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01:38:06 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137527&oldid=137526 * Tommyaweosme * (+189)
01:39:23 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137528&oldid=137527 * Tommyaweosme * (+2)
01:45:48 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137529&oldid=137528 * None1 * (+338) /* Copyright violation */
01:51:56 <esolangs> [[Talk:Brainfuckconsole74]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137530&oldid=137243 * Tommyaweosme * (+3382)
01:52:49 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137531&oldid=137529 * Tommyaweosme * (+205) /* Copyright violation */
01:54:46 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137532&oldid=136991 * Tommyaweosme * (+218)
01:56:51 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137533&oldid=137532 * Tommyaweosme * (-244)
02:02:23 <esolangs> [[Kcidea]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137534 * Tommyaweosme * (+470) Created page with "{{lowercase}}kcidea is a language that makes you feel immense pain like you are on fire when you use it. it is comparable to the active denial system. == commands == the only people stupid enough to use this have provided documentation for ''some'' of these commands:
02:03:05 <esolangs> [[Kcidea]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137535&oldid=137534 * Tommyaweosme * (+52)
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02:54:46 <esolangs> [[Dotfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137536&oldid=137332 * None1 * (+109) /* Why is it brain-exploding */
03:10:27 <esolangs> [[... Bottles of beer on the wall]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137537 * None1 * (+29731) Created page with "... Bottles of beer on the wall is an even more brain-exploding [[brainfuck]] derivative by [[User:None1]]. It is like [[Bottles of beer on the wall]]. But instead of numbers, you use dots! ==Examples== ===One time [[Cat Program]]=== <pre> ......
03:10:42 <esolangs> [[... Bottles of beer on the wall]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137538&oldid=137537 * None1 * (-1) /* Cat program] */
03:11:47 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137539&oldid=137286 * None1 * (+38) /* Non-alphabetic */
03:12:03 <esolangs> [[... Bottles of beer on the wall]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137540&oldid=137538 * None1 * (+6)
03:12:52 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137541&oldid=137272 * None1 * (+120) /* My Esolangs */
03:14:16 <esolangs> [[Dead fish +- +.]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137542&oldid=137274 * None1 * (+45)
03:17:59 <esolangs> [[PlusOrOutput]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137543&oldid=118648 * None1 * (+1) /* Hello World */
03:20:45 <esolangs> [[PlusOrOutput]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137544&oldid=137543 * None1 * (+1013) /* Interpreter for PlusOrOutput only (in Python) */ Add interpreters in JS
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03:29:01 <zzo38> Which file format can be used if I want a key/value database which is mostly reading and not writing, and the key and value are both sequences of bytes, and that if you find a specific record then you can easily find all records that have the same key as a prefix (and that you can also do so even if there is no such record for the requested key)?
03:39:44 <ais523> zzo38: the last property you talk about sounds like a B+ tree; I know there are database formats based on those
03:40:37 <ais523> if write performance is completely unimportant you could use a list of key/value pairs sorted by the key, and use binary search to find entries
03:42:06 <ais523> if you're looking for more of a standard file format, SQLite should work, storing one table with an index on the key
03:43:09 <esolangs> [[Interpret Esolangs Online]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137545&oldid=127630 * None1 * (+39) /* Introduction */ PIO and POO are now supported
03:46:45 <esolangs> [[PlusOrOutput]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137546&oldid=137544 * None1 * (+4570) /* Interpreters for both languages in JavaScript */
03:55:00 <esolangs> [[Talk:Translated Shakespeare]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137547 * None1 * (+264) Created page with "You can translate using the wrong language to get wierd translations. --~~~~"
03:56:40 <esolangs> [[User talk:Page crapper from explain xkcd]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137548&oldid=137515 * None1 * (+215)
04:01:24 <esolangs> [[NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine with an iterating quine]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137549 * None1 * (+594) Created page with "'''NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine with an iterating quine''' is an esolang invented by [[User:None1]]. It is [[NameErro
04:03:56 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137550&oldid=137260 * None1 * (+443) /* Error simulators */
04:07:23 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137551&oldid=137541 * None1 * (+854) /* My Esolangs */
04:08:17 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137552&oldid=137551 * None1 * (+30)
04:09:05 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137553&oldid=137552 * None1 * (+36) /* My Esolangs */
04:09:11 <esolangs> [[C@++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137554&oldid=133820 * BoundedBeans * (+861) Made the language much more powerful/expressive with new commands
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04:13:41 <esolangs> [[Talk:Nope.]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137555&oldid=134527 * None1 * (+313) /* + interpreter using Nope. */
04:15:48 <esolangs> [[Talk:Nope.]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137556&oldid=137555 * None1 * (+121) /* + interpreter using Nope. */
04:17:05 <esolangs> [[Talk:C@]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137557&oldid=109970 * None1 * (+275)
04:17:17 <esolangs> [[Talk:C@]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137558&oldid=137557 * None1 * (+12)
04:18:18 <esolangs> [[C@++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137559&oldid=137554 * BoundedBeans * (+353) Added some examples
04:21:54 <esolangs> [[User:BoundedBeans]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137560&oldid=135046 * BoundedBeans * (+123)
04:22:25 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137561&oldid=137539 * BoundedBeans * (+25)
04:30:57 <esolangs> [[Dead fish]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137562&oldid=137269 * None1 * (+25)
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04:41:53 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137563&oldid=137506 * None1 * (+340)
04:45:51 <zzo38> Write performance is not completely unimportant, but read performance is more important. I would also expect that when writes occur, several records will be written at once rather than one at a time (although one at a time is also possible, but less likely).
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04:58:34 <b_jonas> zzo38: if write preformance is *completely* unimportant then you should sort the whole table after each write and do some kind of binary search among sorted records for reading. but a writable B-tree isn't really much worse than that.
04:59:28 <b_jonas> and I think sqlite3 might work decently for what you want
05:01:00 <zzo38> I had considered the SQLite4 format, which is a real key/value database unlike SQLite3.
05:01:17 <b_jonas> well... it's not perfect, if you can have multiples of the key then it might not be the best format, or you need some kind of trick for it where you append a unique identifier column and make the two columns together the primary key, so that you can have just one table WITHOUT ROWID table, rather than a table and a separate index
05:02:32 <b_jonas> if not then you have to put them in one single column where you artificially append something to your key to make it unique
05:03:58 <b_jonas> mind you, the separate index mostly just makes the write performance worse if you make that index contain all columns
05:04:08 <b_jonas> so even a normal table can work
05:05:25 <b_jonas> yeah, I guess just use a normal table with an index covering both the key and value columns, and don't make the key primary or unique since you want to allow it to repeat
05:07:57 <b_jonas> if you want to find all records with a prefix then write a comparison like WHERE key BETWEEN ?1 AND ?2 but you bind ?2 to the same as ?1 incremented by 1 when interpreted as a big-endian number
05:08:24 <b_jonas> so it's as if WHERE key BETWEEN 'one' AND 'onf'
05:08:36 <b_jonas> only you probably use blobs instead of strings
05:10:43 <zzo38> Yes, that would do, although SQL is more than is needed, I think, especially if it is merely a key/value database. I do understand what you mean and had thought of that too but it seems much more complicated than it should be.
05:11:13 <b_jonas> it certainly is, but you don't need to use all the features
05:12:07 <b_jonas> also make sure to read https://sqlite.org/howtocompile.html
05:12:50 <b_jonas> there's a lot of optional features that you usually needn't compile into sqlite3 if you aren't like making debian with a thousand packages depending on sqlite3, and they now have good documentation describing these compile-time settings
05:15:14 <b_jonas> (you've probably read it already, but the documentation is kind of new so I want to mention it)
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05:38:41 <esolangs> [[lang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137564&oldid=132867 * PrySigneToFry * (+73) Fixed [[wenyan]] interpreter
05:39:58 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137565&oldid=136954 * PrySigneToFry * (+35)
05:44:11 <esolangs> [[Translated Die Deutsche Programmiersprache]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137566 * None1 * (+2563) Created page with "There have been lots of horribly translations of esolangs in English and Chinese, this time let's translate one that isn't. '''Translated Die Deutsche Programmiersprache''' is an esolang invented by [[User:None1]]. It is [[Die Deutsche
05:45:06 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137567&oldid=137550 * None1 * (+118) /* Horribly translated variants */
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05:46:53 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137568&oldid=137553 * None1 * (+88) /* My Esolangs */
06:00:57 <esolangs> [[Foo : The term 'foo' is not recognized as the name of a cmdlet, function, script file, or operable program. Check the spelling of the name, or if a path was included, verify that the path is correct and try again.]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137569&oldid=131324 * None1 * (+33) /* See also */
06:01:52 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137570&oldid=133843 * Yayimhere * (-2222) /* Triangular CPU */
06:02:18 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137571&oldid=137570 * Yayimhere * (-226) /* idea 2 */
06:04:12 <esolangs> [[Is not recognized as the name of a cmdlet, function, script file, or operable program. Check the spelling of the name, or if a path was included, verify that the path is correct and try again.]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137572&oldid=131489 * None1 * (-14) /* Examples */ no spaces
06:13:08 <esolangs> [[Wow owo]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137573 * Yayimhere * (+3332) Created page with "{{lowercase}} '''wow owo''' is a [[Cellular automaton]] created by [[User:Yayimhere]] while bored == cell types and interactions == cell types: * <code>#</code> copies itself in every direction(no diags). if 3 come in a horizontal cluster walls form around them(<code
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06:26:29 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137574&oldid=137456 * Ractangle * (+14)
06:36:57 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137575&oldid=137563 * Ractangle * (+99)
06:37:58 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137576&oldid=137512 * Ractangle * (+4) /* Syntax */
06:39:06 <esolangs> [[Markov algorithm]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137577&oldid=137523 * Unname4798 * (+112)
06:40:03 <esolangs> [[Markov algorithm]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137578&oldid=137577 * Unname4798 * (+12)
06:41:48 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137579&oldid=137576 * Ractangle * (+0)
06:42:03 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137580&oldid=137579 * Ractangle * (+0)
06:44:44 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137581&oldid=137580 * Ractangle * (+21)
06:44:54 <esolangs> [[]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137582 * PrySigneToFry * (+3069) Created page with " is an Esolang designed by PSTF which inspired from [[Bottles of beer on the wall]]. == Exmaples == === 1-time Cat Program === <pre> ..."
06:45:34 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137583&oldid=137581 * Ractangle * (+1)
06:45:37 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137584&oldid=137582 * PrySigneToFry * (+64)
06:45:55 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137585&oldid=137583 * Ractangle * (-22)
06:46:10 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137586&oldid=137561 * PrySigneToFry * (+28)
06:46:39 <esolangs> [[Talk:Undelta]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137587 * Yayimhere * (+126) Created page with "so would <code>`1</code> push one? --~~~~"
06:48:10 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137588&oldid=134864 * PrySigneToFry * (+473) /* English */ new section
06:48:29 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137589&oldid=137588 * PrySigneToFry * (+5) TM
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06:52:21 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137590&oldid=137044 * PrySigneToFry * (+641) /* I might ! need an English page for . */ new section
06:52:58 -!- tromp has joined.
06:54:08 <esolangs> [[Category:Audio Output]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137591&oldid=106427 * Ractangle * (+23)
06:54:41 <esolangs> [[User:XKCD Random Number]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137592&oldid=137273 * PrySigneToFry * (+39)
06:59:37 <esolangs> [[U (PrySigneToFry)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137593&oldid=137422 * PrySigneToFry * (+130)
07:00:33 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137594&oldid=137586 * PrySigneToFry * (+8)
07:03:16 <esolangs> [[U (PrySigneToFry)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137595&oldid=137593 * PrySigneToFry * (+82)
07:03:51 <esolangs> [[U (PrySigneToFry)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137596&oldid=137595 * PrySigneToFry * (+20)
07:04:06 <esolangs> [[U (PrySigneToFry)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137597&oldid=137596 * PrySigneToFry * (-2)
07:10:15 <esolangs> [[Talk:Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137598&oldid=137587 * Yayimhere * (+129)
07:11:26 <esolangs> [[I am sure this is the shortest code for 99 bottles of beer]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137599&oldid=115858 * PrySigneToFry * (-31036)
07:12:38 <esolangs> [[]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137600 * Yayimhere * (+21) Redirected page to [[Undelta]]
07:23:21 <wWwwW> today somebody had already written a truth machine in word worm. damn
07:25:05 <esolangs> [[User:Cycwin]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137601 * Cycwin * (+952) Sdac2
07:28:23 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137602 * Cycwin * (+952) Sdac2
07:32:54 <esolangs> [[User:Cycwin]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137603&oldid=137601 * Cycwin * (-770)
07:33:55 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137604&oldid=137602 * Cycwin * (+7)
07:55:25 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137605 * Yayimhere * (+813) Created page with "'''0x80070050''' or '''sorry this file exists'''(which is what this error code is for...for the file existing) is a esolang created by [[User:Yayimhere]] inspired by [[An Odd Rewriting System]]. it really just annoys you == memory == there are 3 memory things: * <co
07:56:11 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137606&oldid=137605 * Yayimhere * (+23)
08:00:23 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137607&oldid=137606 * Yayimhere * (+91)
08:03:04 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137608&oldid=137607 * Yayimhere * (+100)
08:05:31 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137609&oldid=137608 * Yayimhere * (+77)
08:10:16 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137610&oldid=137574 * Yayimhere * (+17)
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08:24:55 <esolangs> [[Talk:An Odd Rewriting System]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137611&oldid=109641 * Yayimhere * (+142) /* contradiction in computational class proof? */
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09:11:54 <esolangs> [[Talk:An Odd Rewriting System]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137612&oldid=137611 * Yayimhere * (+92) /* what was the limitation */
09:12:40 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137613&oldid=137609 * Yayimhere * (+77)
09:19:02 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137614&oldid=137613 * Yayimhere * (+51) /* syntax */
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09:20:20 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137615&oldid=137614 * Yayimhere * (+92)
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09:39:25 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[User:Ractangle/rt]] to [[User:Linxium]]
09:39:34 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[User:Linxium]] to [[Linxium]]
09:39:51 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[Linxium]] to [[LX]]
09:41:37 <esolangs> [[LX]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137622&oldid=137620 * Unname4798 * (+6) categories
09:42:01 <esolangs> [[LX]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137623&oldid=137622 * Unname4798 * (-28)
09:43:35 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Unname4798 * moved [[LX]] to [[Rt]]
09:43:52 <esolangs> [[Rt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137626&oldid=137624 * Unname4798 * (+14) lowercase
09:58:26 <esolangs> [[Rt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137627&oldid=137626 * Ractangle * (+173)
09:58:35 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move_redir * Ractangle * moved [[Rt]] to [[LX]] over redirect
09:58:35 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete_redir * Ractangle * Ractangle deleted redirect [[LX]] by overwriting: Deleted to make way for move from "[[Rt]]"
09:59:29 <esolangs> [[LX]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137630&oldid=137628 * Ractangle * (-35) /* Hello, world! */
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10:29:56 <esolangs> [[LX]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137631&oldid=137630 * Ractangle * (+195)
10:54:03 <esolangs> [[Talk:An Odd Rewriting System]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137632&oldid=137612 * Ais523 * (+448) /* what was the limitation */ it's hard to explain simply, which is why I made an esolang to demonstrate it
11:22:25 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137633&oldid=137215 * Ractangle * (+9) /* Esolangs */
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12:43:37 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137634&oldid=137590 * Tommyaweosme * (+179) /* I might ! need an English page for . */
12:44:32 <esolangs> [[User talk:Page crapper from explain xkcd]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137635&oldid=137548 * Tommyaweosme * (+178)
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13:05:21 <esolangs> [[/English version]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137636 * None1 * (+3029) Translate as the author requested
13:06:00 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137637&oldid=137634 * None1 * (+50) /* I might ! need an English page for . */
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15:03:14 <b_jonas> do chemists use methanol for household cleaning, like cleaning the outsides of their mobile phones and rubik's cubes, or do they use it only for cleaning in their laboratory?
15:05:20 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * OllyBritton * New user account
15:07:48 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137640&oldid=137339 * OllyBritton * (+216)
15:25:17 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137641&oldid=137531 * Tommyaweosme * (+258)
15:25:55 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137642&oldid=137641 * Tommyaweosme * (-5498) Replaced content with "hello this is a wip archives at [[/Archives|here]]"
15:26:04 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137643&oldid=137642 * Tommyaweosme * (+0)
15:26:24 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme/archives/july 31 to september 1]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137644 * Tommyaweosme * (+5550) Created page with "{{User:Tommyaweosme/tabs}} You can see block details at [https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=User:Tommyaweosme/blockedlist&action=raw User:Tommyaweosme/blockedlist]. meow if youve got any questions, ask em here.
15:26:54 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme/archives]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137645&oldid=134352 * Tommyaweosme * (-161)
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15:41:31 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137652&oldid=137615 * Yayimhere * (+240)
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15:46:20 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137657&oldid=137654 * Tommyaweosme * (+190)
15:48:03 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798/vector.css]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137658 * Unname4798 * (+62) Created page with "* {background-color:pink !important; color:purple !important;}"
15:48:59 <wWwwW> what do you think of this esolang? and also. what could the possible computational class be?:
15:49:00 <wWwwW> https://esolangs.org/wiki/0x80070050
15:49:20 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798/vector.css]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137659&oldid=137658 * Unname4798 * (+0) Unname4798 changed the content model of the page [[User talk:Unname4798/vector.css]] from "wikitext" to "CSS"
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15:51:27 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137664&oldid=137585 * Ractangle * (+214)
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15:52:21 <ais523> wWwwW: it's TC, it can implement Thue almost directly (the evaluation order is a little different but that doesn't matter); you just need to design the strings so that the replacements can never match in reverse
15:54:25 <ais523> also it isn't IO-complete because it can't output anything that's smaller than the entire internal state, but IO isn't needed for TCness
15:54:59 <wWwwW> since it has no in
15:55:13 <ais523> ah right, isn't output-complete then
15:55:39 <wWwwW> what do you think of the esolang?
15:55:49 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137666&oldid=137375 * Unname4798 * (+55)
15:57:27 <ais523> it's basically a string-rewriting esolang with awkward syntax – I generally prefer less awkward syntax, but there are merits to doing it both ways round
15:57:49 <ais523> I have been thinking more about the esolang I created yesterday, and realised that it has both an easy-to-write syntax and a very minimal, tarpitty syntax
15:57:53 <ais523> and I think I might just make a page for both of htem
15:58:41 <ais523> no, it's an arithmetic-based esolang
15:58:53 <ais523> based on Blindfolded Arithmetic but I changed one of the rules and it makes TCness much harder to prove
15:58:58 <ais523> I haven't written the page for it yet
15:59:39 <ais523> I think many people think the wiki defines esolangs, but it actually mostly just documents them – esolangs can have an existence outside the wiki, and, e.g., there are plenty of golfing and puzzle languages that aren't written up there yet
16:00:02 <ais523> occasionally I write someone else's language up to get a more comprehensive coverage of esolangs in the wiki, but not very often, and there are plenty of esolangs I don't know about
16:00:24 <wWwwW> most of my esolangs only exists
16:00:31 <wWwwW> cuz the website it does
16:00:37 <ais523> I think I'll write an article now, though
16:03:52 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Yayimhere * uploaded "[[File:Logo of sorry this file exists.jpg]]"
16:04:07 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137668&oldid=137652 * Yayimhere * (+68)
16:05:36 <wWwwW> without the redifintion rule of sorry this file exists would it be tc?
16:05:50 <wWwwW> cuz idk if i like it lol:)
16:07:50 <ais523> oh wow, that's tricky (assuming you mean that ⟪x∧y⟫ is only legal once per program) – my guess is no but I'm not sure
16:08:16 <wWwwW> i mean that ⟪x∧y⟫ is legal multiple times
16:08:29 <wWwwW> rules are always updated with a and b
16:08:41 <wWwwW> but idk which one i should choose
16:09:14 <wWwwW> i think ill choose your idea tho
16:09:32 <ais523> it's only a small idea, you can credit me if you want to but don't have to
16:09:47 <wWwwW> i like to give credit tho
16:09:52 <ais523> you sort-of created it yourself by mistake, by saying something I interpreted as that
16:10:19 <wWwwW> i wonder if any esolangs has happend kinda like that?
16:10:50 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137669&oldid=137668 * Yayimhere * (-126)
16:11:01 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137670&oldid=137669 * Yayimhere * (+1)
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16:11:50 <wWwwW> no prob with leave
16:15:15 <esolangs> [[Sorry this file exists]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137671 * Yayimhere * (+24) Redirected page to [[0x80070050]]
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16:22:28 <esolangs> [[Hello world program in esoteric languages (nonalphabetic and A)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137672&oldid=136083 * Yayimhere * (+46) /* 0815 */
16:26:48 <esolangs> [[Imprecision]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137673 * Ais523 * (+4428) new language!
16:27:16 <ais523> wWwwW: ^ there's my new language
16:27:44 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137674&oldid=137594 * Ais523 * (+18) /* I */ + [[Imprecision]]
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16:28:13 <esolangs> [[User:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137675&oldid=135719 * Ais523 * (+17) + [[Imprecision]]
16:28:43 <b_jonas> “I think many people think the wiki defines esolangs, but it actually mostly just documents them” => true, I most often document esolangs that already exist on the wiki
16:30:00 <b_jonas> wWwwW: depending on what you mean, maybe: I created https://esolangs.org/wiki/Amycus by mistake
16:30:42 <wWwwW> that was pre''y much what i meant
16:30:59 <b_jonas> in that case I got a more esoteric and less useful language
16:31:23 <b_jonas> but it's still interesting enough that I kept it
16:35:04 <b_jonas> https://esolangs.org/wiki/Imprecision#Computational_class => hmm, that's an interesting argument, I'll have to think of whether that actually works with just the operations that you have
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16:40:55 <ais523> my current tentative plan is "implement a 2-counter Minsky machine that only simulates multiplications and divisions by 2 and 3 (to get predictable behaviour of the counters), quantize the state variables sharply enough that the error term drops rapidly enough to converge if they aren't being perturbed much by reading the counters, ensure error from the counters themselves is no greater than 1 over the square of their value so that converge stoo"
16:41:05 <ais523> but I don't know whether or not that actually works
16:41:35 <wWwwW> that was very confusing. maybe im read to fast
16:41:36 <ais523> and you would need to "reset" the error in the counters as they got near 0, but it's possible to create a quantizer that only works near 0 but doesn't disturb the value of large values very much
16:42:09 <wWwwW> also where does the name come from?
16:42:15 <b_jonas> ais523: so you'd store information like your state and stack as integers, kept in the round to nearest integers parts of your variables. then in each round, you'd compute a number C that is easily an upper bound on the magnitudes of all numbers involved. then you'd write something like y = 1/(x*x*C+1), and now if x is zero then y=1, but if x is nonzero then y is close enough to zero that you can use it
16:42:21 <b_jonas> in control flow by multiplying y with some almost integer and adding it to another almost integer. and you make sure that C is so large that even if you do such conditionals a few times per round (you know how long your program is) the round to nearest values are always the correct exact values that you want to simulate.
16:43:06 <ais523> wWwwW: frrom my thoughts about computational class – it's very unusual to have a language that looks inherently capable of storing exact numbers, but chooses to use approximations instead
16:43:10 <b_jonas> and this could simulate a computation on integers that is similar to something you do in Blindfolded arithmetic
16:43:43 <ais523> b_jonas: right, that's the general principle
16:44:15 <b_jonas> there's the slight problem that this only lets you equal-compare integers, not less-than compare them, but fortunately our constructions to compile to blindfolded arithmetic are such that we can get away with just equal comparisons
16:44:37 <ais523> Minsky machines only use equal-compares anyway
16:44:38 <b_jonas> oh, we will also have to be able to compute integer remainders for the blindfolded arithmetic thing
16:44:51 <b_jonas> integer reminders with some fixed divisors at least
16:45:04 <b_jonas> but I think you can avoid that if you do a somewhat more complicated construction
16:45:12 <ais523> I wasn't going to go via BA, just implement Minsky machines directly
16:45:16 <b_jonas> one that reads the top digit instead of the bottom digit
16:45:23 <wWwwW> that jumps when the register is NON zero
16:45:30 <wWwwW> be turing complete
16:45:31 <b_jonas> ais523: yeah, that would be enough for TC but I don't like it if we can avoid it
16:45:42 <wWwwW> still decrementing
16:45:51 <ais523> wWwwW: it's still Turing-complete, you just have to reorganise the program
16:46:06 <ais523> the original version of Minsky machines was "jumps somewhere if zero, jumps somewhere else if nonzero"
16:46:22 <wWwwW> i didnt know that!
16:46:39 <ais523> and if only one of the cases jumps, you can make yourself an unconditional jump afterwards (either using an unconditional jump instruction, or a conditional jump where you already know the input) in order to make the other case jump too
16:46:55 <b_jonas> ok, this needs more taught. Imprecision turned out to be a more interesting language than I assumed yesterday when you mentioned it
16:47:03 <wWwwW> also isnt this program:
16:47:34 <ais523> sort of – it gets complicated when you have multiple gotos or comefroms aiming at the same line
16:47:51 <ais523> or if the argument to goto/comefrom is a variable or expression rather than a constant
16:47:58 <ais523> but in the simple case it's equivalent
16:48:15 <wWwwW> then why is comefrom worse than goto????
16:48:48 <ais523> because to most programmers, not knowing where the code could be jumped to is less confusing than not knowing where the code could be jumped from
16:48:55 <int-e> because it goes against the flow of the program which we usually follow when reading code
16:49:15 <ais523> goto is also confusing if the goto destinations aren't labelled (e.g. if every line is numbered, like in BASIC)
16:49:33 <ais523> although, in practice, most programmers tend to label both ends of the jump and so it doesn't matter
16:49:35 <int-e> backwards sentence a writing like is it
16:49:44 <wWwwW> wouldnt it be funny if j in malbogle was a comefrom
16:50:09 <ais523> so malbolge uses computed jumps, and the program memory is mixed in with the data memory
16:50:44 <ais523> meaning that if the data you were storing randomly happened to be a comefrom instruction you would end up having to comefrom multiple places as soon as the computation produced the correct value
16:50:59 <ais523> *comefrom the current location to multiple places
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16:51:07 <wWwwW> that would be very annoying
16:51:23 <wWwwW> i will add that to my malbolge derevative
16:51:30 <ais523> the sad thing is that I'm not even sure that this isn't TC (if you use one of the Malbolge generalisations to infinite memory)
16:52:19 <b_jonas> afaiu in some APL-likes, including very early versions of J, the main control flow mechanism to jump between entire statements was a goto (represented by a right arrow) that takes a line number, and jumps there if it's a line number or continues to the next line if it's... an empty array? or zero? there were no structured if/while statements yet. so now I'm imagining the same but with computed come
16:52:25 <b_jonas> froms that are conditional in the same way, they don't come from anywhere if the label is empty or invalid or zero
16:52:41 <ais523> b_jonas: doesn't INTERCAL work like that?
16:52:44 <b_jonas> note that in APL this used actual line counts, not labels, so you'd have to edit the numbers if you renumbered lines
16:52:54 <ais523> 0 isn't a valid line number there, and making COME FROM expressions evaluate to 0 when you don't want to jump is convenient
16:53:25 <ais523> also I thought that "actual line count" was an esolang invention the first time I saw it, and was very impressed at the idea (I have subsequently discovered that I was wrong in ths)
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16:53:42 <ais523> this may be a side effect of BASIC being my first programming language – I think I was about 6 at the time
16:53:56 <b_jonas> ais523: yes, INTERCAL works like that, but wWwwW just reminded me that other languages can have come from as well. which I had considered earlier for languages like C, python, ruby (only non-computed in C) but not yet for APL
16:54:02 <ais523> so I assumed that written line numbers and RENUMBER were just normal in languages that used line numbers
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16:54:24 <ais523> b_jonas: your Python control flow nonsense reminds me of C setjmp, it's pretty similar
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16:54:44 <int-e> hmm what happened to aspect-oriented programming :)
16:54:57 <int-e> (that has some "come from" flavor to it)
16:55:21 <b_jonas> ais523: I think they were normal in APL too, but the line numbers were used in the *editor* that you can use on a printer tty without a CRT, so the line number of a line are stable even if you insert or delete lines until you renumber by saving then reloading the currently edited list of lines
16:55:21 <esolangs> [[Huit]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137676&oldid=136641 * TheCanon2 * (+105)
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16:56:29 <int-e> I swear I said that before reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspect-oriented_programming#Criticism
16:56:41 <b_jonas> ais523: setjmp differs in that you have to actually run a statement to get a label value there, you can't jump to somewhere that the control flow hasn't visited yet. you can get around this by writing your function as a big switch statement using a state variable, but that's annoying. here I can just put labels anywhere and you can jump to them as soon as you have the stack frame.
16:56:50 <ais523> int-e: I was just about to link you to that
16:57:11 <ais523> b_jonas: C-INTERCAL uses the "big switch" approach to compile COME FROM
16:57:30 <ais523> at least in some of the complex cases; I can't remember whether it optimizes the simple case into a goto
16:57:45 <b_jonas> ais523: note that https://esolangs.org/wiki/W_(Viktor_T._Toth) combines these: it uses the setjmp-like thing where you save the instruction pointer at runtime for backwards jumps, and structured if statements for forwards jumps. (except it also has function calls and even computed function calls)
16:57:53 <ais523> I guess I see "entering a scope" as comparable to "running a command"
16:57:58 <b_jonas> and W does allow you to goto a computed value
16:58:00 <esolangs> [[Huit interpreter]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137677 * TheCanon2 * (+2978) Created the article
16:58:55 <int-e> I did like the Threaded INTERCAL take on coming from the same location multiple times.
16:59:08 <ais523> it is the obvious solution, I think
16:59:20 <ais523> (I didn't invent Threaded INTERCAL, but was the second person to write an interpreter for it)
16:59:26 <ais523> err, compiler, not interpreter
16:59:31 <int-e> Well, yes, but sometimes the obvious thing is also nice. :)
16:59:36 <ais523> although the compilation is somewhat close to the "bundle an interpreter" method of compiling
17:00:50 <int-e> Plus there's the fact that INTERCAL is one of the earliest esolangs. So even obvious things had a good chance of being novel.
17:01:24 <wWwwW> isnt it THE first one?
17:01:25 <ais523> I can't remember when COME FROM was added to INTERCAL
17:01:38 <ais523> both INTERCAL and COME FROM are old, but the idea of combining them is more recent
17:01:44 <wWwwW> it was in the C dialect
17:01:57 <ais523> wWwwW: https://esolangs.org/wiki/Prehistory_of_esoteric_programming_languages
17:02:26 <ais523> it was C-INTERCAL I think, but not sure what date
17:02:37 <wWwwW> ais523 they werent made to be esolangs
17:02:59 <ais523> the article I linked mentions that it's hard to define whether a language is an esolang, if it was invented before there was a concept of what a normal programming language looks like
17:03:37 <ais523> BF was almost invented in 1964, though (P′′ is a slightly minimized version of it)
17:03:41 <int-e> Game of Life is a proper esolang.
17:04:34 <int-e> Huh I didn't realize how close the inceptions of GoL and INTERCAL are. But GoL wins.
17:05:20 <int-e> I'm not sure when they proved it TC though?
17:05:39 <ais523> int-e: it took a while I think
17:05:59 <ais523> yes, INTERCAL is obviously TC to someone who understands the subject, and IIRC one of the authors said as much
17:06:02 <wWwwW> and i cant find it online
17:06:05 <int-e> Conway's Game of Life
17:06:13 <ais523> that it naturally ended up TC and they didn't need to do anything to make it TC
17:06:55 <ais523> I have put some thought into game-of-life golf – finding a set of primitives that let you write powerful programs in relatively small area
17:07:20 <int-e> INTERCAL TC... oh right it has stacks.
17:07:27 <ais523> I had an idea of using beams of spaceships and gliders that made gaps in each other, that can be quite compact and might be workable into something TC
17:07:28 <int-e> (The arrays only provide finite memory)
17:07:40 <ais523> int-e: it's actually TC even without variables at all, but I did that one intentionally
17:07:49 <wWwwW> GoL assembly lang??? perhaps?????
17:07:56 <ais523> that was the first time I almost discovered The Waterfall Model, oddly enough
17:08:32 <ais523> some of the best esolang ideas come up time and time again in lots of different contexts, but if you've never seen the pattern before it can be hard to notice
17:09:25 <wWwwW> does the exist any computational models, that are well...
17:10:25 <ais523> computational models are useful if you're studying computation
17:10:42 <wWwwW> to create programs
17:10:59 <ais523> and any nontrivial/optimising compiler will need some computational model for representing the programs it's compiling
17:11:07 <ais523> although normally it's more complicated than the ones you'll find on the wiki
17:11:29 <ais523> most of them aren't intended for writing in directly, but rather for compiling into
17:11:31 <int-e> wWwwW: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random-access_machine is probably more boring than you want
17:11:48 <ais523> I agree that it's both useful and boring
17:13:10 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137678&oldid=137670 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+24) Category
17:13:12 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Unimplemented]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137679&oldid=34020 * Yayimhere * (+36)
17:13:22 <int-e> (it turns out that people don't enjoy implementing random access memory on Turing machines)
17:14:32 <ais523> hmm, should I tell PSDW to stop adding "Category:Languages" without adding the other categories at the same time?
17:14:51 <ais523> it just makes it harder to find uncategorized pages because they don't show up on the list of uncategorized pages any more
17:15:21 <wWwwW> maybe uncategorized could include ones with only lang?
17:15:49 <ais523> that would be a good idea, but unfortunately the definition of "uncategorized" isn't very easy to change
17:16:40 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137680&oldid=137604 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+88) Lowercase, categories
17:17:11 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137681&oldid=137678 * Yayimhere * (+155)
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17:19:30 <b_jonas> I was watching https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSxW2jHS87g recently, in which Marc tells how the US helped the rocket engineer Von Braun move to the US around 1945, but the President didn't trust him for a while, so he wasn't allowed to participate in actual spaceflight research until the 1960s. So that and Böhm's prediscovery of brainfuck reminded me of a joke that I read somewhere and I'll retell in
17:19:40 <esolangs> [[LX]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137682&oldid=137631 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+62) Categories
17:22:17 <b_jonas> The joke plays in the 1950s, when the US tries to make rockets for spaceflight, but the rockets keep failing and the whole things costs a lot of money. The scientists recommend hiring Von Braun, but the President does not approve that. So instead they hire a spirit medium to summon the spirit of Ciolkovski. Ciolkovski takes one look at the rocket designs presented to him, then says "why do you need a
17:22:24 <b_jonas> hundred scientists working on this, when I have already published a good design for the entire space rocket in my 1929 article?" A few years later, they summon the spiriti of Ciolkovski again. "Professor Ciolkovski, we built the rocket following your instructions in the 1929 article, but it exploded at launch." "Ah yes, that is the explosion problem that I solve in my 1931 article."
17:22:51 <b_jonas> I usually think of Gauss like this but for mathematics problems.
17:23:17 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137683&oldid=137666 * Tommyaweosme * (+159)
17:23:19 <esolangs> [[Undelta]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137684&oldid=137664 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+67) Categories
17:25:20 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137685&oldid=137681 * Yayimhere * (-19)
17:25:21 <esolangs> [[Wow owo]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137686&oldid=137573 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+94) Categories
17:26:20 <b_jonas> Marc explains in the video that the rocket exploded because of a short between two diodes, since back then they didn't have the material technology for all the cheap plastic insulators that we use today. So after that, everything that the NASA built that went into the rocket was either properly capped with an insulator, or the whole circuit board and components on it were embedded in epoxy so that
17:26:26 <b_jonas> components can't move. I don't know if that's the same explosion problem that Ciolkovski had solved in the joke though.
17:26:56 <esolangs> [[Wow owo]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137687&oldid=137686 * Yayimhere * (+2) /* examples */
17:27:21 <b_jonas> don't take "epoxy" in the strict sense above, I don't know what insulating filler material they used\
17:29:54 <esolangs> [[Kcidea]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137688&oldid=137535 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+87) Stub, categories
17:30:43 <wWwwW> PDW is rlly active rn
17:32:09 <b_jonas> only Ciolkovski is better because he actually wrote the articles, while Gauss just solved the problems and wrote down very little
17:32:40 <ais523> I discovered recently that Gauss invented the Fast Fourier Transform algorithm, but nobody noticed until after it had already been rediscovered by modern mathematicians
17:33:05 <wWwwW> i cant get dis stupid idea of my head
17:33:39 <wWwwW> a consistency checking esolang
17:34:09 <esolangs> [[Blast protection]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137689&oldid=136978 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+59) Categories
17:34:21 <esolangs> [[Imprecision]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137690&oldid=137673 * Ais523 * (+0) /* Specification */ move a sentence to a more sensible place
17:35:37 <esolangs> [[Analogia]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137691&oldid=137440 * Ais523 * (+35) see also
17:35:57 <esolangs> [[NOP (esolang)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137692&oldid=115850 * Ractangle * (+62) /* More elaborate Python interpreter, but unfortunately it is incompatible with other languages */
17:36:01 <esolangs> [[Blindfolded Arithmetic]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137693&oldid=134825 * Ais523 * (+18) /* See also */ +[[Imprecision]]
17:37:59 <wWwwW> everbody gettin active
17:38:10 <wWwwW> but is my esolang idea a good one
17:38:23 <ais523> I'm not entirely sure what you mean by consistency checking
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17:38:52 <wWwwW> like you know how some systems are inconsistent?
17:39:06 <wWwwW> could you makea. esolang with some operations and data types n' stuff
17:39:14 <wWwwW> to make it easy to check?
17:39:36 <ais523> it will depend on the exact meaning of "inconsistent" that you're using
17:39:41 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137694&oldid=137685 * Yayimhere * (+55)
17:39:43 <ais523> it is hard to objectively define
17:40:01 <wWwwW> like. isnt it without paradoxes?
17:40:46 <wWwwW> just the way in dis yt vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeQX2HjkcNo
17:40:52 <int-e> sure you can take the concept from formal logic
17:41:06 <int-e> but how do you make a language around this that is interesting?
17:41:32 <ais523> so the problem here is that for a language X to be able to prove a language Y consistent, X must be *more* powerful than Y, not just equally powerful
17:41:36 <wWwwW> i want something where you apply operqators to a language(idk how you would store that)
17:41:48 <ais523> unless X is inconsistent, in which case it can typically prove a lot of false statements so the proofs aren't interesting
17:41:53 <int-e> the "fundamental flaw" framing still upsets me beyond reason
17:42:11 <int-e> And I've never watched the video because of that.
17:42:11 <wWwwW> ais523 ik. thats why maybe it would only be for FSA's
17:42:20 <ais523> so your esolang will need to be more powerful than the languages it's operating on, and it's hard to do that while remaining computable (but this isn't really interesting if the language can't be implemented)
17:42:49 <int-e> (Plus being well too familiar with Gödel's theorems and related ones by Rosser and Tarski and Kleene and I forgot who else already)
17:42:52 <wWwwW> like all turing complete esolangs cant be implemented(but still yea)
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17:43:52 <wWwwW> like not constructing theorems as a esolang
17:43:59 <wWwwW> but like apply dis and dis operaotr
17:44:03 <wWwwW> until you get a bool
17:44:42 <int-e> if you simpify too much you probably end up in the vicinity of SAT and SMT solvers.
17:45:05 <ais523> an esoteric SAT solver would be fun, although arguably the existing SAT solvers are esoteric already
17:45:10 <wWwwW> what is a SAT and SMT solver??????
17:45:22 <ais523> actually, violin already exists, sort of
17:45:37 <int-e> SAT is "(boolean) satisfiability"
17:45:46 <ais523> it's in a repository and might even build if you somehow manage to figure out the right sequence of commands
17:45:50 <wWwwW> how would you do that
17:45:54 <wWwwW> convert a lang to a bool
17:45:57 <wWwwW> and do it correctly
17:46:14 <int-e> SMT is "satisfiability modulo theories"; I /could/ explain more I suppose but Wikipedia probably does a better job without any effort on my part :P
17:46:34 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137695 * Ractangle * (+316) Created page with "'''Nope. with no quine''' is an esolang created by [[User:Ractangle]] based on those "None. without a quine" esolangs. it's basicly [[Nope.]] with no quine. So that basicly means: if you put "None." to the input. The interpriter will print: and if you pu
17:46:36 <wWwwW> also all inconstent things are not TC right?
17:46:50 <ais523> (violin is specialised for INTERCAL reverse assignments, like .1 $ .2 <- #12345, and works out what values to assign to the variables to make them work even if the same variable is used twice)
17:47:04 <int-e> inconsistent theories have no models, so are they "things" at all :P
17:47:17 <wWwwW> does what im saying even make sense?
17:47:34 <ais523> well, arguably an inconsistent theory resolves everything that's implied by a contradiction to bottom, so it's the equivalent of a language where none of those programs halt
17:47:45 <int-e> wWwwW: I think it's an "idea" but it's pretty vague.
17:47:53 <ais523> I am not sure if it's possible to still be TC despite that, if it doesn't have the law of excluded middle or the like
17:48:07 <ais523> so that some things can be meaningfully true or false despite the inconsistency
17:48:45 <ais523> right, but you can define a way to observe the equivalent of a halt
17:48:55 <ais523> e.g. in a CA you can define a halt as being an exact repeat of a previous state
17:49:01 <wWwwW> but cant you do that for something that doesnt halt?????
17:49:03 <int-e> I've never made an esolang because fleshing out ideas is hard. It's easier *within* a framework so I've analyzed a few of the existing ones.
17:49:27 <wWwwW> i will start working on dis
17:49:37 <ais523> wWwwW: yes – the exact definition of halting becomes somewhat subjective when dealing with weak versions of Turing-completeness in which you're allowed to change the halt condition
17:50:14 <wWwwW> either some inconsitent systems are TC or GoL is not TC ig????
17:50:38 <ais523> weak Turing-completeness isn't very easy to define precisely and the definition is still debated
17:50:49 <int-e> GoL is TC but in what sense would it be consistent or inconsistent?
17:50:51 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137696&oldid=137695 * Ractangle * (+133)
17:51:03 <int-e> It's not a logical system in any obvious way.
17:51:17 <wWwwW> wow this went of the rails o_o
17:51:28 <ais523> int-e: conceptually, isn't that because it's untyped?
17:51:39 <ais523> you can send a spaceship at an interface that's expecting a glider and *something* happens
17:51:45 <ais523> just not necessarily what you intended
17:51:57 <wWwwW> wow dis is confusing
17:52:03 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137697&oldid=137633 * Ractangle * (+26) /* Esolangs */
17:52:04 <wWwwW> wtf even does logic MEAN??????
17:52:08 <ais523> meanwhile, untyped lambda calculus is TC, but is inconsistent if you try to interpret it as a proof system
17:52:24 <wWwwW> It doesnt mean algebra since how tf is GoL algebra????
17:52:24 <int-e> ais523: sure there's an emergent level of abstraction where you have a type system of sorts
17:52:29 <int-e> I'd call it non-obvious
17:53:18 <ais523> oh wow, I just realised something that might be completely wrong, or even meaningless – but in the Curry-Howard correspondence, aren't consistent systems necessarily total, and the ones that can write infinite loops the ones that can prove false?
17:53:31 <wWwwW> i just found out somethin(i think)
17:53:42 <ais523> so in a sense, it's *only* the inconsistent systems that are TC, none of the consistent ones
17:53:44 <wWwwW> i made dis stubid esolang : https://esolangs.org/wiki/Not
17:53:53 <wWwwW> heres the thing i found out:
17:54:09 <wWwwW> either not is more powerfull than a PDA
17:54:20 <wWwwW> or a PDA can make the program on the black page
17:54:22 <int-e> ais523: Sounds mostly correct to me. There's the codata trick though.
17:54:41 <ais523> wWwwW: not is indeed more powerful than a PDA in some respects, but less powerful in other respects
17:54:56 <int-e> codata Result a = Result a | Step (Result a)
17:55:02 <wWwwW> in a *full respect*
17:55:03 <ais523> imagine what happens to the stack after you do 1#1[1+==#N] (this is your example program with an extra =)
17:55:17 <ais523> the resulting state of the stack is something that a PDA can't even express, it is two-dimensional
17:55:36 <int-e> with a type like that you can split your computation into a sequence of steps that each terminate
17:55:39 <ais523> but, the language can't do some things that PDAs can do easily, like read memory in a way that affects control flow
17:56:09 <ais523> int-e: one of my first esolangs was like that, [[e:Wiki Cyclic Tag]]
17:56:17 <ais523> err, https://esolangs.org/wiki/Wiki_Cyclic_Tag
17:56:27 <int-e> I guess this corresponds to Kleene's normal form (one outer fixed point/minimization/while loop)
17:56:42 <ais523> MediaWIki doesn't support infinite loops, so you have to manually rerun the next loop of the program
17:57:10 <wWwwW> people consider html and css TC
17:57:15 <wWwwW> but it need user input forever
17:57:19 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137698&oldid=137696 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+87) Categories
17:57:23 <ais523> wWwwW: languages don't have to be in the main computational classes – it's normally very simple languages that aren't, because they don't have enough power for their operations to substitute for each other, so adding new operations gives new powers
17:58:07 <wWwwW> i wonder what a not comp calss would look like lol :]
17:58:13 <ais523> think about HQ9+, it has effectively no computational power at all – but if it did, then the HQ9+ commands would be redundant
17:58:25 <esolangs> [[Nope. without a quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137699&oldid=136324 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+46) Distinguish confusion
17:58:33 <ais523> but because it isn't, each command is contributing to the language in it s own very limited way, so it is in a computational class of HQ9+-alikes
17:58:38 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137700&oldid=137698 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+48) Distinguish confusion
17:58:56 <ais523> and it is hard to create another language in this class without creating essentially the same language but with different syntax
17:59:08 <esolangs> [[Not]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137701&oldid=135881 * Yayimhere * (+20)
18:00:13 <wWwwW> aaaaa my brain is breakin
18:00:29 <wWwwW> also i wonder if Not has any paradoxe:)
18:00:58 <esolangs> [[Template:S]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137702 * Ractangle * (+17) Created page with "<del>{{{1}}}<del>"
18:01:45 <esolangs> [[Template:S]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137703&oldid=137702 * Ractangle * (+1)
18:02:12 <wWwwW> but its for sure in a *full* perspective not is less powerfull than a PDA
18:02:41 <ais523> computational power isn't a straight line
18:02:52 <ais523> we say language X is more powerful than language Y if X can do everything Y can do, and more
18:03:04 <ais523> but sometimes, there are two languages, and each can do things that the other can't
18:03:21 <wWwwW> what if the only thing x can do thaty y cant is a no-op
18:03:27 <wWwwW> something non important
18:03:32 <wWwwW> also ive found a way to cheat
18:03:36 <ais523> that's still a power difference, and possibly an interesting one
18:03:54 <wWwwW> you can just count the number of 1's in a not string as a symbol in a PDA
18:03:54 <ais523> writing a language that can't do a nop is hard unless you're doing something like enforcing output
18:04:08 <ais523> yes, except a PDA can't have infinitely many symbols
18:04:20 <ais523> that specifically is the thing that gives Not the extra power
18:04:58 <ais523> because PDAs are normally defined in terms of a lookup table: "when there's an X on top of the stack, and a Y on the input, and you're in state Z, do «thing»"
18:05:11 <ais523> but if you had infinitely many symbols you'd need an infinitely big program
18:05:28 <wWwwW> aaaa dis is kinda hard
18:05:32 <esolangs> [[Old Branjunk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137704&oldid=135725 * Ractangle * (+244)
18:05:42 <esolangs> [[Old Branjunk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137705&oldid=137704 * Ractangle * (-8)
18:06:04 <wWwwW> aaaaaa im annoying myself
18:06:15 <wWwwW> i didnt know not could confuse me so much'
18:06:15 <ais523> or, well, here's an example: if Not had input, you could write a program that input a string, then printed it twice
18:06:16 <esolangs> [[Branjunk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137706&oldid=137217 * Ractangle * (+28) /* See also */
18:06:18 <ais523> you can't do that with a PDA
18:06:21 <int-e> wWwwW: take a break. get some fresh air. :)
18:06:55 <esolangs> [[Old Branjunk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137707&oldid=137705 * Ractangle * (+30)
18:07:09 <wWwwW> is dis allowed in a pda?:
18:07:09 <wWwwW> for all symbol and state Y do «thing»
18:07:21 <wWwwW> since Not has no conditional
18:07:51 <ais523> it's sort-of allowed, but the «thing» wouldn't be able to follow an infinite pattern
18:07:58 <ais523> otherwise you get more power than a PDA is normally allowed to have
18:08:01 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137708&oldid=137697 * Ractangle * (+55) /* Esolangs */
18:08:15 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137709&oldid=137708 * Ractangle * (+13) /* Esolangs */
18:08:31 <wWwwW> so no infinite loops???
18:08:44 <ais523> you can have an infinite loop, you just need to stay in a known state
18:09:02 <ais523> "when there's a 1 on top of the stack and you're in state 1, stay in state 1 and leave the 1 on top of the stack", that sort of thing
18:09:03 <wWwwW> then Not is representable in a PDA
18:09:08 <wWwwW> unless im wrong in some way
18:09:13 <ais523> no, a PDA cannot do the concatenation
18:09:23 <wWwwW> but if you have infit e symbols
18:09:28 <wWwwW> to represnt the ones
18:09:33 <ais523> then the concatenation would be an infinite pattern
18:10:07 <ais523> computational classes are defined more by what they can't do, than by what they can
18:10:27 <wWwwW> lol i think i find this to funny
18:10:38 <ais523> this is why the https://esolangs.org/wiki/Looping_counter test is useful, if a language can do that it proves that it isn't just a PDA or LBA
18:11:12 <ais523> it might have a unique or unusual computational class, especially if it's simple or defined based on a list of examples, but if that seems unlikely it raises the chance it's TC
18:11:17 <ais523> LBA = "linear-bounded automaton"
18:11:22 <int-e> Little Big Adventure, scnr
18:11:31 <ais523> https://esolangs.org/wiki/Linear_bounded_automaton
18:11:43 <esolangs> [[Old Branjunk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137710&oldid=137707 * Ractangle * (+98)
18:11:44 <int-e> What else... Linear Block Adressing
18:11:51 <ais523> my favourite example is https://esolangs.org/wiki/BuzzFizz which was intentionally designed as one
18:12:00 <wWwwW> so its somewhere between a LBA and a TM
18:12:08 <wWwwW> ais523 i like the name
18:12:14 <ais523> and it can do most of the popular problems, but not looping counters because an LBA can't do that one
18:12:33 <wWwwW> how much the esolang comunity has proove
18:12:46 <wWwwW> like if you want to choose something just get some esolang guys interested in it
18:13:03 <wWwwW> *proove or disproove something
18:13:10 <ais523> it's been a lot of people over a lot of years, and some of us have a lot of practice
18:13:16 <esolangs> [[Imprecision]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137711&oldid=137690 * Hakerh400 * (+168) Add interpreter
18:13:22 <ais523> int-e: fungot isn't here
18:13:56 <wWwwW> wait wtf û looks like a pencil
18:14:25 <wWwwW> the name is like a metaphor
18:14:29 <ais523> oh good, I was procrastinating on writing an Imprecision interpreter and someone wrote one already
18:14:41 <wWwwW> or however you speel it
18:15:01 <wWwwW> "im *not* going to be normal" or something like dat
18:16:40 <wWwwW> how the hell is not destroying me
18:18:00 <wWwwW> im just going to keep on going
18:18:45 <ais523> bbchallenge has spent a while trying to do something that has been proven impossible to continue indefinitely, to see how far they get
18:19:24 <esolangs> [[Looping counter]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137712&oldid=136507 * Int-e * (+74) add Unlambda
18:19:51 <ais523> wWwwW: they are working through all Turing machines in the order of simplest to most complicated, trying to work out which ones halt and which ones don't
18:19:51 <int-e> busy beaver challenge I suppose
18:20:19 <ais523> it is known that at some point, we will reach a Turing machine that doesn't halt, but this is impossible to prove
18:20:50 <ais523> (it is also possible that we will reach a Turing machine that does halt, but we can't prove it and can't simulate it for long enough to observe it halting)
18:21:00 <int-e> can we blame this on Chaitin ;-)
18:21:17 <ais523> "we" here is general, I hardly did anything
18:21:27 <int-e> it's a facet of the halting problem being undecidable
18:21:40 <esolangs> [[Looping counter]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137713&oldid=137712 * Yayimhere * (+26) added not cuz its possible
18:22:12 <int-e> If you could, for each Turing machine, whether it halts or not, then you could decide the halting problem simply by enumerating all possible proofs until one of them does the trick for the TM in question.
18:22:13 <ais523> int-e: oh wow, looping counter without s or k
18:22:31 <int-e> ais523: the ``ci`ci infinite loop is weird
18:22:44 <int-e> it's basically that with output
18:23:05 <ais523> now I am tempted to make a generalization of https://esolangs.org/wiki/Subtle_cough by adding the identity function to it
18:23:37 <int-e> (it's not original code... some example like this was in Madoore's original distribution)
18:23:44 <ais523> my current guess is "still sub-TC" but it's hard to tell
18:24:11 <int-e> (but it should be too simple for copyright issues, plus I reconstructed it on the spot :P)
18:24:15 <wWwwW> if you do that ais523 then plz name it general cough plz
18:24:36 <ais523> I guess the hard-mode version would be c+d+i
18:25:08 <ais523> d is sort-of like an identity function
18:25:14 <wWwwW> you said it took years for you to make eoslangs
18:25:25 <wWwwW> (not to say you lie or anythin')
18:25:33 <wWwwW> (and not to annoy you)
18:28:01 <wWwwW> you made on yester day
18:28:06 <wWwwW> and now your making another
18:28:12 <wWwwW> im confused i tihnk
18:28:17 <ais523> I don't really count that as making an esolang
18:28:21 <ais523> I guess I did, in a way
18:28:21 <int-e> wWwwW: nobody said that *all* languages take that long to make
18:28:29 <int-e> also this one is a variation on an existing one
18:28:43 <ais523> right, removing commands from an esolang is easy, it's probably even easier than adding them
18:29:00 <ais523> having some reason to think that removing commands from an esolang might be *interesting* takes insight, but in this case it wasn't my insight
18:29:21 <int-e> and besides it's not done
18:29:30 <ais523> like, I didn't originally notice that ~ in Underload could be implemented in terms of the other commands, someone else noticed that
18:29:38 <int-e> because I imagine ais523 wouldn't write anything about it unless it's somehow actually interesting
18:29:46 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137714&oldid=137709 * Ractangle * (+2)
18:29:48 <wWwwW> i have a *controverisal* thing somebody said:
18:29:49 <wWwwW> a good esolang take three things: boredom, ot much freedom, an ADHD
18:29:49 <int-e> and both c and d are... awkward.
18:30:06 <ais523> int-e: right, although I guess not knowing whether it's interesting or not is interesting in its own way?
18:30:21 <ais523> that normally takes a few days of thought to determine that it isn't uninteresting in a non-obvious way, though
18:30:46 <ais523> and oerjan isn't a regular here nowadays – oerjan was good at that sort of thing, probably better than me
18:31:31 <int-e> it is promising in that c and d kind of offset each other; c makes termination harder; d makes termination easier
18:32:01 <b_jonas> %s/Ciolkovski/Ciolkovskij/g
18:32:07 <ais523> fwiw I was considering a call-with-previous-continuation operation in an esolang I was working on recently
18:32:15 <int-e> my brain just wants to shut off though so I won't think about it
18:32:23 <ais523> the difference is that call/cc, if you call the continuation, the argument effectively replaces the entire call/cc call
18:32:56 <ais523> with call/pc, if you call the continuation, it effectively replaces the *argument* to the call/pc call, so it gets given the same continuation again and continues from there
18:33:28 <wWwwW> this day has made me hate not
18:33:30 <ais523> I think this is equivalent in logics that don't have linear-logic-like restrictions on duplicating and discarding values
18:33:38 <wWwwW> i will add that to my user page
18:33:41 <ais523> but it's easier to use for some things
18:34:11 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137715&oldid=137610 * Yayimhere * (+22)
18:35:55 <int-e> b_jonas: ITYM Циолковский
18:36:04 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137716&oldid=137345 * Ractangle * (+221) /* test topic */ new section
18:36:06 <b_jonas> fizzie: channel logs webserver seems inaccessible
18:36:37 <int-e> (except for the front page)
18:36:43 <ais523> b_jonas: try an invalid URL, it 404s right away
18:36:57 <ais523> server's accessible but is having trouble serving for some reason
18:37:18 <fizzie> I'm guessing it's the "stalker mode sometimes makes it get stuck" thing, which I hoped would've been fixed when I updated CivetWeb.
18:37:19 <int-e> wWwwW: I've forgotten essentially all the russian I've learned but I can still use the cyrillic script :P
18:37:23 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137717&oldid=137716 * Ractangle * (+0) /* test topic */
18:37:36 <fizzie> The front page, and 404s, are served by nginx; only the logs are served by the special log-server binary.
18:38:19 <fizzie> Restarted it, and it works again, but will probably break at some point in the future for the same reason.
18:38:33 <fizzie> One of these days I'll debug it. But not today.
18:38:35 <wWwwW> chat must look so confusing
18:38:52 <int-e> fizzie: sure, just narrowed it down because /sometimes/ something usually stable like DNS breaks
18:40:55 <b_jonas> wWwwW: to be clear, COME FROM was originally proposed as a joke replacement instead of GO TO, so it is by design that that they are equivalent. The joke was that there's an influential paper by Dijkstra where he explains why languages like FORTRAN should have a structured IF and WHILE statement, and you should write program using those rather than with conditional GO TO statements. So the COME FROM
18:41:01 <b_jonas> proposal starts from the base idea that GO TO is harmful, but then proposes an even worse solution.
18:43:28 <ais523> b_jonas: they aren't equivalent in interpreted languages, goto is much more efficient to implement
18:43:28 <int-e> wWwwW: IRC can get convoluted. It used to be worse :)
18:44:05 <ais523> e.g. you can't come from in a scripting interpreter that starts executing commands before it's fully parsed the program
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18:47:58 <b_jonas> yeah, Random-access machine is the computational model that is rather similar to the 70s and 80s computers which had a CPU and RAM running on the same clock, with no cache other than sometimes a 1-byte data prefetch, so every RAM access has the same cost. Only the model abstracts away the part that the available RAM and address space is necessarily finite. I think it could have been discovered earlier,
18:48:04 <b_jonas> but back then computers stored data on disks/drums or tape or mercury delay loop rather than core memory or SRAM or DRAM, so the abstraction was deeper, pretending that it always took the same amount of time to access any cell, even though that usually wasn't true for disks.
18:48:27 <zzo38> The variant of call/cc that I had consider is law of excluded middle continuations
18:49:02 <wWwwW> b_jonas: interesting
18:49:26 <b_jonas> Although now that I think of it, https://www.righto.com/2024/08/minuteman-guidance-computer.html describes a computer that stores its work memory on a disk, but its CPU clock cycles are synchronized with the disk's rotation, and it has a separate head for each track, so it does actually access its memory in constant time!
18:50:25 <b_jonas> that's the D-37 family of computers.
18:51:14 <b_jonas> oh hey, the logs web server fixed itself, thank you
18:51:29 <int-e> b_jonas: fizzie poked it
18:52:34 <wWwwW> int-e: i just got reminded of the c'mon do something meme but something happend
18:53:15 <int-e> wWwwW: honestly I'm not sure how many memes there are that both of us know
18:53:28 <int-e> (I'm not sure what you're referring to)
18:54:07 <int-e> links are fine (within reason)
18:54:27 <wWwwW> https://imgflip.com/i/923fer
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18:56:10 <b_jonas> int-e: yes, but the library catalogs store russian names in ISO-9 scientific transcription, presumably so that they could type them on a typewriter with fewer type elements, and then this got kept when the catalog got digitized, so if I type Ciolkovskij in the digital catalog https://nektar2.oszk.hu/LVbin/LibriVision/lv_search_form.html then it works (though gives some false positives for other people
18:56:16 <b_jonas> with the same family name), but if I enter Циолковский then it finds nothing
18:56:52 <int-e> b_jonas: that's kind of sad
18:57:03 <b_jonas> I think this is a bug, the library catalog software should be able to find transliterated versions of the name if I type Циолковский, but I have to know the workaround
18:57:56 <wWwwW> ahhh. radioactive theme. make my brain go yes
18:58:06 <b_jonas> and last I was in the building, they still had parts of the catalog not digitized, so I may have to search in the cupboards of catalog slips by the transcribed name sorted in alphabetic order
18:58:54 <b_jonas> I don't know if OSzK and/or Rényi Int kvt still has parts of their catalogs not yet digitized though, maybe they scanned everything by now
18:59:14 <int-e> Using 'j' for 'й' (which in context mostly extends the 'и' vowel) is also a bit weird, but whatever.
18:59:50 <int-e> (it's hard to argue with standards)
19:00:02 <int-e> cf. https://xkcd.com/927/
19:02:08 <wWwwW> sorry for bringing this up again but:
19:02:09 <wWwwW> how the hell is not more powerfull than whats just a TM but with bounded memory
19:03:23 <int-e> you need unbounded memory to keep track of the number of 1s to print between newlines
19:03:27 <b_jonas> int-e: the ISO 9 transcription wants to be a simple reversible transliteration that takes one letter always to one letter, so I think that makes sense. There are other transliterations that don't try to keep that.
19:03:39 <wWwwW> all you need is duplication concatenation and infinite loops
19:03:54 <b_jonas> also ISO 9 tries to transliterate all languages written in cyrillic letters uniformly, but in a way that's optimized for Russian first
19:03:55 <int-e> log(N) -> oo as N -> oo.
19:04:44 <int-e> And since there's no input, an LBA only gets finite memory here.
19:05:21 <wWwwW> even with input it can be a LBA(see buzzfizz)
19:05:33 <int-e> (The memory is bounded by a linear (technically affine to make the zero sized input case work) function in the input size.)
19:05:45 <b_jonas> and I think Serbian second, so that the transliterations for letters usually matches the Gaj serbian transliteration, except for ј where Russian takes precedence, and for the letters where serbian transliterates one cyrillic letter to two latin letters
19:06:02 <ais523> int-e: here, have an infinity symbol: ∞
19:06:22 <int-e> ais523: it looks ugly in my terminal font :P
19:06:31 <zzo38> I did not know about Minuteman computer now I see
19:06:47 <b_jonas> the one digit number for the standard is really cool by the way. do you know any other ISO or ECMA or ANSI etc standards with such a cool name?
19:07:02 <ais523> the book I learned about computer construction from was written a little after magnetic core memory was invented
19:07:18 <ais523> and had sections on both digital and analog computers, although there was more space devoted to digital
19:07:34 <int-e> ais523: https://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/owo.png
19:07:40 <ais523> b_jonas: aren't Ecma standards normally just two digits long? although they might have reached three digits by now
19:07:58 <b_jonas> ais523: two letters yes, but I don't think I've seen any one-digit one
19:08:05 <ais523> ISO have cool-sounding numbers for some of the standards, like ISO 9000 (the standards themselves are less interesting though)
19:08:12 <b_jonas> and the name with ISO is more impressive with how most ISO standards have longer names
19:09:36 <ais523> this IRC channel tried to set up a standards organisation once, but it didn't get as far as publishing even a single standard
19:09:41 <int-e> wWwwW: BuzzFizz has unbounded counters, so that means unbounded memory.
19:09:42 <ais523> (I think it was planning to do BF first, unsuprisingly)
19:10:10 <wWwwW> then its not a LBA????
19:10:11 <ais523> int-e: but it can be implemented with memory that's bounded linearly by the input
19:10:37 <int-e> okay so it can't do the looping counter
19:10:46 <ais523> wWwwW: the trick is that although the counters can theoretically go arbitrarily high, every very high value is indistinguishable from some lower value, and you can determine that statically
19:10:57 <b_jonas> I admit "typewriters" is too specific a reason, the library catalog even on a digital computer would probably have used a latin transliteration until about 1990 the least
19:11:00 <ais523> so you can "cheat" by storing the higher values as a lower one
19:11:03 <int-e> ais523: right I didn't read that far
19:11:29 <ais523> (well, "statically based on the input" which is how you get the LBA's input-dependence)
19:11:31 <wWwwW> does buzzfizz have strings?
19:11:43 <ais523> except for string literals in the print statements
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19:11:52 <wWwwW> else you could prop implement not
19:12:11 <int-e> it's not an LBA for the purpose of printing stuff
19:12:32 <int-e> you can print a counter
19:12:36 <b_jonas> "this IRC channel tried to set up a standards organisation once" => wait what?
19:12:42 <ais523> int-e: oh, ouch, that is probably a mistake
19:12:56 <ais523> b_jonas: it collapsed into bikeshedding about what typesetting software to use, I think
19:13:09 <ais523> it didn't get as far as considering issues like hosting or getting anyone to pay any attention to it
19:13:20 <int-e> but for properties like halting it's an LBA
19:14:15 <wWwwW> ill have to leave in a bit sorry
19:14:28 <int-e> that said... I still don't think that it can do the loooping counter even if you abuse the ability to print counter values
19:14:48 <b_jonas> typical. hopefully tom7 will improve his BoVeX esoteric typesetting system to a point where we can standardize on that. though we may need to write a texinfo-like template for it that can compile to either HTML or printable PDF.
19:14:52 <int-e> wWwwW: it's fine, people drop off and return all the time
19:15:22 <int-e> sure it may take hours, days, weeks... sometimes more
19:15:25 <ais523> conversations here often move slowly
19:15:31 <ais523> we continue them across hours or days quite often
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19:15:42 <int-e> and there are logs to help...
19:18:00 <esolangs> [[BuzzFizz]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137718&oldid=58772 * Int-e * (+96) nitpick
19:18:53 <b_jonas> https://logs.esolangs.org/libera-esolangs/2024-09-01.html#l5f APL Del editor, ∇ editor, for log search purposes
19:21:41 <int-e> ais523: ironically that capability to print the counter is quite essential for FizzBuzz
19:21:44 <b_jonas> "sort of – it gets complicated when you have multiple gotos or comefroms aiming at the same line" => that's how Chomsky context-free grammars work if you translate it to a nondeterministic stack automata, but with a very different semantics for multiple COME FROM from the same place as in Intercal
19:21:55 <b_jonas> re https://logs.esolangs.org/libera-esolangs/2024-09-01.html#lpf
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19:22:26 <ais523> b_jonas: it's not very different, it's actually pretty similar
19:22:39 <ais523> C-INTERCAL implements backtracking and threading using the same internal primitives
19:24:01 <b_jonas> we should look up the original article proposing come from and link it from https://esolangs.org/wiki/Prehistory_of_esoteric_programming_languages https://esolangs.org/wiki/INTERCAL https://esolangs.org/wiki/C-INTERCAL
19:25:19 <esolangs> [[GoL]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137719 * B jonas * (+26) Redirected page to [[Game of Life]]
19:26:35 <b_jonas> ok, I admit I haven't really looked at how threaded intercal worked, it didn't seem interesting enough an extension
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19:29:17 <ais523> the way it does inter-thread communication is probably the most interesting part, and ended up being useful for single-threaded programming too
19:34:00 <int-e> I'm trying to recall... was it a one-shot version of REINSTATE?
19:35:00 <b_jonas> "<wWwwW> a consistency checking esolang" => would a modern SAT solver or finite domain logic programming solver count? how about just Prolog?
19:35:05 <int-e> (I'll look it up myself)
19:37:27 <int-e> Ah, statement get an optional ONCE/AGAIN flag and 'ONCE' can toggle the NOT flag. Yeah, I think my memory got close enough :)
19:37:42 <ais523> int-e: it's a statement modifier that flips the abstention status once when the status runs, and then turns itself off, but it turns itself back on again if it gets externally abstained/reinstated
19:39:45 <b_jonas> and this is guaranteed to be atomic in that if two threads run into a statement that is currently reinstanted once only then exactly one will execute that statement?
19:40:35 <b_jonas> that's convenient, yes. though you'll also need some way to pause a thread without a spinloop.
19:41:02 <int-e> I think you have to spin here
19:42:13 <esolangs> [[Sculptlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137720&oldid=136486 * Ractangle * (+1)
19:42:15 <int-e> and nothing stops you from ineffectively REINSTATING a DO ... ONCE statement or ABSTAINING FROM a DON'T ... ONCE one.
19:42:39 <int-e> So there's some effort to make this awkward.
19:44:16 <b_jonas> “<int-e> inconsistent theories have no models, so are they ‘things’ at all” => yes, in that because there are interesting theories where we can't tell if they have models or not, we want to be able to talk about a model even if it might be inconsistent for all we know
19:44:36 <int-e> b_jonas: the link I'm looking at is https://web.archive.org/web/20160303230852/http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/intercal/threaded.html
19:44:40 <b_jonas> it's like being able to talk about a person who may be dead, even if a known dead person isn't interesting
19:45:22 <int-e> b_jonas: I was playing with the idea that the meta level is less tangible than the object level
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19:45:31 <int-e> and things should be tangible
19:45:36 <int-e> it wasn't too serious
19:47:28 <b_jonas> in that case you'd have to say that theories aren't things, regardless if they're consistent, only models are things
19:48:15 <int-e> I have bigger gripes in the same conceptual space... the reversed roles of reification and reflection in https://hackage.haskell.org/package/reflection-2.1.8/docs/Data-Reflection.html :P (values are concrete, so reification should be the process of expressing a type as a value, while reflection does the opposite... but no, it's the opposite)
19:49:18 <b_jonas> "I've never made an esolang because fleshing out ideas is hard." => the trick is to make a toy language or experimental language, and then posting it on the esolang wiki because those are off-topic enough
19:50:11 <b_jonas> by toy language I mean a language whose main goal is to learn how to implement a language; an experimental language is one that has features that are probably not good to put in a real language, but you want to explore their consequences so you put them into a language anyway.
19:50:55 <b_jonas> ok, not really, by toy language I mean a language whose main goal is to learn how to *design and develop* a language, which may involve implementing it, but that's not strictly necessary
19:52:26 <b_jonas> so toy language ends up as not practical mostly by the limitations of its creator, because they don't know how to make a good enough practical language; while experimental language ends up as not practical because you are trying an esoteric idea
19:52:48 <b_jonas> or too many strange ideas in the same language, where a few of those ideas may turn out to be good
19:53:13 <esolangs> [[Uyjhmn n]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137721&oldid=132744 * Ractangle * (-28) /* See also */
19:53:25 <b_jonas> I don't care too much about whether such languages count as esoteric or not, they're on topic enough for the wiki and channel
19:53:37 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[Uyjhmn--]] to [[I love circuit boards]]
19:54:14 <esolangs> [[I love circuit boards]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137724&oldid=137722 * Ractangle * (-1719) Replaced content with "{{Stub}} '''I love circuit boards''' is a circuit board esolang [[Category:Languages]][[Category:2024]][[Category:Unimplemented]]"
19:58:44 <esolangs> [[I love circuit boards]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137725&oldid=137724 * Ractangle * (+143)
20:09:00 <esolangs> [[NOP (esolang)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137726&oldid=137692 * Aadenboy * (+2)
20:13:36 <b_jonas> ais523: wait, what is call/pc ? I heard of call/cc and call/ec . is this something related to delimited continuations?
20:14:16 <int-e> 'p' is for 'previous' and there's an explanation of that in context
20:16:27 <b_jonas> "which I hoped would've been fixed when I updated CivetWeb" => I recently upgraded Oracle VirtualBox on my work machine because it sometimes used to crash with a segfault in the process running on the host. after the upgrade, multiple times it froze while the Windows guest was shutting down. this might not be a Virtualbox bug, it's possible that the guest freezes, but if so the timing is strange because
20:16:33 <b_jonas> I don't think that ever happened before, certainly not repeatedly.
20:20:03 <b_jonas> "<int-e> cf. https://xkcd.com/927/" => oh, there absolutely are that many standards for transliterating russian to latin script.
20:23:09 <esolangs> [[User:B jonas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137727&oldid=134895 * B jonas * (+152) /* Todo */ D-17, thank you for the reminder zzo38
20:24:01 <esolangs> [[User:Aadenboy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137728&oldid=132517 * Aadenboy * (+666) yet another rewrite
20:24:19 <esolangs> [[User:Aadenboy]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137729&oldid=137728 * Aadenboy * (+1) whitespace fail
20:25:21 <esolangs> [[User:Aadenboy]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137730&oldid=137729 * Aadenboy * (+16) /* who. who are you */ STYLE FAIL
20:28:28 <esolangs> [[Sculptlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137731&oldid=137720 * Tommyaweosme * (+0) Undo revision [[Special:Diff/137720|137720]] by [[Special:Contributions/Ractangle|Ractangle]] ([[User talk:Ractangle|talk]])
20:28:56 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosme/common.css]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137732&oldid=137656 * Tommyaweosme * (-62) Blanked the page
20:29:10 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosme/common.css]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137733&oldid=137732 * Tommyaweosme * (+62)
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20:36:55 <int-e> ais523: Hmm BuzzFizz should have enough for full LBA capability if we adopt a convention that the first input is 2^M if we want to simulate an M-bit tape. We get full finite control and counters modulo 2^M, and we can decrement a counter by zeroing an auxiliary counter, incrementing it once, and then incrementing both counters until the auxiliary counter is 0.
20:37:08 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosme/common.css]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137734&oldid=137733 * Tommyaweosme * (-62) Blanked the page
20:37:51 <int-e> also, else: isn't needed for full finite control; you can maintain your own modulo 2 counter for that instead
20:40:08 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosme/common.js]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137735&oldid=136372 * Tommyaweosme * (-157) uwu
20:40:10 <int-e> (incidentally the example that adds two numbers doesn't use else: either)
20:41:40 <int-e> also since if ...: can be nested you can implement finite control with N states with log_2(N) toggles.
20:42:34 <int-e> with a silly opportunity to employ a Gray code.
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21:02:49 <ais523> int-e: ooh, nice proof – so I guess the hard part is doing it only with the numbers in the input
21:03:49 <ais523> (also I was wondering when Tommyaweosme was going to blank that CSS page)
21:04:12 <ais523> that JS edit could be trouble, I think it is likely to screw up edited pages, cloud-to-butt style
21:04:34 <ais523> but I'll wait for it to demonstrate that it's a problem before blanking, just in case it isn't
21:05:27 <esolangs> [[Uyjhmn--/Brainfuck interpreter]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137736&oldid=130673 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+146) Link, category
21:05:37 <ais523> else: was included mostly because FizzBuzzes do that rather than for LBA-completeness
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21:14:03 <b_jonas> I haven't watched this recent video yet, but it has a clickbait title related to stuff on-topic here => https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFoXooShZXc
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21:54:51 <esolangs> [[Imprecision]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137737&oldid=137711 * Ais523 * (+7) /* Computational class */ better wording
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22:48:35 <korvo> For the MtG fans who didn't see it yet: https://david.kolo.ski/blog/sort-library-steps-mtg/
22:48:50 <korvo> A judge discusses this in a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhZnHJBH4Ag
22:54:28 <esolangs> [[Stck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137738&oldid=131435 * Thebarra * (+19) /* More Examples */
22:57:31 <esolangs> [[Stck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137739&oldid=137738 * Thebarra * (+108) /* More Examples */
23:03:51 <b_jonas> https://www.righto.com/2023/08/datapoint-to-8086.html “Following the 8080, Intel intended to revolutionize microprocessors with a 32-bit ‘micro-mainframe’, the iAPX 432. This extremely complex processor implemented objects, memory management, interprocess communication, and fine-grained memory protection in hardware. The iAPX 432 was too ambitious and the project fell behind schedule, leaving
23:03:57 <b_jonas> Intel vulnerable against competitors such as Motorola and Zilog. Intel quickly threw together a 16-bit processor as a stopgap until the iAPX 432 was ready;” => that means Intel's microprocessor development lab was capable of executing and reordering independent models way before they made the Pentium and Pentium Pro which were their first CPUs that could execute independent instructions in parallel
23:04:03 <b_jonas> and reorder instruction respectively.
23:19:31 <b_jonas> https://www.righto.com/2024/08/pentium-navajo-fairchild-shiprock.html => hmm, do we have a thematic esolang for this, one where the source code is woven fabric and it's interpreted as if it were plans for an integrated circuit?
23:47:44 <zzo38> I don't know what is BoVeX. What I think would be useful in a typesetting system is to be able to include PostScript codes which can be executed during the decisions of typesetting, and not only at the end when the output is being made.
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23:55:09 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Tommyaweosmalt * New user account
23:55:40 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137740&oldid=137640 * Tommyaweosmalt * (+184)
23:57:34 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137741&oldid=137657 * Tommyaweosmalt * (+496) /* unbrick needed */ new section
23:58:46 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosmalt]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137742 * Tommyaweosmalt * (+139) Created page with "[[user:tommyaweosme]]s alt account made for a non-banevading reason. this account has never edited and never will edit [[esolang:sandbox]]"
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00:23:24 <b_jonas> zzo38: https://esolangs.org/wiki/BoVeX
00:38:19 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137743&oldid=137680 * Cycwin * (+2084)
00:46:00 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137744&oldid=137743 * Cycwin * (+238)
00:48:49 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137745&oldid=137744 * Cycwin * (+30)
00:50:27 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137746&oldid=137745 * Cycwin * (+31)
01:00:30 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137747&oldid=137746 * Cycwin * (+12)
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01:24:20 <esolangs> [[Talk:Befunge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137748&oldid=121104 * Tommyaweosmalt * (+354)
02:02:14 <zzo38> About setting up a standards organization but standards were not made, I think though, that I had tried to make up one, which is a chording keyboard that uses the same combinations as the IBM format of punched cards, e.g. 0 and 9 together will make "Z". There will be a separate space key and enter key.
02:21:08 <zzo38> The other thing I had wanted to do is like Dewey decimal system with TV shows and movies, so that you can select them by number on a on demand service. After each digit is entered, a menu can be displayed with the choices for the next digit, and then afterward finally you can select which one you want from that menu by entering the rest of the digits according to the specific movie you want.
02:55:18 <esolangs> [[(,)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137749&oldid=119053 * Dadsdy * (-42) /* Discord */
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04:15:06 <zzo38> (I had also written other stuff though, such as Scorpion protocol/file-format.)
04:15:42 <zzo38> Maybe we will be able to make a standard organization if you have ideas about what kind of standards documents you will intend to write.
04:16:24 <zzo38> I think that it was mentioned that my ideas about chording keyboard might be suitable. So, next time you make up something else, and then we will have enough to make it, even if they contradict each other
04:53:59 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137750&oldid=137714 * Ractangle * (-53) /* Esolangs */
04:57:37 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137751&oldid=137700 * Ractangle * (+109)
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06:49:49 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137752&oldid=137683 * Unname4798 * (+189)
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07:49:40 <esolangs> [[Animosian]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137753&oldid=75706 * Star651 * (+340) kinda sorta got implemented but not exactly
08:10:30 <b_jonas> zzo38: how would that be layed out? the most common modifiers 10, 11, 12 under your left fingers, 10-11, 10-12, 11-12 in a row above your left fingers; the less common 8, 9, 8-9 modifiers under your left pinky; 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 keys under your right fingers and the row above them; enter key somewhere reachable with your right hand; space under your thumbs? or would it be more like eight of 1,
08:10:36 <b_jonas> 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 in the home row; two copies each of the 10, 11, 12 modifiers above and 10-11, 10-12, 11-12 modifiers below the home row so you can use whichever is reachable with the other hand than the number you're pressing?
08:12:56 <b_jonas> or would you just start with a layout similar to traditional keyboards with separate keys for the 26 letters, 10 digits, and a few other, but then have two copies of the modifier to get lowercase equivalents that negate the 10, 11, 12 columns, and two copies of the 8 and 9 and 8-9 modifiers?
08:13:34 <b_jonas> (and a space and enter key, the space modifiable)
08:16:37 <b_jonas> that would not be too many keys, but I'm not sure it counts as chorded
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08:31:10 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Gabenugget114 * New user account
08:36:38 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137754&oldid=137740 * Gabenugget114 * (+92)
08:36:56 <esolangs> [[User:Gabenugget114]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137755 * Gabenugget114 * (+2) Created page with "hi"
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10:35:21 <esolangs> [[/English version]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137756&oldid=137636 * None1 * (+2) /* Command in the language */
10:36:52 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[User:Tommyaweosme/common.js]]": Author request: JS page that is rendering the account unable to edit
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10:37:23 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137757&oldid=137741 * Ais523 * (+229) /* unbrick needed */ unbricked hopefully
10:37:41 <esolangs> [[/English version]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137758&oldid=137756 * None1 * (+58)
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11:18:49 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137759&oldid=137717 * PrySigneToFry * (+466)
11:20:27 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137760&oldid=137751 * None1 * (+1)
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11:22:38 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137761&oldid=137225 * PrySigneToFry * (+745)
11:26:30 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137762&oldid=137647 * PrySigneToFry * (+195) I'll fliter the message with important level.
11:26:50 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137763&oldid=137762 * PrySigneToFry * (+5)
11:27:31 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137764&oldid=137757 * None1 * (+216) /* Delete blank pages */
11:29:55 <esolangs> [[]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137765 * PrySigneToFry * (+19) Redirected page to [[Nope.]]
11:30:08 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137766&oldid=137764 * None1 * (+279) /* the war */
11:35:45 <esolangs> [[The Esoteric File Archive]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137767&oldid=82517 * None1 * (+13) /* Known mirrors */ probably dead
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11:39:36 <esolangs> [[Nope.]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137768&oldid=136253 * PrySigneToFry * (+218)
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11:53:13 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137769&oldid=137763 * Ais523 * (-200) undo sorting a user talk page is generally useless, but if a user wants to do it, it should be up to them whether and how to do it, not up to visitors to the page edits by other users to user talk pages should primarily be for the purpose of sending messages to t
11:58:58 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[I love circuit boards]] to [[How dare you fuck the brain]]
12:01:44 <esolangs> [[Translated ORK/PSTF Again2]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137772 * PrySigneToFry * (+1024) Created page with "MHPP: I think we're going to go crazy with ORK NON1: Yes, but we can make it crazier PSTF: This is my product {{PSTF's Version|None1|[[Translated ORK/None1 again2]]}} 1. Take the semi-product <pre> Cable texture. Nothing not nothing. Nothing
12:02:47 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137773&oldid=137770 * Ractangle * (+8)
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12:36:10 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137774&oldid=137773 * Ractangle * (+75) /* Syntax */
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12:37:03 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137775&oldid=137759 * Ractangle * (+29) /* test topic */
12:37:21 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137776&oldid=137775 * Ractangle * (+167) /* test topic */
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13:11:51 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137777&oldid=137766 * Tommyaweosme * (+181) /* unbrick needed */
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13:13:14 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137778&oldid=137752 * Tommyaweosme * (+210)
13:23:27 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Unimplemented]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137779&oldid=137679 * None1 * (+252)
13:37:52 <esolangs> [[Befunge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137780&oldid=132328 * None1 * (+120) /* Related languages */
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13:52:57 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137781&oldid=137694 * Yayimhere * (+0)
13:53:18 <esolangs> [[Turing (Joshop)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137782&oldid=108909 * PkmnQ * (-8) Page was blanked by the creator
13:54:03 <esolangs> [[Atomless set computation]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137783&oldid=108747 * PkmnQ * (-8) Undo revision [[Special:Diff/108747|108747]] by [[Special:Contributions/Squidmanescape|Squidmanescape]] ([[User talk:Squidmanescape|talk]])
13:54:40 <esolangs> [[BlueBell]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137784&oldid=108760 * PkmnQ * (-8) Page was blanked by the author
13:54:58 <esolangs> [[Gino]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137785&oldid=109130 * PkmnQ * (-8) Page was blanked by the author
13:55:14 <esolangs> [[Brainfucker++]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137786&oldid=108894 * PkmnQ * (-8) Page was blanked by the author
13:55:31 <esolangs> [[Brainfucker++/SBFR]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137787&oldid=108895 * PkmnQ * (-8) Page was blanked by the author
13:59:21 <esolangs> [[Chagz]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137788&oldid=124079 * PkmnQ * (-16) Can probably be safely deleted
13:59:51 <esolangs> [[Miau]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137789&oldid=110915 * PkmnQ * (+2) Redirectify
14:00:39 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137790&oldid=137781 * Yayimhere * (+98)
14:00:59 <esolangs> [[BoredKat]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137791&oldid=108880 * PkmnQ * (-20) Can probably be safely deleted
14:01:29 <esolangs> [[DimensionDoors]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137792&oldid=84021 * PkmnQ * (-22) Probably accidentally created
14:02:06 <esolangs> [[Cpy/Converter]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137793&oldid=109114 * PkmnQ * (-22) Page was blanked by the author
14:02:30 <esolangs> [[Gino/Interpreter]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137794&oldid=109129 * PkmnQ * (-22) Page was blanked by the author
14:02:54 <esolangs> [[Gdlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137795&oldid=130860 * PkmnQ * (-22) Page was blanked by the author
14:04:53 <esolangs> [[Sequence]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137796&oldid=109374 * PkmnQ * (-15) Replace with template, author may choose to add page in the future
14:06:22 <esolangs> [[Talk:Sandbox/tr]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137797 * PkmnQ * (+106) Created page with "Is this supposed to exist? --~~~~"
14:07:12 <esolangs> [[Marmite]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137798&oldid=112492 * PkmnQ * (-27) Can probably be safely deleted
14:09:11 <esolangs> [[Lim95]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137799&oldid=99617 * PkmnQ * (-7) Probably accidentally created
14:10:11 <esolangs> [[Exclamation]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137800&oldid=122306 * PkmnQ * (-8) Can probably be safely deleted
14:10:20 <esolangs> [[New]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137801&oldid=122307 * PkmnQ * (-8) Can probably be safely deleted
14:11:29 <esolangs> [[StupidStackLanguage/Examples]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137802&oldid=79822 * PkmnQ * (-14) Can probably be safely deleted
14:12:05 <esolangs> [[REG.TYPE = STR TRUE turing completeness]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137803&oldid=131824 * PkmnQ * (-28) Can probably be safely deleted
14:12:29 <esolangs> [[C-trice]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137804&oldid=108903 * PkmnQ * (-31) Can probably be safely deleted
14:12:45 <esolangs> [[FunctionsFTW/FizzBizz]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137805&oldid=93699 * PkmnQ * (-31) Can probably be safely deleted
14:12:57 <esolangs> [[Alexa]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137806&oldid=109845 * PkmnQ * (-31) Can probably be safely deleted
14:13:08 <esolangs> [[Robotic Smiley Face]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137807&oldid=109961 * PkmnQ * (+1) Redirected page to [[Robotic smiley face]]
14:13:29 <esolangs> [[Esolang1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137808&oldid=91005 * PkmnQ * (-34) Probably accidentally created
14:14:35 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137809 * PkmnQ * (+114) Created page with "Is this supposed to be a redirect? --~~~~"
14:15:00 <esolangs> [[Quoi?]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137810&oldid=112869 * PkmnQ * (-36) Can probably be safely deleted
14:15:06 <esolangs> [[Quoi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137811&oldid=112868 * PkmnQ * (-36) Can probably be safely deleted
14:15:19 <esolangs> [[Business Offers]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137812&oldid=108901 * PkmnQ * (-41) Can probably be safely deleted
14:16:44 <esolangs> [[LambdaStack]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137813&oldid=101633 * PkmnQ * (-50) Can probably be safely deleted
14:19:09 <esolangs> [[Disk Drive]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137814&oldid=106434 * PkmnQ * (-62) Redirected page to [[]]
14:20:06 <esolangs> [[BuzzFish]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137815 * Yayimhere * (+413) Created page with "'''BuzzFish''' is a esolang by [[User:Yayimhere]] to demonstrate the problem with [[Looping counter]]s. == the syntax == BuzzFish has 3 commands: *: print * and a newline |''x''}: loops x forever |''x''}=: move the string |x}= to after the = == the problem == the
14:20:46 <esolangs> [[Pinecone]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137816&oldid=92298 * PkmnQ * (+23) Hopefully someone remembers what this esolang does
14:20:48 <wWwwW> https://esolangs.org/wiki/BuzzFish
14:21:27 <esolangs> [[Talk:Sleep]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137817 * PkmnQ * (+97) Created page with "Is this esoteric? --~~~~"
14:22:06 <esolangs> [[Chaos]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137818&oldid=109100 * PkmnQ * (-14)
14:22:44 <esolangs> [[OCDMess]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137819&oldid=110035 * PkmnQ * (-89) Can probably be safely deleted
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14:27:49 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137820&oldid=137778 * Unname4798 * (+250)
14:27:52 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137821&oldid=137337 * None1 * (+315)
14:29:31 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137822&oldid=124504 * None1 * (+1)
14:30:29 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Chagz]]": apparent test page, has never had useful content
14:31:59 <esolangs> [[BoredKat]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137823&oldid=137791 * Ais523 * (+25) manual revert back to being a redirect it is possible there are still links to the old name of the language, and a redirect is more useful than a missing page
14:34:00 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Sandbox/tr]]": apparent (very old) attempt to test a template but it doesn't make sense to keep tests around indefinitely, and normally userspace is a better place for that sort of test
14:34:24 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Talk:Sandbox/tr]]": delete the talk page, too
14:34:50 <ais523> wWwwW: can that even do a looping counter? you at least need * and the newline to be separate commands
14:36:13 <esolangs> [[BuzzFish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137824&oldid=137815 * Yayimhere * (+40)
14:36:44 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[User talk:Unname4798/vector.css]]": Author request
14:37:03 <esolangs> [[BuzzFish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137825&oldid=137824 * Yayimhere * (+69)
14:37:03 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[User:Unname4798/common.js]]": Author request
14:37:25 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[User:Unname4798/vector.css]]": Author request
14:37:42 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[User:Unname4798/vector.js]]": Author request
14:38:11 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137826&oldid=137820 * Ais523 * (+146) /* Unrated */ deleted
14:40:49 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ais523 * moved [[LambdaStack]] to [[User:Squidmanescape]]: revert accidental move of a userpage to mainspace temporarily deleting the replacement userpage to do the history merge, I will undelete it once the history merge is finished
14:40:49 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[User:Squidmanescape]]": Deleted to make way for move from "[[LambdaStack]]"
14:41:20 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] restore * Ais523 * undeleted "[[User:Squidmanescape]]": history merge
14:41:21 <wWwwW> ais523: now it works right?
14:41:51 <esolangs> [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137828&oldid=137827 * Ais523 * (+2202) select the correct revision to be the current revision, after the history merge
14:42:39 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Business Offers]]": apparent test page, has never had useful content
14:43:42 <esolangs> [[Quoi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137829&oldid=137811 * Ais523 * (+19) manual revert back to being a redirect it is possible there are still links to the old name of the language, and a redirect is more useful than a missing page
14:46:39 <esolangs> [[User talk:PkmnQ]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137830 * Ais523 * (+814) thanks for finding abandoned pages
14:47:58 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Esolang1]]": accidentally created page, all content is also included at [[User:Esolang1]] which is the correct name for the page
14:48:29 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Alexa]]": abandoned page, has never had useful content
14:49:01 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[FunctionsFTW/FizzBizz]]": redirect left behind after a typo was corrected in the page title
14:51:32 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[REG.TYPE = STR TRUE turing completeness]]": Author request: early draft of a TCness proof that's now superseded by (and redundant to) the proof on the main article, and the author requested deletion
14:52:39 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[StupidStackLanguage:Examples]]": redirect left behind after the page title was corrected to fit the naming convention
14:54:26 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Lim95]]": apparent test page, has never had useful content
14:54:48 <wWwwW> lots of deletions today
14:55:07 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Marmite]]": abandoned page, has never had useful content
14:55:52 <ais523> wWwwW: someone went through blanking all the pages they thought should be deleted
14:56:03 <ais523> they weren't right on all of them, but got quite a lot right, so I went around deleting it properly
14:56:34 <wWwwW> shouldn't the creator be able to delete their pages?
14:56:48 <ais523> if it's soon after creation, typically yes
14:56:52 <wWwwW> so you and others dont need to delete it when they blank it
14:56:56 <ais523> if it's older it gets more complicated, because pages aren't owned by people
14:57:25 <wWwwW> if its something like bf you shouldnt be able to do that
14:57:25 <ais523> and if, say, the only description of an esolang is on the wiki but the creator doesn't feel like maintaining it, sometimes they try to delete the page, but then the description would be lost
14:58:02 <ais523> so those are controversial, and normally need more than one opinion to delete
14:58:21 <ais523> I generally leave the page in whatever state it's in, because that's easiest for me to do
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14:59:15 <ais523> as for BuzzFish, you might as well, e.g., just add a looping counter to HQ9+, it still would be less powerful than a linear-bounded automaton in almost all respects, but it would be able to implement one program the linear-bounded automaton couldn't
14:59:39 <ais523> so it's not *strictly* less powerful
15:00:11 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137831&oldid=137715 * Yayimhere * (+15)
15:00:20 <ais523> there's an HQ9+ variant https://esolangs.org/wiki/CHIQRSX9%2B with a command defined as "makes the language Turing-complete" – that's the definition, it doesn't say how
15:00:26 <esolangs> [[BuzzFish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137832&oldid=137825 * Yayimhere * (+16)
15:01:00 <ais523> I think there's some debate about what that does to the computational class
15:01:09 <wWwwW> so it could be a run the stack as the memory(idk if dis exists) of a universal tag system
15:01:47 <ais523> OK, 18 deletions is a lot (although it's actually only 16 because 2 of them were a history merge, which requires temporarily deleting pages but they get restored afterward)
15:05:22 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[DimensionDoors]]": accidentally created page, duplicate of [[User:DimensionDoors]] which is the correct name for it
15:05:22 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Talk:DimensionDoors]]": Deleted together with the associated page with reason: accidentally created page, duplicate of [[User:DimensionDoors]] which is the correct name for it
15:06:32 <esolangs> [[Gdlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137833&oldid=137795 * Ais523 * (+20) manual revert back to being a redirect it is possible there are still links to the old name of the language, and a redirect is more useful than a missing page
15:07:35 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Sequence]]": No content; content was: "{{Stub}}", has never had content other than the stub template or an equivalent
15:08:50 <ais523> it doesn't make any sense to make a page that's marked as a stub but nothing else, but apparently people do it sometimes
15:10:36 <ais523> at Wikipedia there are short letter+number codes for all the common ways people make pages that are either entirely useless or rulebreaking and can be deleted immediately, containing no useful content at all is A3
15:11:17 <wWwwW> thats pre''y smart
15:11:21 <ais523> I think it's mostly to stop people deleting pages unilaterally when there's supposed to be discussion first, if you don't know an appropriate code you can't delete the page (some admins get a bit trigger-happy with the deletes)
15:11:35 <wWwwW> also gentoo boot menu is TC... for some reason
15:13:39 <ais523> I once wrote a config file format by starting with it being TC and then placing restrictions on it until it wasn't, which is the other way round from how most people design config file formats
15:13:54 <ais523> maybe Gentoo's boot menu did it the other way round from me
15:14:08 <wWwwW> why do you want it to not be TC?
15:14:24 <ais523> because then it isn't really a config file, it's just a program
15:15:01 <ais523> and in particular I was working on a project where people doing similar projects were trying to put too much logic into the config files rather than putting it into the program being configured, where it should be
15:15:06 <ais523> so I wanted it to be sub-TC intentionally
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15:18:27 <wWwwW> i would like to see a ocnfig creating esolang
15:19:24 <ais523> not intentionally designed as one, I think
15:19:48 <ais523> there are almost certainly config file formats that turned into accidental esolangs
15:20:22 <wWwwW> then maybe some random config format is the first esolang?
15:21:36 <ais523> maybe, although early config file formats were very simple
15:27:05 <wWwwW> how the hell did conway get into esolangs??(fractan))
15:29:26 <ais523> so Conway seems to have been interested in showing that certain mathematical problems are hard to solve
15:29:51 <ais523> and there are very few ways we know of to prove that solving a problem is hard or impossible
15:30:14 <ais523> most problems that we know to be unsolvable, we know it because we can reduce them to the halting problem
15:30:30 <wWwwW> xD why is that so funny to me
15:30:37 <ais523> Conway was trying to show that the Collatz problem was difficult, and did so by showing that generalized Collatz problems were Turing-complete
15:30:49 <ais523> and Fractran was an esolang invented for the TCness proof
15:31:05 <wWwwW> yea that reminded me of something
15:31:27 <wWwwW> in the esolang comunity(and other mathemtical comunities)
15:31:43 <wWwwW> it is that after a person has made a lot of esolangs
15:32:02 <wWwwW> they begin using it in their proofs
15:32:10 <wWwwW> kinda like some of your esolangs
15:32:15 <wWwwW> idk why it happens
15:33:07 <ais523> many of my esolangs were created for proofs, and often they turn out to be useful in more than one proof
15:33:39 <ais523> also, "easy to implement esolangs that are TC and are useful for proving things" is one of the main sorts of esolang that I actively look for, it's where a lot of my esolanging effort goes
15:33:44 <ais523> so it isn't surprising that I found quite a few of them
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15:34:59 <ais523> I can sometimes put a huge amount of effort into taking an easy-to-implement TC language (like Cyclic Tag) and trying to make a derivative that's marginally easier to implement, and still TC, but the effort is that often it's a lot harder to prove TCness (like with Acyclic Tag, Grill Tag or Echo Tag, which are cyclic tag with added restrictions that make it easier to implement in some languages)
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15:38:13 <ais523> The Waterfall Model and Spiral Rise seem to be my best discoveries in terms of being TC yet easy to implement in esolangs and other low-powered languages
15:38:16 <wWwwW> hey ais523: do you think it would be possible to construct a computational model(or comp class) that matches not's power
15:38:50 <wib_jonas> wWwwW "i would like to see a ocnfig creating esolang" => I think there was one of those. IIRC it wasn't just turing-complete but had full access to C-level userspace, and used a syntax where commands were made of an opcode byte plus usually two register names, and I think the registers were named of the 52 ascii letters and maybe more but
15:38:51 <wib_jonas> partitioned to like 6 groups with fixed type traditional fortran style
15:39:00 <wib_jonas> but I'm probably misremembering most of this
15:39:26 <wib_jonas> oh hey, here it is => https://esolangs.org/wiki/Scrip7
15:39:44 <ais523> one thing I noticed is that Not is almost a subset of Underload: it has (1) * : S (¶)S (in Underload syntax), plus an infinite loop which is expressible in Underload but isn't a simple command
15:39:48 <wib_jonas> I just had to search https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?search=configuration+floating&title=Special%3ASearch&go=Go
15:41:05 <wib_jonas> "the first version of the idea had seven registers in all 8 forms, and the author forgot that the alphabet has 26 letters, not 28"
15:41:57 <ais523> hmm, I think Not's computational class can be described like this: you have a counter that grows by a fixed amount at every iteration, and can output fixed strings of 1 and can also output the counter, but can't do anything else
15:42:23 <wWwwW> thats not tc for sure
15:42:24 <ais523> wib_jonas: that makes me think that the esolang should just have added two more letters, œ and æ perhaps
15:42:55 <ais523> those are less symmetrical but easier to type
15:43:24 <wWwwW> i mistype stuff with these so often loæ
15:44:27 <wib_jonas> ais523: in the current form one of the code pointer (as in Script7 code, not C code) typed variables, named G, is the instruction pointer, the so the nice symmetry of 7 general purpose registers in each type would be broken again
15:45:06 <wWwwW> œ and æ are the same???? right???
15:45:12 <wib_jonas> also Script7 basically just *removed* the letters g h G H
15:45:16 <ais523> no, one is a mix of an o and an e, the other is a mix of an a and an e
15:45:34 <wWwwW> they look so simileair
15:45:47 <ais523> æ used to be used in some older English words, but nowadays is normally typed as "ae" or just "e"; œ is used in French
15:46:13 <wWwwW> and maybe swedish(idk)
15:47:03 <wWwwW> cuz denmark has it
15:47:16 <wWwwW> and we just f'ing do that to people ig
15:48:20 <wWwwW> juts like denmark used to have norway
15:57:18 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137834&oldid=137790 * Yayimhere * (+82)
15:57:39 <wWwwW> ^^ progress has been made on the comp class
15:59:58 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137835&oldid=137834 * Yayimhere * (+68)
16:04:11 <wWwwW> what would you expect dis esolangs comp class to be?
16:05:44 <ais523> I am not sure – my guess is that it's TC but it isn't obvious and I don't have a proof
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16:09:00 <esolangs> [[Instructistuctisurcticitstucrit]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137836 * Tommyaweosme * (+774) Created page with "{{lowercase}}instructistuctisurcticitstucrit is a language where you have to code in one program to code in another etc. to finally get to [[brainfuck]]. == how it works == code a [[befunge program]] read the stack: ...987654321 where 1 is
16:09:15 <esolangs> [[Instructistuctisurcticitstucrit]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137837&oldid=137836 * Tommyaweosme * (+0)
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16:34:16 <wWwwW> hey also ais523 can you understand rectangle now?
16:35:58 <ais523> I understand it a bit better
16:36:22 <ais523> I haven't really thought about how to program in it, though
16:37:05 <wWwwW> i have a question about Is It Art?. would it be possible to construct a program that always accepts input
16:37:51 <ais523> I think so, one simple way is to have all the pieces rectangular and all having letters that represent input on them
16:38:08 <ais523> it isn't I/O complete because if input X maps to output Y, then input XX maps to output YY
16:38:26 <ais523> although, you could just dedicated some symbol to "end of input" to work around that
16:39:10 <wWwwW> could we maybe tro to create that program??
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16:53:10 <esolangs> [[User:Tommyaweosme/befunge scripts]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137838 * Tommyaweosme * (+346) Created page with "unincluding the [[user:tommyaweosmalt|one i made on my alt]]: == hello world! == v v"hello world!"< @,,,,,,< >,,,,,^ == program that ends itself with no @ in sight == 88*60p == fizzbuzz (looks like cherries) == &
16:57:25 <wWwwW> i just got a f'ing stupid idea
17:01:10 <wWwwW> can i get feedback?
17:02:20 <zzo38> b_jonas: My intention was to use a small keyboard not much bigger than a telephone keypad, although I am not sure which orientation will be best. (I also did not think lowercase will be needed for the use of this kind of keyboard, and that it is not intended for when you have a full keyboard available but for when you use a small keyboad without too many keys.)
17:03:56 <wWwwW> that whats the program does is it modifies itself
17:04:02 <wWwwW> and not like emmental
17:04:19 <wWwwW> like it modifies the WAY its compiler works
17:04:58 <ais523> there are a lot of self-modifying languages on the wiki already, https://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:Self-modifying – you could look at some of those for inspiration or to see if your idea's already been done
17:05:11 <wWwwW> it just fro goes into the compiler and just modifies the code
17:05:21 <wWwwW> not thta kind of self modifying
17:05:28 <ais523> wow, 319, I don't have all of those memorised (yet, or probably ever)
17:05:46 <ais523> I think that there are probably some that replace the interpreter already
17:05:57 <ais523> editing it rather than replacing it is a bit rarer, though
17:06:08 <wWwwW> but i dont mean something like: make dis command do dis code
17:06:26 <wWwwW> i mean that it actually modifies the code that inteprets the program
17:07:03 <ais523> so the problem with that is, if you are just editing the interpreter rather than just outright replacing it, you would need to specify what language the interpreter is written in, to be able to edit it
17:07:26 <wWwwW> maybe you could do *two layer* interpretation
17:07:46 <ais523> also, there is the potential problem that the program might edit the interpreter to just do everything on its own without even looking at the program
17:08:03 <ais523> so you'd effectively be programming in the outer language rather than in the esolang
17:08:17 <wWwwW> it coul prop be made better
17:09:22 <wWwwW> what if like the memory was the intepreter
17:10:09 <ais523> maybe what you want is an esoteric programming style in an existing language
17:10:33 <wWwwW> that sentence made no sense to me
17:10:47 <ais523> like, imagine a Python library that just alters bytes in memory directly, and only the bytes that correspond to the Python interpreter's memory image
17:11:05 <ais523> and all the language can do is "set byte X to value Y"
17:11:21 <wWwwW> where dis idea comes from is from 90
17:11:24 <ais523> but I think it might be uninteresting because people would just write a small machine code program that did all the work itself
17:11:40 <ais523> 90 works around the problem by not letting you add code, you can only delete it
17:11:53 <wWwwW> that would be cool
17:12:02 <wWwwW> the esolang is its own CPU
17:12:12 <wWwwW> then the bytes wont have the prblem of the computer
17:12:23 <ais523> then what is running the program?
17:12:24 <wWwwW> so it woudlnt have the problem 90
17:12:44 <wWwwW> ais523: and itepret which in intepreting the cpu which is interpeting the esolang
17:13:24 <ais523> so does the esolang change the CPU?
17:13:50 <wWwwW> it modifies the cpus compiler for it
17:13:56 <wWwwW> wow dis is confusing
17:14:26 <ais523> hmm, I have used the tools that are used to compile CPUs (rather than compiling software) – placing all the transistors and the like is very hard by hand, so computers are used to do it
17:14:28 <esolangs> [[Instructistuctisurcticitstucrit]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137839&oldid=137837 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+143) Categories
17:14:39 <ais523> but they're generally closed-source and awkward to use, with bad interfaces
17:15:01 <esolangs> [[BuzzFish]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137840&oldid=137832 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+24) Category
17:15:14 <wWwwW> idc about how computationally possible it is
17:15:22 <wWwwW> like if its hard to compile or whatever
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17:18:36 <esolangs> [[Pinecone]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137841&oldid=137816 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+100) Wayback, GitHub, categories
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17:20:18 <esolangs> [[LCTDNH]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137842&oldid=111110 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+24) Category
17:21:23 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137843&oldid=137774 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+57) Categories
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17:29:53 <esolangs> [[BuzzFizz]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137844&oldid=137718 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+22) Category
17:31:40 <int-e> ais523: I guess the obvious LBA task that BuzzFizz cannot accomplish without tweaking the input is reading a sequence of numbers in {1,2} and output them in reverse.
17:33:11 <zzo38> The standard organization can be made from some common conventions (e.g. RFC 2119) as well as uncommon conventions. Furthermore, they should be made 100% public domain They should be made in a way that can use a simple protocol and simple file (e.g. plain ASCII files) since otherwise it is difficult to access the file that you cannot know without reading the specification first.
17:33:41 <esolangs> [[BuzzFish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137845&oldid=137840 * Yayimhere * (+17)
17:34:29 <zzo38> There are several of "small web protocols" (I made a document which a list of them and some brief descriptions). If you need virtual hosting, then Nightfall Express won't do, and Gopher without TLS also won't do. Gopher with TLS has a problem due to how the gopher menu is made, but you could use a DNS record to specify that TLS is required if you do not have version 6 internet.
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17:36:11 <ais523> int-e: it possibly can if it takes them as digits of a single number? although that program seems like a pain to write
17:36:11 <wWwwW> is it a good idea tho?
17:36:36 <ais523> I think it would take too much effort to do well, and wouldn't really want to see it done badly
17:38:08 <zzo38> I don't know if they had considered using DNS records to avoid that problem of using gopher with TLS.
17:40:23 <int-e> ais523: Yeah that'll work... encode your input using only non-zero digits in a suitable base; do the same for the output (you can set aside a dedicated counter for accumulating the output). Also, yes, painful.
17:40:40 <wWwwW> ais523: for making the cpu i could just uselike idk assembly
17:42:18 <zzo38> (The DNS record can also specify that TLS is available but is not required even with version 4 internet, in case you do not need virtual hosting.)
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18:14:45 <zzo38> (I have seen gopher servers that require version 6 internet (I think it is the gopher server for INTERCAL), and I don't know if this might be why.)
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18:34:44 <int-e> The server may not have an IPv4 address. They often cost extra these days.
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18:38:21 <zzo38> They did have a HTTP server with a version 4 address though.
18:46:56 <int-e> It could be the lack of name-based virtual hosting (HTTP has a Host: header after version 1.1 I think?; Gopher doesn't have anything like that). Or there could be a
18:47:07 <int-e> Err... Or there could be no technical reason at all.
18:52:17 <zzo38> Yes, maybe there is no reason and they just did it, although lack of virtual hosting is also what I had mentioned; however, virtual hosting will be possible with TLS.
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19:00:31 <zzo38> But with version 6 internet, I would expect that they will have enough addresses that name-based virtual hosting will not be needed, I think.
19:02:22 <zzo38> So, protocols with virtual hosting can also be set up with servers with version 4 internet that can be forwarded to the appropriate version 6 addresses. In some cases TLS will be required for doing this but sometimes it can be done without TLS (although gopher isn't one of them).
19:02:37 <b_jonas> zzo38: I think two things you'll want to decide about the keyboard is (1) the typical largest set of fingers that users are expected to type on it, eg. on a qwerty keyboard you can use all fingers on both hands; on typical small mobile phone keypads you use just one finger; on some small keypads you'd use two thumbs; some calculators you can use with either one thumb when handheld, or one finger each
19:02:43 <b_jonas> from one hand if you put the calculator down onto a desk;
19:06:01 <b_jonas> (2) and how it processes the keydown and keyup events: for a normal keyboard you usually only care about keydown of non-modifier keys, and the up or down status of modifiers at the moment when the non-modifier is pressed, you ignore keyups of non-modifier keys and ignore the up/down status of modifiers at all other times; a mobile phone keypad usually only cares about keydowns and only when no other key
19:06:07 <b_jonas> is pressed, you then have to release all keys simultaneously before you can press a new key, this is a good way to ignore the effects of most accidental fat fingerings; while I think a stegano keyboard allows you to press the keys in a chord in any order, and goes to the next syllable when you release all the normal keys
19:06:28 <b_jonas> of course (2) can be decided in software in any case.
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19:16:28 <zzo38> OK, that is valid to consider. For (2), I did think to do that all keys must be released before it is worked and another keys can be entered, but I did not consider (1).
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20:10:05 <esolangs> [[Not]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137846&oldid=137701 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+2384) Added an interpreter implementation in Common Lisp.
20:10:15 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137847&oldid=137843 * Ractangle * (+104)
20:11:08 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137848&oldid=137847 * Ractangle * (+7) /* Syntax */
20:11:31 <esolangs> [[Not]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137849&oldid=137846 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+1) Inserted a missing newline instruction (N) in the original example.
20:11:56 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137850&oldid=137848 * Ractangle * (+21) /* Syntax */
20:18:13 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137851&oldid=137850 * Ractangle * (+146) /* Syntax */
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20:22:02 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137852&oldid=137851 * Ractangle * (+60) /* Syntax */
20:22:15 <esolangs> [[How dare you fuck the brain]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137853&oldid=137852 * Ractangle * (+3) /* Syntax */
20:22:58 <esolangs> [[1L a]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137854&oldid=136696 * Graue * (-4) /* Example code */
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20:40:18 <esolangs> [[Category:2027]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137855 * Tommyaweosme * (+11) Created page with "{{yearcat}}"
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00:43:03 <esolangs> [[Sdac2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137858&oldid=137747 * Cycwin * (+53)
00:56:20 <esolangs> [[Deadfish]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137859&oldid=137275 * TheCanon2 * (+19)
00:57:03 <esolangs> [[Deadfish]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137860&oldid=137859 * TheCanon2 * (+1)
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01:16:15 <esolangs> [[Talk:0 bytes XD]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137861&oldid=135254 * Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff * (+163) /* bad name :( */ new section
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01:46:42 <esolangs> [[Deadfish with gotos and input]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137862 * Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff * (+469) Created page with "made by ~~~~ . jumps to instruction accumulator , input h halt c output char goto 0 if at 256 ==Programs== ===truth machine=== ,iiiis. soh ddddddddddddddddddddddddoiiii
01:47:11 <esolangs> [[User:Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137863&oldid=134270 * Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff * (+41)
03:15:15 <zzo38> I can make up a way for name-based forwarding of connections, which may be helpful in several cases, e.g. forwarding from a version 4 to several version 6, sharing on a single computer with the same address where multiple servers may be running, forwarding to a computer that is not directly connected to the internet, forwarding through a reverse connection in case they cannot listen directly, etc.
03:16:06 <zzo38> However, as far as I have found, SSH does not have virtual hosting. Do you know why they did not add that, even though TLS does have virtual hosting?
03:19:43 <zzo38> (or is that wrong?)
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03:57:32 <zzo38> It can be done directly by reading the client's request, before the server sends to the client, with: TLS, HTTP, Spartan, Scorpion (unencrypted). For some protocols it would require handling some of the functions in between, which means that it is not suitable for all uses, but might sometimes work for some uses, such as: SMTP, NNTP, IRC.
04:06:30 <zzo38> Do you like "Movie decimal system" which can be like a Dewey decimal systems, but with TV shows and movies
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04:53:35 <korvo> I gather that SSH supports key dispatch at the protocol level, although I don't know how often it's implemented. It doesn't need vhosts; it has vkeys.
04:54:42 <korvo> (Key dispatch can be hacked with e.g. OpenSSH on Linux by creating users whose login shells execute a fixed action, and then doing per-user key dispatch. Don't laugh -- this is how git-push works with forges!)
05:06:27 <esolangs> [[FOLDERS text]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137864&oldid=94706 * Yayimhere * (-14) replace external link since it was too the wiki anyway
05:10:23 <esolangs> [[Notf]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137865&oldid=135902 * Yayimhere * (+138)
05:10:57 <esolangs> [[Not]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137866&oldid=137849 * Yayimhere * (-2523) /* Implementation */
05:11:03 <esolangs> [[Not]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137867&oldid=137866 * Yayimhere * (+2524) /* why tho */
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05:16:37 <zzo38> OK, but can it work if you do not already have a key (e.g. if it is a public service that does not require a password or a key to log in)?
05:55:25 <esolangs> [[Chaos]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137868&oldid=137818 * PkmnQ * (+72)
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07:37:19 <b_jonas> zzo38: ssh has *client-side* virtual hosting: you can easily configure it to use fake hostnames, set any options including the actual hostname to connect to based on the hostname. I've done that many years ago, though I'm not using it right now. This is convenient because then you can use those hostnames in programs that use ssh as a lower-level program to access remote hosts, such as rsync or svn.
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09:06:58 <esolangs> [[NOP (esolang)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137869&oldid=137726 * None1 * (-9) /* Interpreters */ it is not the shortest since an empty program is shorter
09:10:42 <esolangs> [[Chicken you too beautiful]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137870&oldid=126536 * None1 * (+27)
09:24:50 <esolangs> [[Category:2027]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137871&oldid=137855 * Unname4798 * (+37)
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10:08:46 <esolangs> [[Reversefuck]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137872 * None1 * (+25) Redirected page to [[ReverseFuck]]
10:18:53 <esolangs> [[Not]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137873&oldid=137867 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+578) Formatted code fragments as such and introduced an aperu of the instruction set.
10:19:13 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137874&oldid=124538 * None1 * (+18)
10:19:39 <esolangs> [[]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137875 * None1 * (+2130) Created page with " is a derivative of [[ReverseFuck]] but in Chinese. It's created by [[User:None1]], and it is a member of [[Trivial brainfuck substitution]]. It is equivalent to [[ReverseFuck]], which is equivalent to [[brainfuck]]. It is also the reverse of [[]], just like [[ReverseFuck]] is
10:19:57 <esolangs> [[]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137876&oldid=137875 * None1 * (+1) /* Commands */
10:21:48 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137877&oldid=137674 * None1 * (+11) /* Non-alphabetic */
10:22:19 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137878&oldid=137877 * None1 * (+2) /* Non-alphabetic */
10:22:56 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137879&oldid=137568 * None1 * (+25) /* My Esolangs */
10:23:58 <esolangs> [[Translated Die Deutsche Programmiersprache]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137880&oldid=137566 * None1 * (+12)
10:27:42 <esolangs> [[Chicken you too beautiful]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137881&oldid=137870 * None1 * (+26) /* Turing completeness */
10:28:12 <esolangs> [[]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137882&oldid=137876 * None1 * (+73) /* Interpreters */
10:34:37 <esolangs> [[Talk:0 bytes XD]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137883&oldid=137861 * None1 * (+308) /* bad name :( */
10:35:32 <esolangs> [[Chicken you too beautiful]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137884&oldid=137881 * None1 * (-26) /* See also */ Wrong place
10:37:48 <esolangs> [[Translated JNTM]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137885 * None1 * (+2099) Created page with "{{lang|a=User:None1|f=horribly translated [[Chicken you too beautiful]]}} It goes through simple translations, but it is wierd. 1. Take this program (as an example): <pre class="rectwrap"> chicken chicken chicken chicken chicken chicken chicken chicken rap beauti
10:38:56 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137886&oldid=137567 * None1 * (+85) /* Horribly translated variants */
10:39:39 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137887&oldid=137879 * None1 * (+85) /* My Esolangs */
10:40:05 <esolangs> [[]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137888&oldid=137874 * None1 * (+13) /* See also */
10:40:59 <esolangs> [[ReverseFuck]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137889&oldid=115067 * None1 * (+26) /* External resources */
10:48:33 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137890&oldid=137750 * Ractangle * (+34) /* Esolangs */
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10:53:49 <esolangs> [[Uyjhmn--/Brainfuck interpreter]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137891&oldid=137736 * Ractangle * (-1017) Replaced content with "{{Stub}}"
10:54:19 <esolangs> [[Uyjhmn--/Brainfuck interpreter]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137892&oldid=137891 * Ractangle * (+38)
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11:35:31 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137893 * None1 * (+3698) Created page with "{{lang|a=User:None1|f=an esolang which uses English abbrevations for tokens}} ==Syntax== In the Syntax column, \n represents line feeds. Tokens are case insensitive. {| class="wikitable" ! Token !! Meaning in English (If you wonder) !! Syntax !! What it does |- | lo
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11:42:42 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137894&oldid=137893 * None1 * (-1) /* Syntax */
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12:05:19 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137895&oldid=137878 * None1 * (-58) /* P */
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12:06:08 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137896&oldid=137886 * None1 * (+77) /* General languages */
12:08:02 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137897&oldid=137887 * None1 * (+64) /* My Esolangs */
12:10:29 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137898&oldid=137894 * None1 * (+8) /* Syntax */
12:11:32 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137899&oldid=137898 * None1 * (+42) /* Fibonacci (recursion) */
12:12:07 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137900&oldid=137899 * None1 * (+34) /* Syntax */
12:12:41 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137901&oldid=137900 * None1 * (+2) /* Syntax */
12:12:58 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137902&oldid=137901 * None1 * (-2) /* Syntax */
12:13:30 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137903&oldid=137902 * None1 * (+1) /* Fibonacci (recursion) */
12:13:43 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137904&oldid=137903 * None1 * (+0) /* Fibonacci (recursion) */
12:14:02 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137905&oldid=137904 * None1 * (+7) /* Fibonacci (recursion) */
12:14:47 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137906&oldid=137905 * None1 * (+46) /* Truth Machine */
12:15:22 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137907&oldid=137906 * None1 * (-2) /* Truth Machine */
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12:53:08 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[Uyjhmn--/Brainfuck interpreter]] to [[Opal]]
12:54:39 <esolangs> [[Opal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137910&oldid=137908 * Ractangle * (+24)
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12:56:44 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137911&oldid=137907 * None1 * (+57) /* Examples */
12:57:16 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137912&oldid=137911 * None1 * (-9) /* Standard library */
12:59:20 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137913&oldid=137912 * None1 * (+74) /* Examples */
13:00:00 <esolangs> [[A+B Problem]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137914&oldid=135625 * None1 * (+89) /* Powershell */
13:05:41 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137915&oldid=137913 * None1 * (+2) /* Fibonacci (recursion) */
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13:12:25 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137916&oldid=137915 * None1 * (-10)
13:14:46 <esolangs> [[PostScriptum]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137917&oldid=137916 * None1 * (+363)
13:21:03 <esolangs> [[Palindrome]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137918&oldid=47145 * None1 * (+126) /* External resources */
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14:14:17 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137919 * DGCK81LNN * (+752) Created page with "{{Stub}} WhatLang is a stack-based programming language created by [[User:YufangTSTSU]] (Yufang). Written in TypeScript, its first interpreter is a private (not published on ''npm'') plugin for [https://koishi.chat Koishi], a bot framework for QQ and other instant me
14:14:30 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137920&oldid=137895 * DGCK81LNN * (+15) /* W */
14:15:52 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137921&oldid=137919 * DGCK81LNN * (+61)
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15:06:29 <wWwwW> somebody made a frickin Not intepret. wow
15:30:02 <fizzie> fungot's gone missing again. :/
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15:30:47 <fizzie> fungot: You're such a flaky bot.
15:30:47 <fungot> fizzie: no time for it. actually good hacker practice imho. not about that.
15:37:49 <fizzie> (It's just one of those bots.)
15:38:56 <fizzie> https://esolangs.org/wiki/Esolang:Community_portal#.23Esoteric > The channel is visited by a large number of bots (some of which come and go), including fungot, HackEso, EgoBot, lambdabot, thutubot, metasepia, idris-bot, myndzi, jconn, j-bot, bfbot, velik, and esolangs (irc).
15:38:56 <fungot> fizzie: filled in my fnord are working on scheme :( mind you that pakistan is 140 million fnord country with fnord of
15:39:09 <fizzie> Many of them have departed though.
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15:52:29 <wWwwW> i got a ping buyt idk wut it was.anybody who mentioned me?
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17:01:13 <esolangs> [[Word worm]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137922&oldid=137492 * Yayimhere * (+81)
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17:53:55 <wWwwW> what do you think?:
17:53:55 <wWwwW> https://esolangs.org/wiki/Byte
18:03:53 <wWwwW> wait i wont have time
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18:26:21 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * OllyBritton * uploaded "[[File:Fibonacci example.png]]"
18:36:52 <esolangs> [[CALC]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137924 * OllyBritton * (+11668) Created page with "== Language overview == '''CALC''' is an esoteric programming language created by [[User:OllyBritton]] based on the kinds of expression which a simple scientific calculator with memory allows. It was designed to demonstrate that the Casio FX-991EX can do arbitrary com
18:38:37 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137925&oldid=137920 * OllyBritton * (+11)
18:38:56 <esolangs> [[CALC]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137926&oldid=137924 * OllyBritton * (-32)
18:43:28 <esolangs> [[Opal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137927&oldid=137910 * Ractangle * (+180)
18:44:22 <esolangs> [[Over-Objective Programming Language (Opal)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137928&oldid=107081 * Ractangle * (+31)
18:45:51 <esolangs> [[CALC]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137929&oldid=137926 * OllyBritton * (-4)
18:54:45 <esolangs> [[Opal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137930&oldid=137927 * Ractangle * (+151)
18:54:58 <esolangs> [[Not]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137931&oldid=137873 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+4) Amended the Common Lisp implementation's orthography.
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20:10:35 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137932&oldid=137921 * DGCK81LNN * (+2655)
20:20:53 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[LX]] to [[Assembolge]]
20:23:01 <esolangs> [[Assembolge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137935&oldid=137933 * Ractangle * (-770)
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20:55:35 <esolangs> [[Opal]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137936&oldid=137930 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+49) Categories
20:59:29 <esolangs> [[CALC]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137937&oldid=137929 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+78) /* Implementations */ Categories
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21:11:01 <zzo38> Is there a TLS extension to include a ASN.1 data with an error condition?
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21:35:24 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Shriansh * New user account
21:36:26 <esolangs> [[Category:2027]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137938&oldid=137871 * Tommyaweosme * (-37) no u
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23:58:56 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137939&oldid=137932 * DGCK81LNN * (+3167)
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00:45:12 <esolangs> [[Talk:Fortran]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137940 * Tommyaweosme * (+238) Created page with "help this page doesnt exist and no proof of it existing exists plsplsplspslplspls add it back ~~~~"
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02:13:29 <esolangs> [[Boolshit]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137941&oldid=108195 * Tommyaweosme * (-27) uncomputable so obviously unimplementable
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05:19:49 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137942&oldid=137939 * DGCK81LNN * (-7)
05:58:22 <esolangs> [[Fortran]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137943 * PkmnQ * (+106) Created page with "{{serious|URL=Fortran}} {{stub}} [[Category:Languages]] [[Category:Before 1993]] [[Category:Implemented]]"
05:59:00 <esolangs> [[Category:2027]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137944&oldid=137938 * Unname4798 * (+60)
05:59:16 <esolangs> [[Category:2027]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137945&oldid=137944 * Unname4798 * (+8)
05:59:38 <esolangs> [[Category:2027]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137946&oldid=137945 * Unname4798 * (+1)
06:00:34 <esolangs> [[Category:2027]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137947&oldid=137946 * Unname4798 * (+10)
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07:06:24 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137948&oldid=137942 * DGCK81LNN * (+3193)
07:09:31 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137949&oldid=137948 * DGCK81LNN * (+0) /* Instructions */
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07:53:39 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * 5cover * New user account
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08:01:43 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137950&oldid=137856 * 5cover * (+104) Introduced myself
08:13:10 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137951&oldid=137949 * DGCK81LNN * (+1993)
08:29:18 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137952&oldid=137951 * DGCK81LNN * (-128)
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08:41:07 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137953&oldid=137952 * DGCK81LNN * (+49)
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11:54:55 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Unimplemented]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137954&oldid=137779 * Yayimhere * (+133)
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12:06:01 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Unimplemented]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137955&oldid=137954 * Yayimhere * (+95)
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12:07:04 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137956&oldid=137835 * Yayimhere * (-1)
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12:37:25 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * DueToTechnicalReasons * New user account
12:38:22 <wWwwW> im bored and i have no dieas fo a esolang
12:39:37 <esolangs> [[0x80070050]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137957&oldid=137956 * Yayimhere * (+0)
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13:04:03 <esolangs> [[Brainhook]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137958 * Yayimhere * (+583) Created page with "'''Brainhook''' is a esolang created by [[User:Yayimhere]] to minimize [[Brainfuck]] == memory == memory is a tape the continues to the right forever. the tape pointer moves right every command. each cell is 6 bit and wrap(so if 0 is decremented its set to 63) == com
13:04:18 <wWwwW> what do you mean sprout?
13:11:00 <sprout> you asked for ideas, I gave you one
13:19:03 <wWwwW> i don wanna steal somebodys else's idea
13:20:25 <wWwwW> but even if its already made i want it to be orgiginal
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13:30:39 <wWwwW> also if you said somethin
13:30:54 <wWwwW> so could you maybe resend sprout
13:35:58 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137959&oldid=137776 * PrySigneToFry * (+471)
13:43:41 <esolangs> [[Talk:Translated JNTM]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137960 * PrySigneToFry * (+510) Created page with "..."
13:46:00 <esolangs> [[BFInfinity]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137961&oldid=134105 * PrySigneToFry * (-289)
13:49:36 <esolangs> [[User:PrySigneToFry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137962&oldid=136936 * PrySigneToFry * (+9)
13:50:17 <esolangs> [[Translated ORK/None1 again2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137963&oldid=137017 * PrySigneToFry * (+71)
14:02:56 <esolangs> [[CALC]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137964&oldid=137937 * OllyBritton * (+367)
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14:09:51 <esolangs> [[ZeroDivisionError: Division by 0/NoQuine]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137965 * PrySigneToFry * (+1109) Created page with "''ZeroDivisionError: Division by 0/NoQuine'' is designed by PSTF and based on [[ZeroDivisionError: Division by 0]] which is inspired by [[SyntaxError: invalid syntax]] which is inspired by [[foo : The term 'foo' is not recognized a
14:10:10 <esolangs> [[ZeroDivisionError: Division by 0]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137966&oldid=133832 * PrySigneToFry * (+47)
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14:13:28 <esolangs> [[ZeroDivisionError: Division by 0/NoQuine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137967&oldid=137965 * PrySigneToFry * (+239)
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14:17:43 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137968&oldid=137769 * PrySigneToFry * (+251) I see.(For the previous operation by AIS523)
14:21:49 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137969&oldid=137565 * PrySigneToFry * (+296)
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14:54:25 <wWwwW> can gte feedback on it?
14:58:28 <wWwwW> i can give the full idea
15:10:07 <wWwwW> if any of you want
15:13:50 <esolangs> [[Talk:Fortran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137970&oldid=137940 * Yayimhere * (+161)
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15:48:24 <korvo> wWwwW: What do you want to accomplish?
15:49:18 <wWwwW> a esolang where you do crafting like in meincraft be deifnin g what things craft to what
15:51:27 <korvo> Fun! It sounds like the main thing to build would be a book of recipes.
15:51:53 <wWwwW> but what if you could modify it?
15:51:58 <wWwwW> like stirng rewriting
15:52:03 <wWwwW> but as minecraft crafting
15:52:53 <wWwwW> im makign am md doc of the book
15:52:59 <wWwwW> i would like help:)
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16:06:25 <wWwwW> ill send a link to the page korvo then you can check it out
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16:18:10 <wWwwW> did somebody say somethin to me?
16:18:20 <wWwwW> and wanted to know
16:23:05 <wWwwW> curent progress korvo: https://hackmd.io/@idkleftoutsidekkk/ryM0QbI3C
16:34:29 <ais523> wWwwW: there were no messages while you were connected
16:34:50 <ais523> you can see all the messages in the log, e.g. today's is https://logs.esolangs.org/libera-esolangs/2024-09-04.html
16:35:03 <ais523> lots of people here look at the log in order to reply to comments made while they weren't here
16:37:12 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Fortran]]": no content, has never had useful content don't create useless pages just to turn blue links red, it's possible that the link should be unlinked, but even when it shouldn't be, you should leave page creation to someone who has something to say
16:37:21 <fowl> my new programming language will have first-class telemetry. still working out the details
16:38:08 <esolangs> [[Talk:Fortran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137971&oldid=137970 * Ais523 * (+334) page was created empty, and I have deleted it
16:39:15 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[Category:2027]]": it doesn't make sense to create future year categories early if doing so is simply going to inspire edit wars
16:40:22 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/protect]] protect * Ais523 * protected "[[Category:2026 [create=sysop] (expires 16:40, 4 September 2025 (UTC))]]": protect future year categories until closer to the date, they tend to inspire useless pages and/or edit wars
16:40:50 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/protect]] protect * Ais523 * protected "[[Category:2027 [create=sysop] (expires 16:40, 4 September 2026 (UTC))]]": protect future year categories until closer to the date, they tend to inspire useless pages and/or edit wars
16:41:13 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/protect]] protect * Ais523 * protected "[[Category:2028 [create=sysop] (expires 16:41, 4 September 2027 (UTC))]]": protect future year categories until closer to the date, they tend to inspire useless pages and/or edit wars
16:41:44 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/protect]] protect * Ais523 * protected "[[Category:2029 [create=sysop] (expires 16:41, 4 September 2028 (UTC))]]": protect future year categories until closer to the date, they tend to inspire useless pages and/or edit wars
16:42:09 <ais523> fowl: in the sense that you can use telemetry as the argument and/or return value of a function?
16:42:33 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/protect]] protect * Ais523 * protected "[[Category:2030 [create=sysop] (expires 16:42, 4 September 2029 (UTC))]]": protect future year categories until closer to the date, they tend to inspire useless pages and/or edit wars
16:43:41 <ais523> it's kind-of mindboggling to imagine telemetry *not* being a special case, given that it seems to be a different kind of thing that the values and types that programs normally work with
16:50:12 <ais523> (I'm not saying that this is a bad idea – just that I'm interested to see how you'll accomplish it)
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16:56:49 <korvo> wWwwW: I'm getting a 403, sorry.
16:57:30 <korvo> I happen to be one of the Minecraft reverse engineers. I can tell you that the MC protocol supports a fairly flexible extension of crafting behaviors; it's not hard-coded.
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16:58:04 <korvo> The protocol lets a server tell a client to open up a modal box. There's hardcoded modals for crafting, furnaces, etc. but also freeform chest-like modals.
16:59:04 <korvo> The client and server can move objects around in the modal, and each movement (each mouse click, each drag-n-drop, etc.) sends an event from client to server. Also the server can force-change anything about the modal, like moving objects on their own.
17:00:03 <korvo> One of my early experiments was a sort of combination lock. The client attempts to open a chest/door. The server sends them a mostly-empty modal containing e.g. six colored wool blocks.
17:00:26 <korvo> The client has to drag them into the right locations on the modal, upon which the server instantly closes the modal and opens the door or spawns the chest modal.
17:00:34 <korvo> (If you've played Riven...)
17:01:04 <korvo> wWwwW: Anyway, it sounds like you're hard at work. When you're ready to share stuff publically, let me know and I'll have a look.
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17:14:14 <wWwwW> ill try to fix the 403
17:15:04 <wWwwW> https://hackmd.io/@idkleftoutsidekkk/ryM0QbI3C
17:16:36 <int-e> . o O ( window.GOOGLE_DRIVE_API_KEY = 'AIzaSyAHmcP5gL_64ZafuAYOvJruFAIaYgHQaY4' )
17:18:26 <int-e> just looking at the source code of that blank page :-P
17:19:10 <int-e> It might be less blank if I enabled Javascript. I don't know.
17:21:31 <esolangs> [[Talk:Fortran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137972&oldid=137971 * Yayimhere * (+175)
17:22:35 <int-e> It's hopefully a read-only API key. :-P
17:23:08 <wWwwW> i will make google doc
17:23:14 <wWwwW> since nobody can see it lol
17:23:15 <int-e> don't worry about it
17:24:02 <int-e> I have Javascript disabled by default. A lot of stuff doesn't work without Javascript. It makes me sad but... oh well.
17:24:35 <wWwwW> its just also korvok cant see it
17:25:09 <int-e> I can say that it's no longer s 403.
17:26:08 <ais523> int-e: I use two browsers, one with JS disabled, one with JS enabled but which wipes localstorage and cookies regularly
17:26:43 <ais523> and use the JS-disabled one for most browsing (I do enable JS on it on a case-by-case basis for websites which don't abuse it, like Wikipedia and Esolang)
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17:27:34 <ais523> then I have a third browser for testing that websites render correctly cross-browser, and a fourth browser for use in the terminal
17:28:04 <ais523> plus at least two browsers that I don't regularly use for anything (one of which is IE6, which I think I used once to test that a website would work in it)
17:28:11 <wWwwW> thats a lot of brwser
17:28:22 <wWwwW> ok thats enough browsers i think
17:28:50 <ais523> three browsers I don't regularly use for anything, I forgot I had Konqueror installed
17:29:13 <ais523> I do have a lot of browsers, I think I use even more text editors than that though
17:33:43 <fizzie> At least when it comes to the Google Drive API, I rather think API keys are entirely orthogonal to read-onlyness/read-writedness. Whether you can read or modify things depends on the relevant end-user credentials, usually through OAuth.
17:34:22 <wWwwW> im to stupid to understand that
17:34:26 <wWwwW> so immma ignore it ig
17:35:18 <fizzie> int-e: Looking at the feature list of the website, I'm guessing that's there to enable a "save to Drive" / "import from Drive" feature.
17:36:01 <b_jonas> can you recommend an x11 volume control program for my debian desktop? ideally one that I can just install to debian 11 from a native package and then keep when I upgrade to debian 12 (or 13 if I'm too lazy). I don't have any special needs, but currently I'm using qasmixer and that keeps crashing, so I'd just like something that doesn't crash so often.
17:37:34 <fizzie> Before PulseAudio/PipeWire, I used to just use that TUI thing, what's it called, `alsamixer`, with a thing that opened a new terminal for it.
17:38:04 <fizzie> If you glue a text-mode program to a terminal emulator, it counts as an X11 program.
17:38:22 <int-e> fizzie: There's a GOOGLE_DRIVE_CLIENT_ID as well. API credentials just are something that I don't really expect to see in client side JS code. But they may be fine. It's really more of a surprise than something I'll actually worry about.
17:40:01 <b_jonas> for browser, I primarily use firefox, the debian-modified version on my home machine and stock firefox on my Windows work machine. I have sometimes used extra Firefox profiles for a few things: I had one that uses the library's proxy to access parts of some paywalled publishing sites, I don't have the library subscription now but I'm not nuking it because I may use the same one in the future when I
17:41:34 <b_jonas> Long ago during my previous job I used to have a separate profile just to separate an in-house developped website to a separate process because it sometimes just consumed all resources and froze firefox. These days firefox has better built-in separation so that might not be necessary, though I still sometimes meet cases when the whole Firefox process hangs.
17:42:10 <fizzie> The "client ID" (in that context, anyway) is an OAuth2 concept, where it indicates the "client" (i.e., a specific website), for things like the auth/consent flow, so that it can show the correct details in the "do you want to let Frobnozz access your account" dialog.
17:42:24 <fizzie> Or something along those lines, I find modern webdev real hard to follow.
17:42:26 <b_jonas> I occasionally use Chrome or (at work only) IE to test if a website is only broken on Firefox or only with my Firefox plugins or it's just broken regardless of browser.
17:45:03 <fizzie> These days I just use Chrome, because, well, you know. With separate profiles for banking stuff and normal web browsing, for what little good that probably does. And then once in a blue moon re-check a website in Firefox to see if it's only broken on Chrome, but that seems to happen a lot less often than the other way around.
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17:45:51 <ais523> b_jonas: IE, not Edge?
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17:46:44 <b_jonas> ais523: uh yeah, it's probably actually Edge these days. I never specifically installed IE or Edge, it only comes up when I'm trying something from a machine other than my work laptop and it doesn't yet have firefox or chrome installed
17:47:47 <b_jonas> it's getting quite rare these days, we just have chromium installed even on production windows machines that aren't even supposed to run a browser during production
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18:05:22 <korvo> wwwww: I wonder whether this could be implemented as a Thue program or similar. The idea is that a general-purpose string-rewriter, if we feed it a special interpreter program, becomes a customized string-rewriter for your language and application.
18:05:54 <korvo> So you'd feed in your special interpreter, followed by your list of crafting recipes, and finally the user-level crafting program.
18:37:30 <esolangs> [[User talk:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137973&oldid=137959 * Ractangle * (+185) /* test topic */
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19:39:09 <esolangs> [[Conedy]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137974&oldid=131963 * Ais523 * (+8) /* Computational class */ deitalicise parentheses
19:54:20 <esolangs> [[Brainhook]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137975&oldid=137958 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+110) Categories
19:54:38 <esolangs> [[Brainhook]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137976&oldid=137975 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+23) Categories
19:56:38 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137977&oldid=137953 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+50) Categories
19:56:55 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137978&oldid=137977 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+0) /* External resources */ Fix typo
19:59:42 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137979&oldid=136775 * Ractangle * (+60) /* Commands */
20:02:07 <esolangs> [[Varnand]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137980&oldid=64536 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+49) Categories
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20:07:46 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137981&oldid=137979 * Ractangle * (+134) /* Examples */
20:10:34 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137982&oldid=137981 * Ractangle * (+27) /* Truth-machine */
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20:24:47 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137983&oldid=137968 * Tommyaweosme * (+321)
20:43:14 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Netfri * New user account
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22:31:51 <zzo38> If you call a triangle a dodecagon, is it equilateral?
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22:49:10 <esolangs> [[Empty]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137984&oldid=137511 * Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff * (+2) /* Hello, World! */
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22:56:08 <esolangs> [[Empty]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137985&oldid=137984 * Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff * (+63)
22:59:09 <esolangs> [[Talk:Nopfunge]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137986 * Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff * (+28) Created page with "in[[finite-state automaton]]"
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00:06:43 <esolangs> [[Bit~]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137987&oldid=83006 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+23) Category
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00:27:16 <zzo38> I think that you should still continue to make up the standard organization. I also think that there can be the classification of e.g. programming languages, mathematics, character sets, file formats, electrical wiring, protocols, documents which are made as jokes, etc. I also think that a discussion can be made up, perhaps with IRC and NNTP. Furthermore, make it fully public domain.
00:27:44 <zzo38> Many people in this IRC can be included, but also possibly some other people such as Knuth and Tom7.
00:28:35 <zzo38> Furthermore: "The sad fact of the matter is that people play politics with standards to gain commercial advantage, and the result is that end users suffer the consequences. This is the case with character encoding for computer systems, and it is even more the case with HDTV." Therefore, these standards should be made to mitigate this things, by making different standards for character codes and televisions.
01:25:27 <esolangs> [[NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137988 * Tommyaweosme * (+360) Created page with "NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine is a derivative of NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a
01:34:09 <esolangs> [[Braincraft]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137989 * Tommyaweosme * (+1203) Created page with "{{lowercase}}braincraft is brainfuck but updates happen like minecraft. == updates == === 1.0 - barebones === the additions for 1.0 are: + increments the cell under pointer by 1 - decrements the cell under pointer by 1 x squares the cell under pointer [ jump
01:37:55 <esolangs> [[Braincraft]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137990&oldid=137989 * Tommyaweosme * (+655)
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05:51:12 <esolangs> [[Turmin]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137991&oldid=136878 * Ttulka * (+568) add Extensions
06:55:55 <esolangs> [[Talk:Fortran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137992&oldid=137972 * PkmnQ * (+163)
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09:58:40 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Faustify * New user account
10:03:31 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137993&oldid=137950 * Faustify * (+222) /* Introductions */
10:36:47 <esolangs> [[Blues++]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=137994 * Faustify * (+1299) Created Blues++
10:37:17 <esolangs> [[Blues++]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137995&oldid=137994 * Faustify * (-45) Removed incorrect link
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11:40:25 <esolangs> [[Polytran]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137996&oldid=60977 * None1 * (-8)
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12:16:11 <wWwwW> hey korvo idk if u here but ill resend the link: https://hackmd.io/@idkleftoutsidekkk/ryM0QbI3C
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12:47:21 <esolangs> [[Talk:Yayimhere-like esolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137997&oldid=137389 * Yayimhere * (+3)
12:47:29 <esolangs> [[Talk:Yayimhere-like esolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137998&oldid=137997 * Yayimhere * (+1)
13:11:27 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=137999&oldid=137983 * PrySigneToFry * (+868)
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13:16:37 <esolangs> [[Talk:Emoji-gramming]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138000&oldid=133850 * PrySigneToFry * (+582) /* Multiplication, Division and Modulo */ new section
13:16:54 <esolangs> [[Talk:Emoji-gramming]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138001&oldid=138000 * PrySigneToFry * (-1)
13:18:17 <esolangs> [[Talk:Emoji-gramming]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138002&oldid=138001 * PrySigneToFry * (-4)
13:23:24 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138003&oldid=137826 * PrySigneToFry * (+767) /* A suggestion for Translated Shakespeare */ new section
13:23:37 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138004&oldid=137999 * None1 * (+529) /* inbox */
13:25:27 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138005&oldid=138004 * None1 * (+34) /* inbox */
13:27:27 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138006&oldid=138003 * None1 * (+204) /* A suggestion for Translated Shakespeare */
13:28:08 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138007&oldid=138005 * PrySigneToFry * (+691)
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13:36:13 <esolangs> [[Drive-In Window]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138008&oldid=126057 * None1 * (+26) Pseudonatural category
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13:45:26 <esolangs> [[Translated Drive-In Window]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138009 * None1 * (+1619) Created page with "'''Translated Drive-In Window''' is an esolang invented by [[User:None1]]. It is [[Drive-In Window]] but horribly translated. 1. Program <pre> Hi, welcome to Spill_The_Beans. Here is a menu. Vodka: $50 Here are your sides. Truth Serum: $2 May I tak
13:45:40 <esolangs> [[Windows]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138010 * PrySigneToFry * (+1281) Created page with "'''Windows''' or ''''''(aka '''swodniW''') is an esolang inspierd by [['xxx' is not recognized as an internal or external command, operable program or batch file.|dmc]], [[bash: foo: No such file or directory|hasB]], foo : The term 'foo' is not recognized as the n
13:46:59 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138011&oldid=137896 * PrySigneToFry * (+156)
13:47:12 <wWwwW> aaaa i cant stop thinking about a consistency checking esolang. i have some ideas tho...
13:47:29 <wWwwW> also if i make it ill make the syntax uiua style syntax
13:47:55 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138012&oldid=138011 * None1 * (+86) /* Horribly translated variants */
13:49:08 <esolangs> [[Translated Drive-In Window]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138013&oldid=138009 * None1 * (+21)
13:50:30 <esolangs> [[Windows]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138014&oldid=138010 * PrySigneToFry * (+65)
13:51:49 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138015&oldid=137897 * None1 * (+86)
13:52:39 <esolangs> [[Windows]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138016&oldid=138014 * PrySigneToFry * (-1)
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13:58:13 <esolangs> [[Translated Drive-In Window]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138017&oldid=138013 * None1 * (-39)
14:30:30 <esolangs> [[Blues++]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138018&oldid=137995 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+45) Stub, Wikipedia links, categories
14:32:39 -!- Sgeo has joined.
14:33:25 <esolangs> [[Braincraft]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138019&oldid=137990 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+139) Categories
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16:19:44 <esolangs> [[Collabi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138020&oldid=135460 * HammyHammerhead * (+636) ADDED LOTS OF COMMANDS
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16:44:33 <wWwwW> where there a log of today?
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17:03:44 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138021&oldid=138007 * Unname4798 * (-2694) remove non-English texts
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17:10:10 <esolangs> [[Poetic.BCT]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138022 * Unname4798 * (+388) Created page with "Poetic.BCT is a language made by Unname4798 and a member of the [[Poetic]] family. == Commands == This language encodes the word length mod 2 as commands. Alphabetic characters are in the word, other characters act as delimiters. All commands are the same as in [[
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17:13:06 <esolangs> [[User:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138023&oldid=137450 * Unname4798 * (+34)
17:13:34 <esolangs> [[User:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138024&oldid=138023 * Unname4798 * (+35)
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17:32:10 <esolangs> [[Wiki/pedia/.org]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138025 * Yayimhere * (+522) Created page with "'''Wiki/pedia/.org'''(pronounced '''Wikipedia dot org''') is a esolang created by [[User:Yayimhere]] based on the [[Wikipedia:Getting to Philosophy|Philosophy Game]] == semantics / syntax == the program structure: / wikipedia page name(in 19.30, 5. september 2
17:32:30 <wWwwW> ^^what do you think of dis esolang?
17:34:53 <esolangs> [[Wiki/pedia/.org]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138026&oldid=138025 * Yayimhere * (+40)
17:35:02 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138027&oldid=137831 * Yayimhere * (+22)
17:35:09 <esolangs> [[Wiki/pedia/.org]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138028&oldid=138026 * Yayimhere * (-30)
17:44:57 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138029&oldid=137982 * Ractangle * (+2) /* Truth-machine */
17:47:34 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138030&oldid=138029 * Ractangle * (+11) /* Commands */
17:51:46 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138031&oldid=137505 * Ractangle * (+147) /* Karma */
17:53:58 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138032&oldid=138030 * Ractangle * (+44) /* Commands */
17:54:59 <esolangs> [[Wiki/pedia/.org]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138033&oldid=138028 * Yayimhere * (+52)
17:56:16 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138034&oldid=138032 * Ractangle * (+1) /* Truth-machine */
17:58:19 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138035&oldid=138031 * Ractangle * (+1) /* Kava */
17:59:26 <esolangs> [[Kava]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138036&oldid=138034 * Ractangle * (+54) /* Commands */
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18:27:23 <esolangs> [[Collabi]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138037&oldid=138020 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+25) /* Examples */ Category
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19:56:58 <esolangs> [[Talk:Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138038&oldid=137598 * Ractangle * (+178)
19:58:04 <esolangs> [[Talk:Undelta]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138039&oldid=138038 * Ractangle * (+0)
19:58:21 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move_redir * Ractangle * moved [[Undelta]] to [[]] over redirect
19:58:21 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[Talk:Undelta]] to [[Talk:]]
19:58:21 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/delete]] delete_redir * Ractangle * Ractangle deleted redirect [[]] by overwriting: Deleted to make way for move from "[[Undelta]]"
19:58:35 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138044&oldid=138040 * Ractangle * (-47)
20:00:44 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138045&oldid=138044 * Ractangle * (+57)
20:01:26 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138046&oldid=138042 * Ractangle * (+47)
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20:19:33 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138047&oldid=138021 * Tommyaweosme * (+2694) stop pls
20:22:20 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138048&oldid=138047 * Tommyaweosme * (+263)
20:22:38 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138049&oldid=138048 * Tommyaweosme * (+0)
20:25:26 <esolangs> [[Spaghetti]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138050&oldid=65416 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+18) Wayback
20:53:38 <esolangs> [[Cat (Language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138051&oldid=131295 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+51) Categories
20:54:13 <esolangs> [[Cat]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138052&oldid=131298 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-10) Reword
20:58:38 <esolangs> [[Cat]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138053&oldid=138052 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-82) Hundreds of pages link to Cat instead of Cat program, so a redirect makes more sense
20:58:53 <esolangs> [[Cat program]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138054&oldid=113902 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+15) Distinguish confusion
21:00:41 <esolangs> [[Cat (Language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138055&oldid=138051 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+49) Distinguish confusion
21:01:22 <esolangs> [[Cat Program (language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138056&oldid=134838 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+15) Distinguish confusion
21:08:45 <esolangs> [[Braincraft]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138057&oldid=138019 * Tommyaweosme * (+1878)
21:10:08 <esolangs> [[Braincraft]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138058&oldid=138057 * Tommyaweosme * (+48) /* 1.0-current */
21:11:34 <esolangs> [[Braincraft]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138059&oldid=138058 * Tommyaweosme * (+22) /* number */
21:11:46 <esolangs> [[Braincraft]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138060&oldid=138059 * Tommyaweosme * (+1) /* 1.4 */
21:15:10 <esolangs> [[Talk:Fortran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138061&oldid=137992 * Tommyaweosme * (+170)
21:17:32 <esolangs> [[Wiki/pedia/.org]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138062&oldid=138033 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+33) Stub, category
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01:55:55 <esolangs> [[User:DGCK81LNN]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138063&oldid=81117 * DGCK81LNN * (+23340)
01:58:53 <esolangs> [[Wenyan]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138064&oldid=136870 * DGCK81LNN * (-489) /* Interpreter */
02:00:53 <esolangs> [[Wenyan]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138065&oldid=138064 * DGCK81LNN * (+74) /* (Nope.) Interpreter */
02:13:11 <esolangs> [[User:DGCK81LNN]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138066&oldid=138063 * DGCK81LNN * (-6) /* RBF*ck */
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02:54:24 <korvo> I'm about to add the URL https://concatenative.org/wiki/view/Cat to a page. fizzie, would you please consider adding this to the interwiki list? I figure that they are potential friends, and I know some of them are alright folks.
02:55:26 <ais523> I'm not sure how much we even use the interwiki list – there are a few uses of wikipedia: but I think consensus is for the prefix to be visible
02:57:49 <ais523> the external link might be more useful even if the internal link is added to the list? it isn't obvious to me that "concatenative:Cat" (internal link) is more useful than "Cat at concatenative.org" (external link) for readers
02:57:53 <korvo> I dimly remember fizzie adding something for me, likely the Lojban wiki. I just thought it'd be a neighborly thing, that's all.
02:58:26 <ais523> I have no objections to it being on the list, just don't think the change would do anything
02:59:04 <ais523> (also, what is that wiki's name? it has a URL but doesn't appear to have a visible name anywhere, e.g. the homepage title is "Front Page")
02:59:16 <esolangs> [[User:TheCanon2]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138067&oldid=136047 * TheCanon2 * (+12)
02:59:31 <ais523> (also, I wonder whether I should add Underload)
02:59:41 <esolangs> [[Cat (Language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138068&oldid=138055 * Corbin * (+109) Link to the other Cat. No opinion on how our top-level namespace should accommodate its existence.
03:00:24 <korvo> I think it's called "the concatenative languages wiki". I guess I should start idling in their channel again.
03:02:12 <ais523> cat(1) can also be interpreted as a programming language (https://esolangs.org/wiki/Text)
03:02:27 <ais523> so that's three languages which could plausibly be called "cat"
03:02:44 * ais523 vaguely wonders how many plausible extensions you need to add to cat(1) to make it Turing-complete
03:04:06 <ais523> I did once find a denial-of-service bug in xterm where you could cat a particular sequence of bytes into the terminal and it would enter an infinite loop – does that make Text non-total? (I reported it, and it's been fixed for ages)
03:09:38 <korvo> I've asked in #concatenative. Once I get a response, I'll edit that page and I suppose add see-alsos for a few overlapping langs too.
03:12:40 <ais523> now I am wondering whether Jelly is concatenative (assuming you ignore the rules for disambiguating ambiguous syntax, which take the entire line into account)
03:13:04 <ais523> it makes me think that there's a continuous range between fully concatenative and fully applicative, and Jelly is on the "mostly concatenative" location
03:15:07 <ais523> I guess the thing that makes it not fully concatenative is that if a function has two arguments, you can't split the function from its adjacent argument, but you can split the function-argument pair from everything else
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03:21:42 <esolangs> [[Cat (Language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138069&oldid=138068 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+1) :
03:27:59 <korvo> The way I think of it is that a language is generalized-concatenative if it's got a syntactic monoid, and the classical definition is when the monoid has "" as unit.
03:29:53 <korvo> Or " " for some of them. Or maybe "\n" for sanity. And etc. It's become looser over time, but ISTR that something Cammy-shaped wouldn't ever fly because bracketing is an unacceptable complexity.
03:30:21 <ais523> Jelly does have that (if you allow for its idiosyncratic way of showing precedence) but you can't split just anywhere
03:31:21 <ais523> and in particular it doesn't seem to have or simulate a stack
03:31:48 <ais523> (except for the call stack)
03:39:29 <korvo> Oh, yeah. Most concatenative languages don't allow splitting; that's something else entirely. Like, Forth doesn't allow splitting because of the interpreter/compiler modes.
03:39:37 <korvo> To say nothing of ." quotation "
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05:08:16 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Rhythm game statistics * New user account
05:11:43 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138070&oldid=137993 * Rhythm game statistics * (+175)
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07:55:04 <esolangs> [[WISC]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138071&oldid=122878 * Ractangle * (+5) the image is too big
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09:00:37 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138072&oldid=138045 * Ractangle * (+3) /* Syntax */
09:01:04 <esolangs> [[]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138073&oldid=138072 * Ractangle * (+1) /* Syntax */
09:04:27 <esolangs> [[Yayimhere-like esolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138074&oldid=137381 * Ractangle * (+170) /* examples */
09:13:02 <esolangs> [[Yayimhere-like esolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138075&oldid=138074 * Ractangle * (+104) /* syntax */
09:15:53 <esolangs> [[Yayimhere-like esolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138076&oldid=138075 * Ractangle * (-7) /* syntax */
09:18:50 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138077&oldid=138027 * Ractangle * (+16)
09:19:36 <fizzie> I'll just enable the Interwiki extension, that'll allow any sysop to edit the list + I don't have to run raw SQL insert statements. Looks like it comes bundled in the standard distribution nowadays.
09:19:53 <fizzie> (Sometime later today, currently at the dentist.)
09:20:43 <esolangs> [[User:DGCK81LNN/vector-2022.js]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138078 * DGCK81LNN * (+100) Created page with "$( "meta[name=viewport]" ).attr( "content", "width=device-width, initial-scale=1, minimum-scale=1" )"
09:21:37 <fizzie> You know how people always refer to things disparagingly as "Big X", like there's Big Oil and Big Pharma and so on? I wonder if there's a group of people who believe a cabal of dentists is manipulating people, would that get called Big Tooth?
09:23:11 <fizzie> Anthropogenic teeth decay is just a lie from Big Tooth.
09:24:57 <esolangs> [[Poetic.BCT]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138079&oldid=138022 * None1 * (-20)
09:25:15 <esolangs> [[User:DGCK81LNN/common.css]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138080 * DGCK81LNN * (+27) Created page with "pre { overflow-x: auto; }"
09:28:06 <esolangs> [[User:DGCK81LNN]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138081&oldid=138066 * DGCK81LNN * (-11003) fix wrong version of jvavscript brainfuck interpreter code
09:30:49 <esolangs> [[User:DGCK81LNN]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138082&oldid=138081 * DGCK81LNN * (+38) /* JvavScript */
09:33:51 <esolangs> [[Caca]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138083&oldid=129403 * Ractangle * (+50) /* Trivia */
09:42:40 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138084&oldid=138049 * None1 * (+455)
10:00:22 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Unname4798 * moved [[Poetic]] to [[Poetic (family)]]
10:00:33 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Unname4798 * moved [[Poetic (family)]] to [[Poetic (esolang)]]
10:01:52 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138089&oldid=138088 * Unname4798 * (-30) Blanked the page
10:03:06 <esolangs> [[Poetic]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138090&oldid=138086 * Unname4798 * (+77) Removed redirect to [[Poetic (family)]]
10:05:06 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138091&oldid=138089 * Unname4798 * (+169)
10:05:37 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138092&oldid=138091 * Unname4798 * (+0)
10:06:00 <esolangs> [[Poetic.BCT]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138093&oldid=138079 * Unname4798 * (+0)
10:06:15 <esolangs> [[Poetic.BCT]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138094&oldid=138093 * Unname4798 * (+16)
10:06:54 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138095&oldid=138092 * Unname4798 * (+64)
10:07:01 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138096&oldid=138095 * Unname4798 * (+1)
10:07:11 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138097&oldid=138096 * Unname4798 * (+1)
10:07:35 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138098&oldid=138097 * Unname4798 * (+17)
10:08:02 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138099&oldid=138098 * Unname4798 * (+29)
10:08:15 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138100&oldid=138099 * Unname4798 * (+3)
10:08:55 <esolangs> [[Poetic]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138101&oldid=138090 * Unname4798 * (+0)
10:09:04 <esolangs> [[Poetic]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138102&oldid=138101 * Unname4798 * (+0)
10:09:13 <esolangs> [[Poetic]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138103&oldid=138102 * Unname4798 * (+1)
10:13:53 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138104&oldid=138084 * Unname4798 * (-3412) None1 was right
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10:34:07 <wib_jonas> fizzie: https://www.xkcd.com/2130/
10:52:46 <esolangs> [[Empty Program]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138105&oldid=136457 * Ractangle * (+10)
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10:59:42 <vms14> here is where the weirdest ideas come true
11:00:11 <esolangs> [[Comments]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138106 * Ractangle * (+184) Created page with "{{stub}} '''Comments''' are a part of a programme to explain something either a part of code or something else This page is going to talk about on how do you make comments in esolangs"
11:09:43 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138107&oldid=138106 * None1 * (+447)
11:11:43 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138108&oldid=138107 * None1 * (+256)
11:11:56 <esolangs> [[Comments]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138109&oldid=138108 * None1 * (+1) /* Languages with halting instructions */
11:12:19 <esolangs> [[Comments]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138110&oldid=138109 * None1 * (+23) /* Languages with halting instructions */
11:12:36 <esolangs> [[Comments]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138111&oldid=138110 * None1 * (+30) /* Languages with halting instructions */
11:13:30 <esolangs> [[Comments]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138112&oldid=138111 * None1 * (+0)
11:30:41 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * UrnEn * New user account
11:37:19 <esolangs> [[Never Gonna Give You Up]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138113&oldid=128882 * None1 * (+156) /* External resources */
11:44:36 <esolangs> [[]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138114&oldid=137639 * PrySigneToFry * (+34)
11:46:10 <esolangs> [[]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138115&oldid=138114 * PrySigneToFry * (-10)
11:47:04 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138116&oldid=138112 * Ractangle * (-77)
11:53:25 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138117&oldid=138116 * Ractangle * (+127) /* Befunge */
11:55:19 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138118&oldid=138117 * Ractangle * (+34) /* Python */
11:58:49 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138119&oldid=138118 * Ractangle * (-2)
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12:16:27 <esolangs> [[User:GUAqwq]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138120&oldid=137251 * GUAqwq * (+14)
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12:46:28 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138121&oldid=138119 * Ractangle * (+20)
12:48:07 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138122&oldid=138121 * Ractangle * (+19)
12:51:28 <esolangs> [[Talk:Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138123&oldid=115903 * Ractangle * (+12)
12:56:55 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138124&oldid=135855 * Ractangle * (-113) /* Python interpreters */
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13:14:38 <esolangs> [[Truth-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138125&oldid=138035 * Yayimhere * (+5) /* ZOMBIE */ added link
13:16:11 <esolangs> [[Talk:Wierd Machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138126&oldid=136272 * Yayimhere * (+30) /* turth machine */
13:19:05 <esolangs> [[Wierd Machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138127&oldid=54543 * Yayimhere * (+22) /* Truth-machine */ its not the shortest truth machine)
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14:03:16 <esolangs> [[User:GUAqwq/TCproof to Lambda calculus]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138128 * GUAqwq * (+2557) Created page with "One of my friend doubted whether ''lambda-calculus'' is ''Turing complete''.So I proved it. Here's my solution: == Recursion == Y := \f.(\x.f(x x))(\x.f(x x)) =><code>Y f = f(Y f)</code> == Boolean == True := \x y.x False := \x y.y N
14:04:05 <esolangs> [[User:GUAqwq]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138129&oldid=138120 * GUAqwq * (+70) /* Articles */
14:11:58 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138130&oldid=138070 * UrnEn * (+154) /* Introductions */
14:14:23 <esolangs> [[User:GUAqwq/TCproof to Lambda calculus]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138131&oldid=138128 * Yayimhere * (+41) added the lambdas
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14:32:10 <esolangs> [[Poetic (family)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138132&oldid=138100 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-5) Convert to list
14:32:35 <esolangs> [[Poetic]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138133&oldid=138103 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-4) Convert to list
14:39:17 <esolangs> [[Poetic.BCT]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138134&oldid=138094 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+211) Converter, category
14:52:17 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138135&oldid=137760 * Ractangle * (-90)
14:52:34 <esolangs> [[Nope. with no quine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138136&oldid=138135 * Ractangle * (-110) /* Cheating quine */
15:01:20 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138137&oldid=138122 * Ractangle * (+253) /* Python */
15:07:03 <esolangs> [[Windows]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138138&oldid=138016 * PrySigneToFry * (+0)
15:10:22 <esolangs> [[Try]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138139 * Yourusername * (+180) Created page with "Try is a esolang where you write esolang specs to code == Commands == [name] is a esolang where you [val] : set name to value <nowiki>== [Topic] ==</nowiki> : define a proceedure"
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15:18:53 <esolangs> [[Translated ORK/PSTF Again3]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138140 * PrySigneToFry * (+762) Created page with "ORK: Are you going crazy? {{PSTF's Version|PSTF Origin|[[Translated ORK/PSTF Again2]]}} 1. "PrOgRaM" <pre> their legs difficulty difficulty difficulty "Room" is a joke. Sadiraki Sara Sarachio's Luvanou It's a bit confusing. Orbis Repanos Pasciu
15:20:02 <wWwwW> i have a question to all of you. is the infinite loop a looping counter?: https://esolangs.org/wiki/Bijection
15:20:44 <esolangs> [[Translated ORK/PSTF Again2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138141&oldid=137772 * PrySigneToFry * (+74)
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15:27:31 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138142&oldid=137821 * PrySigneToFry * (+329)
15:28:17 <ais523> wWwwW: I don't see how the "infinite loop" example is actually a loop – doesn't it become "{{}0}0" but with the instruction pointer at the end of the command?
15:28:47 <wWwwW> i need to specify that it runs whats inside
15:29:02 <ais523> ah, that makes more sense
15:29:06 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138143&oldid=136694 * Yayimhere * (+31)
15:29:10 <esolangs> [[Comments]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138144&oldid=138137 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+496) Copyediting, category
15:29:19 <ais523> so {}n appends a copy of line n to what's inside the brackets, and then runs what's inside the brackets
15:29:49 <esolangs> [[Comments]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138145&oldid=138144 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-254) /* CLFCE */ Remove duplicate section
15:30:32 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138146&oldid=138142 * PrySigneToFry * (+442)
15:30:43 <wWwwW> so it would be a looping counter right?
15:31:07 <ais523> I'm trying to work out how to get the exact triangle shape that's required
15:31:31 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138147&oldid=138146 * PrySigneToFry * (+31)
15:31:34 <ais523> the {}0 program isn't a looping counter because it grows exponentially, not triangularly
15:31:57 <wWwwW> doesnt it still proove it has more power than a LBA?
15:32:34 <ais523> it probably does, but it doesn't prove it because it doesn't prove there's a way to actually read the data that's being stored
15:33:01 <wWwwW> but if it has to read data as a rule then. it would right?
15:33:07 <ais523> and in this sort of language, finding a way to read data is often harder to find a way to write it
15:33:55 <ais523> I would encourage you to leave the language the same, it's interesting as it is – or maybe change "append" to "prepend", that might be necessary to make control flow possible
15:34:18 <ais523> imagine a program like {{}0}1 \n x
15:34:19 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138148&oldid=138143 * Yayimhere * (+1)
15:34:49 <wWwwW> my brain is proccesing that
15:35:57 <ais523> oh, I just realised this language doesn't have any sort of goto, so the only line that actually changes is the first one (until it finishes running), meaning that any TCness has to come from just a single line
15:36:11 <ais523> which might well be possible but it reduces the chance a bit
15:36:26 <wWwwW> unless you do concurrency
15:36:34 <wWwwW> or only run the first line then the second so on
15:36:39 <wWwwW> then reruns until it halts
15:38:28 <ais523> hmm, an implicit loop is also possible
15:38:49 <ais523> no, I mean, what you were talking about is an implicit loop
15:38:54 <ais523> where the program starts again after reaching the end
15:39:52 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138149&oldid=138148 * Yayimhere * (+126)
15:40:33 <esolangs> [[User:PrySigneToFry/Sandbox/TEST3]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138150 * PrySigneToFry * (+1226) Created page with "[[User:PrySigneToFry|<span style="color:blue;background:yellow;"></span>]][[User talk:PrySigneToFry|<span style="color:aqua;background:red;"></span>]][[Special:Contributions/PrySigneToFry|<span style="color:red;background:aqua;"></span>]][
15:41:13 <esolangs> [[User:PrySigneToFry/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138151&oldid=136944 * PrySigneToFry * (+45)
15:45:25 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138152&oldid=137109 * PrySigneToFry * (+609) /* */ new section
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16:14:20 <wWwwW> i spesified some more
16:14:59 <ais523> I don't think "no changes happen" is even possible, is it?
16:15:21 <ais523> unless all the commands refer to blank lines, and if the program doesn't start in that state it can never reach that state
16:15:28 <wWwwW> what should i do to the halts
16:15:50 <ais523> I think, with a language like this, you should probably just resign yourself to it running indefinitely, and let people define their own halt state to prove TCness
16:16:09 <ais523> and when there is a proof that "it would be TC if behaviour X was treated as a halt", then you can add the halt to the language
16:17:27 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138153&oldid=138149 * Yayimhere * (-25)
16:19:34 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138154&oldid=138153 * Yayimhere * (+42) /* examples */
16:20:16 <wWwwW> now do you think a looping counter is possible?
16:21:27 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138155&oldid=138154 * Yayimhere * (+27)
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16:27:42 <ais523> wWwwW: yes, {}1 \n (print *) \n (print \n) would be a looping counter in that version of the language (apart from the first line), if it had a print statement
16:28:48 <wWwwW> wouldnt it just work anyway
16:31:01 <ais523> but having the print statements makes it easier to describe
16:31:32 <wWwwW> ig you would include it
16:31:42 <wWwwW> the prints are for clarity
16:34:55 <wWwwW> and if so should i give credit?
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16:40:27 <b_jonas> you can always define multiple variants of a language together on one page, like if you want the support for print statements optional.
16:55:07 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138156&oldid=137978 * DGCK81LNN * (+6578)
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17:17:51 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138157&oldid=138155 * Yayimhere * (+179)
17:18:21 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138158&oldid=138157 * Yayimhere * (+28) /* examples */
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17:20:28 <esolangs> [[Iframe]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138159&oldid=119594 * PkmnQ * (+478) Less annoying syntax for when I implement this
17:27:53 -!- m5zs7k_ has changed nick to m5zs7k.
17:28:47 <esolangs> [[Nope]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138160&oldid=137037 * Yayimhere * (+1)
17:35:06 <esolangs> [[WhatLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138161&oldid=138156 * DGCK81LNN * (+1664)
17:37:32 <esolangs> [[Assembolge]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138162&oldid=137935 * Ractangle * (+175)
18:05:32 <esolangs> [[Ridewith]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138163 * Yayimhere * (+787) Created page with "'''Ridewith''' is a esolang created by [[User:Yayimhere]] for creating ascii art == memory == memory is a grid(infinite) with a pointer starting at <code>(0, 0)</code>. the places the pointer goes are drawn on == syntax == there is dis syntax: ''start direction'' (
18:06:28 <wWwwW> i made dat horrible thing^
18:07:49 <esolangs> [[Ridewith]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138164&oldid=138163 * Yayimhere * (+4)
18:11:24 <esolangs> [[Ridewith]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138165&oldid=138164 * Yayimhere * (+24)
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18:53:18 <esolangs> [[Enwokenment]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138166 * Hakerh400 * (+1678) +[[Enwokenment]]
18:53:47 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138167&oldid=137925 * Hakerh400 * (+18) +[[Enwokenment]]
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18:53:59 <esolangs> [[User:Hakerh400]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138168&oldid=137204 * Hakerh400 * (+18) +[[Enwokenment]]
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19:28:03 <esolangs> [[Enwokenment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138169&oldid=138166 * Ais523 * (+985) explain why this is TC (it has the category already)
19:28:17 <esolangs> [[FRACTRAN]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138170 * Ais523 * (+22) caps redirect
19:29:02 <ais523> wWwwW: I'm not sure I'm in the right frame of mind for looking at esolangs right now
19:33:02 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138171&oldid=138145 * Ractangle * (+73)
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19:35:52 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138172&oldid=137890 * Ractangle * (+20) /* Other things */
19:36:21 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138173&oldid=138172 * Ractangle * (-17) /* Other things */
19:38:20 <esolangs> [[Enwokenment]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138174&oldid=138169 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+0) Fix year
19:39:38 <esolangs> [[Ridewith]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138175&oldid=138165 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+23) Category
19:40:54 <esolangs> [[Try]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138176&oldid=138139 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+33) Stub, category
19:54:59 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138177&oldid=138158 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+51) Categories
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20:18:21 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138178&oldid=138104 * Tommyaweosme * (+3595)
20:23:29 <esolangs> [[Opal]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138179&oldid=137936 * Ractangle * (+72)
20:34:44 <esolangs> [[4ME]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138180&oldid=137011 * Ractangle * (-9)
20:36:33 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138181&oldid=136368 * Ractangle * (+1) /* Looping counter */
20:37:41 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138182&oldid=138181 * Ractangle * (+31)
20:41:16 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138183&oldid=138182 * Ractangle * (+23) /* Looping counter */
20:42:44 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138184&oldid=138183 * Ractangle * (+31) /* Infinite loop */
20:43:08 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138185&oldid=138184 * Ractangle * (+4) /* Infinite loop */
20:44:27 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138186&oldid=138185 * Ractangle * (+32) /* Truth-machine */
20:45:18 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138187&oldid=138186 * Ractangle * (+11) /* Looping counter */
20:46:36 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138188&oldid=138187 * Ractangle * (+35) /* Deadfish implementation */
20:46:56 <esolangs> [[G Sharp]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138189&oldid=138188 * Ractangle * (+0) /* Looping counter */
20:47:59 <esolangs> [[Deadfish/Implementations (nonalphabetic and A-L)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138190&oldid=136830 * Ractangle * (+20) /* G# */
20:49:29 <esolangs> [[Deadfish with gotos and input]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138191&oldid=137862 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+1065) Interpreter, see also, categories
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23:03:22 <zzo38> Currently in a mahjong program I have: typedef struct { char*name; uint16_t value; } Name; it is used with tsearch. However, this requires two allocations and some extra space for the pointer, and it might be better to instead: typedef struct { uint16_t value; char name[0]; } Name;
23:05:23 <zzo38> The search key in this program will always be the same static buffer, so it could use some otherwise unused address to denote that, or to subtract sizeof(uint16_t) from the address of that buffer and somehow force the compiler to make that work (being valid if used in this way and not null).
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00:09:31 <esolangs> [[Comments]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138192&oldid=138171 * None1 * (+165) /* brainfuck */
00:10:29 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * None1 * moved [[Comments]] to [[Comment]]: Should be singular
00:10:29 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * None1 * moved [[Talk:Comments]] to [[Talk:Comment]]: Should be singular
00:11:34 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138197&oldid=138193 * None1 * (+55)
00:11:53 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck algorithms]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138198&oldid=132457 * None1 * (+4) /* Header comment */
00:17:27 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138199&oldid=138197 * None1 * (+92)
00:20:45 <esolangs> [[NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138200&oldid=137988 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+155) Link, categories
00:21:11 <esolangs> [[NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138201&oldid=138200 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+28) Category
00:22:16 <esolangs> [[NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138202&oldid=137477 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+117) See also
00:56:40 <esolangs> [[+-)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138203&oldid=122375 * None1 * (+219)
01:06:16 <esolangs> [[Talk:Bfos]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138204&oldid=113882 * None1 * (+311)
01:07:55 <esolangs> [[NameError without a quine with a quine without a quine with a quine without a quine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138205&oldid=138202 * None1 * (+113) /* See also */
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01:31:09 <Sgeo> What CPUs have emulation modes? x86 architecture is infamous for that, 65816 has an emulation mode for 6502 (or some variation I think)
01:36:48 <esolangs> [[Trilangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138206&oldid=112452 * Bbrk24 * (-111) Trilangle can interpret Qdeql
01:40:25 <fizzie> The eZ80 has a "classic Z80" mode, I think. (Quite different from the native "ADL mode" in which the 16-bit register become 24-bit ones.)
01:44:29 <fizzie> Not sure if ARM's 32-bit execution state on AArch64 counts, maybe.
02:58:18 <esolangs> [[Talk:Velato]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138207&oldid=31126 * None1 * (+126) /* Music images */ new section
02:58:24 <esolangs> [[Talk:Velato]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138208&oldid=138207 * None1 * (+235) /* Music images */
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03:36:35 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138209&oldid=138152 * PrySigneToFry * (+106)
03:39:22 <esolangs> [[Template:OLoP]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138210 * PrySigneToFry * (+105) Created page with ":''This page is written by the language {{{1}}}, and the version of language {{{2}}} is at [[{{{3}}}]].''"
03:39:45 <esolangs> [[Enwokenment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138211&oldid=138174 * Hakerh400 * (+6)
03:39:57 <esolangs> [[/English version]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138212&oldid=137758 * PrySigneToFry * (-19)
03:41:25 <esolangs> [[]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138213&oldid=138115 * PrySigneToFry * (+77)
03:45:39 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138214&oldid=138147 * PrySigneToFry * (+79)
03:52:51 <esolangs> [[Translated Shakespeare/PSTF]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138215 * PrySigneToFry * (+4973) Created page with "1. Program <pre> The Infamous Hello World Program. Romeo, a young man with a remarkable patience. Juliet, a likewise young woman of remarkable grace. Ophelia, a remarkable woman much in dispute with Hamlet. Hamlet, the flatterer of Andersen In
03:54:13 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138216&oldid=138006 * PrySigneToFry * (+524)
03:55:31 <esolangs> [[Translated Shakespeare/PSTF]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138217&oldid=138215 * PrySigneToFry * (+8)
03:59:02 <esolangs> [[User:PrySigneToFry/My Decimal Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138218 * PrySigneToFry * (+1091) Created page with "It calls "The PSTF constant" and its symbol is . 2.561765029376982639476905739572392398749348647654346788698569836928685656575656559200198249263159047584721586234075946897315867407907847846941795720456298375091247679407723064907438724
04:00:08 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138219&oldid=138214 * PrySigneToFry * (+114)
04:04:56 <esolangs> [[User talk:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138220&oldid=136579 * PrySigneToFry * (+588) /* Translate it even scarier if thouyou want. */ new section
04:19:55 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138221&oldid=137969 * YufangTSTSU * (+162) /* Any account on other platforms? */
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05:22:40 <esolangs> [[Why tho]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138222&oldid=135934 * Yayimhere * (+63)
05:30:50 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138223&oldid=138177 * Yayimhere * (+122)
05:32:46 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138224&oldid=138223 * Yayimhere * (+105)
05:36:11 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Unknown computational class]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138225 * Yayimhere * (+266) Created page with "i think this should have a sub category for things that have a high chance of being TC and must be at least close to it. like esolangs that has a [[Looping counter]] made in it ~~~~"
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06:20:16 <esolangs> [[Kicky BCT]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138226 * Yayimhere * (+1532) Created page with "'''Kicky BCT''' is a [[Esolang]] by [[User:Yayimhere]]. its a modified version of a [[BCT]]. it comes from two things: a misunderstanding on the [[ResPlicate]] page, and the creators hate to the fact that the datastring is not represented in the program == what has
06:35:47 <esolangs> [[ResPlicate]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138227&oldid=53514 * Yayimhere * (+24) /* Counting Up From Zero (in Unary) */
06:47:09 <esolangs> [[CASTLE]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138228&oldid=92236 * Yayimhere * (-33) /* Examples */ Circute is on wiki
06:48:49 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Yayimhere * uploaded "[[File:Kicky BCT logo.jpg]]"
06:49:18 <esolangs> [[Kicky BCT]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138230&oldid=138226 * Yayimhere * (+66)
06:50:01 <wWwwW> ^^hate of humanity confirmed^^
06:56:11 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138231&oldid=138209 * Yayimhere * (+124) /* bring back the old sandbox war */
07:04:41 <esolangs> [[FizzLang Unbounded]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138232 * Yayimhere * (+320) Created page with "'''FizzLang Unbounded''' is a simple variant of [[FizzLang]]. the original esolang was created by [[User:Mihai Popa]] and this variant is by [[User:Yayimhere]] == the change(yea there's only one) == now the: 1 -> 100 would not be there. there would just be
07:05:21 <esolangs> [[FizzLang Unbounded]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138233&oldid=138232 * Yayimhere * (-2)
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07:28:39 <esolangs> [[BFX]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138234&oldid=18220 * Ractangle * (-69)
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07:45:38 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138235&oldid=138077 * Ractangle * (+25)
07:51:58 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138236&oldid=138235 * Ractangle * (+16)
07:54:55 <esolangs> [[Kicky BCT]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138237&oldid=138230 * Yayimhere * (-844)
07:55:47 <wWwwW> i have a qeustion. souldnt a looping counter starting at ** isntead of * proove the same things right?
08:02:51 <esolangs> [[Kicky BCT]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138238&oldid=138237 * Yayimhere * (+161)
08:05:11 <esolangs> [[Kicky BCT]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138239&oldid=138238 * Yayimhere * (-36) /* random examples */
08:05:56 <esolangs> [[Kicky BCT]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138240&oldid=138239 * Yayimhere * (-16) /* what has changed? */
08:21:23 <esolangs> [[Chance]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138241&oldid=78318 * Yayimhere * (-5) needs to show the User part in user page link
08:22:14 <esolangs> [[Deadfish 2]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138242&oldid=135327 * Yayimhere * (-5) needs to show the User part in user page link
08:42:42 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138243&oldid=138221 * PrySigneToFry * (+712)
08:43:19 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138244&oldid=138243 * PrySigneToFry * (+0) Change the time post
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08:48:44 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138245 * PrySigneToFry * (+651) /* About IDE for "" */ new section
08:52:58 <esolangs> [[Talk:Hello, world!]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138246 * PrySigneToFry * (+66) Created page with "One world, one line of code. Welcome to the temple of programming."
08:59:01 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138247&oldid=138216 * PrySigneToFry * (+34)
09:00:06 <esolangs> [[User talk:None1]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138248&oldid=138220 * PrySigneToFry * (+24)
09:00:39 <esolangs> [[Translated Zhongwen]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138249 * PrySigneToFry * (+33) Redirected page to [[Translated ZhongWen]]
09:09:44 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138250&oldid=138178 * PrySigneToFry * (+923)
09:10:27 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138251&oldid=138250 * PrySigneToFry * (-14)
09:11:04 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138252&oldid=138251 * PrySigneToFry * (-12)
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09:18:56 <esolangs> [[User:PrySigneToFry/My Decimal Number]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138253&oldid=138218 * PrySigneToFry * (+29)
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10:01:51 <esolangs> [[User talk:Page crapper from explain xkcd]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138254&oldid=137635 * PrySigneToFry * (+537)
10:07:07 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138255&oldid=138252 * Unname4798 * (+892)
10:08:28 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138256&oldid=138255 * Unname4798 * (-189)
10:17:26 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry/My Decimal Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138257 * Unname4798 * (+214) Created page with "What is the formula for PSTF's number? ~~~"
10:18:11 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry/My Decimal Number]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138258&oldid=138257 * Unname4798 * (+0)
10:18:21 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry/My Decimal Number]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138259&oldid=138258 * Unname4798 * (+4)
10:38:08 <esolangs> [[List of ideas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138260&oldid=135904 * ZachChecksOutEsolangs * (+201)
10:39:08 <esolangs> [[List of ideas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138261&oldid=138260 * ZachChecksOutEsolangs * (-1)
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11:27:15 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138262&oldid=138244 * YufangTSTSU * (+129) /* Any account on other platforms? */
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12:47:52 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138263&oldid=138231 * Tommyaweosme * (+182) /* bring back the old sandbox war */
13:14:55 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Unknown computational class]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138264&oldid=138225 * Corbin * (+570) Cool idea, but probably not feasible.
13:26:56 <fizzie> Okay, https://esolangs.org/wiki/Special:Interwiki is now available for anyone to read, and for admins to modify.
13:31:16 <fizzie> I feel like there's so many links in that table, some of them must have died since then.
13:33:27 <int-e> groups.google.com still exists? :P
13:33:46 <fizzie> I'd add that aforementioned concatenative.org but I don't know if the interwiki prefix should be `cat`, `concat` or `concatenative`.
13:34:07 <fizzie> We use groups.google.com a lot internally, unsurprisingly.
13:34:09 <int-e> there's cache but no archive.org prefix... odd
13:34:25 <fizzie> (Maybe that's why the product hasn't been killed entirely?)
13:34:33 <fizzie> It's less useful now that it no longer functions as a Usenet frontend.
13:34:39 <int-e> The only thing I've ever used groups.google.com for was as an NNTP archive and I think that part is long gone.
13:35:53 <fizzie> All the entries in "My groups" at groups.google.com for my personal Gmail account are acting as ACL lists for dogfooding prerelease versions of different Google things.
13:36:26 <int-e> is there any downside to disabling forwarding for everything?
13:37:08 <int-e> (I don't mind the idea that those destinations are trusted, but I wonder what legitimate purpose these forwards really serve in the esolang context.)
13:37:51 <int-e> anyway, no real complaints
13:38:06 <int-e> also I wouldn't consider myself a heavy user of the wiki
13:38:56 <int-e> "A user with 231 edits. Account created on 27 September 2015."
13:39:11 <fizzie> You can write shorter links using the prefix, and it'd be possible to update them all at once if the destination changes their URLs, I imagine that's the primary advantage. Which is only relevant if people want to write such links and know about the feature, of course.
13:39:45 <fizzie> I'm sure we got the list from some list of defaults back when originally installing MediaWiki without thinking about it too much.
13:39:48 <int-e> But wouldn't the wiki expand them for you?
13:45:01 <fizzie> Oh, I didn't know what the "forward" column does. Yeah, the WikiMedia wikis should probably be "no" here, I don't think they're useful.
13:45:52 <fizzie> Ain't no-one going to try going to https://esolangs.org/wiki/wikipedia:Cat expecting it to work.
13:46:48 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138265&oldid=138262 * PrySigneToFry * (+659)
13:47:34 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikibooks" (https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:48:04 <fizzie> Okay, this is going to cause a bit of spam since there's no bulk edit functionality.
13:48:17 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikinews" (https://en.wikinews.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:48:39 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikipedia" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:48:49 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikiquote" (https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:49:00 * int-e pats esolangs on the head
13:49:02 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikisource" (https://wikisource.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:49:08 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikispecies" (https://species.wikimedia.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:49:13 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikiversity" (https://en.wikiversity.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:49:18 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wikt" (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:49:24 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_edit * Fizzie * Fizzie modified prefix "wiktionary" (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) in the interwiki table: disabling forwarding for WikiMedia wikis since we're not one
13:49:45 <fizzie> Think that was all of them.
13:53:04 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138266&oldid=138219 * PrySigneToFry * (+300)
13:54:58 <int-e> conway = https://conwaylife.com/wiki/$1 might be useful
13:56:55 <int-e> (inspired by https://esolangs.org/wiki/Bitgrid which links to Unit Cell there)
14:11:54 <fizzie> Hmm, but should it be `conway:` or `life:`? Despite the URL, they do call themselves LifeWiki.
14:12:24 <fizzie> There should be some kind of a mechanism where each MediaWiki wiki can declare their preferred interwiki prefix, and/or a registry of them.
14:15:15 <b_jonas_> Steo: I think ARM32 supports two or three instruction sets, as in the classic one where instructions are fixed 32 bit long, and the variable one called thumb where instructions can be 16 or 32 bits long (maybe also longer), and I think you can mix these within a process
14:15:29 -!- b_jonas_ has changed nick to b_jonas.
14:16:54 <b_jonas> x86 has this too, in theory you could mix x86_16 and x86_32 code in the same process, it's just that that's very rarely worth, about the only time it comes up is if a 32-bit DOS extender wants to call into a DOS file system driver, or a 32-bit boot loader called into old style BIOS, or some nonsense like that.
14:17:18 <b_jonas> and those ones don't even count because those call into real mode, which you *can't* mix in the same process
14:17:21 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_add * Fizzie * Fizzie added prefix "life" (https://conwaylife.com/wiki/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) to the interwiki table: add LifeWiki (conwaylife.com) since it's relevant to our interests
14:17:25 <b_jonas> you can only mix 16-bit and 32-bit protected mode
14:19:54 <b_jonas> I changed opinion about the interwiki codes and I think they should just die these days. We should just use absolute URLs for every link, and if the wiki interface wants to display them in a special way, they can recognize the URLs directly.
14:20:46 <b_jonas> both google groups and yahoo groups does exist, basically they are mailing list servers where anyone can create mailing lists, and you can use the web interface to subscribe or read the archive
14:21:02 <b_jonas> they also used to have a usenet interface, but that part may have died
14:21:32 <fizzie> There's two versions of Thumb; the plain Thumb(-1) is also fixed-length at 16 bits, the extra 32-bit instructions are a Thumb-2 thing.
14:22:03 <fizzie> ARM also had that Jazelle thing, where it can execute Java bytecode "natively".
14:22:12 <b_jonas> what? how can you have a fixed 16-bit length instruction set these days?
14:22:37 <b_jonas> I mean it's not really "these days" because now everything runs ARM64 instead
14:23:23 <int-e> b_jonas: Hmm I don't hate the prefix but the fact that they are not displayed as external links feels odd.
14:23:50 <b_jonas> but obviously on an existing wiki we can't just disable support for interwiki prefixes, and both esolang wiki and the wikimedia sites are very long-lived, so we'll have them forever,
14:24:11 <b_jonas> so what I said applies only to new wikis
14:24:30 <b_jonas> int-e: how they're formatted is kind of supposed to be orthogonal to how they're displayed though
14:24:43 <fizzie> For Sgeo's question I was really only trying to think of examples about emulating older, pre-existing architectures, for backwards (or sideways) compatibility reasons.
14:25:32 <b_jonas> fizzie: x86_16 was an established older architecture when the 386 introduced x86_32
14:25:47 <b_jonas> oh wait, there's a better example
14:26:29 <b_jonas> I think there are 16-bit 6502 extensions that have a compatibility mode that closely emulates the 6502 (or some 8-bit 6502 variant), they behave like that older CPU by default, but can be switched to the more modern mode
14:26:41 <fizzie> There's a CSS class `extiw` on interwiki links (compared to `external text` for regular external links), so if I knew what I was doing I could probably make them render the same as external links.
14:26:54 <fizzie> That's pretty similar to the Z80/eZ80 thing.
14:26:58 <b_jonas> some of them are even hardware-compatible with an existing 6502 variant as long as you keep them in compatibility mode in software, but then change how they use pins if you switch to 16-bit mode
14:28:25 <b_jonas> they need a compatibility mode because the 6502 was so popular and third-parties documented all the undocumented instructions that a lot of programs relied on what almost all undocumented behavior is (with the exception of a few instructions that just freeze the CPU), so it's hard to add new instructions; plus also they didn't just want to add new instructions but replace many of the normal ones with
14:28:31 <fizzie> Yes, Sgeo mentioned 65816 having a 6502 mode.
14:28:48 <b_jonas> plus they can just run existing 8-bit 6502 software that way
14:29:48 <esolangs> [[*bfuck]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138267 * ChuckEsoteric08 * (+914) Created page with "'''*bfuck''' is an esolang by [[User:ChuckEsoteric08]] based on [[brainfuck]] ==Commands== The tape has infinite amount of unsigned unbounded integers +-,.[] Are the same, <code><></code> are removed and there is additional command | Which toggles between two st
14:29:53 <b_jonas> int-e: I think most of the interwiki codes are just inherited from defaults from the mediawiki software
14:30:19 <korvo> fizzie: Thank you!
14:31:10 <b_jonas> "it'd be possible to update them all at once if the destination changes their URLs" => you can do URL rewriting with normal absolute URLs just as much, and then you don't need specific knowledge of the particular wiki. I think I've replaced OEIS links on the wiki after the old links failed to work.
14:31:13 <fizzie> korvo: I didn't actually add concatenative.org yet, because I couldn't pick the prefix. If you have an opinion on that, that might help.
14:31:43 <int-e> b_jonas: I was looking at a test edit to change the `unit cell` link I mentioned and now I'm not sure I want to actually do it.
14:32:30 <korvo> fizzie: "catlang wiki" was suggested in #concatenative; it's supposedly popular with their Discord community. I might suggest "catwiki" or "catlangwiki". "concatenative" is not a bad option, given that it's their channel and domain name.
14:32:34 <int-e> Because it would no longer indicate an external link.
14:32:54 <b_jonas> I've definitely replaced several links to OEIS and to Erich Friedman's webpage from elsewhere, mostly on SE. Sadly the Erich Friedman links are trickier because it's not just a simple prefix replace, pages moved within the site too. Technically some of that wasn't at the same time, but we don't replace links every half a year.
14:32:57 <int-e> "test edit" - a preview to use proper terminology
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14:33:44 <esolangs> [[User:ChuckEsoteric08]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138268&oldid=121602 * ChuckEsoteric08 * (+24) /* Things I made */
14:34:03 <b_jonas> Plus I think the complexity zoo may have moved. I think all three of these were universities getting nervous about what their subdomains point to and that they'll be considered endorsing everything hosted under any subdomain, which is kind of ridiculous but that's how politics goes.
14:34:09 <fizzie> korvo: It can't have a space in it for technical reasons, but both `catwiki` and `catlangwiki` would work.
14:34:33 <korvo> fizzie: Let's do `catlangwiki`. Thank you again for your attention to detail.
14:35:27 <b_jonas> "the WikiMedia wikis" => those shortcuts are probably among the more useful ones, because the esowiki was originally founded to rescue esolang documentation that would be deleted from en.wikipedia
14:35:37 <korvo> b_jonas: Complexity Zoo had some organizational issues; they couldn't really cross-reference. I visited a while ago and took detailed drawings (https://github.com/MostAwesomeDude/zaha/tree/master/complexity) but didn't write down the academic details.
14:35:45 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/interwiki]] iw_add * Fizzie * Fizzie added prefix "catlangwiki" (https://concatenative.org/wiki/view/$1) (trans: 0; local: 0) to the interwiki table: add prefix for concatenative.org
14:36:02 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck is not turing complete]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138269&oldid=134927 * PrySigneToFry * (+303) I added even more horrible things in the page
14:36:14 <fizzie> And I'll probably also try to style interwiki links to indicate that they're external links, but only after running some errands.
14:36:26 <korvo> With both the Zoo and nLab, I've got projects (that one just linked and Catabase respectively) that are basically "this wiki could have been written as a SQL database, with constraints and checks and FKs".
14:36:49 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck is not turing complete]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138270&oldid=138269 * PrySigneToFry * (+64)
14:37:21 <esolangs> [[User:B jonas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138271&oldid=137727 * B jonas * (+44)
14:38:43 <fizzie> On the other topic, the Commodore C128 _system_ has a "CP/M Mode", but that's just based on having a separate Z80 CPU in addition to the 8502 (similar to how GBA included an SM83, the Z80-alike of the original Game Boy), so that's on a different level than the CPU execution modes.
14:38:44 <esolangs> [[Cat (Language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138272&oldid=138069 * Corbin * (-47) Test out the new interwiki entry for concatenative.org.
14:39:10 <esolangs> [[Pointfree programming]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138273&oldid=107984 * B jonas * (+144)
14:39:44 <esolangs> [[Cat program]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138274&oldid=138054 * Corbin * (+63) Also add a disambiguation link here, since this is currently the redirect target for [[Cat]].
14:42:16 <b_jonas> simcop2387: oh yeah, and the Commodore 128 has a Commodore 64 mode built into it, with partly separate hardware, and because the Commodore 64 was so popular but the 128 wasn't, most software running on the 128 is just Commodore 64-bit software
14:43:37 <b_jonas> while the GBC has a GB compatibility mode, but I think that doesn't really count as an emulation, most of what it does is slowing down the CPU+memory and not changing the video card to color mode
14:44:36 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138275&oldid=138199 * Ractangle * (+171) /* brainfuck */
14:46:38 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138276&oldid=138247 * PrySigneToFry * (+26) Added a sub-title
14:46:54 <esolangs> [[User talk:Unname4798]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138277&oldid=138276 * PrySigneToFry * (+4) Fixed
14:51:07 <simcop2387> lol, though if i had the space and time i'd have a C64 or C128 for playing with :)
14:52:17 <b_jonas> simcop2387: you can just emulate them these days
14:52:22 <fizzie> I had a C128, but donated it to someone else when I moved countries, wasn't really using it for anything.
14:52:54 <simcop2387> and i think the GBC was slightly different than that, it always boots in the slow mode and B&W until it sees the new GBC nintento copyright string/logo bitmap but it's been a while since i've looked into exactly how that worked anymore
14:53:22 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138278&oldid=138275 * Ractangle * (-3) /* /// */
14:55:08 <simcop2387> i'd also love to have a teletype of some kind acting as a notification printer like it's part of an old time news room getting automated telegraphs of breaking news but i'm a bit weird that way
14:57:50 <fizzie> I missed all the "other systems" growing up (we were always a PC household), so I got a few (the C128, a Performa 5200, a SparcStation 5, an SGI Indy) to play with when they were already obsolete.
14:59:54 <fizzie> The SS5 probably saw the most use, because it ran OpenBSD and was my router for a couple of years, until Fast Ethernet was no longer fast enough.
15:02:45 <fizzie> Come to think of it, that's where the logs.esolangs.org logs start from, because it's also where I ran irssi on and started logging: https://logs.esolangs.org/freenode-esoteric/2002-12-14.html
15:04:01 <b_jonas> oh an OpenBSD router? nice
15:10:18 <esolangs> [[]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138279 * PrySigneToFry * (+1862) Created page with " is an Esolang that designed and implemented by PSTF. It is reversed version of [[]]. == Command Table == <pre> This Esolang Brainfuck < >
15:12:41 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138280&oldid=138167 * PrySigneToFry * (+19)
15:16:25 <esolangs> [[Hello world program in esoteric languages (nonalphabetic and A)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138281&oldid=137672 * PrySigneToFry * (+48)
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15:20:09 <esolangs> [[@!+-()]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138282&oldid=116382 * ChuckEsoteric08 * (+18) /* Specification */
15:21:15 <HackEso> olist <https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1310.html>: shachaf oerjan Sgeo boily nortti b_jonas Noisytoot
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15:26:14 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138283&oldid=138278 * Ractangle * (+32) /* Befunge */
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15:43:57 <esolangs> [[OTS]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138284 * Yayimhere * (+1411) Created page with "'''OTS'''(pronounced OATS) is a esolang created by [[User:Yayimhere]] == memory == memory is a stack holding negative esolangs. the stack can only hold 4 elements at a time == commands == {| class="wikitable" |+ commands |- ! command !! meaning |- | <code>W(''n'')</code>
15:44:16 <esolangs> [[OTS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138285&oldid=138284 * Yayimhere * (-2)
15:49:27 <esolangs> [[OTS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138286&oldid=138285 * Yayimhere * (+8)
16:03:25 <esolangs> [[OTS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138287&oldid=138286 * Yayimhere * (+0)
16:05:47 <esolangs> [[Yayimhere-like esolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138288&oldid=138076 * Ractangle * (+22) /* syntax */
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16:58:19 <esolangs> [[User:GUAqwq/TCproof to Lambda calculus]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138289&oldid=138131 * Hakerh400 * (+24) Fix some mistakes
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17:08:03 <esolangs> [[Try]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138290&oldid=138176 * BestCoder * (+240)
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17:09:34 <esolangs> [[Try/hello world]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138291 * BestCoder * (+69) Created page with "Message is an esolang about hello world == Main == Output is Message"
17:10:23 <esolangs> [[Try]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138292&oldid=138290 * BestCoder * (+35)
17:15:53 <esolangs> [[Comment]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138293&oldid=138283 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+29) /* Befunge/>/*> */
17:16:43 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138294&oldid=138224 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+1) /* examples */ Fix link
17:18:26 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Turning tarpits]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138295 * BestCoder * (+23) Created page with "you mean turing tarpits"
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17:19:48 <esolangs> [[*bfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138296&oldid=138267 * ChuckEsoteric08 * (+4) /* Commands */
17:20:18 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Turning tarpits]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138297&oldid=138295 * Yayimhere * (+169)
17:22:38 <esolangs> [[OTS]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138298&oldid=138287 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+49) Categories
17:22:48 <esolangs> [[OTS]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138299&oldid=138298 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+0) Typo
17:23:19 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/rights]] rights * Fizzie * changed group membership for User:Fizzie from bureaucrat, checkuser, sysop to bureaucrat, checkuser, sysop, interface-admin: grant interface-admin rights to self in hopes of restyling interwiki links
17:25:37 <esolangs> [[Kicky BCT]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138300&oldid=138240 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+74) Categories
17:26:27 <esolangs> [[Timelang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138301 * BestCoder * (+426) Created page with "You have to wait to code == Idea == time mod 8 determines what thing gets ran time%8 do 0 add one to current cell 1 sub one to current cell 2 move one cell left 3 move one cell right 4 input to cell 5 output from cell 6 start
17:29:09 <esolangs> [[EmojiCoder]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138302&oldid=78174 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+24) Category
17:29:11 <esolangs> [[User:BestCoder]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138303&oldid=134424 * BestCoder * (+18)
17:30:24 <esolangs> [[MediaWiki:Common.css]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138304&oldid=51399 * Fizzie * (+270) attempt to style interwiki links with the external-site link indicator
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17:34:31 <fizzie> Kinda tricky. Different skins apply the "external site" icon differently; default Vector does it by setting a background-image to a small SVG, positioning it to 'center right' and adding a bit of padding; Citizen does it by adding an ::after pseudo-element that's `background-color: currentcolor` + masked with an SVG data: URL, presumably so that it inherits the color. But Common.css is common to
17:34:33 <fizzie> both, and I really don't want to start doing that per-skin.
17:35:08 <fizzie> In the end just applied Vector's simpler external-link styling to a.extiw.
17:35:35 <fizzie> The _right_ way to do it of course would've been to put the `external` CSS class to interwiki links as well, but couldn't find an option to do that.
17:41:57 <korvo> wWwwW: Mediawiki and similar wiki software has the concept of "interwiki", which lets us bluelink between different wikis. It's a little brittle, but it's mostly just a way to manage lots of offsite URLs.
17:44:00 <esolangs> [[~~]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138305 * Yayimhere * (+1425) Created page with "'''~~'''(first of all idk how i got that name second of all its pronounced sin) is a esolang created by [[User:Yayimhere]] while on a twitch stream == ~~ hexadecimal format == ~~ has a way to write hexadecimal numbers(where there are couples so they can be divided into chu
17:44:08 <korvo> fizzie: For some reason, `position: absolute` is getting added to that class. Pages like [[Cammy]] are getting a pile of links dragged to the top-right.
17:44:24 <wWwwW> hey korvo. it had a link to send you(idk if you've seen it) its the crafting esolang. here it is: https://hackmd.io/@idkleftoutsidekkk/ryM0QbI3C
17:46:26 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138306&oldid=138305 * Yayimhere * (-1)
17:47:56 <esolangs> [[MediaWiki:Common.css]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138307&oldid=138304 * Fizzie * (+1) add a missing )
17:48:20 <fizzie> korvo: I missed a ) in `url(...)` and somehow didn't notice.
17:58:33 <korvo> fizzie: Nice, looks great.
17:58:49 <wWwwW> the link should work now
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18:02:10 <esolangs> [[Talk:Push-down automaton]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138308&oldid=20543 * BestCoder * (+601)
18:02:20 <esolangs> [[Talk:Push-down automaton]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138309&oldid=138308 * BestCoder * (+60)
18:04:03 <esolangs> [[Talk:Brainfuck is not turing complete]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138310&oldid=137254 * Tommyaweosme * (+242)
18:06:06 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138311 * Xarthan * (+450) Created page
18:07:35 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138312&oldid=138311 * Xarthan * (+49) lmao
18:21:10 <wWwwW> is it ready for the wiki?
18:22:43 <b_jonas> fungot, how often do you dishearten, and how often do you connive?
18:22:44 <fungot> b_jonas: please look at r5rs: the revised5 report on scheme
18:33:51 <esolangs> [[Direction]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138313 * BestCoder * (+727) Created page with "This is a esolang that uses 2d syntax, plus orthogonal directions == The but == every direction command when you step on it it gets deleted == Commands == <>^v: direction commands I: get input and push it to stack ?: pops from stack and if that is 0 turn left >0
18:35:07 <esolangs> [[User:BestCoder]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138314&oldid=138303 * BestCoder * (+20)
18:35:33 <wWwwW> is it ready for the wiki korvo?
18:36:04 <korvo> wWwwW: I don't know. I don't think I am a good person to ask about that.
18:38:27 <esolangs> [[OTS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138315&oldid=138299 * Ractangle * (+71)
18:39:07 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138316&oldid=138236 * Ractangle * (+12)
18:40:48 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[Assembolge]] to [[User:Ractangle:Assembolge]]
18:41:10 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[User:Ractangle:Assembolge]] to [[User:Ractangle/Assembolge]]
18:49:36 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[User:Ractangle/Assembolge]] to [[User:Ractangle/iurgdytrh]]
18:50:01 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle/iurgdytrh]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138323&oldid=138321 * Ractangle * (+6)
18:54:36 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138324&oldid=138173 * Ractangle * (-9) /* Esolangs */
19:00:15 <esolangs> [[Markont]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138325&oldid=43106 * Ractangle * (+22) /* Example */
19:01:23 <esolangs> [[Randwork]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138326&oldid=51122 * Ractangle * (+22) /* External resources */
19:02:00 <esolangs> [[Expandable Quantum Brainfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138327&oldid=59466 * Ractangle * (+22)
19:06:22 <esolangs> [[Algebraic Brainfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138328&oldid=136046 * Ractangle * (+22) /* Sources */
19:07:15 <esolangs> [[Awib]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138329&oldid=88809 * Ractangle * (+22)
19:09:53 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138330&oldid=138294 * Yayimhere * (+181)
19:14:43 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck minus -]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138331&oldid=59759 * Ractangle * (+22) /* See also */
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19:15:34 <esolangs> [[Doors]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138332&oldid=135814 * BestCoder * (+72)
19:17:01 <esolangs> [[FRAK]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138333&oldid=125034 * Ractangle * (+23) /* External resources */
19:21:30 <esolangs> [[Doors]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138334&oldid=138332 * BestCoder * (+308)
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20:33:36 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138335&oldid=138312 * Xarthan * (+872) language overview
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20:40:30 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138336&oldid=138335 * Xarthan * (+111) file type and language overveiw edits
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20:53:50 <HackEso> olist <https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1310.html>: shachaf oerjan Sgeo boily nortti b_jonas Noisytoot
20:56:06 <b_jonas> Sgeo: fizzie had rang the obell earlier
21:01:43 <esolangs> [[OTS]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138337&oldid=138315 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+1) .
21:02:35 <esolangs> [[Direction]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138338&oldid=138313 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+88) Categories
21:06:11 <esolangs> [[Timelang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138339&oldid=138301 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+162) Categories
21:24:16 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138340&oldid=138336 * Xarthan * (+40) fixed bit count mistake
21:27:24 <zzo38> How to securely specify that a self-signed X.509 certificate supersedes another self-signed X.509 certificate? Since a certificate contains a public key, presumably you could use that for security, but is there the way to use in this way, or will it be necessary to make up a new extension for this purpose?
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22:23:36 <user3456> zzo38: why not self sign a root cert and sign other certs with it
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22:59:41 <zzo38> Then what if you will want to revoke the root certificate?
23:00:26 <zzo38> Also, signing other certificates with a root certificate will not tell you that one certificate is intended to supersede another one.
23:15:49 <zzo38> (You could use the names to indicate this, although this won't help if the names will be changed or if the names are later used by someone else (with the same certificate authority), as well as the other reasons such as if you will want to revoke the root certificate for whatever reason)
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00:11:37 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck is not turing complete]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138341&oldid=138270 * None1 * (+6)
00:13:09 <esolangs> [[]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138342&oldid=138279 * None1 * (+1) /* Example */
00:24:44 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138343&oldid=138340 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+158) Categories
00:27:03 <zzo38> I had consider how to make the "Common Data Format" of the operating system design. Perhaps it can be: 8-bits command code, 4-bits length type, 4-bits data type. The data types might be: 0=compound, 1=raw, 2=text, 3=reference, etc. (The number of bits allocated to each part also might be different, if this is consider to be not good enough)
00:30:59 <zzo38> What is your opinions of such a thing like that?
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00:36:59 <zzo38> One possible consideration that might be needed is if a container has an unknown length.
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00:48:22 <esolangs> [[Factor]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138344&oldid=136304 * None1 * (+95) Distinguish confusion
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01:01:58 <esolangs> [[User:Gilbert189/Iternary]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138345&oldid=136799 * Gilbert189 * (-390) Removed all the ellipses (it makes implementation more difficult)
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01:48:04 <esolangs> [[QuickLangs]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138346&oldid=129460 * PaxtonPenguin * (-94)
01:48:26 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * PaxtonPenguin * moved [[QuickLangs]] to [[QuickLang]]: no mo others
01:48:52 <esolangs> [[QuickLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138349&oldid=138347 * PaxtonPenguin * (-26)
01:49:40 <esolangs> [[User:PaxtonPenguin]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138350&oldid=129331 * PaxtonPenguin * (-1)
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02:17:12 <esolangs> [[User:Qawtykit]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138351&oldid=125000 * Qawtykit * (+16)
02:18:48 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138352&oldid=138343 * Xarthan * (+259) added more opcodes
02:21:26 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138353&oldid=138352 * Xarthan * (+55) Clarified descriptions
02:32:05 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138354&oldid=138353 * Xarthan * (+290) memory-mapped I/O edits
02:44:47 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138355&oldid=138293 * None1 * (+311)
02:55:09 <esolangs> [[User talk:/w/wiki/index.php/Talk:index.php/Main page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138356&oldid=138266 * PrySigneToFry * (+353)
02:56:38 <zzo38> Is there a way in Linux, for a C program to call a function to save the user memory of the program in a way that can later be restored? File descriptors should not be saved, and user/group IDs should not be saved, etc.
03:00:42 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138357&oldid=138263 * PrySigneToFry * (+836)
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03:01:55 <zzo38> For example, it could be: int write_user_memory(int fd); Returns 1 if successful, 0 if just restored, or -1 if error.
03:02:44 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138358&oldid=138354 * Xarthan * (+0)
03:03:09 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138359&oldid=138357 * PrySigneToFry * (-3)
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03:32:00 <esolangs> [[Bitfuckery]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138360&oldid=138358 * Xarthan * (+0)
03:32:21 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138361&oldid=138256 * PrySigneToFry * (+30)
03:36:55 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138362&oldid=138361 * None1 * (+264)
03:38:14 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138363&oldid=138362 * PrySigneToFry * (+847) /* */ new section
03:39:58 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138364&oldid=138363 * PrySigneToFry * (+799)
03:44:43 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138365&oldid=138364 * None1 * (+328)
03:51:41 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138366&oldid=138365 * None1 * (+293) /* */
04:15:10 <esolangs> [[Factor]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138367&oldid=138344 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-1) :
04:19:15 <korvo> TIL about [[Template:Distinguish/Confusion]]; thanks PSDW for showing the way.
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04:40:51 <esolangs> [[Translated ORK/PSTF Again4]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138368 * PrySigneToFry * (+585) Created page with "[[Translated ORK/PSTF Again3]] 1. Semi-product <pre> Leidse. swing swing swing My name is Joan of Arc Bonni. Avelis. This is a document. TantYachiukevkuchokera prays; In the camera, come on, come on, come on. swing Tippiene Aniza Retdak. </pre>
04:41:52 <esolangs> [[Translated ORK/PSTF Again3]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138369&oldid=138140 * PrySigneToFry * (+46)
04:43:25 <esolangs> [[User talk:Tommyaweosme]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138370&oldid=138366 * PrySigneToFry * (+713)
04:43:35 <zzo38> O, about my "Common Data Format", it seem that ASN.1 has a way of making indefinite length, so something like that could be used. Actually, it could be made more like ASN.1 in other ways too, e.g. instead of the length type and data type like that, can use one bit to indicate constructed or primitive like ASN.1 is doing.
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05:14:24 <esolangs> [[Bijection]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138371&oldid=138330 * Yayimhere * (+20)
05:18:13 <esolangs> [[Category talk:Unknown computational class]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138372&oldid=138264 * Yayimhere * (+155)
05:20:56 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138373&oldid=138359 * Yayimhere * (+68) /* bring back the old sandbox war */
05:22:17 <esolangs> [[User talk:MihaiEso]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138374&oldid=138373 * Yayimhere * (+187) /* bring back the old sandbox war */
05:54:15 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck is not turing complete]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138375&oldid=138341 * Unname4798 * (+3)
06:01:02 <wWwwW> that every minimaztation of BF
06:01:44 <wWwwW> has a problem with that when you try to minimize < and > you always end up having one preserved and the second one changed but sstill the same number of commands
06:03:16 <esolangs> [[Brainhook]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138376&oldid=137976 * Yayimhere * (+1)
06:16:52 <wWwwW> am i stupid for working on burn now
06:22:41 <zzo38> Why do some HTTP servers send a compressed response even if the client does not request it?
06:31:18 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138377&oldid=137571 * Yayimhere * (+135) /* Burn */
06:31:50 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138378&oldid=138377 * Yayimhere * (-2098) /* BackFlip x sets */
06:31:57 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138379&oldid=138378 * Yayimhere * (-547) /* idea 1 */
06:32:09 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138380&oldid=138379 * Yayimhere * (-3188) /* idea 3 */
06:32:47 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere/Sandbox]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138381&oldid=138380 * Yayimhere * (-609) /* math in ()NEST() */
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07:11:37 <esolangs> [[OTS]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138382&oldid=138337 * Yayimhere * (+22)
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08:38:39 <b_jonas> zzo38: does that involve the HTTP 2 or 3 protocol? if so, I think allowing compression is assumed in those protocols even if it's not explicitly listed in the header. if not, I think I've seen at least one specialized server that still does that, with the justification that if you're downloading the large data involved uncompressed then you're just wasting everyone's bandwidth, and everyone has access
08:38:45 <b_jonas> to a zlib decompression implementation these days.
09:03:30 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138383&oldid=138355 * Ractangle * (+80) /* Befunge/>/*> */
09:05:36 <esolangs> [[Comment]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138384&oldid=138383 * Yayimhere * (+30)
09:36:21 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/move]] move * Ractangle * moved [[User:Ractangle/iurgdytrh]] to [[Input hello world or else:]]
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09:43:00 <esolangs> [[Input hello world or else:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138387&oldid=138385 * Ractangle * (+15)
09:43:29 <esolangs> [[Input hello world or else:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138388&oldid=138387 * Ractangle * (+24)
09:45:28 <esolangs> [[User:Ractangle]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138389&oldid=138324 * Ractangle * (+89)
09:46:53 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138390&oldid=138316 * Ractangle * (+13)
09:48:19 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138391&oldid=138306 * Yayimhere * (+44) /* syntax */
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09:49:34 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138392&oldid=138391 * Yayimhere * (+60) /* ~~ hexadecimal format */
09:50:06 <esolangs> [[Input hello world or else:]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138393&oldid=138388 * Ractangle * (+112)
09:51:02 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138394&oldid=138392 * Yayimhere * (+44)
09:51:50 <esolangs> [[QuickLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138395&oldid=138349 * Ractangle * (+0) mispel
09:52:39 <esolangs> [[Talk:QuickLang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138396 * Ractangle * (+190) Created page with "good execution :thumbsup:~~~"
09:53:07 <esolangs> [[QuickLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138397&oldid=138395 * Ractangle * (+23)
09:53:29 <esolangs> [[QuickLang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138398&oldid=138397 * Ractangle * (+17)
09:53:55 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138399&oldid=138394 * Yayimhere * (+59) /* syntax */
09:54:22 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138400&oldid=138399 * Yayimhere * (+42) /* ~~ hexadecimal format */
09:55:20 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138401&oldid=138400 * Yayimhere * (+17)
09:55:59 <esolangs> [[~~]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138402&oldid=138401 * Yayimhere * (+0)