressively checking for those, at least in standard, so it probably won't happen.
17:21:07 <b_jonas> it's certainly better than the workarounds like static abilities that apply "as long as" a permanent has a certain type of counter
17:21:54 <zzo38> Yes, it won't have rules problems, and avoids workarounds like that too.
17:22:13 <zzo38> Although as I said I would have done it as tokens instead
17:22:33 <b_jonas> or the ones that just modify characteristic forever without any marker like a counter, like Balduvian Frostwaker
17:22:45 <b_jonas> compared to those, an ability counter is a cleaner solution
17:23:07 <b_jonas> obviously they have to be careful balancing them so that they don't cause playability problems in formats with larger cardpool
17:23:15 <zzo38> Although there are disadvantages to using tokens too, such as status.
17:23:19 <b_jonas> `card-by-name Aquitect's Will
17:23:20 <HackEso> Aquitect's Will \ U \ Tribal Sorcery -- Merfolk \ Put a flood counter on target land. That land is an Island in addition to its other types for as long as it has a flood counter on it. If you control a Merfolk, draw a card. \ LRW-C, DDT-C
17:23:28 <b_jonas> ^ this is an example for the "as long as it has a flood counter" thing
17:25:36 <b_jonas> there's also the solution where they print tokens and do abilities like "create an aura enchantment token with shroud and enchant creature and 'enchanted creature has flying' attached to target creature", but it gets long and ugly to print such abilities, so it's not useful when they want to do in large numbers
17:28:00 <b_jonas> anyway, +X/+X counter tech has existed forever in Magic, so it's technology that's proven to work if they don't overuse it
17:29:27 <b_jonas> I just wonder if there's any clash with existing names of counters that happen to be ability words
17:29:48 <zzo38> Yes, I wondered about that too.
17:32:30 <b_jonas> the rules manager probably knew for a decade that ability counters may come one day, but would he have the authority to veto the *name* of a keyword ability on that ground?
17:44:14 <zzo38> I don't know.
17:44:46 <zzo38> Another idea I thought of is for ability counters to use the words "[ability] ability counter".
17:49:34 <zzo38> Also, perhaps they will have to add a new sub-layer for ability counters.
18:06:54 <b_jonas> `card-by-name Soul Echo
18:06:54 <HackEso> Soul Echo \ XWW \ Enchantment \ Soul Echo enters the battlefield with X echo counters on it. \ You don't lose the game for having 0 or less life. \ At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice Soul Echo if there are no echo counters on it. Otherwise, target opponent may choose that for each 1 damage that would be dealt to you until your next upkeep, you remove an echo counter from Soul Echo instead. \ MI-R
18:08:22 <b_jonas> zzo38: ^ echo counter. echo used to be a keyword ability without a parameter.
18:10:54 <b_jonas> imagine suddenly having to pay WW for each counter on Soul Echo each turn
18:11:17 <zzo38> Echo costs only apply once.
18:11:31 <zzo38> O, OK, so there is one (although now that keyword ability has a parameter, so it is perhaps not as bad as the other one).
18:12:07 <b_jonas> oh true, you'd only pay it one turn
18:12:30 <b_jonas> like I said, echo didn't use to have a parameter. even the Comp rules mentions that.
18:12:35 <b_jonas> see the printed text of Acridian
18:13:09 <zzo38> Yes, I do know that.
18:15:02 <b_jonas> well, at least in this case, at worst they have to oracle patch it to use echo - {0} counters, or better, some other kind of named counters
18:15:47 <zzo38> Yes.
18:16:24 <rain1> hi
18:16:55 <zzo38> Still, I said it is messy due to things like this, and would prefer explicitly calling them "ability counters" in the text. The effect is the same, although it is more clearly what it means and provides better forward and backward compatibility.
18:19:14 <b_jonas> oh yeah, there are fuse counters, but they'd be really hard, probably impossible, to get them to a situation where it's ambiguous
18:19:20 <b_jonas> `card-by-name Goblin Bomb
18:19:21 <HackEso> Goblin Bomb \ 1R \ Enchantment \ At the beginning of your upkeep, you may flip a coin. If you win the flip, put a fuse counter on Goblin Bomb. If you lose the flip, remove a fuse counter from Goblin Bomb. \ Remove five fuse counters from Goblin Bomb, Sacrifice Goblin Bomb: Goblin Bomb deals 20 damage to target player or planeswalker. \ WL-R \ \ Goblin Bombardment \ 1R \ Enchantment \ Sacrifice a creature: Goblin Bombardment deals 1 damage to
18:19:34 <b_jonas> mentioned on multiple old cards
18:19:46 <esowiki> [[Minimal operation language]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70597&oldid=70574 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+1124)
18:20:03 <zzo38> The other possibility, other than explicitly saying they are ability counters in the effect that adds them, is to extend rule 111.10 similar to how I mentioned before.
18:20:34 <zzo38> (Although this results in a different effect than the other one.)
18:21:04 <b_jonas> they could also just explicitly list which named counters are ability counters
18:23:01 <zzo38> Yes, although I don't like that much either, since it interferes with unofficial cards.
18:34:10 <esowiki> [[Minimal operation language]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70598&oldid=70597 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+162) /* Operators */
18:34:53 <esowiki> [[Minimal operation language]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70599&oldid=70598 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+18) /* Syntax */
18:35:28 <esowiki> [[Minimal operation language]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70600&oldid=70599 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+29) /* Syntax */
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19:34:36 <esowiki> [[KeyVM]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70601&oldid=68927 * Void * (+33) /* General properties */
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20:23:43 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Usernametaken * New user account
20:30:39 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70602&oldid=70584 * Usernametaken * (+430) /* Introductions */
20:31:38 <esowiki> [[Befunge]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70603&oldid=65759 * Usernametaken * (+1) /* Hello, world! (without string reversion) */
20:33:52 <esowiki> [[Befunge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=70604&oldid=70603 * Usernametaken * (+0) /* Simple game ("Less or More") */
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22:48:59 <tromp> int-e: I ended up just using id (\ 1) instead of bottom inside simpE, which has the exact same behaviour
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23:54:49 <zzo38> I thought some idea of ais523's card game. Possibly the overspill for Reconnaissance resource can be moving cards from the bottom of your spent pile to the bottom of your regular pile.
←2020-04-01 2020-04-02 2020-04-03→ ↑2020 ↑all